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Fri Feb 27, 2015, 08:28 PM

I'm a hard person to love these days and I'll tell you why

I was a teenage geek when Trek came on the air as a weekly series and it was stunning. Showing a hopeful and above all intelligent approach to life and civilization on and Earth that was assumed to be diverse, cooperative and peaceful. Chekov and Uhura and Kirk and the others and no one noticed sex or color or race or nationality as anything special or any impediment, Uhura was obviously as competent as anyone else, Chekov's impish nationalism cracked me up.

And above all there was Spock.

Nimoy-Spock managed to turn geeky into dignified and oddly cool, an amazing thing in our culture really, a role model I had a hard time pulling off. I was old enough to be sure it was make believe and young enough to be idealistic. Star Trek and the entire crew became a fairly big thing with me until the show was canceled. And of course I continued to think about the role model I'd found.

Fast forward forty years of steady upward climb to lower middle class for thirty of them and then in 2003 the wheels started coming off, prolonged bedridden illness, depression, vast bills, loss of job and the coup de grâce, my thirty year marriage fell apart and I was divorced reasonably amiably but horribly hurt in 2008.

I took my grandchildren to see the 2009 Star Trek reboot, all five of them. About halfway through the scene with Nimoy I realized I had tears trickling down my cheeks and it took me a little while to figure out why. Sitting there with my beloved descendants I didn't and don't believe we have a hopeful future ahead of us like the one in Star Trek, with a benign Federation and an open, egalitarian and post-capitalistic society. I realized that I think my grandchildren will probably not have the same opportunity I had to thrive in an open and relatively free society albeit a less than perfect one in many ways. I think the future is more likely to be Bladerunner or Clockwork Orange or Snow Crash or Rollerball or Elysium or any number of other dystopian films and novels I have experienced. I now think the power of human greed and hate is just too strong as I watch what is happening in this country and in so many places around the world.

I have lost hope.

From the stars our bodies largely come and to our star they will eventually go, we are all starstuff but some of us shine a little more brightly than others. Godspeed Leonard, our atoms will in due time be mixed and we will all indeed be as one.

You gave me hope and then, through no fault of your own showed me I thought it was gone.

I keep having to stop and dry my eyes to see the screen, I've been that way since I heard Leonard had left us.



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Reply I'm a hard person to love these days and I'll tell you why (Original post)
Fumesucker Feb 2015 OP
CaliforniaPeggy Feb 2015 #1
rhett o rick Feb 2015 #6
Fumesucker Feb 2015 #13
Hekate Feb 2015 #40
Wounded Bear Feb 2015 #2
Egnever Feb 2015 #3
Fumesucker Feb 2015 #4
rhett o rick Feb 2015 #5
Aerows Feb 2015 #8
Fumesucker Feb 2015 #9
Aerows Feb 2015 #15
ancianita Feb 2015 #56
daleanime Feb 2015 #68
Enthusiast Feb 2015 #65
Half-Century Man Feb 2015 #7
KoKo Feb 2015 #10
csziggy Feb 2015 #11
Fumesucker Feb 2015 #14
csziggy Feb 2015 #46
byronius Feb 2015 #18
madfloridian Feb 2015 #12
Tsiyu Feb 2015 #16
Fumesucker Feb 2015 #23
Tsiyu Feb 2015 #25
ND-Dem Feb 2015 #27
Tsiyu Feb 2015 #28
Fumesucker Feb 2015 #32
Tsiyu Feb 2015 #81
ND-Dem Feb 2015 #53
appalachiablue Feb 2015 #63
Enthusiast Feb 2015 #66
Tsiyu Feb 2015 #82
Jackpine Radical Feb 2015 #33
Fumesucker Feb 2015 #70
Tsiyu Feb 2015 #83
Jackpine Radical Feb 2015 #87
hunter Feb 2015 #17
Fumesucker Feb 2015 #19
hunter Feb 2015 #22
BeanMusical Feb 2015 #42
UTUSN Feb 2015 #20
sendero Feb 2015 #21
littlemissmartypants Feb 2015 #24
littlemissmartypants Feb 2015 #26
Martin Eden Feb 2015 #29
G_j Feb 2015 #30
tavernier Feb 2015 #31
ThoughtCriminal Feb 2015 #34
mountain grammy Feb 2015 #35
awoke_in_2003 Feb 2015 #36
Phlem Feb 2015 #37
pansypoo53219 Feb 2015 #38
Kalidurga Feb 2015 #39
BeanMusical Feb 2015 #41
MrMickeysMom Feb 2015 #43
Warren DeMontague Feb 2015 #44
blkmusclmachine Feb 2015 #45
DeSwiss Feb 2015 #47
lumberjack_jeff Feb 2015 #48
Fumesucker Feb 2015 #50
raven mad Feb 2015 #49
JEB Feb 2015 #51
leveymg Feb 2015 #52
Joe Turner Feb 2015 #54
Fumesucker Feb 2015 #55
Joe Turner Feb 2015 #58
Fumesucker Feb 2015 #59
Joe Turner Feb 2015 #62
tandot Feb 2015 #57
tandot Feb 2015 #60
sabrina 1 Feb 2015 #61
Post removed Feb 2015 #64
Enthusiast Feb 2015 #67
cwydro Feb 2015 #69
Paka Feb 2015 #71
GTurck Feb 2015 #72
Bmad1 Feb 2015 #73
ChiciB1 Feb 2015 #74
Rosa Luxemburg Feb 2015 #75
catbyte Feb 2015 #76
yallerdawg Feb 2015 #77
niyad Feb 2015 #78
LWolf Feb 2015 #79
Zorra Feb 2015 #80
AverageJoe90 Feb 2015 #84
1monster Feb 2015 #85
Hatchling Feb 2015 #86

Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 08:30 PM

1. My dear Fumesucker...

Thank you for this wonderful post...

You are not alone.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Reply #1)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 08:46 PM

6. What she said.

 

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Reply #1)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 09:05 PM

13. Thank you Peggy, you're one of the nicest people I've run into

I appreciate your kind words and I wish I could clone some of your sunny disposition.



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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Reply #1)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 11:16 PM

40. What Peggy and csziggy said

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 08:32 PM

2. Great tribute, man...Thanks...nt

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 08:36 PM

3. So in a nutshell

 

You became bitter based on your own personal tragedies.

Sorry your life has been so hard the last few years but your individual situation does not equal the rest of the world.

I think if you talk to young people you will find most of them are filled with the same optimism you were at that age.

There was no shortage of god awful stuff going on when you were young the difference between then and now is your ability to see past it and recognize the possibility.

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Response to Egnever (Reply #3)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 08:44 PM

4. I try not to be bitter

With varying degrees of success of course..

I watch my children at the age I was and despite them being at least as smart and competent and as I was they're not getting as far as fast by a considerable margin.

Admitting your faults is part of learning to overcome them in my view.

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Response to Egnever (Reply #3)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 08:45 PM

5. I wonder what your intent is with your post. Tell me you are not chastising the OP author.

 

Maybe I misunderstood.

"I think if you talk to young people you will find most of them are filled with the same optimism you were at that age." I have talked to young people and they don't have much to look forward to.

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Response to rhett o rick (Reply #5)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 08:51 PM

8. Par for the course

 

from that poster.

They meant it exactly as it was said.

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Response to Aerows (Reply #8)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 08:56 PM

9. From a certain point of view it's not inaccurate

Easy conclusion to draw and I expected it, there aren't too many reactions I don't expect here any more.

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Response to Fumesucker (Reply #9)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 09:07 PM

15. If you post a lot

 

responses become predictable.

It doesn't make them any less valid, welcome or otherwise. It's the organic nature of a forum.

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Response to Fumesucker (Reply #9)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 12:46 AM

56. I don't know you at all, but you seem to be someone who truly knows we're not our circumstances.

And so, more than most, you can open up that heart and keep looking around. You will see what your grandchildren gravitate to. Keep in mind that the world has changed in ways we couldn't have imagined in our own youth, and trust that your grandkids' futures will be wonderful in similarly unexpected ways even as we have to let our world go and never see theirs.

My daughter just showed my grandson Star Trek IV, The Voyage Home. Said it was perfect for this nine year-old. Feed children visions and they try to make them real in their lives.

You've a great heart. Cry your heart out. Keep your eyes on the stars. Keep letting go.


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Response to Fumesucker (Reply #9)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 08:27 AM

68. Easy conclusion, easy way to not deal with it.....

I've noticed that when people don't want to deal with something they separate it from themselves.

"Well, that's just for you." This allows them to assign fault, freeing them from worry.

Problem for me is that I too easy see where your coming from. The overwhelming amount of 'bleak' futures in our pop culture is dis concerning. Wish I could suggest some remedy, but I don't have one.

Just that when I fall, I want to be moving forward.

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Response to Aerows (Reply #8)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 06:37 AM

65. I recognize that too.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 08:48 PM

7. I too, was stuck sick by the realization of what is and what could have been

Something came to me around 3:30 this afternoon; I was saddened because I thought the world would just become what Star Trek said it should be. It won't. We have to turn it into that.
Some of us were inspired to dream, some succumbed to nightmares.

