Fast Cars

[Oubaas]

I've been thinking lately. The other day, I read something about a new Dodge Challenger special edition that boasts 707 horsepower. Today, I looked at pictures from the Geneva Auto show and saw a new prototype with 1,500 horsepower. And there are more of these beasts.

Back in the 80s, I had a Mustang with 225 horsepower. It was bordering heavily on scary, especially in the lower gears. Why do we even permit the manufacture and marketing of 707 horsepower cars if energy is such a big issue in this world?

And my other question is, how comfortable are you knowing that anyone with the money can walk into the nearest car dealer and drive off in a vehicle that would give a professional racing driver pause?

Is it just because our requirements for issuance of a driver's license are so gosh darn stringent that we KNOW nothing could go wrong?

"Awe, the kids will be OK on the highway. Them boys are just liquored up and driving like that because they're so happy about their new car!"

Or maybe I just worry too much. After all, Americans are BORN consummate professionals behind the wheel. What are the chances of one of those big steel rocketships even being on the same road as a school bus? And if you can afford the gas, you should be able to drive what you want. And it's our RIGHT! Besides, it's manly, and chicks dig it.

[taught_me_patience]

1. As oil gets more scarce and expensive

High HP cars will go the way of the dodo bird. In order to meet new epa requirements, engines will have to get much smaller and cars much lighter. Market will take care of itself on this issue.

[2naSalit]

16. In what century

pray tell?

[hifiguy]

39. Nope.

The cutting-edge sports car manufacturers (Porsche, Ferrari, McLaren) have already developed insanely fast hybrids. The technology now available allows far more power to be squeezed out of less and less fuel. Science marches on.

[stone space]

2. Fast Car

[Throd]

3. Fast Cars

[Fumesucker]

4. 2014 Corvette: 455 hp and 30 mpg highway..

It really isn't that simple any more, it's possible to get big horsepower and still have an efficient cruise.

http://gmauthority.com/blog/2013/07/2014-corvette-stingray-30-mpg-highway-in-eco-mode-with-seven-speed-manual/

From a sheer data standpoint, the 2014 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray is quickly shaping to be a legendary machine. When this “base” Corvette hits the market in a few months, not only will it be the most technologically-advanced and powerful base model ever (with 455 standard horsepower), but it will also achieve an official EPA estimated 17 mpg city and 29 mpg highway for a combined 21 mpg — making it the most fuel-efficient V8 sports car on the market.

The 29 mpg highway rating comes from the average of the C7?s driving settings, with the default Touring mode achieving 28 mpg highway, and the Eco mode attaining the coveted 30 miles per gallon mark, all while delivering 455 ponies (460 hp with the performance dual-mode exhaust system). Fuel economy numbers for the 2014 Corvette Stingray equipped with the six-speed automatic transmission are still being finalized.

The 30 mpg rating is achieved with Corvettes equipped with the seven-speed manual transmission, and is made possible with the fifth-generation Small Block LT1 V8 engine’s Active Fuel Management system, which deactivates four of the eight cylinders during light driving conditions. Check out our deep dive feature on the new LT1 to read more on the system’s mechanics.

Read more: http://gmauthority.com/blog/2013/07/2014-corvette-stingray-30-mpg-highway-in-eco-mode-with-seven-speed-manual/#ixzz3TXGXYRA7

[DrDan]

50. this is legit . . . I have a C6 corvette with 6-speed manual transmission and get 32 mpg

just drive it from Charlotte to Orlando - right at 500 miles - on a single tank of gas - 30-32 mpg the whole way driving 65-70 mph

[Hoyt]

5. We let folks walk in a buy gunz and walk down the street with them. Many of today's 4 cylinder cars

are plenty fast, with acceleration that is easy to lose control of.

When I started to drive decades ago, big V8s were popular. But, I'm not sure they were that much "faster" than many of today's turbo 4 cylinders.

Fortunately, those 700 horsers are quite expensive and not very practical on the streets. I'm sure insurance is ridiculous, especially for younger male drivers. They are much like gunz, marketed to those who need a boost.

