Maybe the Florida shooting is the last straw....

[clarice]

Maybe it's time for everyone, right, left, middle, green, LGBT, libertarians, socialists, to come together in a common consensus
and present a united policy/face to the world that we will not stand for this sort of outrage. Political sniping and inter camp bickering
between all parties only emboldens our enemies. If you don't think that terrorists troll chat rooms/forums of every stripe to gauge the responses/mood of the American people in regards to these acts, then I'm sorry, but your kidding yourselves. I for one, am SICK
of the blame games and the attempts to politicize these terrible events. Is there no common ground upon which everyone can agree
that this HAS to stop? I guess the first step would have to be recognizing who is actually responsible for these acts...not "who created the climate" but who actually pulled the trigger.

[-none]

1. Yeah, like Sandyhook did correct?

[clarice]

2. I was speaking of the Florida shootings.nt

[-none]

3. What's the difference?

[clarice]

4. Once again, back to the text of my post....

You don't think that it is a good idea to united against this sort of thing?

[TexasProgresive]

25. One could hope for that outcome.

However if the massacre of little children didn't bring us (the nation collectively) to our senses I can't image what would.

[clarice]

42. Once again... I'm amazed by the number of Sandy Hook references to my OP...

Is this the new narrative? Is this a way to deflect our attention away from The Florida shootings and the perpetrator?

[TexasProgresive]

97. The PTB who can enact sensible gun laws

Tend to be prejudiced against the victims of the Orlando horror. I'm referring to congress and many state legislatures. Maybe you are correct in your OP that this could be a turning point. I am pessimistic.

[Scootaloo]

101. It's not deflecting attention, it's lamenting a lack of action

Sandy Hook was "the Last Straw," too. And all the massacres before. There's a lot of sentiment, but not much substance, basically

I don't think anyone's trying to tear you down or deflect from your point. It's just we've all edeard the promises before, and it keeps happening. It leads to a pretty deep cynicism about anything ever coming of it.

[WiffenPoof]

120. I'm amazed that you are amazed

Remember what happened right after Sandy Hook? A plol was taken where 92% of Americans agreed that we needed stricter background checks for purchasing a firearm? Nothing was done. If 92% off the population desire this, how come it didn't even get to a vote. And you wonder see why we can't seem to get our act together.

[jberryhill]

126. It's because of your use of "last straw"

Many believed several previous straws were, likewise, the "last straw".

[Adrahil]

129. I heard a commentator this morning remark....

that if the sight if 20+ young school children dead didn't turn the tide, then perhaps nothing can.

I think some folks just feel that this view point, however sad, is true. This is absolutely horrific. But what could make it the last straw that hasn't existed before?

[-none]

41. Our country is off the rails in many ways.

We foster a free wheeling gun climate in this country and spend hundreds of billions of dollars in other countries to make terrorists and then wonder why we have routine mass murders in this country? Nobody should be wondering.

Only 30 to 35 percent of the people in this country own firearms. Yet there are many more firearms than people in this country. The biggest problem are hand guns and being allow to carry in public. The second biggest problem are the military looking knock-offs, too many use to get their testosterone fix.

So, the problem is two fold. One, too many guns in the hands of too many people that should not be having them in the first place, and two - Too many guns floating around.
Fix those two items and watch out firearm death plummet.

[clarice]

49. Ok...but why deflect the Florida shootings (if it was terrorism) with gun control?

It's as if the gun itself fired at those poor people

[-none]

93. Better firearm control means less weapons in the hands of those that should not be having them

in the first place.
If you are paranoid enough to think you need a gun in the first place, especially in public, maybe you are too paranoid to be possession of any firearms.

[Straw Man]

103. How well did that work in France?

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-34827497

[-none]

107. Please don't tell me that

you think one or more concealed carry guys in the crowd would have taken out the bad guys and stopped the carnage.

[Straw Man]

112. I asked you a question.

You chose not to answer it. Let's get that out of the way first, shall we?

