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GliderGuider

(21,088 posts)
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 07:23 PM Apr 2017

Carter Page Went to Moscow With a Tape of Donald Trump Offering Treason For Hacking

Rock on, Louise!

Carter Page Went to Moscow With a Tape of Donald Trump Offering Treason For Hacking

Sources with links to the intelligence community say it is believed that Carter Page went to Moscow in early July carrying with him a pre-recorded tape of Donald Trump offering to change American policy if he were to be elected, to make it more favorable to Putin. In exchange, Page was authorized directly by Trump to request the help of the Russian government in hacking the election.

A separate source with links to the intelligence community reported to me several months ago that Boris Epshteyn, alone of the four men named in the first FISA application, is an actual FSB agent, and, the source said, is the son of two other sleeper agents. Paul Manafort is registering as an agent of a foreign power; Carter Page has admitted, from public reporting, to have met with Russian intelligence agents.

It may therefore be surmised that Page, Manafort and Epshteyn, in this conversation wherein they discussed taking the Trump tape to Moscow, were all acting in concert as agents of the Russian state first and foremost, and Trump staffers second. Because the provision of such a tape to Putin would clearly be the ultimate in kompromat on a future American President (far worse than any sexual blackmail tape).

Page had always seemed weirdly confident about his relationship with Trump. He had the tape of Mr. Trump offering to change policy. Sources say that this tape was played in meetings with Russian intelligence officers in Moscow,

