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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsPope Francis compares pushing gay agenda to ‘Hitler Youth’ indoctrination
Last edited Tue Jan 27, 2015, 01:21 PM - Edit history (1)
https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/pope-francis-compares-pushing-gay-agenda-to-hitler-youth-indoctrinationIn comments at his Monday in-air interview that were totally ignored by the mainstream media, Pope Francis lamented the Western practice of imposing a homosexual agenda on other nations through foreign aid, which he called a form of “ideological colonization” and compared to the Nazi propaganda machine.
Shiny new Pope, not so new.
I should point out that this is a Pro-Life site that seems to support the Pope in this. But the quotes are accurate.
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MohRokTah
(15,429 posts)This pope is sinking fast.
edhopper
(33,570 posts)just different rhetoric and a smiling face.
MohRokTah
(15,429 posts)Everything else is meet the new boss, same as the old boss.
LiberalElite
(14,691 posts)he goes up a notch. See: Pope holds private audience with transgender man. http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014998643
NuclearDem
(16,184 posts)
Jefferson23
(30,099 posts)our Congress? Separation of Church/State.
Baitball Blogger
(46,700 posts)I don't imagine he gets to see the other side of this issue when he's surrounded by resistant, traditional ways.
Avalux
(35,015 posts)Ugh. I don't get how he can think this? I supposed he's ok with the anti-gay mess in Uganda?? 
heard him say anything against what is going on there. or chastise the Priests involved.
Avalux
(35,015 posts)Equal rights of ALL human beings is the only answer. Separation, which is exactly what he's promoting in what he said, takes us all down a notch and keeps us divided. Can't pick and choose when to preach unity, and when to preach division; that old religious paradigm won't be able to continue in the new world.
LuvNewcastle
(16,844 posts)but he chooses to remain silent about it. If there is a such thing as sin, I think his refusal to intervene in that matter definitely qualifies as one. If you can help someone who is being abused by another person and you choose to do nothing, you might as well be abusing that person yourself. I think Jesus would agree.
I have no regard for Francis because he hasn't even tried to do anything to stop what's going on in Uganda and other countries with significant numbers of Catholics. It's one thing not to speak out about the execution and mistreatment of gay people in some Muslim countries -- although I believe he should speak out about that too -- but he could sway many Catholics in some of those African countries. I'll never forgive him for that.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)Anglican. Bishops of the Catholic Church have encouraged the anti gay laws, publicly celebrated them and preach 'elimination' of gays from Uganda. Francis is absolutely silent about Uganda, but her provides them with a steady stream of anti gay statements like the one in Manila equating us to Nazis.
People on DU like to claim that 'American Evangelicals' are fully to blame for Uganda, although Evangelicals are a small percentage of Ugandans and Catholics and Anglicans comprise a large, non Evangelical majority.
Behind the Aegis
(53,949 posts)He has some real gall to speak about "propaganda machines"!
niyad
(113,259 posts)his attitudes towards women, toward gays, etc. has not changed. his remarks about gay marriage last week were disgusting, and nothing has changed in the church's attitude toward women.
colour me soooooo not impressed.
He drives a shitbox Renault, washes some feet and hugs a disfigured believer, and people think he's the second coming of Jesus Christ himself.
When really, he's Ratz with a better PR team.
Sid
ChazII
(6,204 posts)that hug was a break through. That man does not have the facial privileges that so many others take for granted. I should know as my son has the same genetic disorder (Neurofibromatosis 1) and to this day gets called freak and monster.
That hug does not excuse the Pope for his stand on many issues but my blood does boil when the hug gets dismissed as it was nothing.
m-lekktor
(3,675 posts)it makes me fucking ILL! the catholic church is a hideous institution, i am so thankful my parents didn't force religion on me as a child, the catholic church would have been it if they had.
herding cats
(19,564 posts)Wanting to live a life where you enjoy the same advantages and liberties as other people isn't an agenda, it's a right. Working to strip those rights from someone else because of a misguided religious belief, however, is an agenda.
longship
(40,416 posts)What a fucking wonderful post.
