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Locut0s

(6,154 posts)
Wed Jan 18, 2017, 10:45 PM Jan 2017

What's with all the upscale grocery stores popping up...

Last edited Thu Jan 19, 2017, 04:44 AM - Edit history (1)

What's with all the upscale grocery stores popping up. Is this also a trend in the US? It feels like part of the overall trend of the increasingly stark divide between the rich and poor. I see more and more dollar stores and people shopping in them for food necessities. And more and more trendy upscale big grocery stores replacing the old Safeway's. Big stores with premium European deli and cheese sections, olive bars, premade hot food sections, and where even the regular food items are 2 or more dollars more than anywhere else.

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What's with all the upscale grocery stores popping up... (Original Post) Locut0s Jan 2017 OP
Our favorite store-Fred Meyers- has gone "upscale" so we can't shop there Boxerfan Jan 2017 #1
Interesting we are seeing the same thing here in Canada... Locut0s Jan 2017 #4
We are also having alot of this happening Texasgal Jan 2017 #2
I love it metroins Jan 2017 #26
Everything in Oklahoma City is going upscale. KatyaR Jan 2017 #3
2 beds and 2 baths for $900 is a steal in any city in America TransitJohn Jan 2017 #12
10 yeats ago i was paying 750bfor a two bedroom townhouse with a basement, i thought dionysus Jan 2017 #20
Average here in Denver for a 2-bedroom is $1757 TransitJohn Jan 2017 #23
One of the reasons I love living out in rural small town Connecticut. NutmegYankee Jan 2017 #21
That's awesome, if you can find work there. TransitJohn Jan 2017 #22
Connecticut is a small state. Commutes are short. NutmegYankee Jan 2017 #25
I don't have much against most of the companies but... Locut0s Jan 2017 #5
Unfortunately the Whole Foods owner is pretty much a wingnut emulatorloo Jan 2017 #34
I remember when there were just grocery stores. Not trendy and poor ones. NightWatcher Jan 2017 #6
Well, investors and owners can chase people who have money . . . hatrack Jan 2017 #7
People pay for the experience, not the food HoneyBadger Jan 2017 #8
Indeed very true... Locut0s Jan 2017 #14
Trumplers trying to squeeze more $$ out of us. I'll keep eating cheap. Bonx Jan 2017 #9
From a former independent supermarket owner, who is working on being one again.... tableturner Jan 2017 #10
Thank you. I can tell from your succinct points that you know what your talking about... Locut0s Jan 2017 #13
To me, the ultimate supermarket would be to marry the special features that you mentioned, tableturner Jan 2017 #16
Yes that would be great!... Locut0s Jan 2017 #19
Thanks for posting, great info! emulatorloo Jan 2017 #33
People don't shop the cheap grocery stores anymore. Codeine Jan 2017 #11
My small town grocery store closed and will reopen soon - because of GoFundMe womanofthehills Jan 2017 #15
If the store wants to have competitive prices and a full selection, it needs get hooked up with a tableturner Jan 2017 #18
This message was self-deleted by its author CountAllVotes Jan 2017 #29
I have never gone to our Winco without its being absolutely packed renate Jan 2017 #31
Winco is a notable exception. Codeine Jan 2017 #35
Wal-Mart has stripped away the margin grocers had to work with on high-volume staples, Sen. Walter Sobchak Jan 2017 #17
Two Americas Amishman Jan 2017 #24
In my area, during the recession, a lot of people made it to higher income levels. NCTraveler Jan 2017 #27
aldis is still growing in my area dembotoz Jan 2017 #28
Gentrification otohara Jan 2017 #30
Sprouts produce prices are really very economical emulatorloo Jan 2017 #32
I like Sprouts. They bought out a local chain, about 10 year ago, but kept the same low prices. LeftInTX Jan 2017 #39
Sunflower otohara Jan 2017 #40
Going for higher-margin items? Retrograde Jan 2017 #36
Both of those types stores that popped up in my somewhat upscale community, closed... Tikki Jan 2017 #37
I've noticed an explosion in Chinese and Iranian run small produce stores... Locut0s Jan 2017 #38
We've got a store that was opened by Arabs, but it has expanded. LeftInTX Jan 2017 #41
I friggin LOVE dolmas!... Locut0s Jan 2017 #42
Served best with yogurt!!! LeftInTX Jan 2017 #43
Message auto-removed Name removed Jan 2017 #44

Boxerfan

(2,531 posts)
1. Our favorite store-Fred Meyers- has gone "upscale" so we can't shop there
Wed Jan 18, 2017, 11:03 PM
Jan 2017

The prices went way up after a lengthy remodel. They are packed every day busy so I'm sure they don't see us as a loss. I just hope we don't get priced straight out of our neighborhood.

