Michael Moore thinks Trump was effective today (in a dastardly way)

[flamingdem]

- that he owned the room, the props were effective, the "fake news" finger wagging at Jim Acosta of CNN was effectively done, Nixon couldn't have pulled it off without looking paranoid.. Moore "This was genius today, he pulled it off" - "we shall see if the media comes back at him about his own fake news".

So, he says, now it's critical that the media does its job - do not be afraid, do not back down a la Buzzfeed due to things like the "Michael Cohen" confusion. Trump conflated the CNN and Buzzfeed stories to his benefit. The press has to focus and be serious about checking sources, etc. (even though Trump was the chief birther..)

The real question is if there is collusion between the Russians and Trump campaign, this was the question Acosta was trying to ask.

Hayes says that now Trump has replaced Hillary with "The Media" as an attack object.

[bullwinkle428]

1. Misleading headline - I just watched the same segment.

[flamingdem]

2. He was praising him

What would you suggest?

[Cha]

22. Sounds like Moore's missing the whole gist of what just happened

and trying to normalize him.. like we need to see it through his eyes and not our own,

Thank you for the report,

[KittyWampus]

23. He critiqued his performance. And he wasn't complementary other than that.

[flamingdem]

24. He's criticizing but recognizing what Trump is doing

We have to try to see beyond our biases to recognize that he is utilizing power and what he's up to. He is in no way complementary to tRump!

[Cha]

27. That's good.. I went into more detail about how I

feel about it down thread.

Thank you.

[flamingdem]

29. I just answered! If I can find the video I'll post it because

I understand your concern about any positive statements about tRump. We must be relentless and not normalize him too.

[Cha]

32. He's so not normal.

[Phoenix61]

35. Gee

What could go wrong with that?

[MosheFeingold]

47. Faint praise

I'm Jewish and fled from a German-speaking border town in Poland. I fled the Nazis as a pre-teen.

I can comfortably say Hitler gave good speeches and rallies and handled the press masterfully.

I don't see any distinction here. Trump is very able.

And he was given a gift by CNN -- actual bullshit with which to slime them. They should never have touched this stupid story.

It played into his hands, especially given how CNN is damaged by giving Hillary preference over Bernie.

[flamingdem]

3. I basically just quoted him - how was that misleading?

Of course Moore is ironic in his praise, he's warning us that Trump is good at his bullshit and the media has to step up.

[bullwinkle428]

17. Okay, thanks for the headline edit - this post is a much more accurate reflection of his words.

[greenman3610]

4. Trump's performance was disturbing and shocking

"winning the news cycle" is not the same as winning hearts and minds.
This will not end well for those who have joined themselves to the Trump train.

[flamingdem]

5. I hope you're right but he now wields enormous power and has the street smarts

to work it for himself.

So far he's giving up NOTHING. Not his lies, not his businesses, not his support of Russia. It's madness, but he knows how to steamroll. We need a whole new crop of news people to pin him down.

[kerry-is-my-prez]

15. Only the fanatics and crazies would go for that. The more "normal" people who voted Trump

Would more likely be turned off. An acquaintance who voted for Trump is majorly turned off when she sees Trump acting crazy or angry. She apparently didn't watch his rallies!

[lambchopp59]

36. The more "normal" people who voted for Trump.

Concept has me stumped. I only know of 3 who voted for Trump. One got dismissed from work for public racist commentary... even to clients. Buh-bye. Another who was shown a video of a nutjob southern preacher proposing concentration-style death camps be erected for gays and lesbians, and commented "I'd be alright with that". He was a contractor at my work, his contract extension was denied. And the only other one was recently reprimanded for making an anti-gay slur. This one was retained, but admonished never to act out like that, ever again.
I suppose if under a Trump administration, the new "normal" is being blatantly politically incorrect?
Or perhaps those who simply weren't paying much attention.
Humor me here. I certainly get why you placed "normal" in quotation marks.

