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WDIM

(1,662 posts)
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 09:57 PM Jan 2015

Please say no to Hillary Clinton in 2016!

It seems she is already the nominee in the eyes of the media. But there are so many reasons she should not be the democrats nominee. Unless we are satisfied with the status quo and i dont think we'd be here if we were happy with how things are going.

First off she is part of the 1% and part of the problem.

She is a supporter of free trade, reagonomics, the federal reserve, the drug war, the prisons for profit, the police state,

She voted for the wars in iraq and afghanistan.

She is for US globalism and the US acting as the world police.

She has been living off the public payroll for more than 20 years. She is a washington insider and nothing is going to change under her presidency.

We need somebody from outside the beltway. Somebody with new ideas and somebody with the courage to follow through on the vision of hope. A person who sees the change this country needs and is willing to strive for the dream of freedom and equality.

Hillary is part of an old generation and an old way of thinking. It is time for the country to rise above to a new level of enlightenment. We could make life wondeful for every citizen in this country we just need the courage to make the change.

We need somebody that will fight for a living wage for all full time employees. We need somebody that will get universal health care. We need somebody that will stop the redistribution of wealth to the top. That will stand up for workers rights. Unions. Small businesses. Local goods and services, national companies. Alternative fuels. Zero point energy. Public utilities, better infrastructure. Treasury printing its own money. Disbanding the fed and paying the insterest back to the people where it belongs.

Who is this person. I dont know but there has to be somebody better than Hillary.

