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Fumesucker

(45,851 posts)
Fri May 4, 2012, 10:09 PM May 2012

How would the world be a different place today if Barack Obama had gotten busted for drugs?

That's my Point Of Divergence as they say in alternate history, Barack Obama gets busted for drugs back in the day when he was young and dumb..

But wait, we've read his letter to his girlfriend that was recently posted, he sure wasn't dumb, brilliant in fact.

One of the tenets of alternate history is you cannot do just one thing, change one thing and everything after it is different, go back and bribe or convince the art school to take Hitler and history is vastly different. Barack Obama getting a record for drugs would echo through history, by now I suspect the echo would be near volcanic in our political world.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/For_Want_of_a_Nail_(proverb)




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How would the world be a different place today if Barack Obama had gotten busted for drugs? (Original Post) Fumesucker May 2012 OP
President McCain would be basking in the media limelight as the occupation of Iran went well zbdent May 2012 #1
That seems like a reasonable scenario.. Fumesucker May 2012 #2
Hillary Clinton cruises to the nomination and wins the race. pa28 May 2012 #3
So you're of the opinion that history is more or less inevitable and individuals don't count much? Fumesucker May 2012 #4
I don't think Obama did so much prior to becoming President that dkf May 2012 #14
agreed JVS May 2012 #15
How about GWB gets busted for drugs too? Lasher May 2012 #5
How do you know Dubya didn't get busted? Fumesucker May 2012 #6
He would have to run as a Republican. krispos42 May 2012 #7
Excellent reply.. Fumesucker May 2012 #8
He's have to have dodged military service and be married 2+ times, too. krispos42 May 2012 #9
We'd have a public option. joshcryer May 2012 #10
You mean Obama would still be president anyway despite a drug conviction? Fumesucker May 2012 #16
Yes, but Hillary was a partisan and Obama was not. joshcryer May 2012 #18
I don't think Hillary would have been near the shoe-in that you evidently do.. Fumesucker May 2012 #20
Her faux pas would've been less noticed without Obama, imo. joshcryer May 2012 #21
Hillary wasn't targeted by the right in the general, Obama was.. Fumesucker May 2012 #22
The public option was purely predicated on partisanship. joshcryer May 2012 #25
The United States of Gilead. Zalatix May 2012 #11
Perhaps I am reading too much into your OP, but... Bonobo May 2012 #12
That was more or less my point, you sussed it out well.. Fumesucker May 2012 #17
Then we probably would not have elected our first black President yet. Zorra May 2012 #13
I'm not so sure about Hillary.. Fumesucker May 2012 #19
How different things would've been if George W. Bush had been busted for coke use. Honeycombe8 May 2012 #23
If Dubya had been busted for coke how would we know it even now? Fumesucker May 2012 #24

zbdent

(35,392 posts)
1. President McCain would be basking in the media limelight as the occupation of Iran went well
Fri May 4, 2012, 10:33 PM
May 2012

(at least, according to the "liberally-biased media", which helped him get into office with the constant reminders of Hillary Clinton's "feminine cowardice" in not lopping off the genitals of Bill, and the constant rehashing of the idea that she killed Vince Foster)

Fumesucker

(45,851 posts)
2. That seems like a reasonable scenario..
Fri May 4, 2012, 10:47 PM
May 2012

All from one anonymous young man getting busted with drugs, something that happens day in and day out and has for decades.

How many other Barack Obamas have been kept from doing great things for the world thanks to just a random twist of fate, they got busted where Obama didn't?

pa28

(6,145 posts)
3. Hillary Clinton cruises to the nomination and wins the race.
Fri May 4, 2012, 10:47 PM
May 2012

The state of our economy as well as our tax and trade laws are roughly the same. We're still offshoring good jobs, wealth is still being accumulated at the top while the middle class is strangled to death. Life in America looks pretty much as it does in our "real" reality.

The most interesting part is the big dog having a great time living in the White House as the first "first husband".

Fumesucker

(45,851 posts)
4. So you're of the opinion that history is more or less inevitable and individuals don't count much?
Fri May 4, 2012, 10:54 PM
May 2012

Or just in this particular case?

