General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsMy right wing sister forwarded this email to me....
This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by petronius (a host of the General Discussion forum).
I've given up responding to her, but maybe others have some ideas of how I should respond.
Who is Bernie Sanders?
Bernie Sanders father was a high school drop-out, who tormented his family with rants about their financial problems. He blamed society and economic inequality for his plight, though as a white male in a middle class neighborhood, he was hardly among the downtrodden.
This was Bernies inspiration to take up the cause of economic justice, though he would spend half of his life as an able-bodied college graduate living off of unemployment checks, and the women in his life, between odd jobs. By his own admission, Bernie was not a great student, starting at Brooklyn College and transferring to Univ. of Chicago, but his enrollment kept him protected from the draft.
He joined socialist organizations and dabbled in far-left communist politics, gaining national notoriety by petitioning the school to let students have sex in the dormitories. This was before birth control and abortion were legal, when there were still very serious repercussions for women if the condom broke, but that didnt stop him from crusading against those silly rules that were an obstacle to his own satisfaction. He participated in the 1963 March on Washington, a few demonstrations, and was arrested once, but his activism for civil rights ended when he became obsessed with socialism. NOT democratic socialism, but oppressive far-left Marxism.
Bernie married his college sweetheart, Deborah Shilling, and spent his small inheritance on a summer home in Vermont on 85 acres. The shack had a dirt floor and no electricity, maintaining his proletariat credibility, but not impressing his new bride. He refused to get a steady job, so his wife didnt stick around long, divorced after 18 months.
The Viet Nam war was escalating, and when the next draft was announced, Bernie applied for a conscientious objector deferment. His deferment was denied, so he dodged the draft by having a kid out of wedlock in 1969 with his new girlfriend, Susan Mott, even though he STILL wasnt working, and had no way to support the child. By the time his draft number came up, he was too old to be drafted anyway. He continued to subsist on odd carpentry jobs and unemployment checks, and occasionally selling $15 articles, including the one about how women fantasize about gang rape. He still refused to get a steady job to support his child. His girlfriend left him.
In 1988 he married Jane Driscoll, and took a cold-war era honeymoon in communist USSR. His new wife supported Bernie financially through his many attempts to win a public office, and shared his radical leftist political views. They visited the pro-Soviet Sandinista Government in Nicaragua known for their human rights violations, support for anti-American terrorists, and the imprisonment and exile of opponents. Bernie blindly overlooked the carnage to stand with fellow socialists. They traveled to Cuba in hopes of meeting Bernies hero Fidel Castro, but access to him was denied.
Bernie Sanders managed not to hold a full-time job his entire life or vote in a single election, until he finally ran for Mayor of Burlington at the age of 40. After several failed elections, he finally won the office of Mayor of Burlington, VT, and eventually a Senate seat, which he has managed to keep off and on. For all of his years representing Vermont, Bernie Sanders passed a total of three bills, and two of them were for naming post offices.
Hes a draft-dodging deadbeat dad, a globe-trotting communist dilettante, and a petulant detractor of hard-working honorable Democrats. His one skill is yelling about how unfair the world is, and how everything SHOULD be. But he has no plans for how to make it happen, and no idea what goes on in the rest of the world or how to deal with problems overseas. His excuse for not having a foreign policy or national security plank on his platform: Ive only been campaigning for three months.
His socialist friends are bitter about what they see as a betrayal of their values by Bernies pursuit of the Democratic nomination. His former wife and girlfriend run when they see reporters and will not speak to the press. Bernies past, including a brief stint living in a kibbutz in Israel is cloaked in secrecy. Former employees and coworkers describe him as hostile and belligerent. All of the Democrats in Vermonts government have endorsed Hillary Clinton.
The people who know Bernie best cannot stand him. His supporters cannot explain how he is qualified to be president. As for his detractors, we can only watch in horror as this Nader 2.0 works an appalling act of sabotage on the Democratic Party.
djean111
(14,255 posts)braying about sources. it is a bunch of spew, and there is nothing to be done.
Erich Bloodaxe BSN
(14,733 posts)About him being a Nader 2.0 sabotaging the Dem Party.
This was written BY Hillary supporters. And yeah, they are RW. But no declared Republican would give a damn about Bernie 'sabotaging the Dem Party'. They'd be cheering him on if they thought that.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)But I suspect that much of the information/misinformation will be used by the right, should he win the Democratic nomination.
