Does anyone of DU actually care about the war on Iraq?

[Victor_c3]

It seems most/all on this forum are quick to forget about Iraq, the wealth we squandered over there, and the lives wasted - both Iraqi and American.

I'm both disappointed and perplexed by not only the eagerness in which the majority of DU members wish to forget about Iraq and sweep it away to a forgotten corner, but that the American people and electorate at large are just quick to forget it.

Seriously!?!? How can anyone with the slightest tinge of a soul or a conscience be so quick to give our politicians a pass on their support for the violence our country had inflicted or the Iraqi people?

I don't get it. Please, someone, explain this to me. Don't the dead American lives mean anything to anyone? What about the dead Iraqis? What about those disabled by the war?

When people find out I'm a veteran they are quick to thank me for my service. However, if my service actually meant anything to the American people then why aren't the American people holding those who pushed for that war responsible for the millions of lives ruined by that war?

[lapfog_1]

1. we are so uninterested

that we voted for one of the few people in our government who opposed the Iraq war for President.

and elected him twice.

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

5. And he in turn wanted to look "forward" not back...

while the Dem leadership told the American people that impeachment was "off the table."

good times...

[lapfog_1]

9. so what would have made you happy?

during the largest economic crises to face the US since the great depression, we were to put someone on trial for lying us into war... someone who is now no reviled by both sides that he couldn't even campaign for his own brother for dog catcher much less for President. And for what? Firing squad? Life in prison? Would that make you happy?

It wouldn't bring back the thousands of Americans lost, the 100s of thousands of Iraqis lost, the trillions of dollars spent.

The only positive thing we can do is never ever let a Republican in the White House again.

And hope that the Democratic leadership never leads us into another unnecessary war.

[reddread]

14. im guessing a little justice to restore shattered faith

and shattered lives.

[lapfog_1]

18. What would be "justice"?

would it be justice to incarcerate the former President and Vice President...

and give the rabid right even more reasons to hate the left and never work with a Democratic House or Democratic Senate ever again.

You KNOW that they would claim that the trial was a political show trial and many Americans, including not a few Dems, would agree with them.

Democrats would have lost the House, Senate, AND the Presidency.

So for the millions of lives that now have Obama care and the millions of women who can still go to Planned Parenthood and the LGBT community that now have the right (mostly) to live their lives and serve in the military and all of the other dozens of progressive goals either left in place or actually met... we should have put that all at risk for "justice".

I spit on justice... there is no justice in this world... and no sentence of prison time would ever be enough to counter the horror that is/was the Iraq war. It would not deter the next repuke running for President (you think a Donald Trump would EVER stop a war action or reconsider one based on Shrub being in jail?).

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

19. Happy is irrelevant to the rule of law and punishing

those for high crimes and misdemeanors.

There is justice and then there are excuses that negate justice.

The Nuremberg Trials did not bring back the millions who died, but it gave them a voice: "never again."

When our own politicians are allowed to skate, after causing the deaths of so many, then We The People are accountable for doing nothing.

"The only positive thing we can do is never ever let a Republican in the White House again."

That may be, but I consider myself to be reality-based. Would you feel the same way if Bushhad been responsible for the deaths of tens of thousands of Americans?

I believe not.

[lapfog_1]

22. Bush WAS responsible for the deaths of 10s of thousands of Americans

The death toll is only just begun.

All of the Blowback that is ISIS and the wars we are fighting still and possibly the ones to come and the terrorism that is Orlando and San Bernadino and Nice and Paris and Istanbul and... and ...

All of it can be directly linked to the decision to go to war with Iraq.

And, no, I don't think putting Shrub and Cheney in jail would be worth it.

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

37. So your post states...

1) Bush was responsible...

2) You don't believe incarcerating Bush would be wirth it.

Equals) You don't believe in the rule of law

[RandiFan1290]

2. I see people try to bring it up a lot on DU

They are set upon and attacked for it by the Islamaphobes with very little defense from other members.

[reddread]

16. it is important to focus on the alleged locus of blame

if you dont want people thinking about what is really behind
these strategic crises. who benefits.