I am not ready just yet to stop. Dreams that make you cry for joy are worth a lot of pain.

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Response to Half-Century Man (Reply #7)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 08:58 PM

10. Yes...thanks for this post...and a Hug to "Fumesucker" and the rest.......

Who are still hoping...

I don't think we give up ....I think we still keep looking to that future we dreamed of...and it might not come now..in the form we thought it would...but, it will take more time to unfold.

We can't ever give up "moving forward" ...it pleases those who want us to "Move Back or Stay Static" ....just too much to give them that satisfaction.

HOPE is there......even in the dark...or civilization would have snuffed itself out long ago. Always those who survive are Filled with Hope and they manage to cultivate the SKILLS to survive. HOPE is GOOD for survival. It is creative and gets one's mind working to find "ANOTHER WAY." Survival..

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 09:01 PM

11. Remember - the Star Trek timeline had wars and hard times before Enterprise

There was a World War III in their timeline (in 2053 depending on which timeline you go with) - think of the conditions they found Zefram Cochrane in "Star Trek: First Contact."


Star Trek: the Original Series takes place about 200 years after WWIII, leaving lots of time to clean up and learn from the mistakes made. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_Star_Trek

While it may be depressing to realize even if Star Trek were true we have over two hundred years of chaos and inequity to live through, it also means it is way too soon to give up on humanity. We just need to keep working on improving the future.

for Leonard Nimoy and for you and yours.

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Response to csziggy (Reply #11)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 09:06 PM

14. Yeah, I know...

That doesn't do my grandkids much good though and at the moment they are what's on my mind.

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Response to Fumesucker (Reply #14)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 11:35 PM

46. I remember when I was a teenager in the late 60s

We didn't expect to survive this long. We made serious plans for what to do when there was a nuclear attack. I pretty much wanted to be at Ground Zero in case of attack so I wouldn't have to suffer. I read a lot of apocalyptic science fiction - such as Alas Babylon, set only a hundred miles or so where I grew up - so I knew how bad it might get even if people survived the initial event.

But we survived. And some things got better, for at least a while. Some got worse. At the moment it seems like it is going down the drain even faster but I can't believe that is permanent.

Now I worry about my nieces and nephews and my grand nephews - but the grown ones seem to have more optimism than I did at their age and I know they are for the most part better people than many I grew up with. They are far more capable of dealing with adversity than I was at their age. They've been exposed to more varieties of culture and traveled more than I ever have. They are ready for their futures.

Worry, but try to equip your grandkids to deal with whatever they will encounter. It's all you can do.

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Response to csziggy (Reply #11)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 09:36 PM

18. Well said.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 09:04 PM

12. ......

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 09:32 PM

16. This is what gives me hope

there are 80 million millennials who will soon start kicking ass and taking down names.

They revere Nimoy, as evidenced by his visage all over reddit's front page today.



And you know what gives me more hope?


Look at the choices for charitable giving by reddit users:

http://www.redditblog.com/

(scroll down)

Every winning charity will receive a donation in the amount of $82,765.95 from reddit.


After +250,000 votes cast on +8,000 charities by 80,000+ voters, we have our top 10 list of charities:

Electronic Frontier Foundation
Planned Parenthood Federation of America
Doctors Without Borders, USA
Erowid Center
Wikimedia Foundation
Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies
NPR
Free Software Foundation
Freedom From Religion Foundation
Tor Project Inc.



The kids just have to wait out the dying Old Guard, but they're already making a difference.


Everyone should have hope.









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Response to Tsiyu (Reply #16)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 09:55 PM

23. This is closer to my feeling most days..

It hit me hard today though...





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Response to Fumesucker (Reply #23)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 09:59 PM

25. I know you remember the other similar poster



but, yeah...we all have those days.

My kids are having it tough as well, with student loans. They can't even do in their thirties what we could manage to do in our twenties. It's very scary to think how bad things have gotten, that so many young people can't even begin to get in the game.

But they aren't afraid to shame the morans, and I look forward to their handling of things. Our generation gave it all away.

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Response to Tsiyu (Reply #16)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 10:04 PM

27. "The kids just have to wait out the dying Old Guard" was heard in the 60s.

 

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Response to ND-Dem (Reply #27)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 10:13 PM

28. And then the kids of the '60s sold out

but truthfully, there weren't as many socially liberal kids as there are now.

Older people who never hang around younger people think that younger people are apathetic. Nope. Some are, sure, but most people my age are apathetic or plain stupid about politics.