Congrats. You win the Internets.
Best post today.
Thank you.
LuvNewcastle
(16,844 posts)
hunter
(38,310 posts)The progress of the Catholic Church is glacial.
The Church is "conservative" but not quite so much as our own U.S. Republican Party is.
Our Republican Party is actually regressing to a time of gross ignorance and the persecution of anyone who does not share their twisted "faith."
ChosenUnWisely
(588 posts)but I think they are just lying because I am not gay.
So anyone in the know want to share what the agenda is.
One friend did tell me the agenda once, but he was really drunk and could having been lying besides well the agenda is not fit for posting here however if what he told me is true Hugh Jackman better have lots of lube as should Alexander Skarsgård! Oh my!
SO if that is the agenda, I really don't care and am not very worried.
FiveGoodMen
(20,018 posts)It's shocking how many straight people oppose that!
ChosenUnWisely
(588 posts)FiveGoodMen
(20,018 posts)Really, I think most of the idiots out there are just afraid their kids will "turn" gay if anyone tells them it's not a sin.
Behind the Aegis
(53,949 posts)
ChosenUnWisely
(588 posts)and so, so boring and normal, why it is what hetro's do!
Yes I fully support all people who want to get married and live a dull boring life or exciting one but the excitement does not last forever one of the joys of marriage, monotony!
Just wait once all people are allowed to marry whomever they want, then everyone will be able to share in the joy of monotony!
hedgehog
(36,286 posts)ChosenUnWisely
(588 posts)Works for me!
I would like one in Stainless but one with some color would be nice too, just no orange or yellow please.
Thanks!
lunasun
(21,646 posts)ChosenUnWisely
(588 posts)They are nice toasters after all!
Come to think of it all my gay friends have Nespresso Coffee makers too, I think there is a conspiracy afoot!
el_bryanto
(11,804 posts)He told of an education minister he once knew who was offered loans to build schools for the poor, but on condition their libraries stocked a book on gender theory, the questioning of traditional male and female roles. He gave no other details.
"This is ideological colonization. They colonize people with ideas that try to change mentalities or structures," he said.
"But this is not new. This was done by the dictatorships of the last century," he said, citing the Hitler Youth and Balilla, its Italian equivalent under Fascist dictator Benito Mussolini.
From Rueters article by Philip Pullella
This colonization process passes through the youngest, said the Pope. “The same was done by the dictatorships of the last century. They entered with their own doctrine,” he remarked.From an article at The Catholic Register by Alan Holdren.
“Think of the Hitler Youth,” he said in reference to the Nazi-training programs to indoctrinate young people to party ideas.
. . . “When conditions are imposed by imperial colonizers, they seek to make [these] peoples lose their own identity and make a uniformity [in society],” he said. “This is the globalization of the sphere — all the points are equidistant from the center.”
However, “true globalization” doesn’t take the form of a sphere, creating uniformity and equal distances from the center, said Pope Francis.
Bryant
joeglow3
(6,228 posts)In many ways, the internet is great and in others it sucks ass.
rug
(82,333 posts)muriel_volestrangler
(101,306 posts)When the Catholic church is saying that no group from outside a country should place conditions on its aid, you know it is a huge case of hypocrisy. They interfere in country's laws about homosexuality, abortion and divorce.
joeglow3
(6,228 posts)I agree that aid should not be conditioned upon someone's beliefs. Locally, Catholic Charities does a lot and none if it is contingent upon uniformity with catholic views.
muriel_volestrangler
(101,306 posts)It's not just in the USA, you know. They teach Catholic doctrine in Catholic schools in developing countries too - stuff like "God exists".
joeglow3
(6,228 posts)I am talking about giving people clothes, food, utility assistance, housing, job training, etc. likewise, aid to a country should be subject to the same criteria - none.
muriel_volestrangler
(101,306 posts)Can you really think that a Pope, whose organisation runs whole schools telling children to believe in its particular concept of God, is not being hypocritical when it says someone else putting a book in school libraries is like the Nazis?
https://w2.vatican.va/content/francesco/en/speeches/2015/january/documents/papa-francesco_20150119_srilanka-filippine-conferenza-stampa.html
joeglow3
(6,228 posts)One is offering a voluntary school for people to attend as an alternative to an already available alternative that does not teach a particular concept of God versus someone providing ONE option and requiring that one to teach a particular view of God. If you cannot see the difference, it is only because you refuse to see it.
muriel_volestrangler
(101,306 posts)Who is that? You appear to be fighting a strawman of your own creation. Did you read what the Pope said? I gave the quote from the Vatican site, so there can be no claims of "misquoting".
