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Mon Aug 10, 2015, 05:42 PM

#BlackLivesMatter activists want the women who interrupted Bernie Sanders to publicly apologize

Perhaps the start of the healing process?
This petition, created by #BlackLivesMatter activists, demands that Marissa Johnson and Mara Willaford publicly apologize to Bernie Sanders.

Johnson and Willaford are the women who interrupted Bernie Sanders' speech during a social security rally in Seattle and accused the audience of "white supremacist liberalism."

#BlackLivesMatter activists believe that this type of behavior is inappropriate and counterproductive, and we will not support it.


https://www.change.org/p/blm-activists-want-the-women-who-interrupted-bernie-sanders-to-apologize-to-him?recruiter=358375400

*on edit*
Related: The Real Black Lives Matter Wants Activists To Publicly Apologize to Bernie Sanders

Black Lives Matter wants the two women who shut down a Bernie Sanders event in Seattle on Saturday to publicly apologize to the Senator and Presidential Candidate.

Jason Easley wrote about Marissa Johnson and Mara Willaford shutting down Bernie Sanders’ rally in Seattle.

They led organizers and the media to believe they are part of Black Lives Matter. It’s not hard to understand why. BLM is succeeding in its efforts to raise awareness and get action on the multitude of issues that are a direct consequence of structural racism. The Black Lives Matter movement is very loosely structured without a central organization. That provides freedom to activists and supporters, but it means that BLM is also vulnerable to groups who may wish to co-opt their national reputation, as occurred on Saturday. Adding to the confusion is the fact that there are many groups who use black lives matter as a rallying call.


More at the link:

http://www.politicususa.com/2015/08/10/real-black-lives-matter-wsnts-activists-publicly-apologize-bernie-sanders.html

142 replies, 11801 views

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Arrow 142 replies Author Time Post
Reply #BlackLivesMatter activists want the women who interrupted Bernie Sanders to publicly apologize (Original post)
Bubzer Aug 2015 OP
daredtowork Aug 2015 #1
blackspade Aug 2015 #75
Bubzer Aug 2015 #99
daredtowork Aug 2015 #102
Bubzer Aug 2015 #103
daredtowork Aug 2015 #105
Bubzer Aug 2015 #109
daredtowork Aug 2015 #120
Bubzer Aug 2015 #121
daredtowork Aug 2015 #130
Bubzer Aug 2015 #131
daredtowork Aug 2015 #133
Bubzer Aug 2015 #134
daredtowork Aug 2015 #136
Bubzer Aug 2015 #138
daredtowork Aug 2015 #141
Bubzer Aug 2015 #142
leveymg Aug 2015 #127
Eleanors38 Aug 2015 #112
notadmblnd Aug 2015 #2
snagglepuss Aug 2015 #7
Bubzer Aug 2015 #9
George II Aug 2015 #83
Bubzer Aug 2015 #110
Supersedeas Aug 2015 #132
notadmblnd Aug 2015 #10
haikugal Aug 2015 #11
notadmblnd Aug 2015 #12
haikugal Aug 2015 #13
notadmblnd Aug 2015 #25
haikugal Aug 2015 #46
notadmblnd Aug 2015 #50
snagglepuss Aug 2015 #14
winter is coming Aug 2015 #64
snagglepuss Aug 2015 #71
HooptieWagon Aug 2015 #88
LiberalArkie Aug 2015 #90
artislife Aug 2015 #108
hifiguy Aug 2015 #18
restorefreedom Aug 2015 #22
notadmblnd Aug 2015 #32
Nuclear Unicorn Aug 2015 #33
snagglepuss Aug 2015 #42
HooptieWagon Aug 2015 #89
NaturalHigh Aug 2015 #137
roguevalley Aug 2015 #20
Sheepshank Aug 2015 #91
roguevalley Aug 2015 #93
Sheepshank Aug 2015 #100
Skwmom Aug 2015 #67
daredtowork Aug 2015 #96
Eleanors38 Aug 2015 #113
mythology Aug 2015 #128
99th_Monkey Aug 2015 #3
CTyankee Aug 2015 #4
Supersedeas Aug 2015 #139
99th_Monkey Aug 2015 #140
PSPS Aug 2015 #5
Supersedeas Aug 2015 #135
snagglepuss Aug 2015 #6
rusty fender Aug 2015 #8
PoutrageFatigue Aug 2015 #15
daredtowork Aug 2015 #97
Skidmore Aug 2015 #16
Hydra Aug 2015 #19
Skidmore Aug 2015 #56
Hydra Aug 2015 #59
Skidmore Aug 2015 #61
Hydra Aug 2015 #65
Skidmore Aug 2015 #69
ismnotwasm Aug 2015 #79
sheshe2 Aug 2015 #95
sheshe2 Aug 2015 #70
PeaceNikki Aug 2015 #21
Nevernose Aug 2015 #48
Skidmore Aug 2015 #57
freshwest Aug 2015 #80
Shankapotomus Aug 2015 #106
blackspade Aug 2015 #82
Starry Messenger Aug 2015 #94
Bubzer Aug 2015 #24
PeaceNikki Aug 2015 #27
Bubzer Aug 2015 #29
PeaceNikki Aug 2015 #31
Bubzer Aug 2015 #38
Egnever Aug 2015 #43
PeaceNikki Aug 2015 #45
Egnever Aug 2015 #49
PeaceNikki Aug 2015 #51
historylovr Aug 2015 #63
RichVRichV Aug 2015 #129
catrose Aug 2015 #36
okasha Aug 2015 #92
George II Aug 2015 #84
Shankapotomus Aug 2015 #107
Skidmore Aug 2015 #30
Bubzer Aug 2015 #35
Skidmore Aug 2015 #37
Bubzer Aug 2015 #41
ismnotwasm Aug 2015 #76
Bubzer Aug 2015 #104
George II Aug 2015 #86
Bubzer Aug 2015 #122
Nevernose Aug 2015 #44
Egnever Aug 2015 #26
Skidmore Aug 2015 #34
Egnever Aug 2015 #39
Truprogressive85 Aug 2015 #47
Egnever Aug 2015 #52
LineLineLineLineLineReply ?
Truprogressive85 Aug 2015 #55
Egnever Aug 2015 #58
Truprogressive85 Aug 2015 #62
Egnever Aug 2015 #87
Skidmore Aug 2015 #68
Egnever Aug 2015 #85
Rosa Luxemburg Aug 2015 #28
Erich Bloodaxe BSN Aug 2015 #101
nadinbrzezinski Aug 2015 #53
historylovr Aug 2015 #66
Skidmore Aug 2015 #72
onehandle Aug 2015 #73
Skidmore Aug 2015 #77
blackspade Aug 2015 #74
haikugal Aug 2015 #17
restorefreedom Aug 2015 #23
Marr Aug 2015 #40
riversedge Aug 2015 #54
Maedhros Aug 2015 #60
Skidmore Aug 2015 #78
ismnotwasm Aug 2015 #81
daredtowork Aug 2015 #98
NCTraveler Aug 2015 #111
Eleanors38 Aug 2015 #114
NCTraveler Aug 2015 #115
Eleanors38 Aug 2015 #116
NCTraveler Aug 2015 #117
Eleanors38 Aug 2015 #118
NCTraveler Aug 2015 #119
Bubzer Aug 2015 #123
NCTraveler Aug 2015 #124
Dornick Aug 2015 #125
valerief Aug 2015 #126