295 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Please say no to Hillary Clinton in 2016! (Original Post) WDIM Jan 2015 OP
Didn't you know that EVERYONE is ready for Hillary? winter is coming Jan 2015 #1
she's dodging the xl pipeline. she's a coward roguevalley Jan 2015 #25
Hillary no coward/ She is fighter/ Her and Bill beat the GOP over and over again lewebley3 Jan 2015 #292
that was then, this is now roguevalley Jan 2015 #294
No, I didn't know that. Jack Rabbit Jan 2015 #128
Is Hillary Perfect ? No, far from it. QuestionAlways Jan 2015 #137
The vast majority of Dems agree with you. nt SunSeeker Jan 2015 #189
Most American and Dems agree with Hillary! What is needed is Team work!! lewebley3 Jan 2015 #213
Sounds like a winning plan, lewebley3! SunSeeker Jan 2015 #220
You are right Hillary is the Best candidate! lewebley3 Jan 2015 #206
Hillary has never been a Democrat. obxhead Jan 2015 #242
What Crazy thing to stay!!! Hillary was the Head of Democratic party with Bill lewebley3 Jan 2015 #290
Exactly lark Jan 2015 #228
There is no party registration in Vermont. MNBrewer Jan 2015 #233
HIllary is a menace, a Third Way corporate predator in a Democrat suit. woo me with science Jan 2015 #274
I already said no to her Nyc72dem Jan 2015 #2
For which republican Jakes Progress Jan 2015 #231
False choice. We can run someone else. That's the point. cui bono Jan 2015 #234
It was the choice the poster set up. Jakes Progress Jan 2015 #285
"No" to Hillary; there, I said it. "Yes" to Obama's third term (paging Michele, please pick up the red hotline phone). InAbLuEsTaTe Jan 2015 #265
If you think Jakes Progress Jan 2015 #286
YES! Hillary should Run on Obama Record/w Obama support! Howard for DNC lewebley3 Jan 2015 #291
Her friendship with Henry Kissinger makes me not be Cleita Jan 2015 #3
Have said no to Hillary marym625 Jan 2015 #4
It was that craven, immoral vote for me too. AtomicKitten Jan 2015 #7
. marym625 Jan 2015 #9
* AtomicKitten Jan 2015 #19
That's new marym625 Jan 2015 #40
* AtomicKitten Jan 2015 #67
Can you share? marym625 Jan 2015 #70
Sure thing. AtomicKitten Jan 2015 #132
FABULOUS! marym625 Jan 2015 #135
That's when I said goodbye to her also. And then when Sen. Graham told us that Senators had sabrina 1 Jan 2015 #59
I could live to be 1000 marym625 Jan 2015 #63
Thank you for telling how I feel about that Senate vote. A Simple Game Jan 2015 #219
You're welcome marym625 Jan 2015 #226
Afghanistan was not much better in my opinion. n/t A Simple Game Jan 2015 #239
completely agree. n/t marym625 Jan 2015 #240
They were either ignorant or complicit. Thank you for putting so well. nm rhett o rick Jan 2015 #256
Thank you, rhett o rick marym625 Jan 2015 #257
Exactly. They really do think we are stupid. sabrina 1 Jan 2015 #277
yep. no doubt marym625 Jan 2015 #280
Sorry. marym625 Jan 2015 #91
That sealed the deal for me too. I'm sick of politicians like Hillary who check which way the political wind is blowing before taking a "principled" stand... InAbLuEsTaTe Jan 2015 #268
So you must really Jakes Progress Jan 2015 #288
So voting Jakes Progress Jan 2015 #287
no. marym625 Jan 2015 #289
Sorry to have lumped Jakes Progress Jan 2015 #295
So who then? yeoman6987 Jan 2015 #5
Not sure yet, but any Dem but Hillary at least gives us a chance things will improve.... peacebird Jan 2015 #8
Whenever anyone says "any dem but Hillary" I chuckle... Agschmid Jan 2015 #83
Talk about "damning with faint praise". n/t winter is coming Jan 2015 #92
Yup. Agschmid Jan 2015 #107
the OP is against the Fed hfojvt Jan 2015 #209
Don't know about other progressives, truebluegreen Jan 2015 #244
Why you insulting vampiresquids by comparin em to Wall Streeters? Now you apologize. InAbLuEsTaTe Jan 2015 #270
Well, so far Romney looks like he intends to run to the left of Clinton. fbc Jan 2015 #12
So what you're saying is, you support Mitt Romney for president? Okay. I know enough about you. eom BlueCaliDem Jan 2015 #22
No, I don't think that's what he said. WhiteTara Jan 2015 #32
yeah fbc Jan 2015 #164
If Hillary becomes the nominee , maybe you should switch parties if that's what you think? pkdu Jan 2015 #96
I am disappointed in that comment. It's as if that's the only choice. rhett o rick Jan 2015 #259
Romney is lying to the left of Hillary. Cha Jan 2015 #138
What issues has he staked out that are to the left of HRC? DemocratSinceBirth Jan 2015 #166
I know you are being sarcastic but of course he is lying: truebluegreen Jan 2015 #245
Thom Hartmann WDIM Jan 2015 #24
I'm wondering... pacalo Jan 2015 #34
I wrote the OP. WDIM Jan 2015 #46
I apologize. nt pacalo Jan 2015 #54
I like him but Bernie will never be elected president redstateblues Jan 2015 #88
Yeah --- if he runs just watch bullsnarfle Jan 2015 #192
The people who would be freaked out by the label truebluegreen Jan 2015 #246
I'm an avid TH follower for almost 5 years. Amazing genius but doubt he would run for office. appalachiablue Jan 2015 #98
You said you wanted someone from outside the Beltway. DemocratSinceBirth Jan 2015 #167
I don't care what she says. I'm not giving upon Warren. JDPriestly Jan 2015 #48
I can't wait for Hillary to make her big announcement that she's throwing her support behind Liz. Voice for Peace Jan 2015 #198
No means no. Yavin4 Jan 2015 #223
Ugh. Don't use that phrase about rape so lightly please. n/t cui bono Jan 2015 #235
So what's your point? That we have to settle for H. Clinton-Sachs? rhett o rick Jan 2015 #258
The oligarchy (third way) will pick her and we will get the usual distraction crumbs. L0oniX Jan 2015 #6
"Anyone who is for Hillary is a centrist, not a Democrat." That's a lie. BlueCaliDem Jan 2015 #17
What you say about FDR is all wrong. Read up on those times before spouting this stuff. RiverLover Jan 2015 #26
I have. Apparently YOU haven't. Ever heard of Huey Pierce Long of Louisiana? He was the loudest BlueCaliDem Jan 2015 #36
Rec to read: 'Roosevelt's Purge: How FDR Fought to Change the Democratic Party' RiverLover Jan 2015 #80
+1 an entire shit load. Enthusiast Jan 2015 #146
I was referring to PRE-1938. Here's rec reading that's FREE: BlueCaliDem Jan 2015 #186
He was also attacked from the right and accused of being a "traitor to his class" dflprincess Jan 2015 #28
FDR was far from a socialist. DemocratSinceBirth Jan 2015 #169
I didn't say he was a Socialist dflprincess Jan 2015 #278
Bizarre reimaginethis Jan 2015 #31
Anyone who states that they won't vote for Hillary Clinton no matter what, is the Republican. BlueCaliDem Jan 2015 #42
...and anyone who votes for $$$ owned politicians is a traitor to the Democrat party. L0oniX Jan 2015 #82
The "Democrat party" OilemFirchen Jan 2015 #102
Ouch. zappaman Jan 2015 #108
No kidding. Bobbie Jo Jan 2015 #129
+1 Little Star Jan 2015 #160
I didn't know we had our own police dept. I'm a registered "democrat". L0oniX Jan 2015 #188
How nice for you. OilemFirchen Jan 2015 #199
Only Republicans refer to the Democratic Party as the "Democrat" Party. Be mindful of that. eom BlueCaliDem Jan 2015 #183
whatever ...i'm a registered "democrat" L0oniX Jan 2015 #187
Then you should've known, as a registered "Democrat", that it's OFFICIALLY the Democratic Party. BlueCaliDem Jan 2015 #227
It's good to have hopes dreams and goals. L0oniX Jan 2015 #237
A simple, "Oops! My bad" would've sufficed. Instead, you double down. BlueCaliDem Jan 2015 #250
I'm glad you are learning all about me. Write a book. L0oniX Jan 2015 #252
"I've clearly stated that should she win the nom, I will vote for you." BeanMusical Jan 2015 #85
Oops. I made the correction. But I'm certain you knew what I meant. eom BlueCaliDem Jan 2015 #251
So you think that a person who enacts Republican policy but belongs cui bono Jan 2015 #236
Yes, I'm well aware of your staunch dislike for President Obama, cui. eom BlueCaliDem Jan 2015 #249
I don't dislike Obama. I dislike him enacting and pursuing moderate Republican policy. cui bono Jan 2015 #293
Calling someone a Republican when he or she isn't is very bad form. DemocratSinceBirth Jan 2015 #170
Anybody could win at this point. WDIM Jan 2015 #37
FDR put some of the cheats on Wall Street in jail. He investigated the rest, publicly denounced JDPriestly Jan 2015 #52
Best post in this thread. MADem Jan 2015 #69
Awww ...hit a nerve huh. L0oniX Jan 2015 #78
So is everyone who that refuses to support Clinton a "left-leaning Indie"? davidpdx Jan 2015 #147
Not only is it a lie.... Bobbie Jo Jan 2015 #163
Well Hillary is the GOP's best chance for the white house. zeemike Jan 2015 #58
Those that do the corporate thing are richly rewarded. Enthusiast Jan 2015 #144
I will not vote if she's the nominee. fbc Jan 2015 #10
If she's the nominee and you don't vote, you're actually voting. BlueCaliDem Jan 2015 #18
False. An uncast ballot is an uncast ballot, and as such, goes to no one. winter is coming Jan 2015 #27
An uncast ballot is acceptance for what everybody else decides. MohRokTah Jan 2015 #38
No, an uncast ballot is a statement that the choice presented is irrelevant to the would-be voter. winter is coming Jan 2015 #57
Nope, it's an acceptance of the outcome, regardless. MohRokTah Jan 2015 #60
What a bizarre thing to say. winter is coming Jan 2015 #76
The only bizarre thing I see is trying to say an uncast ballot is a protest vote. MohRokTah Jan 2015 #81
And the difference would be? RiverLover Jan 2015 #29
Funny, that sounds like what the Nader voters said in 2000 YoungDemCA Jan 2015 #202
Yet another insane, ridiculous post from an emerging Republican reimaginethis Jan 2015 #33
Depends on what state you live in. Agschmid Jan 2015 #86
Yep. xmas74 Jan 2015 #140
Even if you choose not to vote in the presidential race, please show up dflprincess Jan 2015 #30
Yes. SomeGuyInEagan Jan 2015 #111
I concur. I'll write in the name of a real progressive, and hope Hillary loses. fbc Jan 2015 #196
Every Time the Democrats Lose, the Party Moves farther to the Right AndyTiedye Jan 2015 #65
We lost in the latest election. truebluegreen Jan 2015 #247
I suggest you vote for a Democratic write in. nm rhett o rick Jan 2015 #264
So many 'I hate Hillary' newbies without an idea for an alternate. onehandle Jan 2015 #11
The alternative is to not vote. fbc Jan 2015 #13
I'm certain Rove and the Koch Bros are supportive of your alternative and plans. BlueCaliDem Jan 2015 #20
Post removed Post removed Jan 2015 #39
Kucinich stands a better chance of winning the Democratic nomination than Zell Miller. MohRokTah Jan 2015 #47
So commons sense is bizarre to you? Well, what I've written is pretty bizarre to RWers, too, BlueCaliDem Jan 2015 #49
Well they win both ways don't they? fbc Jan 2015 #168
Wrong. They only win a little under a Democrat but hugely under a Republican. BlueCaliDem Jan 2015 #182
Hillary is a Democrat. Those threatening to sit out 2016 are the real DINOs. nt geek tragedy Jan 2015 #190
I am a Progressive. Or a Liberal. I'm not "take whatever crap the Blue dogs foist on me" fbc Jan 2015 #194
Probably you do. Good luck getting Nader elected President. nt geek tragedy Jan 2015 #195
Who's "we?" Hillary is pretty popular among Democratic voters YoungDemCA Jan 2015 #204
You think that's gonna work? YoungDemCA Jan 2015 #207
And a couple of high count posters throwing their weight around dismissively. bluedigger Jan 2015 #66
Just be glad you didn't get hit with the Deadly Blue Link List! hatrack Jan 2015 #90
I'm just shocked I wasn't juried. bluedigger Jan 2015 #156
It's not just newbies who don't like Hillary. I didn't see an 'I hate Hillary' in the OP Autumn Jan 2015 #97
It's starting super early. They're desperate for a GOP victory next year. nt ecstatic Jan 2015 #106
AND, So Many "Not So Newbies" Want Someone Else... n/t ChiciB1 Jan 2015 #125
Good catch YoungDemCA Jan 2015 #205
Maybe you are starting to get the point. If you want Jeb, then nominate Clinton-Sachs. rhett o rick Jan 2015 #260
If she is anything like her husband Bill project_bluebook Jan 2015 #14
This message was self-deleted by its author reimaginethis Jan 2015 #44
I will no longer vote for a republican who is a registered Democrat TheProgressive Jan 2015 #15
This message was self-deleted by its author Agschmid Jan 2015 #109
I placed that info in my profile that you are welcomed to view...! TheProgressive Jan 2015 #116
This message was self-deleted by its author Agschmid Jan 2015 #126
First, my profile states 'Northern California' TheProgressive Jan 2015 #131
Yup. Okay. Agschmid Jan 2015 #133
I see no integrity in what you claim you will do. MohRokTah Jan 2015 #153
And integrity is important to you. Clinton switched sides and bowed to King George Bush and rhett o rick Jan 2015 #266
And Elizabeth Warren has already endorsed Hillary Clinton for the presidency. eom MohRokTah Jan 2015 #271
What? You support her in spite of her lack of integrity because Sen Warren endorsed her? rhett o rick Jan 2015 #273
I supprt her because she is a GOOD LIBERAL DEMOCRAT. MohRokTah Jan 2015 #276
What is the "extreme left" you hate so much? Tell me what do they want that rhett o rick Jan 2015 #281
No comment. eom MohRokTah Jan 2015 #282
What does the extreme left want that you don't want? When you disparage the "extreme left" rhett o rick Jan 2015 #283
Again, no comment. eom MohRokTah Jan 2015 #284
Clinton plans to astound, intimidate with fundraising ‘like nothing you’ve seen’ RiverLover Jan 2015 #16
Oh, boy, that could be the deciding factor. tclambert Jan 2015 #21
What Hillary is doing is fight for the nomination!! Which is a good Idea , if she wants it!! lewebley3 Jan 2015 #208
And the crowd goes "oooooooooo . . . ahhhhhhhhh . . ." InAbLuEsTaTe Jan 2015 #272
Its very important to Papa Paul Cryptoad Jan 2015 #23
You Better Believe It. Bobbie Jo Jan 2015 #41
Nope, I'm backing Hillary. MohRokTah Jan 2015 #35
+1 byronius Jan 2015 #113
If Romney was a woman, he'd vote and act like Hillary BP2 Jan 2015 #43
Hillary started a company who's primary purpose was outsourcing and got rich off of it? onehandle Jan 2015 #45
LOTS of newbies with low post counts hating on SoS Clinton. Republicans must be terrified BlueCaliDem Jan 2015 #50
Nailed it. Agschmid Jan 2015 #110
I will be backing Hillary, she has the ability to step in the shoes of being president. Thinkingabout Jan 2015 #51
She is going to regret not having a spirited primary season. As it stands now the repukes Purveyor Jan 2015 #53
I think she will have a tough primary. WDIM Jan 2015 #64
No way in hell will I vote for Hillary MissDeeds Jan 2015 #55
Post removed Post removed Jan 2015 #61
What state do you live in? Agschmid Jan 2015 #74
So will I. 840high Jan 2015 #123
and then your vote will be invalid sabbat hunter Jan 2015 #151
My vote may be discarded if I don't vote for Hillary, but I'll leave with a clear conscience... benz380 Jan 2015 #162
Well, you have the talking points and buzz words Bobbie Jo Jan 2015 #171
Thank you for the welcome. benz380 Jan 2015 #176
No way I would vote for anyone..... but Hillary!!! lewebley3 Jan 2015 #210
That's basically voting for the Republican. n/t Adrahil Jan 2015 #262
Million times YES to Hillary!!! lobodons Jan 2015 #56
Post removed Post removed Jan 2015 #71
kick riversedge Jan 2015 #253
"million"?? Is that how many deaths from the IWar she is responsible for? Her and Bush, two peas in rhett o rick Jan 2015 #263
FDR "welcomed their hatred"...think Hillary will ever say this.... RiverLover Jan 2015 #62
Nice FDR quote WDIM Jan 2015 #72
No, never. She's too indebted even if she can still see right from wrong. nt RiverLover Jan 2015 #87
There are several things that terrify me about The Inevitability of Hillary. SheilaT Jan 2015 #68
^^ All of this. n/t winter is coming Jan 2015 #93
I like your post, SheilaT. RiverLover Jan 2015 #100
Thank you for your appreciation. SheilaT Jan 2015 #143
You mean African-Americans might not vote for her when reminded of her racist campaign in 2008? ieoeja Jan 2015 #200
I'll be honest here and admit my ignorance. SheilaT Jan 2015 #230
No to this OP... BklnDem75 Jan 2015 #73
Sounds like someone I'd throw my support behind next year! George II Jan 2015 #75
When/if you find someone let us know. Agschmid Jan 2015 #77
I am voting for Hillary. hrmjustin Jan 2015 #79
I am also voting for Hillary Frances Jan 2015 #94
I think the people of our party will proudly support Hillary if she is nominated. hrmjustin Jan 2015 #95
All you have to do fadedrose Jan 2015 #84
Sounds to me like a lot in DU sunnystarr Jan 2015 #99
Progressives who ran as Progressives in MN won. Voters stayed home in states no progressive ran. RiverLover Jan 2015 #101
Meanwhile, Arkansas had a higher turnout than usual for a mid-term Art_from_Ark Jan 2015 #139
When did I say I would not vote for her or anyone else who wins the primaries? fadedrose Jan 2015 #105
Worst post of the week Tommy2Tone Jan 2015 #89
same thing I thought Tommy2Tone SCantiGOP Jan 2015 #216
In 2008 the media said it was going to be Hillary vs Rudy.... Spitfire of ATJ Jan 2015 #103
" I dont know but there has to be somebody better than Hillary." ecstatic Jan 2015 #104
There will be. fbc Jan 2015 #197
This is an extremely silly post. byronius Jan 2015 #112
The Supreme Court is too important to not vote for a Democrat for POTUS Hawaii Hiker Jan 2015 #114
I think the poster mean say no to Hillary in the primaries. nt Logical Jan 2015 #121
All the more reason to support someone other than Clinton. There are a lot of Americans rhett o rick Jan 2015 #269
Is there anybody else who wants to run? mackerel Jan 2015 #115
There's a reason why Hillary lost the 2008 primary Oilwellian Jan 2015 #117
You are causing us to think, Duval Jan 2015 #118
If you think Hillary is satisfied with the "status quo" you are simply ignorant. BootinUp Jan 2015 #119
I'll say it NO!!!!!! Hillary. 840high Jan 2015 #120
Have NEVER Supported Her, Even Last Time Out... ChiciB1 Jan 2015 #122
I did last time out. Changed my mind. 840high Jan 2015 #127
If you want a Liberal Democrat, elect Hillary Clinton. NYC Liberal Jan 2015 #124
+1. And Clinton and Warren are on the same page with most issues. n/t totodeinhere Jan 2015 #130
+1 treestar Jan 2015 #159
maybe you're right. WDIM Jan 2015 #212
I'm saving it for the primaries. This kind of thing is a waste of oxygen at this point DFW Jan 2015 #134
I'm sick of the Clintons and I'd wish they'd go away. BlueStater Jan 2015 #136
We have a government elected by a majorty of those who vote. Agnosticsherbet Jan 2015 #141
If she wins the nomination, I will vote yes this way Agnosticsherbet Jan 2015 #142
K&R woo me with science Jan 2015 #145
Agreed. rosesaylavee Jan 2015 #148
If I enter the voting booth and the choice is Hillary or Mike Huckabee, Vinca Jan 2015 #149
you mean the election Gore won even with Nader's votes? the one everyone admits was stolen? MisterP Jan 2015 #211
I've been saying no to HRC LWolf Jan 2015 #150
I would prefer sabbat hunter Jan 2015 #152
Spot on sellitman Jan 2015 #155
I hope Hillary runs, and is the Democratic nominee... SidDithers Jan 2015 #154
You can do that Sid, safe in your Canadian citizenship. We Americans don't have that luxury. Autumn Jan 2015 #174
+1 beerandjesus Jan 2015 #177
Okay then -- I hope Hillary runs, and is the Democratic nominee... brooklynite Jan 2015 #221
As an American and not a member of the 1% I hope she does not run, I will not Autumn Jan 2015 #238
I write to the DNC weekly & tell them I will not vote for Clinton or any other corporate tool, CrispyQ Jan 2015 #157
Get out of your bubble. One of the 99 Jan 2015 #158
I will say No to Hillary. bigwillq Jan 2015 #161
OK. Tierra_y_Libertad Jan 2015 #165
The voters will make the decision in the primaries. MineralMan Jan 2015 #172
I will say yes to the Democratic candidate, whomever he or she might be. DemocratSinceBirth Jan 2015 #173
I won't say it is so, but rtracey Jan 2015 #175
Needs... NotHardly Jan 2015 #178
I have never voted for or supported that DINO 1%er. 99Forever Jan 2015 #179
I confess I haven't paid much attention to potential candidates in either party. Pacifist Patriot Jan 2015 #180
Well since you mentioned you don't want a globlism, the president needs to have lots of foreign Thinkingabout Jan 2015 #181
Very Sad Mr Dixon Jan 2015 #184
I sure wish that when someone posts such a laundry list of "negatives" about Hillary Clinton... George II Jan 2015 #185
Hillary does not have many Negatives/Stop Trolling for the GOP lewebley3 Jan 2015 #203
Me? I was addressing the OP, who listed a bunch of so-called "bad" things about Clinton... George II Jan 2015 #224
Opens thread. Looks around. Closes thread. Metric System Jan 2015 #191
It's kinda like the Oscars, or any other award show SmittynMo Jan 2015 #193
I say YES to Hillary!!!!!! Hillary is a fighter for the People lewebley3 Jan 2015 #201
She certainly is. For the RICH people. hifiguy Jan 2015 #215
This message was self-deleted by its author Corruption Inc Jan 2015 #214
"Hillary is part of an old generation..." brooklynite Jan 2015 #217
No, Rather say no to you in 2015 nt aka-chmeee Jan 2015 #218
I would prefer Democrats find a different nominee but......... RationalMan Jan 2015 #222
I'll Vote for Hillery if she's the nominee but Pyrzqxgl Jan 2015 #225
You had me until..... lexington filly Jan 2015 #229
If there's no other choice LiberalLovinLug Jan 2015 #232
IMO, women's rights, gay rights, minimum wage increase..... BeeBee Jan 2015 #243
Definately vote WDIM Jan 2015 #241
Stand With Hillary? Alkene Jan 2015 #248
Hillary stood with Republican when we needed her most. She's a coward LittleBlue Jan 2015 #254
Well put. She is not for the 99%. nm rhett o rick Jan 2015 #267
she is not getting my vote - period hopemountain Jan 2015 #255
Go ahead call me crazy but I see the 2016 election tartan2 Jan 2015 #261
OK... you're crazy! nt benz380 Jan 2015 #279
+100000 Hilllary is a menace. A corporate predator in a Democrat suit. woo me with science Jan 2015 #275