Young people are having many discussions about issues, and their insight is far more honest, humble and guileless than that of my generation.

Also, the older generations of CEOs were not as avaricious and cruel as older affluent today. And young people have greater access to what's happening all over the world.

They saved net neutrality, and they will use it wisely.







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Response to Tsiyu (Reply #28)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 10:33 PM

32. I was at a family dinner table with some old friends quite a number of years ago..

Visiting their home I ate with them and their then teen daughter (who I long after learned is bisexual) raised some social issue or other with her rather conservative parents, they of course immediately disagreed with the daughter and told her she was wrong on the facts. I knew them well enough and long enough to speak up and say that the daughter was in fact correct on what she had said and I could prove it on their computer (no smartphones then)..

I'll never forget the look of gratitude the daughter gave me, a peer of her parents, for standing with her.

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Response to Fumesucker (Reply #32)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 01:38 PM

81. ...

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Response to Tsiyu (Reply #28)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 12:21 AM

53. I know plenty of young people. I don't see what you do, particularly once they settle down,

 

get jobs, and start having kids. If anything, they're less liberal on economic issues than earlier generations. The only thing they have over earlier generations is that they're more liberal on issues like gay rights. But that's about it. In fact, some are downright reactionary on economics, to a frightening degree.

I also don't see the general "apathy" or "stupidity" you see from older people.

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Response to Tsiyu (Reply #28)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 02:21 AM

63. I am close with a good deal of young people whose energy, strength, and stability provides me much

happiness and joy. Many of them possess courage, determination and maturity that is beyond their years. The young are associated internationally through our diverse culture and the internet. Yet in many ways they are being left a world of uncertainty, vast global economic inequality, regression in achievements for the middle class, currents of reactionary conservatism particularly in the west and global climate change. That's an enormous load to deal with and it concerns me a greatly. Comparisons between generations are sometimes detrimental. We're all part of the thread of life, in this together, not competing on a cosmic reality show about human existence.

These major issues that the young face were nonexistent when I was growing up. We also had many opportunities and advantages particularly in terms of education and employment opportunities, also human and environmental health that are now compromised. The same holds for my parents and grandparents lives. I do not think the internet or the digital age can compensate yet, for the many insecurities facing 7 billion on the planet, more than doubled in my lifetime. I sincerely hope that I am too pessimistic and that bright young minds worldwide will develop solutions to these major challenges.

As a person of the 60s I disagree about a shallow and avaricious characterization of the majority. I didn't sell out, nor did those closest to me and many very fine colleagues. As for cultural diversity I loved travel, started early and was always drawn to people from different places and origins. This was the norm for most people I was around well into adulthood.

People I know including many family members and friends are involved politically and are about as broad minded, socially liberal and varied as you can get. We are of white, black, Hispanic, Asian, Christian, Jewish, Sikh and Muslim backgrounds and dispersed through the US, Canada, Europe and Asia. I don't think most of this is highly unusual for my generation. The many intense, bigoted, politically active conservatives so prevalent today and featured in the media are real and very disturbing. But they hold no place in my world other than opposition.

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Response to Tsiyu (Reply #28)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 07:05 AM

66. You are on to us. We sold out.

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Response to Enthusiast (Reply #66)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 01:45 PM

82. Many of my generation ( I am mid 50s) did.

Of course, I live in the South, in areas where there was not any huge hippie movement, but even poor Appalachians who always supported Dems are switching to the Jeebus Money party in the hopes that they will please Jeebus and make lots of money.

And put them uppity "others" out of bidness. They key to their betrayal of the party. Who needs fair working conditions or a social safety net when you can take away other people's rights to simply exist?

But my cousins and sibs are clueless about poverty, social justice, etc. My brother is a Dem elite, travels the world but very judgmental of the poor; my sister is a fundy; my cousins are in various states of competition/apathy for the most part.

To me, they are sellouts. DU shows the degree. Not all are sellouts, of course, but there are not enough people in my generation willing to secure a future for the next generations. It's all about the next quarter/leased car/episode/smartphone.

Just my opinion, of course.

Peace.

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Response to Tsiyu (Reply #16)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 10:41 PM

33. What an interesting list of charities--

In particular, I note that Erowid and MAPS made it. Heh.

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Response to Jackpine Radical (Reply #33)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 08:35 AM

70. I was sort of struck by NPR..

I don't see NPR as being a positive force any more and haven't for over a decade. They certainly sound more rational and far less breathless than Fox or even MSNBC but in my view that makes them an even better conduit for propaganda.