Response to Bubzer (Original post)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 05:46 PM

1. Petition closed?

Who are those "Black Lives Matter Activists"?

I would be interested in the opinion of the founders of the movement Alicia Garza and Patrisse Cullors, though. Their writing on oppression is fairly sophisticated and, more importantly, refers to "white supremacist liberals".

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Response to daredtowork (Reply #1)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:50 PM

75. Who are these "white supremacist liberals?"

A firm definition or examples would be worth knowing.

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Response to daredtowork (Reply #1)

Tue Aug 11, 2015, 09:40 AM

99. Turns out Black Lives Matter Activists was a seperate entity.

One that spoke for itself. However, Patrisse Cullors didn't like the message they put out and ordered her people to shut down the page. They took it over instead and claimed the page was actually hacked. I guess BLM isn't the inclusive non-leader based group everyone thought it was.

"

It looks like the page owner has re-acquired the page since Patrisse had her people shut down the page.
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Black-Lives-Matter/747345981986069?fref=ts

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Response to Bubzer (Reply #99)

Tue Aug 11, 2015, 04:42 PM

102. Looks like their "stage" got hijacked, too!

Are you saying BLM should be inclusive to the point of having no consistent message at all? At that point it just sinks into the sea of chatter, and there is no BLM.

The only direction BLM can have is from its founders. Patrisse is one of them. When people started demanding apologies from BLM, my question instead was what do Patrisse and Alicia Garza have to say?

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Response to daredtowork (Reply #102)

Tue Aug 11, 2015, 05:14 PM

103. I would say there really isn't room for the claim that the group has no centralized leader...

and then have the organization be directed by someone who is part of a de facto leadership.

BLM has every right to control their message. But if they operate under the claim of decentralized action, then they have set the stage and opened a door for others to use the BLM™ in a manner that may parallel or even diverge from their intent.

In short; if BLM wants to control the message, they can't pretend they let other people lead and expect to always get what they want.

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Response to Bubzer (Reply #103)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 01:24 AM

105. So if a bunch of fakers apologized in the name of BLM

without the spiritual influencers of BLM being behind that, you would accept that as a real apology?

I wouldn't. That's a prank apology.

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Response to daredtowork (Reply #105)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 10:21 AM

109. Well, and thats part of the problem at hand. Who's fake and who's real?

If the founders of the BLM organization open that door to let leaderless groups use the name, who's to say what is legitimate and what isn't? That's the weakness of decentralized authority... anyone with an agenda can use the name for their own reasons.

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Response to Bubzer (Reply #109)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 03:32 PM

120. Again, that's why it's good to check out the founders opinion. nt

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Response to daredtowork (Reply #120)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 08:11 PM

121. And I would agree. There is a caveat though.

The BLM Organization was and is operating under the notion of decentralized leadership... that idea means that the founders theoretically aren't necessary to check with for an opinion.

The BLM wants to appear as a decentralized organization... but that doesn't work if you have a centralized force calling the shots. In effect, they are trying to have it both ways...and that is what has lead to the current problems they're facing. Its a crisis of identity, where they'll have to choose one or the other... or risk this happening again.

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Response to Bubzer (Reply #121)

Thu Aug 13, 2015, 01:23 AM

130. You are confusing organizational structure with philosophy and intent of the organization. nt

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Response to daredtowork (Reply #130)

Thu Aug 13, 2015, 10:47 AM

131. Assuming you're right, then the BLM organization has a messaging issue.

If we look at their mission statement, we find this passage:
We embrace a diversity of tactics. We are a decentralized network aiming to build the leadership and power of black people.

At the very least, this implies setting up leaders outside the BLM organization who can use tactics they deem appropriate.

The rift between Black Lives Matter Activists and the BLM organization is a result of either a messaging issue or an identity crisis.
In either case, they're still going to need to address it or potentially deal with more similar issues.

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Response to Bubzer (Reply #131)

Thu Aug 13, 2015, 01:16 PM

133. BLM doesn't have a messaging issue at all. "Stop Killing Us" seems pretty clear.

The decentralized networks build their own leaders based on that message.

The game of twister your playing to try to judge them is getting pretty ridiculous.

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Response to daredtowork (Reply #133)

Thu Aug 13, 2015, 06:12 PM

134. You are confusing analysis for judgment.

You seem to want to pretend that the Black Lives Matter Activists didn't happen...
or at the very least, you're simply choosing to ignore them. Why is that?

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Response to Bubzer (Reply #134)

Fri Aug 14, 2015, 03:53 AM

136. Because they have nothing to do with BLM. They are fakers. nt

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Response to daredtowork (Reply #136)

Fri Aug 14, 2015, 10:55 AM

138. Okay, so they are fakers. I'm not disputing that point here.

Just because they were fake doesn't mean they didn't have an impact. The fact that they were able to force BLM to counter their actions speaks to that.