winter is coming

(11,785 posts)
1. Didn't you know that EVERYONE is ready for Hillary?
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:00 PM
Jan 2015

People who haven't been born yet will invent time travel so they can have the privilege of voting for her.

 

lewebley3

(3,412 posts)
292. Hillary no coward/ She is fighter/ Her and Bill beat the GOP over and over again
Sat Jan 24, 2015, 01:13 PM
Jan 2015


I was middle class after Bill and Hillary got elected
They were successful for most of the American people,
Unemployment was African Americans in country was
down to low single digits.
 

QuestionAlways

(259 posts)
137. Is Hillary Perfect ? No, far from it.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 01:59 AM
Jan 2015

Is she the most progressive possible candidate, no, once again. But the most progressive Democratic candidates have said they will not run if she runs or they will have to change their registration in order to run as a Democrat.

But she will be different from the Republicans on woman issues, gay rights, helping children and families to survive with an in tact safety net, higher minimum wage, etc. But she will not bring wholesale changes in basic economic relationships which would scare the 40% of moderate third way democratic and independent voters who are necessary to win elections. She is by far the strongest candidate we have at this time, even if it is only to break the glass ceiling and make history as we did in 2008.

But if that is not enough, think of the Supreme Court, which is the only realistic way Citizens United will be overturned, With a more progressive court the 2016 election will effect american history for the next 20 years.

 

lewebley3

(3,412 posts)
213. Most American and Dems agree with Hillary! What is needed is Team work!!
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 04:27 PM
Jan 2015


Check the polls she has all the support right now, if she runs on
Obama record, and Obama is out there with her she cannot lose.

Also with Sherri Brown from Ohio as VP, Howard Dean as DNC Chair!

SunSeeker

(51,550 posts)
220. Sounds like a winning plan, lewebley3!
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 04:33 PM
Jan 2015

Sherrod Brown would make a great VP...and a great President after following Hillary into the White House!

 

lewebley3

(3,412 posts)
206. You are right Hillary is the Best candidate!
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 04:16 PM
Jan 2015



I like the way she fights, she won Calf, New York, and all the blue states,
Obama caucus states. More democrats voted for her in primary than him.
She never quit, she has been a democrat most of her life time.
 

obxhead

(8,434 posts)
242. Hillary has never been a Democrat.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 07:47 PM
Jan 2015

She began political life as a Republican and has continued that mindset throughout her entire political career.

 

lewebley3

(3,412 posts)
290. What Crazy thing to stay!!! Hillary was the Head of Democratic party with Bill
Sat Jan 24, 2015, 12:56 PM
Jan 2015


She only was republican when she was young, when the GOP
was liberal, and GOP was a big tent.

Republican use to be liberal, Nixon started the EPA, they also
used to be for planned parenthood: and as bad Regan was to
this country re raised the cap on SS. Republican always supported
unemployment Bfs.

Hillary has given most of her life to the democrats.

lark

(23,097 posts)
228. Exactly
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 05:26 PM
Jan 2015

Hillary is WAY too corporatist for my taste and I'd love to be able to vote for Bernie or Elizabeth instead. However, if neither of those 2 win the nomination, would you vote for another Bush or for Mittens? Hell no, I hope I can say with confidence. She may not reverse the sucking up of money by the 1%, but she won't undo SS or Medicare, won't end abortion, and could make things better for the working class by raising the minimum wage.

She's not my first choice, but she's not batship RW crazy, so I will vote for her if she's the Democratic nominee. Hoping I get to vote for someone I really want to be president, but prepared to vote for the "not as bad" choice if not.

MNBrewer

(8,462 posts)
233. There is no party registration in Vermont.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 06:17 PM
Jan 2015

Question 8. Do I have to register as a Democrat, Republican, Independent or some other party in Vermont?

Answer: No. There is no party registration in Vermont.

woo me with science

(32,139 posts)
274. HIllary is a menace, a Third Way corporate predator in a Democrat suit.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 10:36 PM
Jan 2015
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=6129706

Hillary Clinton's leading role in drafting the TPP
http://www.democraticunderground.com/101667554

Hillary Clinton and Trade Deals: That “Giant Sucking Sound”
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1016101761

Hillary Clinton Cheerleads for Biotech and GMOs
http://www.democraticunderground.com/112772326

Dissecting Hillary Clinton's Neocon Talking Points - Atlantic Interview
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017209519

NYTimes notices Hillary's natural affinity toward the neocons.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025205645

Hillary Clinton, the unrepentant hawk
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024876898

More from Hillary Clinton's State Department: The fascistic TISA (Trade in Services Agreement)
http://m.thenation.com/blog/180572-grassroots-labor-uprising-your-bank

How Hillary Clinton's State Department sold fracking to the world
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251376647

Hillary Clinton Sides with NSA over Snowden Disclosures
http://www.democraticunderground.com/101695441

On the NSA, Hillary Clinton Is Either a Fool or a Liar
http://m.thenation.com/article/180564-nsa-hillary-clinton-either-fool-or-liar

Corporate Warfare: Hillary Clinton admits role in Honduran coup aftermath
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025601610#post29

The Bill and Hillary Clinton Money Machine Taps Corporate Cash
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025189257

Hillary's Privatization Plan: TISA kept more secret than the TPP
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014829628

Hillary Clinton criticizes Obama's foreign policy 'failure'; strongly defends Israel
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014867136

Some of Hillary Clinton's statements on Social Security.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024379279

Hillary Clinton's GOLDMAN SACHS PROBLEM.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025049343

Ring of Fire: Hillary Clinton - The Perfect Republican Candidate
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017209285

How Americans Need Answers From Hillary Clinton On TPP, KXL, Wall St & More
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017181611

Hillary Clinton Left Out By Liberal Donor Club
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025809071

Why Wall Street Loves Hillary
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1016106575

Hillary Clinton: Neocon-lite
http://www.democraticunderground.com/101684986

Interactive graphic of Hillary Clinton's connections to the Forbes top 400 (Follow link in post)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025824981#post9

Jakes Progress

(11,122 posts)
231. For which republican
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 06:02 PM
Jan 2015

will you vote then?

The description above sounds a lot like Obama. But you won't get to choose between his brand of third way and hers. He can't run again. If you have been happy with Obama, you will be happy with Hillary.

cui bono

(19,926 posts)
234. False choice. We can run someone else. That's the point.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 06:22 PM
Jan 2015

We don't want a choice between two Republican mindsets and if Hillary is the "Democratic" candidate that's what we'll have.

And no real liberals are happy with Obama and they won't be happy with Hillary either. That's why we are saying no to Hillary. We don't need another moderate republican president such as Obama. If you wonder why I say that just check my last journal entry. He calls himself that.

Jakes Progress

(11,122 posts)
285. It was the choice the poster set up.
Sat Jan 24, 2015, 12:18 PM
Jan 2015

I'm not a fan of third way either. My problem is the invective flung at Hillary for the same positions and actions that are praised when Obama does them. I don't think candidates are what we should be arguing now. That is the politics of personality. It is too easy to demonize this man or that woman without regard to what they really do. We should be arguing policy. The policy of this "alternative" to Hillary campaigned as a progressive and administered an executive branch that was something to the right of richard nixon.

That said. We won't get a choice. Hillary will likely be our candidate. I think it better to trap her into progressive positions during the campaign and hope that she might be less willing to ignore her promises. Didn't work with Obama, but, hey. Citizens united just made public what was already happening. Our candidates will be chosen by others.

Color me cynical.

InAbLuEsTaTe

(24,122 posts)
265. "No" to Hillary; there, I said it. "Yes" to Obama's third term (paging Michele, please pick up the red hotline phone).
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 10:12 PM
Jan 2015

Jakes Progress

(11,122 posts)
286. If you think
Sat Jan 24, 2015, 12:20 PM
Jan 2015

there would be a difference between Hillary's first term and Obama's third, you are lightly informed and easily swayed.

But you seem to be a positive and happy person. That is a good thing. Go with that. I am not to positive or happy with what has happened with my party.

Cleita

(75,480 posts)
3. Her friendship with Henry Kissinger makes me not be
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:01 PM
Jan 2015

her fan. There is better and we have to get behind them.

marym625

(17,997 posts)
4. Have said no to Hillary
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:02 PM
Jan 2015

From the moment she voted for the war. Actually, before that but that was the nail in the coffin for me

 

AtomicKitten

(46,585 posts)
7. It was that craven, immoral vote for me too.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:13 PM
Jan 2015

I said no to her in 2008.
I will do the same in 2016.

marym625

(17,997 posts)
70. Can you share?
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:35 PM
Jan 2015

Please? Pretty please?

Skinner will make it one of the set ones if you share it with him.

It's great!

 

AtomicKitten

(46,585 posts)
132. Sure thing.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 12:59 AM
Jan 2015
http://i.imgur.com/ZCKzsqw

Slap a ".jpg" on the end of that and you've got the image. Please feel free to submit it to the DU smilie fairy for inclusion in the pile 'o smilies.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
59. That's when I said goodbye to her also. And then when Sen. Graham told us that Senators had
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:17 PM
Jan 2015

access to the full information they needed before the vote, which is what changed HIS mind, and that some of them didn't go look at that information, Hillary being one of them, that sealed it. It told me she wanted to be able to say she believed the lies. That was a huge deception.