[Kittycow]

37. At least I felt a molecule better 2 of them had a little consequence.

[Alice11111]

6. MM is really able to look past his bias

He may not look the part of a serious journalist, but he is one of the best ever. He called the election. I watch an options show (which is sort of an unusual place for MM, but my point is he wasn't just sticking to the left), and he appeared on it right b4 the election to explain his reasoning. Of course, he was dead on. He had been in the field doing his own research, getting feedback. He said that we did not have a good feedback loop.

[flamingdem]

8. I agree with you! That's why I posted this - you are so right he sees through his

bias - what a quality - totally lacking at among Democrats these days.

We ignore him at our peril!

Trump has smarts, we need to be 100x smarter because he also has so much power

[Alice11111]

21. Well said

[Dem2]

12. Agreed

I had the same feeling that he did based on the fervor in my area for small hands. I would never have predicted that the idiot was going to win, but I was not confident like so many here were. The press was handled today by the swaggering nutcase, though I'm fairly certain that the press will get the last laugh.

[putitinD]

7. Michael Moore has a gift for seeing things as they really are.

[flamingdem]

9. And at first we resist right?

I thought he was nuts when he warned about Trump, but he was dead on.

[LaydeeBug]

10. Trump paid staffers to cheer him on in that roomed he "owned"

http://www.rawstory.com/2017/01/trump-packed-news-conference-with-paid-staffers-to-cheer-and-jeer-as-he-bashed-reporters/

[flamingdem]

11. Yes, he controlled the presser and created the vibe he wanted

He doesn't care about how it was done before

[2naSalit]

16. He can own it at

his property, not ours..the WH. We need to make sure he isn't allowed to do this again.

[bullwinkle428]

18. Was listening to it in the car. I was like, "DOES HE HAVE PAID SHILLS CHEERING HIM ON?"

[LaydeeBug]

20. and low and behold, he DID...no worries, the propaganda press won't mention it

[nini]

13. Only with those who already buy his crap

Last edited Thu Jan 12, 2017, 01:23 AM - Edit history (1)

He didn't do himself any favors with the rest of us.

[JI7]

19. exactly, at this point it's people who WANT to believe Trump

these are people who are happy russia helped trump win. when given this info it doesn't make them question trump, but it makes them like russia.

[UTUSN]

14. MM is ... (I paid a ticket for the 2000 doc)

[Cha]

25. I don't care if "he can see through his bias" or not.. I'm not

listening to how effective trump was when everyone I talked to thought he looked and sounded like a gd maniac. That's "normalizing" him.. Of course, it was effective for the suckers.

"Hayes says that now Trump has replaced Hillary with "The Media" as an attack object."?

Poor trump? All the shit that's come out on him just the last few days.. we'd be damn grateful if our "media" stepped up to the job.

The media attacked Hillary and loaded her down with negativity for months on end while giving trump billions of $$$ of free publicity and spinning so fast to try and normalize him.

They didn't have to try to normalize Hillary but they made sure everyone knew about emails 24/7.. and then there was comey.

[JI7]

26. exactly, moore has never been helpful, he was one of those claiming trump won the debate against

clinton.

[Cha]

30. Comforting to know.. someone else sees

it my way.

Thank you, JI7.. No way did trump win any debates against Hillary except to the monster suckers who believe every lies that comes out his donut hole.

[flamingdem]

28. Effective megalomaniac is what he meant

so I don't think he is normalizing him.

I didn't even think he'd show up today, and I never thought in a million years he'd win. This is not a situation that is easy to predict and that's the issue with bias. If we have them it makes it harder to predict and to have a strategy of resistance that is important.

[Cha]

31. I see your point of view..

I guess I'm just battle worn.

And, I've been going through a personal issues now.. and I am depleted!

[KittyWampus]

34. Please don't comment on something you didn't hear. It's like critiquing a movie you haven't seen.

Or go right ahead. But you mischaracterize the entire segment.

He was mocking Trump at the same time.

Have a good night.