I will produce a short timeline of the Trump-Russia story on this blog tomorrow. For now, the point is that intelligence sources say that Page, Manafort and Epshteyn, possibly also with Trump, are on tape discussing how Page should carry a recording of Donald Trump to Moscow, offering his bona fides in exchange for Russia’s help hacking the election; and that the said tape of Trump was played by Page to Russian intelligence, possibly including Mr. Diveykin, the Russian official in charge of hacking the election; and that multiple foreign intelligence services, among them the UK, Germany and Ukraine, have a tape of this; and that finally, in October, the FBI was able to listen to that tape.and that several Western intelligence sources have recordings of the meetings and the tape which they supplied to US intelligence.
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Carter Page Went to Moscow With a Tape of Donald Trump Offering Treason For Hacking (Original Post) GliderGuider Apr 2017 OP
If that tape becomes available, that is the end of President Trump Doodley Apr 2017 #1
How? Bettie Apr 2017 #4
It will be the biggest news story since 9/11. His poll numbers will plummet to under 30%. Doodley Apr 2017 #9
yep, it's pure treason on tape... doesn't get much worse than that Fast Walker 52 Apr 2017 #11
Fast Walker 52, you are pretty cool! I will remember your name! Doodley Apr 2017 #16
Remember him saying, "I have a very good brain?" What an idiot to put something like that on tape. brush Apr 2017 #57
well, it's fairly clear by now that he's really not that bright Fast Walker 52 Apr 2017 #121
The only people more stupid are those who voted him in BigBearJohn Apr 2017 #141
sure seems that way... Fast Walker 52 Apr 2017 #145
Yep. calimary Apr 2017 #156
Couldnt have put it better myself BigBearJohn Apr 2017 #157
He also told the world that he doesn't use email malaise Apr 2017 #147
Still skeptical Bettie Apr 2017 #14
I have to keep looking at the best case scenario. It's the only way to survive! Doodley Apr 2017 #17
Me too, Doodley, me too.. sagetea Apr 2017 #48
Good Mantra Sage. Let's keep living in hope until the day comes when Trump is toast! Doodley Apr 2017 #62
So Carter Page gave the tape to Putin last summer FakeNoose Apr 2017 #94
Right there with you... with fingers crossed. InAbLuEsTaTe Apr 2017 #127
Biggest news story since Abe Lincoln's assassination. And numbers to 5%. sharedvalues Apr 2017 #59
Yes, I agree. He would have to resign by the next day. Doodley Apr 2017 #64
I don't think the people would wait for congress MyNameGoesHere Apr 2017 #53
Yes, he will be told to resign by pretty much the whole party. Doodley Apr 2017 #65
I don't doubt the repub's would go for impeachment 1 second duncang Apr 2017 #58
I think that is what would happen. Doodley Apr 2017 #66
That was the plan all along... askyagerz Apr 2017 #85
His Presidency won't continue if such a thing exists and is proven. Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #74
Yes they would have to impeach him...or go down with him. Demsrule86 Apr 2017 #131
Don't toy with me. n/t kacekwl Apr 2017 #34
I can't believe it. They wouldn't be that stupid. dem4decades Apr 2017 #2
They are that stupid as everything they do shows us. Doodley Apr 2017 #13
Normally I would agree with that with most high level people nini Apr 2017 #38
Remember how Ghouliani opened his mouth and sank Trump's Muslim ban? dixiegrrrrl Apr 2017 #50
Agreed - and the word is old Rudy will probably be going down within the next few weeks womanofthehills Apr 2017 #105
the beautiful part about THAT is rudy considers NY HIS kingdom dixiegrrrrl Apr 2017 #120
The Ghoul has been MontanaMama Apr 2017 #154
I'd like to believe that tsuukiyomi Apr 2017 #158
lol tazkcmo Apr 2017 #54
Right. Even a dullard wouldn't put evidence like this on tape. sharedvalues Apr 2017 #60
Maybe it isn't about being stupid Bettie Apr 2017 #68
There's also speculation Trump was protected FBI informant sharedvalues Apr 2017 #70
I think it's Felix Sater DeminPennswoods Apr 2017 #123
trump is the only one who needs to be that stupid certainot Apr 2017 #77
Malcolm Nance was talking about how stupid they all were on Randi Rhodes's show a few days ago womanofthehills Apr 2017 #109
it's possible that they're just same old greedy republicans certainot Apr 2017 #111
It must be true, unnamed sources with links to the hughee99 Apr 2017 #161
"Sources with links to the intelligence community say it is believed that" lindysalsagal Apr 2017 #3
Oh well. GliderGuider Apr 2017 #7
If we don't have a little more adventure, a little more fun, what do we have? Doodley Apr 2017 #19
nope. this board has great credibility, imho, because everything gets mopinko Apr 2017 #24
Good point. Doodley Apr 2017 #72
According to an anonymous blogger... Major Nikon Apr 2017 #26
She's hardly anonymous. GliderGuider Apr 2017 #41
... Major Nikon Apr 2017 #51
Anonymous blogger - where have you been? womanofthehills Apr 2017 #97
Not following conspiracy theory nutbags Major Nikon Apr 2017 #98
Daily Kos - "Louise Mensch is not a Nutter, and she may be the reason why Biglygate is big-league" womanofthehills Apr 2017 #100
An anonymous blogger says she isn't a nutter so it must be twue! Major Nikon Apr 2017 #126
That's all we get when NYTimes and the WA Post report their stories with anonymous sources. pnwmom Apr 2017 #37
Yes but in that case the paper rests it's reputation on the vetting of the sources lindysalsagal Apr 2017 #42
I agree that it's good to be skeptical, and we don't know whether this story will be confirmed pnwmom Apr 2017 #47
Others seem to believe it ........ womanofthehills Apr 2017 #99
Most people here take things with a grain of salt. Many of us have posted if... brush Apr 2017 #63
Extreme narcissism can make people that stupid. Failure is unimaginable to someone like DT. n/t pnwmom Apr 2017 #101
plus add a little dementia to that narcissism womanofthehills Apr 2017 #103
I can hope, but I'll stay circumspect. HopeAgain Apr 2017 #49
Louise Mensch is definitely not anyone from anywhere. womanofthehills Apr 2017 #107
Your last line: " This message board loses credibility when we're willing Pathwalker Apr 2017 #149
Eh... WOW! Eyeball_Kid Apr 2017 #5
When US MSM is milquetoast about the Sculpin Beauregard Apr 2017 #6
Someone doesn't like your post and alerted. revmclaren Apr 2017 #8
'Twas ever thus. GliderGuider Apr 2017 #10
The Russians are amongst us! Doodley Apr 2017 #21
Agreed - I have noticed more broken English on this site in the past few days womanofthehills Apr 2017 #102
I did not alert. Wasn't me. lindysalsagal Apr 2017 #43
Aww the "Smoking Gun" that Could be Easily Understood by Average Americans Stallion Apr 2017 #12
I've heard a lot about Mensch being unreliable, but something about the specific details here Fast Walker 52 Apr 2017 #15
This message was self-deleted by its author elias7 Apr 2017 #90
What specifically have your heard her being unreliable about? womanofthehills Apr 2017 #104
it's a constant criticism of her from people who don't like her work without many details Fast Walker 52 Apr 2017 #122
I' like to know... Mike Nelson Apr 2017 #18
Well, can you name one other billionaire as stupid as Trump? Doodley Apr 2017 #20
Nope... Mike Nelson Apr 2017 #23
Trump was spouting off this pro-Putin, anti-Nato stuff in his speeches wishstar Apr 2017 #69
Maybe the person Trump was begging (again?) for help demanded the prerecording. Cracklin Charlie Apr 2017 #106
That is HUGE if true. (ha) triron Apr 2017 #22
Per the Dossier, Putin and Trump had already been working together for 8 years at that point HoneyBadger Apr 2017 #25
If this story is true, then Trump will: Rollo Apr 2017 #27
All of the above. Doodley Apr 2017 #28
Operative word there is "if" because so far there hasnt been anything to confirm it. cstanleytech Apr 2017 #36
We're not at the "reveal evidence" stage yet. GliderGuider Apr 2017 #44
Ya but you also have to be careful because not all "leaks" are actually leaks and none of us here cstanleytech Apr 2017 #86
1, 2, & 7 Duppers Apr 2017 #61
And the plot thickens............ womanofthehills Apr 2017 #110
David Corn speculated something similar DeminPennswoods Apr 2017 #124
That would be a huge gamble though Kentonio Apr 2017 #135
Not to mention the fact that they'd get VP Pence as the new President. Calista241 Apr 2017 #150
I'll believe it when I see it. There's been endless speculation AJT Apr 2017 #29
Is this source legitimate? NewJeffCT Apr 2017 #30
Dig into her posts and twitter feed, and decide for yourself. GliderGuider Apr 2017 #46
She keeps scooping NYT, Washington Post, RM but somehow the confirmations never come grantcart Apr 2017 #116
Unless there is something solid to support this its just unsubstantiated rumor and if there is cstanleytech Apr 2017 #31
What kind of tape was it? awesomerwb Apr 2017 #32
8 track and you have to use a pack of matches to hold the tape in place SammyWinstonJack Apr 2017 #40
Hahaha I remember those days! VOX Apr 2017 #163
If that tape is available, Trump is toast. If it is available, where is it? Otherwise, it's just Hoyt Apr 2017 #33
if this is authentic...game...set....match. And off to completely uncharted waters. NRaleighLiberal Apr 2017 #35
Don, do not make tapes that compromise you flamingdem Apr 2017 #39
I'd love for this to be true radical noodle Apr 2017 #45
Didn't trump say something to the effect that it's better to use couriers to convey shraby Apr 2017 #52
Why a recording? Recording means jail if found. sharedvalues Apr 2017 #56
The donald has to be in charge ALL the time. He would want to make sure shraby Apr 2017 #95
Good point. InAbLuEsTaTe Apr 2017 #128
Yes, he has said that radical noodle Apr 2017 #113
Come on. Did you watch Trump talking about how delicious his chocolate cake was womanofthehills Apr 2017 #112
Sure, but what does that have to do with taping a message to the Russians? radical noodle Apr 2017 #114
It's bordering on dementia womanofthehills Apr 2017 #117
There's that too! radical noodle Apr 2017 #119
I'm skeptical. Why would anyone record that? sharedvalues Apr 2017 #55
OTOH, the Twitter trolls are now attacking her sharedvalues Apr 2017 #67
There have been fake twitter accounts with her name too, with crazy conspiracy theories wishstar Apr 2017 #75
GG, yesterday it was reported by Claude Taylor that Carter Page had been turned Mr. Ected Apr 2017 #71
Wrong, Oct FISA warrant is for Carter Page et.al, so he isn't cooperating until after the election. L. Coyote Apr 2017 #81
Claude Taylor posted this about Louise Mensch's tweet womanofthehills Apr 2017 #115
And according to Claude, everyone seems to know about the tape womanofthehills Apr 2017 #118
more false hopes? Softail1 Apr 2017 #73
It's plausible when u think about it. NoMoreRepugs Apr 2017 #76
From Claude Taylor @TrueFactsStand (served on Clinton's staff) Ccarmona Apr 2017 #78
I'm beginning to really like Louise Nensch. "So God bless America, and God Save the Queen" L. Coyote Apr 2017 #79
Awesome.Manafort, Page, Flynn 45. birds of a feather flock together. bronxiteforever Apr 2017 #80
Now Claude Taylor is confirming sharedvalues Apr 2017 #82
If only this will see the light of day... AntiFascist Apr 2017 #83
I'm not buying it sellitman Apr 2017 #84
Aye I am kind of the same way until it leads to his impeachment as cstanleytech Apr 2017 #87
This would be the Easter miracle we have all been waiting for. Doodley Apr 2017 #88
This would be amazing... Satch59 Apr 2017 #89
So why is the top of the GOP so complacent? Crash2Parties Apr 2017 #91
Helpful hint, if you plant a spy, don't have him named 'Boris'. Snarkoleptic Apr 2017 #92
Oh please, oh please, oh please mcar Apr 2017 #93
kick for visibility triron Apr 2017 #96
This sounds like the kind of bullshit nut jobs like Alex Jones puts out doc03 Apr 2017 #108
It's possible but... kentuck Apr 2017 #125
Yep jberryhill Apr 2017 #129
I hope that there is a tape of Trump and associates Progressive dog Apr 2017 #130
Although this would be major if proven to be true, I feel there is something else out there that... Frustratedlady Apr 2017 #132
K&R Mad-in-Mo Apr 2017 #133
This is treason Gothmog Apr 2017 #134
Remember, the stolen election was by Republican TICKET. No Pres. Pence. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2017 #136
In an ideal world, yes, but there is nothing in the constitution to provide for this, unless you Amaryllis Apr 2017 #138
This whole tRump Russia treason is unprecedented with few contingencies to handle it. . . nt Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2017 #139
Right, and there was no such thing as hacking or even voting machines Amaryllis Apr 2017 #146
At the very least a special election. byronius Apr 2017 #143
keep on front burner!! triron Apr 2017 #137
keeping this on the burner triron Apr 2017 #140
The shoe fits perfectly. byronius Apr 2017 #142
Great so half the free world has this tape, jmg257 Apr 2017 #144
All the IC experts say it will be a complicated and Enoki33 Apr 2017 #155
Time to lawyer up Trumpsters. L. Coyote Apr 2017 #148
I find it difficult to believe that a billionaire would resort to these types of messages Calista241 Apr 2017 #151
He's not really a successful billionaire... AntiFascist Apr 2017 #162
Yes he did rockfordfile Apr 2017 #152
putz is an arrogant, ignorant buffoon Motley13 Apr 2017 #153
I'd sure like to see an actual source on that. paulkienitz Apr 2017 #159
You mean one blessed by the commercial news establishment? GliderGuider Apr 2017 #164
Again tiptonic Apr 2017 #160
What's the latest on this? L. Coyote Apr 2017 #165

