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DonCoquixote

(13,616 posts)
Thu May 18, 2017, 09:54 PM May 2017

On Chris Cornell killing himself, and generation X

OK, if you are not a Gen Xer, please hear this out, because even though CC might not have been your generations hero, his death says a lot about our era.
Cornell led Soundgarden, a band that was part of the whole "Seattle Grunge" thing, even though he was always more of a traditonal singer than a punk screamer. He had chops, as is shown in this clip:



Soundgarden was always considered more metal, whereas most of the grunge movements kept on saying "we aint metal, we're punk!" To some extent, that was noble, as they did not want to cash in on another era, but to some extent it showed that people wanted to follow easy labels and simply want to tell their boomer parents to fuck off. Cornell had fans, although they were never like the media anointed darlings/spokesmen of their generation, Nirvana, or their good friends Pearl Jam. You see, Kurt Cobain, Eddie Vetter, they knew how to sell the idea of being some tortured soul, so that they could cry all the way to the bank. The Generation X crowd , my group, was so eager to find some way of dealing with real angst, the idea that the last generation really did screw up the world, and left a life where the best chances had faded. Not like they were against all Boomers, indeed, Neil Young joined right in, but that came from the fact that Neil Young really did not care of people loved or hated him, and that is why his career has not died, despite changes in time.

But what happened is that generation X did not know, and indeed, DOES not know, how to deal with it's anger, however justified, in a productive way. That is why so many of the Generation X voices, from Cobain to Layne Stanley to Tupac to now Cornell lived short lives full of "what might have been." Worse, many of them turned conservative, part of that old punk rock "we wanna piss you off" attitude, an attitude that did rear it's ugly head last November when Trump actually used young people and Gen Xers to play Hillary off as the clueless greedy old Baby Boomer.

Now, I offer this to the Millenials and Gen Z. Millennials, you guys are getting a lot of crap, especially from the Boomers and Gen X; ignore it. You beat the Generation Xers are seeing that, unlike them, it is not enough to feel pain and rage, you have to DO something with it, and you are. The Boomers could have been leaders, but too many of them (and yeah Gloria Steinem and Erica Jong, I do include you) choose to demonize you because you would not step in lock, they refused to see that they had to talk TO you, not shout AT you. As far Gen Z, the you tube are already talking about you kids will supposedly be the most conservative geenration ever. All I say is, prove them wrong, because when soem gen Xers bought that from the GOP Boomers, they got screewed, royally, and you do not want to become like the generaion that X'd itself out.