In any case, My point, again, was so long as BLM insists on putting out a message that the organization is decentralized, rather than having a core leadership, the BLM organization will continue to be at risk for others (fakers or legit) to put out the wrong message.

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Response to Bubzer (Reply #138)

Fri Aug 14, 2015, 01:55 PM

141. Anyone is at risk of being catfished

Someone could put up a fake facebook profile of me tomorrow. So what?

The founders of BLM then came out and said: "that's not us." Other BLM groups around voiced their opinion via Twitter, There was a collective response. It's pretty easy to recognize the "spirit" rather than the "letter" of the law here. If you can't recognize it, you're just dense.

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Response to daredtowork (Reply #141)

Fri Aug 14, 2015, 04:37 PM

142. You're confusing a directed response with a collective response. Look at post 99.

So you're arguing that since everyone's at risk, the BLM organization should just ignore it? If that's your stance, then its a bit naďve. Corporations have been fighting for ages to control their messages, corporate logo and collective branding... and for good reason! They get catfished too, but they don't simply ignore it. They rightly know their image could be harmed, and so they take action. The same danger holds true for people. People's lives have been significantly damaged through doctoring, hacking, cat-fishing etc of facebook pages and other social media.

Look, I'm willing to agree to disagree with you. I don't think I'm going to convince you to see my point... and you haven't proven your point to me. I'd rather this not descend into personal attacks, which we've been flirting with. So instead of continuing this back and forth, which is really getting us no-where, how about we let the conversation end and move forward? After all, I'm pretty sure you and I both want the same thing: to support racial justice.

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Response to Bubzer (Reply #109)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 09:40 PM

127. The real question is who are the fake BLM working for?

Qui bono?

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Response to daredtowork (Reply #105)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 01:19 PM

112. You correctly chose the word: "Spiritual."

 

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Response to Bubzer (Original post)


Response to notadmblnd (Reply #2)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 06:40 PM

7. BLM co-founder Patrisse Cullors has come out

stating her supporter of the Seattle protesters and denied rumors about apology to Bernie.



https://www.facebook.com/marissa.jenae.johnson




Patrisse Marie Cullors-Brignac
3 hrs · Edited ·

Mara Jacqueline and Marissa Jenae deserve to be treated with respect and dignity. They are apart of BLM. I support them in their leadership. Please discontinue harming them through social media. If you have questions about what Black Lives Matter's does. Please message me. I'm tired of folks not being principled or just hateful for no good reason.

BLM did not circulate a petition asking for an apology. We are not circulating articles that are slandering these women's names. Cut this shit out, yall.

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Response to snagglepuss (Reply #7)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 07:09 PM

9. Wow... thats unfortunate.

That means BLM is embracing everything those two women have done.
I must say, its quite disappointing.

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Response to Bubzer (Reply #9)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 10:00 PM

83. It also means that the OP is false. For DU, that's disappointing.

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Response to George II (Reply #83)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 10:31 AM

110. The origional OP is still correct. Black Live Matter Activists is a splinter group.

Patrisse has chosen not to embrace the touted "decentralized leadership" of the group's message, and has chosen to counter it.
The BLM Organization is having a crisis of identity right now.

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Response to Bubzer (Reply #9)

Thu Aug 13, 2015, 01:06 PM

132. maybe it is not everything

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Response to snagglepuss (Reply #7)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 07:09 PM

10. Yep, I read that and I was just reading an article written by Alisha Garza

Black Lives Matter affirms the lives of Black queer and trans folks, disabled folks, Black-undocumented folks, folks with records, women and all Black lives along the gender spectrum. It centers those that have been marginalized within Black liberation movements. It is a tactic to (re)build the Black liberation movement.[/div class="excerpt"]http://www.thefeministwire.com/2014/10/blacklivesmatter-2/

So yes, I am incredibly disappointed with this group of women who have decided that the way to attain their goals is to employee any means necessary. To me, any means necessary, includes acts of violence and I can not support any group that advocates change by committing acts of violence.

They will not gain dignity or respect by pulling stunts like the one they pulled the other night. And if they continue on their militant path, they will not advance any positive change, but will indeed go the way of others they are currently trying to emulate and resurrect. .

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Response to notadmblnd (Reply #10)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 07:27 PM

11. So, liberals are the enemy now? What is this movement about now?

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Response to haikugal (Reply #11)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 07:39 PM

12. From what I gather reading their works- everyone who is not in agreement with them is the enemy

My question to them would be- outside of other angry feminists- who do they think will give them the support required to effect the change they want. The men they hate? The white people they hate? The children they haven't borne? Who?

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Response to notadmblnd (Reply #12)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:00 PM

13. Thanks for your answer.

Is this what's on the page from the Seattle group?

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Response to haikugal (Reply #13)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:26 PM

25. No, I did a google search of the founders

and am reading interviews and articles they have written. I put a link to an article that was in the Feminist Wire further down in one of my posts and I'm currently reading an interview with one of the founders about them shutting down BART in Ca back in 2014.

Here are a couple of other groups they are affiliate themselves with and who they look to for advice and training

http://www.alternet.org/activism/meet-badass-activist-collective-bringing-direct-action-back-black-communities
http://fundersforjustice.org/black-organizing-for-leadership-dignity/

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Response to notadmblnd (Reply #25)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:52 PM

46. Thanks for the links and information.

Are you looking for affiliations higher up? Just wonder where the money comes from.

Anyway, I have reading to do!

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Response to haikugal (Reply #46)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:57 PM

50. Short answer, yes.

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Response to notadmblnd (Reply #12)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:01 PM

14. This is an excellent question. I was really shocked

reading comments in the Guardian from those identifying themselves as BLM supporters after Net Roots. The hostility towards white progressives who they derisively refer to as "emo-progressives" really took me me aback. If they're not going to ally themselves with progressives how do they plan to effect change?

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Response to snagglepuss (Reply #14)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:20 PM

64. Maybe they're not trying to effect the change you thought they were aiming for.

Looks like the goal is to create a lot of bad blood between the AA community and white progressives.

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Response to winter is coming (Reply #64)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:29 PM

71. You're right and it has been a jarring experience because I have been assuming

everyone Left at least agrees on who the "enemy" is.