[guillaumeb]

27. Some of us do attack what "appears" to be Islamophobia at DU.

There was a thread yesterday that repeated many of the same tired, GOP talking points about Muslim intolerance. The poster received quite a number of attacks and rebuttals. It was nice to see.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

3. Clinton voted for the war, Trump did not.

So, are we supposed to vote for Trump?

War is one issue, a big one, but there are more issues to help decide my vote. I wish GHWB hadn't started the war with Iraq, with all the loss of lives and treasure. I'll still vote for Clinton.

And, as much as you hate to hear it, thanks for your service!

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

8. There was no mention of Trump in the OP.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

11. And no mention of Clinton either.

just a general reference to "politicians", two of whom are running for President.

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

15. " So, are we supposed to vote for Trump?"

It's a strange takeaway from the OP...IMHO.

[Jim Beard]

33. We all need to reply to the people who would attack all the

New York politicians that voted for the war. It was their turf that was attack and not many miles from Bill Clinton's office.

[Loki]

4. Are you serious?

Who keeps beating the drums of war in this country? My family has served this country since the Revolutionary War up through and including Desert Storm, but we have had and still have people in power who support the Military Industrial Complex and will continue to do that until we rid ourselves of its power and influence. President Eisenhower warned us and we have ignored that warning. If Obama would have removed all the troops from Afghanistan and Iraq and closed Guantanamo, they would have impeached him, yes impeached him. How would that have saved any lives? If you think that because I didn't support Bernie Sander's for president because he didn't support the Iraq war, then somehow I don't care for the lives of our military members and their families, then you really don't know where my family has been.

[still_one]

6. Does anyone on DU actually care about the holocaust?

What kind of strawman are you setting up?

The Iraq war is talked about at DU. The Viet Nam War is talked about at DU. WWII is talked about, as are the horrors of war and senselessness of wars

Your implied "judgement" that somehow DU is insensitive to war is wrong.

During the primaries the Iraq War, brought up, and no doubt will be brought up in the general election

Perhaps you should dismount from your horse

[shenmue]

28. Yep

[LuvNewcastle]

7. I don't talk about it much because it

makes me so angry and upset to even think about it. What really pisses me off, though, is when people I know, all of them Fox viewers, claim that Saddam really had WMDs all along. I want to pinch their heads off.

[Motley13]

10. I'm tired of our young people being killed for nothing

so yes I do care.

I'm tired of their people being killed

[emulatorloo]

12. Strawman argument. Yes DU'ers remember and care about Iraq War

Somebody promoted your Strawman Argument that DU'ers don't care about the Iraq War a few months ago. The Strawman was false then, and it is false today.

[Doodley]

13. Insulting OP.

[bigwillq]

17. I do

It was a mistake and a disaster and those folks who supported it, voted for it, etc should be held accountable.

[msanthrope]

20. I forgave Kerry and Biden their votes. I'll forgive HRC. Hypocritical to do otherwise. nt

[shenmue]

29. Amen

[msanthrope]

30. Interesting, isn't it? Tells you a bit about who voted for whom. nt

[sammythecat]

34. No, it's not hypocritical

to forgive one and not the other. Some, I suppose, were actually gullible/stupid enough to actually believe the lies of the Bush administration despite pleas and warnings from their fellow colleagues, worldwide condemnation of the planned invasion, common sense, and a complete absence of any evidence supporting the claims of the administration. Stupidity can be forgiven, but it should have precluded any subsequent bids for re-election.

Others, however, knew the truth. They also knew that to get along they had to go along, and go along they did. The resulting financial cost and price paid in blood and ruined lives was unknown at the time of the IWR, but whatever it turned out to be, their political careers were worth more than other peoples money and other peoples lives. Without a sincere act of contrition this kind of self-interest and moral cowardice in a leader is unforgivable. We have not heard anything close to sincere contrition from any of these people, only lies and deflections that insult the intelligence.