RIP Chris..RIP way too many Gen Xers
74 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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On Chris Cornell killing himself, and generation X (Original Post) DonCoquixote May 2017 OP
I've been listening to Temple of The Dog all night... Dr Hobbitstein May 2017 #1
RIP Chris from a Gen X'er Tom67 May 2017 #2
If Chris Cornell (age 52) was a Gen X'er then so is Barack Obama (who is only 55). GreenEyedLefty May 2017 #3
CC was on the very front edge of GenX... as am i... Rhythm May 2017 #13
Why do we only get 11 years when everyone else gets like 20? OhioBlue May 2017 #17
You're not wrong. It's probably safer to call us the Contraception generation politicat May 2017 #43
"Oregon Trailers" I love that Sen. Walter Sobchak May 2017 #49
I never understood the way generations are sliced up into years. Exilednight May 2017 #72
I'm a few years older, and I go back to before Gen X FakeNoose May 2017 #33
Generation X was first used in the UK Sen. Walter Sobchak May 2017 #50
I can't even follow this any more Sen. Walter Sobchak May 2017 #48
I don't think there is a clear dividing line between these waves of people. GreenEyedLefty May 2017 #59
I was never a huge Soundgarden fan, but I respect the man's work. RIP. Warren DeMontague May 2017 #4
EXACTLY Warren. I didn't know you were a fellow Gen Xer! anneboleyn May 2017 #9
Yep. Warren DeMontague May 2017 #11
I remember my cousin making a joke OriginalGeek May 2017 #22
I used to make Watergate cake and had no idea why it had that name LeftInTX May 2017 #23
Lol yeah OriginalGeek May 2017 #38
Therein lies the problem... CanSocDem May 2017 #36
Yes, I'm a late Boomer and I have lots of Gen X friends... LisaM May 2017 #53
Look, generational generalizations are generally for shit. Warren DeMontague May 2017 #62
Presumably the millenials with the (correctly) high approval of same-sex marriage LisaM May 2017 #63
Maybe, but that doesn't explain why the boomers themselves Warren DeMontague May 2017 #64
Because of what their own parents told them. LisaM May 2017 #65
People are responsible for themselves and their own views, full stop. Warren DeMontague May 2017 #67
But I think it's because a lot of Boomers changed. LisaM May 2017 #68
I know, I went to a Lesbian wedding in the mid-90s. Warren DeMontague May 2017 #70
A more realistic argument is that Gen Xers, and an even greater part Exilednight May 2017 #73
Fine, whatever. Warren DeMontague May 2017 #57
Gen X here, too Dorian Gray May 2017 #25
Yeah, there were a whole bunch of undercurrents that were going on before the media and culture Warren DeMontague May 2017 #26
We had similar experiences.... Dorian Gray May 2017 #27
Ah, too bad you didnt make it to the right show. Warren DeMontague May 2017 #30
Nicely said, from another blue-haired slacker. politicat May 2017 #44
As a Gen Xer this is some bullshit, right here. Spider Jerusalem May 2017 #5
I'm a Gen Xer, and I agree with you. This was just not something I agree with -- Cornell was NEVER anneboleyn May 2017 #8
Correct Cosmocat May 2017 #28
No one ever cared about us. No one ever will. AngryAmish May 2017 #6
Oh yeah, how much has anybody ever heard marybourg May 2017 #7
Your characterization of Cobain is uninformed and frankly, ludicrous. BannonsLiver May 2017 #10
RIP eShirl May 2017 #12
Rofl. n/t miyazaki May 2017 #14
Just a note cagefreesoylentgreen May 2017 #15
Gen Z is used crazycatlady May 2017 #54
Cry me a river... GulfCoast66 May 2017 #16
thank you Skittles May 2017 #19
Yeah GulfCoast66 May 2017 #20
I have to say Skittles May 2017 #60
Totally agree. hamsterjill May 2017 #51
you know it hamsterjill Skittles May 2017 #61
Me too, Skittles. hamsterjill May 2017 #66
whenever I hear about "retirement communities" Skittles May 2017 #71
Thank you. NT enough May 2017 #31
. Iggo May 2017 #39
I'm a gen x'er from the Seattle area mrs_p May 2017 #18
this is about Mental health and depression. it has nothing to do with gen x v boomers or whatever JI7 May 2017 #21
well it does, G_j May 2017 #24
Gen X not defined by music Buckeyeblue May 2017 #29
Right on the fucking money!!!!! moda253 May 2017 #46
Agree, I was born in 66 KatyMan May 2017 #74
Suicide is also a part of millennials. Demsrule86 May 2017 #32
I don't think we X'd ourselves out JustAnotherGen May 2017 #34
Mostly disagree - a couple thoughts Cosmocat May 2017 #35
LOL- We didn't have any rage growing up as Gen X snooper2 May 2017 #37
I'm a genxers TNLib May 2017 #40
A long time ago, post-Cobain on a music forum I posted something like this Tarc May 2017 #41
This comes across as completely contrary to so many Gen X examination articles Blue_Adept May 2017 #42
You know the millenials are gonna blame you, right? Iggo May 2017 #45
Lost one of my favorite musicians and ruined a favorite song Amishman May 2017 #47
Boomer here, and Chris will always be my hero emulatorloo May 2017 #52
I think the gen x tag should have covered another 5-10 years Kentonio May 2017 #55
I was born in 80 crazycatlady May 2017 #58
Here's a little hole in your theory... kysrsoze May 2017 #56
Oh, FFS! This is not a Gen X issue. All generations have had these issues.... madinmaryland May 2017 #69
 

Dr Hobbitstein

(6,568 posts)
1. I've been listening to Temple of The Dog all night...
Thu May 18, 2017, 09:59 PM
May 2017

This one hit me pretty hard.

Pain is real. If you're hurting, don't be afraid to speak up. Life is the most precious thing you can lose. And in the end, it punishes those who care most about you.

GreenEyedLefty

(2,073 posts)
3. If Chris Cornell (age 52) was a Gen X'er then so is Barack Obama (who is only 55).
Thu May 18, 2017, 10:05 PM
May 2017

Which actually says a lot and gives the lie to generalizations like this.

Rhythm

(5,435 posts)
13. CC was on the very front edge of GenX... as am i...
Thu May 18, 2017, 10:43 PM
May 2017

I'm only a year younger...

Quick Google-search came up with this:
Millennials / Gen Y: Born 1977 to 1995.
Generation X: Born 1965 to 1976.
Baby Boomers: Born 1946 to 1964.

OhioBlue

(5,126 posts)
17. Why do we only get 11 years when everyone else gets like 20?
Thu May 18, 2017, 11:59 PM
May 2017

wtf! why do we always get screwed?

*sarcasm* kinda......

politicat

(9,808 posts)
43. You're not wrong. It's probably safer to call us the Contraception generation
Fri May 19, 2017, 12:20 PM
May 2017

I date us from 1963, because the Pill was introduced in 1961-2, and the real effects began to be seen in 1963, and I end us with the passage of the Hyde Amendment, in September, 1976, when the gains of contraception and Roe got cut off for the poorest quarter of the female population. (I think there's a transitional cohort of Oregon Trailers - born 77 to 83ish - who are the bridge between solid X and Millenial. But there's also a transitional cohort - Jones - between the clear Boomers and the beginning of X in the late 50s and very early 60s.)

There are multiple reasons GenX is small -- some of us weren't born, we're a short time frame -- but we're small and influential. We built this internet thingy.

Exilednight

(9,359 posts)
72. I never understood the way generations are sliced up into years.
Sat May 20, 2017, 10:04 AM
May 2017

Most historians break generations down by historical events.

Boomers are often considered to be born between the end of WWII and JFK's death.

The forgotten generation are those that fought WWI.

The Greatest generation fought WWII.

FakeNoose

(32,535 posts)
33. I'm a few years older, and I go back to before Gen X
Fri May 19, 2017, 07:31 AM
May 2017

Here's what I remember: In 1970 when my son was born, they didn't have the name "Generation X" yet, that wasn't in use until the 1990's.