[-none]

116. I did. France is not Florida.

There are plenty of Christians that have committed mass murder, so what is the difference?
The problem is fundamentalism, not any specific religion. If the guy had been a Republican Christian and all else being equal, would you be having the same mind set? I'm betting no.
The word is he was a long time ticking time bomb, who finally went off. Deal with that for a bit.

[Straw Man]

121. You tapdance divinely.

Are you responding to a different subthread? The question was how effective restricting weapon access is for preventing terrorist shootings. I asked you how well it worked in France. I'm still waiting for your answer.

[-none]

122. That is because we are looking at this differently.

I see a problem with too many guns in general and you see a problem with his religion.

[Straw Man]

123. Begging your pardon ...

I see a problem with too many guns in general and you see a problem with his religion.

I never said a word about his religion. Perhaps you have me confused with someone else.

[Vinca]

5. If nothing happens after little kids are slaughtered, nothing is going to happen.

I imagine there's a good chunk of the far right that is downright happy to see gays gunned down.

[clarice]

7. Back to the OP.....don't you think that uniting is a good idea?nt

[Joe the Revelator]

12. Thank you for trying to keep people on topic.

Good luck

[clarice]

15. It's tough...but I won't give up.nt

[Albertoo]

113. Yes. I saw the cultural relativists were quick to try to derail your thread

Common sense is like garlic to people who want all cultures and ideologies to be equally good.

Personally, I think the Maya cult involving human sacrifices was sub par. But that's me.

[Vinca]

16. I think realism is a good idea.

There are no rainbows or puppies or unicorns or singing "Kumbayah" when it comes to guns. One side worships them, the other cares about the well being of the citizens. While uniting is always a good idea, it's only wishful thinking at this point in time. Are you ready to hold hands with Trump and skip down a rose petal covered path? If you are, here's a news flash: he's not interested. His followers aren't interested. Most Republicans aren't interested. A gun wielding thug can take out the babies in a hospital nursery and the GOP will stand with the NRA before they stand with the babies. Sad, but true.

[clarice]

27. I respectfully disagree... I think 99% of the population...delpores this....

sort of thing....maybe wishful thinking.

[Vinca]

99. I think you're very naive, but maybe that's a good thing.

Realists like me have pretty much given up when it comes to the carnage that is allowed to happen on our streets every day.

[clarice]

134. I for one...will NEVER give up. nt

[Albertoo]

114. How about: mental health care AND radical Islam should BOTH be tackled?

[sufrommich]

6. If a room full of dead six year olds didn't do it,

nothing will. It's time for politicians to do the right thing and ban automatic weapons regardless of the shit fit that will be thrown by the NRA and their gun humper enablers.

[clarice]

8. Back to the OP.....don't you think that uniting is a good idea?nt

[sufrommich]

10. What does "uniting" even mean?

There are many groups united to stop gun violence,we can unite til the cows come home,it does mean shit if politicians won't act.

[lancer78]

33. Automatic weapons

have been banned for years. Only way to get one is through extensive background checks and shelling out $20,000 per gun.

[Hoyt]

78. Semi-autos are plenty deadly, just look at last night. Stop the gunner BS.

[yuiyoshida]

102. This

n/t

[One_Life_To_Give]

9. Guns are likely already flying off the shelves

History has shown that events like this cause a spike in defensive gun purchases. Alot of people will think that if only one or a few of the victims had a gun then many lives could have been saved.

[clarice]

11. Perhaps...but what about the idea in the OP and uniting? nt

[One_Life_To_Give]

31. Two diametrically opposed camps seldom unite

With half the country seeing the only solution as gun control while the other half sees the only solution is every good person to carry a gun. You are only guaranteed to have roadblock.

[clarice]

40. Thank you...but I was speaking more about a united....

front against terrorism....not gun control.

[kcr]

98. Yes. That's exactly why you aren't getting the kind of "uniting" you're calling for.

Not interested.

[jberryhill]

130. Is there some lack of unity in condemning terrorism?

Are you suggesting that, other than terrorists, there is some significant demographic which is either apathetic or supportive of terrorism?