This is about a book being kept in a library, in school(s) that get funding from a source. I am comparing that to the Catholics doing far more than just saying "if we provide funding for a school, it must have a bible in the library".
joeglow3
(6,228 posts)I really don't consider offering an alternative school for those that choose to accept it as "aid." I am confident you don't either. You are just twisting that which benefits you.
muriel_volestrangler
(101,306 posts)and the one condition I discussed, for anyone other than the Catholic school, was the stocking of a book in the libraries. What I have consistently pointed out is that Catholic aid for schools involves far more 'indoctrination' or 'ideological colonization' than just making a book available to the pupils. It involves teaching Catholic religious claims.
Of course that's aid. You don't think providing schools is 'aid'? What planet are you on?
What 'benefit' do you think I'm getting from this, by the way?
joeglow3
(6,228 posts)Again, you and I both know you don't believe that.
For instance, I live in the Westside School District. There is an elementary school two blocks from my house that my tax dollars funds. Four blocks from my house is a Catholic grade school for those that choose to pay $2,200 in tuition. It is not provided because kids in my neighborhood don't otherwise have a school to attend. It is provided as an alternative for those who want to pay for it. This is not considered aid.
muriel_volestrangler
(101,306 posts)Aid, in this context, is charity sent from outside a country. When the international Catholic church sends money to run a school (eg in a developing country), that's aid.
If you are arguing that the Catholic church is in reality a commercial organisation that exists to get people to accept its products, that will, I think, be strongly resisted as a claim by Catholics, and the church hierarchy in particular. For one thing, it would mean they'd lose their tax-free status. They wouldn't be able to claim religious exemptions. It would destroy their entire political and legal strategy.
joeglow3
(6,228 posts)I went to a catholic college preparatory high school. My parents paid for the tuition (which is $9,000 today). Are you claiming that is aid?
muriel_volestrangler
(101,306 posts)If the Catholic church puts any money into a school in a developing country, it's aid. Such as the Catholic Church's official charity for overseas mission supporting education. It's a worthwhile charitable activity; but the Pope ought to realise that he is sending 'propaganda' to countries more than someone wanting a book to be placed in libraries. His aid comes with more strings.
Octafish
(55,745 posts)Context is important.
el_bryanto
(11,804 posts)While it does give more context, it's still a homophobic stance, particularly when you consider what the people in those African countries are actually arguing for. It's a bit like those neo-Confederates who are convinced that the South fought the Civil War to preserve freedom. In the Civil War they were fighting for the "freedom" to own slaves; in many nations in Africa they are fighting for the "freedom" to discriminate and even execute homosexuals.
I agree with Pope Francis when he says something I agree with, usually on the economy; in this case I have to say he's in the wrong.
Bryant
Octafish
(55,745 posts)From what I've found, the guy was talking about Globalization and how the capitalist-missionaries work both sides of the Third World street. They go in as missionaries and line up the coffee contracts; when they can't go in as Missionairies, they'll go in as Coffee Experts and then evangelize.
el_bryanto
(11,804 posts)But it was a talk with many reporters, so who knows.
The problem with that formulation is he specifically referenced African Bishops (several of the accounts mention that) - Bishops who are living in countries where it is still a capital crime to be gay.
Bryant
Octafish
(55,745 posts)Nothing like what the original source at Life Site News inferred. If I find something better, I'll post.
Humanist_Activist
(7,670 posts)Octafish
(55,745 posts)Life Site News has an agenda and truth isn't part of it.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Campaign_Life_Coalition
Humanist_Activist
(7,670 posts)The question is, did they report what he said accurately? I would say yes, and the other accounts linked only differ in what they choose to emphasize.