So, no, I will not be supporting her.

marym625

(17,997 posts)
63. I could live to be 1000
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:22 PM
Jan 2015

And still that vote will piss me off. How could little old me know there were no WMD but the Senate didn't? Huh? How? Someone please explain that to me.

Fucking lying pieces of shit money, power hungry asswipes. Weak, spineless, murdering bastards.

Arrrggghhh!!!!

A Simple Game

(9,214 posts)
219. Thank you for telling how I feel about that Senate vote.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 04:32 PM
Jan 2015

Saved a lot on my adjective allocation for the month.

None of the information was even secret, it was readily available on the TV, newspapers, internet, etc...

marym625

(17,997 posts)
226. You're welcome
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 05:05 PM
Jan 2015

Haven't done that in a while. But I think about what we did......

We should be on our hands and knees apologizing, paying restitution, rebuilding on our dime and prosecuting the main culprits.

Sorry. I can't think about this without flipping out.

InAbLuEsTaTe

(24,122 posts)
268. That sealed the deal for me too. I'm sick of politicians like Hillary who check which way the political wind is blowing before taking a "principled" stand...
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 10:17 PM
Jan 2015

... or in this case, an UNprincipled stand.

Jakes Progress

(11,122 posts)
287. So voting
Sat Jan 24, 2015, 12:24 PM
Jan 2015

for the war was terrible.

But conducting and expanding the war and the bush surveillance and the drone war is okay-dokey.

Not a fan of her record either. But she did what she voted. Obama didn't.

Jakes Progress

(11,122 posts)
295. Sorry to have lumped
Sun Jan 25, 2015, 06:30 PM
Jan 2015

you in with the silly people who think there is a difference between Hillary and Obama.

Actually, there might be. She voted for the war and helped conduct it. Obama voted against the war, campaigned against the war, got elected and awarded a prize for doing so, then carried on with the bushwar. Does that count as honest? Doesn't get my vote, but . . .

 

yeoman6987

(14,449 posts)
5. So who then?
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:05 PM
Jan 2015

Warren - no interest to run as she mentioned numerous times.
O'Malley - my Governor for 8 years. Decent progressive but lost the Governorship for his LT Gov and can be boring while speaking.
Sanders - Good choice but has made no attemp to change parties yet.
Dean - good choice, but endorsed Hillary.
Webb - ok choice but kinda moderate.


So who? Serious question.

peacebird

(14,195 posts)
8. Not sure yet, but any Dem but Hillary at least gives us a chance things will improve....
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:14 PM
Jan 2015

I like Warren, I like Sanders, I am open to fresh voices. I am not open to someone who has sold their soul to the vampiresquids of wall street like Hillary has.

Agschmid

(28,749 posts)
83. Whenever anyone says "any dem but Hillary" I chuckle...
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:44 PM
Jan 2015

There are many Dems out there who are just as "bad" or worse than her by the measurements laid out in the OP.

 

truebluegreen

(9,033 posts)
244. Don't know about other progressives,
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 07:53 PM
Jan 2015

but I'd rather have a national bank in government hands (and pay the interest to ourselves) instead of the current set-up.

Kinda doubt the Paulbots would agree with that.

 

fbc

(1,668 posts)
12. Well, so far Romney looks like he intends to run to the left of Clinton.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:28 PM
Jan 2015

Maybe he can switch parties.

BlueCaliDem

(15,438 posts)
22. So what you're saying is, you support Mitt Romney for president? Okay. I know enough about you. eom
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:41 PM
Jan 2015

WhiteTara

(29,704 posts)
32. No, I don't think that's what he said.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:56 PM
Jan 2015

Maybe I'm wrong, but he was being a bit sarcastic. The chance of our nominee not being Hillary is fairly slim.

 

fbc

(1,668 posts)
164. yeah
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 12:10 PM
Jan 2015

I was being facetious.

But... there's a grain of truth to it: Even Romney has been using populist rhetoric very recently. Now, of course I don't believe a bit of it coming from a guy who made his fortunes destroying American businesses and putting people out of work.

But it does go to show how out of touch the mainstream Democratic party is these days when even Republicans are talking about the wealth gap while they continue to put their weight behind Blue Dogs and Wall Street darlings like Hillary Clinton.

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
259. I am disappointed in that comment. It's as if that's the only choice.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 10:03 PM
Jan 2015

We need to kick the conservatives, including H. Clinton-Sachs into the other party where they belong.

H. Clinton showed in 2002 that she has zero integrity. Her stand on Iraq was the same as Bush. Do you forgive them both?

 

truebluegreen

(9,033 posts)
245. I know you are being sarcastic but of course he is lying:
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 07:58 PM
Jan 2015

rMoney is trying to change the packaging, but not the contents. It is still all about tax cuts for the rich, deregulation, etc.: that will fix everything!

WDIM

(1,662 posts)
24. Thom Hartmann
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:47 PM
Jan 2015

That would be interesting.
I like Warren I hope she changes her mind.
Sanders would be a dream.
Im hoping for a voice to come through thats maybe unknown on national scale. Like Clinton in 92 wasnt a huge national name and came in as the underdog. Everybody likes an underdog.

pacalo

(24,721 posts)
34. I'm wondering...
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:57 PM
Jan 2015

why the writing style in the OP doesn't match the writing style in your reply to yeoman6987. If the OP was written by someone else, please include the attribution in the OP.

redstateblues

(10,565 posts)
88. I like him but Bernie will never be elected president
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:48 PM
Jan 2015

An avowed socialist will not be elected President of the U.S.

bullsnarfle

(254 posts)
192. Yeah --- if he runs just watch
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 02:40 PM
Jan 2015

the rightwings plaster "he's a (gasp!) EVIL SOCIALIST!!!" all over your t.v., mail, the net, etc., 24-7, with Koch Bros mega-funds. Will probably work too, seeing as their fan base is so damned ignorant. Too bad, he's one of the only people in D.C. that's worth a rat's ass, IMO.

And then again...it wasn't too long ago that I would have thought (with all the %@! bigots of voting age in this country) that a black man might never be elected president, at least not in my lifetime.

Maybe, just maybe, we should never say "never"?

 

truebluegreen

(9,033 posts)
246. The people who would be freaked out by the label
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 08:06 PM
Jan 2015

are people who would never vote for him regardless. I don't think it would be as big a detriment as conventional wisdom would indicate. Something that could be a problem: RWNJs spending 6+ years hyperventilating about Obama being a Socialist...and thereby tarnishing the term for a new generation.

appalachiablue

(41,131 posts)
98. I'm an avid TH follower for almost 5 years. Amazing genius but doubt he would run for office.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 12:06 AM
Jan 2015

Sanders and Warren are top pics for me. Dean's great but declared he'd support Hillary. Welcome to DU.

DemocratSinceBirth

(99,710 posts)
167. You said you wanted someone from outside the Beltway.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 12:19 PM
Jan 2015

How can two sitting senators be "from outside the Beltway"?

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
48. I don't care what she says. I'm not giving upon Warren.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:06 PM
Jan 2015

But I will back Bernie Sanders if he becomes a Democrat. And I think he will.

I could be wrong, but I think he is going to run and just has to announce that he will run as a Democrat. He has to get his percent of the vote over 4%. Because I want to see him and/or Elizabeth Warren or maybe both debate Hillary. Hillary is not a good debater.

She is rather smug and doesn't think on her feet as well as say Obama or maybe even Biden.

She learns her stuff, but she doesn't own it.

 

Voice for Peace

(13,141 posts)
198. I can't wait for Hillary to make her big announcement that she's throwing her support behind Liz.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 03:45 PM
Jan 2015

heh

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
258. So what's your point? That we have to settle for H. Clinton-Sachs?
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 09:59 PM
Jan 2015

Not me. I made a pledge when those bastard Democrats chose to bow before King George and give him authority to destroy Iraq and the US middle class. I pledge to never support any Democrat that betrayed us and went arm in arm into that war.

They are all responsible for the deaths of hundreds of thousands of people. May their gods send them to hell.

 

L0oniX

(31,493 posts)
6. The oligarchy (third way) will pick her and we will get the usual distraction crumbs.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:12 PM
Jan 2015

$$$ rules in both parties. Anyone who is for Hillary is a centrist, not a Democrat. Real Democrats do not bend over to corporations. Either get back to our FDR roots or admit you are with the 1%. No more facade candidates with smooth speeches and false promises.

BlueCaliDem

(15,438 posts)
17. "Anyone who is for Hillary is a centrist, not a Democrat." That's a lie.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:37 PM
Jan 2015

I'm NOT centrist, but I'm NO loser, either. So far, SoS Clinton has got everything in place to win the White House, and that's all that matters to me - WINNING. All my hopes and dreams of moving this country forward on a more progressive path will be dead and buried if we can't get a Democrat into the White House and win back the Senate in 2016 (we'll have to wait for 2020 to have a chance to win back the House when it's time for Republicans to gerrymander again and we can stop them).

Also, for the left-leaning Indies who wax poetic over FDR, please stop doing that history revisionism and CYA. In his time, FDR was constantly attacked by people from his left flank. Constantly. FDR was attacked for being too close to Wall Street, that his New Deal was too pragmatic and didn't go far enough, and he was criticized for "preferring conservative rather than liberalism". Do any of these ring a bell?

Now, all of a sudden, FDR's become the Left's shining beacon of liberalism? Give me a break.

RiverLover

(7,830 posts)
26. What you say about FDR is all wrong. Read up on those times before spouting this stuff.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:49 PM
Jan 2015

He fought the Wall Street Dems of those days. He had ALOT of republican help to achieve all that he did. Republicans weren't the party they are today. There's alot of history there to be proud of, and he fought Wall Street & WON & our country WON.

Until a Democrat deregulated.(& he deregulated alot more than just Wall Street regulations.)

And now we have Hillary, Wall Street's Darling. Rubin & Summer's Darling.

The only thing worse than A Republican is a Republican with a (D) behind their name.

BlueCaliDem

(15,438 posts)
36. I have. Apparently YOU haven't. Ever heard of Huey Pierce Long of Louisiana? He was the loudest
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:58 PM
Jan 2015

detractor of President FDR from his Left.

This is what Schlesinger wrote about what Gov. Long said in early 1935:

"Long retained deep suspicions of some of Roosevelt’s associates. A day or two before the inauguration, he came to (FDR advisor and braintruster Raymond) Moley’s room at the Mayflower, kicked the door open, chewed on an apple, and said pugnaciously, "I don’t like you and your goddamned banker friends!"...and in May denounced the administration on the ground that it was dominated by the same old clique of bankers who had controlled Hoover. "Parker Gilbert from Morgan & Company, Leffingwell, Ballantine, Eugene Meyer, every one of them are here – what’s the use of hemming and hawing? (Schlesinger, The Politics of Upheaval 54-55)

Sound familiar to you, Riverlover?

BlueCaliDem

(15,438 posts)
186. I was referring to PRE-1938. Here's rec reading that's FREE:
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 02:10 PM
Jan 2015
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2010/08/11/891631/-UPDATED-Liberal-Criticism-of-Franklin-Roosevelt-and-The-New-Deal

It has timelines and references galore. It's illuminating, educational, and FREE. The excerpts are written by notable and highly respected Historian David Kennedy, a Pulitzer prize winner for his book, "Freedom from Fear: The American People in Depression and War, 1929-1945" (Oxford History of the United States) Paperback – April 19, 2001.

dflprincess

(28,075 posts)
28. He was also attacked from the right and accused of being a "traitor to his class"
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:50 PM
Jan 2015

Certainly, even Eleanor would have liked him to be further left than he was.