[qnr]

13. You keep saying "Back to the original post" - whether or not individuals

here think that it is a good idea, the fact that shooting a school full of kids wasn't 'the last straw' makes it obvious that this shooting isn't going to be.

[clarice]

14. Yes, but no one has addressed the benefits of all groups uniting. nt

[mythology]

19. And you didn't address how you think you're going to get all of those groups to unite

Unfortunately the NRA is an incredibly entrenched organization. Yes obviously if the overwhelming majority of Americans who support some measure of gun control come together, vote out the cockroaches who kowtow to the NRA, then gun reform can happen. Unfortunately as we have seen with senseless tragedy after senseless tragedy, there will always be those who value their guns over other people's lives.

[clarice]

23. I wish I HAD the answer. I presented a possible deterrent (not an answer).....

That it might help if groups from all across the political spectrum could unite and
form a coalition condemning these acts.

[qnr]

21. As was mentioned in another post, a large segment of the population are going

to be secretly glad that this happened to the LGBTQ community. Any uniting is going to be partial.

[clarice]

26. You know, honestly....perhaps I'm naive....

but it's hard for me to imagine anyone in main stream America, regardless WHAT side you lean to, taking Joy in in an act like this. Yes perhaps .00005 percent of the population who are TRULY mentally deficient would applaud this act. But again,
I think that the VAST majority would condemn them.

[qnr]

28. Love the attitude :D - I recommend that you stay away from the comments section on almost anything

on the internet though, in order that you are allowed to keep it.

Incidentally, I wasn't being facetious - I really do love the attitude.

[clarice]

35. Thanks....qnr......but I can assure you....

I'm not always this "rosy" lol

[alarimer]

119. Yes, you are naive.

People have already gone on record celebrating this, most notably Dan Patrick of Texas. The lieutenant governor, if fact. If you think I'm going to unite with people like that, you are naive. If elected officials can stay that stuff, or people running for office, it's because they know it won't cost them votes. Because it is fully accepted among the constituencies.

Sure, a lot of people will post pictures on Facebook to show their "solidarity"; many will offer "thoughts and prayers" (quite literally the very least they can do), but in the end, nothing will get done to stop the carnage. Nothing will get done to stop the foaming-at-the-mouth bigotry that is very much a part of mainstream culture.

Spend some time in the dark corners of the internet and you will see it. It's not even that far away.

So, no, I'm not uniting with those people. I'd sooner lie down with a snake. If I get bitten, it's my fault. A snake can't help its nature.

[dumbcat]

125. You are naive

It would seem you don't spend much time in the real world. Your percentage is WAY off.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

17. I don't believe we can prevent all acts of terror.

[clarice]

18. True...but presenting a solid front stating that we won't tolerate things like ...

The Florida shootings seems like a good idea....don't you agree?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

22. I agree... Your intentions are noble...

I just don't see how you can eliminate all of it...

[-none]

89. Getting it down to the average of the civilized countries would be a good thing, don't you think?

As things stand now, this country, as a industrialized nation, is the world's leader in both domestic gun violence and our export of our gun violence via our military. Both need to be stopped.
Just because it may be unrealistic to totally eliminate gun violence, does not mean, in any way, we should not at least try.
I'm getting from your posts that because it cannot be 100% eliminated, we should not try. Am I correct, or not?

[sarisataka]

20. Best idea of the day...

unfortunately you see people don't want to unite. They prefer politicizing and pointing fingers.

I don't understand why it is so hard to stand with people you may disagree with on many issues and say hate is wrong, violence is wrong, we can live together is peaceful disagreement.

[clarice]

24. BINGO....Thank you. I wasn't trying to posit the final solution...

to this issue...maybe just a step forward.

[A HERETIC I AM]

29. They already have come to a common consensus.

You call for uniting all the various groups.

Well, it's already happened. As has been pointed out in the thread already,the entire country basically threw it's hands up in the air and said "Oh well!" after Sandy Hook.

If 5 year olds getting shot in the face doesn't do it, what will?