Bettie

(15,995 posts)
4. How?
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 07:29 PM
Apr 2017

Do you think Republicans will impeach their perfect idiot?

Until he's impeached, he's pretty much untouchable.

Doodley

(8,976 posts)
9. It will be the biggest news story since 9/11. His poll numbers will plummet to under 30%.
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 07:36 PM
Apr 2017

He will become poison to Republicans who want to be reelected. He will be dead meat.

brush

(53,467 posts)
57. Remember him saying, "I have a very good brain?" What an idiot to put something like that on tape.
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 09:02 PM
Apr 2017

If it's true he is officially the stupidest man on earth.

 

Fast Walker 52

(7,723 posts)
121. well, it's fairly clear by now that he's really not that bright
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 06:50 AM
Apr 2017

astoundingly ignorant in many ways

Bettie

(15,995 posts)
14. Still skeptical
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 07:39 PM
Apr 2017

slightly hopeful, but mindful that these types always find a way to weasel out.

sagetea

(1,363 posts)
48. Me too, Doodley, me too..
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 08:45 PM
Apr 2017

I don't like saying 'hate', but, I really do hate this orange thing in our house. Every morning I wake up and hope for something that today is the day that he goes down. Even hoping that "Biff" would do something kind....but nothing, he is cruel, hell beyond cruel. All of them are cruel.

My mantra, I hope, I hope, I hope...then action.


A'Ho,

sage

FakeNoose

(32,328 posts)
94. So Carter Page gave the tape to Putin last summer
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 11:51 PM
Apr 2017

...I guess that means he doesn't have it?
Or maybe if he was smart, he made a copy first?

I'll start sharpening the guillotine just in case.





sharedvalues

(6,916 posts)
59. Biggest news story since Abe Lincoln's assassination. And numbers to 5%.
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 09:06 PM
Apr 2017

If there is a tape, and it gets released, it's almost impossible to underestimate the magnitude of the story.

Honestly, the news revelations that would rank with it are:
- Kennedy's assassination
- Nuclear bombs used in Japan

That's all I got. Nixon doesn't compare. Reagan got shot but survived. Iran-contra would be up there if Reagan had ever been convicted. Challenger explosion was a shock but didn't threaten the basis of American democracy. OJ's Bronco was important for the race relations story but not of this size. Falklands, Greenpeace bombing, My Lai, all small potatoes.

Actually, I'll add: 1968 race riots, as much for their lasting impact on America as for their news value in the moment.

