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rogerashton

(3,920 posts)
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 09:11 PM Apr 2017

I really don't think tRump is a Russian spy.

I don't think the Russians would want an incompetent spy, and he is clearly incompetent. But it seems they did want the US to have an incompetent president.

That's a good example for the saying: be careful what you want. You might get it.

36 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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I really don't think tRump is a Russian spy. (Original Post) rogerashton Apr 2017 OP
He's a monkeywrench not a spy tirebiter Apr 2017 #1
Lift sanctions in Crimea, and launder money, too. Sculpin Beauregard Apr 2017 #2
Yeah, he's always struck me more as stooge than spy. QC Apr 2017 #3
Hey QC, love your Celtic cross photos PA Democrat May 2017 #18
One of them looks like the cross at Monasterboice. smirkymonkey May 2017 #22
I think you're right. The round tower at Clonmacnoise is also damaged PA Democrat May 2017 #23
I went on a Rick Steves tour around Ireland. smirkymonkey May 2017 #32
B&B s are wonderful and are a great way to meet Irish people. PA Democrat May 2017 #33
It's amazing how well educated and knowledgeable they are about many things, especially smirkymonkey May 2017 #34
Thanks! In order, they are in QC May 2017 #24
Magical is the word I use to describe it as well. PA Democrat May 2017 #25
I had to get to Sligo to visit Yeats, a favorite of mine. QC May 2017 #30
He's a willing co-conspirator who sought the support of a foreign government to illegally MedusaX Apr 2017 #4
Right, he didn't think he'd get caught uponit7771 Apr 2017 #6
Ya nailed it medusa still_one May 2017 #26
He is too damn stupid to be a spy. doc03 Apr 2017 #5
He isn't a spy. He is a tool. Caliman73 Apr 2017 #7
This is their favorite kind...high up on the food chain and not so bright. Demsrule86 Apr 2017 #8
Depends on your definition of 'spy' Abu Pepe Apr 2017 #9
Well, maybe. rogerashton May 2017 #10
I think that is right Abu Pepe May 2017 #12
He's been laundering Russian money through his properties for decades SticksnStones May 2017 #11
He is a money launderer. blogslut May 2017 #13
I don't think he's a spy .I do think he hired hackers and launders Russian money, though. octoberlib May 2017 #14
Well he allowed Flynn in top secret meetings knowing he was working for Russia so he enabled spying. bettyellen May 2017 #16
You're right. octoberlib May 2017 #17
And he's been laundering money for years- it's a slippery slope, but I imagine bettyellen May 2017 #20
He's a tool, not a spy. Like that other guy, he's too dumb to be a spy. Vinca May 2017 #15
He's a Useful Idiot Leith May 2017 #19
This, in spades... Wounded Bear May 2017 #36
Spy is the wrong word. Intelligence (Asset/Dupe/Tool/Compromised person) - pick one or more. stevenleser May 2017 #21
He wouldn't be smart enough to pull it off nycbos May 2017 #27
Read the Dossier again and connect the dots HoneyBadger May 2017 #28
Trump is a criminal, who colluded with Russian mobsters vlyons May 2017 #29
FF45 is not spy for ideological reasons Thomas Hurt May 2017 #31
He brings chaos and makes us question the very reality of the United States. VOX May 2017 #35

QC

(26,371 posts)
3. Yeah, he's always struck me more as stooge than spy.
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 09:22 PM
Apr 2017

Bannon, Manafort, and the others, though...they know exactly what they're doing.

PA Democrat

(13,225 posts)
18. Hey QC, love your Celtic cross photos
Reply to QC (Reply #3)
Fri May 5, 2017, 02:54 PM
May 2017

Any idea the location of those photos? The one looks like Clonmacnoise Ireland and another either Clonmacnoise or Glendalough.

 

smirkymonkey

(63,221 posts)
22. One of them looks like the cross at Monasterboice.
Fri May 5, 2017, 03:04 PM
May 2017

The one with the damaged tower in the background.