The much needed purge of the stupid and the cowardly from the House and Senate never happened and we are left with what we've got. I'm a Democrat and believe in the ideals of the Democratic Party. Forgiven or unforgiven, I will vote for the Democratic nominee.

[msanthrope]

35. Shorter: I won't forgive the female. nt

[sammythecat]

38. I didn't give names.

As far as I'm concerned, the whole sorry lot of them should have been gone by now. They're not, and they're what we have to work with now. I can't say for sure which one's voted out of stupidity, I haven't made a study of it and it doesn't matter anyway, all of them should be gone. Stupid can be forgiven, but still needs to find another job. The "female", as you put it, was not one of the stupid ones. We can all agree she is whip smart and not easily fooled.

I was all in for Hillary since Bill took office. 100%. I always hoped she'd run for the Presidency some day. Her gender was a plus. Half the population is female and it was way past time we had a female President. The IWR changed my opinion on a whole bunch of people, Hillary included. Nevertheless, we Democrats have a job to do. We have to defeat Donald Trump. The way to do that job is to vote in November for Hillary Clinton. That is what I intend to do.

Here's something else: I resent very much you're not-very-veiled accusation of misogyny. What the hell! Do you just toss out serious accusations like that whenever someone disagrees with you or what? Nothing I've said in this post or in any of my previous 3,168 posts going back over a dozen years would give you any reason or right to make such a sneaky suggestion. So, unless you can back it up you can take that shit elsewhere.

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

21. Yes, I do. We're still fighting it.

It's called Daesh now and it is spreading.

Our politicians backed this war, and they should be held accountable for it.

[LWolf]

23. I care.

I have never supported the fucking "war on terror." I didn't support it then, I don't support it now.

[muriel_volestrangler]

24. DUers have been calling for Bush, Cheney etc. to be prosecuted for over a decade

especially after the Democrats won the House in 2006 (the name calling of Pelosi when she made it clear she wasn't going to impeach them was pretty nasty). But, in practice, the USA is not going to prosecute them; the votes for impeachment were never there in the Senate, and the USA doesn't have clear laws about prosecuting for falsely presenting the case for war. Since the majority of politicians, and the populace, went along with it at the time, it ends up being a political position rather than an obvious case of something they can be punished for. After a few years, posting "we must hold them responsible" again loses any chance of making any difference.

[Demonaut]

25. Does anyone on DU care about the plight of whales anymore?

or the trade in ivory

please add your outrage below

[asiliveandbreathe]

26. Victor_c3 - All in good time will the bushco be held

responsible..it takes time - in the public forum they have been judged and the sentence is still being carried out every day with so much public humiliation - should they stand trial? - you bet - but who is going to do it -

Right now we are in the fight of our countries future - your's and mine -

You have used a very wide brush to paint all of us here at DU with not supporting our military - forgetting about Iraq..it should never have happened in the first place..and we are fighting to make sure it doesn't happen again....

My retired Navy Chief E-8 son (he is visiting) and I, wish you well and ask that you join in the fight and GOTV.....be well...

[edhopper]

31. Almost everyone on DU

was for prosecuting the war criminals.

Obama was not going to do it.

So after 8 years, we stopped talking about it.

Doesn't mean we don't care and what happens there doesn't break our hearts.

Right now we are focused on stopping the worst man to every run for office.

[AwakeAtLast]

32. I'm an OIF Veteran spouse

I have been here since 2004, when my husband was in Basic and our daughter was two. He served in between Fallujah and Ramadi, going back and forth in 2005-06. He has hearing loss, short-term memory loss an a mild TBI.

DUers have been some of the most supportive out of all my contacts from those dark days until today.

DUers have fought hard to elect people who are not quick to advocate for war and line the pockets of the profiteers. That's what it takes.

It's also going to take a Congress that will actually do something. We have to support our downticket races in all 50 states.

[Nye Bevan]

36. People don't usually post about an issue unless there is something new to say.

There was plenty of discussion here a few weeks ago when the Chilcott Report was issued, for example. But just because people are not still posting stuff like "Hey, wasn't it horrible how Bush started a war based on lies" doesn't mean that DUers don't still care about it.