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Wed Nov 25, 2015, 03:48 PM

Taibbi: America Is Too Dumb for TV News

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/america-is-too-dumb-for-tv-news-20151125

<snip>

This is a horrible thing to have to say about one's own country, but this story makes it official. America is now too dumb for TV news.

It's our fault. We in the media have spent decades turning the news into a consumer business that's basically indistinguishable from selling cheeseburgers or video games. You want bigger margins, you just cram the product full of more fat and sugar and violence and wait for your obese, over-stimulated customer to come waddling forth.

The old Edward R. Murrow, eat-your-broccoli version of the news was banished long ago. Once such whiny purists were driven from editorial posts and the ad people over the last four or five decades got invited in, things changed. Then it was nothing but murders, bombs, and panda births, delivered to thickening couch potatoes in ever briefer blasts of forty, thirty, twenty seconds.

What we call right-wing and liberal media in this country are really just two different strategies of the same kind of nihilistic lizard-brain sensationalism. The ideal CNN story is a baby down a well, while the ideal Fox story is probably a baby thrown down a well by a Muslim terrorist or an ACORN activist. Both companies offer the same service, it's just that the Fox version is a little kinkier.

<snip>

101 replies, 18670 views

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Arrow 101 replies Author Time Post
Reply Taibbi: America Is Too Dumb for TV News (Original post)
Fumesucker Nov 2015 OP
mindwalker_i Nov 2015 #1
hifiguy Nov 2015 #6
Thespian2 Nov 2015 #35
erronis Nov 2015 #41
hifiguy Nov 2015 #43
elljay Nov 2015 #96
Electric Monk Nov 2015 #2
hifiguy Nov 2015 #7
navarth Nov 2015 #12
Snotcicles Nov 2015 #30
valerief Nov 2015 #74
AlbertCat Nov 2015 #88
Marr Nov 2015 #65
Maedhros Nov 2015 #40
yuiyoshida Nov 2015 #3
KamaAina Nov 2015 #4
FairWinds Nov 2015 #17
guyton Nov 2015 #19
erronis Nov 2015 #45
valerief Nov 2015 #76
Samantha Nov 2015 #62
Enthusiast Nov 2015 #75
elias49 Nov 2015 #77
fasttense Nov 2015 #90
hatrack Nov 2015 #93
guyton Nov 2015 #99
Samantha Nov 2015 #100
hifiguy Nov 2015 #5
NRaleighLiberal Nov 2015 #23
hifiguy Nov 2015 #25
NRaleighLiberal Nov 2015 #32
hifiguy Nov 2015 #34
LineLineLineLineLineLineReply .
NRaleighLiberal Nov 2015 #36
erronis Nov 2015 #47
hifiguy Nov 2015 #52
leveymg Nov 2015 #33
LuvNewcastle Nov 2015 #50
villager Nov 2015 #26
hifiguy Nov 2015 #28
jwirr Nov 2015 #42
hifiguy Nov 2015 #44
jwirr Nov 2015 #57
hifiguy Nov 2015 #59
jwirr Nov 2015 #60
passiveporcupine Nov 2015 #97
LiberalArkie Nov 2015 #8
hifiguy Nov 2015 #29
Funtatlaguy Nov 2015 #9
Enthusiast Nov 2015 #78
stupidicus Nov 2015 #10
erronis Nov 2015 #48
stupidicus Nov 2015 #51
Wellstone ruled Nov 2015 #11
SharonAnn Nov 2015 #24
erronis Nov 2015 #49
hifiguy Nov 2015 #63
Enthusiast Nov 2015 #81
Moostache Nov 2015 #95
nitpicker Nov 2015 #70
LuvNewcastle Nov 2015 #53
Wellstone ruled Nov 2015 #56
Enthusiast Nov 2015 #82
tech3149 Nov 2015 #85
CrispyQ Nov 2015 #92
Wellstone ruled Nov 2015 #94
bemildred Nov 2015 #13
Guy Whitey Corngood Nov 2015 #14
spooky3 Nov 2015 #15
90-percent Nov 2015 #16
hifiguy Nov 2015 #27
LuvNewcastle Nov 2015 #55
KoKo Nov 2015 #84
Enthusiast Nov 2015 #86
Solly Mack Nov 2015 #18
maxsolomon Nov 2015 #20
reddread Nov 2015 #98
cyberswede Nov 2015 #21
erronis Nov 2015 #54
NRaleighLiberal Nov 2015 #22
rladdi Nov 2015 #31
underpants Nov 2015 #37
ffr Nov 2015 #38
tech3149 Nov 2015 #80
Tab Nov 2015 #39
Octafish Nov 2015 #46
hifiguy Nov 2015 #58
Octafish Nov 2015 #67
hifiguy Nov 2015 #68
colsohlibgal Nov 2015 #61
SadWingsOfDestiny Nov 2015 #64
mike_c Nov 2015 #66
Rex Nov 2015 #69
Scuba Nov 2015 #71
trumad Nov 2015 #72
cantbeserious Nov 2015 #73
tech3149 Nov 2015 #79
Fumesucker Nov 2015 #83
Enthusiast Nov 2015 #87
Hepburn Nov 2015 #89
Not a Fan Nov 2015 #91
raouldukelives Nov 2015 #101

Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 04:28 PM

1. Ouch

The country is heading for voluntary retardation.

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Response to mindwalker_i (Reply #1)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 04:44 PM

6. A do it yourself lobotomy

 

performed with a ball-peen hammer and a wood chisel.

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #6)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 06:32 PM

35. What you said...

Plus several million...



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Response to hifiguy (Reply #6)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 06:49 PM

41. I imagine "Doctor" Bin Carson could do it to himself.

I also couldn't imagine any sentient person agreeing to be under his scalpel (or hammer/chisel).

I don't expect to be alive in the 30-40 years when this can be reviewed as "That Were The Years When ..." but it's either going to be hilarious, or brain-deadening.

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Response to erronis (Reply #41)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 06:51 PM

43. That ship sailed a long time ago for Mental Ben.

 

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Response to erronis (Reply #41)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 03:57 PM

96. I think he already did

I theoretically have about 30-40 years left and, based on my first 56 years, am seeing things only going in one direction. Would love to be proved wrong....

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 04:33 PM

2. I know there are some DUers who dismiss Matt Taibbi with a :rofl: but I like him. K&R nt

 

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Response to Electric Monk (Reply #2)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 04:45 PM

7. They dismiss him because he doesn't carry

 

the official Fan Club Card. There is no other reason to do so.

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #7)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 04:56 PM

12. +1 nt

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #7)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 06:11 PM

30. Matt Taibbi is one of the very best this country has. David Corn with Mother Jones, is another. nt

 

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Response to Snotcicles (Reply #30)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 11:23 AM

74. +1

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Response to valerief (Reply #74)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 12:47 PM

88. +2

 

and now a heartwarming story about an adorable kid....

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #7)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 09:19 PM

65. +1, exactly right. The same people who dismiss him immediately now

 

used to praise his work during the Bush Administration. Their opinion of Taibbi flipped 180 degrees on Obama's inauguration day.

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Response to Electric Monk (Reply #2)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 06:46 PM

40. Anyone who dismisses Taibbi offhand is not using critical thinking skills. [n/t]

 

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 04:40 PM

3. I tossed my TV away long ago...

gave it to someone, who really wanted a TV. The internet is all I need, and judging by the kind of stories I find on the internet, most of those are never covered in this COUNTRY! You have to go find an English speaking site out of country to find real news stories, that aren't about what the Kardashian are wearing this week or get the opinion of a Duck Dynasty wierdo about the Middle East.

Pluuuueaaaaaaaaaase! Our TV sucks so bad.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 04:43 PM

4. Al Gore for instance never really recovered from saying,"I took the initiative in creating the 'Net"

 

True, he never said he invented the Internet, as is popularly believed, but what he did say was clumsy enough that the line followed him around like an STD for the rest of his (largely unsuccessful) political life.



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Response to KamaAina (Reply #4)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 05:24 PM

17. In fact, what Gore said was accurate.

 

Here we have a good example of another sort of media manipulation . .

Ridiculing the truth so that people THINK it is a lie.

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Response to FairWinds (Reply #17)


Response to guyton (Reply #19)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 06:53 PM

45. Yup - I was also there, then (and still am.)

The first IMPs to transmit packets between a very few university/research organizations.

What Al Gore didn't realize at the time is that billions of people would be making use of this. And that some large percentage of those would take advantage of the communications power to misinform so many people that can't think.

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Response to erronis (Reply #45)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 11:26 AM

76. Misinformation and misdirection had already been done by teevee, radio, newspapers,

and mass mailings.

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Response to guyton (Reply #19)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 08:53 PM

62. After the cold war ended, the military and intelligence groups had no need for the Arpanet

Someone in charge suggested it be given to the people. When presented with the opportunity to take charge of this amazing creation, not one legislator was interested in working on the project. Had it not been for Al Gore, who actually was fascinated by the project, that legislation might not have ever been written. And in 1992, he spoke to the American people about the concept of an internet super-highway. I heard that speech.