PA Democrat

(13,225 posts)
23. I think you're right. The round tower at Clonmacnoise is also damaged
Fri May 5, 2017, 03:18 PM
May 2017

at the top, but the top edge is pretty even all around. I've never been to Monasterboice, but would love to go there.

 

smirkymonkey

(63,221 posts)
32. I went on a Rick Steves tour around Ireland.
Fri May 5, 2017, 05:07 PM
May 2017

It was great! We saw so many wonderful places that you would normally never see touring on your own. I loved that we stayed in little family run B&B's instead of chain hotels. It was such a lovely trip!

PA Democrat

(13,225 posts)
33. B&B s are wonderful and are a great way to meet Irish people.
Fri May 5, 2017, 05:29 PM
May 2017

My husband did all the driving on our trips and he was a pro at navigating the narrow and winding roads after the first couple of days. We used Rick Steves' guide books in addition to the Lonely Planet ones. They were a great tool although we did still manage to get lost a few times on some pretty shaky roads.

I was amazed how much the Irish people knew about American politics and every single person we spoke with was immensely relieved when they learned we were not conservatives. Haven't been back since Trump has been elected, but you should have heard the locals talking about him because he had recently purchased his golf club in Doonbeg. They thought he was an ass and said his body guard carried around hand sanitizer for him to use immediately after he shook hands with the locals. They were very insulted.

 

smirkymonkey

(63,221 posts)
34. It's amazing how well educated and knowledgeable they are about many things, especially
Fri May 5, 2017, 05:32 PM
May 2017

politics. I also love their sense of humor! They definitely don't mince words!

QC

(26,371 posts)
24. Thanks! In order, they are in
Fri May 5, 2017, 03:44 PM
May 2017

Sligo, Monasterboice, and Glendalough. Snapped those on a trip a couple of years ago. I hope to get back to Ireland soon. It's a magical place.

PA Democrat

(13,225 posts)
25. Magical is the word I use to describe it as well.
Fri May 5, 2017, 04:38 PM
May 2017

I've been to Glendalough, but not to County Sligo or to Monasterboice. We have spent most of our time on the west coast and have rented a house on the ocean in County Clare for a week for a part of the three trips we have made. Our last trip we climbed Croagh Patrick in County Mayo on a gorgeous clear sunny day. It was an amazing experience that I will never forget.

And I love the Irish people as much as the country itself. I hope you make it back to Ireland too!

Slainte!

QC

(26,371 posts)
30. I had to get to Sligo to visit Yeats, a favorite of mine.
Fri May 5, 2017, 04:53 PM
May 2017

Next time I hope to get to Clare, since I have ancestors from there. Not sure which village...still looking into that.

MedusaX

(1,129 posts)
4. He's a willing co-conspirator who sought the support of a foreign government to illegally
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 09:37 PM
Apr 2017

Obtain access to cyber based data which was then utilized as ammunition in target based active measures designed to influence the 2016 election outcome.

This was achieved through a network of transaction based relationships in which payments, in the form of currency and policy decisions, were exchanged for data, services, campaign funding, inaugural donations, etc.


Caliman73

(11,726 posts)
7. He isn't a spy. He is a tool.
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 09:55 PM
Apr 2017

He may not even be working in concert with them in a traditional sense. He is just easy to manipulate.

Abu Pepe

(637 posts)
9. Depends on your definition of 'spy'
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 10:21 PM
Apr 2017

He is a Russian asset. And a witting one.

he might even be guilty of espionage.

But he isn't a spy in the sense of being a trained officer of an intelligence agency.

rogerashton

(3,920 posts)
10. Well, maybe.
Mon May 1, 2017, 08:07 AM
May 2017

As I understand it, most spies are untrained -- made spies by fraud and blackmail -- and often do not know what side they are working for.

Certainly he is not a trained Russian agent.

My point was that the Russian expectation in getting him elected was not that he would do their bidding, but that he would weaken the US. They didn't take into account the real possibility that, in doing so, he would blunder into a Russo-American war.