Octafish
(55,745 posts)Here's the best I can find, which goes with my interpretation above -- the Pope was comparing globalization with indoctrination, not homosexuality.
Jan Christoph Kitzler (Bayerischer Rundfunk): I would like to return for a minute to the encounter you had with the families. You have spoken of ideological colonization. Would you explain a bit more the concept? Also Paul VI, speaking of the “particular causes” that are important to in the family… Can you give an example of these particular cases and maybe say also if there is need to open the way, to have a corridor for these particular cases?
Pope: The ideological colonization. I’ll only give you an example of what I saw 20 years ago, in ’95. A Minister of Public Education had asked for a big loan to build schools for the poor, public schools. They gave the loan on condition that in the schools there would be a school book for children of a certain level, no? It was a well prepared book, where the theory of gender was taught. This woman needed the money but that was the condition. She was smart. She said yes, and also made them give another book, of a different orientation. And so she succeeded. This is ideological colonization. They enter with an idea that has nothing to do with the people; but with groups of people yes, but not with the people. It colonizes the people with an idea that wants to change a mentality or a structure.
During the Synod, the African bishops lamented this: certain loans on certain conditions. I only say that which I have seen.. Why do they say ideological colonization? Because they take a real need of the people to have an opportunity to enter and make themselves strong with the children. But this is not new, the dictators of the last century did the same. They came with their own doctrine. Think of the BalilLa (The Fascist Youth under Mussolini), think of the Hitler youth.
They colonized the people, but they wanted to do it. But how much suffering. Peoples must not lose their freedom. A people has its culture, its history. Every people has its own culture.
But when conditions are imposed by the colonizing empires they seek to make peoples forget their own identity and make them (all) equal. This is the globalization of the sphere — all the points are equidistant from the center. But the true globalization – and I like to say this – is not the sphere. It is important to globalize but not like the sphere, but like the polyhedron. Namely that every people, every part, conserves its own identity without being ideologically colonized. These are the ideological colonizations.
There is a book, excuse me but I’ll make commercial, there is a book that maybe is a bit heavy at the beginning because it was written in 1903 in London. It is a book that at that time, the writer had seen this drama of the ideological colonization and wrote in that book, it is called “The Lord of the Earth” or the other title “The Lord of the World.” One of those. The author is Benson, written in 1903. But I advise you to read it, and reading it you will understand what I mean by ‘ideological colonization’.
On Paul VI: It’s true that openness to life is a condition for the sacrament of matrimony. A man cannot give the sacrament to the woman, and the woman cannot give it to him, if they are not in accord on this point of openness to life. If it can be proved that he or she married with the intention of not being Catholic (on this point) then the matrimony is null. (It is) a cause for the annulment of the marriage, no? Openness to life.
Paul VI had studied this with the commission for life, what to do to help many cases, many problems, no? The important problems that make for the love of life; the problems of every day — but many, many.
But there was something more. The refusal of Paul VI was not only about the personal problems, that he then tells the confessors to be merciful, to understand if this is true, and then (he tells them) “you can be merciful, more understanding”. He was looking at the Neo-Malthusianism that was underway worldwide. What do you call this Neo-Malthusianism? Less than one percent of birth rate in Italy. The same in Spain. That Neo-Malthusianism that seeks to control humanity on behalf of the powers (that be).
This does not mean that the Christian must make children in series. I rebuked a woman some months ago in a parish who was pregnant eight times, with seven C-sections (cesareans). “But do you want to leave seven orphans? That is to tempt God! (Paul VI) speaks of responsible parenthood. What I wanted to say was that Paul VI was not antiquated, close minded.
No,(he was) a prophet again who with this (encyclical) told us to watch out for the Neo-Malthusianism that is coming. This is what I wanted to say.
SOURCE: http://www.newvision.co.ug/news/663885-transcript-of-pope-francis-press-conference-aboard-papal-flight.html
That's from an Ugandan journalist aboard the plane. Dunno if he used Babblefish to translate. The transcript's got enough errors to lend it authenticity. Please, if you do see a better transcript or an actual tape with the Pope talking in his own words, let me know.
