HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Main » General Discussion (Forum) » "Sexism, racism and bully...

Tue May 2, 2017, 01:54 PM

"Sexism, racism and bullying are driving people out of tech, US study finds"

More: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/apr/27/tech-industry-sexism-racism-silicon-valley-study
Sexual harassment, bullying and racist stereotyping are common in the technology industry, creating a culture that drives underrepresented employees out of their jobs, new research has found.

One in 10 women in tech experience unwanted sexual attention, and nearly one in four people of color face stereotyping, according to the Kapor Center for Social Impact and Harris Poll, which surveyed more than 2,000 people who left tech jobs in the last three years.

The findings Ė which suggest that sexual harassment and complaints about unfairness are disproportionately high in the tech sector compared to other industries Ė come at a time of heightened debates around diversity and discrimination in Silicon Valley.

ďFor each person who experiences unfairness, itís very personal and itís very painful,Ē said Ellen Pao, Kaporís chief diversity and inclusion officer and former Reddit CEO, who has been outspoken about discrimination. ďAs someone who has been working in the tech industry since 1998, I know itís prevalent, and now we have the data so people can understand the scale.Ē

38 replies, 5509 views

Reply to this thread

Back to top Alert abuse

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 38 replies Author Time Post
Reply "Sexism, racism and bullying are driving people out of tech, US study finds" (Original post)
Jamaal510 May 2017 OP
JHan May 2017 #1
ismnotwasm May 2017 #3
burnbaby May 2017 #2
smirkymonkey May 2017 #5
burnbaby May 2017 #9
JNelson6563 May 2017 #27
burnbaby May 2017 #31
bettyellen May 2017 #6
burnbaby May 2017 #11
bettyellen May 2017 #15
burnbaby May 2017 #32
gypsy11 May 2017 #24
TNLib May 2017 #4
wcmagumba May 2017 #7
Sen. Walter Sobchak May 2017 #8
ismnotwasm May 2017 #13
Sen. Walter Sobchak May 2017 #16
YoungDemCA May 2017 #18
bettyellen May 2017 #17
Sen. Walter Sobchak May 2017 #19
bettyellen May 2017 #26
Sen. Walter Sobchak May 2017 #29
bettyellen May 2017 #30
Sen. Walter Sobchak May 2017 #34
bettyellen May 2017 #35
Sen. Walter Sobchak May 2017 #36
bettyellen May 2017 #37
Sen. Walter Sobchak May 2017 #38
TBA May 2017 #10
burnbaby May 2017 #12
IronLionZion May 2017 #14
CousinIT May 2017 #20
Initech May 2017 #21
NewJeffCT May 2017 #23
Initech May 2017 #25
Starry Messenger May 2017 #22
DonCoquixote May 2017 #28
LAS14 May 2017 #33

Response to Jamaal510 (Original post)

Tue May 2, 2017, 01:55 PM

1. sounds like economic anxiety to me. /sarc

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to JHan (Reply #1)

Tue May 2, 2017, 01:59 PM

3. Bahahaha!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Jamaal510 (Original post)

Tue May 2, 2017, 01:58 PM

2. hmmm interesting

 

I've been in tech since the 80s and never saw much discrimination if any. funny to read that

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to burnbaby (Reply #2)

Tue May 2, 2017, 02:24 PM

5. Let me guess. You are a white or asian male.

Am I right?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to smirkymonkey (Reply #5)

Tue May 2, 2017, 02:37 PM

9. lol

 

no I am a female, white Italian with a big mouth who in my younger days was the intimidating one.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to burnbaby (Reply #9)

Tue May 2, 2017, 05:22 PM

27. There's your answer.

Different personalities result in different treatment. Bullies are good at identifying potential victims. The loud/bad-ass sort are rarely chosen. Sadly, those not touched such bullying behavior are often oblivious to it when it happens to others, or worse, see the victims as just needing to toughen up.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to JNelson6563 (Reply #27)

Tue May 2, 2017, 08:18 PM

31. interesting what you said

 

it makes me reflect. I would hate to think that I thought of victims who just need to toughen up.

Honestly I was trying to survive. My plate was over flowing back then.

