Almost 100 hate-crime murders linked to single website, report finds

It now allows members from all over the world.

What a nightmare.

and this is where a lot of folks get their feet wet when looking for this ideology on the web. Not the Conservative Cave, not free republic, but stormfront.

There's a thin little space between free speech rights and incitement and action. These snivelling cowards know just how far they can go without running afoul of the law. They revel in their infamy (think of Aesop's fable about the dog with a millstone tied around its neck), cheer the losers who act out their fantasies (because they won't do it themselves), and laugh at the disgust they inspire in decent people.

I am reluctant to use some kind of "Minority Report" scenario that would bust these pinheads absent an overt act, but there are times when that seems like an attractive option. One of the surviving family members at Dylann Roof's preliminary hearing said it best, and right to his vacant face: Hate never wins.

I tried to get DU to be aware of them as a real problem more than a decade ago when Freepers were supposedly the big enemy.

really...

You and I. and a few others who are aware of these guys. (And yes, it is mostly guys)

websites. I tried to explain that these were subversives and we should put them under the microscope. They were beyond just RW politics. But no one really listens to me.

the owners are advocates of THAT policy. Perhaps now that it has blown in their faces at discussionist. Oh never mind...

....that is way off base. This has nothing to do with the great big boogyman of triangulation.

Back in the day at DU there was some really good sourcing to be had at DU. Right Wing Watch was and is a good source, as is Southern Poverty Law Center. People for the American Way. Another site dedicated to critical information just about the religious right, people like Rushdoony, etc. All of them created by people on our side.

All of these groups and their websites are good for info, analysis, and reference to primary sources, with plenty of links to whatever hate group you want to research personally. The thing is, you know this already. There's no need to link DU directly to Stormfront when you can refer to SPLC or the like and benefit from their research, and, as I said, follow it from there if you want to.

Linking directly to certain things is a hazard to the site and to the home researcher -- I will never forget the time some impetuous (or malicious) person on this site started an OP about the horrors of child pornography, complete with link to a child porn site just to make sure we got the point. Without warning the reader that's what it was. You think I really want the cookies from either that or hate sites on my computer?

"Triangulation" for pete's sake.

Have an excellent day

however obliquely, now didn't you.

Too bad it's not working.

Have a really fine day

I am saddened that this is your interpretation. DU and it's founders are tied to the DLC at the hip.

It has none to do with Stormfront. Sorry that hyper partisans read what is not there in a post. The history of Mr Allen and his partner is out there in the WWW. He has been a party operative for a few decades now.

Suffice it to say your interpretation says far more about you than anything else.

But nope, the DLC has not one bit to do with Stormfront. But, early in the history talk of groups such as this one that are extremely dangerous were verboten on this site.

It had a lot to do with efforts at levels much higher than a mere political operative to reach to all corners of the body politic. It was, and still is, a wrong headed approach. Not one that political partisans want to discuss in an intelligent manner.

It's a dog-whistle.

Try-angulate again.

here is the dictionary definition from political science

triangulation
The act of a political candidate presenting his or her views as being above and between the left and right sides of the political spectrum. It’s sometimes called the “third way.”
The term was first used by political consultant Dick Morris while working on the re-election campaign of President Clinton in 1996. Morris urged Clinton to adopt a set of policies that were different from the traditional policies of the Democratic Party in order to co-opt the opposition.
Morris described triangulation in an interview on Frontline in 2000: “Take the best from each party’s agenda, and come to a solution somewhere above the positions of each party. So from the left, take the idea that we need day care and food supplements for people on welfare. From the right, take the idea that they have to work for a living, and that there are time limits. But discard the nonsense of the left, which is that there shouldn’t be work requirements; and the nonsense of the right, which is you should punish single mothers. Get rid of the garbage of each position, that the people didn’t believe in; take the best from each position; and move up to a third way. And that became a triangle, which was triangulation.”
Morris also offered a definition in his book Power Plays: “The idea behind triangulation is to work hard to solve the problems that motivate the other party’s voters, so as to defang them politically… The essence of triangulation is to use your party’s solutions to solve the other side’s problems. Use your tools to fix their car.”

http://politicaldictionary.com/words/triangulation/

And here you go, some academic dog whistles, err articles

http://eric.ed.gov/?id=EJ968447

http://jtr.sagepub.com/content/44/4/431.short

http://soc.sagepub.com/content/40/1/125.short

I could give you more.