JI7
(89,247 posts)Humanist_Activist
(7,670 posts)the OP just summarized a part of it more, if you want to get technical, the Pope is comparing putting conditions such as teaching feminism, teaching facts about gender, LGBT people etc. to the fucking Hitler Youth. I'm sorry, who in there right minds would defend this homophobic, misogynistic, transphobic bigot?
el_bryanto
(11,804 posts)
cbayer
(146,218 posts)And that someone would link to it and help them promote their agenda is alarming.
This was not ignored by the press at all. There were many articles on this interview, it's just that none of them made up this inflammatory interpretation in order to push their hateful agenda.
This is embarrassing, frankly, and even more embarrassing is how some people are lapping this up because they want to believe it. You alone have actually done your own research.
PeaceNikki
(27,985 posts)"During the Synod, the African bishops lamented this: certain loans on certain conditions. I only say that which I have seen... Why do they say ideological colonization? Because they take a real need of the people to have an opportunity to enter and make themselves strong with the children. But this is not new, the dictators of the last century did the same. They came with their own doctrine. Think of the BalilLa (The Fascist Youth under Mussolini), think of the Hitler youth."
What does this mean?
The AP described the Pope's idea of "ideological colonization" as "allowing health care workers to distribute condoms, or withdrawing assistance if legislation discriminating against gays is passed," for example.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)This article, on the other hand, is conflating and distorting several different things in order to make an outrageous conclusion that support their own extreme homophobia and hate.
The pope didn't make this comparison at all. This ugly, ugly site wants to say that he did because that they think homosexuality is comparable to nazi indoctrination. They are sick, sick, sick. That people here are jumping on this, recommending it and promoting this site's agenda is, frankly, horrifying.
There is plenty of legitimate room to criticize and even condemn this pope on his statements about marriage and GLBT civil rights, but this is really a new low in distortion.
How does one even find such a despicable site, let alone think it would be ok to post AND support what it is saying?
Arugula Latte
(50,566 posts)
msongs
(67,395 posts)hell fire
Arugula Latte
(50,566 posts)The RCC is one of the longest-running rackets in world history.
SidDithers
(44,228 posts)same as the old boss.
Sid
trumad
(41,692 posts)edhopper
(33,570 posts)"Defenders" with an s.
lame54
(35,284 posts)
Orsino
(37,428 posts)Project much?
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Is former Pope Benedict his source on the Nazi propaganda machine? Did he share heartwarming stories of his days in the Hitler Youth movement, talk about the cool uniforms and the great songs. Does the Pope have any opinions on the various neo-Nazi parties in Europe, including Golden Dawn (Greece), the Front National (France), etc.?
MineralMan
(146,286 posts)sent LGBT people to concentration camps? I think the Pope has lost his mind to make this association.
He has truly jumped the shark on this one.
Initech
(100,063 posts)Yes the Nazis are still the textbook definition of absolute evil, but when you think about Glenn Beck and his almost cartoonish overuse of Nazi references during the height of his Fox program, it really makes one look like am idiot for using them any more. 
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)nor does anyone here make crazed arguments that Glenn is really a big liberal who is saying shitty things for some magically good reason. No one here suggests that Glenn Beck is a suitable role model for this Party, but they do say that about anti gay, anti choice Francis. They love him.
And the indoctrination of propaganda isn't the same without the state backup the Nazis had. North Korea, Saudi Arabia, maybe, but not the west. It happens that nations who really do try to restrict what their citizens hear would be mostly anti-gay.
Beaverhausen
(24,470 posts)it's a right-wing nutjob site. Might want to get another view of what he said before going off on it.
see post# 17
edhopper
(33,570 posts)has other, more neutral, sources.
Beaverhausen
(24,470 posts)I really wish people here would check sources better.