But it was noticed that the birthrate suddenly spiked as we baby boomers hit our 20s and started marrying and having our own kids. This was happening around the late 1960's and early 70's, and it was being called the "echo boom". Nobody uses that term now because "Gen X" sounds way cooler. Your generation is defined by the music you listened to, just as ours was, and I guess it's also true for our parents and grandparents.

So when a new "generation" is born, how do you define it when nobody knows yet what the music trends will be? Also how do you define a generation when musical tastes are so diverse as we are in the USA? Our tastes are not only diverse but quickly changing, and it's hard to define a name that's widely accepted.

Be happy with the name Gen X, it's better than Baby Boomer.



 

Sen. Walter Sobchak

(8,692 posts)
48. I can't even follow this any more
Fri May 19, 2017, 02:36 PM
May 2017

The goal posts are completely arbitrary and adjusted to the purposes of whoever is making the argument. I get particularly puzzled when I look at my colleagues in their early 30's. Their formative years were exactly the same as mine, but they're apparently to be lumped in with kids who had Facebook and cell phones when they were in high school.

GreenEyedLefty

(2,073 posts)
59. I don't think there is a clear dividing line between these waves of people.
Fri May 19, 2017, 06:06 PM
May 2017

I also think Gen X extends to at least 1980.

I also firmly believe the Millennials are going to save us. I might be a bit partial as my oldest daughter was born in 1990 and she has yet to ask me for a dime of money. She lined up temp jobs, side jobs and gigs - sometimes 3 or 4 at a time - to make ends meet when she lost her job a few years back. It was amazing.

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
4. I was never a huge Soundgarden fan, but I respect the man's work. RIP.
Thu May 18, 2017, 10:09 PM
May 2017

I disagree with some of your generational generalizations, though. I think in terms of selling out and getting conservative, you have to look at the Boomers, first.

Gen X- of which I am a member as well- has been catching shit from all quarters from the get-go, and we've had that bullshit about us all being right-wing Alex Keaton clones floating around for decades, at least when we weren't all lazy, nose-ringed starbucks-working slackers.

It's bullshit. There is a strong progressive/activist streak in Gen X, and while many Boomers were nursing their 1970s bellbottom and cocaine hangovers by voting for Reagan in the 80s, a lot of us were active in groups like CISPES and listening to R.E.M. (the IRS years, thank you very much). It is Gen X combined with the Millennials who have brought societal sea changes on everything from marriage equality to cannabis legalization. Solid polling data tells us that.

We haven't always done things the way the Boomers wanted us to, mind you- there is a strong small-l libertarian streak in Gen X, I'll grant you that- which pisses some of them off, but that's the way it goes.

As for Gen Z, or the minecraft generation-- I wouldn't worry too much about them. The kids are more than alright.

And hey, Stephen Malkmus is still going strong.

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
11. Yep.
Thu May 18, 2017, 10:39 PM
May 2017


My first real political memory is hearing adults talking about "watergate"- I thought it had something to do with water, and a gate.

OriginalGeek

(12,132 posts)
22. I remember my cousin making a joke
Fri May 19, 2017, 12:56 AM
May 2017

That my aunt's pistachio jello salad was called Watergate salad because it had bugs in it. (The bits of pistachio nut looked like bugs).

It was many years later in my 20s that I got it.


I wasn't the smartest of us.

LeftInTX

(25,050 posts)
23. I used to make Watergate cake and had no idea why it had that name
Fri May 19, 2017, 02:39 AM
May 2017

Just that I made it with pistachio pudding....yum!!!

Now I want some Watergate cake.

(I'm a baby boomer. This cake was really popular)

OriginalGeek

(12,132 posts)
38. Lol yeah
Fri May 19, 2017, 09:59 AM
May 2017

I loved that salad...really just pistachio pudding with pineapple and nuts and marshmallows and maybe some other stuff. Wouldn't be thanksgiving without it!

The cake sounds great too...ill have to look that up!

 

CanSocDem

(3,286 posts)
36. Therein lies the problem...
Fri May 19, 2017, 09:05 AM
May 2017

..."hearing" about Watergate and Woodstock and Lee Harvey Oswald is much different than being there.

Your generation is always quick to 'remember' the big events, but slow to appreciate those who precipitated the 'big events'.

Up thread you take credit for cannabis...'liberalization' without acknowledging the boomers who sacrificed much in making pot accessible to everybody. As I remember it, it was your generation who decided to put a price tag on grass, throw in some stocks and seeds and proclaim it a consumer product. MY generation was giving it away.

We threw open the gates at Woodstock- your generation is still trying to make money from it.


.

LisaM

(27,791 posts)
53. Yes, I'm a late Boomer and I have lots of Gen X friends...
Fri May 19, 2017, 02:57 PM
May 2017

They constantly blame Baby Boomers for everything, lumping in people born in the 40s with people born in the 60s, and yet somehow don't realize that a lot of the things they blame us for actually occurred under Reagan. They may not realize I'm a Boomer - late Boomer, look kind of young for my age - and sometimes they insult me right to my face. I'm never quite sure what it is we're supposed to have done. Almost none of my contemporaries are rich, and like me, many of them left college with large debt, entered a job market in recession, and have never had the means to afford a house. To hear them tell it, we all basically went to school for free, left college when jobs were being handed out like candy, and squandered everything the next generation "deserved" on McMansions.

