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MineralMan

(146,286 posts)
Sun May 28, 2017, 11:07 AM May 2017

Multiple Sources: Much of what appears on Internet is bunkum.

According to my sources, all highly connected and familiar with both news and the Internet, have explained to me that much of the writing that appears on the web is based on inaccurate information or is sheer guesswork or wishful thinking. They advise double checking anything found on blogs or social media against actual reported news stories before accepting it as accurate or true.

29 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Multiple Sources: Much of what appears on Internet is bunkum. (Original Post) MineralMan May 2017 OP
Agreed, and even the news stories have to be from trustworthy sources. nt CozyMystery May 2017 #1
True. Everything should be cross-checked for accuracy. MineralMan May 2017 #4
How dare you question the internet! hrmjustin May 2017 #2
I dare boldly. That's how I dare. MineralMan May 2017 #3
Boldly, did you just say boldly? leftofcool May 2017 #18
Please pardon my grievous error. MineralMan May 2017 #20
LOL leftofcool May 2017 #21
It's ridiculous around here lately. cwydro May 2017 #5
Anybody can post anything on the internet. The Velveteen Ocelot May 2017 #6
"The problem with quotes on the internet is they are often not true" nycbos May 2017 #7
Honest Abe was way ahead of his time, wasn't he? MineralMan May 2017 #9
That's a fake quote... I'm pretty sure it was Sir Isaac Newton who said it. InAbLuEsTaTe May 2017 #11
Alternate facts! It was Einstein. leftofcool May 2017 #19
Uh, bonjour. (n/t) Iggo May 2017 #8
And good day to you, as well! MineralMan May 2017 #10
You can't lie on the internet. Iggo May 2017 #13
I'm shattered. lpbk2713 May 2017 #12
The strength of DU is a mass ability to debunk false reporting Mr. Ected May 2017 #14
this mopinko May 2017 #22
Consider Feynman. Igel May 2017 #25
The same is true with Fox malaise May 2017 #15
Isn't this page and your post... SonofDonald May 2017 #16
It could be complete garbage, of course. MineralMan May 2017 #17
Plus, 36.4% of all Internet statistics are just made up on the spot. n/t Binkie The Clown May 2017 #23
I'm pretty sure that estimate is too low, by at least 6.3%. MineralMan May 2017 #24
Are your multiple sources "connected" to the Internet? onenote May 2017 #26
They're connected in many ways. MineralMan May 2017 #27
Remember when WH Press Conferences were considered a reliable source of fact based information? MedusaX May 2017 #28
I have always considered them to be biased, partisan information. MineralMan May 2017 #29

The Velveteen Ocelot

(115,674 posts)
6. Anybody can post anything on the internet.
Sun May 28, 2017, 11:15 AM
May 2017

You can pretend to be someone you're not; you can say things that are completely made up; you can sling all manner of bullshit at the whole world, and somebody, somewhere will take it as gospel truth. The Internet is a fertile field for con artists, fakes and trolls. I also love it because you can learn so much (I wish it had been around when I was in school), but using it is like walking through a cow pasture. You have to be damn careful where you step.

Mr. Ected

(9,670 posts)
14. The strength of DU is a mass ability to debunk false reporting
Sun May 28, 2017, 11:26 AM
May 2017

Our collective resources far outweigh the attempts to make innuendo fact. If there's merit in a report, we can isolate that point and use it going forward. If there's not, we can use it to attack the credibility of the report as a whole. If the source is dubious, we can assail it for all to see.

mopinko

(70,083 posts)
22. this
Sun May 28, 2017, 12:01 PM
May 2017

that is why i come here. everything gets chewed over, validated or destroyed.
i like to know what everyone is saying, but i also want to know how valid it is.
du never disappoints.

Igel

(35,300 posts)
25. Consider Feynman.
Sun May 28, 2017, 12:42 PM
May 2017
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Feynman

The easiest person to deceive is yourself.

Why?

Because if you come up with an idea, if you do an experiment that supports what you are advancing, what fits what you believe, it must be right. It's hard to decouple your agenda and goals from your interpretation of what's correct and what should be correct. If you're methodologically sloppy, if your statistics are off, if you don't take into account a control properly, you'll overlook it. Problems vanish and all that remains is the truth that you are bringing to the world and which you have identified with. Such research, such a report, always has merit. If the truth is debunked, it's a bitter pill to swallow because it means you were wrong. Your self-image takes damage. (Not to worry, we mostly tend to forget such things.)

