Hell is definitely beginning to freeze over

[lunatica]

A Sea Change in Climate Politics
Something strange has happened in Florida: Rising seas have changed GOP views.

http://legal-planet.org/2016/03/21/a-sea-change-in-climate-politics/

There was a surprise question about climate change at the last Republican debate. What was surprising wasn’t the question itself. Instead, it was the source of the question: Tomás Regalado, the Republican mayor of Miami. It turns out that this wasn’t a fluke.

Regalado and the Republican mayor of Miami Beach have spoken out in an op. ed. about climate change:

“The overwhelming scientific consensus is that the rising sea levels are caused by the planet warming, that the burning of fossil fuels is driving this warming, and that we need to act quickly to avoid the worst impacts ahead.

These are the facts. We shouldn’t waste time debating them.”

Or consider this, from a Republican Congressman:
http://www.miamiherald.com/opinion/op-ed/article41324724.html

“Rising sea levels and the erosion of our coastal communities have made it abundantly clear that South Florida is at the frontline of climate change. . . . If we want to diminish the impact that greenhouse gases will continually have on our planet over the next century, the effort to constrain carbon emissions must be expanded.”
**************
Below is an interactive map of the rising water levels all over the world

http://geology.com/sea-level-rise/

[giftedgirl77]

1. I'm from MIA & nobody with an ounce of human DNA can

deny the turmoil we are facing.

[lunatica]

5. By MIA do you mean Miami?

In this interactive map you can zoom in any area you want and see how much of the coast lines are endangered. Miami looks like it's at best a marshland, at worst completely underwater

http://geology.com/sea-level-rise/

[giftedgirl77]

13. Yes, sorry I meant Miami. just being lazy.

The flooding streets are a common occurrence & in some places the water table is so high ppls front yards now inhabit fish.

[lunatica]

24. That's horrible!

this country is going to have to deal with climate change refugees within itself.

A few more hurricanes and things will be much worse than just the rising of the sea level.

[giftedgirl77]

26. Oh yeah, the area I grew up in will be completely under water.

Every time I get homesick & want to move home I remind myself that it us being swallowed up & I wouldn't even get a chance to pay off a mortagr much less stay forever.

[Tanuki]

43. That gives new meaning to "underwater mortgage"! eom

[giftedgirl77]

45. For realz

[Dont call me Shirley]

33. Katrina had lots of global warming refugees.

[lunatica]

49. Yes! And history will repeat itself all along the East Coast and the Gulf Coast

Out on the West Coast the land starts up higher and gets higher very quickly. The land loss will be much smaller because of that.

[saturnsring]

41. how soon before it's sharks and gators

[Scootaloo]

53. Not too long ago, I looked up where I used ot live, in Mobile, AL

There was a creek, a little tributary of Dog River that I used to stomp around at, fish for bream, catch turtles, that sort of stuff, right?

Manatees live there now. Fucking Manatees. You know those things that are supposed to need really warm waters/ yeah, they're apparently all up in Mobile Bay and its attendant rivers now. In winter. They're new arrivals, apparently sightings started around 2008, but they're there.

[yourpaljoey]

56. Wow! I love manatees! Wonder if they are migrating from Florida.

[Scootaloo]

57. Well, I would presume so

They appear to not be doing great there - several boat strikes (Alabama, for maybe understandable reasons, doesn't seem to have much manatee awareness, and Mobile Bay is a big shipping port) and cold deaths, since it's still not quite warm enough for the critters.

But yeah, I was a little shocked ot learn that there are sea cows grazing the same plants I used ot fish up for my aquarium collection.

[yourpaljoey]

60. that is quite a revelation

[certainot]

65. and yet 5 fla universities support 20 global warming denying

rush limbaugh stations.