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
62. Look, generational generalizations are generally for shit.
Fri May 19, 2017, 06:33 PM
May 2017

But statistically, there's certainly a good amount of evidence that large numbers of boomers, despite their self-proclaimed liberalism back in the days of Jimi Hendrix, tacked fairly conservative as they aged- and voted in Reagan, etc. to boot. (I mean, to hear it told on DU sometimes, Gen X is supposed to be to blame for Reagan- even though, if you take 1964 as the starting year, we weren't voting age in 1980 and most of us couldn't even vote in 1984.)

That's not all of you, nor is it some badge of shame on the entire cohort either. But in terms of where the polling lies, the fact is that by and large it is boomers- and older- who have been dragging their feet on things like marriage equality.



Gen X isn't perfect, mind you, really the credit for pushing those issues into the "yes" column goes mostly to the Millennials. But when Boomers try to pretend like they invented sex and weed while simultaneously by and large supporting granny state prohibitions on personal behavior pertaining to both, the hypocrisy is probably gonna get pointed out.

LisaM

(27,791 posts)
63. Presumably the millenials with the (correctly) high approval of same-sex marriage
Fri May 19, 2017, 06:42 PM
May 2017

have Boomer parents who instilled a lot of those values in them.

LisaM

(27,791 posts)
65. Because of what their own parents told them.
Fri May 19, 2017, 06:54 PM
May 2017

Heck, even Bernie and Hillary and a lot of other people evolved on the issue - in particular, taking the leap from civil unions to marriage and coming to the realization that there is a difference.

When same-sex couples started having ceremonies, it was a very, very new thing (remember how it was treated on both "Seinfeld" and "Friends" as being fairly unusual). Now that it's legal everywhere, I think it's becoming much more accepted. In 2004 it was a wedge issue in Ohio and may have swung the election. In 2016, it wasn't a wedge issue anymore.

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
67. People are responsible for themselves and their own views, full stop.
Fri May 19, 2017, 07:11 PM
May 2017

It's ludicrous to give Boomers the credit for Millennial opinions on the subject while simultaneously letting them themselves off the hook.

I remember, I remember all the bullshit in 2004 about how we were supposed to try and court "values voters", barf. Fact is, though, in my mind at least true leaders do what is right before it is politically tenable- that's one big reason I went from seeing Gavin Newsom as a blow-dried yuppie to supporting his national aspirations (should he have them) -- because he was willing to lead on marriage equality and marijuana.

While it's great that Bernie and Hillary and Obama "evolved", doing what is right once the polling says it's okay isn't exactly what I would call a profile in courage.

LisaM

(27,791 posts)
68. But I think it's because a lot of Boomers changed.
Fri May 19, 2017, 07:35 PM
May 2017

When I was in college, I lived in a house with a number of gay women. Many of them had not even come out to their own parents. I'd go to clubs with them, and it was made quite obvious to me that I was not ever to divulge that I'd seen some of the people there at the club (I was in a kind of public-facing job at the time, so many of them recognized me). Some of my co-workers knew I had gay roommates, but they'd ask in all seriousness, "but not SO AND SO, right?" and I'd always answer "of course not".

Things have shifted so dramatically that it's hard to believe that was in the 1980s. I was lucky that I lived in that situation because it put me way ahead of the curve on a lot of issues, but not everyone had that opportunity. Many of them probably had gay friends and didn't know it. In fact, I know several men who were all living a lie at the time, and have since come out to their friends and family.

Familiarity is essential to acceptance, IMO, for a lot of people. Once they realize that they are not, in fact, going to be "converted" (bad term, but it's what I can think of at the moment), and that their friend is the same person they always knew, it gets easier. I don't know what path everyone takes to acceptance but the important thing is that we are all getting there. Excoriating people for getting there a little later is unhelpful, IMO.

I like my Gen X friends. I just wish they'd quit de facto blaming me for things!!!

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
70. I know, I went to a Lesbian wedding in the mid-90s.
Fri May 19, 2017, 08:54 PM
May 2017

always ahead of my time!

I like Boomers, too. Don't blame you guys for anything, personally- in fact I'm eternally grateful for the music.

Exilednight

(9,359 posts)
73. A more realistic argument is that Gen Xers, and an even greater part
Sat May 20, 2017, 10:18 AM
May 2017

Of millennials were much more open about experimenting with sex and refusing to hide who they are.

I have tons of gay friends, and about 90% of them share the same story of their family being anti-gay, and their family not realising that their own child was gay. Their parents were then forced to make a choice of lovimg their child, or ostracizing them. Thankfully, many of them chose love and acceptance.

But more to the point, I find more often than not that millennials moved boomers, and not the other way around.

Dorian Gray

(13,479 posts)
25. Gen X here, too
Fri May 19, 2017, 06:26 AM
May 2017

I think you're right. I know too many Gen Xers who are all over the spectrum, politically.

I think the Seattle bands dealt with some hard questions which is why they appealed to a certain subsection of Gen X. I love them. But Eddie Vedder is a different beast than Cornell or Cobain.

I think that life is way more complicated than the OP states, but I don't have anything but my feelings to support that, so....