There is plenty of RESEARCH into this, and it is not just an American phenomena.

As I said, you cannot discuss this intelligently with partisans.

Nice try at the smear though. Good day. I got an article to write. Air shows are fun.

Well, guys,...and guys pretending to be women.

who are proud... and all that.

They were actually scarier... and I will leave it at that.

we are talking of different subcultures though.

Southern Poverty Law Center. They are a wonderful source of information. Because we are members, we get the Intelligence Report. It is a great source on all sorts of hate groups.

The media needs to pay more attention to their warnings as well. So does our government, at all levels. SPLC has the information on the real terrorists in this country.

I first became aware of the SPLC. However, it seems, it's taking a lot longer for the nation to take notice. I wonder why though. Racism has really been a bad and festering sore across this country.

You have to log into smile.amazon.com instead of amazon.com for the donation to kick in.

https://smile.amazon.com/


Of course, you can select from other charities, too. They provide a list but you can type in your charity (IIRC, I had to type in SPLC).

being part of the problem.

I don't know if it's just me or what, but they (the MSM) seem worse than ever in regard to how they foment this hatred- in subtle and not so subtle ways. Idk, but maybe I'm just noticing it more since the Trayvon Martin case and all of the despicable things that have happened since?

In any event, they definitely seem more than a little culpable with things like calling peaceful protests 'riots', and black people 'thugs' (ect.).

Also, doesn't it seem as if this country's collective mood has become more hateful and hostile lately? It's downright scary imo, since this is how fascist countries behave. They start by picking on vulnerable groups in society such as minorities, immigrants, ect and expand their hate from there once they've achieved 'socially acceptable' forms of bullying, or worse... We are seeing it all the time now, it appears. Stormfront, the KKK, and other white supremacist-type groups are nothing new, but they seem to be attracting an alarmingly high number of people to them in recent years.

I don't know what, if anything, can be done about all of this crap going on, but I sincerely hope things turn around soon. This sick BS has got to end!

Sorry about the rambling rant, but I just feel so useless and helpless when it comes to what has been happening to the targets of this hatred. I don't see how things can continue to go on this way...

It's good that you are trying to make more people aware of the SPLC, tho.

more hateful and hostile lately. It started when Obama began campaigning for the White House. The number of hate crimes has gone up dramatically.

This is just one example:

http://www.splcenter.org/get-informed/news/hate-group-numbers-up

crimes increased during the Clinton white house years as well. just more so with Obama. It's always "quieter" when R's are President.

And there is plenty of academic writing on this by the way.

We are extremely aware of this and are more than just careful in what we select to run photo wise and the rest of it.

Here is an easy thing where you will notice.

Next time there is a murder in your local area, it will be easy to know if the person is white or minority. The photos will be all you need. The white person gets graduation photos, in a suit, you know the drill. The black person, or other minority, gets the in cuffs treatment, behind bars, in a police car.

Watch that pattern.

Intelligence Report from SPLC yesterday. It was excellent investigative reporting.

around the same ime he was born if his parents are in this group

as in very, if you knew a thing about the site.

Who would name their child after a hate group?

And from remarks by his relatives, it sounds like they thought Roof was getting into weird stuff, not that it was a family tradition.

But it is an interesting coincidence.

Whasisname.... David Duke. Yep. 1990.
I remember it being all over the news.
So yeah- Storm is possibly for storm front.

