Want to know why we're screwed regarding healthcare?

[bluesbassman]

Had a sinus infection week before last and had a show to that weekend so I needed an antibiotic fast. Went to the local Urgent Care, was in there for about 20 minutes. Doc saw me for all of 5 minutes. Agreed with my opinion that it was a sinus infection and prescribed the antibiotic (I had had a sore throat, so he did a throat culture to rule out strep).

Got the bill today:

Urgent Care: $316.00
Lab: $63.00
Physician: $285.00
Total $664.00

Six hundred and sixty four dollars for what was an extremely routine office visit. Granted, it was urgent care so I can see a small premium for that service, but that is just outrageous for that kind of health care. Don't even want to think about what the bill would've been had I been seriously ill.

We truly need health care reform from top to bottom.

[pnwmom]

1. Did you have insurance? I just noticed my son's last bill

had almost half the total discounted right off the top, as per the insurance company's agreement with the provider. (We will have to pay the rest as we're still in the deductible.)

And when my son used the nearby urgent care, insurance covered the whole thing. (To encourage people to go there instead of the E.R.)

But if you don't have insurance you are paying premium prices for everything.

[bluesbassman]

4. No insurance.

Self employed and with the amount of times I get sick it's not cost effective to pay $3,000 in premiums and have to cover a $6,000 deductible, so even with insurance I'd still be paying the $664 out of pocket one way or another.

[pnwmom]

18. It's not too late to look at what's offered on the exchanges and change your mind.

They just re-opened the exchanges for a little while.

Unfortunately, your past history of how much you've gotten sick isn't predictive of what could happen in the future. Or you could get hit by a car.

Also, I don't think you've looked at the exchanges, because a $6,000 deductible would be very high. That's usually the maximum out-of-pocket for a whole year, which is a different thing.

And like I said, if you were paying $100 a month or so for a subsidized insurance plan, then you would get that plan's rates, not the higher non-insured rate. So that initial bill wouldn't be over $600, it would likely be much less.

[BrotherIvan]

105. Subsidies don't work for self-employed people

I have a silver plan. My preminum goes up every four months and is currently $379. I have a $6900 deductible. The exchange plans are basically junk insurance.

[pnwmom]

106. They aren't junk insurance, at least in general. My son has a good one.

I'm sorry yours isn't working out for you though. I know it is hard to budget when income doesn't come regularly.

[BrotherIvan]

107. Yes, I hate my insurance and can't find better that's affordable

It goes up every quarter and they are shrinking the network on purpose to squeeze people. It also does not work out of state and for a person who travels all the time, that is just stupid. Glad your son likes his.

[pnwmom]

108. He needed a certain prescription last year that cost more per month

than his monthly premium, and they paid it without giving him any trouble. So we've been impressed so far.

But I'm sorry it's not working out for everyone.

[Revanchist]

37. I hope you have a catastrophic health insurance plan at the very least.

Although I agree with the other posters about looking into a bronze plan. You may be complaining about a $664 bill today but that's nothing compared to what a hospitalization can cost you without any insurance.

[lovemydog]

93. +1

[TheNutcracker]

50. Premiums are not to exceed 9% of your income. You should have gotten a policy.

[Agnosticsherbet]

79. Since you refuse to get insureace, go to CVS pharmacy, if they have one in your area.

You can see a nurse practitioner who would prescribe the same thing for a fraction of the cost.

Otherwise, go to healthcare.gov, or your state exchange. They do have reasonable cost of insurance depending on your income.

[HereSince1628]

5. We wouldn't tolerate buying bread and milk this way

I can't see how laddered pricing in this way reflects anything close to equal treatment in the pricing of 'essential' services.

One price for all by the provider. PERIOD

[justalovebug]

11. But yet we do

I can go to three grocery stores in my city and see the same brand milk and bread priced differently

[HereSince1628]

13. But NOT in the same store.

I accept that overhead costs can cause pricing to vary between providers. But the cost to the provider for services rendered is EXACTLY the same whoever is served in a unit of time.

