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JohnyCanuck

(9,922 posts)
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 07:21 AM Oct 2015

The Sea Gypsy Philosopher: The Machine is not Your Friend

The self-described "itinerant philosopher" and sailor Ray Jason has a revelation while taking shelter from an approaching tropical gale in the lee of a small island.

The Machine is not Your Friend


Tribal peoples understood that we are intimately linked to those realms and they paid homage to them in their rituals and in their daily existence. For example, the Plains Indians didn’t just see the buffalo as a protein source; they revered it as an important strand in the web of life. And they used the entire animal to aid in their survival – the meat, hide and bones.

But modern civilized peoples have lost their reverence for the natural and the wild. They have let themselves evolve into creatures that are artificial and tame. They are no longer Children of the Earth – they are Servants of the Machine. Their partners in the dance of life are smart phones, talking automobiles and computers.

They can’t grow their food, mend a garment, build a shelter or read the weather from the signals in the sky. But they will justify this impotence by claiming that modern technology frees them up to pursue more meaningful activities. Like what? Mounting a camera to your hat and filming the sad emptiness that is urban living? Now there is an evolutionary leap forward.

The creators of these myriad devices, which dominate the human-built world, will claim that they are designed to save you time and money and exertion. But their real purpose is to turn you into a product addict - and to reap obscene profits while doing so. How else does one explain lines of people camping out to buy a slightly better phone than the one they bought a year earlier? At least they can now video each other with their GoPros as they shiver in their sidewalk lunacy.

More: http://theseagypsyphilosopher.blogspot.com/2015/09/the-machine-is-not-your-friend.html
57 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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The Sea Gypsy Philosopher: The Machine is not Your Friend (Original Post) JohnyCanuck Oct 2015 OP
So only Ray Jason can see the Matrix. The rest of us are just stupid. randome Oct 2015 #1
Not stupid, just hypnotized. zeemike Oct 2015 #18
And I would agree with that. randome Oct 2015 #19
But I don't think that is what he was saying. zeemike Oct 2015 #22
''Servants of the Machine'' Octafish Oct 2015 #2
As posted on blogspot! Nuclear Unicorn Oct 2015 #3
If you don't have a machine (boat, plane, 4WD) how do you get to that place of wild contentment? leveymg Oct 2015 #4
To get to the place of wild contentment you have to walk. nt bemildred Oct 2015 #6
I don't walk on water. leveymg Oct 2015 #7
That works too. nt bemildred Oct 2015 #24
Sometimes less is more. bemildred Oct 2015 #5
I agree that simpler is better. leveymg Oct 2015 #8
I've read it many times. It is one of a handfull I keep going back to. bemildred Oct 2015 #9
As a 30 year programmer ('software engineer' is just to make people feel better IMO) I bet..... Logical Oct 2015 #11
And they would be right too. bemildred Oct 2015 #13
Technology is a means to an end. As someone who worked a summer in one of the first computer plants leveymg Oct 2015 #14
I'm not against technology, like Pirsig I'm against bad technology. bemildred Oct 2015 #15
Bad technology can be improved. That's the redeeming joy of hot rods, and leveymg Oct 2015 #16
Yes, I spent a lot of time doing exactly that, and I wish they'd let me do it more. bemildred Oct 2015 #17
Having a sense of purpose is key to making things work, macro or micro. The rest is leveymg Oct 2015 #25
Yes. bemildred Oct 2015 #32
Quality Octafish Oct 2015 #35
Well, this is weird to me. Advancement in technology is a great thing. nt Logical Oct 2015 #10
Technology Is An Illusion Designed To Ensnare Belief In A Future That Will Never Unfold cantbeserious Oct 2015 #37
Yes, I miss the days when infections and the plague killed millions. nt Logical Oct 2015 #38
Sarcastic Answer Misses The Point - Modern Industrial Society Runs On Oil - No Technology cantbeserious Oct 2015 #39
So you think solar or wind will never be able to replace oil? nt Logical Oct 2015 #44
All Reliable Estimates Indicate That To Be The Case cantbeserious Oct 2015 #45
Do you realize how future technology predictions have been totally incorrect? nt Logical Oct 2015 #47
No Amount Of Solar And Wind Can Replace The The Energy Stored And Used From Oli cantbeserious Oct 2015 #48
LOL....... Logical Oct 2015 #49
Obviously, One Has Not Done Their Own Reserach And Is Depending On Media Anecdotes cantbeserious Oct 2015 #50
ok, keep up your make believe! I bet on technology! Nt Logical Oct 2015 #51
No Make Believe - Hard Science - Let Us Know How Denial Works For One In 20 Years cantbeserious Oct 2015 #52
Here's another for you...... Logical Oct 2015 #53
Misses The Point Entirely - Our Industrial Society Is On A Collision Course cantbeserious Oct 2015 #54
OK someone Sent me a DU mail and told me you're just fucking with us.... Logical Oct 2015 #55
Very Serious - Good Luck With Your Denial cantbeserious Oct 2015 #56
You cannot run a modern military machine on renewable power. bemildred Oct 2015 #46
dude your on teh internets eShirl Oct 2015 #40
Dude - What's Your Point cantbeserious Oct 2015 #41
your irony, eom eShirl Oct 2015 #42
No Irony Here - Faith In Technology Is A Fool's Errand cantbeserious Oct 2015 #43
He wrote, on his computer. Brickbat Oct 2015 #12
That's the same sentiment about Al Gore flying on planes to talk about climate change too The2ndWheel Oct 2015 #20
I think your assertion is kind of a reach. Brickbat Oct 2015 #30
Have you ever tried to find a quill pen? nt LiberalElite Oct 2015 #26
That requires ink. Real enlightened people make marks in the dirt with their finger. /nt Marr Oct 2015 #29
If you can't find one, MAKE ONE. Brickbat Oct 2015 #31
A lot of "children of the earth" never made it into adulthood aikoaiko Oct 2015 #21
self-important jackass CBGLuthier Oct 2015 #23
What I Do Is Important. What You Do Is Meaningless. MineralMan Oct 2015 #27
I'm about to blow your mind. Marr Oct 2015 #28
See Also The ArchDruidReport For Related Musings About The Western Descent To Simpler Sustainable Life cantbeserious Oct 2015 #33
+1000 nt Mojorabbit Oct 2015 #36
See Also "Of Two Minds" Blog About How The System Ensnares And Enslaves cantbeserious Oct 2015 #34
. snagglepuss Oct 2015 #57
 