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Response to Fumesucker (Reply #70)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 01:50 PM

83. Perhaps the hope is that funding them

will make them less reliant on Reichwing support?

I wondered about that, too.





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Response to Fumesucker (Reply #70)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 07:15 PM

87. I agree about NPR, but defend WPR.

Wisconsin Public Radio has some really great content with local afternoon hosts and often very provocatively progressive guests. They maintain the image of "balance" by sprinkling in a number of Heritage Foundation types, but with either flavor of guest, the hosts are well-prepared, have read the guests' books, ask intelligent and probing questions, and open up the discussion to the listeners for questions & comments. Let's just say they must have good screeners because the callers generally have a lot of useful stuff to contribute.

If you want to try it, you can get podcasts of most of the shows at wpr.org. I recommend the Kathleen Dunn show in particular.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 09:34 PM

17. My parents wouldn't let me watch the first few episodes of Star Trek...

... until they saw what it was about.

As a third grader that made me crazy!

My parents soon approved, even for my younger siblings, and I was immediately stricken with a very serious third grade crush on Uhura.








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Response to hunter (Reply #17)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 09:41 PM

19. Do you know that MLK all but ordered Nichelle Nichols to stay on the show after the first season?

It's quite a story..

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Response to Fumesucker (Reply #19)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 09:52 PM

22. So I learned later...

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Response to Fumesucker (Reply #19)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 11:28 PM

42. Wow, I had no idea.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 09:43 PM

20. R#38 & K for, I stopped reading halfway through but my condolences n/t

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 09:47 PM

21. I get it...

.... and I'm frankly astounded that so many do not. It's like the whole country forgot everything it learned. Hang in there.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 09:59 PM

24. Excellent post and points, Fumesucker. Thank you. eom

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 09:59 PM

26. kickety.kick.kick

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 10:18 PM

29. You give me hope.

For hope lies in the human spirit, which shines through what you've written here.

And in idealistic young people who see in role models like Nimoy/Spock the course to a better future.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 10:19 PM

30. thank you

So many times I have thought of our earth as a spaceship, and thought how 'logical' it should be for all of us to cooperate for the sake of succeeding on this journey. I wished and hoped people would come to see that actions such as polluting the water supply on our ship (rivers and oceans) effects the well being of everyone onboard. These analogies certainly came from watching Star Trek as a kid. It's difficult to gauge the extent of the show's influence on our culture, I think it is greater that most realize. There are many of us who share those cooperative and equalitarian values. There are many of us.

But I share your dire view of the future. People like ourselves never sought power, and especially power over others. Most of us did not have the slightest desire to gather all the wealth and power to ourselves. So while we were learning to be decent human beings, practicing compassion and tolerance and enjoying life. Certain others gathered the wealth and power to themselves, and now it's almost complete. I don't know what the answer is. I'm afraid they have hyjacked the ship and don't care if it crashes.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 10:32 PM

31. Oh dear one: spend some time with the children!

I've been lucky enough to have grandkids, and lately I'm working in the school system with both grade school age and high schoolers. For the very most part, they are as starry eyed and hopeful as we were at that age. They love family, are furiously devoted to friends, excited about their futures, and yet nervous about it all. Sound familiar? They haven't as yet learned how to be cynical or corrupt. Mind you, they are not angels. But they truly want to count.

I truly wish there was a way to identify the crossroads, when these kids choose to pick the wrong road. Is it a lack of our school system? A lack of family involvement?

Either way, don't count them down. There are plenty of kids out here who still have their eyes to the stars and are filled with as much hope and optimism as we were.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 10:44 PM

34. During the Bush/Cheney years

I felt like we were destined to live in the universe where Spock would have a beard. But even that universe had hope.

I leave you with the words from another great science fiction series - delivered by another great actor that left us a few years ago (Andreas Katsulas):

G’Quon wrote, “There is a greater darkness than the one we fight. It is the darkness of the soul that has lost its way. The war we fight is not against powers and principalities; it is against chaos and despair. Greater than the death of flesh is the death of hope, the death of dreams. Against this peril we can never surrender. The future is all around us, waiting, in moments of transition, to be born in moments of revelation. No one knows the shape of that future or where it will take us. We know only that it is always born in pain.”

-G'Kar
"Babylon 5"

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 10:53 PM

35. Fumesucker, you got me. Your post will be in my head for a long time..

We must be close to the same age. I was also a teen when Trek began, just a few years after the death of my dad. I was so lonely and depressed, but had to hide it from my mom. She was pretty fragile for a while. We watched the show together, mom and me, bonding over the characters and story. It was an escape, and a fun evening for both of us. We loved it all, but Spock was our favorite.