 

MyNameGoesHere

(7,638 posts)
53. I don't think the people would wait for congress
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 09:01 PM
Apr 2017

If true they will be dragged from the Whitehouse and well, then who knows?

duncang

(1,907 posts)
58. I don't doubt the repub's would go for impeachment 1 second
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 09:06 PM
Apr 2017

To get rid of idiot boy and move pence in one shot. Repub's would consider that a win win. Ryan, rubio, cruz, McCain, and the list goes on. They would be rushing to the WH to help get him packed and out of there.

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
74. His Presidency won't continue if such a thing exists and is proven.
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 09:25 PM
Apr 2017

It simply can't. Republicans Shmepublicans. They will impeach him or tell him he's gotta resign.

Demsrule86

(68,347 posts)
131. Yes they would have to impeach him...or go down with him.
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 09:14 AM
Apr 2017

Americans won't stand for a traitor president.

nini

(16,670 posts)
38. Normally I would agree with that with most high level people
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 08:20 PM
Apr 2017

But this group has proven time and again they ain't as smart as they are corrupt.

They'd screw their own mamas over - so why would a whole country not be possible?

dixiegrrrrl

(60,010 posts)
50. Remember how Ghouliani opened his mouth and sank Trump's Muslim ban?
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 08:56 PM
Apr 2017

Ghouliani is up to eyeballs in illegal deals with international players, he is going down too.
He was very invilved with Trump/russian deal, and oil deals.
And..he will sing like a canary, has no balls at all.

Yeah, they are that stupid....everything Trump has tried to accomplish is falling apart, because he says and does stupid things 10 times a day and then can't understand why everyone is laughing at him all the time.

womanofthehills

(8,579 posts)
105. Agreed - and the word is old Rudy will probably be going down within the next few weeks
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 12:23 AM
Apr 2017

sounds like NY state has him, let alone Comey.

dixiegrrrrl

(60,010 posts)
120. the beautiful part about THAT is rudy considers NY HIS kingdom
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 01:51 AM
Apr 2017

and has cops AND some FBI in his pocket.
We'll see how Comey deals with that.

MontanaMama

(23,238 posts)
154. The Ghoul has been
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 04:32 PM
Apr 2017

remarkably quiet lately. I'm hopeful that he's guilty as sin and his attorneys have gagged him.

tsuukiyomi

(20 posts)
158. I'd like to believe that
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 06:22 PM
Apr 2017

in the future (if the GOP hasn't destroyed the world by then), this picture is used in childrens' e-textbooks (or some other manner of futuristic learning technology) as they detachedly discuss 2016-2020 with the same attitude that children today discuss the political fuck-ups of old.

tazkcmo

(7,286 posts)
54. lol
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 09:01 PM
Apr 2017

I can only assume you're joking. It's amateur hour in the WH. These guys are totally ignorant, stupid and beyond arrogant. Have you seen any of Page's interviews?

In summation, they ARE that stupid.

Bettie

(15,995 posts)
68. Maybe it isn't about being stupid
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 09:17 PM
Apr 2017

but arrogant enough to think that what they do doesn't matter.

Nothing the orange creature has ever done has stuck to him. He truly believes he's above the law and, frankly, he's never had to deal with evidence to the contrary.

sharedvalues

(6,916 posts)
70. There's also speculation Trump was protected FBI informant
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 09:21 PM
Apr 2017

Josh Marshall speculates Trump was like Whitey Bulger -- protected by the FBI as an informant while he committed crimes.
Last para in this story: http://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/piecing-together-more-details-on-trump-and-russia

Perhaps Trump believed he was above the law because the FBI had protected him.

DeminPennswoods

(15,246 posts)
123. I think it's Felix Sater
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 07:23 AM
Apr 2017

TPM has been digging into Felix Sater, a business associate of Trump's. Sater went to jail and later became an FBI informant for many years. Marshall cites the gov't going to great lengths to protect Sater, thus the comparison to Whitey Bulger, and has been trying to figure out why. He thinks the FBI knows a lot about Trump's business dealings with Russia/Putin/oligarchs, but hasn't/hadn't done anything with the info because Trump was mostly irrelevent until he won the Nov election.

 

certainot

(9,090 posts)
77. trump is the only one who needs to be that stupid
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 09:35 PM
Apr 2017

the other's only have to be stupid enough to think they weren't being surveilled or that they might get away with it and allying with such a vainglorious bozo.

and it's possible some of them worked for 'our side'. the idea that all those shits were just private business people is nutty.

womanofthehills

(8,579 posts)
109. Malcolm Nance was talking about how stupid they all were on Randi Rhodes's show a few days ago
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 12:35 AM
Apr 2017

He said every European country is intercepting all these Russian guys and Trump's buddies were so dumb to think that if they called a Russian contact from Germany or Estonia no one would intercept their call. In fact, it was recently reported, that Germany has years and years of intercepts of Manifort conversations. Rachel said last week, it's become a competition between the intel communities about who is the best on Trump/Russian intercepts.

 

certainot

(9,090 posts)
111. it's possible that they're just same old greedy republicans
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 12:57 AM
Apr 2017

capable of all sorts of dumb

maybe good with numbers and partying. a mob.

lindysalsagal

(20,433 posts)
3. "Sources with links to the intelligence community say it is believed that"
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 07:28 PM
Apr 2017

You could follow that with just about anything, from fake moon landings to alien abduction to hemmorroids.

Before I get my undies in a bundle, I'd like to know that someone reliable is willing to be the source and have some evidence.

This message board loses credibility when we're willing to post anything from anywhere.

 

GliderGuider

(21,088 posts)
7. Oh well.
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 07:35 PM
Apr 2017

That's why it's a message board and not the New York Times. There is a little more chill here, a little more speculation, a little more adventure - a little more fun.

mopinko

(69,803 posts)
24. nope. this board has great credibility, imho, because everything gets
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 07:55 PM
Apr 2017

posted here, and dissected.
bunk sinks. bunk gets fact checked.
this gives the members the tools they need to knock down the bunk irl.
and often by people w real expertise. lawyer, historians, local observers.

and truth is amplified, even if it seems far fetched.