I love people who cannot make up their minds. And I thought you said he could not be on the web anyway. It is not part of his environment or something like that.

Stormfront was a hate group from way back before public internet.

I seem to remember something about that, but not the specifics.

Their mission is no different than the slow rise of the cultish & dangerous movement of Adolph Hitler.
It took a damned World War to finally reign in the Hate Crimes of that terrorist organization too.
One that targeted a specific part of society, by one insane person or small group, and resulted in the most massive slaughter of humanity.

Terrorist groups like ISIS & Stormfront are mirrors to Adolph Hitler.
Now imagine if Adolph Hitler would have had the Internet available as these groups do today.

I immediately thought of storm front.

Most people don't use a middle name there and I thought it might be a way for them to identify themselves.

and Dylann Storm Roof has some?

I can't think that's a coincidence.

is being managed by somebody...

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Dylann-Storm-Roof/833320566744304

things that make you go hmmmm.

especially with high profile crimes

I did spent more time than anybody should at well... Stormfront, and they were doing a wonderful game of distancing. You should know that this kid loves and is friends with some well. will save the N word. I wonder if the page you were looking at is... http://national.suntimes.com/national-world-news/7/72/1318856/dylan-roof-is-not-the-charleston-shooter-according-to-facebook

I also wonder if... let me check

https://www.facebook.com/dylan.roof.3

Yup, no wonder. This other young man is indeed a different person.



Whenever we have a local crime we have to be careful what FB profile you look at.

****SPECULATION****

There is a page managed by somebody, who is doing the just the facts ma'am, but there is more than one page, So indeed there is the clear possibility that somebody is exploiting this. It would not be the first time. But I have no definite evidence of this.

Will save the N word".

Maybe you want to edit that into something more coherent?

Have a good day

Hope it's not a rainy day?

You want me to use a word. Here is a huge clue. Ain't gonna happen.

quotes or something. Not sure what you were trying to say there. Wouldn't hazard a guess either.

Said this guy could not be one of them. Since he had man of them as friends. You understood. And racists are creepy.

Lots of new pages since then, but at that time other people with a middle name of "storm" popped up in my search box.

and I do not mean this in a good way.

I think the FBI puts you in a special file just for typing Stormfront into Google.

As soon as I read the headline on the main page, I thought "I bet it's stormfront."

Yes indeed

A very sick site indeed.

Nothing like that bunch of hatemongers.

Tweeted this plus K&R

But not on the net.

Oh wait. You said we were like 200 years ago before magazines and books.

Make up your mind aleeady

Candidacy for senator. 1995 was when it went from a shitty built in board to a full fledged web site.
But the group was know well before that.

They had a magazine too? Are you sure about that?

Made Stormfront a big name back then. It's online presence started - like most groups at that time- as a bulletin board. Then it got its own website.
Just saying it was a known thing in the news in 1990. Those were heavy recruiting years for Stormfront.

Since the terrorist didn't finish the 9th grade and was born after the fall of apartheid.and wouldn't or couldn't put this connection by himself. The black jacket is special too to be displayed on the net. This hate crime is not without deeper supporters and promoters.

There is also the dark web or deep web sites
But I really don't think he was smart enough to use them



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Web

Which brings us back to his computer which will be a key piece in the investigation of his development.

After a simple search on google I found only one site on e bay that sold the Rhodesian patch and it was located in New Mexico. However I know that some racist store in South Carolina might have sold them. The killer btw didn't have a credit card as far as I have read, so that leaves a couple of avenues for explanations for his purchase of them. He bought them locally or someone let him use their credit card.

This still doesn't explain where he got his racist development from regarding the two patches. I doubt it was locally in his home town.


Yeah, stormfront is a nasty group of a holes and that site is my first suspect for his indoctrination.

Now the question is will homeland security, the fbi and the justice department really do their job on this or will it be just another 'crazy lone gunman bullshit story? Yes he did it alone but he got his twisted thoughts from somewhere.


