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Sun Aug 23, 2015, 02:44 PM

You can go to prison due to fetal personhood laws.






33 replies, 2151 views

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Arrow 33 replies Author Time Post
Reply You can go to prison due to fetal personhood laws. (Original post)
gollygee Aug 2015 OP
smirkymonkey Aug 2015 #1
DirkGently Aug 2015 #2
Gothmog Aug 2015 #3
Proud Liberal Dem Aug 2015 #4
NotoriousRBG Aug 2015 #5
yeoman6987 Aug 2015 #6
Lars39 Aug 2015 #8
yeoman6987 Aug 2015 #15
mercuryblues Aug 2015 #20
yeoman6987 Aug 2015 #23
DirkGently Aug 2015 #24
davidpdx Aug 2015 #27
PeaceNikki Aug 2015 #28
davidpdx Aug 2015 #29
PeaceNikki Aug 2015 #30
davidpdx Aug 2015 #31
cui bono Aug 2015 #9
Lars39 Aug 2015 #17
Dont call me Shirley Aug 2015 #7
WinkyDink Aug 2015 #10
cui bono Aug 2015 #11
former9thward Aug 2015 #14
mercuryblues Aug 2015 #21
former9thward Aug 2015 #32
mercuryblues Aug 2015 #33
yeoman6987 Aug 2015 #16
ncjustice80 Aug 2015 #19
yeoman6987 Aug 2015 #22
ncjustice80 Aug 2015 #25
yeoman6987 Aug 2015 #26
RoccoR5955 Aug 2015 #12
valerief Aug 2015 #13
ncjustice80 Aug 2015 #18

Response to gollygee (Original post)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 02:48 PM

1. K&R

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Response to gollygee (Original post)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 02:53 PM

2. YES. Republicans don't like to talk about


... what this "personhood" push really means. All of those scenarios would flow from that framework. I believe there already is a woman in prison in Indiana (?) accused of murder for what she says was a miscarriage.

A woman died in Ireland not long ago because the abortion that could have saved her life was illegal.

This is what candidates like Huckabee and Rubio and Walker, and other "mainstream" Republicans like Paul Ryan are proposing:

Charging women with crimes like assault and murder based on how they handle their pregnancies.

Everyone needs to start asking these psychopaths what the world they are trying to create would look like, and why that should be okay with anyone.

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Response to gollygee (Original post)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 03:02 PM

3. These laws are bad policy

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Response to gollygee (Original post)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 03:18 PM

4. Don't forget

At least one state (Alabama) appoints lawyers for fetuses now.

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Response to gollygee (Original post)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 03:23 PM

5. Why do they all have the same booking number?

 

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Response to NotoriousRBG (Reply #5)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 04:03 PM

6. It probably a this could happen in America if GOP

 

Wins anymore elections. These are just examples of the future.

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Response to yeoman6987 (Reply #6)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 04:33 PM

8. These have already happened.

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Response to Lars39 (Reply #8)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 07:38 PM

15. In what country?

 

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Response to yeoman6987 (Reply #15)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 09:00 PM

20. some chiling examples

Some chilling examples:

•A woman in Utah gave birth to twins. When one was stillborn, she was arrested and charged with criminal homicide based on the claim that the woman’s decision to refuse cesarean surgery was the cause of the stillbirth. Several hours after giving birth, and immediately after suffering the death of her child, she was forcibly taken from her hospital room to a jail cell.


•After a hearing that lasted less than a day, a court issued an order requiring a critically-ill pregnant woman who was refusing surgery in Washington, D.C. to undergo a cesarean. Neither she nor her baby survived.


•A judge in Ohio kept a woman imprisoned to prevent her from having an abortion.


•A woman in Oregon who did not comply with a doctor’s recommendation to have additional testing for gestational diabetes was subjected to involuntary civil commitment. During her detention, the additional testing was never performed.