The country is already united. And we don't give enough of a fuck to elect people who will do what is necessary.

[clarice]

37. Yes...Sandy Hook was a terrible tragedy, but back to the discussion at hand

this event has a distinctly different smell to it.nt

[A HERETIC I AM]

44. I never went away from the discussion at hand.

This event is a case of a whackjob acting on an impulse he should have otherwise controlled.

How is that any different from Sandy Hook?

[clarice]

50. With all respect... I think that you KNOW the answer to that.nt

[A HERETIC I AM]

56. What? That they were children at Sandy Hook and these were grown adults at a club?

With all respect... I think that you KNOW the answer to that.

How is it different? Add "Muslim" to the mix? What? Please enlighten me.

It's a non rational thinking actor, taking his hatred to the extreme.

There are plenty of people I could say I hate and I would like to see dead, but I am not an irrational person and I am not going to act on those thoughts.

This person did.

So did Adam Lanza

[randr]

30. I have posted this around today

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" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[clarice]

38. Excellent *sniff sniff*nt

[deathrind]

32. It would be nice...

But honestly if 20 dead children did not move the common sense meter in a sane directions this will not either.

This issue is symmetrical it is one of the few issues that plays both sides equally and until we recognize that the cost for one side of this issue far out weighs the other side nothing will be done.

[SoCalMusicLover]

34. No, This Is The New Norm

It really should not even be news. We just are drawn to it, so the networks and press cover it.

[Dalziel3979]

36. Sod all.

The only way there will be no more American mass shootings is when there are no more Americans left to be shot.

[SwankyXomb]

96. That's the NRA wet dream

[clarice]

39. I am finding it interesting that there are many posts mentioning....

Sandy Hook....but very few referencing the event in the OP. The Florida Shootings.

[-none]

94. If we had done our duty after Sandy Hook, this last shooting most likely would not have happened.

[clarice]

43. Ok...with all due respect....can we stay away from the Sandy Hook analogies?..I get it..

but the OP was about the Florida Shootings.

[A HERETIC I AM]

52. Your OP was about trying to get people to come together to stop this sort of thing.

You can't expect your readers, unless they were born in the last 2 years to not make the comparison.

Maybe it's time for everyone, right, left, middle, green, LGBT, libertarians, socialists, to come together in a common consensus and present a united policy/face to the world that we will not stand for this sort of outrage.

Do you honestly think that hasn't happened to a large degree?

Political sniping and inter camp bickering between all parties only emboldens our enemies.

What enemies? The guy who committed that atrocity in Orlando last night was an American citizen. What enemies?

If you don't think that terrorists troll chat rooms/forums of every stripe to gauge the responses/mood of the American people in regards to these acts, then I'm sorry, but your kidding yourselves.

So what? And I have not seen a single thread on DU that indicates otherwise.

I for one, am SICK of the blame games and the attempts to politicize these terrible events.

So? You think you are the only one? It is unfortunate, if not downright tragic that the nation has now begin to expect these things.

Is there no common ground upon which everyone can agree that this HAS to stop?

For rational people, sure. But if you can't see that a large segment of the electorate is not rational.....

I guess the first step would have to be recognizing who is actually responsible for these acts...not "who created the climate" but who actually pulled the trigger.

Really? That's YOUR "first step"? I think you'll find that most people made that step pretty quick.

[clarice]

55. As to your last line.. No one here has even ADDRESSED the Florida shootings...

all I'm getting is Sandy Hook.

[A HERETIC I AM]

59. To WHAT DEGREE WOULD YOU LIKE THEM ADDRESSED?!?!?!?!?

Excuse me shouting, but what the hell can be said?

An asshole went into a nightclub and gunned down a shitload of people. It is unique in this country only because of the numbers, but it differs little from any of the mass shootings we have seen over the last ten years.

What is it you want said? That the targets were homosexuals? That it happened in Orlando on a Saturday night? That it was in Micky Mouse's backyard?!? What?

WHAT THE FUCK DIFFERENCE DOES IT MAKE?