And, I suspect it will be effective for anyone leaning away fro Bernie.
Erich Bloodaxe BSN
(14,733 posts)he will, by default, get all of the same 'Dem voters' that would vote for hillary because she's a Dem, or indeed anyone who simply doesn't want a Trump presidency. The number of people who will give a crap about any of the things in that bit of writing are A) tiny, and B) were never going to vote for a Dem anyway. Plus, he'll keep all of the left-leaning indies who are tired of the status quo candidates from defecting to Team Trump.
truebluegreen
(9,033 posts)"DemocratIC"--dead giveaway. No RWer wrote that, they always say "DemocRAT".
Yo_Mama
(8,303 posts)Turbineguy
(37,285 posts)Jerome Corsi.
TM99
(8,352 posts)Seriously. This is the kind of re-writing of history that nutty far right people do. They have done it with every Democrat. I can't stand Hillary Clinton's politics and positions. I know she is a serial liar. But these people believe she is a closet lesbian who killed Vincent Foster.
There is no rational argument for their kind of crazy. I am very sorry you have a sister like this.
Nevernose
(13,081 posts)It's from someone in the Clinton camp. The Clintons know how politics are played, and sometimes they're played a little dirty.
Notice the last line: " As for his detractors, we can only watch in horror as this Nader 2.0 works an appalling act of sabotage on the Democratic Party."
Does that sound like a RWer's concern to you?
TM99
(8,352 posts)I stopped.
Indeed that may be a Brock shit-stir using low information right wingers to do their dirty work for them.
onecaliberal
(32,775 posts)hifiguy
(33,688 posts)In fact the stench would knock a buzzard off a shitwagon.
restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)Skittles
(153,111 posts)hifiguy
(33,688 posts)trying to deal with Trumpolini right now. The only person who benefits from tearing down Bernie right now is Her Majesty.
Skittles
(153,111 posts)the anti-Hillary crowd is going off the deep end
DONE here, it makes me SICK
xmas74
(29,669 posts)I'm still undecided about my candidate but Damon if the anti Hillary crowd isn't pushing me into her with open arms.
I want a candidate who doesn't just make promises but can actually keep a few. When I decide which of the two offers the best chance I'll know who to support. I tend to be pragmatic and don't buy what most sell.
Skittles
(153,111 posts)but I am sooooo sick of hearing about Saint Bernie
xmas74
(29,669 posts)The Hillarybots are terrible but the Cult of St Bernie is unbearable. He didn't part the sea, didn't turn water into wine, etc.
I'm ready for primary season to end and Missouri hasn't even voted yet. I will say this:anyone who refuses to vote for the party candidates in the GE should leave right now. I don't care who gets it. If a (D) is next to their name on the ballot they have my vote in the GE.
bkkyosemite
(5,792 posts)arcane1
(38,613 posts)monicaangela
(1,508 posts)Just reading through it I can see many problems. This person seems to know everything about Sanders life, but admits his family, past and present will not speak with the press. Where did this innuendo come from? Also too, trying to paint him as lazy and someone who didn't work is also a lie. After finishing college in 1964 with a degree in political science, Sanders lived on a kibbutz in Israel before settling in Vermont. He worked a number of jobs, including filmmaker and freelance writer, psychiatric aide, and teaching low-income children through Head Start, while his interest in politics grew.
http://www.biography.com/people/bernie-sanders
Nevernose
(13,081 posts)No house, no family, hung out with his friends all the time. Worked as a carpenter, a sailor, a fisherman, a teacher, and the savior of all mankind, and couldn't make ANY of those jobs last.
If it's that easy to twist up Christ's life into something nefarious, how hard is it to do with an actual, still-alive average American?
monicaangela
(1,508 posts)The question then becomes this: We know why Christ life was turned into something nefarious by those who opposed him, so what was their reason for creating such lies about him? The truth is that the Pharisees did hate Jesus, and He rightly isnt known for showing them a great deal of grace. He called them out for their hypocrisy. He exposed their inner tombs. But the hatred they felt for Him wasnt mere sour grapes at His approval rating, nor was it as principled as mere evil versus good. It was rather more craven. They hated Jesus not because He called them names, but because He threatened their security, prestige and income. Sound familiar?
