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Thu Nov 24, 2016, 09:14 AM

Mining Would Be Exciting For Kids: Trumps Secretary Of Education Wants Legal Child Labor

Seriously, WTF is wrong with these people?
Betsy DeVos is a far fringe lunatic. Her husband is a (SC)amway heir, her brother is Erik Price of Blackwater infamy.

http://winningdemocrats.com/mining-would-be-exciting-for-kids-trumps-secretary-of-education-wants-legal-child-labor/

On Wednesday, Trump announced Betsy DeVos as the person he wants overseeing education in this country for the next four years. DeVos is a billionaire conservative donor who supports school vouchers and diverted public funds to religious schools, which would be a major violation of the separation of church and state since tax dollars would flow to “Christian” schools.

But DeVos is even more dangerous because of her ties to groups that want to take poor children out of the classroom and stick them straight into the workforce doing dangerous jobs like coal mining.

Acton Institute is funded by DeVos, and it advocates for the end of child labor laws.


They are on the streets, in the factories, in the mines, with adults and with peers, learning and doing. They are being valued for what they do, which is to say being valued as people. They are earning money.

Whatever else you want to say about this, it’s an exciting life. You can talk about the dangers of coal mining or selling newspapers on the street. But let’s not pretend that danger is something that every young teen wants to avoid. If you doubt it, head over the stadium for the middle school football game in your local community, or have a look at the wrestling or gymnastic team’s antics at the gym.


Here's a link to the Thinktank-
http://blog.acton.org/archives/89837-bring-back-child-labor-work-is-a-gift-our-kids-can-handle.html

The abundant prosperity of the modern age has brought many blessings when it comes to child-rearing and child development, offering kids new opportunities for education, play, and personal development. Yet even as we celebrate our civilizational departure from excessive child labor, we ought to be wary of falling into a different sort of lopsided lifestyle.

Alas, as a day-to-day reality, work has largely vanished from modern childhood, with parents constantly stressing over the values of study and practice and “social interaction” even as they insulate their children from any activity that might involve risk, pain, or boredom. As a result, many of our kids are coming far too late to the arena of creative service and all it brings: dignity, meaning, freedom, virtue, creativity, character, and neighbor love.

Operating out of fear of the harsh excesses of “harder times,” we have allowed our cultural attitudes to swing too far in the opposite direction, distorting work as a “necessary obligation of adulthood,” a gift too dangerous for kids. Working from these same distorted attitudes, the Washington Post recently published what it described as a “haunting” photo montage of child laborers from America’s rougher past.


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Reply Mining Would Be Exciting For Kids: Trumps Secretary Of Education Wants Legal Child Labor (Original post)
Snarkoleptic Nov 2016 OP
octoberlib Nov 2016 #1
Drahthaardogs Nov 2016 #26
octoberlib Nov 2016 #33
Drahthaardogs Nov 2016 #35
smirkymonkey Nov 2016 #2
RKP5637 Nov 2016 #3
Post removed Nov 2016 #4
Grey Lemercier Nov 2016 #23
baldguy Nov 2016 #5
MrModerate Nov 2016 #7
Afromania Nov 2016 #6
ananda Nov 2016 #8
Snarkoleptic Nov 2016 #11
eleny Nov 2016 #32
Snarkoleptic Nov 2016 #34
KingCharlemagne Nov 2016 #47
tblue37 Nov 2016 #39
Feeling the Bern Nov 2016 #41
Grey Lemercier Nov 2016 #24
neeksgeek Nov 2016 #9
Chemisse Nov 2016 #14
KingCharlemagne Nov 2016 #48
whathehell Nov 2016 #10
The Velveteen Ocelot Nov 2016 #51
whathehell Nov 2016 #52
Dustlawyer Nov 2016 #12
Mc Mike Nov 2016 #13
lostnfound Nov 2016 #15
NickB79 Nov 2016 #16
kcr Nov 2016 #31
Ilsa Nov 2016 #17
SharonAnn Nov 2016 #20
Ilsa Nov 2016 #28
onethatcares Nov 2016 #18
gollygee Nov 2016 #19
milestogo Nov 2016 #21
keithbvadu2 Nov 2016 #22
tblue37 Nov 2016 #37
mascarax Nov 2016 #25
ck4829 Nov 2016 #27
tblue37 Nov 2016 #38
gollygee Nov 2016 #40
Initech Nov 2016 #29
Yavin4 Nov 2016 #30
tblue37 Nov 2016 #36
Snarkoleptic Nov 2016 #44
tblue37 Nov 2016 #50
Mc Mike Nov 2016 #58
tblue37 Nov 2016 #59
Mc Mike Nov 2016 #61
Mc Mike Dec 2016 #62
Maru Kitteh Nov 2016 #42
Snarkoleptic Nov 2016 #45
duffyduff Nov 2016 #43
Hekate Nov 2016 #46
kskiska Nov 2016 #49
KK9 Nov 2016 #55
pansypoo53219 Nov 2016 #53
smirkymonkey Nov 2016 #54
tblue37 Nov 2016 #60
NastyRiffraff Nov 2016 #56
yortsed snacilbuper Nov 2016 #57
MineralMan Dec 2016 #63

Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 09:16 AM

1. This is sick.

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Response to octoberlib (Reply #1)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 11:51 AM

26. Fuck it

I am not fighting anymore. My grandfather was at Ludlow, met mother Jones and fought like hell to unionize because people were dying. Let the Republicans do what they will. We have forgotten and it only took a generation.

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Response to Drahthaardogs (Reply #26)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 06:17 PM

33. Oh wow, your grandfather was on the frontlines doing all the hard work.

Don't these Trump voters in the Rust belt know that it wasn't only the manufacturing jobs but the unions that gave them a middle class lifestyle complete with pensions for when they retired? So discouraging.

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Response to octoberlib (Reply #33)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 08:54 PM

35. It WAS the unions

In the old days, if one union struck, they ALL struck. They sold out. Trump is going to screw them over bad.

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 09:25 AM

2. What a sick, sick person! Trump is declaring war on the American evidenced by the people he is

appointing to his cabinet. Like John Cleese said, "it's like he is assembling the crew of a pirate ship".

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Response to smirkymonkey (Reply #2)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 09:26 AM

3. Exactly!!! "it's like he is assembling the crew of a pirate ship".n/t

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)


Response to Post removed (Reply #4)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 11:33 AM

23. ...

 

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 09:41 AM

5. Of course, it wouldn't apply to white kids.

 

Trump supporters have nothing to fear.

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Response to baldguy (Reply #5)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 10:04 AM

7. Except it's their kids who are stuck at home, hopeless, jobless . . .

. . . and crippled by bad education and nonsensical notions that make them effectively unemployable -- even in industries that have long since disappeared.

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 09:45 AM

6. holy shit

HOLY!
SHIT!

I can't even begin to formulate a reasonable response to this woman. I read her comments to my entire family and they can't believe it.

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 10:08 AM

8. This country is regressing so far back it's unreal!

Pretty soon, everything we hold dear will be privatized,
corrupted, and unaffordable for most.

Labor unions -- forget them.

Social Security and Medicare -- privatized

Healthcare -- no longer affordable for most

Workers' rights -- think zero

Civil and human rights -- think zero again

And now privatized schools and child labor!

We are losing everything our ancestors fought
and died for!

I hate where this country is going, just to make
the Trumps and their minions rich!

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Response to ananda (Reply #8)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 10:36 AM

11. It's horrifying how quickly their rotten deeds can undo progress.

Here are some photos of kids at the coal mine "being valued for what they do, which is to say being valued as people. They are earning money."
And as they say over at the DeVos-funded thinktank, "Whatever else you want to say about this, it’s an exciting life."
They also aren't being deprived of "dignity, meaning, freedom, virtue, creativity, character, and neighbor love." (not sure WTF "neighbor love" is)
In sum, we must resist the temptation to coddle kids and refer to child labor as "a gift too dangerous for kids".
I mean, look at the happy faces of freedom!1!1!

http://www.shorpy.com/shorpy

December 1910. "Shorpy Higginbotham, a 'greaser' on the tipple at Bessie Mine, of the Sloss-Sheffield Steel and Iron Co. in Alabama. Said he was 14 years old, but it is doubtful. Carries two heavy pails of grease, and is often in danger of being run over by the coal cars."



A view of the Pennsylvania Breaker. “Breaker Boys” remove rocks and other debris from the coal by hand as it passes beneath them. The dust is so dense at times as to obscure the view and penetrates the utmost recesses of the boys’ lungs. South Pittston, Pennsylvania.