I hate Wally World but I do almost all my shopping there due to pricing. It used to be 80% Fred Meyers & WM for the high dollar items.

Now its every damn thing & I'm feeding the bastards that are killing us-instead of a local union employer.

Locut0s

(6,154 posts)
4. Interesting we are seeing the same thing here in Canada...
Wed Jan 18, 2017, 11:38 PM
Jan 2017

The biggest name in upscale grocery stores seems to be Whole Foods. But many of the regular grocery stores here have shut down for renovations and turned themselves into whole foods clones.

Texasgal

(17,029 posts)
2. We are also having alot of this happening
Wed Jan 18, 2017, 11:23 PM
Jan 2017

In Austin, TX. The growth of our city apparently demands it.

Not into it at all and cannot afford it. Thank goodness we still have some options.

metroins

(2,550 posts)
26. I love it
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 01:25 PM
Jan 2017

I live in Austin and the bars/restaurants in Whole foods are great. The 6th Street location has an ice rink on the top.

Sprouts isn't very upscale but quality food. I'm not a huge Trader Joe fan.

My go to store is HEB though, unless we went quality meat/veggies.

KatyaR

(3,445 posts)
3. Everything in Oklahoma City is going upscale.
Wed Jan 18, 2017, 11:28 PM
Jan 2017

I blame it on all the development downtown--studio apartments starting at $1000/month, $250,000 apartment homes, expensive restaurants, all so you can live in the "hip" areas of town. Now most of the older apartment complexes on the north side of town have been remodeled and are now charging the same amount as the upscale apartments. I'm being gentrified out of the apartment I've lived in for over 12 years. Two beds, two full baths--I started out at $450/month; with the remodeling, they're now asking over $900/month. They actually filled in the in-ground pool so they could have a "dog park" like the other complexes! They've changed the name of the complex and are not allowing anyone to renew their leases--I guess we're all too trashy to live here now. I'm now looking at downsizing to a one-bed apartment but will still probably end up paying more than I am now. I'm absolutely sick over it--I love this place.

TransitJohn

(6,932 posts)
12. 2 beds and 2 baths for $900 is a steal in any city in America
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 01:38 AM
Jan 2017

and a steal in lots of small towns, too. Not trivializing your difficulty, just trying to add some perspective.

dionysus

(26,467 posts)
20. 10 yeats ago i was paying 750bfor a two bedroom townhouse with a basement, i thought
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 06:53 AM
Jan 2017

It was a steal!

NutmegYankee

(16,177 posts)
21. One of the reasons I love living out in rural small town Connecticut.
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 07:20 AM
Jan 2017

While the urban areas pay $1000 plus for a 1 bedroom, I get a 4 bedroom 2 bath house for less and own it.

TransitJohn

(6,932 posts)
22. That's awesome, if you can find work there.
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 11:02 AM
Jan 2017

That's a lot of house. Hope you have a good vacuum cleaner!

Locut0s

(6,154 posts)
5. I don't have much against most of the companies but...
Wed Jan 18, 2017, 11:42 PM
Jan 2017

For example Whole Foods here pays their employees very well. They are frequently listed as one of the better employers. The food tends to be equally good in terms of selection and quality. They tend to market to a largely liberal demographic too, but a monied liberal demographic. What I find worrisome is that it seems to be just part of the larger trend towards marketing to either end of the income distribution. You either shop at Trader Joe's where they give you a faux European hand crafted experience. Or you shop at the dollar store. Nothing in between.

NightWatcher

(39,343 posts)
6. I remember when there were just grocery stores. Not trendy and poor ones.
Wed Jan 18, 2017, 11:54 PM
Jan 2017

But yes, now there's a huge divide between Whole Foods and Trader Joe's and Save A Lot and Dollar Store.

hatrack

(59,439 posts)
7. Well, investors and owners can chase people who have money . . .
Wed Jan 18, 2017, 11:56 PM
Jan 2017

Or they can build Dollar Stores and chase people who don't have money.