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Response to winter is coming (Reply #64)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 10:19 PM

88. FWIW, that's my take.

 

Apparently, they want nothing to do with Democrats in general, and progressives/liberals in particular. We are the enemy. They want a constant agitation and conflict between blacks and democrats, because it empowers them. Sort of like Generals wanting constant war, b/c it keeps them in power/employed. If black and white Democrats worked together to resolve police violence on blacks, BLM would be out of business.

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Response to winter is coming (Reply #64)


Response to snagglepuss (Reply #14)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 02:57 AM

108. This isn't about elections or coalition building

 

You see a+b=c

They are doing trig.

Not the same.

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Response to notadmblnd (Reply #10)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:13 PM

18. Lotsa luck with that.

 

Marginalize yourself and piss off/push away any potential allies.

"You are all assholes and you all suck, now give us what we are demanding, you shitheads" is NOT a strategy that will win friends or influence anyone to do anything but despise you right back.

Fucking idiots.

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #18)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:24 PM

22. +1 nt

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #18)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:32 PM

32. I agree they will not make friends or influence anyone that can really help them effect the change

they claim to want. And for the life of me, I don't understand why they want to emulate or resurrect a group that (whether rightly or wrongly) has already been shut down by the powers that be- and expect it will go any differently than the first time around.

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #18)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:34 PM

33. It certainly doesn't speak to a liberal democratic government with equality and consensus.

I mean, if you're into that sort of thing, and all. Maybe they're looking for something -- oh, I dunno -- a bit less encumbered by participation of those they would presume to govern.

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #18)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:48 PM

42. These folks have some heavy personal issues they aren't dealing with because

that sort of thinking is completely irrational.

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Response to snagglepuss (Reply #42)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 10:22 PM

89. Exactly my thought.

 

They are some serious wackos.

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #18)

Fri Aug 14, 2015, 07:34 AM

137. Yep.

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Response to snagglepuss (Reply #7)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:16 PM

20. they will go up in flames with these fake protesters. Acorn anyone?

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Response to roguevalley (Reply #20)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 11:30 PM

91. Acorn was fake?

 

Intersting analogy

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Response to Sheepshank (Reply #91)

Tue Aug 11, 2015, 12:48 AM

93. no. acorn was killed with lies.

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Response to roguevalley (Reply #93)

Tue Aug 11, 2015, 10:26 AM

100. I still don't get the analogy

 

Acorn killed with lies and so the BLM, BLM protestors, Bernie, someone else is going to be killed off because of lies?

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Response to snagglepuss (Reply #7)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:24 PM

67. Respect and dignity is a two way street. n/t

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Response to snagglepuss (Reply #7)

Tue Aug 11, 2015, 03:44 AM

96. This was what I wanted to know. nt

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Response to snagglepuss (Reply #7)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 01:22 PM

113. Sorry, Ms. Cullors: Get into the game, expect your hand to be called.

 

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Response to snagglepuss (Reply #7)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 09:40 PM

128. If one wants to be treated with respect and dignity, one should act in a way that shows it

 

Instead, they acted like petulant clowns and got what they perceive as disrespect in return.

People rarely realize when they are acting like assholes.

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Response to Bubzer (Original post)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 05:53 PM

3. Whoa! Guess we'll see where this goes. I like the petition idea

 

May it work some good mojo to keep BLM alive & well, and credible

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Response to 99th_Monkey (Reply #3)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 06:01 PM

4. I couldn't agree more.

Forward!

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Response to 99th_Monkey (Reply #3)

Fri Aug 14, 2015, 11:06 AM

139. Credible with whom?

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Response to Supersedeas (Reply #139)

Fri Aug 14, 2015, 11:32 AM

140. With the broader African American community primarily

 

I admire BLM's activist fire, especially when its most supportive with candidates
who are most aligned with issues vital to most AA's.

I am happy to see the Congressional Black Caucus supports BLM .. and I'm
happy that this primary season is shaking up the Demccratic Party to take more
more seriously how AA's are being targeted by racist cops. <-- this

.. has been going on way too long and it sickens me every day that passes
that it's not squarely dealt with and stopped.

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Response to Bubzer (Original post)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 06:06 PM

5. The Seattle NPR station interviewed the head of the Seattle chapter of the NAACP today.

It was probably the most awkward ten minutes of the poor man's life.

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Response to PSPS (Reply #5)

Thu Aug 13, 2015, 09:24 PM

135. there's alot of that going round

and maybe this is a good thing....for all of us to be a little awkward

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Response to Bubzer (Original post)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 06:35 PM

6. BLM Co-founder Patrisse Cullor has come out and stated that they are part of BLM

and that she supports their leadership and states that Mara Jacqueline and Marissa Jenae deserve to be treated with respect and dignity.






https://www.facebook.com/marissa.jenae.johnson




Patrisse Marie Cullors-Brignac
3 hrs · Edited ·

Mara Jacqueline and Marissa Jenae deserve to be treated with respect and dignity. They are apart of BLM. I support them in their leadership. Please discontinue harming them through social media. If you have questions about what Black Lives Matter's does. Please message me. I'm tired of folks not being principled or just hateful for no good reason.

BLM did not circulate a petition asking for an apology. We are not circulating articles that are slandering these women's names. Cut this shit out, yall.








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Response to snagglepuss (Reply #6)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 06:47 PM

8. Those 2 are yahoos and

 

they don't deserve an ounce of respect.

What they did to Sanders and the audience that waited to hear him speak was shameful. Those 2 women made their protest about themselves and not about BLM.





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Response to snagglepuss (Reply #6)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:02 PM

15. Then BLM owns the statement "white supremacist liberals"...

 

Fuck. That. Shit.

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Response to PoutrageFatigue (Reply #15)

Tue Aug 11, 2015, 03:49 AM

97. I pointed out that it was even in an essay by Alicia Garza

Inventor of the #BlackLivesMatter hashtag. This is why I keep urging DU to try to find out more about the accusation instead of just recoiling and assuming 2 crazy women. We also allowed an Alert swarm on a DU member (Bravenak) who was trying to convey the more militant message of #BLM here. I think that was a grave mistake.

