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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsDid Trump warn someone of this Tweet, giving them insider information AKA Insider Trading?
Quixote1818
(28,903 posts)zero unless someone knew.
Jean-Jacques Roussea
(475 posts)Insider trading is one of those few things that gets rich white guys in prison
Mr.Bill
(24,103 posts)TheBlackAdder
(28,073 posts)Mr.Bill
(24,103 posts)They will fit right in.
Bettie
(15,998 posts)in the new world order, they can do whatever they please!
TrekLuver
(2,573 posts)hrmjustin
(71,265 posts)KittyWampus
(55,894 posts)Maru Kitteh
(28,303 posts)from prison.
rzemanfl
(29,540 posts)yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)Kellyanne Conway said his tweets could move the market.
http://www.cnbc.com/2016/12/07/kellyanne-conway-theres-no-excuse-for-trump-not-to-get-things-done.html
kimbutgar
(20,874 posts)As suspious trading.
tanyev
(42,358 posts)I laugh everytime I see those names. It's brilliant.
And it wouldn't surprise me if it was them.
mountain grammy
(26,568 posts)Quixote1818
(28,903 posts)so by this occurring minutes before instead of just after tells me they wanted to beat anyone waiting for his tweet. But why not do it hours before?
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)It's public knowledge. Wall Street is watching the news and looking for things that will cause Trump to tweet.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10028358977
You can do the same and make a mint!
Edited to add investment advice
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)stevenleser
(32,886 posts)The market doesnt open until 9:30am. However, early trading options are available through brokerages as early as 4am. Whoever dumped that stock took advantage of that.
But hold on. If you are trying to game the system like you suggest someone was doing, and you heard the day before that there were issues with Lockheed Martin's jet and you thought Trump might Tweet about it the next day, you would act as early as possible. Probably 4am, the earliest that early market trading opens.
But wait, it gets better. After market training goes until 8pm. Depending on the timing of the CNN report, they could have dumped stock late.
Dumping it in the six minute period before he Tweets isnt guessing he might talk about something that day, it's specific knowledge of what and when.
TrollBuster9090
(5,953 posts)Schedule:
1. Set alarm for 3:45 am
2. 3:50 am -Sit on gold toilet with iPhone
3. 4:00 am -Call broker to dump LMT.SW stock
4. 4:15 am - Tweet out that I'm cancelling the F-35 project
5. 4:30 am - Call broker to enter 'buy on stop' order for when the stock drops 20%, and bottoms out at $250
6. 5:00 am - (Goof around. Watch Fox & Friends. Send out insulting tweets about Rosie O'Donnell.)
7. 8:00 am - buy back all holdings in LMT.SW
8. 9:00am - Send out tweet that I've changed my mind about the F-35 project, and am planning to DOUBLE the order.
9. 10:00 am -Set alarm for 3:45am to repeat process all over again.
pnwmom
(108,925 posts)It seems odd that someone would drop large amounts of Lockheed minutes before DT's tweet.
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)and already has their lawyers working on a lawsuit against whomever sold it to them.
bucolic_frolic
(42,663 posts)trace to foreign PO Boxes in places where the investigation dead-ends.
Just saying
Dustlawyer
(10,493 posts)He cannot resist, but I am sure he has it worked out on how he is to be paid. He is going to be known as the Plutocrat's President, that is if he doesn't get impeached first.
ToxMarz
(2,154 posts)Rex
(65,616 posts)He has no idea what he is doing and won't listen to anyone.
tclambert
(11,080 posts)Excuse me, I think I have to go rinse my brain.
kentuck
(110,950 posts)Not!
BadgerKid
(4,541 posts)But I agree there are definitely "interesting" trading phenomena that happen. For example, the stock trades flat all day, and then after hours, it rises/falls significantly on no news. The next day, the news comes out. The meme "somebody knows something" really does seem to apply.
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)terror attacks.
Sunlei
(22,651 posts)Stonepounder
(4,033 posts)Congress critters in districts that have big military contracts live or die by those contracts. And to have Trump, who isn't even President yet, saying HE is going to cancel contracts (psst, Donnie, Congress makes the budget not you), and seeing big movements in company's stock, will give them ulcers.
Donnie when you get the Repugs in Congress pissed off at you, then you have a problem.
And what does the Idiot-in-Chief think are going to happen to all the jobs that those Billions pay for?
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)And yes, I know he ran as a Repug but he's not really one of them. He's not a Democrat either, he is just a loose canon.
What happens to all independents is that they completely lose their legislature. Jesse Ventura ended up completely undermined by the Minnesota state legislature. The two parties eventually would get together and pass bills with veto proof majorities and essentially ignore him.
world wide wally
(21,719 posts)See? He's already changed things to MAGA
SomethingNew
(279 posts)Even if Trump told someone he was going to make the tweet, it would not be insider trading and the SEC wouldn't even think twice about it.