•A Louisiana woman was charged with murder and spent approximately a year in jail before her counsel was able to show that what was deemed a murder of a fetus or newborn was actually a miscarriage that resulted from medication given to her by a health care provider.


•In Texas, a pregnant woman who sometimes smoked marijuana to ease nausea and boost her appetite gave birth to healthy twins. She was arrested for delivery of a controlled substance to a minor.


•A doctor in Wisconsin had concerns about a woman’s plans to have her birth attended by a midwife. As a result, a civil court order of protective custody for the woman’s fetus was obtained. The order authorized the sheriff’s department to take the woman into custody, transport her to a hospital, and subject her to involuntary testing and medical treatment.

http://personhoodforwomen.org/this-is-what-legal-abortion-looks-like.php

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Response to mercuryblues (Reply #20)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 09:12 PM

23. Yikes!!!! Some of those are astonishing.

 

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Response to mercuryblues (Reply #20)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 09:22 PM

24. Jesus.


Barbaric.

What is wrong with people?

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Response to mercuryblues (Reply #20)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 11:37 PM

27. I think the personhood laws are completely unnecessary and an invasion of a woman's privacy

I would caution though some of the information may be iffy. I'm seeing the same exact information appears in several different articles, but the main source all of them are relying on is Paltrow, L.M. & Flavin, J. in the Journal of Health Politics, Policy, and Law (full reference below). As I couldn't find any other articles regarding the Oregon case, which I was interested in. I don't have access to this journal, but am interested to see some supporting proof on the case in Oregon. I'm not saying it's not true, just that I see nothing backing it up.


Paltrow, L.M. & Flavin, J. (2013). Arrests of and forced interventions on pregnant women in the United States, 1973–2005: Implications for women's legal status and public health. Journal of Health Politics, Policy, and Law 2013, 38(2), 299-343. doi: 10.1215/03616878-1966324

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Response to PeaceNikki (Reply #28)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 11:54 PM

29. Good find

I believe it is true.

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Response to davidpdx (Reply #29)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 11:57 PM

30. But it looks like it was reversed

In any case, these personhood laws are a real threat to women and the point of the graphic on the OP and the link with these cases is to demonstrate how they can, are and will be used to reduce women to broodmares.

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Response to PeaceNikki (Reply #30)

Mon Aug 24, 2015, 12:07 AM

31. Yes, very true

The reason I was curious is because Oregon doesn't have specific person-hood laws that I know of. It looks like the case was an isolated incident. The fact that the judge overturned it proves the law was on her side.

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Response to NotoriousRBG (Reply #5)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 04:37 PM

9. Those are just pics for the ad campaign, not the actual cases/women.

I was thinking it would have been better if they had made signs with different numbers but then people might have thought they were trying to pass them off as real victims. I think this way it's clear that these are not actual victims but the pics were taken to make the point.

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Response to cui bono (Reply #9)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 07:46 PM

17. Iirc, the 2 middle scenarios have actually happened.

Same background in photos just give a better finished look.

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Response to gollygee (Original post)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 04:30 PM

7. Just where the misogynists, that includes women-hating women, want them.

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Response to gollygee (Original post)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 04:38 PM

10. These photos are "staged" per this website explaining and givng even WORSE examples:

 

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Response to gollygee (Original post)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 04:39 PM

11. This is really disgusting. How are those laws allowed to stand?

Abortion is legal in this country dammit. How do these misogynist thugs keep getting around that?

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Response to cui bono (Reply #11)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 05:37 PM

14. The pictures are fake.

No one is in jail for having an abortion. In some states prosecutors use these laws to charge a person when they kill a pregnant woman. One charge for the woman and one for the fetus. They can't be used in an abortion context. Another example of posting something that is not true on the internet to generate faux outrage.