Just make the points you keep insisting others make for you, for crying out loud.

[clarice]

62. I obviously struck some sort of nerve...sorry about that....

Have you read or seen any news on the perpetrator of these shootings?

[A HERETIC I AM]

73. The nerve you have struck is your repeated insistence that others make the points,,,,

you obviously want to make yourself, but have yet to do so.

Have I read or seen anything on the douchebag? Sure. He's a whackjob. And he is Muslim. And a Floridian.

So bloody what?

I'm just curious what it is you want the respondents to this thread to say FOR YOU.

That this was an act of terrorism? Well...sure...or maybe not.

That this guy did this because his Imam told him to? Or that he took orders from abroad?

SO WHAT?

[Crunchy Frog]

45. Nice sentiment, but I think more in the realm of fantasy than reality. n/t

[clarice]

47. Just an idea.nt

[Crunchy Frog]

60. I like a good fantasy as much as the next person.

I'll be going back to my Doctor Who videos after I finish reading up on this. I'm just not going to tell myself that it's going to magically bring about some miraculous social change.

[clarice]

64. I thought that my idea was better than useless snarking....apparently you disagree. nt

[Crunchy Frog]

77. What is it that you want, that hasn't already been done?

We're all horrified by this. What more is there that you want? For people to stop talking about the gun issue? To put American Muslims in internment camps? What is it that you want us to unite to do?

[clarice]

81. Admit we have a problem....admit that it is of a foreign nature....

admit that we ALL live in the same Country... and take steps together to curtail more needless loss of life.

[Crunchy Frog]

90. I think we have all admitted there's a problem.

There's some diversity of opinion as to what degree it is domestic or foreign in nature, or to what extent our own gun culture and "freedoms" are playing a role. Also about the role that our own activities in the Middle East may have sown some seeds.

Are you asking to rid this country of diverse opinions, or of opinions that differ from your own? Is that your definition of "uniting"? If so, I think you're going to find yourself disappointed and frustrated.

What steps do you think are going to "curtail more needless loss of life"? Invade more countries? Arrest/deport Muslims? Arm more citizens? Not mention any other recent mass shooting incidents?

I still can't figure out what it is that you want.

[Bluenorthwest]

108. you seem to be asking LGBT to get used to being murdered and that is unacceptable.

It's not cool to nurture the 'opinion' that gay people must die. So do not do that.

[Crunchy Frog]

110. Where the FUCK did you read that in my post!?!?!?!?

I was having a dialogue with another poster that you were not party to, and that you apparently did not read, and are taking completely out of context.

Kindly apologize for your unfounded accusation.

[Crunchy Frog]

111. You seem to be defending the actions of the Stanford rapist, and that is unacceptable.

It's just not cool to nurture the opinion that rape is "okay". So do not do that.

[Dem2]

124. Please just bury your head in the sand

Nazi Trump appreciates your passive support.

[clarice]

46. Also.... I'm getting the feeling that my idea of all parties......

uniting against organized terrorism ( as it is looking like this event was) (If it isn't, I will be the first to say I was wrong) going over so well. Why?

[Crunchy Frog]

57. Is there evidence that this was organized terrorism

as opposed to a single, homophobic, gun obsessed person, who found himself identifying with ISIS?

I've honestly only just found out about this, so don't know the answer. I'll be interested to learn more.

Is there any evidence that he was actively affiliated with ISIS and carrying out their instructions, or just that he had apparent sympathies?

[clarice]

61. No....just taking a que from what was reported on CNN...

that it APPEARED to be realated. I am making no firm accusations, as you will notice from several of my posts.
Ho about the option that I sited in my OP? Let's stay on topic.

[Crunchy Frog]

69. I am staying on topic. I responded to the exact wording of your post.

Also.... I'm getting the feeling that my idea of all parties......

uniting against organized terrorism ( as it is looking like this event was) (If it isn't, I will be the first to say I was wrong) going over so well. Why?

I think pretty much everyone already is against organized terrorism. If you find someone defending it here, please point it out.