Major Nikon

(36,814 posts)
26. According to an anonymous blogger...
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 08:02 PM
Apr 2017

"Sources with links to the intelligence community say it is believed that"

There actually have been posts here about alien invasions, government mind control, and chemtrails with more credibility.

womanofthehills

(8,579 posts)
97. Anonymous blogger - where have you been?
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 11:54 PM
Apr 2017

Louise Mensch: the former British MP who scooped US media on Trump's Russian ties - the Guardian


However, it seems increasingly clear that Mensch landed an extraordinary scoop that had eluded the best investigative journalists in the US. Her explanation is that her vocal advocacy on behalf of UK and US intelligence agencies since former NSA contractor Edward Snowden’s revelations about mass surveillance led her sources to trust her.


https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/feb/17/louise-mensch-trump-russia-ties-media-scoop

womanofthehills

(8,579 posts)
100. Daily Kos - "Louise Mensch is not a Nutter, and she may be the reason why Biglygate is big-league"
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 12:10 AM
Apr 2017
However, it seems increasingly clear that Mensch landed an extraordinary scoop that had eluded the best investigative journalists in the US.


http://www.dailykos.com/story/2017/2/20/1635812/-Louise-Mensch-is-not-a-Nutter-and-she-may-be-the-reason-why-we-are-Democrats-and-love-Metallica

pnwmom

(108,925 posts)
37. That's all we get when NYTimes and the WA Post report their stories with anonymous sources.
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 08:18 PM
Apr 2017

If we only posted stories with named sources, we wouldn't be reading many important stories. For example, Watergate was sourced by Deep Throat.

Mensch has gotten enough "scoops" right that I don't think we should automatically discount her reports. She was, for example, the first to correctly report on the FISA warrant on the Alpha Bank server. And she scooped the NYTimes by 3 days when she named the WH link involved in Nunes little charade.

lindysalsagal

(20,433 posts)
42. Yes but in that case the paper rests it's reputation on the vetting of the sources
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 08:37 PM
Apr 2017

even if the source is not named. That's the point: The times and Post have decades of editors that have asked us to trust that THEY know the source is reliable. In this post, I don't see anything like that.

Hey- I'd LOVE to be proven wrong on this, I just think it deserves a healthy skeptical reaction at this point.

pnwmom

(108,925 posts)
47. I agree that it's good to be skeptical, and we don't know whether this story will be confirmed
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 08:44 PM
Apr 2017

elsewhere, as other stories of hers have been. In fact she beat every other media source on the story about the FISA warrant on the alfa bank story in November, and also on the WH link for Nunes little charade.

I disagree that posting her story is equivalent to posting "anything from anywhere."

womanofthehills

(8,579 posts)
99. Others seem to believe it ........
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 12:05 AM
Apr 2017
Olga_nyc
✨? @olgaNYC1211
Same source has told me they have received audio of Trump directly involved with arranging financial arrangements with 🇷🇺..
#Trumpleaks

plus: Alexandra is reposting this and Alexandra Chalupa worked for Clinton.

Alexandra Chalupa? @AlexandraChalup 2h2 hours ago

Carter Page Went to Moscow With a Tape of Donald Trump Offering Treason For Hacking https://patribotics.blog/2017/04/16/carter-page-went-to-moscow-with-a-tape-of-donald-trump-offering-treason-for-hacking/ … via @patribotics

Claude Taylor? @TrueFactsStated

My sources are able to corroborate that the BND (German Intelligence) handed over electronic intercepts confirming quid pro quo (1)


Andrea Chalupa?Verified account @AndreaChalupa 4h4 hours ago

Russia expert: Putin has something on Trump and will use it on him now that he is no good to him http://www.rawstory.com/2017/04/russian-expert-putin-has-something-on-trump-and-will-use-it-on-him-now-that-he-is-no-good-to-him/#.WPQCIDoR4RI.twitter




brush

(53,467 posts)
63. Most people here take things with a grain of salt. Many of us have posted if...
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 09:11 PM
Apr 2017

it's true TRUMP IS THE STUPIDEST MAN ON EARTH TO PUT SOMETHING LIKE THAT ON TAPE.

We'll see.

This is DU not the NYT or WAPO.

We read, watch and see how things play out.

pnwmom

(108,925 posts)
101. Extreme narcissism can make people that stupid. Failure is unimaginable to someone like DT. n/t
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 12:11 AM
Apr 2017

HopeAgain

(4,407 posts)
49. I can hope, but I'll stay circumspect.
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 08:53 PM
Apr 2017

Just sounds too good to be true and in this era of fake news, even the best reporters can get mislead since there is so little regard for the truth these days by so many.

womanofthehills

(8,579 posts)
107. Louise Mensch is definitely not anyone from anywhere.
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 12:26 AM
Apr 2017

There are many independent reporters out there who seem to be way ahead of "reliable news."

Pathwalker

(6,596 posts)
149. Your last line: " This message board loses credibility when we're willing
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 03:50 PM
Apr 2017

to post anything from anywhere." I think you may have hit on the very point/motive of these posts.
Week1: Flynn has flipped on Trump
Week 2: Trump considering resignation
Week 3: Carter Page has a damning tape.

All of these stories have appeared as Friday news dumps. Coincidence is no longer an option.

Sculpin Beauregard

(1,046 posts)
6. When US MSM is milquetoast about the
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 07:34 PM
Apr 2017

most egregious corruption in US history, one cannot be blamed for seeking info elsewhere. Louise Mensch has not been wrong yet.

This British lady is more of a US patriot than most on CNN etc. That is the truth.

 

Fast Walker 52

(7,723 posts)
15. I've heard a lot about Mensch being unreliable, but something about the specific details here
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 07:40 PM
Apr 2017

sound all too believable.

It could be crap, or totally true.

We will have to see.