But he did do a few good things, the CCC, WPA, PWA, TVA, Rural Electric Authority, Social Security, the SEC, FDIC, Glass Steagall.

Let's face it, compared to today's Third Way types (you know, the crowd that repealed Glass Steagall and wouldn't have a lot of problems destroying Social Security?), FDR looks like a Socialist.

dflprincess

(28,075 posts)
278. I didn't say he was a Socialist
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 11:07 PM
Jan 2015

I said compared to today's Third Way types who are content to let Wall Street run wild and attack Social Security, he looks like one.

Remember his "economic bill of rights" you'll never see Clinton and her crowd proposing anything like that. (Oh, maybe during campaign season, but it will be forgotten after the election).

BlueCaliDem

(15,438 posts)
42. Anyone who states that they won't vote for Hillary Clinton no matter what, is the Republican.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:59 PM
Jan 2015

Last edited Fri Jan 23, 2015, 09:03 PM - Edit history (1)

And I've clearly stated that should she win the nom, I will vote for *you her. How about you, reimaginthis? Gonna stay home and give your vote by default to Jebbie Bush or Mittney? Do tell.

BlueCaliDem

(15,438 posts)
227. Then you should've known, as a registered "Democrat", that it's OFFICIALLY the Democratic Party.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 05:13 PM
Jan 2015

Only Republicans refer to the Democratic Party as the Democrat Party.

Freudian slip, perhaps? That would explain the posts I've so far read from you.

BlueCaliDem

(15,438 posts)
250. A simple, "Oops! My bad" would've sufficed. Instead, you double down.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 09:13 PM
Jan 2015

That tells me all I need to know about you.

BeanMusical

(4,389 posts)
85. "I've clearly stated that should she win the nom, I will vote for you."
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:45 PM
Jan 2015

So if Hillary is the nominee you'll vote for reimaginthis?

cui bono

(19,926 posts)
236. So you think that a person who enacts Republican policy but belongs
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 06:40 PM
Jan 2015

to the Dem Party is okay to vote for? But people who won't vote for the Republican policy are the Republicans?

Um... okay.

We've just had a self-described moderate Republican. We need a REAL Democrat. Someone who remembers what Dems are supposed to stand for. Someone who is actually on the left.

cui bono

(19,926 posts)
293. I don't dislike Obama. I dislike him enacting and pursuing moderate Republican policy.
Sat Jan 24, 2015, 02:30 PM
Jan 2015

But you go ahead and keep ignoring substance and just react emotionally as you just did.

DemocratSinceBirth

(99,710 posts)
170. Calling someone a Republican when he or she isn't is very bad form.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 12:25 PM
Jan 2015

A mere step from calling a person a criminal, thieve or liar.

WDIM

(1,662 posts)
37. Anybody could win at this point.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:58 PM
Jan 2015

Sure Hillary is going to have the war chest and the media bias on her side, but with a ground swell movement the people could bring in our candidate.

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
52. FDR put some of the cheats on Wall Street in jail. He investigated the rest, publicly denounced
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:10 PM
Jan 2015

them and put the fear of God into them right up until the S&L crisis in the 1980s and until 2008.

Both he and Teddy Roosevelt valued government that was close to free from corruption.

The banking cabal in D.C. to which the Clintons are very close is about as corrupt as you can get. They are so corrupt they think they are the government.

davidpdx

(22,000 posts)
147. So is everyone who that refuses to support Clinton a "left-leaning Indie"?
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 08:47 AM
Jan 2015

This seems like a full blown meme now. I've heard at least one or two other DU member use similar terms. I think it is funny how someone who is part of the Democratic Party can try to tell someone they are not welcome.

zeemike

(18,998 posts)
58. Well Hillary is the GOP's best chance for the white house.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:17 PM
Jan 2015

And so they will make sure she wins...the media will declare her the winner early.
And even if she were to win the presidency nothing would change, so it is a win win.
Warren or Sanders are our best choice, but I suspect the pressure will come to bear against them, and we will be fed with bullshit to convince us it is good.

 

fbc

(1,668 posts)
10. I will not vote if she's the nominee.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:27 PM
Jan 2015

The democratic party is never going to stop going for republican-light as long as we keep voting them in as the lesser of two evils.

winter is coming

(11,785 posts)
27. False. An uncast ballot is an uncast ballot, and as such, goes to no one.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:49 PM
Jan 2015

Telling people "but that means you're voting for a Republican!" is a poor GOTV strategy. Really? The best that can be said for a candidate is that they're not a member of the other party? That's unlikely to fire up reluctant or disinterested voters.

 

MohRokTah

(15,429 posts)
38. An uncast ballot is acceptance for what everybody else decides.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:58 PM
Jan 2015

If the Democrat wins, that uncast ballot is for the Democrat.

If a Republican wins, that uncast ballot is for the Republican.

winter is coming

(11,785 posts)
57. No, an uncast ballot is a statement that the choice presented is irrelevant to the would-be voter.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:16 PM
Jan 2015

It's not an endorsement of either party, but a condemnation of both.

 

MohRokTah

(15,429 posts)
60. Nope, it's an acceptance of the outcome, regardless.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:19 PM
Jan 2015

A write in is a statement that the choice presented is irrelevant.

An uncast ballot is acceptance of the outcome regardless.

winter is coming

(11,785 posts)
76. What a bizarre thing to say.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:39 PM
Jan 2015

Both a write-in and a non-vote are ways to indicate that the choices presented are unacceptable/irrelevant to the voter. Both are tacit acceptance that someone the voter does not support will be elected. Functionally, they're equivalent, and neither choice can/should be read as an endorsement of one major candidate over another.

 

MohRokTah

(15,429 posts)
81. The only bizarre thing I see is trying to say an uncast ballot is a protest vote.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:42 PM
Jan 2015

It's an acceptance of the outcome regardless. The ONLY protest votes cast are wither third party votes or write in votes.

 

YoungDemCA

(5,714 posts)
202. Funny, that sounds like what the Nader voters said in 2000
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 04:13 PM
Jan 2015

Well, I guess Bush and Obama are both Republicans, and are "equally" bad.

xmas74

(29,674 posts)
140. Yep.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 02:28 AM
Jan 2015

If she's our nominee I'll campaign and vote for her. I live in a very red area and don't want that to extend all the way to the WH. Not voting for the party candidate in the general election is the same as handing over your vote to the other side.

dflprincess

(28,075 posts)
30. Even if you choose not to vote in the presidential race, please show up
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:53 PM
Jan 2015

to vote in any other races in your area. Or, at least, just file a blank ballot - in most areas it's the only way you can say "none of the above". And it shows you were paying attention and didn't just not vote out apathy.

SomeGuyInEagan

(1,515 posts)
111. Yes.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 12:25 AM
Jan 2015

Candidates down ticket need your consideration. This election's local candidate may be the next election's state candidate.

AndyTiedye

(23,500 posts)
65. Every Time the Democrats Lose, the Party Moves farther to the Right
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:28 PM
Jan 2015

The only way to move the party leftwards is in the primaries. There. Is. No. Other. Way.

 

fbc

(1,668 posts)
13. The alternative is to not vote.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:29 PM
Jan 2015

Make the democratic party give us a democrat if they want our votes.

BlueCaliDem

(15,438 posts)
20. I'm certain Rove and the Koch Bros are supportive of your alternative and plans.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:40 PM
Jan 2015

They're hoping that you can convince a few tens of million more. I hope they'll send you a Thank You note afterward since they'll be able to take back the White House, because you can bet your behind that Republicans and Teabaggers, no matter how disenchanted they are with the establishment Republican Party, WILL VOTE and they WILL VOTE Republican.

Response to BlueCaliDem (Reply #20)

 

MohRokTah

(15,429 posts)
47. Kucinich stands a better chance of winning the Democratic nomination than Zell Miller.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:05 PM
Jan 2015

Now you're just pushing absurd points.

BlueCaliDem

(15,438 posts)
49. So commons sense is bizarre to you? Well, what I've written is pretty bizarre to RWers, too,
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:07 PM
Jan 2015

so maybe your perception is the problem, not my post. I mean, you even brought up...Zell Miller?! Now that's bizarre.

Like I said, whoever wins the nom will get my vote. I'll be outraged in the primaries and vote for the better candidate, but when the dust settles and the majority decides on a Democratic nominee, I will vote for that Democrat because - and this may come across as bizarre again to you - I want a DEMOCRAT TO WIN.

And, by the way, you've got a real attitude for someone who only has 23 posts who has yet to prove to be a Democrat around here while accusing me of being a Republican. I've been here since December 2004. My Democratic bona fides are proven. How about yours?

 

fbc

(1,668 posts)
168. Well they win both ways don't they?
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 12:20 PM
Jan 2015

Here's how they don't win: a progressive democrat in the white house.

BlueCaliDem

(15,438 posts)
182. Wrong. They only win a little under a Democrat but hugely under a Republican.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 01:46 PM
Jan 2015

Should a Republican capture the White House in 2016, the American people WILL LOSE. Period.

Although this might be too little for all-or-nothing people like you, fbc, I would like to defer you to the wise idiom: better to have ONE bird in the hand than two in the Bush. Pun intended.

 

fbc

(1,668 posts)
194. I am a Progressive. Or a Liberal. I'm not "take whatever crap the Blue dogs foist on me"
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 03:33 PM
Jan 2015

If Hillary Clinton is a representative democrat, then I guess we need a new party.

 

YoungDemCA

(5,714 posts)
204. Who's "we?" Hillary is pretty popular among Democratic voters
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 04:15 PM
Jan 2015

No, DU is not representative of the Democratic voter base. Far from it.

There's a lot of petty provincialism and wishful thinking around these parts.

bluedigger

(17,086 posts)
66. And a couple of high count posters throwing their weight around dismissively.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:30 PM
Jan 2015

Just argue the issues and quit worrying about who has the biggest dick.

Autumn

(45,064 posts)
97. It's not just newbies who don't like Hillary. I didn't see an 'I hate Hillary' in the OP
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 12:05 AM
Jan 2015

Hmmmm......... Some people see hate, others see a fairly new poster laying out damn good reasons for someone other than Hillary.

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
260. Maybe you are starting to get the point. If you want Jeb, then nominate Clinton-Sachs.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 10:07 PM
Jan 2015

Because a lot of us will not forgive her betrayal. We will find an alternative. It will be an uphill fight because the Oligarch money is on Clinton-Sachs. Funny how some Dems (?) will side with the Oligarchy when the chips are down.

Response to project_bluebook (Reply #14)

 

TheProgressive

(1,656 posts)
15. I will no longer vote for a republican who is a registered Democrat
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:34 PM
Jan 2015

I will vote for Senator Sanders. I will vote for Senator Warren.

But I will not vote for Clinton. If she is the nominee, I hope there is a
good Green Party or Independent candidate.

Response to TheProgressive (Reply #15)

Response to TheProgressive (Reply #116)

 

TheProgressive

(1,656 posts)
131. First, my profile states 'Northern California'
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 12:57 AM
Jan 2015

I will never, repeat never, vote for a republican who is a registered Democrat.
Clinton is a republican...

It is called integrity. And I plan on sticking to my integrity.

Maybe everyone should 'stick to integrity'....

And reading comprehension is our friend...!

 

MohRokTah

(15,429 posts)
153. I see no integrity in what you claim you will do.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 09:16 AM
Jan 2015

In fact, it is my opinion that such a move completely lacks any integrity at all.