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Reply #11)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 06:15 PM

32. Thank for posting about Shorpy

He came to mind as soon as I saw this thread. I knew a DUer would post pictures of him and other kids and there you were.

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Response to eleny (Reply #32)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 08:28 PM

34. Seems the current batch of conservatives longs for the 1900-1910 era.

No women voting, plenty of child labor, fewer regulations....a hellscape to most is their idea of utopia.
hi: :

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Reply #34)

Fri Nov 25, 2016, 01:54 AM

47. Back to 1859 and the "land of cotton," I think you mean. - nt

 

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Reply #11)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 09:11 PM

39. Pic of my grandpa in the Pennsylvania coal mines--post #36 below.

He started in the mines at age 13. He eventually died of black lung disease.

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Response to tblue37 (Reply #39)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 09:30 PM

41. Black Lung Disease puts hair on your chest and makes frail little boys real men!

 

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Response to ananda (Reply #8)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 11:35 AM

24. you are wide awake

 

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 10:30 AM

9. 6 children died in a school bus crash? That's nothing!

Trump will give us headlines like "60 children killed in mine collapse!"

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Response to neeksgeek (Reply #9)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 10:46 AM

14. But that's okay, because teenagers crave danger.

So of course they should be given it!

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Response to neeksgeek (Reply #9)

Fri Nov 25, 2016, 01:55 AM

48. I blame Obama, er, Hillary :sarcasm: - nt

 

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 10:36 AM

10. Yes, Newt Gingrich liked that idea too.

Let's repeal 100 year old Child Labor laws and go back to the Gilded Robber baron years.

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Response to whathehell (Reply #10)

Fri Nov 25, 2016, 02:51 PM

51. It was Gingrich who suggested

that the poor kids could be put to work as janitors in the public schools instead of the unionized janitors:

"You say to somebody, you shouldn't go to work before you're what, 14, 16 years of age, fine," Mr. Gingrich said. "You're totally poor. You're in a school that is failing with a teacher that is failing. I've tried for years to have a very simple model. Most of these schools ought to get rid of the unionized janitors, have one master janitor and pay local students to take care of the school. The kids would actually do work, they would have cash, they would have pride in the schools, they'd begin the process of rising."

http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2011/11/newt-gingrich-thinks-school-children-should-work-as-janitors/248837/

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Response to The Velveteen Ocelot (Reply #51)

Fri Nov 25, 2016, 02:53 PM

52. I know..Totally disgusting,

but hey..It's one more way to eliminate unions, right?

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 10:38 AM

12. DeVos and the Kochs, Daltons and other Plutocrats want to bring back serfdom.

They fund ALEC which lets them pass laws killing unions, think tanks and Astroturf groups designed to fool average Americans to do what they want to screw the 99% and further enrich themselves!

Welcome to fascism!!!

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 10:42 AM

13. Mackinac Center for Public Policy funded by DeVos, Kochs:

" In March 2011, as protests over Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker's proposal to effectively end public sector collective bargaining continued to grow in Wisconsin, the Mackinac Center for Public Policy issued Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) requests for three Michigan Universities, the University of Michigan, Wayne State University and Michigan State University. The request targeted any emails containing: “collective bargaining,” “Wisconsin,” “Madison,” “Scott Walker” or “Maddow.” The requests target labor studies faculty at each school. [57] USA Today wrote that Mackinac's "demands for professors' e-mails about Wisconsin's public employee labor strife is causing an uproar among some who suggest the Freedom of Information Act requests aim to intimidate pro-labor dissenters and stifle academic freedom." [57]

The FOIA request was very similar to one submitted by the Republican Party of Wisconsin to University of Wisconsin-Madison historian William J. Cronon during the same week, after the professor had published a blog post questioning the role of the American Legislative Exchange Council in Governor Walker's anti-union legislation. [58] Paul Krugman of the New York Times wrote " there’s a clear chilling effect when scholars know that they may face witch hunts whenever they say things the G.O.P. doesn’t like." [59]

Like the Wisconsin GOP's request for Cronon's emails, Mackinac's request posed some concerns for university professors because the request could be an attempt to quell political opposition. [60] In a New York Times article, Director of Academic Freedom for the American Association of University Professors, Greg Scholtz, said, “We think all this will have a chilling effect on academic freedom. We’ve never seen FOIA requests used like this before.”[61] "

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php/Mackinac_Center_for_Public_Policy#Chilling_Academic_Freedom.3F

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 10:47 AM

15. Those tiny fingers can clean the barrel of the gun.. nt

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 10:59 AM

16. Not that I'm defending this crazy shit, but child labor has always been legal for farm kids

I remember feeding cattle and pigs in the barn when I was 5, of shoveling manure when I was 8, and picking rocks in the field, baling hay, milking cows, collecting eggs, butchering chickens, castrating pigs, driving the tractors, and helping to repair buildings and equipment by the age of 10. Small farms can't operate without all the family members working together, because hired hands can be expensive if you need them more than once or twice a week.