As he points out, once you publish your findings there are no end of critics to take you to task. They do the critical thinking you should have done; the system is adversarial. But the important word here is "critics." If there's a school of thought, the first thing that the school of thought needs is to be self-critical, otherwise you have to treat that entire group as a single entity. Critics and dissidents are seldom permitted to stay in a group if they're too dissident or critical.

There's a reason that some wag said it took a generation for a paradigm shift in physics--until the old guard died out.

Feynman took to task some pseudo-scientific enterprises. They were a target, to be sure--but his primary aim was to tell a bunch of grad students at CalTech how to be good scientists. His secondary targets were things like psychology and education, the "soft sciences" in which controls are lacking, rigor is missing, and random ideas get picked up and bandied about with carefree abandon, at least with respect to accuracy and a self-critically valid methodology. So in education, learning styles and phonemic awareness were a big thing--with even psychologists saying the first is pure bunkum and linguists pointing out that nobody actually believes the long-since discounted '70s and '80s view of linguistics that "phonemic awareness" requires. Psychology has a reproducibility problem. I know one guy with his doctoral degree proud that he had a huge data set and did a statistical tour-de-force on it, using more than 40 statistical methods to find a couple of results true at p = 0.05. (Of course, the odds at that point were in favor of finding at least one positive result even with random data the first time through; he also said he had to revise his hypotheses several times, thus increasing the odds that he'd get random false positives with no way to tell if any were "true positives". Note that he was proud of data-dredging with no control, and called this "good research.&quot Now I run across this "growth mindset" idea: It's a valid idea, as formulated, but not as preached. Deliberate practice, effort, etc., all go to success; IQ is not fixed and can decline or increase. But the way it's gotten to my campus is that practice is all that's needed for anybody to master anything, with "deliberate" being poorly defined; there is simply no such thing as IQ or talent. I keep waiting for them say there's no such thing as neuron pruning. Then there are the literature profs I've run into convinced that Worf/Sapir was long ago proven by linguists and linguists all accept them as canonical truth, but nobody thinks of literature as "science". Again, there's an agenda and a cause, and both are like sarin to truth.

Many of the self-critics on DU are routinely castigated. Bucking the trend has consequences. The real danger is that we sit back and say, "Hey, we're past masters at critical thinking. Hear about that anonymous leak reported on social media and echoed by the Partisan Press? Three sources there, it has to be true." Such systems are begging for disinformation that suits their particular mindset: such a report has no actual source. It's rumor, it's gossip, it's hearsay. It's worth, "Hey, there's this bit of gossip" but no serious consideration past that. As Feynman said, we have no problem arguing and countering things we disagree with--we've vested in the failure of those arguments, they're a threat to our identity (my addition, that last clause). The problem is when we run into things that agree with us and which help our cause: Then we're our own worst enemy.

malaise

(268,938 posts)
15. The same is true with Fox
Sun May 28, 2017, 11:28 AM
May 2017

but guess what, all the other Cable Channels tried to pattern themselves off of them for the money-making benefits.

SonofDonald

(2,050 posts)
16. Isn't this page and your post...
Sun May 28, 2017, 11:30 AM
May 2017

On the internet?, so anything I read here is hokum?.

I've read your posts and agree with a lot of them, so by your admission they could all be garbage too?.

MineralMan

(146,286 posts)
24. I'm pretty sure that estimate is too low, by at least 6.3%.
Sun May 28, 2017, 12:32 PM
May 2017

That's what my sources, and they are multiple sources, are telling me. Sad.

onenote

(42,698 posts)
26. Are your multiple sources "connected" to the Internet?
Sun May 28, 2017, 12:44 PM
May 2017

That gives them extra credibility, doncha know?

MedusaX

(1,129 posts)
28. Remember when WH Press Conferences were considered a reliable source of fact based information?
Sun May 28, 2017, 01:22 PM
May 2017

And could be used to validate/debunk things posted on the internet?

(Don't mind me...
Just strolling down memory lane....)

MineralMan

(146,286 posts)
29. I have always considered them to be biased, partisan information.
Sun May 28, 2017, 01:30 PM
May 2017

Spin, more or less, that puts the best light on something, from the administration's point of view.

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