[kentuck]

33. There always has to be a protagonist

and he must always have an enemy, an antagonist, to attack. He divides the reality. Even when it is not necessary. He is a divider. By definition, he is harmful in a leadership position, especially the Presidency.

[flamingdem]

44. In other words he can thrive with the country so divided

Maybe Bernie is right that we must, must reach out to the deplorable set since they will slowly realize they were had. Then he cannot divide us so easily at least.

[Sunlei]

38. agree with Moore. Trump has to get his ass in the white house press room,stop hiding on 5th avenue

Trump along with Republican enablers & babysitters- have created a huge barrier between Journalists questions & Americans right to question OUR government.

This first press conference after 165 days was horrible, three questions and not one was answered.

[flamingdem]

43. I wonder what the press can do now since they fear

losing access.

What is coming is surreal. Trump in the White House acting like a five year old and "firing" any member or the media or organization he doesn't like..

The Founding Fathers needed to know about him!

[pnwmom]

39. For the record, there was no "Michael Cohen confusion." There was an attempt at

a Michael Cohen distraction.

The fact that a Michael Cohen produced a passport with no Czech Republic stamps proves nothing.

For one thing, no passport stamps are needed for someone to travel within the Schengen zone to the Czech Republic. So that Michael Cohen might be lying about not going there. He is being deceptive about his passport for some reason. Should we trust anyone associated with DT?

But, also, there are 5 Michael Cohens who are attorneys in the NYC area alone -- not to mention Michael Cohen attorneys in other states; and more Michael Cohens who aren't attorneys in New York. It turns out to be a very common name. So maybe this Michael is telling the truth about not going there. Maybe DT sent another Michael Cohen to Prague.

We don't know anything except the Michael Cohen controversy hasn't brought us any closer to the truth.

[flamingdem]

41. True, that was odd they way he put a photo of his passport

when it wouldn't have had the Czech stamp anyway. So Trumpian, but he's tRump's Karl Rove, yes what more could we expect really

[loyalsister]

40. Trump has been manipulating audiences

for all of the years the apprentice has been on. He was well prepared after adapting used car salesman tactics to real estate. All he needed was some tips from professional bottom feeding, union busting, scoundrels from the entertainment industry to take it to the level he has.
It's pretty simple. People trust his exaggerations because of the appearance of success. He started working the media long ago by having books published about his expertise and wealth. All anyone has to do is check out the entertainment media from the 80s to see that enough USAers equate wealth with success, moral authority, and personal satisfaction to convince them that Trump was basically a decent guy despite his flaws. He has been keeping himself in the limelight for decades.
Of course he has gotten good at it. He is especially skilled at polishing himself in a way that convinces people that he is as much a victim as anyone who is convinced they have been burned by the government, some rich guy out there, a former spouse, etc. And of course a basically decent guy betrayed by others, and the media. I have heard from supporters that the thought the video was an unfair caught on tape thing.
He's a great shit polisher who can turn criticism and efforts to hold him accountable to his advantage. He is good enough at it that right now it looks like he could get away with anything.
Moore was pointing to the danger of his capabilities, rather than praising them.
This reminds me of the outrage over Time's person of the year. Influence and capacity are not necessarily good.

[flamingdem]

42. He's Machiavellian that's for sure

Very well put and relevant points you're making. I hadn't thought of all the experience he has essentially as an actor and on set manipulator of an audience. Just curious who the scoundrels are from the entertainment biz who you might be referring to - the NY Roy Cohen types or Hollywood scoundrels?

[loyalsister]

49. The reality TV producers

who have embraced the crappiest entertainment media which serves as an out from paying talented writers.

[Arazi]

45. Saw that. As usual MM nails it

[flamingdem]

46. I've learned to listen

after he nailed it on Trumps election.

I was sure he was just trying to gotv but he knew exactly why Trump would win.

[Arazi]

48. He may be a Hollywood guy now but he still hangs w regular folks

And he really listens. That's a rare skill.

He sees and hears both the spoken words and the subtext around it.

I too now pay attention when he makes these observations