I tend to view folks who buy those cars, Hummers, etc. -- or gunz for that matter -- as not very concerned about our society and environment. It's kind of silly actually.

[2naSalit]

18. To be certain...

Mitten$ will need to have one for his elevator room.

[snooper2]

21. here is a Smart Car for you Hoyt, not sure if it is too much car for you though LOL

[Hoyt]

25. I'd take something like that on a short-term rental basis. Looks like fun.

[ileus]

6. I know one guy with that kind of scratch...he totaled his venom 1000 viper.

And replaced it with a new Ferrari. He drives it almost every day to work except in the ice and heavy snow (I've seen him drive it on snowy days)



You worry too much.....these aren't high school kids, dropouts, or drunks buying 100k buck plus cars. Think of the last time you remember a super car being crashed in your town.

If you must worry, then worry that there are still pubs and clubs that serve alcohol while having parking lots for their customers vehicles.

[Motown_Johnny]

7. You are referring to the Hellcat

I sat in one at the Detroit International Auto Show back in January.

It is a really nice car. I love the course grain leather that Dodge is going with in it's vehicles this year.


My only response to your post is "why now?". Why is it this car that set off the alarm bell for you while vehicles like the Corvette have existed for half a century?



P.S. I learned to drive on a '73 Mustang with a 351 CL. I also owned another one in my mid 20s. I am a Mustang guy who now has 2 Ford trucks, but the Hellcat is a really nice car (even if the base price is ~$61,000).

[Throd]

8. After a point, the horsepower race just becomes who has the higher number.

If 700 is great, 800 must be awesome. It gets silly. I have a car with an Oldsmobile 455 that makes about 400hp. I could dump a bunch of money into it to get another 100hp, but what would be the point? The car is scary fast as it is. Horsepower is useless if you can't transfer that energy to the pavement.

One of the things that lead to lower horsepower ratings for the classic muscle cars in the early 70's was higher insurance rates.

[taught_me_patience]

12. It's quite silly

horsepower sells cars but torque wins races. But too much torque and the wheels just spin. 700hp on street tires is just completely overkill and NOBODY could get full use out of that without spinning the wheels.

Frankly, I'd rather have my wifes 2.5L BMW I6 w/170HP. Instantaneous throttle response and honey smooth revs.

[snooper2]

22. 11.8 @ 118 on this run...

Skip to 10 minutes in to hear the greatness of the Hellcat do the standing mile in 30.1 seconds at 173.8 MPH

(superchargers would make your I6 sound like an 80's Escort )

[Fumesucker]

24. :)

[snooper2]

27. And you can see why that video has so many thumbs down...looks like my MIL was driving the hellcat

Um, here is the Hellcat doing the quarter in 10.8 with drag radials...

GET YOU SOME OF THAT!

[leveymg]

35. Paint it white. Kolwalski would've made it to LA in this.

American muscle cars are better than ever, and still the best performance value on the planet. That's why I would buy one of these. Paint it white.

[Blue_Tires]

23. +1...700hp would be insane for a daily driver...

And if it was just a weekend-only toy, you could build a damn nice track car for Hellcat money

My mustang has 412 stock, and that's about all I'd ever want in a daily driver...

Although what goes unsaid is that vehicle curb weights continue to creep unchecked, so they need more power to keep all that mass moving...

[Mnpaul]

55. You could drive it with the black key

If driven with the black key fob horsepower is limited to 500. It can be reduced further with valet mode. High horsepower does not necessarily change the way they drive in normal use. The Corvette is a fine example.

[Oubaas]

9. OK, they're getting more efficient...

...but that still doesn't alleviate the fearful shudder that I experience when I think about the idea that some of the people that I know who appear to have ZERO common sense may one day slide in behind the wheel of one of these things and take to the same highways as my wife and kids.

Should we require more education and training for a license? Should it be possible for me to approach an intersection in Florida without worrying about little old ladies who can't see over the wheel piloting two ton steel missiles and ignoring stop signs?

And if a 400+ horsepower car can get 30 MPG, what could a 125 horsepower car potentially get?