This is simply immoral, to charge the poor MORE because they aren't in an insurance pool.

WE ARE ALL IN THE SAME FUCKING POOL

[justalovebug]

15. In Big Y if I don't have my big y savings card to scan I pay more

It says it right on the tags under sale items. This price with card this price without.


It's just a small example mind you but it happens in that chain grocery store

[HereSince1628]

16. But you sign up FOR FREE...and CAN DO IT AT THE CHECK OUT

[justalovebug]

22. Just the basic one is free

http://www.bigy.com/OurCards/SilverSavingsClub

The other cost $20

[yeoman6987]

30. The poor have Medicaid. Our system is the best we have had in years

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

42. Depends on where you are.

Remember that states get to screw around with medicaid, and not all states were accepting the expansions last I heard.

[HereSince1628]

56. SOME of the poor have medicaid

I think we have to be careful about over generalizing.

[yeoman6987]

72. True. I should have said some.

[malokvale77]

84. Horseshit

I'm paying so others can get tax subsidized insurance.

I don't make enough to get subsidized insurance, much less full priced insurance.

I am however having money taken from my tax return to help you get insurance. Really?

If I'm going to have to pay in taxes, don't you think I should get some fucking healthcare.

[yeoman6987]

87. No it doesn't work that way

Choice is you pay for healthcare or you pay fine. It sounds like you chose to pay fine. I don't understand you part about not making enough for subsidized insurance but can't afford the full price. You must have a really decent salary then. I personally have insurance through employer so not sure if you were saying you were paying my insurance through your taxes....your not.

[malokvale77]

90. What you don't understand...

I thought I made it clear, I can't afford the crappy insurance that I can not ever afford to use. I chose nothing. The choice was made for me with the stupid passing of ACA.

"You must have a really decent salary then." Are you fucking joking?

I may not be paying for your insurance per say, but I sure the hell am paying for others to have what I can't afford for myself.

It is not "healthcare", it is "health insurance", subsidized by people who don't get healthcare.

Polish that turd (ACA) all you want. It hurts as many as it helps. Unfortunately it hurts those of us who can least afford it.

[elehhhhna]

38. why no suits under the equal protection clause?

Just saying

[pnwmom]

67. Because there is no law that says all people must be charged the same

for services.

[herding cats]

7. Uninsured people usually get a discount

I used to pay cash and always had a large chunk of the bill knocked off for it. My dentist, who I don't have insurance for, still does the same for me.

[pnwmom]

20. Insured people automatically get the standard discount that the insurance

company has already negotiated with the provider.

A non-insured person has to request it, and can be denied.

[herding cats]

89. Huh, I never requested it in all those years.

Guess I was really lucky to always have it applied. Of course I'm sure part of it was the doctors and hospitals wanted to get paid. Since I couldn't afford health insurance their best route to getting my money was to cut my price to what they actually charge for the procedures.

Unless they were going for some sort of percentage of compensation funding thing on unpaid bills, that is. Then the inflated prices would help them to still end up closer to their actual mark.

[lancer78]

109. Actually,

if you have insurance, the cost of service is much higher. A lot of doctors give steep discounts to cash payments. I bet his insurance company, if he had one, would have been billed $2,000.

[justalovebug]

2. Mostly all prescribed drugs should be over the counter

Problem to fix it starts a domino affect which many might not like.

From lower paid doctors , nurses , college professors

[bluesbassman]

8. I didn't even mention that in the OP. $58 for generic amoxicillin.

[YarnAddict]

27. Have to disagree with you about prescription drugs

We are facing an antibiotic crisis in the very near future--antibiotic-resistant bugs, and fewer and fewer effective antibiotics. If antibiotics were available OTC, people would be popping them like candy for things that have nothing to do with bacterial infections. We would very rapidly be up the proverbial creek.