Al Gore was ridiculed for a number of things by GE (Jack Welch) who despised both Clinton and Gore. Under the Clinton administration, GE had been fined millions of dollars for violating the Clean Water Act. There was no way Welch was going to remain silent while Gore campaigned for the Presidency, and he took the avenue of simply ridiculing Gore for every possible thing he could, with Tim Russert, et al., backing him up.

Sam

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Response to Samantha (Reply #62)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 11:25 AM

75. Thanks.

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Response to Samantha (Reply #62)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 11:27 AM

77. Thanks. nt

 

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Response to Samantha (Reply #62)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 12:55 PM

90. Thanks Sam for the history lesson

 

I know I never believed the BS the corporate media spouted about Gore. Unfortunately it seems even the great Matt T has succumbed to the corporate media's spin on his career.

Afterall he was VP. How Unsuccessful is being VP? And his 2nd career as a spokesman for the planet. I don't know but to me he was very successful.

He even won the vote in 2000. But the Supremes stole it away from him. His real problem was the mistake he made by not fighting the Supremes and the RepubliCONS when they stole his win. I think that is why Matt T sees him as unsuccessful.

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Response to Samantha (Reply #62)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 02:01 PM

93. No one person "invented" the net, but Robert Khan and Vinton Cerf created HTML

And here's what they had to say about Al Gore:

Al Gore and the Internet

By Robert Kahn and Vinton Cerf

Al Gore was the first political leader to recognize the importance of the
Internet and to promote and support its development.

No one person or even small group of persons exclusively "invented" the
Internet. It is the result of many years of ongoing collaboration among
people in government and the university community. But as the two people
who designed the basic architecture and the core protocols that make the
Internet work, we would like to acknowledge VP Gore's contributions as a
Congressman, Senator and as Vice President. No other elected official, to
our knowledge, has made a greater contribution over a longer period of
time.

Last year the Vice President made a straightforward statement on his role.
He said: "During my service in the United States Congress I took the
initiative in creating the Internet." We don't think, as some people have
argued, that Gore intended to claim he "invented" the Internet. Moreover,
there is no question in our minds that while serving as Senator, Gore's
initiatives had a significant and beneficial effect on the still-evolving
Internet. The fact of the matter is that Gore was talking about and
promoting the Internet long before most people were listening. We feel it
is timely to offer our perspective.

As far back as the 1970s Congressman Gore promoted the idea of high speed
telecommunications as an engine for both economic growth and the
improvement of our educational system. He was the first elected official
to grasp the potential of computer communications to have a broader impact
than just improving the conduct of science and scholarship. Though easily
forgotten, now, at the time this was an unproven and controversial
concept. Our work on the Internet started in 1973 and was based on even
earlier work that took place in the mid-late 1960s. But the Internet, as
we know it today, was not deployed until 1983. When the Internet was still
in the early stages of its deployment, Congressman Gore provided
intellectual leadership by helping create the vision of the potential
benefits of high speed computing and communication. As an example, he
sponsored hearings on how advanced technologies might be put to use in
areas like coordinating the response of government agencies to natural
disasters and other crises.

EDIT

http://web.eecs.umich.edu/~fessler/misc/funny/gore,net.txt

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Response to hatrack (Reply #93)


Response to hatrack (Reply #93)

Fri Nov 27, 2015, 03:32 AM

100. It was a complex evolution over a long period of time

Last edited Fri Nov 27, 2015, 11:08 AM - Edit history (1)

I previously read some time ago a military historian's statement about Gore's involvement with the creation of what we call today the Internet. I could not find that this evening, but I did start reading another interesting article that I will quote from here:

Gore's 1986 bill called for a study of the possibility of creating fiber optic links to supercomputer centers, requiring the White House Office of Science and Technology Policy (OSTP) to issue a report on the subject. Though references differ on whether Gore's 1986 bill was ever actually passed, the report it called for was issued in November of 1987. It expressed concern that the U.S. was falling behind Europe and Japan in the development of supercomputers and high speed networks, and recommended creation of a program to advance research in those areas.

Gore's 1988, 1989, and 1991 bills were attempts to create such a program. During this period the White House was reluctant to do so, but in early 1991, just before the Gore Bill finally passed, the White House proposed in its budget to fund a High Performance Computing and Communications Program. Gore's 1991 bill defined that program and authorized spending more than a billion dollars over the next five years on supercomputing and network projects. This funding was mostly under the control of the NSF, but also parts also went to DARPA and NIST.