The part they're overlooking, of course, is that there are fewer and fewer of the former, and more and more of the latter.

 

HoneyBadger

(2,297 posts)
8. People pay for the experience, not the food
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 01:17 AM
Jan 2017

It is about quality of life. Same as going to a restaurant not McDonalds or riding a plane, not a a Greyhound.

It is the journey that matters, we all have the same destination.

tableturner

(1,676 posts)
10. From a former independent supermarket owner, who is working on being one again....
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 01:24 AM
Jan 2017

Conventional supermarkets are dealing with two circumstances that are responsible for their "gentrification":

1. Walmart attracts the vast majority of shoppers that seek the lowest prices because almost nobody can compete with them on price. Therefore, it makes no sense for anybody other than limited assortment stores (Sav-a-Lot, Lidl, Aldi, and dollar stores) to go after Walmart's target demographic. As a result, most conventional supermarkets confine the majority of their marketing efforts to trying to attract upper-middle and upper income shoppers because those are battles they have a good chance of winning.

2. On the upper end of the equation, conventional supermarkets feel that natural food stores (such as Whole Foods and similar concepts), and gourmet stores (such as Fresh Market and similar concepts) are vulnerable. As such, they are presently making strong efforts to render such stores irrelevant by adopting key elements of their product lineups and features. The goal of these conventional supermarkets is to eliminate or greatly reduce the number of trips their customers make to the specialty stores.

A supermarket can do a great job of going after upper-middle and upper income shoppers only if they add upscale features such as those the OP mentioned. So they remodel and reequip their existing stores, and design their new stores to be similarly merchandised. The result is a hybrid of sorts....the fusion of multiple concepts into one.

If you have any questions about this or other aspects of the supermarket industry, please feel free to ask.

Locut0s

(6,154 posts)
13. Thank you. I can tell from your succinct points that you know what your talking about...
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 01:43 AM
Jan 2017

Indeed it seems pretty obvious the way you describe it and I've very much noticed those exact trends. I've been in retail myself for quite a few years although as an assistant manager of smaller electronics stores, not on the business and ownership end. Indeed what you describe in comment (2) of conventional supermarkets re-branding themselves after the look and feel of the upper end of the market is exactly what I see. Most of the conventional, I want to say "ugly", supermarkets are now gone around here. Replaced with renovated markets that at least have the same look and feel a Whole Foods or something similar. The key element I have noticed is that in each section of their market they have tried to create what I will call, for lack of a better term, a faux hand crafted European feel. So their Deli section now much more resembles what you would find at a small true European deli, from selection, to presentation. Indeed the stores that do this best it's almost an art form. Walking into these stores is actually quite a pleasant experience even if you don't care for their model or not, or choose to shop there or not. They have managed to work some magic at turning a huge ugly space into many little tinny gourmet food stores linked together. A meats section that looks like something from little itally, a cheese section that looks like it's from france. And every possible usable piece of space is packed with eye catching little goodies. So that it gives one the feel of a more cozy, overflowing small ma and pa market. As Honey Badger said above they are selling an experience. And they are very good at it.

tableturner

(1,676 posts)
16. To me, the ultimate supermarket would be to marry the special features that you mentioned,
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 02:51 AM
Jan 2017

with a normal full line supermarket with competitive prices. By competitive prices, I am not referring to Walmart's prices, but instead, I am referring to being in line with large conventional chains such as Publix, Safeway, and Kroger, which I know are not low priced chains, but they are much lower in price compared to the specialty chains.

The best thing would be to have two or three concepts fused into one. For instance, the meat department could have USDA Choice beef, which is what the great majority of consumers buy, along with other lines such as USDA Prime, naturally fed or organic, grass fed, and limited dry aged cuts.

Another example would be a bakery that would be a combination of a well executed typical supermarket bakery (about 2/3 of the space and sales), along with a line of pastries and breads created by on site pastry chefs. Sometimes you just want a basic layer cake. Sometimes you want something truly special. It would be nice to be able to get both under the same roof.

Special features and competitive prices don't have to be mutually exclusive.