Abu Pepe

(637 posts)
12. I think that is right
Fri May 5, 2017, 01:32 PM
May 2017

I would go even beyond that and say they never thought he would get elected and we're doing what they could to fuck with HRC, who Putin hates.

SticksnStones

(2,108 posts)
11. He's been laundering Russian money through his properties for decades
Mon May 1, 2017, 08:22 AM
May 2017

It's NY AG Schneiderman's eventual RICO charges that will bring him down.

octoberlib

(14,971 posts)
14. I don't think he's a spy .I do think he hired hackers and launders Russian money, though.
Fri May 5, 2017, 01:47 PM
May 2017

I also think he's compromised.

 

bettyellen

(47,209 posts)
16. Well he allowed Flynn in top secret meetings knowing he was working for Russia so he enabled spying.
Fri May 5, 2017, 02:51 PM
May 2017
 

bettyellen

(47,209 posts)
20. And he's been laundering money for years- it's a slippery slope, but I imagine
Fri May 5, 2017, 02:57 PM
May 2017

Since he got away with all those mob ties he figured he could keep doing it w foreign mobsters.

Leith

(7,808 posts)
19. He's a Useful Idiot
Fri May 5, 2017, 02:57 PM
May 2017

and a dupe. He doesn't have the brains to knowingly do important work for the Russian, aside from helping them launder money through real estate. Even then, he must have thought that it was his awesome powers of negotiating that got him double what that property was worth.

Wounded Bear

(58,605 posts)
36. This, in spades...
Fri May 5, 2017, 06:01 PM
May 2017

Besides, I'm pretty sure he's in hock to Putin and the Russians up to his fat neck.

 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
21. Spy is the wrong word. Intelligence (Asset/Dupe/Tool/Compromised person) - pick one or more.
Fri May 5, 2017, 02:59 PM
May 2017

A spy refers to an agent who actively seeks to obtain information on or sabotage/attack enemy assets and report back and obtain additional assignments.

In the conduct of their duties, spies use people who are assets, dupes, tools and compromised persons.

nycbos

(6,034 posts)
27. He wouldn't be smart enough to pull it off
Fri May 5, 2017, 04:43 PM
May 2017

One of the tactics the Russians use is to use unwitting pawns. That seems more likely

 

HoneyBadger

(2,297 posts)
28. Read the Dossier again and connect the dots
Fri May 5, 2017, 04:43 PM
May 2017

He has had high level moles in the DNC and the party for 8 years. Tulsi is supposedly one. He is not just a spy, he is running things.

vlyons

(10,252 posts)
29. Trump is a criminal, who colluded with Russian mobsters
Fri May 5, 2017, 04:49 PM
May 2017

For a long, long time, Russia has been ruled by criminals. During the Soviet era, many in the Communist leadership were very corrupt, funneling rubles to themselves, their families, and their cronies. When the soviets fell and Yeltsin set up the "republic," Russian oligarchs who were basically mobsters too over many of the industries. The same is true today. Trump is not a spy in the classic sense of stealing atomic secrets. But he has colluded for years in laundering their illegally gained money through his real estate properties, casinos, and other businesses. Moreover, I would not put it past him to sell out military technology, provided he got a kickback somewhere. It's called pay to play.

Thomas Hurt

(13,903 posts)
31. FF45 is not spy for ideological reasons
Fri May 5, 2017, 04:56 PM
May 2017

but to gain power and celebrity and more money I think he would sell out his country.

I think he made a deal with Putin, not personally, to attempt to help him, knowing it was a not a sure thing, and what he traded was ultimately tillerson and pulling the sanctions, also not sure thing.

VOX

(22,976 posts)
35. He brings chaos and makes us question the very reality of the United States.
Fri May 5, 2017, 05:55 PM
May 2017

He sows confusion, rancor, anger, contempt, powerlessness, and eventually has a nation so fatigued and divided against itself that it's no longer a superpower contender. And without a single shot fired.

What more could a hostile power ask of a stooge?

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