Humanist_Activist
(7,670 posts)I do wish people would do their research, and stop trying to carry the torch for an open bigot like Pope Francis.
http://catholiclane.com/gender-theory/
Granted its from a tainted source, but you must remember that we are talking about people(like Pope Francis), that believe in the Church's bigoted teachings on sexuality and gender.
PeaceNikki
(27,985 posts)
MFrohike
(1,980 posts)That site isn't a pro-life site, it's a batshit crazy pseudo-catholic site. It's run by the type of people who are absolutely obsessed with abortion AND will talk your ear off about their obsession. The type who'll tell you that birth control not only causes cancer AND changes your DNA, but also doesn't work. Damn, even the most ardent culture warriors I know quit citing this piece of shit a while back. If they've abandoned it as a source, why is someone on DU pushing it?
Humanist_Activist
(7,670 posts)Most will be conservative and/or Christian/Catholic sources, but that is to be expected:
http://www.christianpost.com/news/pope-francis-defends-catholic-churchs-ban-on-contraception-compares-teaching-gender-theory-to-children-in-school-to-the-nazis-132809/
http://www.catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/1500255.htm
http://www.catholicherald.co.uk/news/2015/01/19/pope-says-catholics-must-practice-responsible-parenthood/
http://www.jpost.com/Christian-News/Birth-control-ban-doesnt-mean-breed-like-rabbits-Pope-says-388322
Just because the source is something you don't like, doesn't mean that it is inaccurate. Lifesitenews did pick a headline that emphasizes a different part of his speech.
Behind the Aegis
(53,949 posts)Or better yet, why whitewash it?
Humanist_Activist
(7,670 posts)prop up this Pope, who is, theologically, socially, and economically, no different from the past 2 Popes. Yet, DU absolutely HATED Ratzinger, and was lukewarm at best on JPII. I think its a type of prejudice, Pope Francis is a "New Pope" from the "New World", never mind the fact he follows the Orthodoxy of the Church quite closely. But the expectations are different, Kinda like JPII in the 1980s, though neither one was or is destined to reform the Church.
PeaceNikki
(27,985 posts)"During the Synod, the African bishops lamented this: certain loans on certain conditions. I only say that which I have seen... Why do they say ideological colonization? Because they take a real need of the people to have an opportunity to enter and make themselves strong with the children. But this is not new, the dictators of the last century did the same. They came with their own doctrine. Think of the BalilLa (The Fascist Youth under Mussolini), think of the Hitler youth."
What does this mean?
The AP described the Pope's idea of "ideological colonization" as "allowing health care workers to distribute condoms, or withdrawing assistance if legislation discriminating against gays is passed," for example.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)Pope Francis called marriage equality "ideological colonization" to destroy family
"Pope Francis came out with his strongest comments against marriage equality, calling it, "ideological colonization that we have to be careful about that is trying to destroy the family." His comments came during a visit to the Philippines, and in the midst of a Roman Catholic conversation on marriage and family.
Pope Francis called marriage equality "ideological colonization" to destroy family
By Ross Murray, Director of Programs, Global and US South |
January 16, 2015
Pope Francis came out with his strongest comments against marriage equality, calling it, "ideological colonization that we have to be careful about that is trying to destroy the family." His comments came during a visit to the Philippines, and in the midst of a Roman Catholic conversation on marriage and family.
Reuters speculates that the phrase "ideological colonization" is messaging directed at developing countries, urging them to resist following countries that allow for marriage equality.
The statement comes as a bitter disappointment to those who hoped that Pope Francis would be one to bring reformation on the issue of marriage equality and the equal treatment of LGBT people within the Roman Catholic Church.
Just yesterday, CNN beautifully highlighted the story of LGBT Filipinos who were eager for the Pope's visit, looking forward to a word of consolation, and not of the condemnation that came during his visit. Hearing this couple's story, it would be hard not to imagine the disappointment they felt."
http://www.glaad.org/blog/pope-francis-called-marriage-equality-ideological-colonization-destroy-family
Zorra
(27,670 posts)institutionalized hatred for some harmless, innocent group of people.