How much horsepower does anyone really need? I realize that this issue is a sacred cow for many Americans, but does anyone actually NEED 700+ horsepower on a public highway?

Or is this sort of a psychological thing, where a bigger horsepower number makes some people feel like other things of theirs are bigger?

What is the logical answer here?

[Glassunion]

15. Horsepower can be relatively arbitrary.

2 vehicles can have vastly different HP and still have the same performance.

Example:
Vehicle 1 (Dodge Hellcat) 707hp
Vehicle 2 (BMW i8) 357hp (almost half)

Vehicle 1 - 0 to 60 = 3.6 seconds
Vehicle 2 - 0 to 60 = 3.6 seconds

[A HERETIC I AM]

31. "Should we require more education and training for a license? "

Absolutely. My reason for saying that has nothing to do with the available horsepower one can write a check for.

It is my understanding that in Europe, Germany in particular, getting a drivers license is tantamount to getting a private pilots license in the USA. The probationary period makes the ones in the states look like a weekend picnic and the testing is extensive.

Americans, by and large are less than proficient drivers. Entirely too many have no clue how to use a multi lane interstate and far too many just simply do not take the driving task seriously.

Look at a Porsche at a dealer in the US and count the cup holders. Do the same thing at a dealership in Germany. The difference is remarkable.

I take issue with a few of the points you made in your post above as well as your OP, such as "How much horsepower does anyone really need?" Frankly, that is completely immaterial. A better question would be "Should the amount of driver training be increased with the performance capabilities of the automobile?" and to that I would give a resounding YES! In other words, license car drivers like we license people like me - professional tractor trailer operators. I have to have a special endorsement: take a specific test - in order to carry gasoline in a tanker as opposed to simply carrying boxes of toys in a regular freight trailer.

The faster the car can go or the better it can perform, the more proficiency a driver should be able to display and be accredited for it on his/her license.

It is my opinion that the superfast motorcycles relatively inexpensively available to the demographic you seem to be most concerned with (young people) are a larger threat on the highways than a Charger or a Ferrari or any car easily capable of speeds in excess of twice the speed limit. Let's start requiring young, inexperienced motor vehicle operators that want to buy what is essentially a street legal racing motorcycle to take advanced cycle rider courses.

Leave the people who want to and can afford to buy $100,000 supercars alone. Let's get them properly trained to drive them and teach everyone who gets a license how to be a better driver.

[Glassunion]

38. +1

Side note. Many states require additional driver training for motorcycles.

The #1 cause for motorcycle accidents is actually other vehicles turning into their path. Folks tend to either not see them or poorly judge their actual distance.

[A HERETIC I AM]

43. I have every endorsement except passenger buses....

And the only reason I didn't take that test when I renewed a few years ago is because I left my bus in my other pants! Seriously, I needed a bus with me to take an observed driving test in, in order to get the endorsement. Didn't have one, so I don't have the endorsement. CDL-A, XT + Motorcycle. XT = haz-mat, tankers, Doubles and Triple trailers.

So, yes...I have a Motorcycle endorsement as well, and I agree with you....(owned a '02 Heritage Softail - pic at bottom)


HOWEVER.....the course I took when I first got my bike endorsement wasn't so much "training" as it was centered around simply observing slow speed handling abilities and had NO observation of my ability to operate a bike on the freeway, or even at regular surface street speeds. This was in Michigan, if memory serves, back in 1994 or so. Florida let me grandfather in with the same. Not to toot my horn or anything, but the instructor gave me a perfect score and said it had been a long time since he had done so.

I also agree with your point in the second paragraph and that goes to my suggestion regarding proper, professional rider training, ideally something like a Bob Bondurant competitive/defensive driving course. I know there are similar courses available for motorcycle riders, I am just not familiar with them.


My old scoot;

[Travis_0004]

56. Who cares

Cars with 700 hp make up way way less than 1% of the market. People that own them tend to be older and more responsible. Im more worried about the teenager in a honda civic driving recklessly.