[clarice]

75. You haven't read any "we deserve it posts"? ooooops, someone just posted one....

There are many threads with posts exactly like that.... look them up... you'll be amazed.

[spanone]

48. if the children at sandy hook didn't move congress, this will do NOTHING.

[clarice]

51. You did that on purpose. lol

[spanone]

54. it's true. if children being slaughtered wasn't the last straw, there is none.

[clarice]

58. No...what I meant is.....

I realize that Sandy Hook is the new talking point to deflect the act/perpetrator of the Fla. shootings...
That's why I asked responses to be limited to the event at hand.lol

[Kentonio]

105. It's not about 'deflecting' anything.

Its about pointing out to you that the idea that this horrible tragedy will somehow cause the country to change is just a daydream on your part. Why would this change anyones minds when 20 dead little kids didn't? Or are you asking people to 'unite' behind a movement against Muslims?

[Calista241]

53. i doubt it

This attack can easily and pretty truthfully be blamed on terrorists.

Also, while most everyone can relate to having kids, which makes Sandy Hook more "real" to them; not everyone has LGBT friends and family, and is thus harder for people to have a "this could happen to me" reaction.

Just look at the countries reaction to AIDS in the 80's. If you weren't gay, essentially nobody gave a shit. It wasn't later until Magic Johnson and possibly Easy-E contracted AIDS that people considered themselves at risk.

[clarice]

65. I don't think so.... I don't have any LGBT children or relatives...

not even close friends... but that STILL doesn't stop me from Hating this monster.

[Calista241]

70. There's a big difference between hating a guy that killed people

and making big, societal changes to your and your neighbor's lives, rights, and what many people consider their "freedoms".

[clarice]

72. I'm sorry C. ya lost me...what big societal changes did I posit?nt

[Calista241]

74. sorry. I was conflating your post with the OP's premise of "is this the last straw"

Which i interpreted as "can we implement effective gun control now that a shitload of people have been shot."

[clarice]

76. NO way !!!! lol. I'm totally pro second amendment. nt

[Algernon Moncrieff]

63. Last straw for what? For who?

Everyone (well almost everyone) is sad and outraged. We agree on that.

The shooter was a Muslim, on the "FBI radar" but never arrested, and pledged allegiance to ISIS. Score one for anti-Islamic xenophobia. This will certainly re-energize calls for the banning and deportation of Muslims.

Gun control? If Sandy Hook didn't bring about gun control, nothing will. We will hear Wayne LaPierre make the same tired call for everyone to go about armed which --he will argue -- would have stopped the shooter before he could have done so much damage or deterred him altogether. Meanwhile, the left will argue for an AWB that they will never get.

[smirkymonkey]

67. +1000

[clarice]

68. another Sandy Hook mention.nt

[clarice]

71. +1 for the "Bad America team" pitiful.nt

[Fumesucker]

117. Kunduz hospital bombing, 42 dead

US government inarguably responsible, hardly a peep in protest on DU.

[Hekate]

79. Maybe Columbine was the last straw. Maybe Sandy Hook was the last straw. Maybe...

Maybe this country has a streak of madness in it, and a gun god that demands blood sacrifices daily.

[clarice]

83. Or maybe this incident was perpertrated by a lunatic with....

and anti gay, anti American agenda. Would it have made any difference at all if this nut had used poison gas?

[Crunchy Frog]

92. You can't obtain poison gas legally or easily.

There's no "poison gas rights" lobby that I'm aware of.

[Gomez163]

80. Well, Clarice - have the lambs stopped screaming?

[Crunchy Frog]

84. The most sensible post in this thread so far.

[clarice]

85. Yes...but I must ask you to re-read the OP and keep you comments on topic.nt

[Gomez163]

87. Sorry. I was being ironic.

[jberryhill]

128. Your use of "last straw" invites comparisons to previous incidents

You seem frustrated by people bringing up Sandy Hook, Columbine, etc., but you don't seem to understand that your subject line invites discussion of previous incidents by referring to THIS one as the "last straw".