[justalovebug]

31. People don't do that now with overthe counter drugs

If I have a headache I don't look for toenail fungi cream.
I look for headache medication or if I have a cough I get cough syrup
not a laxative .

You know when you have an infection or not.

[uppityperson]

32. "You know when you have an infection or not" but how do you know if it is bacterial or

treatable by which antibiotic?

[justalovebug]

36. you got me on that

but I did say most medications not all

[uppityperson]

43. So is this the kind, gentler side?

[justalovebug]

45. I'm a love bug

[uppityperson]

47. But not a March love bug?

[justalovebug]

51. All year round

[uppityperson]

52. And what about the other one who I have seen so much of recently?

I am curious, you know that. Are they all you?

[YarnAddict]

39. Not always

A sore throat can be caused by a virus or it can be strep, which is bacterial.

People used to routinely die of simple bacterial infections. the discovery of antibiotics have saved literally millions of lives. I really hope we don't have to go back to the bad old days.

This is the big difference between toenail cream, laxatives, and antibiotics.

[WillowTree]

46. "You know when you have an infection or not." Not necessarily.

Just last week my sister had what looked and felt like a little abscess on her ankle. So se went to the Dr to get an antibiotic. Turned out she has a little stress fracture instead. So now, instead of an antibiotic, she has a big ol' ugly boot to walk around in for the next few weeks.

Which uncovers another health problem we have in this Country. Too many people try to act as their own diagnosticians and it's dangerous. They don't make doctors go to school all those years for nothin'.

[ND-Dem]

48. well, since antibiotics have always been prescription-only, i wonder how we got in

our present dire predicament re antibiotic resistance.

prescription/non-prescription -- doesn't seem to have made much difference.

[YarnAddict]

61. My doc once admitted to me

that he will sometimes prescribe them to people because it's easier than explaining to someone determined to get them that they will do no good.

[ND-Dem]

70. i don't have much sympathy.

[JimDandy]

62. It is a doctor-caused problem.

Drs. would get people out of their office by mollifying them, especially pediatricians.

[Hoyt]

73. Actually, patients often raise a stink if they don't get a prescription.

[JimDandy]

74. Any doctor prescribing an antibiotic when not necessary

is the cause of the problem. Since this jeopardizes the entire human population, doctors who do so, should lose their license.

This is, and always has been, a DOCTOR-caused problem.

[Hoyt]

75. Unreasonable patients are also part of the problem. And there are lots of them.

[JimDandy]

85. I don't know why you are pushing the ridiculous 'the patient is part of the problem'...

Trying to pin any part of this problem on anyone other than the medical community deflects from solving the problem. Short of a patient holding a gun to a doctor's head, there is no way they can make the doctor prescribe antibiotics when it's not indicated.

If you know of a doctor that does that, then report that doc. This is too serious of a world-wide, doctor-created problem to not take serious measures to eradicate the root cause. Any doctor unnecessarily prescribing antibiotics is not adhering to the moral, if not actual, "oath" to do no harm.

[elias7]

95. You're right and wrong

As an ED physician, I see 20-30+ patients per shift, essentially hitting the ground running when I walk in the door and am basically nonstop for 12 hours. There are huge expectations from many who come to the ER, and each encounter requires some finesse if the patient is not going to get what they expect...e.g.narcotics, antibiotics, etc. After hour upon hour in a single day just trying to keep afloat and not hurt anybody, only to have patient after patient still walking in the door, I find that a demanding patient towards the end of the day is just one more conflict that I can't handle, and I will at times relent and give that prescription that may not be necessary. It's not always black and white. Infectious processes are not always clearly viral vs bacterial. Many are not patient enough to play out the process, many are.