This is was I like about DU it makes you think

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to burnbaby (Reply #2)

Tue May 2, 2017, 02:26 PM

6. What was the gender and racial breakdown in these firms because across the board it's dismal....

 

It sounds like you worked for outliers. Or didn't notice the WHY of how few women and POC were employed there. Easy to miss if you're not suffering because of it.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to bettyellen (Reply #6)

Tue May 2, 2017, 02:39 PM

11. I will say this

 

Most of the schooling they used to send us on I was maybe one of two females. I also grew up with only brothers and one girl cousin the rest were boys. I don't know if that played a role in anything or not.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to burnbaby (Reply #11)

Tue May 2, 2017, 02:50 PM

15. When you look around and see that inequality you have to wonder why....

 

Instead of dismissing it as accidental. There's been too much reportage and studies done to ignore it.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to bettyellen (Reply #15)

Tue May 2, 2017, 08:20 PM

32. as I stated above

 

my plate was full. I never looked around to see who and what may have effected others.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to burnbaby (Reply #2)

Tue May 2, 2017, 04:17 PM

24. I'm a white female

and have been in the tech industry since 1991- I personally have had some bad experiences in more than one company. See discrimination regularly. Grew up in a family surrounded by men, i'm the only girl.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Jamaal510 (Original post)

Tue May 2, 2017, 02:22 PM

4. Been a software developer since 1999

I've had some bad experiences personally.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Jamaal510 (Original post)

Tue May 2, 2017, 02:27 PM

7. My sister works in...

a large tech firm and gives me an example of misogyny in her workplace several times a week. Her dept supervisor, a man, actually has the cube offices divided by male and female, women are all together in the area furthest from his office...many of these people have the same job and classification but...women...

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Jamaal510 (Original post)

Tue May 2, 2017, 02:34 PM

8. My girlfriend has been in this world since the early 90s

 

The "cultural issue" she perceives is that over about the last fifteen years tech has begun to attract people who in times past would have gone to Wall Street, Big Law or Big Accounting. Opportunities in those fields have dried up so these people, the Tech Bros and, uhh..."female equivalent" been showing up looking to make their fortune while having little or no technical skills and a wildly different mentality. A lot of people don't want anything to do with this cohort male or female and when those being ostracized are female well the optics are bad and when frat bros behave like frat bros the optics are bad.

She perceives that the Tech Bros and "female equivalent" to mostly congregate in San Francisco while the older Silicon Valley culture is mostly static in good ways and bad. She rolls her eyes at the diversity issue because all the big name companies bombard women, herself included and other visible minorities with high-profile opportunities. But she is an engineer, she isn't interested in being demoted to executive booth babe just so Apple or Microsoft or random startup can roll her out at press events a couple times a year and look diverse.

She is generally of the opinion that pre-Tech Bro technically inclined women and men are basically the same and the shaped by the same interests and life experiences. She believes the force that pushes women away is a fear of being ostracized by other girls for being uncool when they're early adolescents. She just didn't happen to care at the time, she was a lot for interested in outdoor activities and her nerdy projects, notably cable descramblers, than talking about boys at the mean girl lunch table.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Sen. Walter Sobchak (Reply #8)

Tue May 2, 2017, 02:41 PM

13. Does she feel this might be changing?

As more women enter Tech, it would seem the culture would change.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ismnotwasm (Reply #13)

Tue May 2, 2017, 02:54 PM

16. A lot of women perpetuate the old silicon valley culture

 

They come from the same backgrounds, graduate from the same universities and apply for the same jobs. A lot of this is multi-generational now too.

The San Francisco "Tech Bro" scene is something else entirely, that is just a drug and alcohol fueled clusterfuck.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ismnotwasm (Reply #13)

Tue May 2, 2017, 02:55 PM

18. How many top executives are women?

 

That seems to me like it would be a definite barrier to a change in corporate cultures.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Sen. Walter Sobchak (Reply #8)

Tue May 2, 2017, 02:54 PM

17. If "talking about boys at the mean girl lunch table" is what she assumes other women want to do 9-5

 

I'm going to laugh in her face. She seems to be thinking her personal adolescent experiences are the most important thing here? Even though the firms she works for admittedly DO have a huge problem with lack of diversity. But I'm sure she believes she is "exceptional", while dismissing other women as air heads. Wow, that's special.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to bettyellen (Reply #17)

Tue May 2, 2017, 03:06 PM

19. When they're thirteen...

 

She thinks that a fear of being ostracized by other girls as a teenager discourages girls from doing "nerdy" stuff during those formative years and those years of tinkering in the garage is an integral part of the education of a nerd. She will tell you her desire to steal cable is what started her down this path.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Sen. Walter Sobchak (Reply #19)

Tue May 2, 2017, 04:26 PM

26. They're a little young to be pigeonholed as "boy crazy gossips" just because they don't work on

 

cars and such. Not sure why a "computer nerd" would be required to jump into some male domaine in order to prove somemthing. It's awesome she is doing what she loves- it's sad she is falling for such binary and dismissive thinking about other women though. But not a shock that she'd pick that up as part of a rite of passage into their club.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to bettyellen (Reply #26)

Tue May 2, 2017, 07:44 PM

29. Binary? Dismissive Thinking? Male Domain? What Club? What are you talking about?

 

Had peer pressure, bullying and gender roles been vanquished in 1983? Do male nerds automatically get letterman jackets?