Edit: took out "and the OP" from the headline because you WERE the OP!

Locut0s

(6,154 posts)
19. Yes that would be great!...
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 04:10 AM
Jan 2017

In some ways the renovated supermarkets you see these days kind of try to follow the model you mentioned. At least in terms of their regular groceries and produce not being quite as highly priced as the more high end supermarkets. But sadly they almost never actually embrace that side. There is always price creep so that the vast majority of their items are still more expensive than they used to be, simply for being in the revamped store, even if they aren't as much as in the stores they are mimicking.

I don't know if this is the case in the US or not but what I have seen here in Canada is a HUGE explosion in recent years of small family owned grocers that not only can compete with the big names but blow them out of the water when it comes to prices on fresh produce. I'm including Walmart in this. I'm talking about mostly foreign (Iranian, Asian or otherwise) ma and pa produce stores that sell mostly just fresh produce. There is a small Iranian chain of produce stores here in Vancouver Canada that has become a licence to print money. Every minute of every day that they are open at any of their stores I see a long lineup. These stores are not pretty, they sell fresh produce out of the delivery box, no presentation. But man they do a CRAZY amount of business year round because no one else seems to be able to match their prices, at least on produce.

 

Codeine

(25,586 posts)
11. People don't shop the cheap grocery stores anymore.
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 01:37 AM
Jan 2017

Those shoppers have mostly migrated to Walmart or Hispanic markets, so grocers have to compete by making the shopping experience nicer and more upscale in appearance.

I spend all day going in and out of grocery stores and I can see the no-frills markets are struggling while the stores that have seen upgrades doing bang-up business. The divide is very visible within chains; older and smaller units in a chain look like ghost towns alongside the related units that have had cosmetic upgrades and installation of salad and cheese bars and the like.

womanofthehills

(8,579 posts)
15. My small town grocery store closed and will reopen soon - because of GoFundMe
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 02:37 AM
Jan 2017

I live outside of a small town of around 1000 people - closest grocery store is 95 miles round trip. Closest Walmart is over 100 miles round trip. Closest Whole Foods is 160 miles round trip. However, we do have a small Family Dollar. I shop at Whole Foods because I eat only organic. We have raised almost $150 thousand to open our grocery store. We might be the only grocery store in US to open because of a GoFundMe account.

Our grocery store will be a half and half store. It will have organic, high quality food and less expensive food. If you are rich or poor, you will be able to shop there. The majority of people in the town are low income, but wealthier people have retired to the outskirts of the town. The woman who will be operating our store has a nutrition degree and plans to have healthy daily soups and salads and a fruit stand so any child coming into the store, can pick out a free fruit. Our store will also be buying local produce to sell.





tableturner

(1,676 posts)
18. If the store wants to have competitive prices and a full selection, it needs get hooked up with a
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 03:05 AM
Jan 2017

good wholesaler. They can help design and engineer the store, advise on product selection, spec and buy equipment for you, make sure you buy product at the lowest possible cost, give tremendous operating advice and counsel, and generally work hand in glove with the soon to open store in all areas and departments. That is a must!

In many areas, there are cooperative wholesalers that are owned by the stores they service. Most of these wholesalers are quite large and very sophisticated, and they provide a menu of services and features that allow independents to do a good job of competing with the chains.

Even though there is no store to truly compete with in your town, the store will be community owned, and all of you want the best selection and prices, and for the store to be designed, equipped, and run properly. I strongly advise getting them in touch with a wholesaler. If you want me to suggest a couple that service your area, let me know.

Response to Codeine (Reply #11)

renate

(13,776 posts)
31. I have never gone to our Winco without its being absolutely packed
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 01:50 PM
Jan 2017

I love it so much! It's kind of like going to the airport in terms of crowds, only with shopping carts instead of suitcases blocking the aisles, but my gosh, the prices!

 

Sen. Walter Sobchak

(8,692 posts)
17. Wal-Mart has stripped away the margin grocers had to work with on high-volume staples,
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 03:01 AM
Jan 2017

So the supermarket chains have to target the shoppers who would otherwise go to fancy delis, bakeries and stores that sell a hundred varieties of cheese and olive oil.

Now on one hand consumers are getting the basics cheaper than ever before, on the other hand it has become difficult for grocers to cater to the consumer who also shops at Wal-Mart.