Florida 10, Florida St. 4 Miami 2, South Florida 2, Central Florida 2

those are the stations those schools support by broadcasting sports on them. they have no excuse and should be looking for apolitical alternatives.

the station pays a licensing co and the licensing company pays a cut to the university so the station can fly the school flag to attract advertisers and help limbaugh and all the other national and local rw flat earthers on those stations sell global warming denial and make sure that all the repubs are in lock step on that and all the other issues.

if just one of those schools reread its mission statement and began discussing its support for republican radio, advertisers would flee, other schools would be shamed into following, and pretty soon some of those stations would have to rethink their programming.

those schools are just 5 of 90 unis that support 260 limbaugh stations, and none of them has any excuse for continuing to help the republcans deny global warming all over the country.

not to mention all the shit those stations sell.

[giftedgirl77]

66. Are you saying that those Universities broadcast the games

on the same channel as Limbaugh so they should be boycotted? Or are you saying they broadcast Limbaugh as well?

[certainot]

68. they broadcast games on those stations, which use the school's

community standing and brand/logos/mascots and athletes to help them sell advertising and global warming denial ad everything else republican.

the schools need to be petitioned and protested to end those relationships and find apolitical alternatives- they have no excuse not to and maintaining those relationships continues to sell denial to the public, enable the GOP to continue their denial, and continue their obstruction.

and that's on top of the racism, sexism, hate on teachers, working for ALEC to defund and privatize public ed, fight efforts to reduce student debt, etc.

it makes perfect sense for students and faculty at those schools to push their schools. and the general community.

if the admin argues it's revenue, let them provide the exact amt, which will be easy to make up with donations, and so on.

republiconradio.org

[giftedgirl77]

69. So the school's are advertising during these shows?

If they aren't showing any type of affiliations with these shows I'm failed to see the relationship.

[certainot]

71. that happens, but it's more than that

rw radio is parasitizing those schools.

those stations are KKK-lite, and in a myriad of was completely antithetical to what the schools say they represent

i have heard variations on "850 KOA, home of the buffs, and rush limbaugh!" or "mark levin, right after the game!"

it's a variation on paying an athlete to wear a nike swoosh during games. in this case the station is the athlete, and it uses the logo/brand to bring in advertisers, etc. it's the association. it's what businesses pay big dollars for and the stations get it very cheap.

[HooptieWagon]

55. Miami really can't be saved.

It's very low-lying land. A dike/levee won't work...the bedrock is porous limestone, water will just come up through the ground faster than any pumping system could deal with. The entire Miami/Dade County area is so large and spread out, there's no way to bring in enough fill dirt to build it up higher than expected sea rise. They need to just stop building there, and start focusing on getting people relocated.

[djean111]

2. Yeah, well, those real estate investments and expected property tax money and tourism $$$$

are now looking iffy - that's what it takes to get their attention, IMO.

Also, I have always thought the foot-dragging over climate change was really getting themselves time to re-build portfolios and divest themselves of fossil fuel stocks and such. But then, I am kind of cynical.

[Wounded Bear]

4. I think the reality is...

they are staring to realize that several congressional districts are about to disappear forever, unless they can pass laws allowing dolphins and sharks to vote.

[djean111]

8. Well put. But I think the sharks are already in Tallahassee, now.

GOP and DINO sharks.

[Wounded Bear]

11. I wasn't being allegorical...

Never been to Florida. Recent events make it even less likely I'll visit. Of course main reasons are: too hot and too far away. ( I live in Seattle area )

Seriously, my heart goes out to Floridians. It's starting to look like the whole southern end of the state is about to go under water, literally.

[giftedgirl77]

14. I'm from FL but lived in Washington for about 4 yrs.

I'll moved back there in a heartbeat.

[Wounded Bear]

18. I grew up here...

spent 30 years in So California and came back. Frankly, I've had my fill of hot weather.

Sad thing is, the So California climate is moving north. Last year was warmest month of Feb in recorded history. This year, not quite so bad, but almost no snow in the lowlands this year. Just rain. Not totally unusual, but we're definitely trending.