It did teach me a lot of valuable life lessons and instilled a strong work ethic I still have today, but it was also hard, dangerous work sometimes. Apparently my mom kept a journal for the first decade after they started farming, and one entry I found simply says: "July 25, 1983. Nick kicked by a cow today." I guess I was kicked by a cow when I was 3 years old, and my mom didn't think very much of it?!?!

It's not a life I wanted for my family, which is one of the reasons I didn't take over the family farm.

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Response to NickB79 (Reply #16)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 06:02 PM

31. This is true. But it shouldn't have been.

The fact farmers got an exemption was wrong.

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 11:17 AM

17. Does trump even know what these assholes stand for?

Or do his handlers just minimize their cruel, evil philosophies to get them in place, keeping the ignorant president-elect in the dark?

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Response to Ilsa (Reply #17)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 11:28 AM

20. The voters in Michigan should've already know what was going to happen.

And those in Wisconsin, too.

It was obvious that he was going to do what the governors in those states, and Kansas, etc. were going to do country-wide. And since they can do it on a grander sacale, the theft of tax money for private benefit will be on a grander scale.

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Response to SharonAnn (Reply #20)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 03:52 PM

28. I think most people in the US, sadly, are too

incapable of critical thinking. Unless someone draws a line from points A to B to C, they can't get to C. Instead, they are just distracted by hype and fuelled by hatred.

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 11:18 AM

18. all this shit comes out of the mouths

of people that never dug a footer, broke a concrete slab with a sledge hammer, pushed a lawnmower over a 1/4 acre lot, shoveled coal into a shaker.

Nope, they are the gilded elite and think all this builds character in the peons.

Will America accept or reject this crap is the next question.

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 11:23 AM

19. Greed and heartlessness

How many sociopaths are there in the GOP anyway?

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 11:29 AM

21. Let the Trump offspring lead the way into coal mining work.

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 11:31 AM

22. So those are the coal jobs Trump wants to bring back.

With reduced safety regulations and below minimum wage as well.

How many of her progeny will enjoy such 'dignity'?

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Response to keithbvadu2 (Reply #22)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 09:09 PM

37. See my post #36 below. Coal mining destroyed Grandpa's lungs. He went to the mines at age 13. nt

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 11:49 AM

25. Wouldn't she want children going door to door, selling Amway?

Another sales channel! Yes, sarcasm.

This is all just so very bad. Not sarcasm.

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 12:07 PM

27. "valued as people. They are earning money"

I don't even know where to begin with something like that.

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Response to ck4829 (Reply #27)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 09:09 PM

38. Because to a Republican, people who don't earn money have no value at all as people. nt

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Response to ck4829 (Reply #27)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 09:21 PM

40. Republicanism in a nutshell

If you don't make someone money, you're worthless.

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 04:10 PM

29. God could this get any worse?

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Response to Initech (Reply #29)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 04:14 PM

30. Yes. A military draft.

Should happen any time now.

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 09:07 PM

36. At age 13, my grandfather, who came from Sicily as an immigrant,

Last edited Thu Nov 24, 2016, 09:46 PM - Edit history (1)

started working in the coal mines in Pennsylvania. These are pictures of him at age 18, still in the mines:






He died of black lung disease in 1969.

If this jerk thinks mining is all that much fun, why doesn't he do it?

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Response to tblue37 (Reply #36)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 11:50 PM

44. Amazing pix!

Thanks for sharing.

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Reply #44)

Fri Nov 25, 2016, 02:41 PM

50. From a book about child labor in the mines. nt

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Response to tblue37 (Reply #36)

Sat Nov 26, 2016, 12:20 PM

58. My mom's grand dad immigrated here from Sicily and worked in PA mines.

He'd worked in sulfur mining in Sicily from age 7.

In Yatesboro, he was a spokesperson for the immigrant miners and met with John L. Lewis on their behalf, right before WWI.