I'm a liberal Gen Xer and I'm here to represent.

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
26. Yeah, there were a whole bunch of undercurrents that were going on before the media and culture
Fri May 19, 2017, 06:44 AM
May 2017

decided - for about, what, a year and a half? - that "grunge" was even a thing, or the thing.

Like the clothes, shit, in college in the 80s a lot of us just dressed like that. It wasn't a "style". And it bled over to those of us who considered ourselves latter day hippies, too. Same with the hair (not to mention the recreational drug use, which up until grunge no one seemed to realize that we Gen X'ers were enthusiastic participants in as well) .. I guess someone was surprised we didn't all wear pastel sport coats like Don Johnson, or something.

I think with a lot of it was, for whatever reason the LA-centric music media had been focused on these sucky (at least, I thought they sucked, but of course aesthetic appreciation is subjective) glam hair metal bands for so long, and then all of a sudden here was a bunch of music that was guitar-based, raw, "authentic", whatever. Wow! Except a lot of us had been listening to "authentic" music for years, it just was called "college rock" or it didn't even have a category, it was weird post-punk like the meat puppets or (god bless them) the Butthole Surfers.... But the narrative was presented like we heard "smells like teen spirit" on the radio one day and all of a sudden 50 million of us stopped listening to RATT and traded eye shadow for chuck taylors and a flannel.

I still like Eddie Vedder, he's done some good work over the years, and he's an outspoken progressive. I liked Nirvana but it's not usually what I want to listen to on my ipod on any given day. I do feel bad for folks like Kurt or Cornell who suffer, for whatever reason. But what do I know, I spent a good chunk of the 80s and early 90s going to Dead shows.



Dorian Gray

(13,479 posts)
27. We had similar experiences....
Fri May 19, 2017, 06:54 AM
May 2017

I was a "faux" hippie when I went to college in 89/90. I wore a flowing skirt and smoked pot. I never partook in the 80s cocaine fueled era. But pot, of course. I went to Dead shows (until I realized I really didn't like the jam band thing), and I listened to squeeze, the smiths and the violent femmes in high school. The hair bands weren't my thing, and despite being from NJ, I dismissed Bon Jovi as being a hair band guy. I was a Bruce girl. Bruce, Violent Femmes, and the Dead. Kind of a weird mixture of music.

Nirvana was HUGE my junior year at college, which led the way for all the other music. (Though I moved out of the country to hong kong after college, and I was subject to more Brit music than American grunge at that point. And I completely missed the hip hop culture from 1994-2000.)

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
30. Ah, too bad you didnt make it to the right show.
Fri May 19, 2017, 07:10 AM
May 2017

Because if the infection had taken, heh heh.. you'd know it.

Well, as Jerry once said, paraphrasing, they're like licorice.. not everybody likes licorice, but the people who like it, really like it. I think I made it to 100 or so shows, all over the midwest and west, before he died.

Far and away some of my most profound instances of personal growth, so if Im an asshole, blame those dudes.
Saw some mediocre ones, too, but when they were on it was like nothing else. Indescribable.

I've always been a big R.E.M. Fan, too, going back to Murmur. And I do like the Violent Femmes, Smiths etc. have some good stuff. For a few years I'd argue the Talking Heads were probably one of the best bands in the world, too.

The Cocteau Twins came up on my ipod shuffle today, good christ that's some psychedelic shit right there.

As for Bruce, he's just got such an amazing body of work. Even the relatively recent stuff- the album he did of Pete Seeger covers is great, and I would put Magic in as one of the top 5 albums of the Bush era.

 

Spider Jerusalem

(21,786 posts)
5. As a Gen Xer this is some bullshit, right here.
Thu May 18, 2017, 10:12 PM
May 2017

Take any age cohort and there have probably been a disproportionate number of deaths due to suicide, overdose, and general self-destructiveness among celebrities, especially musicians and artists. Brian Jones? Keith Moon? Jim Morrison? Jimi Hendrix? John Bonham? Janis Joplin? Those are just the ones I can name from the '60's and '70's, there are a lot more, I'm sure.

Also Trump lost voters aged 30-45 by 8 points. If anyone turned conservative it was the Boomers.

anneboleyn

(5,611 posts)
8. I'm a Gen Xer, and I agree with you. This was just not something I agree with -- Cornell was NEVER
Thu May 18, 2017, 10:32 PM
May 2017

a Gen X "spokesman." Nor was Vedder. Ever. Also, "grunge" happened TWENTY FIVE YEARS AGO. In Cobain's case his status as "spokesman for Gen X" was manufactured by MTV and record companies trying to capitalize frantically on the grunge trend (because let's face it glam metal killed itself by the end of the 80s -- every glam metal band admits that except for Guns-n-Roses, a band that was actually tapping into the "return to real rock" impulse even before grunge hit -- and yes there was definitely a revival in interest in punk in the late 80s and also new wave). Plus we were hit with a recession in the early 90s. Cobain was also miserable in a role he never wanted -- quite obviously miserable. And I agree with you Spider Jerusalem. The older folks elected Trump (their numbers are WAY WAY over Gen X). It certainly wasn't the fault of Gen X ffs.

Cosmocat

(14,557 posts)
28. Correct
Fri May 19, 2017, 06:57 AM
May 2017

This is basically my reply.