These efforts contributed substantially to allowing NSFNET to grow into the modern Internet. Interesting discussions of their significance can be found in a 1992 paper advocating further expansion of the net, 1993 testimony from the head of OSTP, and Vinton Cerf's description of the evolution of the Internet. All give Gore primary credit for this legislation, and stress it's importance in the development of the Internet. (emphasis added)


from: http://greatgreenroom.org/cgi-bin/bt/backtalk/wasabi/begin?item=11

The point I was trying to make, but which I seemed to have done clumsily, was that when this shall I say communication tool was no longer needed at the end of the Cold War, when the question was asked "what shall we do with this?" - the answer was "give it to the people." We the people were able to accept it and to build it from what it was then to what it is now because one person had a keen interest in this area and agreed to write the legislation creating what eventually came to be referred to as "the Internet."

This is a very long article about Gore which might interest many DU'ers.

Sam

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 04:43 PM

5. I am actually beginning to believe that

 

this country may in fact be doomed.

Perhaps it's for the best, and the rational people and the lizard people can reform into separate and mutually exclusive societies.

The fascism is out in the open on one side and hiding behind a happy-face mask on the other. We now live in a completely surrealistic and arational society.

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #5)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 05:44 PM

23. the world - well, at least human beings mach current - are doomed.

only question is how long we will last. We seem to be an evolutionary dead end, but who knows.

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Response to NRaleighLiberal (Reply #23)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 05:58 PM

25. i don't think the species is doomed.

 

Quite yet. Homo sapiens is a remarkably persistent and adaptive species.

But as a species we are going to set ourselves back 500-1000 years with the current playbook. This may be one of those "burning of the Alexandrian library" periods, though it is possible that greedheads or religulous lunatics may unleash a nuclear holocaust in which case all bets are off the table.

Next time the "holy books" of fairy tales should be burned first and we can try again with science, reason and logic as our guiding lights.

We're a pretty mixed bag as a species. The same genotype that has given us Plato, Euclid, Eratosthenes, Aeschylus, Lao Tzu, the Buddha, Confucius, Leonardo, Michelangelo, Hokusai, Bach, Mozart, Beethoven, Shakespeare, Goethe, Kurosawa, Newton, Einstein and Mandela has also vomited up Chinghiz Khan, Attila the Hun, the Spanish Inquisition, Ivan the Terrible, Vlad the Impaler, Stalin, Hitler, Mao, Pol Pot, Henry Kissinger, ISIL and the Bush Crime Family.

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #25)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 06:25 PM

32. all well said. The issue is that in our species is such an affinity for greed, power, deceit

of course, as you allude to, there is also great potential for intellect, creativity and compassion.

Quite the mixed bag, that's for sure.

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Response to NRaleighLiberal (Reply #32)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 06:30 PM

34. That's because we are apes.

 

Hairless apes with big brains, but still apes with reptile sections at the bottom our brains.

Someday we'll live on Venus, men will walk on Mars
But we will still be monkeys down deep inside
If chimpanzees are smart then we will close our eyes
And let our instincts guide us, oh oh oh oh no.

- David Byrne "The Facts of Life"

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #34)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 06:32 PM

36. .

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #34)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 06:57 PM

47. What a fantastic exchange. However since it mirrors my own - you are both doomed!

Just like me and most rational people.

Only the crazies will ascend to their heaven and we'll be left with a rational world.

I wish them well (NOT).

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Response to erronis (Reply #47)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 07:07 PM

52. I wish they'd blow their brains out (voluntarily, of course

 

and only a pea shooter would be needed) and get the hell on their way.

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #25)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 06:25 PM

33. I mostly agree. We have peaked and will revert to a pretty miserable type of "nasty, mean & short"

life in some not too distant dark age. Afterwards, civilization will regroup, rebuild and reach another unsustainable "golden age", only to again whither away or be conquered every thousand years or so. That cycle has happened four or five times, so far.

We'll get the sort of collapse we deserve.

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #25)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 07:01 PM

50. Well said.

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #5)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 06:02 PM

26. Our country, as such, will break into smaller constituent polities by mid-century or so....

 

..due to the pressures exerted from within (irreconcilable factions) and without (climate change, end of cheap energy, no way to maintain empire).

So some of those constituent parts will be an "evolution" compared to what we have now. Others, of course, quite the opposite...

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Response to villager (Reply #26)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 06:08 PM

28. I very much agree.

 

And I hope the civilized state, which I believe will be a democratic socialist one, will zealously guard against infiltration by the reactionaries, religulous nitwits and other assorted stupids/evolutionary throwbacks. With machine guns if necessary. The humanitarian impulse does not require the entry into a suicide pact.