Response to Fast Walker 52 (Reply #15)

 

Fast Walker 52

(7,723 posts)
122. it's a constant criticism of her from people who don't like her work without many details
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 06:52 AM
Apr 2017

In the past she's made some wild claims, and she gets labeled as a dreaded "conspiracy theorist" a lot. But as far as I can tell, she hasn't been proven wrong on any of the Trump-Russia stuff.

wishstar

(5,267 posts)
69. Trump was spouting off this pro-Putin, anti-Nato stuff in his speeches
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 09:19 PM
Apr 2017

So seems to me that all they had to do was record a speech where he covered all relevant points to satisfaction of Trump's pro-Putin advisors and then tape of his speech could have been used as evidence of his intentions.

Cracklin Charlie

(12,904 posts)
106. Maybe the person Trump was begging (again?) for help demanded the prerecording.
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 12:26 AM
Apr 2017

In exchange for help with "the cyber".


The great deal-maker seems not so good at the deal-making.

 

HoneyBadger

(2,297 posts)
25. Per the Dossier, Putin and Trump had already been working together for 8 years at that point
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 07:56 PM
Apr 2017

Presumably on getting elected as what else would they be working on? He had been getting fake pension payments. He was communicating through a server in Trump Tower. Why would Trump send a tape? Because he wanted to make it easier to blackmail him?

Rollo

(2,559 posts)
27. If this story is true, then Trump will:
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 08:04 PM
Apr 2017

1) Deny it ever happened

2) Say it's not him

3) Say he was just joking

4) Blame it on Obama

5) Say it's fake news

6) Say it was really Hillary's voice on the tape

7) Bomb North Korea

8) Bomb the Russians

cstanleytech

(26,080 posts)
36. Operative word there is "if" because so far there hasnt been anything to confirm it.
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 08:13 PM
Apr 2017

Dont get me wrong, it wouldnt surprise me if it actually happened but without anything to back it up its just another rumor.

 

GliderGuider

(21,088 posts)
44. We're not at the "reveal evidence" stage yet.
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 08:38 PM
Apr 2017

At this point all anyone has from inside the investigation is leaks. Even WaPo and NYT only have leaks.

cstanleytech

(26,080 posts)
86. Ya but you also have to be careful because not all "leaks" are actually leaks and none of us here
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 10:14 PM
Apr 2017

have any way to verify this story unless of course we are the leaker or we are someone who is literally inside and already know if the story is true or not.

womanofthehills

(8,579 posts)
110. And the plot thickens............
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 12:45 AM
Apr 2017
Russia expert: Putin has something on Trump and will use it on him now that he is no good to him

Appearing on AM Joy an expert on Russian policy said that Russian President Vladimir Putin gambled on an erratic Donald Trump becoming president and will soon turn on him because he’s is no longer useful.

According to Nina Khrushcheva, who teaches at the New School and is the director of the Russia Project at the World Policy Institute, the relationship between Putin and President Trump hasn’t so much deteriorated as much as Putin is “pragmatically” moving on.


http://www.rawstory.com/2017/04/russian-expert-putin-has-something-on-trump-and-will-use-it-on-him-now-that-he-is-no-good-to-him/#.WPQCIDoR4RI.twitter

DeminPennswoods

(15,246 posts)
124. David Corn speculated something similar
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 07:28 AM
Apr 2017

Corn was on one of the cable shows and made a similar point - now that Trump is proving less useful than Putin thought, would Russia start releasing whatever damaging info they have on him to discredit him and his administration?

 

Kentonio

(4,377 posts)
135. That would be a huge gamble though
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 10:50 AM
Apr 2017

It's one thing for Russia to want to destabilize the US and make them weaker, but it would be quite another to publicly reveal Russia had interfered in the election. The reaction would likely be a huge groundswell of anti-Russia feeling in the US, and the rise to prominence of US politicians who were virulently anti-Russia. The people would want revenge, and its hard to see how that would benefit Russia's position in any way.

I'd be deeply surprised if Russia ever admitted what they've been doing.

Calista241

(5,584 posts)
150. Not to mention the fact that they'd get VP Pence as the new President.
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 03:58 PM
Apr 2017

Can they bank on him being more pro-Russian and less competent than Trump?

AJT

(5,240 posts)
29. I'll believe it when I see it. There's been endless speculation
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 08:09 PM
Apr 2017

and "breaking news" and so far nothing has come of it.

 

GliderGuider

(21,088 posts)
46. Dig into her posts and twitter feed, and decide for yourself.
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 08:40 PM
Apr 2017

It's a very active blog. She obviously believes she's giving us real information. And she's on our side.

grantcart

(53,061 posts)
116. She keeps scooping NYT, Washington Post, RM but somehow the confirmations never come
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 01:09 AM
Apr 2017

Does it really make sense that well placed sources would pick her as a source and not Robert Costa or any of the other dozens of professional reporters?

When they start to confirm then we should give it credibility.

cstanleytech

(26,080 posts)
31. Unless there is something solid to support this its just unsubstantiated rumor and if there is
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 08:10 PM
Apr 2017

evidence that solidly supports it you can bet they will have buried it deep.

VOX

(22,976 posts)
163. Hahaha I remember those days!
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 08:05 PM
Apr 2017

And sometimes, due to length, a song would just cut off. Ah, the miracle of 8 track.

 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
33. If that tape is available, Trump is toast. If it is available, where is it? Otherwise, it's just
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 08:11 PM
Apr 2017

more wishful thinking and conspiracy theories from a website called "patribotics."

And what the heck is saying in the first paragraph that Trump is on the tape and in the last paragraph saying "possibly also with Trump."

flamingdem

(39,303 posts)
39. Don, do not make tapes that compromise you
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 08:33 PM
Apr 2017

Really... couldn't you have found a better way.

That said, can't wait to see it!!

radical noodle

(7,990 posts)
45. I'd love for this to be true
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 08:39 PM
Apr 2017

but it's hard to imagine even trump is stupid enough to put something like that on tape.

shraby

(21,946 posts)
52. Didn't trump say something to the effect that it's better to use couriers to convey
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 08:57 PM
Apr 2017

messages rather than telephone.

shraby

(21,946 posts)
95. The donald has to be in charge ALL the time. He would want to make sure
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 11:51 PM
Apr 2017

the message delivered was exactly what he wanted to convey.

radical noodle

(7,990 posts)
113. Yes, he has said that
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 01:03 AM
Apr 2017

and we know he doesn't use email. As I said, I hope this is true and the tape can be found but I am skeptical.

womanofthehills

(8,579 posts)
112. Come on. Did you watch Trump talking about how delicious his chocolate cake was
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 01:02 AM
Apr 2017

while talking about bombing Iraq or wherever?