There are 2 good mine organizing movies, The Molly Maguires about Irish Miners organizing in Shamokin county, PA in the late 1870's, and Matewan, a John Sayles movie about the war between WV mining townspeople and the Baldwin Phelps agents hired by the coal operators in Mingo County right after WWI.

The Maguires movie shows child laborers acting as breakers, busting up the big lumps of coal to make it more shippable and easier to burn.

The Matewan movie shows how the coal company imported Italian immigrants and Southern Blacks to work in the mines, to try and divide and conquer the workers and prevent union organizing.

Both good movies.

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Response to Mc Mike (Reply #58)

Sat Nov 26, 2016, 11:25 PM

59. I remember "The Molly McGuires." Saw it when it first came out. (I am old.)

My grandfather lived in Pittston, PA. He immigrated from Montedoro, Sicily. Where did your grandfather come from in Sicily? Maybe we are related.

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Response to tblue37 (Reply #59)


Response to tblue37 (Reply #59)

Sat Dec 3, 2016, 11:17 AM

62. Well, no offense was meant by my last re to your post 59, but I deleted it anyhow. nt

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 09:56 PM

42. "Valued as people" TYPICAL of RW assholes to think that children and others are not valued

as people unless they have money or are making money.

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Response to Maru Kitteh (Reply #42)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 11:54 PM

45. Seems to me it's more like...

they're not "Valued as people" unless they are exploited (and their childhood stolen) by wealthy X-tians.
DeVos is a major jeebus freak, as is her brother Erik Prince.
They use religious dogma to control others and enhance their wealth.

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2016, 11:14 PM

43. Time for the Senate to shoot this nutbagger's nomination down. n/t

 

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Fri Nov 25, 2016, 12:47 AM

46. KnR

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Fri Nov 25, 2016, 02:52 AM

49. Would Black Lung be considered a pre-existing condition?

And would they have health insurance at all?

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Response to kskiska (Reply #49)

Fri Nov 25, 2016, 06:43 PM

55. Medicare...

Black Lung Disease is one of the few diagnoses that will qualify one for Medicare coverage regardless of age.

Of course, Paul Ryan and friends have plans to destroy Medicare too.

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Fri Nov 25, 2016, 04:34 PM

53. minimum wage serfdom here we come.

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Fri Nov 25, 2016, 05:12 PM

54. And when the kids get black lung disease and other occupational related disorders,

well "eff them" because those are just hazards that go with the territory, right you heartless beyotch? In your world, they won't deserve decent healthcare either.

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Response to smirkymonkey (Reply #54)

Sat Nov 26, 2016, 11:26 PM

60. Of course the rich folks wouldn't want THEIR kids to prove their value as people

or share in all that exciting fun by working in the mines.

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Fri Nov 25, 2016, 06:57 PM

56. Coal mining is just like selling newspapers on the street

Whatever else you want to say about this, it’s an exciting life. You can talk about the dangers of coal mining or selling newspapers on the street. But let’s not pretend that danger is something that every young teen wants to avoid. If you doubt it, head over the stadium for the middle school football game in your local community, or have a look at the wrestling or gymnastic team’s antics at the gym.


An exciting life. The greed and stupidity is breathtaking. This alone ought to disqualify DeVos.

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Fri Nov 25, 2016, 09:47 PM

57. My Dad owned a one man coal mine,

when I was little and I helped him work in it, he had a two man saw and I would help him cut locust posts to hold up the roof, he had a hand drill and would drill a hole in the seam and tamp in dynamite and the a blasting cap, we would hide around the corner and he used a nine volt battery to blast the coal out (fire in the hole), we would use a wheelbarrow to haul the coal out to his 1950 Chevy pickup truck and then take it to be weighed, he got $5.00 a ton, it was custom coal for home furnaces. When he finally quit working it the EPA made him blow up the entrance.

My dad started working in coal mines when he was a little kid and had every bone in his body broke in a mining accident once, he died from black lung disease.

My Grand Pap came from Wales and was a Welsh coal miner in the old country.

All the guys in my home town voted for trump, they think he’s going to bring coal back, it’s sad.

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Response to Snarkoleptic (Original post)

Sat Dec 3, 2016, 12:10 PM

63. Didn't we try that already?

Here's a photo of some "breaker boys" in PA.


Here's another photo from PA showing excited children in a coal mine:

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