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #28)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 06:50 PM

42. This is why I am so glad to see the young turning to Bernie.

Maybe they can survive together instead of as individualists. One is the democratic socialist while the other is greed in motion. ME ME ME.

The young seem to be rejecting the gated community for the good of all.

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Response to jwirr (Reply #42)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 06:53 PM

44. Here's a great article discussing the issues you bring up.

 

Well worth a read and a think. Henry Giroux is one smart cookie.

http://www.counterpunch.org/2015/09/18/donald-trump-and-the-ghosts-of-totalitarianism/

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #44)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 07:47 PM

57. I read it and you have read it. Who else is reading this? Are

they teaching this in any colleges?

We need to counter this dumbing down but how are we to do that?

How is this article and the notes after it being used today.

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Response to jwirr (Reply #57)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 08:04 PM

59. I did an OP with excerpts and a link

 

and it sank like an anchor. Sigh.

Its just one of his blog posts. His long-form writing has to be magnificent.

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #59)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 08:10 PM

60. That is what I was afraid of. When I went to college they

would have used his writing in a philosophy class but I am not sure anyone would today as it is long and detailed. Part of the dumbing down I guess.

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #5)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 06:19 PM

97. I'm just waiting for Yellowstone to blow.

Then we won't have to worry any more.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 04:47 PM

8. Just remember that time travel is real. Someone went to the future and brought back

the documentary "Idiocracy".

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Response to LiberalArkie (Reply #8)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 06:09 PM

29. Like all great satirists,

 

Judge cast present society into a different time period to illuminate the insanity of the now.

That film becomes more prophetic every day.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 04:51 PM

9. We have been purposely dumbed down

How else would we accept W as President....twice.
Everything is aimed at keeping us mind numbingly entertained. Not informed.
News Divisions were, at one time, purposely exempt from being profit centers.
Once this changed, reporting and editorial lost any distinction.
Now, we have only advocacy "journalism" profit centers under the banners of fewer and fewer mega monopolies.

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Response to Funtatlaguy (Reply #9)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 11:34 AM

78. We didn't accept him. Either time.

Those that stood to profit from 9/11 and the wars made sure he took the oath of office but Bush lost the elections.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 04:52 PM

10. well, who but TV news do we blame for this sad condition?

 

eom

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Response to stupidicus (Reply #10)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 06:59 PM

48. Trick question, right? Blame the people that buy the products sold on those show?

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Response to erronis (Reply #48)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 07:04 PM

51. hardly

 

killing the criminally stupid "liberal" media myth has long been a desire of mine

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 04:55 PM

11. When Ted Turner was tossed out

 

of CNN,that seemed to be the moment the so called Media did their death spiral. You could see the change to what I can the Advertisement Model,story length was shortened and void of any background,and with the fairness doctrine scraped by Saint Ronnie the Fake,we started to see and hear personal editorials by on air talents. And the rest is History.

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Response to Wellstone ruled (Reply #11)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 05:54 PM

24. And there's very little international news, or even "real" news.

I think there are some countries other than the United States on this earth, but I rarely hear of them any longer unless it is somehow a United States story that brings mention of them.

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Response to SharonAnn (Reply #24)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 07:01 PM

49. Please tune in to AlJazeer or Reuters or BBC or CBC

It is so easy to get real world news without using US outlets (effluents).

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Response to erronis (Reply #49)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 08:57 PM

63. AJA is very nearly BBC-level in every way.

 

Absolutely first rate.

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #63)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 12:10 PM

81. Superior to all US domestic options.

Of course the RightiesŪ can always dismiss it as Muslim propaganda.

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Response to erronis (Reply #49)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 02:39 PM

95. 100% agree...AJA and BBC are the only networks doing even remotely "journalism" on TV.

The networks like One America, Fox, CNBC, MSNBC and the rest are corporate feces piles with on-air monkeys to fling it at each other.
There is no reason to watch any of that crap unless you do not have a local zoo in driving distance to watch monkeys fling poo in person.

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Response to SharonAnn (Reply #24)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 06:33 AM

70. Fortunately, I live in the DC area

The local MHZ lineup features state-sponsored programming from China, Russia, Japan, Germany, France, etc.

And one PBS TV station airs BBC news at suppertime.

And the 4 am network news shows aren't half bad...(ha ha)

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Response to Wellstone ruled (Reply #11)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 07:12 PM

53. Someone should write a book about the similarities

and differences between Ted Turner and Donald Trump. I think that could be the source of a lot of analogies to explain how the media has changed in the last 30-40 years.

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Response to LuvNewcastle (Reply #53)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 07:34 PM

56. Kinda nailed it with the analogy.

 

Great comparison. Really miss CBC,used to get it on Dish,when we lived in the Midwest. One would think people would hunger for real news,but the truth is,our Nation has gone dumb and dumber.

