i know that the left always thinks that they have the momentum for a third party

[La Lioness Priyanka]

But the reality is that if there is momentum for a third party, it is for a blue dog - tuesday group type party.

They are pretty heavily reviled by the national base of their parties, but they are loved in the areas they represent.

They are likely to be well funded because they are business friendly, pro-deregulation, low tax type group.

They are less likely to repulse moderates in the general electorate by not taking up extremely right wing social issues (like being incredibly anti choice or incredibly anti gay)

And we have seen an international version of this in Macron

I'm not actually advocating for this, but it seems a far more likely outcome of the base of both parties being highly partisan and polarized, than the rise of a left wing party that could actually win elections.

[csziggy]

1. I hope the Blue Dogs do NOT leave the Democratic Party!

For borderline red areas they are our only chance to get someone other than a Republican in office. Senator Bill Nelson is often reviled as a Blue Dog - but anyone to the left of him could not get elected. Nelson is a reliable Democrat, votes far more left than he is given credit for, and is in general a good person to have in office.

We are in danger of losing him - the Republican Party is targeting him and Rick Scott may run against him (if he has not already filed against him). They are already pouring money into anti-Nelson PACs. I'd planned on signing up to send Nelson money on a regular basis but with my barn burning down, I just don't have anything extra right now.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

2. people here have hated Manchin, most people didn't even know Caputo's name till healthcare bill

and they seem to hate her less than Manchin anyway

[csziggy]

3. I guess we need to evaluate the Blue Dogs one by one

Some are closer to the party mainstream, some are much more conservative.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

5. we need to review them relative to their district

some one can be liberal for Maine but conservative for Brooklyn.

[NCTraveler]

4. The Democratic Party Platform has marginalized any type of movement from the left.

There is little room to the left under what is deemed acceptable in US politics.

[hunter]

6. Oh bother.

The Democratic Party knows "the left" inside and out. Many of us are leftists, some of us radical, but we are practical too.

The fucking sad truth is that the U.S.A. leans heavily right of center. Maybe 40% of our population is fascist, authoritarian, racist, or otherwise deplorable. We U.S. Americans didn't even know we hated Nazis until they attacked our dear old England, and maybe only because so many of our wealthy class were Anglophiles..

I think Amazon's "The Man in the High Castle" isn't far fetched. Had the Nazis been able to overcome our geographical isolation we would have folded quicker than France did, enthusiastically informing upon our activist Jewish, not-white, pacifist, and socialist neighbors. I wouldn't have been born. All my ancestors ended up in Wild West America because Europe was shit for them. The urban east coast was shit for them too. The Civil War was shit for them. They were incapable of conforming. They would not take up arms. Some of them were semi-functional lunatics of the mostly harmless sort, the sort who did not survive the Nazis in Europe. My insane grandma was inexplicably buried quick in a plain wooden box with a Star of David on it, as per her explicit instructions. Secrets. All I know about my direct ancestors was that they were non-Mormons living in Mormon territory. My last immigrant ancestor was a mail order bride to Salt Lake City who didn't like sharing a husband so she ran off with a monogamous guy.

I'm a radical leftist, environmental extremist, some kind of Luddite. This thing we call economic "productivity" isn't any kind of productivity at all, in fact it's a direct measure of the damage we are doing to what's left of the earth's natural environment an our own human spirit.

Nevertheless I'm a huge fan of Jerry Brown, Barrack Obama, and Hillary Clinton because they know how the system works and they can get things done. Jerry Brown is one of the most competent Governors California has ever enjoyed, just as Obama is one of the most competent Presidents this nation has ever enjoyed. Hillary Clinton was denied that by Republican skulduggery and idiots who somehow couldn't bring themselves to vote for a woman.

[NCTraveler]

7. I'm just glad we were able to slip the Nazi's in there.

Well done.

[hunter]

8. In Trump world, I'm legit.

Goodwin's Law no longer applies.

The Republicans really do want to kill us.

My wife and I are both uninsurable by Republican philosophy, and it's not even anything we did to ourselves, just random shit that fell out of the sky, the sort of shit that can fall on anyone. I'll not go into specifics, but imagine being T-boned by a drunk driver running a red light or a cosmic ray ripping through a single cell in your body and turning it cancerous.

The most terrifying point in my own life, thus far, and I've experienced many terrifying moments, was when my wife's COBRA timed out as she was still undergoing chemotherapy, landing her on the waiting list of our state's high risk insurance pool.

Imagine that. No means of paying the pharmacy...

My wife was accepted to the high risk pool (still very expensive) just in time, but I'm certain many in similar circumstances were not so fortunate, still couldn't pay, and died.

If I hate the Republican Party and Democratic disruptors, you dare call Goodwin on me???

[NCTraveler]

9. "Godwin's law itself can be abused as a distraction"

Priceless.

I was just impressed by the insertion of the Nazi's.

I'm not sure where the "beef" is.

[hunter]

10. You called it. Not me.