House guts Overtime for workers

[Johnny2X2X]

http://money.cnn.com/2017/05/02/news/economy/overtime-pay-bill-passes-house/index.html

Absolutely disgusting. And the names they come up for with these bills are right out of 1984.When they come up with their ethnic cleansing bill, they'll call it the Helping Minorities reach a higher state Bill.

[JudyM]

1. All Dems voted against it. Easy to grasp how sinister this is, so it'll be good to use in our ads.

[get the red out]

2. The more I read

the more I hate Rs this morning. Don't know how I hate them even worse all the time.

[MichMary]

3. Is this the bill about comp time?

Just heard a few things about it. I think there are a lot of people who would choose time off over a little extra pay. Especially working parents, who want the time to go to school events, games, etc.

[Johnny2X2X]

4. No choice

It's about the employer having the right to not pay overtime because they offer comp time instead (which they can delay indefinitely).

[Liberal In Texas]

6. From experience I'll tell you

you can amass so much comp time you are never able to use it because the company can't afford to have employees off work that much.

So the upshot is that you end up working all that overtime essentially for free.

[Johnny2X2X]

10. Exactly

Or they'll start having people use Comp time for Holidays. Or they'll reduce vacation because of Comp time.

The only way for this to be remotely fair would be for you to earn 1.5 hours of comp time for every hour of OT worked. For it to be the employees choice whether to receive 1.5 times pay or comp time. And for the Comp time to be guaranteed to not effect other days off, and if it is not able to be taken for it to be guaranteed to be paid out at the end of the year or rolled over 100% to the new year.

The way this law is, any employers would be stupid not to eliminate OT pay and just give comp time which is a straight pay rate. A lot of workers rely on time and a half to get by. And the employer delaying paying out for hours over 40 would be a huge benefit for them as well.

People need to wake up, the GOP vision for the American worker is horrific. They literally would love to see 3rd world factory conditions where workers work 7 days a week 12 hours a day for slave wages. Their ideal is a place where corporations would own the housing for workers and own the only stores they were allowed to shop at.

[csziggy]

18. Comp time as used by hte state of Florida is useless to the workers

I knew a woman who was pregnant. Before she had her baby she already had two full months of comp time, plus the maximum sick leave and vacation time. She planned to use all of those to stay home with her baby for six months before she returned to work. She worked up to days before she had her baby, so she used little of her accumulated time before delivery.

Her supervisors with the state agency insisted that she begin working from home half time when her baby was two weeks old. Then they constantly insisted that she bring in work but would not let her bring her baby even if all she was doing was dropping off paperwork - so she had to hired a baby sitter to make a run into the office. If she did not produce 4-6 hours a day of work time with no interruptions longer than fifteen minutes, she got written up. That meant she had to have a baby sitter in her home to take care of the baby while she worked.

By the time the baby was three months old she was being threatened with firing if she did not return to full time work. Since she was pretty much having to work full time and had not been able to enjoy the first months of her baby's life despite having plenty of comp time she went ahead and returned to the office full time.

To top it off, since she was not allowed to use her sick leave and vacation time, she lost week's worth of each at the end of that year. She NEVER got to use all her comp time and was never compensated for it. When she transferred to another state agency all those weeks of comp time were lost since they could not transfer out of the agency that granted it.

[uppityperson]

9. That may work in theory, but if the employer won't let you take time off, you never get it.

[MichMary]

12. Are there any "teeth" in this bill

that would ensure that the comp time would be accounted for and given, just like pay? Since this would be in lieu of OT pay, I would hope that there would be some accountability on the employers.

[TexasProgresive]

11. Nobody I know has ever made use of a lot of comp time

They are made to feel like slackers when they do. Pay the OT and be fair.

[procon]

5. This is nothing but greed and wage theft.

If an employer can force employees to work overtime hours without fair compensation, then there is no need to hire additional workers. Employers pocket more money when they can cheat their existing workers out of a fair wage, and avoid hiring sufficient workers to do the work.