.

radical noodle

(7,990 posts)
114. Sure, but what does that have to do with taping a message to the Russians?
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 01:05 AM
Apr 2017

The cake thing wasn't stupidity, it was a manipulative deflection.

radical noodle

(7,990 posts)
119. There's that too!
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 01:29 AM
Apr 2017

But it's also a great ad for his resort and closely follows a report that the kitchen there had been found to be violating health standards (which I feel sure he'll try to undo). Everything trump is the best according to him.

sharedvalues

(6,916 posts)
55. I'm skeptical. Why would anyone record that?
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 09:02 PM
Apr 2017

I think Mensch has been good on some things. In fact I posted her article from yesterday here: https://www.democraticunderground.com/10028937133
The key new allegation there was that Russia had hacked the DNC voter database. That seems plausible to me; Russia hacked DNC emails, it's not a far step to the database, and yet the database is such a huge step forward in illegality and election manipulation that it could be enough to bring down this administration.


But why would DJT ever record a tape? Even a dullard would know it's certain jail if it ever gets out, and of course it would get out, because Carter Page is a moron and Russia would use it for blackmail.


I am a bit paranoid about Russia's propaganda. It wouldn't be at odds with their history to use someone like Mensch to leak a lot of bad stuff before using her to leak something totally wrong.

sharedvalues

(6,916 posts)
67. OTOH, the Twitter trolls are now attacking her
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 09:17 PM
Apr 2017

I just checked twitter and the likely-Russian half-face-picture trolls are attacking her like crazy.
Which suggests she might be right.

wishstar

(5,267 posts)
75. There have been fake twitter accounts with her name too, with crazy conspiracy theories
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 09:28 PM
Apr 2017

For weeks now, unofficial fake accounts in her name have been set up with nutty tweets to confuse people, thinking those tweets are hers when they are fake and not from her official account. The fake accounts are elaborate time consuming attempts to distract and discredit her.

Mr. Ected

(9,670 posts)
71. GG, yesterday it was reported by Claude Taylor that Carter Page had been turned
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 09:23 PM
Apr 2017

And that by early summer of 2016, he was an FBI informant who had been wired.

How does that jibe with this report? Was Page surreptitiously acting as an agent for the USA when he carried this tape to the Russians? Might it be that, not only are foreign intelligence agencies aware of this tape, but the FBI had the inside track?

L. Coyote

(51,129 posts)
81. Wrong, Oct FISA warrant is for Carter Page et.al, so he isn't cooperating until after the election.
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 09:43 PM
Apr 2017

At which point he could be wearing a wire for the FBI , and that is how Nunes would have been compromised, as part of the transition.

womanofthehills

(8,579 posts)
115. Claude Taylor posted this about Louise Mensch's tweet
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 01:06 AM
Apr 2017

Claude Taylor? @TrueFactsStated 4h4 hours ago

My sources are able to corroborate that the BND (German Intelligence) handed over electronic intercepts confirming quid pro quo (1)

womanofthehills

(8,579 posts)
118. And according to Claude, everyone seems to know about the tape
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 01:16 AM
Apr 2017

 Claude Taylor? @TrueFactsStated

Claude Taylor Retweeted William Butler

Markel knows. Trudeau knows. Theresa May knows. Everybody. Knows.

 

Softail1

(56 posts)
73. more false hopes?
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 09:25 PM
Apr 2017

...c'mon...I mean it doesn't even sound plausible...pre-recorded. self indictment, delivered on a silver platter...sorry, I'll be waiting to see hard evidence before I do any happy dances..

NoMoreRepugs

(9,257 posts)
76. It's plausible when u think about it.
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 09:34 PM
Apr 2017

These asshats, based upon what we know they have said and done are not rocket scientists. That a recording was made of a conversation is not too far fetched when u are talking about scoundrels always looking to cover their own behinds. Perhaps it wasnt authorized or orchestrated by the the Orange Douche but done nonetheless. I for one hope it's true.

 

Ccarmona

(1,180 posts)
78. From Claude Taylor @TrueFactsStand (served on Clinton's staff)
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 09:38 PM
Apr 2017

"My sources are able to corroborate that the BND (German Intelligence) handed over electronic intercepts confirming quid pro quo (1) arrangement between Trump campaign officials and the Russian government. (2) "
If this is true and his tweet from yesterday, Comey will be issuing a "blizzard of indictments" very soon.
During Watergate, my college roommate and I would get doughnuts and chocolate milk every morning then sit down to watch the hearings. It may be time to head to the market and stock up.

L. Coyote

(51,129 posts)
79. I'm beginning to really like Louise Nensch. "So God bless America, and God Save the Queen"
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 09:39 PM
Apr 2017

And may they all die in prison.

AntiFascist

(12,792 posts)
83. If only this will see the light of day...
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 09:56 PM
Apr 2017

unfortunately the warmongers supporting Trump at this point have a lot of power as well.

sellitman

(11,596 posts)
84. I'm not buying it
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 10:03 PM
Apr 2017

Not for a second. Enough of this false hope. Until I hear The GOP yell Impeach The Bastard I'm holding back on believing stories like this.

cstanleytech

(26,080 posts)
87. Aye I am kind of the same way until it leads to his impeachment as
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 10:17 PM
Apr 2017

well as his arrest and conviction not to mention everyone that had a hand in carrying it out or knew about it but didnt report it (Hi Mitch) is in prison I am going to err on the side of caution and assume its only another rumor.