Political leaders do the same thing. Like Francis, Putin is also currently using institutionalized hatred for LGBT and women as a vehicle for increasing his power, and the number of his followers, among the gullible ignorant. They are running out of groups they can successfully scapegoat for the cause of mass hate. Groups such as Jews (after all, after Hitler's insane failed adventure in exploiting mass sociopathy, using Jews as scapegoats will only get you so far these days; he used LGBT as well...there just weren't enough of us to mass murder in order to hold the crowd at the time), heretics, and black people, etc, whatever the flavor of the day. So now folks like Pope Francis are having to fall back on the two most hated innocent groups of human beings in the history of the world since the advent of the major patriarchal sky god religions to use as scapegoats in order to maintain their place, power, authority, and wealth:
Women, and LGBT. It is still A-OK with many to hate women and LGBT. The widespread hatred for women and LGBT that the patriarchal sky god religions have institutionalized in most existing societies is their ace in the hole.
The hate for LGBT and women that Francis is currently spreading at an alarming rate throughout the world is not just a random, fleeting phenomenon, it is right now being used enmasse (or is it in Mass?) around the world by various Right Wing religions and political leaders in order to once again rally the hateful faithful to the cause of legalized authoritarian oppression, destruction, misery, and death.
The phrase, "Never Again" is ever present; unless good people stop the current spread of RW hatred around the world, and I'm here to tell you, the fuckers will do it again, in some way of another, if they are not prevented from doing so. The "war to end all wars" never happens.
It doesn't matter that the women and LGBT are innocent, and harmless; using women and LGBT as scapegoats can always be relied on to maintain a substantial congregation of the hateful. It works the same in any country, or religion; all you have to do is tell the ignorant hateful that they are being threatened, and they will follow you to straight down the garden path to hell.
And when the destruction is finally over, there are always the same three words that the congregation of the hateful says to all the kind, incredulous people of the world, in order to justify the senseless carnage they helped inflict on the innocent...
"We didn't know."
......
Rex
(65,616 posts)we all know about the Catholic agenda. It is always too much to expect a 2000 year old religion to change...but more importantly for modern society to change back to some archaic rules that were bullshit in the first place. When people find an ancient faith to be bullshit, they move toward another ancient faith - secularism.
Modern society is not going backwards, sorry established orders. Just the opposite, modern society is getting more secular with every passing year. Sure there are holdover countries that still want to live like barbarians, but most people are moving away from traditional beliefs that don't hold any place in their modern life. Society is changing too fast for people to hold on to some rules written thousands of years ago that are foolish by today's standards.
That goes for any organized religion. Sure lots of people are 'religious' and they are also very secular as well. Secularism naturally includes the right to live life as a person chooses to. Free from any kind of persecution. Hint hint.
Dictators of the world, Popes, whatever leaders...deal with it. You cannot stop progress, you can only anger the growing numbers of ex-Catholics or whoever. Stop being assholes.
Zorra
(27,670 posts)“Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? Likewise, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them."
The Catholic Church brutally tortured, murdered, and imprisoned uncountable numbers of innocent human beings who did not agree with the teachings of the Church.
They did this in a largely successful attempt to ideologically indoctrinate the minds of gullible people in order to control their lives and minds as a vehicle for political power, and to make their organization filthy rich.
And now, you want to harm more innocent people. "Can the leopard change it's spots?"
Obviously not.
"Here's lookin' at you, kid."
"Sympathy for the Devil" is a song by The Rolling Stones, written by Mick Jagger and credited to Jagger/Richards. Sung by Jagger, the song is an homage to Satan, written in the first-person narrative from the point of view of Lucifer, who recounts the atrocities committed throughout the history of humanity in his name.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sympathy_for_the_Devil
cbayer
(146,218 posts)The issue of "gender theory" has nothing to do with homosexuality. It is about female and male gender roles being defined biologically.
No other news source made this interpretation because this is not what was said.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)If you say 'biology dictates heterosexuality' which is what he is saying, that's also saying what the RCC doctrine is, gay people are disordered.