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
266. And integrity is important to you. Clinton switched sides and bowed to King George Bush and
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 10:14 PM
Jan 2015

help him sell the IWar. She has zero integrity. She is too smart to be fooled by the biggest fool ever, she is too smart to believe the lies, so why did she betray the Democratic Party and side with the worst President in our history. She has zero integrity.

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
273. What? You support her in spite of her lack of integrity because Sen Warren endorsed her?
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 10:31 PM
Jan 2015

I don't care who endorses her, she has betrayed the Democratic Party, the American people and is as much responsible for the deaths in Iraq as George Bush. Do you forgive both her and Bush?

 

MohRokTah

(15,429 posts)
276. I supprt her because she is a GOOD LIBERAL DEMOCRAT.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 10:43 PM
Jan 2015

Fuck the extreme left who cannot accept facts.

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
281. What is the "extreme left" you hate so much? Tell me what do they want that
Sat Jan 24, 2015, 01:00 AM
Jan 2015

you don't agree with?

A "good liberal" wouldn't have been caught dead bowing down to George Bush and helping him sell the war. A "good liberal" would have stood their ground and told the Republicans to go to hell. But not H. Clinton, she said to her close friend, "George, how can I help sell this war."

To you H. Clinton is a liberal and those that want freedom and liberty are "extreme left". You have no idea what liberal means.

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
283. What does the extreme left want that you don't want? When you disparage the "extreme left"
Sat Jan 24, 2015, 01:11 AM
Jan 2015

you should tell us why. Why does a Democrat disparage other Democrats. Especially those that are fighting hard for the 99%. Tell me what issues do you disagree with the "extreme left". They don't like fracking how do you feel? They don't like the TPP, how do you feel? They don't like torture, how do you feel? They don't like the Patriot Act, Wall Street bailouts, Arne F'n Duncan, Thomas F'n Wheeler, Penny Pritzker, drone killings, unlimited war in the middle east, NSA domestic spying, etc. How do you feel on those issues? If you disagree with the left, speak out.



RiverLover

(7,830 posts)
16. Clinton plans to astound, intimidate with fundraising ‘like nothing you’ve seen’
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:35 PM
Jan 2015

Its like a devastatingly destructive tsunami, a wall of money to drown everyone but her, & her corporate & bankster sponsors who want continued control over govt policies...

Clinton plans to astound, intimidate with fundraising ‘like nothing you’ve seen’
1/22/15
http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/230306-clinton-plans-to-astound-intimidate-with-fundraising-like-nothing-youve

tclambert

(11,085 posts)
21. Oh, boy, that could be the deciding factor.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:41 PM
Jan 2015

Who can drum up more money? Probably no Democrat can match Clinton. Warren is certainly more popular. But what big money people would back her? And what about Republicans? Will the Kochs throw so much money at the election they can drown Hillary?

Let's hope the Republicans have a really destructive primary fight and burn hundreds of millions just to get the nomination.

 

lewebley3

(3,412 posts)
208. What Hillary is doing is fight for the nomination!! Which is a good Idea , if she wants it!!
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 04:20 PM
Jan 2015


I like women are ambitious, its want it takes to get power, and
when Hillary gets she will put forward a progressive agenda
on behalf of America.
 

MohRokTah

(15,429 posts)
35. Nope, I'm backing Hillary.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 10:57 PM
Jan 2015

My mind is made up. I'll only support another Democrat if they are capable of defeating Hillary in the primaries.

onehandle

(51,122 posts)
45. Hillary started a company who's primary purpose was outsourcing and got rich off of it?
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:03 PM
Jan 2015

And she wears magic underwear?

Really?

BlueCaliDem

(15,438 posts)
50. LOTS of newbies with low post counts hating on SoS Clinton. Republicans must be terrified
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:08 PM
Jan 2015

by her imminent candidacy.

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
51. I will be backing Hillary, she has the ability to step in the shoes of being president.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:09 PM
Jan 2015

I know there is a lot of trash talking, I read it over and over, the same things she is accused of being a corporatists can be delivered to Sanders and Warren. I have not investigated other possible candidates but saying Hillary is too far right and a Dino or Republican when she and Warren is rated the same in the chart of being left does not hold water. Gotta come up with a better story. She is very familiar with security concerns and more experience than others on this issue. Truth and facts should be given and the talking points FOX and Rove provide is just talking points. They do not have a match for Hillary just as they did not have for Obama.

 

Purveyor

(29,876 posts)
53. She is going to regret not having a spirited primary season. As it stands now the repukes
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:12 PM
Jan 2015

are going to suck all of the oxygen out of the political room with their primaries and the DEM's will be left standing out in the cold until the general.

This only works for incumbents which, as much as she might think she is, she is not.

 

MissDeeds

(7,499 posts)
55. No way in hell will I vote for Hillary
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:15 PM
Jan 2015

If she is the nominee, I will write in the candidate of my choice.

Response to MissDeeds (Reply #55)

benz380

(534 posts)
162. My vote may be discarded if I don't vote for Hillary, but I'll leave with a clear conscience...
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 11:17 AM
Jan 2015

...that I didn't support a warmongering corporatist. I'll write in Warren and vote for other REAL Democrats down ballot.
Enough of feeling guilty about someone I vote for supporting war and the TPP. As far as SCOTUS appointments, Hillary will choose whoever her Wall Street masters tell her to.

Bobbie Jo

(14,341 posts)
171. Well, you have the talking points and buzz words
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 12:27 PM
Jan 2015

down pat, right down to the "don't vote" message. Write-ins are the equivalent to not voting, but of course you know that.

Welcome to DU.

 

lewebley3

(3,412 posts)
210. No way I would vote for anyone..... but Hillary!!!
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 04:24 PM
Jan 2015



We need to stick together as we did with Obama, if
you don't back the democratic nomination you are backing
the GOP. Voting is not just a personal choice is for the
betterment of your fellow Americans. That is why I voted
for Obama with pinch of nose, otherwise MCain, would have
destroyed SS.
 

lobodons

(1,290 posts)
56. Million times YES to Hillary!!!
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:16 PM
Jan 2015

If she is the Dem Nominee. Would prefer Warren, but who ever the Dem. nominee, then YES YES YES!!!!

Response to lobodons (Reply #56)

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
263. "million"?? Is that how many deaths from the IWar she is responsible for? Her and Bush, two peas in
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 10:10 PM
Jan 2015

a pod. Never in a million years. If the Democratic Party has sold out to the Oligarchy and runs Clinton/Goldman-Sachs, then the country is toast.

RiverLover

(7,830 posts)
62. FDR "welcomed their hatred"...think Hillary will ever say this....
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:21 PM
Jan 2015

"We had to struggle with the old enemies of peace — business and financial monopoly, speculation, reckless banking, class antagonism, sectionalism, war profiteering.

They had begun to consider the Government of the United States as a mere appendage to their own affairs. We know now that Government by organized money is just as dangerous as Government by organized mob. Never before in all our history have these forces been so united against one candidate as they stand today. They are unanimous in their hate for me — and I welcome their hatred."

Franklin Delano Roosevelt, 1936

WDIM

(1,662 posts)
72. Nice FDR quote
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:37 PM
Jan 2015

FDR was the one that proposed an economic bill of rights be added to the constitution. You'd never see Hillary propose these rights as amendments and guaranteed to all people.

 

SheilaT

(23,156 posts)
68. There are several things that terrify me about The Inevitability of Hillary.
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:32 PM
Jan 2015

First off, we went through this before. Explain to me again why she's not now halfway through her second term?

She represents nothing new, and is in fact a throwback to the worst of the "centrist Democrats" that have done all of us ill.

While supporting her is reasonably admirable, even if I don't, what is inexplicable to me is that her supporters honestly believe that she's bullet-proof because she's been thoroughly vetted because of the campaign on 2008. Are you collectively out of your minds? If she becomes the nominee, every single thing that was ever held against her in the past will be brought up again. And again. And again. Not to mention, this time around she has a record as Secretary of State. You think Benghazi is over and done with? How the Republicans will deal with it will make the swift-boating of Kerry look like a love fest.

The only way she would win the election is 1. If the Republicans nominate someone who is so genuinely unacceptable to the general voter (Romney? Paul Ryan? Rand Paul? Chris Christie?) that even more of them will stay home than Democrats 2. If in the next two years reasonably sensible voters will finally see through the hypocrisy and genuine evil intentions of the Republicans with regard to things like Social Security, Medicare, overall financial doings and start voting in their own self interest. Not that Hillary really represents the self interest of the Middle Class. She is quite firmly aligned with the corporate class, and anyone who doesn't get it is simply mistaken.

As for Elizabeth Warren, keep in mind that she was not at all keen to run for the Senate seat she now holds. Ordinary Democrats need to start going to events she's attending and tell her how much she matters to us and how important it is that she run for President.

And then we all need to be nurturing a new generation of politicians.

 

SheilaT

(23,156 posts)
143. Thank you for your appreciation.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 05:20 AM
Jan 2015

I try, although I don't always succeed, to make worthwhile posts here. I am truly disturbed by the Hillary worship, both here and outside of DU. To me it's a blind fascination with a particular possibility, in this case the First Female President. We saw it in 2008, and I had many arguments both here and in the world outside of DU. The scary thing back then was the fierce determination of the Hillary supporters not to give up. They were labelled PUMAS -- Party Unity My Ass -- for those of you too young to have experienced this. There was a genuine possibility that the PUMAs could completely undermine Democratic unity if the Hillary supporters simply picked up their bats and balls and left the field. On one hand I admire such loyalty -- I was an original Deaniac and so I understand -- but on the other there was a real chance these die-hards would either destroy the party, or at the very least lose the election for us. In the end, thanks in no small part to Hillary's genuine graciousness in defeat, we hung together and won in 2008.

But there's a sense of, "Okay, now it REALLY is Hillary's time" that ignores the reality of the current political situation.

I'm a genuine political activist. I've run for office. I've given money. I've met many of the major players. And this is NOT Hillary's time. The time is for someone else. I'd like it to be Elizabeth Warren, but I'm no prophet. I do know that if we reach back into the past and nominate Hillary Clinton, even if she wins, we'll be aligning ourselves with a lost and obsolete past. We need to be looking to the future, as a party and as a country.

 

ieoeja

(9,748 posts)
200. You mean African-Americans might not vote for her when reminded of her racist campaign in 2008?
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 04:03 PM
Jan 2015

Unless her Democratic opponents are completely incompetent at running a campaign, they are going to remind Black voters of that. It is kind of hard to get the Democratic nominee without Black voters.

Of course, these are Democratic pols we're talking about. So it wouldn't surprise me in the least if they forget "hard working White people", attempts to suppress the Black vote in Las Vegas, Ferraro, Bill's dog-whistling, etc.

 

SheilaT

(23,156 posts)
230. I'll be honest here and admit my ignorance.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 05:55 PM
Jan 2015

I was not aware of a racist campaign on her part, but that may be simply because I myself am white, and therefore sometimes don't notice such things.

BklnDem75

(2,918 posts)
73. No to this OP...
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:38 PM
Jan 2015

I'll vote for whoever the Democratic nominee is. Good luck campaigning against Democrats you don't agree with.

Frances

(8,545 posts)
94. I am also voting for Hillary
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:59 PM
Jan 2015

When Obama won the nomination, I worked hard for him.

I expect most Dems will work for Hillary if she wins the nomination.

Of course, I'm old enough to remember when some young people in CA told me that they could not vote for Brown against Reagan just because Brown was the lesser of 2 evils.