Satch59

(1,353 posts)
89. This would be amazing...
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 10:32 PM
Apr 2017

She has been correct on a bunch of stuff and the leaking of the FISA warrant on Page, Manafort registering as a foreign agent, the info on the Europe allies giving our IC their info...all these pieces seem to be leading up to something? I also keep thinking about Harry Reed back in Oct (?) saying that what he knew about Trump/Russia was explosive and those classified meetings with committee members who came out looking shell shocked...there has to be something to all this...

Seems Comey needs to spill it if this story gets more corraboration... Louise seems to have faith in Comey and says he is being very methodical...

Louise is also saying Trump is done by summer...bold prediction.

Crash2Parties

(6,017 posts)
91. So why is the top of the GOP so complacent?
Sun Apr 16, 2017, 10:35 PM
Apr 2017

They don't exactly seem to think Trump is doing all that poorly. Which tells me either they control him when he's not looking out for Trump corporations or Putin's interests, or they are complicit in working with Putin. It just seems like if they were on the up & up, their needs and his would be in opposition more often.

doc03

(35,143 posts)
108. This sounds like the kind of bullshit nut jobs like Alex Jones puts out
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 12:34 AM
Apr 2017

about Democrats. An anonymous source telling another anonymous source this crap. When I see Trump paraded out
of the WH in chains I will believe it. What is this place turning into our version of Newsmax?

kentuck

(110,950 posts)
125. It's possible but...
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 07:34 AM
Apr 2017

We are dealing with very slick manipulators. They are not beyond creating a situation that they can easily disprove, in order to attempt to cast in doubt all the questions about Mr Trump's team.

Progressive dog

(6,861 posts)
130. I hope that there is a tape of Trump and associates
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 09:12 AM
Apr 2017

offering to make common cause with Putin against the US. The idea seems farfetched, but Nixon did knowingly tape his own criminal discussions and Nixon was much smarter than Trump.

Frustratedlady

(16,254 posts)
132. Although this would be major if proven to be true, I feel there is something else out there that...
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 09:20 AM
Apr 2017

is much worse. Think back to the look on those faces when the Intel Committee came out of that major meeting where they were told of something so horrendous, they were visibly shaken and furious. Of course, part of that was due to the fact that what they heard was highly confidential and they couldn't express their true feelings or back them up with facts.

What they heard had to have been bigger and nastier than we could imagine. A self-incriminating tape would be bad enough, but it would not have brought that reaction. Actually, I'm very surprised whatever they were told hasn't leaked by now. I realize Congresscritters are accustomed to keeping secrets, but throw in pillow talk, discussions among other Congresscritters and office staff, how has it remained secret this long?

I can't imagine anyone wants this crew taken down any more than me and I hope the above is enough to get the ball rolling, but there has to be more yet to surface and I would expect some strange deaths will be included. Just look at what Russia has already done that we know of AND suspect.

Bernardo de La Paz

(48,773 posts)
136. Remember, the stolen election was by Republican TICKET. No Pres. Pence.
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 11:49 AM
Apr 2017

When it is proven that the election was stolen, the rightful President is the Majority winner Hillary Clinton.

If tRump resigns before the case is proven, Pence takes over, but his ticket and the Republican Electoral College win would by rights be erased and Hillary Clinton inaugurated when the case is proven.

Amaryllis

(9,523 posts)
138. In an ideal world, yes, but there is nothing in the constitution to provide for this, unless you
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 02:16 PM
Apr 2017

know something I don't?

Amaryllis

(9,523 posts)
146. Right, and there was no such thing as hacking or even voting machines
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 03:12 PM
Apr 2017

when the constitution was written! Only paper ballots. So no contingency. Not even any for stolen elections. So it is really hard to predict what will happen. Especially with Rs in control of SCOTUS and congress; all the oversight institutions and entities that would normally decide in such times are part of the collusion. Then we have the FAUX crowd in their alternative universe.

One can only hope, as I believe you have pointed out in the past, that there may be unforeseen solutions to an unprecedented problem.

byronius

(7,369 posts)
142. The shoe fits perfectly.
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 02:32 PM
Apr 2017

Trump is the opposite of the character he's portraying -- in reality, he's cowardly, craven, insecure, and full of guilt. Especially if Putin already had the milder 'pee tape' used to ensure Trump's continuing cooperation with the Russian money laundering, Trump might well have been throwing a Hail Mary in the face of certain loss -- 'save me, Vlad, here's a token of my undying devotion' --

It's all submission-sex and zero-boundaries with that guy. As soon as I read the OP it rang like a bell.

jmg257

(11,996 posts)
144. Great so half the free world has this tape,
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 02:40 PM
Apr 2017

And our own FBI heard it in OCTOBER.

Yet here we still are with "investigations ongoing".

WTF are they waiting for?

Enoki33

(1,584 posts)
155. All the IC experts say it will be a complicated and
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 04:47 PM
Apr 2017

time consuming investigation that for a while will not be on the front pages, but that it will be back with a vengeance. A look at any of the cursory charts available of those with Russian connections confirms that assessment. They have to get it right IMHO.

Calista241

(5,584 posts)
151. I find it difficult to believe that a billionaire would resort to these types of messages
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 04:04 PM
Apr 2017

And with someone who hasn't been a close confidant, consigliere type person for his entire life.

Trump is a billionaire and people have been trying to expose, damage, and steal shit from him for decades. The methods described here aren't even plausible for a street level drug dealer.

AntiFascist

(12,792 posts)
162. He's not really a successful billionaire...
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 07:38 PM
Apr 2017

that's one of the biggest myths about him. His empire, since the real estate bubble burst, has been propped up by Russian investors and loans. This is one of the main reasons why people want his tax returns released!

Motley13

(3,867 posts)
153. putz is an arrogant, ignorant buffoon
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 04:19 PM
Apr 2017

There is nothing he could do that would surprise me & that includes pushing the button & nuking the wrong country.

 

GliderGuider

(21,088 posts)
164. You mean one blessed by the commercial news establishment?
Mon Apr 17, 2017, 08:45 PM
Apr 2017

Louise is walking point on this mission. She's in front of those guys by a mile. Ain't nothing wrong with her as a source.

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