Amishman

(5,540 posts)
24. Two Americas
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 11:07 AM
Jan 2017

You are either well enough off that the size of your grocery bill doesn't matter or you are poor and trying to pinch every penny.

The middle has died.

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
27. In my area, during the recession, a lot of people made it to higher income levels.
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 01:28 PM
Jan 2017

A Ferrari dealership was built in the middle of the recession right down the street from me. A good number of people came into serious money.

dembotoz

(16,737 posts)
28. aldis is still growing in my area
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 01:38 PM
Jan 2017

i sort of know my prices at the aldi
see what the other place wants for it...am shocked an can not buy it

 

otohara

(24,135 posts)
30. Gentrification
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 01:45 PM
Jan 2017

You should see all the homes that are being tossed away in Denver to make way for the flood of people - new homes/condos/apartments require new stores.

We have chain called Sprouts and they are a wonderful especially for cheap veges/fruits - they are popping up all over town.

I wonder why I spend so much time recycling when entire neighborhoods of older homes are being thrown away somewhere...dunno where but somewhere.

LeftInTX

(24,549 posts)
39. I like Sprouts. They bought out a local chain, about 10 year ago, but kept the same low prices.
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 11:52 PM
Jan 2017

Another thing is we have is a small outlet called Cost Plus Nutrition. Good gosh. Supplements are much cheaper than anywhere.

 

otohara

(24,135 posts)
40. Sunflower
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 11:54 PM
Jan 2017

I still shop at the original one...

They carry all sorts of veges/fruits that most don't - many types of melons when in season and lots of various apples.
Turnip greens...$1.29

Retrograde

(10,068 posts)
36. Going for higher-margin items?
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 03:59 PM
Jan 2017

There's not that much markup on basic groceries, so to up the return per square foot stores need to stock items that have a higher profit margin for them (and a longer shelf life if possible). The store I usually patronize has greatly expanded its hot food and prepared food sections in the last few years, and those do well at lunchtime, but they still have decent produce (more expensive than Safeway, but more variety and higher quality).

The last grocery store to open in my rather upscale-oriented town was a Grocery Outlet: maybe we're getting ahead of this trend!

Tikki

(14,537 posts)
37. Both of those types stores that popped up in my somewhat upscale community, closed...
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 04:05 PM
Jan 2017

in less than a year.
Trader Joes, which has been here over 10 years, maybe more, is still going strong
as is the 99¢ Store.

Tikki

Locut0s

(6,154 posts)
38. I've noticed an explosion in Chinese and Iranian run small produce stores...
Thu Jan 19, 2017, 10:32 PM
Jan 2017

There is an Iranian produce store near me that is a fucking license to print money, from open to close 7 days a week there is almost never not a long lineup. Better prices there on produce than at any other store.

LeftInTX

(24,549 posts)
41. We've got a store that was opened by Arabs, but it has expanded.
Fri Jan 20, 2017, 12:18 AM
Jan 2017

One half of the store is Indian, the other half is Middle Eastern. It's funny the ME and Indian spices are separate. But it makes sense because the spices used in those types of cooking are quite different. The fresh/butcher stuff is always a mixed bag. You never know what you will find. Just before Christmas, my husband bought home a bunch of persimmons for real cheap. My husband told me they had fresh made lahmajoon. When I went in January, I couldn't find any persimmons and there was no lahmajoon. But I always find something good. They always have something fresh from the bakery.

I found a pound of date paste for dirt cheap. Dates are soooo expensive, but date paste is cheap.

Oh and they have dolma in cans. I think those of us of ME descent are real picky about our dolma. It's a regional thing, so they have different brands from different regions. I can tell by looking at the cans where they are from, but my husband hasn't quite figured it out.

Locut0s

(6,154 posts)
42. I friggin LOVE dolmas!...
Fri Jan 20, 2017, 12:30 AM
Jan 2017

I used to think the more generic term was Dolmades but I've since learned that Dolma is the more widely used term. I'm by no means well versed in ME cusine but it's some of my favourite! I've only had a few varieties of Dolma but I've loved all of them! The ones I've loved the best have been the tartest ones, from lemon juice, where you can really taste the fresh leaf.

Response to Locut0s (Original post)

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