I don't think local cops or investigators will want to go too deep into this because of what it might really expose.

It's been going for decades; before it was a website it was a zine.

Rec
Would be nice to know how many ReTHUG politicians visit the site.

K&R

Some of the most violent hate crimes come from people involved in these hate groups. They use their sites to recruit people and organize meetups. At the meetups, they organize their gun running, drug running, and plans for more hate crimes. I've been reading about this stuff for years.

The Intelligence Report, on the SPLC site, is a treasure trove if you want to know more about the history of these hate groups and the kinds of things they do and the kinds of crimes they commit routinely. Some of the worst ATF related violations are heads of these hate groups on down to their newest members.

They keep it just loosely knit enough that they get away with it, but mainly they use their web sites to recruit and get together to plan their crimes. They are highly dangerous and work in cells just like any other terrorist organizations. The FBI and ATF have been sitting on the information about these groups for ages now and not doing very much about them. That so many in our government refuse to say domestic terrorism speaks volumes about that "invisible empire" concept. Every once in a while, they will arrest one if they threaten a judge or something, but otherwise, they just let them keep committing their crimes.

Our military is chock full of these hate groups too. Some of them even recruit at Fort Bragg. Fayetteville, NC is a hot spot for those hate groups as are the five states the join at the western tip of NC. Indiana is another area that is a hotbed of hate groups. They are all over, but they get away with it more in those areas, from what I have read through the years. Those are the places to go if the feds ever want to get off their asses and really have a war on domestic terror, or even acknowledge that it exists. But, for some fucked up reason, "cough* invisible empire *cough*, they never do.

I had already started wondering about the motorcycle gangs that ride together in huge packs all over the South West USA, you know, whether it was more than just a bunch of old men trying to regain their youth while riding Harleys. Something about them seemed "off", because my instincts were screaming at me to avoid these assholes. They surround your car while you're on the highway, better not react.

Your post made me remember this.

And yes, some of them are racist gangs. You never know. It really is scary.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexian_Lien_beating

a racist and homophobic group, similar to the KKK.

He apparently said that he learned a lot reading the CCC's information.

CAUTION/WARNING GRAPHIC PICTURE and GRAPHIC RACIST LANGUAGE:

https://web.archive.org/web/20150620161351/http://lastrhodesian.com/

In the text, he mentioned the CCC.

Fox News is probably responsible for a lot too!

Happily taking money raised by Stormfront fundraisers for their candidacies.

a series of news letters he wrote during the 1980s that were quite racist

Here:

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2011/12/the-story-behind-ron-pauls-racist-newsletters/250338/

Thank you.

Thank you for the post and information

I had to go out and get a whole case of bleach.

-- Mal

I monitor it. In fact, given the latest revelations I need to go dive back in.

Yes, yes, I will need a shower.

Well, these sites in general and the link between them and Roof. I actually found the horrific sites looking up Charlie Manson. There's absolutely no doubt that there's a tie between Roof and the Manson followers. Whether it's direct or not, I don't know. But it's there

ideologically

I really think there's more of a link. I wonder if we'll ever know for sure though.

Just so you can see the pictures together. Kinda freaky. Not that I am saying that is why I think there's a link. Not at all. Just a freaky thing.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026865799

A tie between Manson and Roof? That's astounding and horrendous.

I used to be a member of WSHF which stands for 'when the shit hits the fan'. I was having some fun, kept it clean, thought maybe I could entertain myself and whatever. I was called 'Traveler' Because I figured I was just passing through. Every one on that site was dedicated to fighting against the Obama agenda.
i suppose that story is not actually funny. Never mind..

Updated to forget to remember

Now I remember. They kicked me out and told me to keep on traveling. I mean I would say that I was not out of line, but they thought I should not be on their message board.

Now thats funny.

This sounds like a job for Anonymous!