[giftedgirl77]

22. When I was there the summers were hell.

We lived in a 400sq ft house with no AC. I understand why they don't have AC but that's going to change in the next few years. It was either this winter or last that there were days it was warmer in Alaska than it was at my moms in Tampa. I would take cold over hot any day. Ideally I'll buy a little place out in the middle of nowhere & never be seen again. Just me my rottie, & 3 cats.

[Wounded Bear]

30. Memory is a tricky thing...

but it definitely feels toastier now than in the 50's-60's when I grew up here. I'm with you on the hot v. cold issue.

Lots of land up in the hills around here. Wish I could afford a 5 acre plot myself. Of course, I'd probably get burned out with all the fires lately, which are also on the up tick, of course. A Rott for intruders and cats for the rodents, you'd be well protected.

[giftedgirl77]

31. Lol, I wish she was for protection....

I hope that in a life or death situation some sort of rottie trait would come forward. As of now I'd be better off tossing a cat at them & letting the shredding to ensue.

[Wounded Bear]

32. OK, you got me there...

If you do ever make it up here, look me up.

[giftedgirl77]

36. Awesome

[lunatica]

50. A playful cat is more dangerous than an angry dog

You can at least climb a tree to get away from the dog...

[djean111]

23. I know. But - I live right under Tampa, and am all too well aware that Florida is home to Rick

Scott, Marco Rubio, and Debbie Wasserman-Schultz. So "sharks" means something else to me, too. Heh, just had a mental picture of Rubio as a shark, too dumb to know he is in the water, looking for some plastic bottles of the stuff.

My home is pretty far above sea level, so if I live that long, I might have that beachfront property I always wanted.

[lunatica]

25. I edited the OP to include an interactive world map and rising sea levels

Check it out.

If nothing else, it's really fascinating.

[snort]

9. Just think of the cool boat tours

through the 'ghost cities' of Aqualand (formerly known as Florida). It'll be a gold mine.

[LiberalElite]

15. Disney World could be renamed

The Magic Atlantis Kingdom.

[djean111]

21. Ha! And - DAMMIT! I see that Bentley's, on Islamorada, is now closed - and they had

the best lobster, shrimp and crab cake in the universe. If the string theory thing about all those parallel universes is correct, then Bentley's had the best crab cakes in all of those universes, too. Seriously.
Dammit. Dammit. Awesome, with a garlic cream sort of Bearnaise sauce.
Dammit. Off to try and find the recipe.

[snort]

27. I was born in Tyndall AFB.

[djean111]

28. Which one of those skiers is you?!

Looks like that AFB will be under water, sooner rather than later.

[dixiegrrrrl]

67. Speaking of "divest themselves of fossil fuel stocks" did you see this other jaw dropper?

.Rockefeller family charity to withdraw all investments in fossil fuel companies
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10027709565

[djean111]

70. Ah hah! The Rockefellers read DU!

Actually, I was just being logical, and it always always clears things up when you follow the money.
If the Kochs were able to get out of fossil fuels and corner the solar panel market - we would see solar panels for sale everywhere.

[Surya Gayatri]

3. K & R. Thanks for posting.

[lunatica]

7. You're welcome

I love your lighthouse quote! It actually fits right into this thread.

[Surya Gayatri]

16. I've always been fascinated with the symbolism of lighthouses. I never miss one

when travelling, and here in Europe, I'm well served!

With rising sea levels, many of the oldest and most venerable ones will be under threat.

[randr]

6. Sooner or later

you just have to react when reality slaps you up the side of your head. Hard to deny a black eye when you are wearing one.

[lunatica]

10. I was beginning to wonder what it'll take since not one word

has been mentioned by the Republican Presidential candidates.

But I don't see anyone on our side doing much screaming about it either. Sigh....

Maybe in 4 years it'll be important enough to run on. But by then we'll be seeing the millions of refugees fleeing the rising oceans. Maybe that will get our attention.

[Wounded Bear]

12. Self awareness is not strong in those folks...

and I'm not sure a lot of them even have mirrors.