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Response to Wellstone ruled (Reply #56)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 12:12 PM

82. Dumb and dumber is clearly the objective.

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Response to Wellstone ruled (Reply #11)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 12:16 PM

85. I think your timeline is about right but you missed an important fact

CBS at about the same time decided that the news department had to be profitable. During that same period print media was being bought out by "investors" that expected a return and couldn't give two squats about informing the public.
I wish I had the money to support all those independent real journalists that actually give us something resembling real information.

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Response to Wellstone ruled (Reply #11)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 01:48 PM

92. This. ^^^

"Fair and balanced." Like both sides are always equal. Bullshit.

Real journalists investigate the pros & cons of the issues & present both sides. They aren't afraid to say that one side doesn't add up. I'm sick of the "democrats do it too" crap that has passed on the "news" for 20 some years, now. The hypocrisy in how they report on repubs vs. dems is boggling. If the democratic candidates had complained that the debate questions were too hard, they would have been the laughing stock of the media. That the media even takes the repub clown car seriously, tells everything about how far they have fallen.

The entire system is so compromised with everything-for-profit & the greed heads are in control. I don't know if we can get it back before they ruin everything. Not one major power/organization is doing anything of scope about climate change.

Sometimes I think as a collective we might be going insane.

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Response to CrispyQ (Reply #92)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 02:36 PM

94. And the crowd goes wild.

 

Had a Poly Sci Prof at the School of Higher Learning make this statement,the art of Politics is,convincing the other Guy that your ideas are better than his in making Society a better place to live. And that was in the early sixties. And he also said,there are a hand full of very wealthy folks who will do what ever is necessary to protect and enhance their families positions within our Nation. What is so profound is,he was a Norwegian University Professor,doing a visiting fellowship.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 04:58 PM

13. Yes, it is 100% marketing crap at this point.

Even the "shows" are marketing crap.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 05:09 PM

14. Yay!!! Take that 20th century USA!!! IN YOUR FACE!!!!! nt

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 05:19 PM

15. Matt, I was with you until you complained about pandas.

Squee is always exempt.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 05:22 PM

16. It's the Oligarch's, dummy!

I'm a boomer from the mid 50's. In hindsight, Mad magazine educated me on the evil horrors of advertising and commercialism, so that grew into a little above average critical thinking skills. Frank Zappa also helped. Been studying the man for 43 years.

And I try to practice my citizenship obligations any way I can. Mostly as a keyboard warrior, which is pretty insipid. So I'm part of a Church that had a group get together for a "talent night". I don't have any talent worth an audience of humans, so I offered to discuss the TPP as my "talent" The reaction was negative, so I thought I'd be going only for the chips and dips. But, then, they made everybody at the party display their talent. Well, mine happened to be lecturing extemporaneously about the TPP, with no outline or prep what so ever. (I don't think good on my feet, so an outline, bullet points, to look at while you talk is a tool to cover the subject deeper and completely)

And I mention this because I feel the TPP and the political leaders that support it, are the END GAME for some kind of Authoritarian, fascist, corporatist, totalitarian NEW WORLD ORDER. I think the orders were given after the 2000 Election, where the Oligarch's learned they could pull off a big lie and get away with murder. Then it escalated with the Iraq invasion lies, to the point where they learned they could lie with impunity about going to war, so there was nothing so venal and preposterous and openly corrupt they couldn't do if they wanted to.



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Response to 90-percent (Reply #16)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 06:03 PM

27. MAD also subverted me on a very deep level.

 

Trust nothing in the mass media was its message and brother, did I take that to heart. Big Zappa fan here, as well.

And Carlin was the Great American Truth Teller of his generation.

The downfall began after WW II when Allen Dulles brought many unreconstructed Nazis to the US and seeded them through what became the Deep/Permanent Government because TPTB of the 20s and 30s thought Nazi Germany was the bright shining wave the future. The US oligarchy very much admired the way Hitler and Mussolini did business - let money run free and crush the proletarians. That has ALWAYS been the wet dream of the American Oligarchy. And now they have it within their reach.

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Response to 90-percent (Reply #16)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 07:31 PM

55. In the old days, real knowledge was able

to be obtained if a person had the intelligence to find it. Nowadays, what most Americans know about the world is the equivalent of teenagers sitting around on the couch discussing this person and that person. Our news is just a series of conversations about whether we should like this person or not.