Plus even if they get 10mpg, people with these cars are probably not driving 12,000 miles a year.

Nobody needs 700 hp, hell I dont need 250, but I like it and thats good enough for me.

[Chuuku Davis]

59. Nanny much?

[liberal N proud]

10. I was glad I had my Hemi last night getting on the freeway

It allowed me to get up to speed on the ramp, as that is the purpose of the ramp, and merge into traffic without issue. Had I not been able to reach highway speed on the ramp, I was looking at having to slow my pace to a craw as the right lane was jammed up as far as I could see looking over my shoulder.

Just kicked it down, blew the carbon out and was sitting at 70 just like that and out in front of the traffic.

[catnhatnh]

11. My brother just purchased a 4 cylinder 2015 mustang...

31 Hiway MPG and 310 horsepower...

[Orsino]

13. I've seen The Road Warrior, and know where this ends.

It won't end earlier, as long as extreme horsepower ratings are still seen as a substitute for missing masculinity.

[Glassunion]

14. Does not bother me.

Folks can buy what they want. Your making the assumption that because the have that the power, that they will misuse it or are somehow more prone to accidents. Cell phone use causes more death and accidents. I can just as easily be killed by a Toyota Corolla.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

17. ....Vroom, Vroom.

[2naSalit]

19. Good one! n/t

[snooper2]

20. How DARE YOU, special edition my ass...it has a name THE HELLCAT!

BOW TO THE AWESOMENESS!

[oneshooter]

47. This is a HELLCAT

&t=48


Wright R-2600 Twin Cyclone two-row, 14-cylinder radial engine of 1,700 hp (1,268 kW) driving a three-bladed Curtiss Electric propeller.

And it's faster too.

[bluedigger]

26. Most supercars spend their lives in dark garages.

Actual supercar mayhem is pretty rare, but always gets press. I'd rather have the filthy rich spending their money on something than just rolling around in it a la Scrooge McDuck.

[Amishman]

28. its fine. Why is the answer always banning things?

Let them have their gas guzzlers, the gas tax and speeding tickets will enrich the rest if us.

Safety isn't much of an issue given that most production cars can easily go well over 100 mph, they just don't accelerate as fast. Idiots can easily drive like idiots without a fancy new car.

[Oubaas]

29. Hmmm...

...clearly many of you have never seen this cautionary tale:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hot_Rods_to_Hell

And it's not far from there to "The Road Warrior" as someone mentioned above.

Oh well. I guess rational use of limited resources and public safety aren't big issues.

How many of you who vociferously defend the sale of grossly overpowered vehicles would support restrictions on assault rifles in the name of public safety?

[Oubaas]

30. BTW...

...the previous post may have contained humor. Be sure to check the contents before reacting.

[guillaumeb]

32. so all you Freudians out there are saying that

my giant engined car, my raised pick up truck, and my long barreled rifle are just examples of a typical insecure male overcompensating for his tiny little



brain?

Bet you thought I meant another organ.

[Oubaas]

33. Woo hoo!

If you want to find out who's green and means it, just take a dump on fast cars, LOL!

Yeah, the majority wins here. You're right. I'm going out to the garage to start building an Allison V-16 powered Camaro. I've seen the light. What good is life if your car won't top 175 MPH?

The grand-kids will just have to deal with what's left when I'm done.

[upaloopa]

34. My 2013 Mustang has 305 HP from a V6 23.3 MPG

I owned a 1967 Mustang that set the D stock national record of 10.8 seconds for a quarter mile. It had a 390 CID engine with 352 HP.
The need for speed. I like mustangs. My first car was a 64 1/2 Mustang in 1965. 289 CID 275 HP

[Xithras]

36. When was the last time an expensive supercar killed anyone other than its driver?

There are a lot of legitimate gripes about cars, but this isn't one of them. On average, more than 100 Americans die in car wrecks every single day. Virtually none of them die in performance cars. In terms of threat to human life, the Toyota Camry and Ford Focus have killed far more people than Mustangs, Porsche's, or Ferarri's ever will.