randome

(34,845 posts)
1. So only Ray Jason can see the Matrix. The rest of us are just stupid.
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 07:36 AM
Oct 2015

There is something to be said for an appreciation of the natural. But there is a reason the species as a whole has progressed to other concerns.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]Precision and concision. That's the game.[/center][/font][hr]

zeemike

(18,998 posts)
18. Not stupid, just hypnotized.
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 10:06 AM
Oct 2015

It is after a shiny things that twirls in front of our face all the time.
When we spend most of our day watching a picture on a screen as a substitute for the real world what else would you expect?

 

randome

(34,845 posts)
19. And I would agree with that.
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 10:12 AM
Oct 2015

He seems to be taking things too far and, coincidentally, in the direction where he is already situated, thereby self-proving his own thesis. Everyone should be more like me is how it comes across.

Now if he had stated things the way you did, I wouldn't be so dismissive.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]Precision and concision. That's the game.[/center][/font][hr]

zeemike

(18,998 posts)
22. But I don't think that is what he was saying.
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 10:40 AM
Oct 2015

That we should be more like him.

I think what he was doing is pointing out what we have lost...our humanity and the recognition of the natural world...replaced with shiny things, that if and when they fail will leave us helpless.

Octafish

(55,745 posts)
2. ''Servants of the Machine''
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 08:08 AM
Oct 2015

People who serve it, don't even know it. The few who who gain from it, will never mention it.

"What is man without the beasts? For if all the beast were gone, man would die of a great loneliness of the spirit." -- Chief Seattle


And that is where we are arrived.

Thank you, JohnyCanuck, for a most important read and OP.

bemildred

(90,061 posts)
5. Sometimes less is more.
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 08:54 AM
Oct 2015

And that definitely applies to technology, 90% or more of which is overpriced and over-marketed crap.

leveymg

(36,418 posts)
8. I agree that simpler is better.
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 09:06 AM
Oct 2015

And, there is pleasure and oneness with the universe in building and fixing it yourself. Read, "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance".

A set of tools and the ability to use them is necessary, useful, and good.

bemildred

(90,061 posts)
9. I've read it many times. It is one of a handfull I keep going back to.
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 09:10 AM
Oct 2015

I spent 20+ years as a software engineer, reading and fixing other peoples shiny code, and I know that most of it is crap.