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Response to 90-percent (Reply #16)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 12:13 PM

84. ...! And the Wall Street Bailout was another signal...

that Power of the People was finally gone. Treasury Secretary Hank Paulson reportedly on his knees begging Pelosi to bail out the banks. And Congress did. Who could have imagined that?

Follow that with the "Citizens United" decision by the Supremes and their recent gutting of crucial parts of the Civil Rights protecting citizen's voting rights and add in our now endless Wars and Interventions we are near the final takeover. If you throw in Climate Change it's a dark time for those of us who've been around long enough to observe it all taking place.

Still...its important to try to stay hopeful. Those of us who've observed it have to to what we can to educate and inform and keep working for change.

Thanks for your post on your own efforts.
'



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Response to 90-percent (Reply #16)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 12:30 PM

86. I think you are very close to he truth with this.

With the demise of the Soviet Union there came a realization of, "Be careful what you wish for." on a massive scale.

The authoritarians had to bring their Iran-Contra mentality to the domestic arena for, despite all their efforts to the contrary, there were no remaining undefeated enemies.

The Oligarch's learned they could get away with absolutely anything. And why not when the system was designed to deal with the entire Soviet empire.

We have watched this ugliness unfold before our eyes since then.



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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 05:24 PM

18. K&R

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 05:29 PM

20. Wait... CNN is Liberal?

THERE IS NO LIBERAL NEWS. not even NPR. Not the NYT.

Maybe Amy Goodman.

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Response to maxsolomon (Reply #20)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 06:24 PM

98. well, some of the US Army Psychop script doctors are Democrats

 

what more do you want?

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 05:36 PM

21. If you listen to Murrow now, you can really see how far we've fallen.





A good dramatization, if you like visuals:

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Response to cyberswede (Reply #21)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 07:13 PM

54. Many thanks for replaying these.

Always appropriate, especially given the current republican talent (cess)pool.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 05:42 PM

22. TV news? what's that?

Left it behind 8 years ago and haven't looked back.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 06:18 PM

31. But American is voted #1 as the most ignorant in the world. This is sad news.

Its tells us that education has failed in America since the Republicans have hijacked it.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 06:33 PM

37. Taibbi is always the best

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 06:40 PM

38. Next two paras: this is where I came to my impasse years ago

...companies offer the same service, it's just that the Fox version is a little kinkier.

When you make the news into this kind of consumer business, pretty soon audiences lose the ability to distinguish between what they think they're doing, informing themselves, and what they're actually doing, shopping.

And who shops for products he or she doesn't want? That's why the consumer news business was always destined to hit this kind of impasse.


I came to the determination years ago that the commercial advertisers of news hours were all evil. To me, they basically market products to viewers that stereotypes them into products they don't need. Air fresheners, OTC drugs & medicines, buying new status symbol goods and services, etc. So I thought, I don't need that crap and why are these companies the sponsors of news? If there's a monetary relationship there between advertisers and news media, it's very possible the news in tainted. Then, as Matt Taibbi points out, you hear stuff in the news that's not news, but basically infomercial content...more and more. You've arrived at your moment of impasse.

Time to turn the news off. While you're at it, might as well turn TV off completely. It's more commercialized bullshit than informative/educational/entertaining value. And I don't need to pay for that.

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Response to ffr (Reply #38)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 12:06 PM

80. I'm not for turning the TV off entirely

We all need a bit of a break from the stress of daily life. Watch a good TV show or a good old movie. As far as news?
I agree with Randi Rhodes. The news has been cancelled! There is no news on TV. If you want news, you've got to read it.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 06:45 PM

39. I like the "old Edward R. Murrow, eat-your-broccoli version of the news" phrasing

Just sayin'

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 06:55 PM

46. The Best Slave Doesn't Know He Is One.

-- Goethe

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Response to Octafish (Reply #46)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 07:50 PM

58. And Kirkegaard's Corollary to Goethe

 

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #58)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 02:16 AM

67. That calls for a toast.

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Response to Octafish (Reply #67)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 03:32 AM

68. To both of us!

 

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 08:43 PM

61. Sad But So True

Infotainment is supercharging the race to the bottom intellectually

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 09:13 PM

64. of Course

 

Fox "News" is exhibit #1 that America is too dumb for TV News.

Sean Hannity, Bill "O" Reilly, and John Stossel conjuring false political equivalency and reaping advertising dollars while doing it, is ample indication of how collectively dumb we are as a nation.

Just when we can't afford to get any dumber, we put creationists in charge of science funding, put children in home schools dedicated to theocracy, and put climate deniers in control of our carbon. When we can least afford to..............