[randr]

47. It is very hard to perceive reality

with ones head up ones ass.

[phantom power]

17. yeah, but they very definitely could have denied what was causing it.

So, weirdly, this exceeds my expectations. I mostly expected them to say "well it's just some unfortunate shit that is happening" and continue to behave exactly the same.

[Wounded Bear]

20. Well, if you really want to try and fix something...

you can't allow the concept of "it's all in God's hands" now can you?

Probably the one argument that galls me the most is the whole "God controls the climate and weather and we can't do anything to fix it." It's like we've been taken over by a bunch of Christian Scientists or something. And the people making money off of fossil fuels are laughing all the way to the bank.

[Major Hogwash]

19. When they talked about New Orleans 10 years ago, they didn't care then.

Did anyone notice how Republicans only give a shit if it affects them?

[lunatica]

29. Well you know New Orleans is just full of those black people

Babs Bush said they lucked out to get to stay in a Texas football stadium after being taken from the New Orleans one. Wasn't that when she said something about her beautiful mind or something???

Anyway, I'm sure she had the same sentiment.

[KamaAina]

34. That was also when she told a nine-year-old boy who said his favorite color was black "stupid"

Babs: "What's your favorite color?" Kid: "Black!" Babs: "Black isn't a color, stupid!"

[lunatica]

38. She just oozed motherly warmth didn't she

what a Battle axe!

[KamaAina]

35. You don't say.

[lunatica]

37. LOL!

Exactly!

[blackspade]

39. Good news....

But typical of Repubs.
They don't give a crap until it's their shit that might get fucked up.

[mountain grammy]

40. I sure would love to make one more trip to the Keys

before they're gone..

[BlancheSplanchnik]

42. Yep, pukes don't give a fuck until something affects them personally.

Lucky those guys don't call in their jobs from their mountain resort in Vail, Colorado.

[Dustlawyer]

44. They dont believe in things until it happens to them!

Whether its Climate Change or Tort Reform, Republicans do not have any empathy for anyone else until their own ox is being gored!

[tabasco]

46. This republican mayor obviously did not get the news

that a senator had a snowball in congress, which means that climate change is a big liberal hoax.

[lark]

48. It's not just southern FL.

At +9 ft. a lot of NE FL disappears, including the area where I live in Jacksonville.

[Adsos Letter]

51. Very cool map at the link.

Thanks for posting this.

[lunatica]

62. It's sobering

And fascinating at the same time.

[desmiller]

52. Climate change is all a hoax until it bites you in the ass.

Karma is my kind of bitch.


<---- Love you Karma

[Uncle Joe]

54. This is good but have the corporate media conglomerates ever asked a climate change question

at a Republican Debate?

Thanks for the thread, lunatica.

[hay rick]

59. Some deafening silence there.

I do remember one question- asked of Rubio and Kasich, but not Trump or Cruz. Kasich acknowledged the problem while Rubio went into full fossil fuel defense mode. I haven't seen any Republican discussion before or since.

I think the media are too embarrassed to press a question which will trigger a public display of climate-change-is-a-hoax pablum regurgitation. Unfortunately, that makes them complicit.

[riderinthestorm]

58. Too little too late to persuade those I know who prioritize climate change

as their #1 issue.

There's only 2 candidates who are making it a major part of their 2016 campaigns:

Bernie Sanders and Jill Stein

[lunatica]

63. Well, we all know the issue of real importance is the size of Trump's

hands.

[Deadshot]

61. This is something that can no longer be denied.

[peabody]

64. Some of the comments on the

Miami Herald's website regarding this article is disgusting. The climate change deniers there have nothing but lies and misinformation to spread. Even members of their own party are starting to realized climate change is real but they still have their heads in the sand. One guy even said that the temperatures haven't been increasing even though it's been hitting records year after year.

[lunatica]

72. kick

[lunatica]

73. Some times facts can't be denied.