((((((((((((((((((GUNS)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) again

[Motley13]

2 yr old kills herself
5 cops dead, several wounded

good ole 2 amendment

Forget ISIS, we are going to finish ourselves for an incorrect interpretation of the 2nd amendment

In the words of Wayne LaPierre
“The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun.”

That worked well. Look up his quotes, insanity. He blames video games & movies.

And just how does a 2 yr old pull a trigger?

Don't forget "guns don't kill people" & regulation wouldn't have work in THIS situation, whatever the situation might be.

Congress DO SOMETHING !!!!!

[stonecutter357]

1. K&R!

[pinboy3niner]

2. K&R!

[livetohike]

3. My friend lost his 14 year old Great Nephew on the 4th of July.

He was watching a fireworks display with his friends - someone drove by and shot into the group. One bullet into his head.

He was 14. Played on a school basketball team and was an honors student. R.I.P. Kinner.

[pinboy3niner]

7. This is beyond tragic, it's insane

The infatuation with gun rights is destroying us.

I am so sorry for your friend and his family.

[livetohike]

8. Thanks. What can any if us do besides vote in people with a

conscience? Vigils, protests, letters. Nothing is changing.

[Glitterati]

4. What the hell did they think the LOGICAL conclusion was?

Put guns in the hands of untrained people, give them permission to shoot anything that moves.

Did the COPS really think they would stop at the badge?

Are we REALLY that stupid that we didn't figure out that when you give PERMISSION to fools with guns they were gonna stop before they got to a cop?

Maybe NOW the police agencies/unions/groups will have the damned sense to stand up and say "Whoa, hold up guys. Maybe this isn't such a good idea." to the NRA.

[groundloop]

5. And let's not forget all the "2nd Amendment Remedy" bullshit spewed by the right

The right wing needs to be held accountable for their "2nd Amendment Remedies" and "Armed Uprising" bullshit comments they've been spewing over the years in response to calls for gun regulations. THIS is what they've been advocating, THEY need to be held accountable for their words.

[doc03]

6. Have we noticed the DU gun lobby has been unusually quiet

the last few hours. Normally if a post would have GUNS in it they come out in force.

[TreasonousBastard]

9. Hmmm, OK...

BUT WE HAVE A CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT!

Would that do?

[pinboy3niner]

11. They're waiting for the talking points to come down

This one's a little tougher so it takes a little longer.

[doc03]

13. That is what I am thinking, gotta hear what Wayne says. n/t

[jonno99]

35. Yes - only the police should be armed...nt

[pipoman]

10. What?...specifically?

"Congress DO SOMETHING !!!!!"

What exactly is it that you believe congress can do? What could they do to prevent this?

No, congress can't do anything. Maybe, oh, I don't know....if police were held responsible for wrong doing....even once in a while.... just waiting for the news from Minnesota that the officer acted entirely lawfully and gets a promotion....

This surely isn't the right remedy, but bad things will happen in the absence of justice....with or without guns.

[pinboy3niner]

14. Throwing up our hands in confusion obviously isn't working

At this point the default position must be to support any and every gun CONTROL measure.

[pipoman]

15. There are none left that will pass constitutional scrutiny...

What congress could possibly do is set guidelines for federal prosecution of police who commit crimes or use poor judgement resulting in injury or death of an innocent person.....

It is time for police reform....this is a horrible tragedy....good police should be pushing for legal remedies and satisfaction for the victims of their bad eggs instead of hiding them...

[pinboy3niner]

16. You've got to be kidding me

Congress has lots of room to act on regulating firearms even within the current restrictions.

Your constant attempts to convince us it's hopeless, nothing we can do, might as well just give up, are both laughable and execrable.

[pipoman]

19. Do enlighten with specifics.

[pinboy3niner]

27. We'll be seeing a lot of gun control proposals

And fuck the gunz-loving crowd, my default position at this point is to support every fucking gun control proposal that comes down the pike.

[pipoman]

37. Support all you wish....

As usual no specifics, just do something even if its wrong....no, you have no specifics because every worn out proposal that is forthcoming is an asked and answered constitutional impossibly....

[pinboy3niner]

38. No, I refuse to play with RKBA assholes with blood dripping from their every post. nt

[pipoman]

40. No you refuse to acknowledge truth in favor of fantasy.

[Javaman]

12. K&R just another hour in america. nt

[Jester Messiah]

17. I've seen this episode already.

Have you ever thought maybe instead of getting hung up on "OMG GUNS" we should consider the prevailing conditions that drive people to use them?

But no, I forgot. "More of the same" is this year's theme.

[Stonepounder]

18. Here's a thought.

SCOTUS says fuck stare decisis. Every now and then we have to admit that a previous decision was just plain wrong. Let's go back to the part about a well-regulated militia and let's take a good hard look at how things are working.