Everyone is part of the problem. Doctors are part, but the expectations that some patients bring are often unrealistic and misinformed. Trying to talk sense to an anti-vaxxer, for example, is like trying to talk to a republican. It is a losing game. Trying to say no to a drug seeker, when they play their artful game with you takes time, energy, patience, and pain...you see the need from their perspective and you have to say no....it's hard. When you get a few of them in a row, it's quite taxing.

If you'd care to walk a shift with me, I guarantee you'd come to see that it's not so simple as "short of holding a gun to the doctors head, there's no way..." and when you perhaps understand the nuance of infectious processes, and how I am called upon to make judgements patient after patient that are not clearly black and white, perhaps you'll not take such a hard stance and threaten to take my license when I don't fall in line with your uninformed and unrealistic standards.

[malokvale77]

88. By all means.

Doctors should bend to the will of unreasonable patients. How can we possibly expect them to say no to so many.

[bvar22]

110. Anybody can go to the Farmer's Co-Op and buy

POUNDS of generic amoxicillin over the counter.

This is for livestock, but I know people too poor to go to a doctor who use it for infections.

[ND-Dem]

112. where is the farmers co-op? i've never seen one.

[bvar22]

113. Any Feed Store will do.

Every small town in the country has a "feed store".
Just go to your nearest small town and follow the Pick-Ups with 50 lb bags of feed and fertilizer in the back.

If the pick-up is carrying a load of 50 lb sacks of sugar,
best leave them alone.

[panader0]

3. I hope your gig paid enough to cover it....

Kidding--I was lucky to get a hundred a night here.

[bluesbassman]

9. Nah, just a dive bar gig.

Got free beer between sets though!

[notadmblnd]

6. Really? They let you walk out the door without paying and billed you two weeks later?

Most urgent cares around here won't treat you without paying first. Hell, my PCP requires payment before they'll even call you into an exam room.

[bluesbassman]

10. They wouldn't tell me up front what the charges were going to be, or even when I left.

I actually spent more time with the processing clerk than the doc. Was told I'd receive the bill in a week or so, but did have to leave them a $250 deposit.

[justalovebug]

12. When I had throat surgery it was crazy sitting down

and actually reading an itemized list of all charges.

You can request it from the finance office in the hospital but most people don't.

[bluesbassman]

14. I probably should've done that, but at that point I didn't have any viable options.

Would've still had to pay as I had to get better fast.

[pnwmom]

21. Please check out bronze plans from the providers in your state.

See what the actual deductible is, and what the plan covers. My son's plan covers Urgent Care in full, without regard to the deductible, because they want people to use it. The ACA requires that check-ups and vaccines be covered in full.

[justalovebug]

26. It's better that you didn't

1 wooden throat depressor a popsicle stick is all it is.

$8.00

[JEB]

17. I avoid the blood sucking leeches whenever possible.

[Hoyt]

19. If you had insurance, I bet you would be responsible for about $200.

That's about the most an insurance company would allow for an encounter like that assuming you went to a network urgent care provider. I realize you have chosen not to insure, but that is one of the benefits of being insured even if you have a high drductible.

[pnwmom]

23. Right. The ACA has fixed some of the problems the OP is talking about.

Too bad he hasn't looked into it.

[bluesbassman]

60. I have looked into it.

In my situation I can get decent insurance for about $7,000 a year with a $2,000 deductible or crummy insurance for $3,000/yr with a $6,000 deductible. At this point I can't justify either one when I only get sick once or twice a year.

[B Calm]

63. It's your gamble! Good luck with that.

[pnwmom]

65. Are you saying that, even with whatever subsidy you could get,

you'd have to pay $600 a month in insurance premiums?

Then you must be older . . . in which case you especially shouldn't count on only getting sick once or twice a year.

[lovemydog]

94. It's the catastrophic that matters most.

So you don't bankrupt yourself and/or your loved ones.

[ND-Dem]

49. but someone still pays for/gets paid for the rest. that's as big a problem as the

patient having to pay.

it's a scam and a crime.