Many other news sources see what he said, but those would be from gay people, so obviously not admissible to those who dismiss LGBT points of view with a smug casualness.
http://www.glaad.org/blog/pope-francis-called-marriage-equality-ideological-colonization-destroy-family
cbayer
(146,218 posts)It doesn't say biology dictates heterosexuality at all.
While I agree that the RCC's position on GLBT civil rights is despicable, endorsing this article in any way is also despicable.
This is a group that wants this to be what he said, but it's not what he said and joining hands with them makes me sick.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)Why don't you explain to us stupid people what he really, really meant. How are they not against marriage equality and equality for women? The Pope and his Church are opposed to marriage equality and to reproductive choice, we all know that. So what is it you think those comments mean, that the rest of the world fails to see? You are defending a man who is openly anti gay, and saying it makes you sick to see GLAAD's point of view expressed by them and lots of others. You say that in this case, the anti gay, anti choice guy is speaking about other aspects of 'gender theory'? What are those aspects? You support his words, tell us what it is you are supporting. You say an organization I support makes you sick, but the organization you support calls me 'disordered' and says my rights are Satan's idea. Explain your views.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)I'm not going to get pulled into your hostile trap here, BNW.
This article is not from GLAAD. It's from a horrible site run by people that would likely want to put GLBT people in camps. You want to be aligned with them, go for it. I'm not going with you.
This is the last exchange I will have with you on this topic.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)asked you to explain your views. You said 'no one else is saying this' and I linked you to GLAAD. You said they made you sick, so I gave you Reuters.
You are making an assertion and just dismissing any questions about your assertion. The article I linked you to, at your request for other sources, was from GLAAD, it quotes Reuters. I am proud of my association with GLAAD. Most every LGBT person is proud of GLAAD.
You asked for other sources, you got them.
You are the only one getting personal here. You asked for other sources, I gave them to you, you attack me. Not very nice.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)It was not there when I answered you.
Done, absolutely done, unless you once again post a gross distortion and make a false accusation.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)Did you bother to read GLAAD or Reuters on the subject or did you ask for other sources just to shout 'I'm done'?
You asked me for such links. I went and got them for you. They already exist up thread. Others tried the 'attack the messenger' method before you. I posted the same links yesterday when people asked for other sources.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)"Pope Francis on Friday warned against an “ideological colonization of the family,” a reference to gay marriage around the world and to a heated debate in the Philippines about a government population control plan.
The Pope made his impromptu comments at rally for families in Manila on a day that began with an appeal to the government to tackle corruption and hear the cries of the poor suffering from “scandalous social inequalities” in Asia’s most Catholic country.
Addressing an evening rally of families, he spoke of an “ideological colonization that we have to be careful about that is trying to destroy the family”. He said it was coming from “outside” and had to be resisted.
While the Pope has said before that marriage must be between a man and a woman, his use of the phrase “ideological colonization” appeared to be an appeal to developing countries not to follow the lead of nations where gay unions are already legal."
http://in.reuters.com/article/2015/01/16/pope-philippines-idINKBN0KP08G20150116
cbayer
(146,218 posts)It is linking to this despicable site and promoting their hateful agenda that is at issue here.
That's it. I'm done discussing this with you. Have the last word.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)them. So you called me hostile. The last word always belongs to the readers.
Humanist_Activist
(7,670 posts)How is this better?
Also, when I looked up gender theory in a Catholic context, it seems to include feminism, gender roles and homosexuality. So where is the distortion?
merrily
(45,251 posts)The right: as always, so in love with the Big Lie.
Response to edhopper (Original post)
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fredamae
(4,458 posts)
Tsiyu
(18,186 posts)There are so many people hurting, broken, sick and desperate.
Why set one person against another? Work to heal the wounded, and you don't have time to worry about what other ADULTS are doing in the privacy of their homes.
Oh, and when you're out there, Popie-Poo, serving the least of these? You'll find people of all faiths and none, of all colors, of all orientations volunteering, donating and working with the least of these to make things better.
They could set an example for you of being Christ-like, if you'd shut that Papal Pie hole of yours long enough to listen to mercy - and if you were not a slobbering slave to cruel dogma.
KamaAina
(78,249 posts)