 

Logical

(22,457 posts)
11. As a 30 year programmer ('software engineer' is just to make people feel better IMO) I bet.....
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 09:13 AM
Oct 2015

many coders think your code is crap also.

bemildred

(90,061 posts)
13. And they would be right too.
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 09:20 AM
Oct 2015

It takes a long time and a lot of effort and skilz to make it not crap. Most of the time you don't get that, it's all about getting it out the door before someone else does.

leveymg

(36,418 posts)
14. Technology is a means to an end. As someone who worked a summer in one of the first computer plants
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 09:25 AM
Oct 2015

in America -- they called them minis at the time, but they were the size of wall bookcases, and didn't store any more data -- I know what they can and can't do for us. Personally, I used my earnings and bought my first car, which I could and did rebuild, myself.

I still get more pleasure from the car. Virtually identical to this one ('67 Mustang Fastback GT) but with a lot of Shelby parts and go-faster mods. Primative cheap thrills:

bemildred

(90,061 posts)
15. I'm not against technology, like Pirsig I'm against bad technology.
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 09:29 AM
Oct 2015

"Quality", right? You cannot maximize both profit and quality, and we all know which one we choose here these days.

leveymg

(36,418 posts)
16. Bad technology can be improved. That's the redeeming joy of hot rods, and
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 09:37 AM
Oct 2015

wooden boat rebuilding. I also worked on and sailed some of these (dangerously, and lived to talk about it):



I guess I'm just a survivor of my youth. Physics had consequences.

bemildred

(90,061 posts)
17. Yes, I spent a lot of time doing exactly that, and I wish they'd let me do it more.
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 10:05 AM
Oct 2015

Never had to worry about getting fired or layed off either. Most programmers can read and understand their own code, if it's not been too long, but guys who can read and repair other peoples code are a different matter, especially memory management errors and that kind of thing, or IP issues, sockets and asynch processing. I'm running on Ubuntu 14.04 right now and one of the things that annoys me about it is they fucked with the user interface again (they love to play with user interfaces because it's easy to get effects people can see) and screwed up the asynch processing, so it stalls.

They kept trying to kick me upstairs or make me a manager and that was the one thing that caused me to find a different job.

And I like to fix cars and build my own computers and repair the flame hood over my stove too.

I went all the way through math and computer science and came out the other side, and I loved Pirsig all the way. "The high country of the mind".

I see you are a boat person, I am not but I approve.

leveymg

(36,418 posts)
25. Having a sense of purpose is key to making things work, macro or micro. The rest is
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 11:05 AM
Oct 2015

formula, rote, intuition and the ability to connect ideas into a cohesive plan. This applies to carrying out any complex operation from systems architecture, to writing a legal brief, to navigating a boat (or a plane) from point A to point B using instruments or the stars.

Reliance upon machines without understanding how they work, and losing the ability to do things without automation, makes people less human. It's like dogs who rely on humans versus wolves in the wild. They're more manageable, but become less competent as intelligent beings. I'm afraid we're losing that ability in many areas of our lives.

cantbeserious

(13,039 posts)
37. Technology Is An Illusion Designed To Ensnare Belief In A Future That Will Never Unfold
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 12:42 PM
Oct 2015

Read The ArchDruidReport for much discussion on the limitations of technology and the religious belief that it can save the human race.

cantbeserious

(13,039 posts)
39. Sarcastic Answer Misses The Point - Modern Industrial Society Runs On Oil - No Technology
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 03:49 PM
Oct 2015

Will replace the energy source that makes modern life possible.

cantbeserious

(13,039 posts)
48. No Amount Of Solar And Wind Can Replace The The Energy Stored And Used From Oli
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 10:21 PM
Oct 2015

In other words, modern industrial society, as we know it today, is not possible on a diet of wind and solar alone.

Such would be the impact of the loss of oil to our western standard of living.

 

Logical

(22,457 posts)
49. LOL.......
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 10:43 PM
Oct 2015

After their 1901 test season Wilbur says: “Not within a thousand years will man ever fly"

People like you have underestimated technology,

If you need hundreds and hundreds more quotes like that let me know,

cantbeserious

(13,039 posts)
50. Obviously, One Has Not Done Their Own Reserach And Is Depending On Media Anecdotes
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 11:15 PM
Oct 2015

Of a cornucopia future with never ending bounty and riches.