[Hoyt]

57. No, the provider has to write off the rest of their inflated charge, if one is insured.

[ND-Dem]

69. depends on the charge. but as a rule, they don't.

[Hoyt]

71. You are wrong. The insurer's allowable governs, as long as you use an in network provider.

[pnwmom]

66. Not true. The same thing happens with Medicare.

The providers agree to a set discount ahead of time. The providers can't charge Medicare patients anymore than they agreed to in advance.

[ND-Dem]

68. but someone still gets more, e.g. drug companies. and that's the real problem.

government payments are subsidizing the medical industry.

I don't mind a certain amount of that, but there's a reason medical profit margins are higher than almost any other business. subsidies.

just because consumers don't necessarily see them doesn't mean they don't exist.

it's corruption.

[Doctor_J]

59. snark. generic amoxicillin doesn't cost $58 no matter who's paying for it

That's probably a thousand percent mark up. And perfectly legal. Why rob a bank when you can write a healthcare law?

[sendero]

24. In the US...

.... health care and pharmaceuticals are offered on a "name your price" system. The providers simply name their price and we suckers pay it. There are no "market forces" there is no "competition" and there is no cap on the prices demanded.

People actually think this is a good system.

[COLGATE4]

25. Are you sure you were seen by a physician?

Most "Doc in the Box" places usually have a Physician's Assistant see the patients. But you pay for the M.D. visit, anyway. (True at other medical groups as well).

[yeoman6987]

28. Your insurance will pay most of it

Wait until you get the final bill before saying how bad our healthcare is.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

33. He states in a comment up top that he doesn't have insurance.

So he'll be paying the entire thing out of pocket.

[yeoman6987]

35. Well for goodness sake. No wonder they are paying full price

The purpose of insurance is to pay a modest monthly and the a reduced medical treatment. Obamacare is at least two years old. Everyone should have insurance now.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

40. Well, yes and no.

He stated that in his circumstances, it would still cost too much overall to be cost effective. I know the pricing can get goofy and there are people who fall in bad places based on the cutoffs, so I'm not going to judge him, but he really did get overcharged, unless he's somewhere with an extremely high cost of living. So he was pointing out the high cost of healthcare itself where he is, not the cost of insurance.

[pnwmom]

54. With a lower income he'd probably be eligible for a large subsidy.

And insurance companies have worked out agreements with providers that take a big discount right off the top. My son's last bill had about a 40% discount.

So the OP mostly demonstrates how expensive the health care system is if you won't consider paying for a subsidized insurance policy because of a false belief in invincibility.

[bluesbassman]

82. False sense of invincibility?

I said I get sick once or twice a year, has been that way my entire life. That doesn't mean that I am not aware that I could become seriously ill tomorrow, but it also means that on a tight budget I have to watch where I allocate funds. So if I look at it from an actuarial point of view (just like the insurance companies do) I have to make a decision about whether to guarantee I'm going to pay an insurance company AND medical providers thousands of dollars a year for the one or two times I get sick, or pay as I go for a lot less and be able to meet the rest of my financial obligations.

Funny how a lot of people in this thread key in on the fact that I don't have insurance (for the thousands it would cost me a year which would largely end up in the profit side of an insurance company's balance sheet) and completely ignore the fact that a less than half hour visit to a doctor cost almost $700. Nice.

[pnwmom]

83. It is false to think that your health so far predicts your health in the ensuing decades.

Until someone has a major health crisis, it is easy to think that the world is divided between the sick people, who have always been sick and are used to it; and healthy people who know how to take care of themselves.

But all of that can change in a heartbeat. Literally. And that's why it makes sense for everyone to have health insurance.

[Major Nikon]

29. Some clinics like that one are set up like an emergency room

...or at least they charge emergency room prices.