Are we now going to decry massive amounts of the black community for calling white people names we don't like and take our ball and go home? Or are we going to engage and ask where that comes from?

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Response to Bubzer (Original post)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:05 PM

16. I am really kind of sick

of this being beaten into the ground. Are you paying attention to Ferguson? Sanders is a politician and will survive political dustup. Meanwhile, a young man who was unarmed at the time he was shot is fighting for his life.

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2015/08/10/get-him-some-help-hes-still-alive-witness-to-officer-involved-shooting-in-ferguson-arrested-video/

An 18-year-old was shot by St. Louis County, Missouri police on August 9th, during protests commemorating the approaching one-year anniversary of Michael Brown’s death.

Video posted to Twitter by Search4Swag shows Tony Rice, a well-known social media personality who often covers events in St. Louis County, demanding that police get help for the critically injured teenager.

As the young man lies bleeding in the street, officers stand with their guns trained on his motionless body. No-one moves to provide medical attention, although it’s believed that police shot the teen multiple times.

The video shows an outraged Rice pleading with police to get the young man some help. “Get him some help! Get him some help!” Rice shouts at an officer. “He’s bleeding out! Get him some help!”

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Response to Skidmore (Reply #16)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:15 PM

19. The problem is that BLM is not actually addressing the issue

The racial killings need to stop. BLM, however, is using the dead to advance an agenda that is divisive and hateful.

That isn't going to help anything- we need to help BLM off the stage and get to work, not follow them on some crusade against ____.

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Response to Hydra (Reply #19)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:08 PM

56. Really?

Against ____? What an astounding remark.

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Response to Skidmore (Reply #56)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:11 PM

59. Read their official statements. I put a blank there not because there's nothing

It's that what they are aiming for is not something I'd like to talk about.

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Response to Hydra (Reply #59)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:16 PM

61. Perhaps that is why dialogue is needed and

understanding. I refer you to Peacenikki's post on this subthread. I personally think that they are asking to be able to not to have to continually live in fear of losing their lives. That they not be the targes for arbitrary overzealous policing. That they not be subjected to brutality. This is a widespread problem and exists in many areas. It is not a "they" problem; it is a problem for us all to address, locally and nationally.

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Response to Skidmore (Reply #61)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:21 PM

65. No, that's not what BLM is working toward

And we'll leave it at that. The people working toward racial equality are not seen as friends by them.

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Response to Hydra (Reply #65)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:26 PM

69. I don't think they are asking for anything other than

ways to be treated equally without prejudice in their statement.


http://blacklivesmatter.com/

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
August 9, 2015
At this time, #BlackLivesMatter does not endorse any presidential candidate. Moreover, we are not affiliated with a political party. Our work is not funded or driven by any political party nor is it influenced by local or national candidates.
As stated in our mission, #BlackLivesMatter is an ideological and political intervention; we are not controlled by the same political machine we are attempting to hold accountable. In the year leading up to the elections, we are committed to holding all candidates for Office accountable to the needs and dreams of Black people. We embrace a diversity of tactics. We are a decentralized network aiming to build the leadership and power of black people. We do not endorse any political party and we are not supported by any political party. Our political aims we’ve stated clearly.
Historically, all political parties have participated in the systematic disenfranchisement of Black people. Anti-black racism, especially that sanctioned by the state, has resulted in the loss of healthy and thriving Black life and well-being. Given that, we will continue to hold politicians and political parties accountable for their policies and platforms. We will also continue to demand the intentional dismantling of structural racism.

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Response to Skidmore (Reply #69)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:53 PM

79. That is exactly right

They are a grassroots organization born out of one hell of a lot of pain. Decades of frustration I respect what they are trying to do

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Response to Skidmore (Reply #69)

Tue Aug 11, 2015, 03:41 AM

95. BLM

That is what they want. Their lives to matter.
Slow to get back here, Skidmore another hide to wade through.

Nailed this time.

Kick Kick Kick your post!

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Response to Hydra (Reply #65)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:27 PM

70. Bull shit

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Response to Skidmore (Reply #16)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:21 PM

21. Agreed.

I refuse to think they are ignorant or stupid or assholes or Republican operatives or part of a false flag operation.

I think they're angry and scared and hurt at what's happening to their brothers and sisters and children and friends.

They're trying to affect change. Sanders and O'Mally now have comprehensive plans laid out regarding racial justice. Neither did before these disruptions. And that's all they are is minor disruptions. Yeah, they said some nasty hurtful shit but they've heard it all themselves their entire lives. They're pissed. I get it. People are dying and they're asking to be heard.

We should listen to them. They have life experiences we don't.

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Response to PeaceNikki (Reply #21)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:53 PM

48. "They're angry and scared and hurt"

That's an excellent and fair summary of the #blm movement.

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Response to PeaceNikki (Reply #21)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:10 PM

57. I think you are spot on.

And they should be listened to and understood.

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Response to Skidmore (Reply #57)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:54 PM

80. Real lives are more important than politics or careers. Period. n/t

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Response to freshwest (Reply #80)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 01:46 AM

106. Politics decides

if the loss of black lives will continued to be ignored. Without someone like Sanders around challenging the establishment you can pretty much bet they will.

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Response to PeaceNikki (Reply #21)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:58 PM

82. +1000

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Response to PeaceNikki (Reply #21)

Tue Aug 11, 2015, 12:57 AM

94. Exactly.

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Response to Skidmore (Reply #16)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:26 PM

24. Okay. So, then, how is interupting Bernie Sanders suppose to help the situation?

Would it not be reasonable to perhaps target politicians who are not currently running, especially the GOP?
Its rare that a genuine life-long civil rights advocate gets a shot at the Whitehouse... even more rare that the individual marched along side MLK Jr.

Bernie has arguably the greatest potential to be a boon to PoC, and everyone else! So, why attack him?
Why not work on changing the minds of various members of the GOP?

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Response to Bubzer (Reply #24)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:28 PM

27. Their disruption led to Bernie’s explicit platform on racial justice.

So there's that.

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Response to PeaceNikki (Reply #27)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:30 PM

29. Ehh... the campaign has already stated it was in the works before the event.

I would not credit the disruption for that.