As numerous posts have pointed out, when two kids died after getting themselves locked in an old abandoned refrigerator, we changed the laws to prevent it from happening again. When we looked at automobiles and saw that we could prevent a whole lot of deaths if we made the auto industry make cars safer, we did, and deaths went down. Congress and the courts have all agreed that Constitutional freedoms are not absolute. Peaceable assembly? Get thee to a 'Free Speech Zone'. Freedom of speech? Don't yell 'FIRE' in a crowded theatre if there isn't one, don't commit slander. So, how about some common-sense restrictions on gun ownership. Will it stop all gun violence? Of course not. Did seat belts stop all traffic deaths? Nope. Did seatbelts significantly reduce them? Absolutely. Will common-sense laws regarding gun ownership stop all gun deaths. Nope. Will the reduce them? I don't know, but what we have now sure ain't working.

So, let us do some clarification on the 2nd amendment. Letting every yahoo who wants an arsenal have one just isn't working. If you are a black man with a legal gun, the cops will kill you. If you are a black man without a gun, the cops will kill you. If you are a white yahoo with a gun, you will leave it lying around so your kids can kill themselves. And on and on. And if you think that 'A good guy with a gun can stop a bad guy with a gun, just ask why the Secret Service won't allow guns at the Republican (or, I expect, at the Democratic) Convention, 2nd Amendment be damned.

[pipoman]

20. It is called the amendment process.

[Saviolo]

21. You should consider making this an OP.

Though I suspect it will have a swarm of detractors screaming at you in little to no time flat.

[calimary]

30. Totally. The 2nd Amendment needs amending.

NO ONE is "entitled" to own any damn gun they want, just because they think they're entitled to have it. They're WRONG.

And NO ONE is "entitled" to own a massacre machine - which is all those automatic rifles and long guns and AR-15s and whatever else they're called.

And don't forget, either - there actually WAS a "good guy with a gun" at that mass shooting at the community college in Umpqua Oregon, last fall. He was an Army reservist or some such, as I recall. I saw him interviewed later. He was taking classes there - and was IN the classroom next door when the shooting started. He also had a gun with him. And he spoke about thinking, instinctively, "gee, I could go help - I'm one of those 'good guys with a gun'." But then he thought better of it, realizing clearly (and accurately) that doing so would only add to the carnage. The police wouldn't know who he was. No way they could know! They'd have no idea whether he was another shooter or not. It wasn't like he was in communication with them or their command center so they even could know. So his own cooler head prevailed and he kept his gun holstered, and he hunkered down in the classroom and did not try to become some Rambo commando or some other ridiculous misconception.

[groundloop]

32. As poorly written as it is "well regulated militia" has to be in there for a reason

You make excellent points. Obviously the NRA and weapon manufacturers will have us believe that the 2nd Amendment simply means that people should be allowed to own whatever killing machine suits their fancy. But if that's what was intended why did they bother to write "well regulated militia" into the 2nd Amendment and not just come out and say - everybody has the right to own whatever guns they choose? Furthermore, they couldn't have possibly foreseen the highly efficient killing machines being produced today.

[ProudProgressiveNow]

34. +1000 nt

[bucolic_frolic]

22. We were safer

when hunters kept their guns at home or at the target range or in the woods

and the only armed people who showed up to disturbances were the police

When was this ... the 1950s, 1960s, 1970s?

[Cryptoad]

23. Only an Idiot

would believe that passing laws that make it easier for Idiots to have guns, would help reduce the number of idiots killing people with guns!

[Katashi_itto]

24. I like cereal.

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

25. But...but....muh riiiioots!!!!

Freeeedumb and duh constitoootion and shit......

[Patiod]

26. Some idiot on FB referred to guns as "a distraction"

She was decrying the issues around income inequality, and said guns were "just a distraction"

Uh, no. Someone with a slingshot didn't target those Dallas cops. Those two men killed this week weren't murdered because the police thought they had a knife. Guns are at the heart of this nonsense.

[TeddyR]

28. Do what exactly?

Pass an "assault weapons" ban? Such a ban would probably be constitutional but there's no political will to get it done, and even then it would take years to get these weapons off the streets. Most everything else being proposed - background checks for example - is simple feel-good laws that will make little difference in the long run, but I'm fine with those too. You aren't going to stop madmen from making these types of attacks.

[calimary]

31. Well doing nothing is certainly not an option.

We've already tried that, and we can see painfully clearly how "well" that's worked out.

[Stonepounder]

36. So, what is/are your suggestion(s)?

Saying this won't work or that won't work isn't particularly helpful. I think we can all agree that we have a problem with guns in this country. So, what do you believe we can do to try and stop the carnage? While the NRA sits back and cheers every shooting with a call for more guns, and Smith & Wesson sees their stock skyrocket, what can we, as a nation, do to reduce gun violence? Or are you suggesting that there is no solution and we simply have to accept the violence as a cost of living in the 'land of the free'?

[mainstreetonce]

29. These killers are armed

With weapons and magazines that should be banned.
Police cannot protect themselves against angry gun slingers who have military style weapons.

We have to deal with this problem.

[oasis]

33. Weapons like those should not be available to the public. Period.

[billh58]

39. K & R!

The right-wing "if you don't have a gun, you're not a real American" crowd is thinning, and predictably so. Unfortunately, they will enable corrupt politicians to allow the carnage to continue until we vote sane people into office.

The ball's in our court.