KamaAina
(78,249 posts)This despicable red-baiting was a means of suggesting that Sanders is a commie without actually saying the word. Here's a guy, the implication runs, who's a secret Bolshevikso in love with America's arch-enemy that he took his new bride to the USSR instead of Niagara Falls or the Bahamas for their honeymoon. It was a rancid attempt to gin up outrage and do Republicans' dirty work for them. It's also deceptive.
The honeymoon story began at Breitbart in late May, then moved on to other right-wing venues, finally getting play in George Will's August 7 column in the Washington Post. Most of his column was devoted to praise for ex-communist Robert Conquest, who had written about the prisons and other atrocities of the Stalin era and had just died at age 98. Will concluded:
Conquest lived to see a current U.S. presidential candidate, a senator, who had chosen, surely as an ideological gesture, to spend his honeymoon in the Soviet Union in 1988. Gulags still functioned, probably including some of the cold Auschwitzes in Siberia, described in Conquests 'Kolyma.' The honeymooner did not mind that in 1988 political prisoners wereas may still be the casebeing tortured in psychiatric hospitals. Thanks to the unblinking honesty of people like Conquest, the Soviet Union now is such a receding memory that Bernie Sanderss moral obtusenessthe obverse of Conquests characteris considered an amusing eccentricity.
Jitter65
(3,089 posts)onecaliberal
(32,775 posts)If she wants to vote for fascists, there is nothing you can say.
BuelahWitch
(9,083 posts)or people "never holding a real job." If The Donald's daddy wasn't rich, where would he be?
joeybee12
(56,177 posts)The original OP was amusing until the usual crowd chimed in and started blaming Hillary for this...take the smears elsewhere and leave GD alone. Thank you.
No one knows who wrote it. To blame Hillary or her supporters is unfair.
I refuse to bash either candidate. To do so only provides ammo for the enemy. An enemy that scares the hell out of me.
joeybee12
(56,177 posts)I mean, it's a ludicrous smear against Bernie...I expected someone to say Bernie advocated "free love"...just the sort of thing that the rw base would eat up!
Response to joeybee12 (Reply #13)
LiberalElite This message was self-deleted by its author.
PatrickforO
(14,558 posts)What? He's running for President???
Well what's his platform?
Single payer - medicare for all Americans. Wow, that sounds good. Right now I'm paying 18.8% of my gross income for shitty HMO healthcare that is rationed complete with really high copays. If I get sick I should not have to fill out a bunch of forms or be wheeled through the finance department to ensure I can pay before they treat me.
Stronger social security? Well, we really have to do something about entitlements...what? As is the Social Security Trust Fund is solvent until 2037? I didn't know that? There's a CAP on the payroll tax? That doesn't sound fair. Let's see if I get this right. On the first $112,000 of my gross pay I must pay into Social Security but ALL earnings above that are exempt? Wow. That sure favors the rich! I don't like that much. And what about capital gains? How come Social Security isn't taxed in the context of capital gains? Maybe if the gain is over a certain amount, then you'd have to pay in.
Free college? Well, when I went to school college was $350 per semester. Yeah I had to work because I still had to pay rent, utilities and so on, but I wasn't smothered with debt when I graduated. What???? The average student debt load now is over $31,000??? And 11% of the loans are in default? And they are garnishing the Social Security checks of oldsters who have 'forever loans?'
But where is the tax money going? Over a trillion on national security and war spending. What? We're 'in' over a trillion on the F-35 fighter but it STILL isn't ready??? The Pentagon can't account for $8.5 trillion between 2001 and now???? WTF? Really?
But what about big corporations? You mean the big Fortune 500 companies are offshoring trillions in profits so they don't have to pay US income tax? Wow. That isn't fair. We're their market. Their semis use our highways. Seems like they should pay their fair share.
Gee. Bernie doesn't seem so bad. He just wants to use our tax dollars for programs that really benefit us and make our lives better. It's another New Deal! I don't think he's a communist. He says he's a democratic socialist. I was in Holland a few years ago and the people are really happy. They have high taxes, but they get healthcare and free college! I like democratic socialism. I LIKE Bernie!
Xolodno
(6,383 posts)...I really don't know where to start. It reminds me of a bartender I ran into while on vacation who said "Obama is going to declare Martial Law to stay as President"......its devoid of fact, reason and sanity. They don't have a clue, if Obama declared himself "President" beyond the Constitutional limits...the first people to vacate the country would be....drum roll please.........