Regardless of generation, a good portion of artists tend to be tortured souls.

marybourg

(12,584 posts)
7. Oh yeah, how much has anybody ever heard
Thu May 18, 2017, 10:30 PM
May 2017

about the "silent generation"? The generation between the "greatest" and the boomers". Yeah, I thought so. And get off my lawn!

BannonsLiver

(16,282 posts)
10. Your characterization of Cobain is uninformed and frankly, ludicrous.
Thu May 18, 2017, 10:36 PM
May 2017

He blew his brains out with a shotgun. Is that not "keeping it real" enough? He was suffering from mental illness, as was Cornell. Cobain embraced the "voice of a generation" tag in the same way I would embrace syphilis.


And it's Vedder, not Vetter. You sure you're Gen X?

15. Just a note
Thu May 18, 2017, 11:18 PM
May 2017

I never got into the grunge scene like my peers. I was into the Madchester scene, into British bands like Blur who deliberately backlashed against American grunge. Nevertheless I acknowledge Cornell was a huge influence and icon to many of my generation.

That said, can I just pick a bone over your use of Gen Z as a term? The "Z" implies (at least in some views) that they will be the last generation, which is rather pessimistic sounding. Personally I always refer to that cohort as "Posties," short for "post-millennial."

Good OP, thank you.

crazycatlady

(4,492 posts)
54. Gen Z is used
Fri May 19, 2017, 02:58 PM
May 2017

Millennials are sometimes referred to as Gen Y so logically Gen Z comes next. Maybe the young children (born after 2010) of today are Gen Alpha?

I've heard Gen Z referred to as the iGeneration. From what I see of them so far, the kids are alright.

GulfCoast66

(11,949 posts)
16. Cry me a river...
Thu May 18, 2017, 11:33 PM
May 2017

You state,

"The Generation X crowd , my group, was so eager to find some way of dealing with real angst, the idea that the last generation really did screw up the world, and left a life where the best chances had faded. Not like they were against all Boomers, indeed, Neil Young joined right in, but that came from the fact that Neil Young really did not care of people loved or hated him, and that is why his career has not died, despite changes in time."

We Gen Xer's were born into the richest country at it's richest time in existence. The guy you are lamenting are victims of mental illness and more commonly drug abuse and a fucked up lifestyle they chose to live. They were not 'victims' of some kind of oppressed generation any more than Jimi Hendrix or Janice Joplin.

The afflictions you place on Gen Xers may be things you are struggling with, and if so I wish you well. But please do not stereotype our entire generation into this kind of disillusion. Many of us are living good lives and those of here on DU fighting to make life good for all Americans.

And by the way, many of we Gen Xer's have never even heard of Chris Cornell. But when Johnnie Cash, Merle Haggard and Waylon Jennings passed we felt we had really lost something.

This may be a little terse, but it is how I feel when someone stereotypes me into something I want nothing to do with.

Have a nice evening.

Skittles

(153,103 posts)
19. thank you
Fri May 19, 2017, 12:03 AM
May 2017

I am a boomer and I get so tired of being blamed for an entire generation's supposed angst

fuck that shyte, we ALL DEAL WITH ISSUES

GulfCoast66

(11,949 posts)
20. Yeah
Fri May 19, 2017, 12:12 AM
May 2017

My greatest generation dad taught me that self pity and whining are not good traits.

Complaining about the horrible angst of the 80's to someone who went thru the depression, WWII and Korea is asking for a verbal ass kicking.

Skittles

(153,103 posts)
60. I have to say
Fri May 19, 2017, 06:19 PM
May 2017

being raised by a Depression survivor and a WWII survivor wasn't no picnic - these were people who didn't just THINK bad things could happen, they KNEW they could...

hamsterjill

(15,220 posts)
51. Totally agree.
Fri May 19, 2017, 02:44 PM
May 2017

When I am labeled by my age, I'm also a boomer.

I think the age labeling needs to stop. We are all individuals and should not be lumped into a category that holds some non-pertinent meaning.

None of us can help when he/she was born and we owe no apology for what others born around the same time period may do. Neither should any of us apologize for aging. We are all aging, with no more control over that process than if we had control over the size of our feet, the color of our skin, or the gender we are born.

Skittles

(153,103 posts)
61. you know it hamsterjill
Fri May 19, 2017, 06:26 PM
May 2017

I don't trash other generations, because I know we all deal with issues

All my life I have loved chatting with the old folk, because OMG you can learn so much from the experience of others.

And I love working with younger folk - many of them, I think they must be born with a computer chip in their brain, the tech info flows so freely.....I pick their brains constantly for advice.

hamsterjill

(15,220 posts)
66. Me too, Skittles.
Fri May 19, 2017, 07:04 PM
May 2017

Constantly amazed at the wisdom of those older than me and the brilliance and creativity of those younger!!!