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Response to Bubzer (Reply #29)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:31 PM

31. It went on his site Sunday.

And it was a wise move.

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Response to PeaceNikki (Reply #31)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:43 PM

38. Definately.

I'm glad its up.

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Response to PeaceNikki (Reply #31)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:50 PM

43. So you think they came up with it overnight in response?

 

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Response to Egnever (Reply #43)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:51 PM

45. You don't think the Netroots event and Saturday helped get it there?

I do.

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Response to PeaceNikki (Reply #45)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:57 PM

49. No I think that defies logic

 

If you read it, it isn't something that was done overnight. That implies it was already being worked on.

Not to mention as has been pointed out many times Bernie has a long history of fighting for social justice going back to MLK days.

I think pretending netroots and saturdays embarrassments had anything to do with bernie suddenly coming to the realization there is a problem can only be made by someone unaware of his long history of working for social change for minorities.

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Response to Egnever (Reply #49)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:00 PM

51. I disagree.

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Response to Egnever (Reply #49)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:19 PM

63. I agree.

I know he was asked about it 28 May, and I've seen where he talked about it elsewhere, before the Netroots ambush. He's not in a cave, he's aware of things happening, if not as tuned in at first that people wanted to address this. This wasn't a last minute term paper. And I don't think he went out and hired Ms. Sanders Saturday afternoon either. I think saying he did this only after Saturday's ... whatever the hell that was supposed to be, is a way for people to claim a victory.

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Response to PeaceNikki (Reply #45)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 11:31 PM

129. I think Netroots did.

Unlike most people I don't see what happened at Netroots and what happened in Seattle as being equal, nor one being a continuation of the other.


Though it could have been handled better by everyone, I see netroots as being a beneficial and constructive event. It brought attention to a very worthy cause, forced the candidates to reevaluate their positions and was viewed very favorably toward BLM. The people involved were disruptive but not overly rude or divisive. I think a good portion of the expanded role of racial justice in the candidates messages can be directly linked to this event.


Now what happened at the social security rally was something else entirely. It was vile, dismissive, aggressive, and served no point but to attack and divide. It almost seemed the head of it was trying to get arrested to create a scene. I don't think it accomplished anything towards the candidates and it definitely hurt BLM. While I don't think it was a hit job, just individuals acting out, I don't think the Republican links to the main person can be easily dismissed. What I saw was someone wanting to harm Democrats not engage us or change our views. I haven't seen anything since to change my opinion of it.


But yes, I do believe netroots helped get us here.

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Response to Bubzer (Reply #29)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:42 PM

36. Probably he wanted to get it good rather than get it out

Hope it's both.

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Response to Bubzer (Reply #29)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 11:48 PM

92. I would.

The Netroots demonstration lit a fire under O'Malley, and he produced an excellent criminal justice reform plan. Both he and Sanders were told they'd be subject to demonstrations till their plans were published. As of Saturday, Sanders' plan had not been published. ("In the works" doesn't count. It's just another version of "Ma'am, I swear I finished my research paper, but I don't have it because...." Now Sanders' plan is out, and by all accounts it's a good one. Barring other problems, that should preclude further demonstrations.

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Response to PeaceNikki (Reply #27)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 10:07 PM

84. Too bad it took a SECOND distruption to get that platform.

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Response to PeaceNikki (Reply #27)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 01:57 AM

107. Like he wouldn't have listened otherwise

in a private meeting.

Is that a precident now for liberals to deal with each other?

Open with accusations of "white liberal supremacy" unless you get what you want? Real great way for us to communicate with each other.

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Response to Bubzer (Reply #24)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:30 PM

30. This is not about Sanders.

It is about the daily threat to lives by out of control policing. Sanders was being asked what he would do to correct for this. I'm sure all candidates on the left will be asked. This is not about him, and I repeat, there is a young man in a hospital tonight fighting for his life.

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Response to Skidmore (Reply #30)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:39 PM

35. Okay, so, again, shouldn't these protests be targeted at those who can more readily affect change?

Say the president or other congressional members? This disruption to Bernie's campaign did little more than cost BLM supporters. Read a few forums on the issue, and you'll see a lot of good-will toward the organization has been lost. That has a very real weakening effect on their message.

I'd even go so far as to say they set their movement back a bit by embracing this action.
Its net loss for everyone involved.

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Response to Bubzer (Reply #35)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:43 PM

37. I don't think "a lot of good-will"

has been lost. Most thinking people and those not invested in a horse race understand that BLM is larger than those two young women or any political candidate. It will be around for as long as it needs to be. The civil rights movement of my youth had setbacks too, but that did not stop people from seeking justice.

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Response to Skidmore (Reply #37)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:46 PM

41. Well, I'd suggest taking a look at some forums, and you might be surprised.

But that's neither here nor there... there are still far more effective means that could and should have been employed over disrupting one of their advocates.

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Response to Skidmore (Reply #37)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:50 PM

76. No goodwill has been lost

They accomplished what they set out to do--and they're not done.

I posted this elsewhere, but people don't seem to know that the Seattle police Department was under review from the Feds a couple of years back because of abusive practices. #Blacklivesmatter couldn't have picked a better city to do this.

Sanders will respond as best he can because he's a decent man, from all I can tell. I'd love to see him reach out to #blacklivesmatter. That would end this. He could do it.

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Response to ismnotwasm (Reply #76)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 01:10 AM

104. Bernie Sanders is already in contact with BLM.

He picked one of their members as his Campaign Press Secretary... no small position, to be sure.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/bernie-sanders-press-secretary_55c77941e4b0f1cbf1e54fec

"No goodwill has been lost" - I suppose that would depend on who you're referring to. Reading through various publications and seeing peoples reactions, provides an awful lot of evidence to the contrary.

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Response to Bubzer (Reply #35)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 10:10 PM

86. When did Sanders leave the Senate? You say....

..."shouldn't these protests be targeted at those who can more readily affect change?"

So I guess you're saying that Sanders, as a United States Senator, can affect change. Why isn't he?