 

Logical

(22,457 posts)
53. Here's another for you......
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 11:46 PM
Oct 2015

In the early 1940s, IBM's president, Thomas J Watson, reputedly said: "I think there is a world market for about five computers."

You would of agreed with him! LOL, maybe still do???

cantbeserious

(13,039 posts)
54. Misses The Point Entirely - Our Industrial Society Is On A Collision Course
Mon Oct 5, 2015, 12:08 AM
Oct 2015

With a future that has much less Oil available to make and run all those gadgets one is obviously fond of.

Good luck with ones continued denial.

 

Logical

(22,457 posts)
55. OK someone Sent me a DU mail and told me you're just fucking with us....
Mon Oct 5, 2015, 12:10 AM
Oct 2015

I guess I fell for it and seem pretty gullible now.

Good one!!!!

bemildred

(90,061 posts)
46. You cannot run a modern military machine on renewable power.
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 06:26 PM
Oct 2015

It takes one heck of a lot of portable energy/fuel to run a war, that's the problem. It's not like just pumping it out in the quantity desired. And power generation will be a problem too, not that there is not enough power, but that it is dispersed and must be collected if you want a lot of it. So the end of cheap fossil fuel will force return to a lower energy state, not necessarily nothing, but a need to be more frugal with it, and much more trouble to get enough to fly an aircraft or other big machines. We won't be able to waste it. It will become precious.

Many wars have been fought over oil, and that is why, for the modern military it is existential.

The2ndWheel

(7,947 posts)
20. That's the same sentiment about Al Gore flying on planes to talk about climate change too
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 10:29 AM
Oct 2015

Or how poor Americans, who in relation to other poor people around the world do have more stuff, shouldn't be complaining so much.

As with everything in life, if you agree with it, you can justify it. If you don't agree with it, you can find a way to not justify it.

Brickbat

(19,339 posts)
30. I think your assertion is kind of a reach.
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 11:28 AM
Oct 2015

But I will grant you that my throwaway line in response to his dripping contempt for others wasn't necessarily productive.

aikoaiko

(34,162 posts)
21. A lot of "children of the earth" never made it into adulthood
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 10:30 AM
Oct 2015

For all the problems we have today life was more brutish, nastier, and shorter in his imagined pre-technological age.

MineralMan

(146,254 posts)
27. What I Do Is Important. What You Do Is Meaningless.
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 11:18 AM
Oct 2015

That seems to be what is expressed in this excerpt. Technology began with humans flaking chips off stones to make tools. Technology began with planting seeds in holes made with a pointed stick.

Technology, of one sort or another, is the story of human history. The assumptions of that writer that users of technology cannot go back to an earlier technology is specious. I can do all of the tasks that person describes, and have done them. All of them require technology of one sort. To grow you own food, you need tools, whether a pointed stick or a tractor. To mend a garment, you first need a garment, which was created from materials created on a loom or cut from an animal's hide with tools, and then you need a needle. To build a shelter of any value, you need tools, including for a simple lean-to in the woods. The only skill this person mentioned that requires no technology is reading the weather by looking at the sky.

Technology has value to humans. Technology is needed by humans. It is not the exact technology that matters. It is how the technology is used by humans that makes the difference. That writer is not getting it, as he or she types on a keyboard to create the essay. Not getting it at all. He or she is saying: "What I Do Is Important. What You Do Is Meaningless."

Silliness.

cantbeserious

(13,039 posts)
34. See Also "Of Two Minds" Blog About How The System Ensnares And Enslaves
Sun Oct 4, 2015, 12:36 PM
Oct 2015

Liberation Is Unprofitable

12 examples of how liberation is not profitable and therefore it must be marginalized, outlawed, proscribed or ridiculed.

If we had to summarize the sickness of our economy and society, we could start by noting that liberation is unprofitable, and whatever is not profitable to vested interests is marginalized, outlawed, proscribed or ridiculed. Examples of this abound.

Liberation from digital communication servitude is not profitable. Don't have a smart phone on 18 hours a day, every day? Loser! Luddite! Liberation from digital communication servitude is not profitable, therefore it is ridiculed.

Liberation from debt is not profitable. Only the wealthy can afford to buy a vehicle without debt, a home without debt or a university education without debt. For everyone else, liberation from debt is not an option, because debt is highly profitable to our financial Overlords and the politicos they buy/own.

Snip ...

http://charleshughsmith.blogspot.com/2015/06/liberation-is-unprofitable.html

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