Skittles

(153,103 posts)
71. whenever I hear about "retirement communities"
Fri May 19, 2017, 10:33 PM
May 2017

oh hell no, F*** NO, I would never want to live around one generation, any more than I want to live with one gender or one race.....NOPE

mrs_p

(3,014 posts)
18. I'm a gen x'er from the Seattle area
Fri May 19, 2017, 12:02 AM
May 2017

Grunge was more than a generation thing for me, it spoke to the angst of being from a grey place in the world, the children and grandchildren of loggers and fishermen and Boeing truck drivers and blue collar workers with not much hope for the future. There was something visceral and releasing and alive (and sometimes violent too) about the music. And the plaid shirts with cut off jean shorts over long johns was actually how we dressed in the late 80s. Almost all of it hand me downs (at least for me).

The area has changed a lot, of course. But I don't think I have much. However, when I think of who gave us Trump it certainly isn't anyone I know from my generation from the PNW. Some boomers, maybe, but mostly older folks (like 70+). But not my pioneer lady grandmother. She would love to "box his ears."

Just some humble thoughts.

JI7

(89,235 posts)
21. this is about Mental health and depression. it has nothing to do with gen x v boomers or whatever
Fri May 19, 2017, 12:20 AM
May 2017

the fuck.

Buckeyeblue

(5,499 posts)
29. Gen X not defined by music
Fri May 19, 2017, 07:05 AM
May 2017

There were too many music scenes going on to say that one particular type of music defined a generation. The grunge scene appealed to a particular segment of white middle class kids.

I would say that mostly Gen X is defined by our shared experience of watching our parents generation self destruct. They cheated on each other, divorced, remarried, drank a great deal and while they tried to be supportive, they didn't know how. Because while we were home alone watching MTV we were very much aware of a world outside of our lives, a world we very much wanted to be apart of. That's why a lot of Gen Xers up and moved away from their home towns.

We are the first generation to regularly change jobs every three to five years. We don't get attached to things or people. We crave experience.

If the Gen Xers had a slogan, it would be: leave me alone.

 

moda253

(615 posts)
46. Right on the fucking money!!!!!
Fri May 19, 2017, 12:34 PM
May 2017

Anyone that tries to boil down our generation to a bunch of flannel wearing rockers hasn't a god damned clue what we were all about. They wanted to hang Cobain's death on us like he was "our Lennon". Which for many of us he simply wasn't. Music was TOO MASSIVE at that point to use as a defining element. There was brit pop, shoegazer, emo roots, rap of many varieties. Just a shit ton of different types of music and yes EXPERIENCE!

KatyMan

(4,169 posts)
74. Agree, I was born in 66
Sat May 20, 2017, 10:27 AM
May 2017

And would identify musically much more with earlyish 80s mtv, new wave, REM etc. I thought Nevermind was great but that's really all the Nirvana I'm familiar with.

Demsrule86

(68,452 posts)
32. Suicide is also a part of millennials.
Fri May 19, 2017, 07:17 AM
May 2017

I nearly lost my youngest...luckily one of her friends directed us to her social media page. She had a plan and a date. She was hospitalized this was two years ago...it was hell to find a doctor...she had been put on the wrong medicine at the hospital...and everyday was a crisis for about six months...we found an old fashioned psychiatrist...not a pill pusher who saw her twice a week for six months...weaned her from the meds and gave her new meds...this year it feels like my daughter is back. Depression and mental illness can happen so quickly and often you don't see it with the young as they can be sad and angry as part of adolescence. I had never dealt with anything like this and reached out to AFSP.ORG -This organization literally saved our lives.

JustAnotherGen

(31,770 posts)
34. I don't think we X'd ourselves out
Fri May 19, 2017, 07:40 AM
May 2017

And we didn't sell out either. What happened is . . . some of us got stuck on Reality Bites and others watched Wall Street, then Boiler room and said: Aha - the trick is to not get caught. We didn't x ourselves out - but we sure do have a lot of spending power.

Cosmocat

(14,557 posts)
35. Mostly disagree - a couple thoughts
Fri May 19, 2017, 08:45 AM
May 2017

Whatever personal angst we may have had, for most it wasn't some larger concern about screwing up the world, the X generation was the splinter away from the superficial nature of the late 70s/early 80s, a push to get more basic. Grundge was the counter to hair bands and techo type music, as an example.

And, for most, people don't over think music. I get that Cornell was brillant and all, but I was never, even then, a Soundgarden fan. Black Hole Sun got on my nerves even at the time. I was a BIG Pearl Jam guy, was OK with Nirvana. I could care less about whatever thinking was behind it all, I just liked PJ's music, didn't much care fore Soundgarden or the other Cornell groups much.

As most noted, what happened with Cornell at the end is not based on his generation or some other such thinking. There has always been a big portion of entertainers through out history who suffer from personal demons or some kind of tortured nature.

 

snooper2

(30,151 posts)
37. LOL- We didn't have any rage growing up as Gen X
Fri May 19, 2017, 09:47 AM
May 2017

Everything was actually going pretty damn good, Clinton in office as most of us graduating high school. Good jobs, not tied to our fucking smartphones we actually hung out with each other.

And some pretty damn good music. I guess you do have the goth crowd that wanted to be pissed about something but that was a pretty damn small group. They were too baked to figure it out anyway

TNLib

(1,819 posts)
40. I'm a genxers
Fri May 19, 2017, 11:17 AM
May 2017

at age 47 so I'm on the top end. But most of my friends I had in my 20's and 30's are a bit younger and white males. We have had several deaths in recent years some from disease and one from suicide, including my late husband who died at 39 form heart disease.
The rest are pretty much drinking themselves to death.