Many people have been out of straws for a while.

No one is disagreeing you, but people are responding to your characterization of this as the "last straw" by pointing out that there is no end to these horrors, and the same thing is said every single time.

[One Black Sheep]

82. Everyone is already united against terrorism

Islamic terrorism, sad to say, is just getting started. You can't stop it, no matter how united.

It is kinda like how everyone is united to stop crime, yea, most people are good citizens and don't want crime to happen. Yet, it still does.

[Bluenorthwest]

109. Your post sounds like a threat.

nt

[clarice]

86. Time for lunch.... be back later.nt

[tabasco]

91. Or maybe it's just another day in America....

another day in the decline of a corrupted democracy.

[Kingofalldems]

95. Do you think we should all vote for Trump?

[Kingofalldems]

100. Here's something to ponder about the GOP:

http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/gop-blocks-bill-stop-terrorists-buying-guns

[TDale313]

104. Thread's not quite going how you hoped, is it?

Not surprising since it is basically a "terrorists bad, stfu about the guns and who was targeted" thread.

I guess you weren't quite clear enough on last thread of what- people keep bringing up Sandy Hook cause they assume you meant (or should have meant) gun violence.

[Eleanors38]

106. Clarice, you have broken the rules of orthodoxy....

and gone beyond the clear failure of not only gun bans as a means of solving a violence problem, but beyond the failure of dialog in general. The reasons for lack of unity are deep and far, far beyond the narrow, failed social policy of gun control. Name the issue, and there is little unity because what brung us to the USA dance in the first place was a set of national myths and legends created by the Mass Media Model. Be it the Big 3 networks, the Dailies, the weekly mags, the goddam Top 40 and Ed Sullivan have all passed by in my adult lifetime. We may have wanted something better with the Innertubes and connectedness, and it may come about down the line, but what we have now is the instant power to discredit anything and anyone at any time. This breeds a profound alienation where the selfies and facebooks do little more than construct a fast-moving self-image; here today, gone tomorrow, with a Lonely Street hangover. Most can put up with this, but many can't, and a few will commit atrocities because the price of legend and myth is cheap with a universal exchange rate: A cure for cancer is as good as shooting up a nightclub, but with too damn much work with too little public notice.

I can (and should) ask you hard questions about What is unity, What is the difference between one atrocity and another? What are the chances your naivete will get anywhere? Are you ignoring bigger questions? But for now, you are the lone picket destroyer in heavy seas at night, trying to inform a fleet you are no longer sure is behind you. I welcome your challenge.

[Albertoo]

115. Well, at times of danger, it might make sense to get some unity vs the danger

Brit, French or Polish politicians bickering among themselves while Hitler was rising..

[Eleanors38]

133. You imply we have very broad dangers, and I agree. Much broader than gun policy.

[alarimer]

118. I wish, but it won't

We'll go back to our lattes and barbeques in a week or two.

[patsimp]

127. I don't believe that people are going to allow themselves to be slaughtered much longer.

And people aren't going to be bullied into staying quiet and not connecting dots.

This killers father is a supporter of the Taliban. The killer pledged allegiance to ISIS. Islamic state hates homosexuals, and like the teachings of the religion state, the penalty is death.

What did the killer do? He killed homosexuals.

It's as direct a line as 911 was to Bin Laden.

[SoCalMusicLover]

131. People Are Idiots

A Third of the population will follow and believe Trump.

Americans also let Shrub convince them that the direct line from 9/11 was really to Sadaam.

The American public will allow it, because the odds of it happening to them are low. Most just expect it won't happen to them.

It is just the price of freedom and living in America.

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

132. Hello Clarice (Hopkins will always do that better)

You've got much on the ball with those thoughts. IMHO a substantial purpose of terrorist work is the demoralization and division of those targeted. Having blame and bicker party here is probably rather satisfying to those that hate us.


re:

"...the first step would have to be recognizing who is actually responsible for these acts...not "who created the climate" but who actually pulled the trigger."

There's some wisdom. Might be tough to accept but wisdom.