It's kind of weird, but the show gave me hope for a future at a time in my life when I had lost all hope.

I also have 5 grandchildren, and little about today gives me hope for their future. They're in their worlds of handheld devices but I can still manage to coax them out for a talk now and then, more than their mom or dad can. I dread their future. The only dystopian story I feel is accurate is Cormac McCarthy's "The Road."

You still have those "beloved descendants," as do I, an maybe, just maybe, one of them will open a door to a better future.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 10:53 PM

36. I agree that the future will be dystopian

 

a lot of the things in 1984 are now brutal reality. Hell, even our TVs are able to listen to us (though we can supposedly turn that feature off- now)

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 10:54 PM

37. *cough* sniff I think I may have poked my eye doing the

the Vulcan "V".

Excellent post my friend, we work at this so ours and every one's grandchildren can live long and prosper.

I will never give up working on my child's future, and hopefully grand kid's too. I'd rather die fighting for a better future for all and education from DU (after it's parsed) helps to articulate the process for the non political people I know.

I think if you look at it from a different perspective, doing what you do is exactly what you should be doing this very moment, for your grand kid's.

We try to leave the place we're born into, a better place for the future, and for everyone, IMHO is how I understand it.

Again, excellent post.



peace.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 10:56 PM

38. the rite can only STALL progress. the crazy will lose eventually.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 11:05 PM

39. I still don't know how to deal with this

Spock was the first person I ever saw on TV that was a little bit like me. He probably saved my life. While I saw everyone around me overcome with emotion and fighting all the time, I was comforted by the idea that there could be a better way. I saw that not being overtly emotional wasn't a freak thing to be it was just different. Now if only I had his brains as well, but that is a whole nuther story.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 11:26 PM

41. What a wonderful post, Fumesucker.

And no, you're not a hard person to love.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 11:30 PM

43. Fumesucker...

Long ago therapy in my life taught me about the letting go processes.

Crying is release, yes, it represents letting go of the "old way". But, the old way I'm speaking of is about what our collective species has to do to not be like we were. Where are we going Where have we been?. Jeebus, where we need to go to get out from under this insanity?

I have a mental and spiritual image of this Trek, I think it hurts to say good-bye to the icons that ushered in this change of consciousness. That's how I've always felt about the entirety of Star Trek… certainly Spock's character.

But, we (at least you, I) are crying for change, and it really hurts going through this because we surely are in the process of shedding the past.

I really believe that. Meanwhile….

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 11:30 PM

44. He lived long. And prospered.


I realize it's not a particularly popular POV around here, but I remain guardedly optimistic. And I think in countless small, but crucial ways, our species IS advancing, improving, becoming more peaceful and more enlightened, more aware and interconnected.

Maybe I'm blowing smoke up my own ass. But I haven't given up hope.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 11:31 PM

45. I sadly concur. Today's Republican Party is hell-bent on destroying the planet. And the DEMS are

 

more than happy to "go along to get along."

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 11:36 PM

47. K&R

 

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 11:38 PM

48. Star Trek was formative to me too... although I idolized Mr Scott.

 

But I haven't given up on optimism. I don't see any useful alternative.



I admire the stuff you have done, and but had no idea that the road had been so bumpy. I appreciate you getting me into electric bikes. I'm now building one for Mrs LJ.

FWIW You're one of my favorite DU'ers.

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Response to lumberjack_jeff (Reply #48)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 12:07 AM

50. The weather has been either wet and cold, icy or frigid so I haven't ridden much lately

Not gonna ride on ice and old enough my temperature tolerance is not what it was.

I'm in "damn the torpedoes full speed ahead" mode most of the time but hearing of Nimoy's passing brought the stupid despair back as hard as I've ever felt it.


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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Feb 27, 2015, 11:42 PM

49. Sending love and good karma -

Spock would not let you give up hope, even if it is an illogical human emotion; neither will your fellow DU'ers.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 12:13 AM

51. Thanks for the honest heart felt post.

 

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 12:13 AM

52. Hang in there my little green friend. The future is us. It is always within us to remake it.

Thanks for making DU not suck.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 12:36 AM

54. the future is more likely to be Bladerunner or Clockwork Orange

 

True, and it's because this country stopped being Nationalist. Globalism, with America at the bleeding edge has done more to bring this country down than anything else. Star Trek had an innovative theme. Maybe someday we will get there. Until then, it's way past high time this country starts to look out for it's own interests so it can be there another 100 years from now.