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Response to former9thward (Reply #14)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 09:10 PM

21. some examples

http://personhoodforwomen.org/this-is-what-legal-abortion-looks-like.php


•A woman in Utah gave birth to twins. When one was stillborn, she was arrested and charged with criminal homicide based on the claim that the woman’s decision to refuse cesarean surgery was the cause of the stillbirth. Several hours after giving birth, and immediately after suffering the death of her child, she was forcibly taken from her hospital room to a jail cell.


•After a hearing that lasted less than a day, a court issued an order requiring a critically-ill pregnant woman who was refusing surgery in Washington, D.C. to undergo a cesarean. Neither she nor her baby survived.


•A judge in Ohio kept a woman imprisoned to prevent her from having an abortion.


•A woman in Oregon who did not comply with a doctor’s recommendation to have additional testing for gestational diabetes was subjected to involuntary civil commitment. During her detention, the additional testing was never performed.

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Response to mercuryblues (Reply #21)

Mon Aug 24, 2015, 01:09 AM

32. I went to your link.

Nothing but allegations. No proof that any of this actually happened. As the fake photos prove you can post anything on the internet.

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Response to former9thward (Reply #32)

Mon Aug 24, 2015, 07:44 AM

33. all of them

are easily googled.

so are these Burton vs Florida A woman was court ordered on bed rest after the hospital refused to let her leave for a 2nd opinion. 3 days into her confinement she had an emergency C-section and the fetus was dead. She did not have a lawyer and the hearing was held over the phone.

https://www.aclu.org/cases/burton-v-florida

https://feminocracy.wordpress.com/2008/09/05/and-now-you-know-the-rest-of-the-story/

Pa Mom arrested for supplying abortion pills for her daughter, at her request

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/09/07/ann-whalen-abortion-daughter_n_5777120.html

Mother arrested for taking her 13 year old daughter for abortion after she was raped

http://www.wildabouttrial.com/one_off/mother-indicted-after-taking-sexual-assault-victim-daughter-to-have-abortion/

Pregnant woman arrested for falling down stairs

http://www.portlandmercury.com/BlogtownPDX/archives/2010/03/02/woman-in-iowa-arrested-for-falling-down-the-stairs-while-pregnant

http://www.alternet.org/civil-liberties/arrested-having-miscarriage-7-appalling-instances-where-pregnant-women-were

http://www.thenation.com/article/women-are-being-arrested-and-jailed-self-abortion/

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/woman-arrested-on-murder-charges-after-reportedly-taking-abortion-pills-10309979.html

http://www.thejournal.ie/georgia-abortion-pill-charged-2152460-Jun2015/

http://www.newrepublic.com/article/politics/magazine/111368/the-rise-diy-abortions

http://www.newrepublic.com/article/politics/magazine/111368/the-rise-diy-abortions

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Response to cui bono (Reply #11)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 07:40 PM

16. The entire constitution is under attack

 

1st, 2nd. 14th and many more. We're I. Trouble in this country.

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Response to yeoman6987 (Reply #16)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 08:03 PM

19. Well, the 2nd is really a GOP problem. I wouldn't mind it going away.

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Response to ncjustice80 (Reply #19)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 09:10 PM

22. Well I'm sure. And after that goes it will be easier to get

 

rid of others. You know the old saying be careful what you wish for. It may happen.

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Response to yeoman6987 (Reply #22)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 09:42 PM

25. Slavery was once a constitutional right as well, and I don't see anyone missing that.

Slippery slope is a logical fallacy.

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Response to ncjustice80 (Reply #25)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 11:00 PM

26. Not comparable but thanks for the effort

 

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Response to gollygee (Original post)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 04:42 PM

12. So when are these personhood laws

 

going to make male masturbation illegal? After all, they are killing literally MILLIONS of unborn babies!

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Response to gollygee (Original post)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 05:19 PM

13. It's revolting how much the GOP HATES HATES HATES women. I wonder if any men go to prison

for this shit.

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Response to gollygee (Original post)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 08:03 PM

18. Wow, disgusting.

What states did this happen in? is there any kind of legal defense fund for these poor women?

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