 

dkf

(37,305 posts)
14. I don't think Obama did so much prior to becoming President that
Sat May 5, 2012, 03:42 AM
May 2012

Things would be much different.

In terms of the Presidency, Yes it would have been Hillary. And she may have decided to put health care reform first which would put us in the same situation. But I do think Bill Clinton would have strategized Hillary into a better position politically. Sometimes I wonder about the Obama people.

Lasher

(27,502 posts)
5. How about GWB gets busted for drugs too?
Fri May 4, 2012, 11:02 PM
May 2012

He got busted for DUI and lied about it. It was too late to matter by the time the liberal media got around to sort of mentioning it. Didn't matter that Lord Vader got busted twice for DUI. It probably wouldn't have mattered if either or both of them had been busted for drugs. It would matter a great deal, however, if Obama had a criminal record like both of these assholes do.

Other things matter. John Kerry was a villain because he was wounded 3 times in Vietnam while serving his country honorably. Junior used money and connections back then to get into the TANG to avoid being drafted. That didn't matter. It did matter when Dan Rather dared to mention that the 'War President' went AWOL.

Sometimes when you're looking at things that seem to matter, you're really just seeing attempts to justify hidden agendas that really do matter to people behind the curtain.

Fumesucker

(45,851 posts)
6. How do you know Dubya didn't get busted?
Fri May 4, 2012, 11:08 PM
May 2012

How would we know for sure?

Yeah, I remember the ...




But you know Obama is POTUS now and I think it's fairly sure that he wouldn't be if the war on drugs had worked the way it's supposed to..

Fumesucker

(45,851 posts)
8. Excellent reply..
Sat May 5, 2012, 12:30 AM
May 2012

I think that would set craniums a poppin' on both sides of the political fence..

Obama as a Republican POTUS, what a sick idea.. and I mean that in a good way.

krispos42

(49,445 posts)
9. He's have to have dodged military service and be married 2+ times, too.
Sat May 5, 2012, 12:36 AM
May 2012

And get a huge fuckin' American Flag pin.

Fumesucker

(45,851 posts)
16. You mean Obama would still be president anyway despite a drug conviction?
Sat May 5, 2012, 06:07 AM
May 2012

I find that not particularly likely.

Bear in mind that Hillary was pro-private mandate during the campaign while Obama was not..

joshcryer

(62,265 posts)
18. Yes, but Hillary was a partisan and Obama was not.
Sat May 5, 2012, 06:12 AM
May 2012

She would not have conceded the public option as easily as post-partisan Obama. She would've probably even pushed the Senate to end the filibuster rules, etc, etc.

And you know what I meant, no need to be pedantic. If Obama was incarcerated, nothing else would've changed for America policy wise. Clinton is the SoS, his foreign policy decisions are influenced by her positions (see: Libya, which he probably would not have done were it not for Clinton). The drone war is probably Clinton inspired, though Obama did promise to escalate against "terrorists" I don't know if he knew at the time that he'd be escalating the drone wars.

We got the mandates with Obama.

We just didn't get the public option because he found that mandates were necessary to keep costs down and the Republicans made him sacrifice it.

Fumesucker

(45,851 posts)
20. I don't think Hillary would have been near the shoe-in that you evidently do..
Sat May 5, 2012, 06:55 AM
May 2012

Deservedly or not Hillary had a veritable freight train of baggage that would have been thrown in our faces 24/7, everything from Whitewater to the Travel Office to Vince Foster to the Mena airport nutjobbery, the M$M had a preexisting supply of damaging memes on Hillary.

Obama had nothing like baggage on that scale, the VRWC was forced to fling some distinctly second string poop on Obama, they would have had a mountain of carefully nurtured toxic poop for Hillary.