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Response to Joe Turner (Reply #54)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 12:41 AM

55. I disagree, globalism for extreme profit was what did America in

It didn't have to be that way but big money got their wish as big money usually does.

The golden rule don't you know.

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Response to Fumesucker (Reply #55)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 12:52 AM

58. What do you think globalism is?

 

If not for extreme profit for the few. I believe in the nation state but the nation state cannot last when big money is allowed buy the government itself. On that I agree, but you seem to be a hair-splitter so I guess I will disagree in advance of your next commentary.

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Response to Joe Turner (Reply #58)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 12:59 AM

59. I think trade is a necessity, it's been going on for as long as we have been humans..

If you an early human and live somewhere there is no salt for cooking and curing or flint for spearheads or any number of other items then you must trade for them. You could substitute obsidian or even bone for flint but salt there really is no substitute for.

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Response to Fumesucker (Reply #59)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 01:34 AM

62. Trade is a necessity

 

Who said otherwise. Being smart about trading relationships and understanding the importance of keeping and growing key industries is something this country lost about 45 years ago. Being a dope on trade by shipping away our factories and key technologies to other nations under the rubric of free trade is an entire different story with an unhappy ending...for us.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 12:46 AM

57. I grew up in Germany and it was my favorite show.

I loved Spock. In German, his "LLAP" was " live long and with peace" ... fast forward to 2002 when I met my hubby ...after immigrating to the US ... the ultimate Trekkie. Our son is now almost 6 and already a big fan ... the message will live on: diversity, inclusion, acceptance, love, and a good whopping for mean bullies

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Response to tandot (Reply #57)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 01:08 AM

60. And that is the message to our son

Good will always win ... Never give up

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 01:08 AM

61. What a beautiful post, Fumesucker. Fwiw, you are one of my favorite DUers.

I can understand what you are feeling about where we are going. But then I remember, that this planet seems to go through periods where there seems to be no hope at all, and then things seem to turn around, just in time.

Looking back at the way things were, the bad periods seem short, but probably didn't feel that way to those who were there at the time.

It's okay to feel hopeless especially when you have good reason to do so.

For now, the bad guys seem to be in charge, but there are signs we may be coming out of this bad period. And those who are making the necessary changes need all of us to be there for them.

Greece eg. It was so hopeless there for so long, but the people kept on fighting and have taken the first step towards turning things around. When I read what the new government's first act was, I felt hopeful again. They restored the Social Programs the neo-liberals abolished! I was so happy to hear that.

Thank you for all you contribute to DU making it still worthwhile to come here.

And thanks for a wonderful, thoughtful OP!

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)


Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 07:27 AM

67. Awesome post, Fumesucker.

You always often share something of an interesting and unique observation. This time it's a perspective that I feel deeply.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 08:35 AM

69. Well said.



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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 09:31 AM

71. Beautiful Post!

I have no progeny to fear for, but like you, I too have lost hope. A small glimmer breaks through now and then, but it's way too muted by the time it reaches me. Thank you for your lovely words.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 09:39 AM

72. In full agreement....

about our dystopian future but I see a melding of Brave New World, 1984, and Fahrenheit 451. We will be ignorant, sensual, and watched by a Big Brother who will keep us confused and on a short leash.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 10:03 AM

73. Thank You for Writing This

This above all I have read portrays my feelings and thoughts more accurately than I have been able to muster. Thank you.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 10:40 AM

74. I've Had To Hide Myself Away For Quite Some Time

to regroup and try to repair MY DESPAIR! I know and understand EXACTLY where you're coming from and feel something deep in my soul that keeps churning that causes me grief. We had such heady times, but there WAS a lot of upheaval too. Things seemed less complicated and the answers easier to wrap your head around.

I have to keep telling myself that TODAY the world is turning so much faster and harder for me to keep up with. I've been a music lover all my life and some of my favorite singer/songwriters like Jackson Browne (really #1), Tom Petty and many more of that era are still writing and singing. The songs that they write now are STILL addressing issues as they did then, issues that we confront today. But the songs are reflective of the lives we've lived and what we learned along the way. I connect with them so well and there's some sadness and angst that tugs at my heart. But I still need them in my life, the ones who were the activists. It helps me to remember, but also shows me "we're still the same" in so many ways.

But since I'm older and have grandkids who are music lovers too, I listen to their music as well. Some is just silly pop, but some has real meaning, as it always has been. I mean does anyone remember a song about "Who Put The Bomp In The Bomp Sha Bomp Sha Bomp, and The Ram A Lam A Ding Dong?" I'm not sure I got that right, I really was VERY young when that came out.