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)Including at least one person who works in a compliance capacity.
What is your background in the financial industry?
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)On a company and you trade based on that information, you have broken the various insider trading laws. "Market moving information" is the term used by the SEC and it is broadly applied.
SomethingNew
(279 posts)It requires the existence of a fiduciary duty (except in limited cases of hacking and things like that). Regardless of whether or not knowing that Trump was going to tweet about a company counts as material non-public information (it doesn't), Trump does not meet the requirement of owing a fiduciary duty under any conception of the term. He therefore cannot be charged with an SEC violation for telling someone he was going to tweet about Lockheed. The "Wall Street" person you asked doesn't know what they are talking about.
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)A person in the position of President elect who obviously is about to have the power to affect the position of various companies, particularly in the defense sector, absolutely has fiduciary duties and various other responsibilities to the shareholders or would be shareholders of those companies.
I suggest you read David CARPENTER, Kenneth P. Felis, and R. Foster Winans, Petitioners v. UNITED STATES.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/supremecourt/text/484/19#:
Petitioner Winans was coauthor of a Wall Street Journal investment advice column which, because of its perceived quality and integrity, had an impact on the market prices of the stocks it discussed. Although he was familiar with the Journal's rule that the column's contents were the Journal's confidential information prior to publication, Winans entered into a scheme with petitioner Felis and another stockbroker who, in exchange for advance information from Winans as to the timing and contents of the column, bought and sold stocks based on the column's probable impact on the market and shared their profits with Winans. On the basis of this scheme, Winans and Felis were convicted of violations of the federal securities laws and of the federal mail and wire fraud statutes, 18 U.S.C. 1341, 1343, which prohibit the use of the mails or of electronic transmissions to execute "any scheme or artifice to defraud, or for obtaining money or property by means of false or fraudulent pretenses, representations, or promises"; petitioner Carpenter was convicted of aiding and abetting. The Court of Appeals affirmed.
SomethingNew
(279 posts)Go back and look at the holding of that case. It confirms what I said above. He was liable there for fraud in connection to selling securities due to his duties owed to the WSJ.
Trump does not owe a fiduciary duty to the shareholders of public corporations. That would be the most impossibly stupid rule that the SEC could ever create. You want the president to have to make sure all of his decisions are made for the financial gain of stockholders?
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)He was NOT liable because of duties owed to the WSJ. The courts didn't care about that. They made mention of it in the brief because it made his transgression worse because he knew he was not only breaking the law but breaking the clearly laid out policy of his employer which he had to sign in advance.
They cared that he knew he could affect stock price by his public writings and entered into a scheme with others so that they could take positions in advance of his writings.
In other words, exactly what it seems Trump has done here.
SomethingNew
(279 posts)Go back and look at the case. It doesn't say what you think it does. Furthermore, go look at the 2nd Cir. Case that it affirmed (791 F.2d 1024). I don't have Westlaw on my phone so I can't get you the exact page number but take a look at paragraph 18. The court explicitly rejected your argument and said the guilt here stems from breaching the duty he owed to the WSJ (and even under that more strict standard, they couldn't get a SCOTUS majority).
I understand that you want it to be true. We all would like Trump to go down on SEC charges. That said, you can't just twist the law into saying the opposite of what it actually says. Arguments need to be grounded in reality (and correct legal doctrines).
Do you have any background in securities law?
Response to SomethingNew (Reply #51)
stevenleser This message was self-deleted by its author.
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)[img][/img]
BSdetect
(8,989 posts)Not much chance Fuk Youse will cover it though.
sarah FAILIN
(2,857 posts)He thought he didn't need it anymore... but he may buy it back now that it's a bargain.
Parker DeWitt
(28 posts)Is that Trump knows he can manipulate the markets -- across the world -- with just a few words. This probably was insider trading -- that's how the stock market works -- but the problem is more far reaching.
Back in the early days of Bush II, he screwed up the international markets, but it was just his stupidity. He had a meeting with the Japanese prime minister and afterwards he said that they had spent a lot of time talking about "devaluation." He meant to say "deflation," but the currency markets went nuts thinking that Japan was going to devalue the Yen.
People all over the world hang on every syllable that comes out of the mouth of POTUS. Giving Trump this kind of power is like giving a hyperactive 8-year-old a loaded gun.
concreteblue
(626 posts)Frighteningly vivid analogy......
tecelote
(5,122 posts)How common is dumping Lockheed stock? Does it happen on a regular basis? Daily? If so, maybe this is coincidence.
Then, how much was dumped? Was it significant enough to be a windfall? If not, then it just might be a coincidence.
I hope I am wrong on all counts because I believe Trump is only about Trump and he needs to be taken down. But, we need to pick fights that are rock solid.
Midnight Writer
(21,546 posts)denbot
(9,894 posts)Somebody/'s was prepped to do a lot of volume.