[Johnny2X2X]

7. Yup

So here's the scam. Company has a really busy week, they make mandatory overtime for their workers, instead of paying time and a half, they pay comp time equal to 1 hour of comp time for every hour of OT worked. So the employer is not paying time and a half, and that Comp time will be paid at some point in the future. The employer pays straight time for comp time rather than time and a half. And this Comp time too, they'll screw people out of it too, if they're willing to screw their workers out of time and a half, they'll figure out a way to screw them on Comp time too, for instance, they'll reduce other time off because Comp time will be available.

People have literally died fighting for overtime pay. This cannot stand.

[ck4829]

8. So the people who don't do any work are cutting the pay of people who are overworked?

Is that about right?

[Johnny2X2X]

14. Exactly right

Math:

10 workers at $20 an hour work 10 hours of OT each at time and a half-
10 X 10 X 20 X 1.5 = $3000 in direct payroll expenses

10 workers work 10 hours of OT for 10 hours of Comp time-
10 X 10 X 20= $2000 in delayed expense.

In finance, the concept of the Time Value of Money makes the $2000 worth less because it is delayed. If I give you $2000 6 months from now it is worth less to you than if I give you $2000 today.

[MineralMan]

13. At many workplaces, comp time is unusable.

Such workplaces are understaffed, as a rule, making comp time something you never get to use at all. If they had adequate staffing, overtime work would rarely be needed. But, they deliberately understaff and hope they can get away with not paying overtime by using comp time that is never actually available to workers.

Strong unions prevent such abuses. No union? Then forget about it. Comp time instead of overtime? If you can't use it, it's worthless.

[rainbow4321]

15. Question: Does it override CA OT state laws? And this screws hospital patients, overall.

I ask because in CA if you work over 8 hrs in a DAY then make time and a half. If you work over 12 hrs a day you earn double time.
I realize this doesn't apply to lot of people but it applies to healthcare workers who work 12 hr shifts (36 hrs a week).

This will screw the healthcare industry nationwide cuz no health care hospital worker is gonna stay over their shift if management asks them to (because the oncoming shift is short staffed) if all they get is promised comp time that in REALITY they will NEVER get to use because hospitals are too short staffed to allow comp time!
Hospital bean counters will love it but you can't force hospital floor workers to stay over or sign up for an extra shift. In the end, this new law effect patient care safety. Higher nurse:patient ratios, etc..

And in the long run....hospitals get reimbursed now in a big part by customer satisfaction surveys (infamous HCAP scores). Low scores=less reimbursement. Longer wait times by patients for meds and other bedside requests make for unhappy patients. Bean counters take that out on the nurses even though nurses are running short staffed....yeah...drumf just royally screwed the nation's hospital patients and bedside health care workers.

[MichMary]

16. Okay, I just looked it up

http://thehill.com/regulation/labor/331645-house-passes-comp-time-bill

Employees will have the choice of comp time or OT pay up to 160 hours, and any comp time not taken in a year would be compensated with pay.

Sounds like this is already in practice in the public sector.

[Johnny2X2X]

20. OT available only to those who will take Comp time

“This bill takes away overtime pay and instead the worker gets a vague ‘IOU’

“Employees would be far better off getting paid time-and-a-half for their overtime hours and putting that money in the bank where it can earn interest, rather than having their paychecks withheld indefinitely,” according to a Democratic fact sheet.

This will be rife with abuse. Employers will pressure workers into taking Comp time. Or actually they'll take OT away and say "hours are available on Saturday, but only for those who will take Comp time as we cannot afford time and a half this week." Overtime is actually sough by most workers.

[uppityperson]

21. So get paid 1 1/2 times now, or 1 time pay at the end of the yr because they wouldn't agree to my

time off request?

Not cool.

[Blue_Tires]

17. But always remember is the Dems who are out-of-step with the "working class"

[Lee-Lee]

22. My employer leaves the choice to me

But my job is very flexible with only about 10 hours a week I need to be in the office and a lot of after hours work and long days. I routinely will do 4 10 hour days and have a 3 day weekend and with comp time for overages when I'm really just driving home from field work I end up with a 4 day weekend about once a month.

It should always be the employees decision what they take.