We elected George W. Bush. Of course we are collectively too dumb for TV News.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Wed Nov 25, 2015, 10:33 PM

66. I don't understand why people don't just turn that noise off....

Seriously. People who haven't had a television in years-- like me-- look at the rest of Americans incredulously. The utter crap that people spend their non-working, waking hours watching on television will shock you pretty quickly after you get that stuff out of your system. They don't call it the plug-in drug for nothing. Over the years, interesting, challenging content has slowly given way to purile entertainment, although arguably television was always deeper down that rat hole than print media.

Every two or three years I'll turn on a television in a hotel room and surf the channels looking for some redeeming value. I'm usually appalled. Television isn't the only thing that is killing journalism, but it's one of the worst offenders. Voting with your feet and turning that noise off permanently is the first step toward undoing the dumbing down of Americans.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 03:35 AM

69. How did I miss rec cing this!

 

RS nails it again.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 08:03 AM

71. There's news on TV? I've never seen any, but then I only get 750 channels.

 

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 08:48 AM

72. Matt is one of my favorites of all time.

 

Oh wait a minute---that goes against the BS'ers narrative. A Hillary supporter loving Matt.

I swear you BS'ers could conflate anything.

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 11:21 AM

73. TV Free For 15 Years Now

eom

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 11:56 AM

79. I would argue the opposite position

The US citizen isn't too dumb for TV news, it's too dumb because of TV news.
I had never been a major consumer of TV news. Even since the 60's I had seen it as being just so much BS. Play to the baser instincts, push every sensational story, limit the discussion to an acceptable story line.
Perhaps we can accept some responsibility because we didn't demand better but that falls into that area of not being able to recognize our own blind spot.
It might just be that we have to exert so much effort just to get through the day. I think that applies to me, I didn't hit my breaking point until 2002. By then it was painfully obvious that the mask was off for the ruling class. They no longer felt the need to hide their goals.
I'm lucky that I now can now invest my time in being informed. I only wish I had the resources to share half of the information I gather with my neighbors. I know they're smart enough to connect the dots but we never seem to be in the same place long enough to get into serious conversations.

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Response to tech3149 (Reply #79)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 12:12 PM

83. It's one of those "chicken or the egg?" conundrums

The thread does remind me of this cartoon though...

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 12:43 PM

87. K&R! This post should have hundreds of recommendations!

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 12:49 PM

89. OK, let's face it...those of us on the DU, no matter who we support right now,

are better informed than at least 90% of the people I see around me. My close friends are informed, intelligent and interested in current events. Thank, gawd, for my close pals and for the DU.

I see the DU, even with are the current primary wars right now, as being a place where I can read, learn, discuss, and consider new information, ideas, points of view and do so with some very well read and informed intelligent people. I always find out something new each day that is of interest -- besides what is posted in GDP!

When I visit internet sites -- not very often, to say the least -- like Free Republic or have a conversation with many in a line at a grocery store, it amazes me how uninformed the general public appears to be. One clear indication of that is look around at the magazines on sale at the grocery check out...I used to see at least Time and Newsweek. Not any more -- the magazine stands are like a Kardashian super-book store.

So, I am not the least bit surprised that things such as Faux Snooze Entertainment network exists and that it pretends to be a news information source. Some, unfortunately, are not too dumb for that supposed and alleged TV News station!

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Thu Nov 26, 2015, 01:05 PM

91. Television

We stopped watching all television over 23 years ago. Have not looked back ... never missed it. It was all far to stupid and insulting to any sentient being's intelligence.

We missed the Rodney King beating, the OJ chase, 9/11, someone's nipple, and every other notable, newsworthy event.

Raised our kids without it, who - in their 20's-30's have thanked us for it and say they will raise their kids the same.

We stopped reading any of the newspapers - except catching links on line - shortly after that.

One of our primary motives was that we did not want corporate America owning the souls of our children.

We didn't want our two daughters AND our son to have problems with image perceptions.

Television is a black hole where good intentions and time are sucked in and strangled.

We didn't want them addicted to garbage.

We never missed it.

People often ask in shock "What do you do instead?" ... and we tell them .... Everything else.

*

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Response to Fumesucker (Original post)

Fri Nov 27, 2015, 09:37 AM

101. K&R We live in the most reality corporations will allow.

If the truth is bad for corporate business, fighting against that truth is in the best interest of the shareholders.

Those who invest in and support Wall St have made a conscious decision to choose short term personal comfort for themselves over honesty, over democracy, for all people.

They are well represented by corporate media, lobbyists, think tanks and politicians.

Thankfully, we still live in the most democracy they haven't figured out how to cut off. Yet.

With every dollar and hour logged in service of those consumed by avarice, that final nail will soon be hammered into place.

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