Democrats.
Many of the Republicans will stay because the "Trains ran on time"...even if they hated who assisted it happening. And with the opposition gone from his own base (either fleeing or going underground), a dictator can easily woo the opposition (GOP). Of course, that isn't going to happen given an number of circumstances.
But for some...like your sister...and a few of my relatives,........well, you can bring a horse to water, but you can't make them drink.
MaggieD
(7,393 posts)monicaangela
(1,508 posts)After finishing college in 1964 with a degree in political science, Sanders lived on a kibbutz in Israel before settling in Vermont. He worked a number of jobs, including filmmaker and freelance writer, psychiatric aide, and teaching low-income children through Head Start, while his interest in politics grew. Now go read the post again.
MaggieD
(7,393 posts)Filmmaker?? LOL!
monicaangela
(1,508 posts)MaggieD
(7,393 posts)In the New Yorker and Washinton Post. What films did he make?
So is that it? Your beef with the original article is that it doesn't give proper deference to the facts the he did odd jobs instead of a career until he was 41?
monicaangela
(1,508 posts)I'm surprised you have the blinders on for that, but seem to find fault with everything else that doesn't agree with your point of view.
OxQQme
(2,550 posts)Flagged the sender as junk.
demmiblue
(36,816 posts)Funny that it's hard to tell anymore from the writing style whether the source is tea party or something else!
JustAnotherGen
(31,780 posts)NBachers
(17,080 posts)I suppose it's serious to those who believe it all, but it's just lame and inconsequential to me.
B Calm
(28,762 posts)JohnnyLib2
(11,211 posts)He's been sending truly godawful things about Obama and the Clintons for years.
To the trash they go.
Response to rgbecker (Original post)
CobaltBlue This message was self-deleted by its author.
Kingofalldems
(38,419 posts)I see accusations in this thread but zero evidence.
MaggieD
(7,393 posts)Kingofalldems
(38,419 posts)On the plus side, I haven't seen Hillary blamed for 911 yet.
Skittles
(153,111 posts)IT HAS TO BE HER!!! Because, you know.......HILLARY!! GET WITH THE PROGRAM, KINGOFALLDEMS!!!
Ghost Dog
(16,881 posts)"Man should be breadwinner" line.
Mendocino
(7,480 posts)would send me crap like this. I told them to stop, they persisted, now I have no relationship with them.
47of74
(18,470 posts)Because they know that they would receive an invitation back to take said emails and shove them up their asses in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.
And also because with my family email is so 1990s.
rgbecker
(4,817 posts)Some are so poorly written I don't make a comment. Thanks to my DU friends, I've sent along a Sanders biography so she can at least see what is appealing to me about him.
I think she is a single issue voter about abortion, but her husband is just an old time racist. They both spout a continual line about everyone being lazy and wanting something for nothing from the government, No one works as hard as they and all the billionaires and if the government would just get out of everyone's business, they'd all be rich.
tokenlib
(4,186 posts)..."the never gainfully employed" attack. All I could think of was Hubert Humphrey, Paul Wellstone, and the other Dems who spoke of public service as an honorable profession. Sad to see this garbage..
Alkene
(752 posts)Don't talk about politics.
She's your sister. Love her for that.
7wo7rees
(5,128 posts)Fairgo
(1,571 posts)It's laughable. Whose rolling in this?
HughBeaumont
(24,461 posts)Vinca
(50,236 posts)itsrobert
(14,157 posts)This is just the a little taste of what the republicans can do to Bernie in the General. They have been doing the same to the Clintons for 25 years. Many on DU post those right wing Clinton smears as gospel in GDP.
JHB
(37,152 posts)Aside from laughter?
"Y'know, sis, sometimes I can't tell how much of your stuff is just 'rah-rah for my team, boo-hiss for the other guy' and how much is believing your own advertising."
SidDithers
(44,228 posts)iAZZZo
(358 posts)for a start, tens of thousands of registered democrats 'crossed the party line" (especially in florida) to vote repub
the nader 'thing' has been debunked (investigative journalist greg palast's research offered on the net - both videos and texts - is is a start and requisite)
petronius
(26,595 posts)thus not in keeping with the SoP of General discussion.