Recently I was out of town and had the flu. I went to a clinic that was inside CVS. Their prices were commensurate with a regular Drs office visit or perhaps even cheaper. The physician was a nurse practitioner, but was certainly qualified to diagnose and treat what I had.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

34. I think you got seriously screwed over.

I went in to an Urgent Care in SW Ohio when I had my first gout attack. Was in there 30-45 minutes or so, albeit most of it waiting. Nurse saw me for 5 minutes, doc for 10 or so, got diagnosed, got prescribed a med, got the med, all for just around $110.

Your Urgent Care places seems a lot pricier.

[pnwmom]

55. My son's trip to an urgent care resulted in no charge at all.

His insurance company doesn't require co-pays if you choose urgent care instead of E.R.

[B Calm]

64. Same with ours and we're on a cheap silver plan.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

98. I didn't have any 'in-network' places close enough.

I had a choice of 'HMOs' basically, and went for something that would work better for me for actual hospital trips, but had less non-hospital choices locally. Yet another reason why we need single payer, and can simply visit ANY hospital, ANY doctor's office, ANY 'urgent care' type place. Not have to just take whatever specific few places might be 'in-network' for any given HMO group.

[pnwmom]

99. There are two states -- I believe Maryland is one -- that legally require

Last edited Tue Mar 17, 2015, 12:30 PM - Edit history (1)

all hospitals in the state to be in-network. So this can happen within the bounds of the ACA. All the states should enact that law.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

100. I'm in a state with a Republican governor, an overwhelmingly Republican state legislature

pretty much all state offices held by Republicans. I'm not going to hold my breath that anything controlled at a state level is going to be made better for me. Basically, my 'plan' is to hope I live long enough to get past the reasons I'm tied to where I live now, so I can move to a blue state at some point in the future.

[marlakay]

41. sorry you don't have healthcare

I feel very lucky because I am covered by my husbands union even though he is retired. Bart SF.

I had all symptoms and very sick a few weeks ago while on a trip alone. I had to drive sick two days.

I emailed my doctor and told her I knew I had sinus infection and would she fax meds to city I was driving through. she did because I had check up with her already planned in 5 days.

when I got back I told her she saved me!!

the difference between us who both had same thing was I had insurance with good relationship with my doctor. and my antibiotic was $5.

[BlueCaliDem]

44. Wow. That's steep! My daughter's boyfriend had strepthroat and we went to Urgent Care

here in SoCal. They didn't accept Medi-Cal (he has Medi-Cal) so he had to pay up front - $95 dollars. That's it. His amoxicillin was covered under his Medi-Cal, but it didn't do much for him.

I put him on a regimen of Carnivora Venus Flytrap extract and had him gargle with lukewarm salt water three times a day. His strep throat was very bad to the point that he couldn't swallow or even speak much. Using lukewarm salt water at the first try already relieved some of the pain and by day 3, he was able to swallow with very little trouble.

My daughter and I are allergic to any type of penicillin so we have to go the alternative route which means keeping our immune system up at all times. When we feel strep throat coming, we gargle with lukewarm salt water (3x a day) while taking Carnivora Venus Flytrap extract (30 drops in a bottle of water to be spread out over the entire day), and it helps us.

Also, because we regularly take Marine Coral Calcium with a multivitamin every day, it helps boost and keep our immune system up, and no one in our family caught his highly contagious strep throat - and he was in our home for five days and nights!

[font color="red" size="4" face="face"]DISCLAIMER:[/font] So as not to be alerted as a spammer, I am not a spokesperson, salesperson, or associate for Carnivora Venus Flytrap extract or a doctor or any other type of health professional. I am not compensated in any way. The advice I offer is simply from personal experience that has kept our family healthy and happy for decades and might not work for you.

[KamaAina]

53. Aren't you out here in the Bay Area?

Can't you get Covered California? shrug:

[Doctor_J]

58. healthcare stocks are through the roof

Thanks for doing your part. Notice how the profit based, competition based, uniquely American model works. That's why we're number one.