I was in High School when The Beatles hit America and I found a certain calling... Many songs of great meaning and then I found my favorite era with Jackson Browne and all the rest. Always loved Dylan, but he was never an activist despite Joan Baez's pleadings! I could go on about all the concerts and so much more, but I think it's because there was a tangible connection back then that those of us who lived that life find it hard to forget. I'll never ever forget those times, but I'm trying hard to keep moving forward. And no truer words have been spoken for me... two steps forward, one step back! It's so hard and it hurts so much.

I NEVER sold out, but with it comes pain and sorrow! I have to keep reminding myself that those are golden memories, but they are memories. It's just so, damn hard to live in today because I knew "way back when" still we must stay aware, there will always be changes. I'm working hard to understand TODAY!

My husband & I are now the Patriarch & Matriarch of our current family. We been together since the way back time, "our" kids are "our" kids, an accomplishment that stands alone. They live close with their kids, our family is close and very like minded and we see each other often. Our fingers still hold tight on the mantle of our family, but new fingers have reached out and are pulling it toward them.

I have a wish and probably DO believe we've given them many tools to guide them. They chastise me often, mostly because they want me to stop worrying and be happy. But still I worry a great deal about the chaos I see all around me, and it disturbs me. Do I see too much apathy??

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 11:06 AM

75. Wow!

Great post!

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 11:10 AM

76. Trying to type through tears, Fumesucker.

That was awesome.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 11:34 AM

77. The best of "Star Trek" was never about 'out there.'

It was always about 'in here.'

We may not always be hopeful about the future, but for fans our lives were made better, our futures were better.

The message will go on forever -- as George Harrison sung, "Within you, and without you."

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 12:54 PM

78. "illegitimati non carburundum" (VERY bastardized latin for "don't let the bastards grind

you down"

I know how hard it is to look and see anything positive these days. just know that you are not alone, that there are still people who care, who will keep working toward what ST showed us as a possible future.

damn, there is a lot of dust in here today!

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 12:57 PM

79. Me, too.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 01:23 PM

80. Recommend...



Star Trek is a genuine timeless classic work of art.

*Live long and prosper*. Don't give up hope. The success of every resistance to fascism movement depended on the people who refused to give up hope in the face of seemingly insurmountable opposition. Consider the possibility that paid corporate trolls are paid to post on DU, in order to crush your hope and spirit. Everytime I feel like giving up, the idea that the evil little fuckers have beaten me brings me back to the fight.

We can do better.



Thanks for the OP, Fumesucker.



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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 02:05 PM

84. I understand.

 

I'm not quite so much the hard pessimist myself, taking more of a history-based approach when I think of the future, but indeed, I think we've missed a fair number of opprotunities over the past 60 years or so. That said, though, as the old saying goes, sometimes the darkest time is just before the dawn.....and although I'm not convinced we're likely to descend into dystopia, perhaps if we want to make that virtually utopian Star Trek future come true, we really have to work at it. But maybe we can.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 02:50 PM

85. There have been times when I have had doubts that there would be a better future...

Then I remember that things go in cycles. Progress, regress, progress regress... The pendulum is always swinging. Even if it swings the whole way around, it is going to go back the other way eventually.

I'm sure that there were people who despaired of a better future for themselves and their children during WWII, during the Napoleanic wars of the nineteenth century that went on for more than a decade, during the plagues that decimated various parts of the world at various times...

Better times came, and worse times came and then better again (not always in one lifetime).

The real concern is that this planet will be so damaged by our corporate "civilization" that it cannot continue to support humans, other mammals, avians, and other creatures.

But, unless it is blown nto smithereens, life of one kind or another will continue on this planet as it has in the past.

And we will return to the elements that created us. (Perhaps to one day become that fossil fuel disater for another type of life making he same mistakes that we did or not.)

I believe that our souls, our "pure energy" is recycled many times. Leonard Nimoy is not gone, he's just changing. And as long as we remember the message he acted and lived, he still lives.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Sat Feb 28, 2015, 04:15 PM

86. Thank you, Fumesucker

You expressed beautifully the thoughts I couldn't.

When Trek came on we only had a BW TV. This little old woman two doors down saw how much I loved it and invited me into her home every week to watch it in color. She and I didn't talk much but we enjoyed the program together. And I always went home elated with my heart and mind filled with dreams.

It's ironic in way. When Robin Williams died my friend was devastated and I had very little sympathy for her. After all, he was just an actor she didn't really know. Now I understand her grief. She knew him as well as I knew Lenard Nimoy. Someone who touched her life in precious ways was lost to her. I have to apologize to her for my insensitivity.

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