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Response to George II (Reply #86)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 08:26 PM

122. Its pretty well know that once somone decides to run for office...

Their time gets necessarily dedicated to campaigning. Obviously he could still have an impact as a senator... but the more time he spends focused on senatorial tasks is less time he can spend on getting his message out to people. We also know the GOP is not likely to let any progressive bill through while Obama is still in office... so in this case, the best Bernie can do is take the long view and focus on the campaign.

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Response to Bubzer (Reply #24)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:50 PM

44. This may sound flippant

But I wonder if it's logistically possible for them to sneak into a GOP rally. They'd stand out like a sore thumb, whereas at any Denicratic rally nobody would give them a second look.

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Response to Skidmore (Reply #16)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:27 PM

26. So no one fired at the cops?

 

No one looted stores again? Just those out of control cops shooting at innocent kids right?

Except here's video of someone shooting at the cops and there are plenty of pics of the cars with bullet holes to be found.
http://fox2now.com/2015/08/10/new-video-shows-shots-fired-on-ferguson-streets/


There is no question there are out of control officers out there but this doesn't seem to even resemble that. You shoot at cops you can be pretty sure they will fire back.

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Response to Egnever (Reply #26)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:34 PM

34. Did the article say that?

Did I make that claim? There was a woman from Ferguson who was interviewed earlier this evening on MSNBC and she said that the people who did the shooting were not from the community.

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Response to Skidmore (Reply #34)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:44 PM

39. The article tries to paint a picture of an innocent bystander shot when cops just went crazy

 

the video puts that bs in perspective.

you and the article try to claim "Meanwhile, a young man who was unarmed at the time he was shot is fighting for his life."

You are outraged people aren't talking about another innocent teen gunned down in the street as if there weren't shots fired at the police. There video of it happening but the article wants to try to claim it was just another innocent unarmed young man left to die in the street.

I am all for reigning in the out of control police but making shit up to try to paint a picture does more harm than good.

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Response to Egnever (Reply #26)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:52 PM

47. wel

All cops are part of system that allows them to get away with anything

If any of those "looters" are caught they are thrown in jail


a Cop can someone like me , say I was a threat to him/her and he get off







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Response to Truprogressive85 (Reply #47)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:01 PM

52. You can see them shooting at the cops in the video

 

Did you watch it?

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Response to Egnever (Reply #52)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:07 PM

55. ?

Did they catch the shooter ?

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Response to Truprogressive85 (Reply #55)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:11 PM

58. They shot him

 

He is the one the article above claims is an innocent bystander.

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Response to Egnever (Reply #58)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:18 PM

62. i see

How do you know he was a shooter
its pretty dark cant see much

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Response to Truprogressive85 (Reply #62)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 10:10 PM

87. you can see the muzzle flashes

 

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Response to Egnever (Reply #58)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:25 PM

68. Says who?

The cops?

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Response to Skidmore (Reply #68)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 10:08 PM

85. Well there is video of it

 

so I guess we will find out who is telling the truth.

Me I am going to stick with the idea that since there is actual video of someone shooting at the police as well as plenty of pictures of the cop cars riddled with bullet holes that they were probably shooting back instead of just firing indiscriminately and since only one person was injured I am also going to guess it wasn't some random bullet hitting an innocent bystander.

Maybe that will turn out to be wrong but watching the live feeds last night the cops appeared to be doing a good job of letting the protestors do their thing. They also are taking heat today because people are saying they were too permissive and should have shut the protests down.

Or we could go with dads statement that the kid didn't have a gun...

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Response to Skidmore (Reply #16)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:29 PM

28. Many Black people have confidence in Bernie

He will be the one who will change things. He's not going to tolerate police brutality.

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Response to Rosa Luxemburg (Reply #28)

Tue Aug 11, 2015, 10:44 AM

101. No President is going to be a 'saviour'.

We need to act like 'ALEC' and find good laws on the books now that keep police in check and propagate them from city to city and state to state, and get them written up if they don't exist. Don't wait for possible Presidents, actually start pushing referendums now, get them onto ballots the country over. Get civilian oversight and control in place, FORCE police to PROTECT and SERVE, not brutalize and terrorize. Get zero tolerance for that sort of crap in place, and get cities, counties and states to pact together not to hire on police who have committed such acts in other jurisdictions. No more simply pushing the problem police off into other jurisdictions to continue their bad actions.

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Response to Skidmore (Reply #16)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:03 PM

53. Yes, I even posted about it as it was breaking

 

and staid way late at night (or was early morning) and that post here sank like a rock....

Here...
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10027062011

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Response to Skidmore (Reply #16)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:21 PM

66. Yes, paying attention.

I hope no one else is hurt or killed.

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Response to historylovr (Reply #66)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:34 PM

72. Me too.

It is very concerning.

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Response to Skidmore (Reply #16)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:46 PM

73. Clearly much more important.

It's really weird that this is still a thing.

Pretty sure Senator Sanders has progressed past it.

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Response to onehandle (Reply #73)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:51 PM

77. Very weird

to the point of being ridiculous. Those purporting to have progressive values which support the general demands that black people are making do not really seem to be attending to the issue.

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Response to Skidmore (Reply #16)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:47 PM

74. The callousness of these assholes is inhuman.

sickening.

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Response to Bubzer (Original post)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:06 PM

17. We're being accused of devastating a young black woman's life by doing our research.

I'm sure this fits in with the notion of us being the liberal racists etc. that we are. I don't know who or what these folks are listening to that they think that. Sounds like a right wing meme to me.

Way to divide the people so all the problems can stay the way they are and get worse with time.

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Response to Bubzer (Original post)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:25 PM

23. i would not hold my breath

waiting for any apology.

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Response to Bubzer (Original post)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 08:44 PM

40. Fine. If you don't want to be part of the coalition, keep your ass off the stage.

 

You'd have to be a moron to think that people you openly despise will ever listen to you. Good luck getting anything done without allies.

Still, BLM seems to me comparable to OWS in many ways. No individual can be said to speak for the organization as a whole, whether they're 'co-founders' or new members. Their stated cause is one I support, though individuals like the two who stormed the stage the other day can go fuck themselves for all I care.