She felt she was free to explore her interests because she didn't care whether the cool girls at school liked her or not. Her life was was centered around mountain biking, astronomy and computers. None of which were school activities. If she had been rendered a social outcast because of it she believes she would have made other choices.

She believes there is a certain self-education process that goes into the creation of the archetype nerd innovator and that will apply to men or women, she just believes that social pressure from other girls lead girls away from that path.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Sen. Walter Sobchak (Reply #29)

Tue May 2, 2017, 08:17 PM

30. If you missed her condensation toward fellow students she didn't know well...

 

I don't know what to say. It's awesome she carved her own path, it's sad that wasn't expressed without belittling other women. Is it a coincidence she ended up in a field with the same belittling attitude?
Like you explained, she has a lot incommon with the IT assholes who believe they're innately better than women- it doesn't all sound positive though.

And "creation of the archetype"!?!? All I can say is "Howard Roark laughed."

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to bettyellen (Reply #30)

Tue May 2, 2017, 10:22 PM

34. You're attacking the character of somebody you have never met

 

because you have an axe to grind with somebody else.

I have never heard her belittle anybody except for stock analysts and business reporters.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Sen. Walter Sobchak (Reply #34)

Tue May 2, 2017, 10:39 PM

35. She put down her school mates as a way to justify her boy network.....

 

Maybe you didn't notice but it's right there. Same sort of dismissive sexist crap guys say about young girls - it only sounded new and fresh to you because a woman said it.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to bettyellen (Reply #35)

Tue May 2, 2017, 10:42 PM

36. boy network? you are clearly having a conversation with somebody else

 

please don't let me interrupt.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Sen. Walter Sobchak (Reply #36)

Tue May 2, 2017, 10:49 PM

37. The overwhelmingly male work environment that she strives to rationize away as normal-

 

Because only "exceptional" women can break through and think like the dudes do. Because THATs normal, and other women just could never cut it because they like girly stuff too much. lOL.
If you can't see how wrong headed that crap is, well it's gotta be that love is blind.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to bettyellen (Reply #37)

Wed May 3, 2017, 12:01 AM

38. No, she didn't say that either.

 

But don't let me get in the way of your righteous lather over somebody you will never meet or know as anything other than an antidote but for whom you have invented an entire backstory.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Jamaal510 (Original post)

Tue May 2, 2017, 02:38 PM

10. Don't forget ageism.

If you are older, how can you know about the cool new stuff?

I was coding when most of my interviewer were in diapers. And yes ... I've kept up.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to TBA (Reply #10)

Tue May 2, 2017, 02:40 PM

12. I know what you mean

 

I've forgotten more than these kids today know

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Jamaal510 (Original post)

Tue May 2, 2017, 02:50 PM

14. You better believe it

It can vary by company and team of course, but there is often an undercurrent of people being literally put in our place by the managers who assign people to tasks based not on any skills, experience, or which state we live, but only on looks. You'd have to see it for yourself. If Trump ever found out what sort of people work on federal contracts, his head would explode. I keep wondering when he'll issue an exec order that contractors have to be US citizens. People who look like me are extremely overrepresented in the lower level jobs in tech.

About 3 years ago, I decided I've had enough of people assigning me to projects. I'm going to apply for assignments that I want or change companies. 3 years later, 3 companies later, life is good for me now. I like my work, team, clients, and commute.

Never let someone make you feel like you don't deserve what you want or you don't belong in your own country. There is more than just one type of American.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Jamaal510 (Original post)

Tue May 2, 2017, 03:22 PM

20. First hand experience w/ that.

EVEN TODAY go into a tech meeting at a 'liberal' employer - and you'll see VERY FEW people of color or females - if any.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Jamaal510 (Original post)

Tue May 2, 2017, 03:54 PM

21. What do you expect when you have racist, sexist bullies in charge of the government?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Initech (Reply #21)

Tue May 2, 2017, 04:09 PM

23. it's not a new phenomenon

I think the rise of anonymous hate on the internet has spread out to the real world - the teens and 20 somethings who have harassed women and minorities online have been emboldened by groups like the MRA and have taken it out to the workplace as well.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NewJeffCT (Reply #23)

Tue May 2, 2017, 04:18 PM

25. And we live in a country where that sort of thing can't and won't be policed.

And the mere mention of that happening is very unAmerican and unconstitutional. Free speech is more popular than Jesus last I checked.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Jamaal510 (Original post)

Tue May 2, 2017, 04:00 PM

22. The broham club

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Jamaal510 (Original post)

Tue May 2, 2017, 05:56 PM

28. This is the Milo crowd

and frankly, it would serve them right if people got tired of their uppity ass and moved their biz to China and India, where they can take orders from the sort of people they hate.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Jamaal510 (Original post)

Tue May 2, 2017, 08:21 PM

33. Wow! Does this mean the left suffers from the same problems as the right?????? nt

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Reply to this thread