[midnight]

76. This is an excellent example of how and why this is over priced….

[on point]

77. Probably something like $10 in Europe, just so there is a co-pay to eliminate 'free goods' problem

[dflprincess]

78. If there is a next time and if there's a Minute Clinic (or equivalent) in your area, go there

It would probably cost under $100, plus the prescription.

[Agnosticsherbet]

80. CVS Pharmacy has a similar program.

You should never go to the emergency room unless your are bleeding profusely or dying and can not say no.

[OBblueMeanie]

81. Sickening

I am a woman 53 years old, and in all of my life have made only 2 major claims on my health insurance. Once, when I had a big uterine fibroid that blocked my kidneys and required surgery, and another last year when I had an accidental fall and broke my wrist and elbow. I ended up having to shell out $6350 in deductibles and "co-insurance". Seems unfair for any human, let alone someone who has worked since age 16 and not availed myself of health insurance at all.

[B Calm]

92. How much did the insurance pay (years ago-before ACA) on your first surgery?

[abelenkpe]

86. It's just great

How our system charges those in need and who can least afford care the most. See, if you were wealthier or fortunate enough to have insurance through work you'd pay less. Kick em when they're down...it's the American way.

[daredtowork]

91. My local clinic has been crappy for a long time

You can never get an appointment. You don't even know when the doctor opens her calendar. She triple books. The appointments are 2 hours late and last 15 minutes. You can give one symptom. If you have a complex condition, you're screwed. If you need solid diagnoses or a doctor's support to work with some State systems like Social Services or SSI, you are also pretty much screwed, because the doctor doesn't remember you or ever have time to ever think about your case: she just keeps trying to refer you out to a specialist. I now tend to over-utilize the ER when I have problems, and they give me the stink eye when I ask them if they can provide a diagnosis: they say their job is to stabilize me and that I need to go back to my medical clinic (where I will have to wait months for an appointment...).

Today I found out the reason for all the chaos. Apparently all the Primary Care doctors except mine and one other (who has handed in his resignation, and is thus not taking on any of the other patients who were set adrift) quit last year. And the clinic hasn't been able to replace them. So my doctor has been trying to hold down the fort, doing the work that is normally done by 4 doctors (actually should be more since they took on all the new Medi-Cal enrollees...). Ay caramba.

I don't even know what to say to this. I feel sorry for the situation. I want the clinic to survive. It's near my house. I think under better conditions, my doctor is a good one. But patients don't get proper care like this. And the patients who are dealing with State bureaucracies at the same time can really be shafted if they can't get fine-tuned coordination of medical care and paperwork. And by shafted I mean homelessness, starvation, crushed into literal roadkill.

[alarimer]

96. I agree; the ACA is NOT health care.

It was a sop to insurance companies. And it does nothing for folks who can't find a plan that they can actually afford to use.

We need single payer. Nothing else will solve these problems. Every other civilized country in the world has some kind of socialized medicine. It isn't fair and it isn't right that we do not. "Oh, but it's not politically possible." Whine, whine, whine.

No, it's not possible because Democrats are a worthless bunch of cowardly assholes who will NOT stand up for what is right and are bought and paid for by corporations.

[Lars39]

97. Negotiate for a lower bill, bluesbassman!!!

You should immediately get on the phone to negotiate a lower bill and payment plan. A lot of people don't realize this can be done.

[MrMickeysMom]

101. Single Payor

Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor

Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor

Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor

Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor

Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor

Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor

Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor

Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor
Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor...Single Payor

[NCTraveler]

102. We have entrenched the concept of for profit healthcare even further.

Wish it wasn't so. We will spend the next decade telling everyone how great the ACA is because we have to. Then in a decade or so we will put our big accomplishment behind us and claim the system is completely broken again. As for now, it is signature legislation that was not an overhaul and furthered a broken system. We have to back it up as if it were signature legislation for a while.

[BrotherIvan]

111. Ayup!

[upaloopa]

103. What do you think people who spend years

school and training so they would be there when you need them should be compensated?