Hillary also had her pro Iraq war record to contend with, in 2008 that was a distinct disadvantage in attracting liberal voters even if not very many give a damn now.

joshcryer

(62,265 posts)
21. Her faux pas would've been less noticed without Obama, imo.
Sat May 5, 2012, 07:07 AM
May 2012

2008 was a Democratic shoe-in. I don't think any of the other candidates could've won (people wanted "revolution" and at the time either a colored person or a woman was the "revolution" they saw, without Obama it would've been between a "woman" and a "man" thus securing her the nomination; remember, Hillary got more votes than Obama in 2008, if he was not a candidate I can't see how she wouldn't have won). Obama said he would've voted for the Iraq war, a point played out so much during the primaries that it's a joke.

I do think, actually, now that I think about it, Hillary would still be in Iraq. She would've forced renegotiation, ala McCain, to keep troops there, particularly during the 2009 Iraq bombings. Obama should get credit for still leaving and not forcing a renegotiation in that time frame.

So we'd have a public option and still be in Iraq, imo.

Fumesucker

(45,851 posts)
22. Hillary wasn't targeted by the right in the general, Obama was..
Sat May 5, 2012, 07:59 AM
May 2012

The VRWC had been honing it's attacks on the Clintons for eight years and I really don't think Low Friction William in the White House as first lecher would have gone over in an overall positive manner.

Every syllable Hillary ever uttered would have been endlessly parsed and reparsed all meaning was lost and nothing left but spin.

In short, we shall have to agree to disagree on the likelihood of a second Clinton presidency although I do agree Hillary would still be in Iraq should she have become POTUS.

The public option? I doubt it, it was never meant to be in the first place.

joshcryer

(62,265 posts)
25. The public option was purely predicated on partisanship.
Sat May 5, 2012, 08:23 AM
May 2012

We will have to agree to disagree, but a Hillary Presidency would not have been "post-partisan." She would've been the most Partisan democrat we've seen in a really longtime.

Just my humble opinion.

There was no way America would've elected a Republican for the third time in a row.

Bonobo

(29,257 posts)
12. Perhaps I am reading too much into your OP, but...
Sat May 5, 2012, 02:58 AM
May 2012

the point this seems to underscore is the tragedy that lies behind the War on Drugs.

When a person in imprisoned for a petty drug offense, just how much damage do we do to that person's life, to their future and even to the life and future of their spouse, children and grandchildren?

How many lives do we ruin for it? And isn't THAT the saddest and most bitter of betrayals of trust by Obama --having been forgiven and having survived his own past indiscretions, he is willing to condemn people who do the same thing to a ruined life.

Fumesucker

(45,851 posts)
17. That was more or less my point, you sussed it out well..
Sat May 5, 2012, 06:12 AM
May 2012

Interesting how few "pro Obama" posters managed to give us their thoughts on this subject..

We ruin millions of lives, I know several personally and my own child came horrifyingly close to having it happen to them when they hadn't even been involved with any drugs at all.

Given the state of our justice system, with convicted murderers being released thanks to DNA evidence, do you ever wonder how many people have their lives ruined by the drug war who never even were involved with drugs in the first place?

Zorra

(27,670 posts)
13. Then we probably would not have elected our first black President yet.
Sat May 5, 2012, 03:12 AM
May 2012

The 1% would still be calling all the shots in much the same way as they are now under President Hillary Clinton.

It is a certainty that no republican candidate could have won a presidential election immediately after 8 years of G. W. Bush.

A republican being elected POTUS immediately after 8 years of Bush would be a 100% non-possibility.

Fumesucker

(45,851 posts)
19. I'm not so sure about Hillary..
Sat May 5, 2012, 06:25 AM
May 2012

She could have mobilized women I think but she had a ton of baggage, deserved or not, and I don't think she would have galvanized young people the way Obama did, Hillary is an older boomer.

I don't think a second president Clinton is as sure a thing as you evidently do.

Honeycombe8

(37,648 posts)
23. How different things would've been if George W. Bush had been busted for coke use.
Sat May 5, 2012, 08:02 AM
May 2012

No recession. No tax cuts for millionaires. No Iraq War.

Fumesucker

(45,851 posts)
24. If Dubya had been busted for coke how would we know it even now?
Sat May 5, 2012, 08:06 AM
May 2012

The Dubya operatives took out Dan Rather when he got inconveniently close to a damaging truth..

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