I'm not stupid. I saw how that worked out. I won't make that mistake.

fadedrose

(10,044 posts)
84. All you have to do
Thu Jan 22, 2015, 11:45 PM
Jan 2015

is not believe the polls.

I never do. And change the TV station every time they say how so many Dems support her. You and I don't, and there are plenty like us, right here in Du.

sunnystarr

(2,638 posts)
99. Sounds to me like a lot in DU
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 12:09 AM
Jan 2015

want us to believe you. I don't. There would never, and I mean NEVER, be a reason I wouldn't vote for the Democratic candidate. There's only ONE requirement. Be a Democrat. I don't care which kind and where the stars and stripes fall. While some will give their wedge issue d'jour, there's really only one issue. Not voting or voting for a 3rd candidate is voting AGAINST the Democratic candidate and FOR the Republican candidate. That's just reality. It's why the Dems lost so many seats in Congress in 2014 - the Dems stayed home.

Art_from_Ark

(27,247 posts)
139. Meanwhile, Arkansas had a higher turnout than usual for a mid-term
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 02:22 AM
Jan 2015

and the Democratic Party got the worst thrashing it had ever received in an election since Reconstruction. Granted, there were no progressive candidates to speak of on the Democratic side (the main progressive Democratic candidate was forced out of the primary before the voters could decide), but the main progressive issue that was popular in the state-- raising the minimum wage-- was taken away from the Democrats when it became a stand-alone ballot initiative.

fadedrose

(10,044 posts)
105. When did I say I would not vote for her or anyone else who wins the primaries?
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 12:21 AM
Jan 2015

A lot of folks were disappointed in 2008 when Obama won when they wanted Hillary so bad, and they continued to support her all through his presidency, and they seemed more loyal to her than to him. That's being a real democrat? I don't think so. Hillary was okay with it, but her supporters were not, and showed it plenty these past 7 years, and have said she was the frontrunner in the next election since he was inaugurated in 2009.

Bill didn't talk to Obama for a year, and his disappointment was more like anger....

Her husband is allowed to act the way he did and I'm supposed to pull the lever smiling even tho I don't choose her as my candidate?

I had to think back to see who I supported in 2008, and it was Biden. But as soon as Obama got the nomination, Biden was history. I had a new President and was so proud of him and America for voting for him.

I will vote for her because I have to. I am a Democrat who hopes the polls are wrong.

SCantiGOP

(13,869 posts)
216. same thing I thought Tommy2Tone
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 04:30 PM
Jan 2015

Seems like a lot of people here are willing to take the chance on a Republican President reshaping the Supreme Court so they will control everything.
And, we know for a fact that some trolls are paid by the Koch boys and others to sit on boards like this. I imagine they love a thread like this.

 

Spitfire of ATJ

(32,723 posts)
103. In 2008 the media said it was going to be Hillary vs Rudy....
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 12:18 AM
Jan 2015

Now they want it to be Clinton vs Bush: Round II.

I wonder if she's called Gore about being her VP.

ecstatic

(32,688 posts)
104. " I dont know but there has to be somebody better than Hillary."
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 12:20 AM
Jan 2015

Focus. On. Who. You. Think. Should. Run. Tearing down the only frontrunner comes across as trollish.

 

fbc

(1,668 posts)
197. There will be.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 03:44 PM
Jan 2015

Why should we focus on who we think should run?

I'll focus on who actually runs. There will be other democratic nominees and they will most likely all be better than Hillary Clinton

Hawaii Hiker

(3,165 posts)
114. The Supreme Court is too important to not vote for a Democrat for POTUS
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 12:28 AM
Jan 2015

Unless the Democratic nominee is Joe Manchin, (who isn't ever going to run anyway, nor would he win), i will always vote for the Democratic candiate for President....SCOTUS (and the other courts as well) are too important to stay at home and pout if my preferred Democratic nominee doesn't win the nomination...


 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
269. All the more reason to support someone other than Clinton. There are a lot of Americans
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 10:20 PM
Jan 2015

that will never forgive her betrayal.

Oilwellian

(12,647 posts)
117. There's a reason why Hillary lost the 2008 primary
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 12:36 AM
Jan 2015

and I have faith that my fellow Democrats will vote against Hillary Kissinger-Clinton in 2016!

 

Duval

(4,280 posts)
118. You are causing us to think,
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 12:39 AM
Jan 2015

and that's a super good thing. You also echo some of my concerns. What worries me are our MSM and the other Corporations and their $$. I think Warren is who we need and Bernie Sanders would make a very good VP, unless HE wants the Presidency. We would need to get out there and campaign as never before. Can we do it? Can I do it?
I know I have at least one more campaign inside and none of us can do it alone.

Thank you WDIM

BootinUp

(47,141 posts)
119. If you think Hillary is satisfied with the "status quo" you are simply ignorant.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 12:42 AM
Jan 2015

Ignorance is not a personal flaw, it just means you need to edumucate yourself. The first thing I recommend you do, is actually read some of the things she has written, OR actually listen to some of the things she has said. AFTER THAT, please come back and try again!

ChiciB1

(15,435 posts)
122. Have NEVER Supported Her, Even Last Time Out...
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 12:48 AM
Jan 2015

This time around in just a short time, without even stating she's running she's made too many statements that worry me. The most recent is about XL Pipeline. Sure, I would love to see someone like Sanders or Warren, but know it's just not realistic. I also think both of them can be extremely effective in the Senate at this point in time.

I really wish MSM would just STOP promoting Hillary day after day, constantly trotting out poll numbers. She really worries me and something in my gut keeps telling me we should be able to find someone else to support. I'm amazed that Democrats are simply falling in line behind in the same way that Repukes do. I refuse to get into post after post going tit for tat with supporters here who not only will attack me, but post long lists of her qualities. I'm sure she has many pluses, but for me I have serious concerns about all the ties she has to Wall Street, and other huge corporations.

AND, I'm surprised that she's already flubbed questions posed to her and her outright dancing around the questions she's asked. I'm worried and find myself very conflicted about my negative feelings and uncomfortable about the prospect of having to vote just so the other side won't win. I'm old enough to remember a completely different Democratic Party. I realize changes always happen and can move more to the middle, but my heart needs to "feel" comfortable doing it. At this point in time, Hillary makes me very uncomfortable.

JMHO.

NYC Liberal

(20,135 posts)
124. If you want a Liberal Democrat, elect Hillary Clinton.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 12:50 AM
Jan 2015

Despite what you might read on DU, Hillary is, in FACT, a liberal.

FDR was part of the "1%" — even more so than Hillary.

Bernie Sanders is a "Washington insider". So are pretty much all the Democrats who have any chance at winning the nomination (let alone the general election).

Hillary supports unions. She supports a living wage. She supports small businesses.

As for the Treasury "printing its own money" -- that one is particularly bizarre because it already does. And the Federal Reserve returns ALL profits minus operating costs to the Treasury every year.

treestar

(82,383 posts)
159. +1
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 10:53 AM
Jan 2015

Some of these comments are so patently ridiculous, the commenter has to be living in a bubble. You can hardly be out in the world in the USA and think Hillary is Republican registered as a Democrat.

WDIM

(1,662 posts)
212. maybe you're right.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 04:26 PM
Jan 2015

About Hillary.

But you're wrong about the treasury printing its own money. Those are federal reserve notes not treasury notes that we use as currency. Federal Reserve is a corrupt affiliation of the worlds top banksters who are living fat off the poor. When has the federal reserve ever been auditted? Everything the fed does is shielded from the light of day. Its books are closed to the public, its board members are anonymous. There is no public disclosure what so ever of its operations. Its a ponzi scheme setup to ensure the rich stay rich.

DFW

(54,365 posts)
134. I'm saving it for the primaries. This kind of thing is a waste of oxygen at this point
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 01:07 AM
Jan 2015

The only one I'm definitely saying "NO" to at this point is the Republican nominee.

BlueStater

(7,596 posts)
136. I'm sick of the Clintons and I'd wish they'd go away.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 01:19 AM
Jan 2015

It drives me nuts that NO ONE has emerged in the past 20 years to take their place in presidential politics. How can that fucking be? We have no successful, charismatic senators or governors who can run? Not a single goddamn one? How is that possible?

Agnosticsherbet

(11,619 posts)
141. We have a government elected by a majorty of those who vote.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 03:10 AM
Jan 2015

At lest two Justices will be appointed by the next President.

You are OK with whoever Republicans appoint.

Republicans control the House and the Senate.

You are OK with whatever bills they pass.

That is what not voting is. Voting for the worst possible side.

rosesaylavee

(12,126 posts)
148. Agreed.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 08:50 AM
Jan 2015

I am hopeful that there are more candidates out there to support than Clinton. However, if she is the nominee, I will have to support her. As I did with Pres. Obama as he was not my initial choice in 2007-2008 either.

Tho she keeps saying she is not running this time 'round, I would support Elizabeth Warren with everything I've got.

Vinca

(50,269 posts)
149. If I enter the voting booth and the choice is Hillary or Mike Huckabee,
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 08:54 AM
Jan 2015

I sure as hell won't be voting for old "Cat Scratch Fever." I could live in lala land and write in "Bernie," but we all saw how the 2000 election shook out.

sabbat hunter

(6,829 posts)
152. I would prefer
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 09:15 AM
Jan 2015

Warren to be the nominee, and if she ran I would vote for her in the primary. But if HRC is the Democratic Party nominee, I will vote for her, as she will be FAR better than anything the GOP puts forward.

SidDithers

(44,228 posts)
154. I hope Hillary runs, and is the Democratic nominee...
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 09:26 AM
Jan 2015

partly because I think she's the best hope for Democrats to retain the Presidency in 2016, but mostly to watch the spittle-flecked outrage go to 11 at DU, as the anti-Hillary True Democrats™ lose their fucking minds at the prospect of her in the White House.



Sid

Autumn

(45,064 posts)
174. You can do that Sid, safe in your Canadian citizenship. We Americans don't have that luxury.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 12:54 PM
Jan 2015
We have to live with the pro corporate and anti people conservative views of those democrats that are elected.

Autumn

(45,064 posts)
238. As an American and not a member of the 1% I hope she does not run, I will not
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 06:54 PM
Jan 2015

support her as the nominee or as a candidate.

CrispyQ

(36,460 posts)
157. I write to the DNC weekly & tell them I will not vote for Clinton or any other corporate tool,
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 10:52 AM
Jan 2015

for all the good it will do. Clinton is part of the status quo that got us here & she's not going to get us out.

 

bigwillq

(72,790 posts)
161. I will say No to Hillary.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 11:15 AM
Jan 2015

I live in CT, where the DEM candidate will likely win, so I am free to explore other options.

That being said, if Hillary runs and wins, I'll be fine with it. I just do not plan on voting for her.

MineralMan

(146,288 posts)
172. The voters will make the decision in the primaries.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 12:41 PM
Jan 2015

They might well not vote as you desire, but that's always a possibility.

If you'd like a different candidate, you should start encouraging a specific candidate to run in the primaries and support that candidate as much as you possibly can. It will not be easy for anyone to win a presidential primary against Hillary Clinton. Any successful opponent should already have stated that he or she will run. Delays in declaring candidacy will not help.

Many people have strong feelings against Hillary Clinton. If they hope to defeat her in the primaries, though, they need to get started in convincing their candidate to run. Time is going by fast.

 

rtracey

(2,062 posts)
175. I won't say it is so, but
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 01:14 PM
Jan 2015

If Hillary Clinton does not run or does not win the primaries, a republican will become president.

Who do you want to run...