I had a falling out with all of them because of their anger and alcoholism.

Its been a few years but I have finally moved on from this emotionally.

I honestly don't know what the f*ck is wrong with my generation it seems to be systemic pain and anger.

Tarc

(10,472 posts)
41. A long time ago, post-Cobain on a music forum I posted something like this
Fri May 19, 2017, 12:11 PM
May 2017


Why We Listen to Music

I believe that there are generally two types of music listener...or two reasons that we listen to music would be more accurate; either to remember, or to forget. Let's face it, for those of us who weren't born into an upper-class privilege of a Kardashian or a Trump, day to day life is a struggle. We work, we pay bills, we have a small bit for leisure here and there, but a lot are one big life-pushing catastrophe away from ruin. An illness, house damage, a car breaking down, all seemingly small things can break down a middle-class family very quickly. When your life and your family's lives are on a potential brink, you look for outlets, and many turn to music.

Some want to forget, these are the people I see gravitating towards pop, mainstream hip-hop, generic rock, and so on. Arena fillers, bit names, big flashy shows. They want to step away from their downer lives and exist somewhere bright and sunny for awhile. That's one way of dealing with it really, imagine for a short time it doesn't exist.

Others, and this is where I see grunge/punk people gravitating, want to remember. Like picking at a scab and not quite leaving it alone. Life is shit, but here's some people singing about how it's shit for them too at times, so y'know, maybe it isn't so bad. We share it, examine it, spread it around.

Not everyone can be saved, it's just how life goes. Kurt, Layne, Kristen Pfaff, Any Wood. I'd like to think that music at least slowed their decent a bit so they had a chance to pull out. I had one college friend shoot herself in the head over issues. Another with crippling depression issues went missing for a weekend, was eventually found and got better over time.

I'm sure this was longer back then but that's the gist of it. I want to remember my anger, and harness it. So, anger? Yea Gen X was angry, we were raised in a conflicting crapstorm of fading Baby Boomer idealism and Reaganomic greed. Wavy Gravy vs. Gordon Gecko. "Here we are now entertain us" indeed, these two factions gave zero fucks about us so we forged our own path, musically and otherwise.

I'm saddened and frustrated beyond words at Cornell's passing.

Blue_Adept

(6,393 posts)
42. This comes across as completely contrary to so many Gen X examination articles
Fri May 19, 2017, 12:13 PM
May 2017

Most of my generation were the "heads down, just try and get things done" mentality while seeing losses upon losses, especially when trying to provide for our children/millennials.

Amishman

(5,553 posts)
47. Lost one of my favorite musicians and ruined a favorite song
Fri May 19, 2017, 12:52 PM
May 2017

I'll never be able to listen to Soundgarden's Pretty Noose again

emulatorloo

(44,048 posts)
52. Boomer here, and Chris will always be my hero
Fri May 19, 2017, 02:49 PM
May 2017

Those songs, that beautiful voice, the pure conviction in every word he sang.

Generalizations are just generalizations. Let's concentrate on celebrating Chris. We're all going to miss him.





 

Kentonio

(4,377 posts)
55. I think the gen x tag should have covered another 5-10 years
Fri May 19, 2017, 02:59 PM
May 2017

I was born in 76, the last year of Gen X, but there's a very clear line between us and the people a few years younger and millenials. I'd probably put the change somewhere around '85 maybe.

I don't like generational generalizations much, but there was a nihilistic, angry vibe about my generation that still hasn't gone away. It did feel like the boomers lecture, the millenials talk about their feelings and my lot are more likely to drink a bottle of something strong and break something.

crazycatlady

(4,492 posts)
58. I was born in 80
Fri May 19, 2017, 06:04 PM
May 2017

And some people classify me as Gen X others millennial.

There was a term dubbed 'Oregon Trail generation" which covers from about 77-83. It covers the people who don't fall clearly into either generation perfectly.

I was also a very sheltered oldest child, so the GEn X pop culture of the 80s was completely lost on me.

kysrsoze

(6,015 posts)
56. Here's a little hole in your theory...
Fri May 19, 2017, 04:03 PM
May 2017

It's being reported Cornell was in good spirits (not perfect), apparently took one or two too many Ativan pills, hence the slurred/off the mark singing, the slurred words to his wife during a phone call shortly (she tried to get someone to check on him) and his quickly killing him self after the show. It's sounding more like an accident.

Your generalization of our generation rings hollow and insulting. I know so many Gen-Xers, including myself, who lead normal lives filled with both happiness and positive activities. We protest, volunteer, donate, etc. If anything, we're the no-bullshit generation. If anything, we are skeptics and realists, not the broken and/or cynical generation. And really, for every generation, there are normal people, freaks, selfish types and those who can't cope. People will always be people.

madinmaryland

(64,931 posts)
69. Oh, FFS! This is not a Gen X issue. All generations have had these issues....
Fri May 19, 2017, 08:20 PM
May 2017

He's four years younger than I am and I am a Boomer. He could nearly be a boomer. BTW, my best friend who was two months younger than me hung himself six years ago. I hate these generalizations that it is just one generation that has problems.

ALL GENERATIONS HAVE PROBLEMS.

You could say the same about the voices and talents that died way too young from the boomer generation.

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