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Response to Bubzer (Original post)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:06 PM

54. The &#8234;#&#8206;BlackLivesMatter&#8236; organization did not create any petitions demanding apology from Seattle ba

This is from BLM Facebook:--also this was 18 hrs ago. Very confusing.



https://www.facebook.com/BlackLivesMatter/posts/479642585540325

Black Lives Matter
18 hrs ·

The ‪#‎BlackLivesMatter‬ organization did not create any petitions demanding apology from Seattle based organizers. We have not issued a public apology, neither have we made any public statements demanding an apology.
Like Comment

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Response to Bubzer (Original post)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:13 PM

60. When a movement is based upon a twitter hashtag,

 

anyone can claim to represent it.

BLM is having a credibility crisis - who do we believe when they say they are BLM?

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Response to Maedhros (Reply #60)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:52 PM

78. That is a gross oversimplifiation.

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Response to Maedhros (Reply #60)

Mon Aug 10, 2015, 09:57 PM

81. You certainly have a choice there don't you?

I have seen some of incredibly egregious interpretations of their legitimacy--straight out of prison planet. The reality is the are a grassroots organization, with plenty of youth. Twitter is often a social medium platform of choice to get messages out to the public--and is successful at it. Not hard to research.

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Response to Bubzer (Original post)

Tue Aug 11, 2015, 03:53 AM

98. Comparison of Black Lives Matter and Free Speech Movement

This is a copy of a comment I made in another thread, but I think it's more pertinent here.

Today I was reading a book on the Free Speech Movement and the New Left of the 1960s. I was amazed at how much that period had in common with today: a feeling that elites were taking away people's rights, that there was an oligarchy hovering over both major political parties, that - this is the kicker - housing prices were out of control!

One interesting element of the Free Speech Movement was that it was led by a United Front of Left, Right, and Radical students = they managed to come together around the issue they wanted to pursue. They took their cue from another coalition group called Slate: while this group was on the Left, it's party-politics stopped there. Slate united a whole spectrum of the Left from mild Liberals to flaming Radicals around very specific goals. According to the book I'm reading, the upshot of this was to shift the goals from the margins and give them a broader political base. This book also explains how this process made the F word part of common teenage vocabulary today (you could and did get arrested for displaying it in 1964).

The Free Speech Movement started in part as a struggle for students to advocate for the Civil Rights Movement on campus, and in turn they absorbed many of its strategies and tactics. As I read the decision of the students to proceed with a Sit-in while a low-level bureaucrat argued vigorously with the reasons their tactics were ineffective (a Professor I had studied under, btw - I had no idea he had ever been an administrator, much less so prominently involved!), all I could do was chuckle to myself over the "diversity of tactics." Many students joined in the actions because they felt that normal procedures simply didn't get things done anymore.

Does any of this sound familiar? The more things change, the more they stay the same! The Millennial generation is rerunning this in the form of Black Lives Matter! Most people are reaching out to MLK for comparisons, but I think the real comparison is the Free Speech Movement for the youth element, the disregard of ideology, and the "diversity of tactics" applied to reach their goal.

Reading this book also underscored for me that Black Lives Matter is solely focused on their goals and not on any larger outcome like whether getting a Democrat elected will ultimately help achieve goals down the road. They have goals NOW, and they take actions NOW to achieve those goals NOW. Until we come to terms with that, I believe we will continue to be frustrated by the actions of Black Lives Matter activists.

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Response to Bubzer (Original post)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 10:37 AM

111. Marissa, you owe no one an appology.

 

We all owe you an apology. I'm sorry for your treatment. I'm sorry for the lies being spread about you. I'm sorry so many white people are going back to a time honored tradition and marginalizing you. You are smart, strong, and black. Their greatest fear. I'm so happy, no matter how engrained this is in our society, that you haven't bought into it. People wanted you tazed. You were told the Garner issue was addressed. I support you and I'm sorry for the sickness that is institutionalized racism being hurled in your direction.

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Response to NCTraveler (Reply #111)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 01:25 PM

114. In this day and age, who the fuck apologizes for anything? Bad form.

 

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Response to Eleanors38 (Reply #114)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 01:29 PM

115. "In this day and age, who the fuck apologizes for anything?"

 

Speaks on its own.

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Response to NCTraveler (Reply #115)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 01:38 PM

116. It looks like the BLM's "spirit" leadership is right on time with public bravado.

 

When looking at how the system is corrupted with racism, and how so many fall unwitting victim to it, the refusal to apologize appears part of that system.

Like a land mine.

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Response to Eleanors38 (Reply #116)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 01:44 PM

117. I agree. "Tase her" was yelled from the crowd. No one appologized.

 

Unbelievable what some want apologies for these days. As I said, she has no need to apologize. Others wouldn't even think of giving her one. Tase her? Seriously? But wait.... didn't Zimmerman say he was really sorry. I respect no one asking this young woman to apologize. Marissa. That's who should be unapologetic. That's all I'm saying.

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Response to NCTraveler (Reply #117)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 01:51 PM

118. And Bernie was "violent" to Ms. Johnson. But she's in the Celebrity System now.

 

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Response to Eleanors38 (Reply #118)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 01:53 PM

119. No idea what you are talking about. nt.

 

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Response to NCTraveler (Reply #119)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 08:38 PM

123. This whole issue is frustrating.

No one wants to apologize... but everyone expects an apology.
No one wants to listen but everyone wants to be heard.
Everyone's too busy being upset to try and come to a resolution.
I see this as a net loss for all involved.

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Response to Bubzer (Reply #123)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 09:18 PM

124. That I get and overall agree with.

 

But I think a couple of people are shining through. Sanders is at the top of that list. I also think BLM had a net gain. But with Sanders. His moves during this have been impressive. I'm not voting for him but he has been amazing in the face of enormous growth and highly unusual and unexpected problems that could not be forseen. Cory Booker was a winner in this. Hillary got a little here and there. Not sure there are too many more.

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Response to Bubzer (Original post)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 09:29 PM

125. It's always hard to tell who is who...

 

... since anyone can claim to belong to virtually any group.

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Response to Bubzer (Original post)

Wed Aug 12, 2015, 09:38 PM

126. Palin fans don't apologize. nt

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