Elizabeth Warren.... she said she won't run over and over and over, and she is a progressive sweetheart, but is she in the moderate line of sight?

Joe Biden..... ummmmm Joe Biden is Joe Biden.....sorry I don't think so

Martin O'Malley.... past MD governor...high tax and spend democrat, not what we need... and I am from MD so....great Mayor of Baltimore though, needs to serve as Senator when Barbara M. retires....

Senator Bernie Sanders.... great guy, I like him, independent.... no traction, needs to change parties, very socialist, may turn moderates off.

You say someone from outside the beltway...find someone, tell me who and I will look close at them, but right now, I need to have someone with a D after their name as president, because this country will implode if and "R" is elected, with an "R" controlled congress


NotHardly

(1,062 posts)
178. Needs...
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 01:30 PM
Jan 2015

If facts and consideration were the rule then emotionality of political choices would be less numerous.
We have a social, economic and political reality now and in the immediate (yeah, long run too) future. Hilary Clinton would be a perfect choice for us, although I fear that being a woman is more to the point of the fear and hate mongering I see directed at her. Misogyny is far stronger in this country than the hate of persons of color or non-European ethnicity. Then there is that little agism sneaking in as well which is always a perfect storm when combined with misogyny.

(As for outside the beltway, I would only have you cast your gaze to Kansas, much of the south and Wisconsin to suggest reconsidering that as any real sort of solution or reality.)

I agree we have many of the needs noted ... living wages, jobs, infrastructure, health care, education, etc. However, none of that will come by dreaming up some mythical creature, even a President needs a people and party to back them and a people and party with the long view instead of the short hop. And, we need action along with all that hope one touts about.

Should she choose to run, I will be working for her, donating my hard earned cash (again) and voting for her. Some research will demonstrate that as a Representative of NY and Secretary of State, Hillary Clinton got results... and we have real need for that as we go towards our future.

Pacifist Patriot

(24,653 posts)
180. I confess I haven't paid much attention to potential candidates in either party.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 01:43 PM
Jan 2015

Pretty much on my radar through political cartoons and DU. Still seems like an awful long time to me. Has a "front runner" before candidacy is even official ever gone the distance? No such thing as a foregone conclusion almost two years out.

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
181. Well since you mentioned you don't want a globlism, the president needs to have lots of foreign
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 01:43 PM
Jan 2015

experience, we have already experienced the "go it alone" rule of Bush. It was a failing decision. You can bury your head in the sand and continue to accept more "Boston Bombings" or you can walk everyday with your eyes wide open.

You said, "We need somebody that will fight for a living wage for all full time employees. We need somebody that will get universal health care. We need somebody that will stop the redistribution of wealth to the top. That will stand up for workers rights."

You may not know Hillary co-sponsored several bills in the Senate to increase the minimum wage? You can't continue to believe the Rove and FOX lies, they do not want Hillary to run, why, right now they do not have a candidate which polls to beat Hillary and right not Hillary polls highest to win 2016 presidency. Hillary tried for universal health insurance, she could not get it past the GOP congress.

Don't cut off your nose to spite your face, you will lose every time.

Mr Dixon

(1,185 posts)
184. Very Sad
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 01:54 PM
Jan 2015

She is shoe-in, even with all us DUer’s raising questions about her past and her integrity the problem is that the majority of voters are moron’s and easily misled by the media and the million being spent in campaign ads. Truth is the 1st casualty.

George II

(67,782 posts)
185. I sure wish that when someone posts such a laundry list of "negatives" about Hillary Clinton...
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 02:02 PM
Jan 2015

some specifics should be listed too. Why don't we ever see that?

 

lewebley3

(3,412 posts)
203. Hillary does not have many Negatives/Stop Trolling for the GOP
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 04:13 PM
Jan 2015



Hillary is the democrats best choice, I have already
started working for her. I had to old my nose and support
Obama.

George II

(67,782 posts)
224. Me? I was addressing the OP, who listed a bunch of so-called "bad" things about Clinton...
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 04:47 PM
Jan 2015

...without specifics. If she is in favor or against the things he/she listed, surely that person could have given us specifics.

SmittynMo

(3,544 posts)
193. It's kinda like the Oscars, or any other award show
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 02:42 PM
Jan 2015

Once you reach a certain age, and your whole life is dedicated to your career, and it doesn't matter how bad or good you were, you win. It seems to apply to Hollywood and Politics.

Pretty sad, isn't it. What ever happened to actually EARNING 1st place?

I'm sorry, but I agree with a lot of what WDIM has posted.

I am going to find it hard for me to vote for her.

 

lewebley3

(3,412 posts)
201. I say YES to Hillary!!!!!! Hillary is a fighter for the People
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 04:10 PM
Jan 2015


This comment say no to Hillary could have been written by GOP
troll.

Hillary is a fighter for people!!!
 

hifiguy

(33,688 posts)
215. She certainly is. For the RICH people.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 04:29 PM
Jan 2015

And the POWERFUL people. Her BFFs are the top management of Goldman Sachs and undisputed war criminal and monster Henry Kissinger.

She does not give one tinker's damn about the ordinary people in this country. Her nest has been well-feathered and it's time to repay the favors.

Response to WDIM (Original post)

brooklynite

(94,510 posts)
217. "Hillary is part of an old generation..."
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 04:31 PM
Jan 2015

So, that knocks out Sanders (73) and Warren (65) as well?

RationalMan

(96 posts)
222. I would prefer Democrats find a different nominee but.........
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 04:41 PM
Jan 2015

If it were a choice between Hillary and any of the clowns or terrorists in the Republican party, I would welcome her candidacy.

Her age is a concern. The fact she is part of a political dynasty from a husband that was a governor and then a two-term President, she herself a two-term U.S. Senator and then Secretary of State is of concern. The Founders expected our elected leaders would not be career politicians but rather ordinary folk (in those days of the landed gentry) who would serve a few terms and then return to agrarian life.

I agree with probably half of her policies and vehemently disagree with the other half from war, etc. But if I compare what I could expect from a Hillary presidency (first woman!!!!) and any of the potential GOP candidates, Hillary is mountains above them.

I would prefer though to see the Democrats start to cultivate a new generation of leaders. I am especially impressed with the Castro brothers from Texas.

Pyrzqxgl

(1,356 posts)
225. I'll Vote for Hillery if she's the nominee but
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 05:02 PM
Jan 2015

I'd sure like to see some progressive competition in the primaries that could perhaps push her thinking to the left and at least make her aware that there is a lot of progressive thought out there and just maybe if she wants to win, she might consider our thoughts & ideas.

lexington filly

(239 posts)
229. You had me until.....
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 05:27 PM
Jan 2015

"Hillary is part of an old generation and an old way of thinking."
Where did you get that idea? There are plenty of Progressives who are of Hillary's generation. For instance..... ME..... just as there are young conservatives. I think Hillary's politics are more a function of economic "station," limited experience with typical Americans because of that station, and so her capacity for empathy and imagination are really limited too. Otherwise, I absolutely agree with you.

LiberalLovinLug

(14,173 posts)
232. If there's no other choice
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 06:10 PM
Jan 2015

Whatcha gonna do?

I'd rather see Warren run, and win the primary.

If Hillary gets in, as others have said, she will be socially liberal as far as women's rights, gay rights, minimum wage increase.....but on the big important issues, she won't be much better than any of the GOP candidates.

There is only one compelling reason to vote for her. And that is the Supreme Court appointments. Sure she'll nominate yet another corporate shill, but they will be OUR corporate shill. Like Kagan. That is only if a damn Con judge will ever step down or just die already! Everyone thought Obama's first term would lead to an overturning of the Republican dominance in the SCOTUS, then it was for sure in the second term. I think these Republican rat bastards are going to hang on for another 8 years if they have to, even if their minds and bodies have gone. It doesn't take much just to sign their name on a verdict that John Roberts tells them to. Hell he'll hold their hand and sign it for them.

 

LittleBlue

(10,362 posts)
254. Hillary stood with Republican when we needed her most. She's a coward
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 09:19 PM
Jan 2015

I will never forgive her for that Iraq War vote. We needed her and she abandoned us on the senate floor for 30 pieces of political silver. She would never betray Goldman Sachs the way she betrayed us.

Wonder if the political heat she avoided was worth the hundreds of thousands who died for a lie.

hopemountain

(3,919 posts)
255. she is not getting my vote - period
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 09:39 PM
Jan 2015

unless she gets the nomination. but, i don't see how that is going to happen with her warhawk, pro-wallstreet, silence on environmental issues, and tppip. she might as well be a republican.

tartan2

(314 posts)
261. Go ahead call me crazy but I see the 2016 election
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 10:08 PM
Jan 2015

as a done deal. Hillary will be the first female POTUS. We will just be going thru the motion of electing a new President. I really don't believe that this country has voted a President since 1960. We've been allowed to think we have but actually haven't...

woo me with science

(32,139 posts)
275. +100000 Hilllary is a menace. A corporate predator in a Democrat suit.
Fri Jan 23, 2015, 10:37 PM
Jan 2015

There is nothing more important than stopping Hillary or any other Third Way corporatist from being shoved down our throats as the Democratic nominee in 2016. No accepting "inevitability" or fast-forwarding to that outcome, because that is the outcome we need to prevent.

That's the corporate goal, because if corporatists succeed in doing that, they have ensured the continuation of their predatory corporate agenda no matter who is elected.

Corporate Republicans and the corporate Third Way are not just another flavor of politician within an essentially functioning representative government. They are building perpetual war, a police and surveillance state, and using our own laws and intelligence agencies to empower corporations over the will of the American people to dismantle democracy itself.



Hillary Clinton's leading role in drafting the TPP
http://www.democraticunderground.com/101667554

Hillary Clinton and Trade Deals: That “Giant Sucking Sound”
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1016101761

Hillary Clinton Cheerleads for Biotech and GMOs
http://www.democraticunderground.com/112772326

Dissecting Hillary Clinton's Neocon Talking Points - Atlantic Interview
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017209519

NYTimes notices Hillary's natural affinity toward the neocons.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025205645

Hillary Clinton, the unrepentant hawk
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024876898

More from Hillary Clinton's State Department: The fascistic TISA (Trade in Services Agreement)
http://m.thenation.com/blog/180572-grassroots-labor-uprising-your-bank

How Hillary Clinton's State Department sold fracking to the world
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251376647

Hillary Clinton Sides with NSA over Snowden Disclosures
http://www.democraticunderground.com/101695441

On the NSA, Hillary Clinton Is Either a Fool or a Liar
http://m.thenation.com/article/180564-nsa-hillary-clinton-either-fool-or-liar

Corporate Warfare: Hillary Clinton admits role in Honduran coup aftermath
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025601610#post29

The Bill and Hillary Clinton Money Machine Taps Corporate Cash
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025189257

Hillary's Privatization Plan: TISA kept more secret than the TPP
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014829628

Hillary Clinton criticizes Obama's foreign policy 'failure'; strongly defends Israel
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014867136

Some of Hillary Clinton's statements on Social Security.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024379279

Hillary Clinton's GOLDMAN SACHS PROBLEM.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025049343

Ring of Fire: Hillary Clinton - The Perfect Republican Candidate
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017209285

How Americans Need Answers From Hillary Clinton On TPP, KXL, Wall St & More
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017181611

Hillary Clinton Left Out By Liberal Donor Club
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025809071

Why Wall Street Loves Hillary
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1016106575

Hillary Clinton: Neocon-lite
http://www.democraticunderground.com/101684986

Interactive graphic of Hillary Clinton's connections to the Forbes top 400 (Follow link in post)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025824981#post9


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