[Major Nikon]

37. Here's the problem

When you get going past 55mph on the highway and you pull back on the steering wheel, nothing interesting happens.

[Oubaas]

42. Yup!

That's very true. No matter how hard I pull back on the yoke in my pickup, nothing happens!

[hifiguy]

40. There will always be fast cars. Humans like going fast.

It's a thrill and it's fun. Your average Joe isn't buying Ferraris, Porsches, Lambos, Maseratis or the Japanese supercars. It's a high-end specialty market for people who enjoy driving fast works of rolling art and those who think a rare/fast/expensive car makes them look cool. Two very different markets.

[X_Digger]

41. You know, the default position isn't that something is illegal until someone 'allows' it.

That seems to be the perspective that you're approaching this from.

I know you're not the first, it just jumped out at me, and I had to comment.

[Oubaas]

44. Yes...

That's true and I agree in principle. However, we're headed for eight billion people on this planet, and resources are dwindling.

At what point do we try to address that, and what areas are off the table?

Shall we tear up the roads, lay sod, and buy everyone a bicycle? Or give them all a free Hell Cat?

BTW, did Dodge check with Grumman before they named that thing?

[Warren DeMontague]

60. Yeah, authoritarians always think they have a good excuse to tell other people what to do.

It's never "I want to run everyone else's shit because, hey, I'm honest that I know better and frankly, it gives me a pleasant shudder up the kundalini to micromanage other peoples' lives"

Except you know what? It was stuff like authoritarian religion that brought us big-ass families, "be fruitful and multiply", and natural family planning.

Whereas it was pesky "freedumb"-minded individualists who promoted annoying ideas like letting people make up their choosy-choice minds about stuff, which brought humanity the birth control pill.

[aikoaiko]

45. I am unconcerned.

[lumberjack_jeff]

46. My Chevelle is painted green. Does that help? n/t

[Mopar151]

48. When it comes to safety on the highway, there are better things to vent your spleen about

Like fools who drive at full tilt on black ice, or don't clean a foot of snow/ice off their cars! "Speed too fast for conditions" far outpaces "speed 20+ over limit" as a cause for serious accidents.
I know one of (actually, several of) the top rally drivers - Frank Sprongl. I recently saw a Facebook post from him, after he towed home from a winter rally @ Pierice Neigie (my sp.) " I was driving home ON ICE, at 80 kmh{~45 mph}, and they are flying by me!" - and he shared video taken by his passenger, of a car passing him and crashing... If they make "Flat Out Frank" nervous, they should petrify most sane folk! He also shared, in an earlier post from that weekend, that he had never been faster on snow over ice - nearly 120 mph, between 4' snowbanks - but that was strapped into a good AWD Evolution, caged, on spiked tires, on closed roads.
It's been a tough winter in NH - but we've had over a dozen police cruisers hit in snowstorms, and 4 State snowplows hit during one storm! It wasn't Dodge Hellcats that were causing those crashes....

[B Calm]

49. The 2014 Hennessey Venom GT production automobile will do 280 mph.

[Oubaas]

51. Holy...

Really? 280 MPH? Are there dealers in the USA? How much do they cost?

Doh! Never mind. That does it!

I propose that all public thoroughfares be closed to non-commercial traffic. And for people with appointments off scheduled routes, we'll maintain a fleet of public unicycles and Nash Metropolitans.

[B Calm]

58. The 1,200 HP model starts at one million dollars.

The engine is made in Texas, but the car assembly is in Europe.

[Travis_0004]

57. Reminds me of a top gear episode.

They were trying to hit about 250 in a veyron. The host was told that the tires would not last more than 10 minutes, but dont worry, the fuel will run out in 6 minutes

[REP]

52. 308HP is enough for me

And damn if it isn't more fuel efficient than the Altima I was driving while it was getting its 30K mile servicing.

[vt_native]

53. I had a 2004 Volvo S60 R

340 HP, but it was too hot, and had a poor turning radius.

Got rid of it.

[Taitertots]

54. Rich people like them and big business is making money

Americans have grown up on a steady diet of car commercials and car manufacturer sponsored media.