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Thu Aug 3, 2017, 03:37 PM

MUELLER IMPANELS GRAND JURY

https://www.wsj.com/articles/special-counsel-mueller-impanels-washington-grand-jury-in-russia-probe-1501788287?mod=e2twus

Special Counsel Robert Mueller has impaneled a grand jury in Washington to investigate Russia’s interference in the 2016 elections, a sign that his inquiry is growing in intensity and entering a new phase, according to two people familiar with the matter.

The grand jury, which began its work in recent weeks, is a sign that Mr. Mueller’s inquiry is ramping up and that it will likely continue for months. Mr. Mueller is investigating Russia’s efforts to influence the 2016 election and whether President Donald Trump’s campaign or associates colluded with the Kremlin as part of that effort.

A spokesman for Mr. Mueller, Joshua Stueve, declined to comment. Moscow has denied seeking to influence the election, and Mr. Trump has vigorously disputed allegations of collusion. The president has called Mr. Mueller’s inquiry a “witch hunt.”

Ty Cobb, special counsel to the president, said he wasn’t aware that Mr. Mueller had started using a new grand jury. “Grand jury matters are typically secret,” Mr. Cobb said. “The White House favors anything that accelerates the conclusion of his work fairly.…The White House is committed to fully cooperating with Mr. Mueller.”


.......


Holy Shit balls....Did Mueller do this because Trump was going to fire him today..is that what Trump was going to announce later?

139 replies, 25863 views

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Reply MUELLER IMPANELS GRAND JURY (Original post)
sunonmars Aug 3 OP
drray23 Aug 3 #1
sunonmars Aug 3 #2
drray23 Aug 3 #5
H2O Man Aug 3 #55
BlancheSplanchnik Aug 3 #113
L. Coyote Aug 3 #62
Not Ruth Aug 4 #126
oldmanandthesea Aug 3 #3
Kingofalldems Aug 3 #4
BumRushDaShow Aug 3 #19
Mrs. Overall Aug 3 #6
sunonmars Aug 3 #8
TexasTowelie Aug 3 #7
MelissaB Aug 3 #9
sunonmars Aug 3 #12
Native Aug 3 #40
Tommy_Carcetti Aug 3 #10
nolabear Aug 3 #68
NurseJackie Aug 3 #11
MiddleClass Aug 3 #33
NastyRiffraff Aug 3 #91
Gothmog Aug 3 #13
SaschaHM Aug 3 #14
GallopingGhost Aug 3 #25
sarge43 Aug 3 #67
WhollyHeretic Aug 3 #15
C_U_L8R Aug 3 #16
L. Coyote Aug 3 #70
maryellen99 Aug 3 #17
Duppers Aug 3 #31
maryellen99 Aug 3 #36
adigal Aug 3 #45
AtheistCrusader Aug 3 #65
Duppers Aug 3 #74
Massacure Aug 3 #115
Wednesdays Aug 4 #120
Duppers Aug 4 #122
Massacure Aug 3 #114
Duppers Aug 4 #121
progressoid Aug 3 #18
LineLineReply !
Kali Aug 3 #90
Glimmer of Hope Aug 3 #20
SunSeeker Aug 4 #132
Nailzberg Aug 3 #21
berksdem Aug 3 #22
Deb Aug 3 #30
Juliusseizure Aug 3 #56
mercuryblues Aug 3 #77
Deb Aug 3 #107
Sunlei Aug 3 #23
drray23 Aug 3 #26
mobeau69 Aug 3 #34
Lee-Lee Aug 3 #32
Native Aug 3 #44
Juliusseizure Aug 3 #48
Lee-Lee Aug 3 #51
L. Coyote Aug 3 #76
Lee-Lee Aug 3 #81
L. Coyote Aug 3 #83
Mr. Ected Aug 3 #96
L. Coyote Aug 3 #101
Not Ruth Aug 4 #128
Not Ruth Aug 4 #127
BigmanPigman Aug 3 #50
MiddleClass Aug 3 #24
Eliot Rosewater Aug 3 #27
UCmeNdc Aug 4 #123
Eliot Rosewater Aug 4 #137
Still In Wisconsin Aug 3 #28
MiddleClass Aug 3 #35
Sophiegirl Aug 3 #38
47of74 Aug 3 #52
SunSeeker Aug 4 #133
Botany Aug 3 #29
procon Aug 3 #37
ailsagirl Aug 3 #39
BigmanPigman Aug 3 #41
adigal Aug 3 #42
Native Aug 3 #46
adigal Aug 3 #47
world wide wally Aug 3 #59
SDJay Aug 3 #61
Juliusseizure Aug 3 #66
Native Aug 3 #87
mcar Aug 3 #69
maddiemom Aug 3 #71
maddiemom Aug 3 #73
safeinOhio Aug 3 #75
humbled_opinion Aug 3 #80
WinstonSmith4740 Aug 3 #84
adigal Aug 3 #86
trof Aug 3 #43
47of74 Aug 3 #53
Juliusseizure Aug 3 #64
ailsagirl Aug 3 #88
tazkcmo Aug 3 #57
Enoki33 Aug 3 #49
safeinOhio Aug 3 #78
Hieronymus Aug 3 #54
Blue_true Aug 3 #58
MiddleClass Aug 3 #82
Blue_true Aug 3 #85
More_Cowbell Aug 3 #116
MiddleClass Aug 4 #138
pnwmom Aug 3 #97
FakeNoose Aug 3 #104
Blue_true Aug 3 #105
FakeNoose Aug 3 #106
L. Coyote Aug 3 #60
LiberalLovinLug Aug 3 #63
Native Aug 3 #89
Cosmocat Aug 3 #98
LiberalLovinLug Aug 4 #124
flibbitygiblets Aug 3 #100
Warren DeMontague Aug 3 #109
Ruby the Liberal Aug 3 #110
More_Cowbell Aug 3 #118
LiberalLovinLug Aug 4 #125
Kentonio Aug 4 #135
Still In Wisconsin Aug 3 #72
Cognitive_Resonance Aug 3 #79
kentuck Aug 3 #92
mucifer Aug 3 #93
JHan Aug 3 #94
workinclasszero Aug 3 #95
GopherGal Aug 3 #99
Vinnie From Indy Aug 3 #102
Ruby the Liberal Aug 3 #111
MrPurple Aug 4 #130
aikoaiko Aug 3 #103
briv1016 Aug 3 #108
machoneman Aug 3 #112
gristy Aug 3 #117
Scruffy1 Aug 3 #119
MrPurple Aug 4 #129
sunonmars Aug 4 #131
SunSeeker Aug 4 #134
PatrickforO Aug 4 #136
bucolic_frolic Aug 6 #139

Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 03:39 PM

1. this is very significant.

if he is empaneling a grand jury, this means he is thinking that he is very close or already has enough material to ask for indictments.

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Response to drray23 (Reply #1)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 03:40 PM

2. Apparently he did it weeks ago, suggests he has the goods and is going for more.

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Response to sunonmars (Reply #2)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 03:42 PM

5. maybe they already have returned sealed indictments

and Mueller is waiting to release all of them at once.

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Response to drray23 (Reply #1)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:01 PM

55. Correct.

It's also insurance that Trump cannot fire him, as obstruction is the easiest, quickest charge to get an indictment on.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #55)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 10:21 PM

113. :)

Yaaaaasssssss!!!!

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Response to drray23 (Reply #1)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:18 PM

62. Indictments almost certain and all the necessary evidence ready to present to jurors.

Witnesses already interviewed and selected for the panel, etc., etc.





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Response to drray23 (Reply #1)

Fri Aug 4, 2017, 01:01 AM

126. Trump was indicted months ago per Louise Mensch

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 03:41 PM

3. He is going to announce that the reprobate Gov. Of W. Va. is going "republican"

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 03:42 PM

4. Aha! That's what this tweet is about:

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Response to Kingofalldems (Reply #4)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:04 PM

19. That's a new one

I usually see the egg or a small board one.

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 03:43 PM

6. Did trump know this was coming and his rally "announcement" is the news diversion?

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Response to Mrs. Overall (Reply #6)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 03:44 PM

8. suggests No - as trumps "counsel" was shocked....panic has set in at the WH.

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 03:44 PM

7. The White House favors anything that accelerates the conclusion of his work fairly."

Since firing Mueller would accelerate the conclusion of his work shouldn't we also conclude that the White House sees firing Mueller is an effective outcome?

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 03:44 PM

9. I think this is an important quote from the article:

“This doesn’t mean he is going to bring charges,” Mr. Zeno cautioned. “But it shows he is very serious. He wouldn’t do this if it were winding down.”


The "winding down" sounds quite significant.

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Response to MelissaB (Reply #9)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 03:45 PM

12. He's ramping it up, he added an "illegal foreign bribe" lawyer yesterday tells us everything.

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Response to sunonmars (Reply #12)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:39 PM

40. This guy?

From the article:
"Another sign the investigation is ramping up: Greg Andres, a top partner in a powerhouse New York law firm, Davis Polk & Wardwell LLP, has joined Mr. Mueller's team. Mr. Andres, a former top Justice Department official who also oversaw the criminal division of the U.S. attorney's office in Brooklyn, wouldn't leave his private-sector job for a low-level investigation, Mr. Zeno said." "People like Greg Andres don't leave private practice willy-nilly," Mr. Zeno said, "The fact he is being added after a couple of months shows how serious this is and that it could last a long time."

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 03:44 PM

10. Official White House comment:

"Uh-oh."

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Response to Tommy_Carcetti (Reply #10)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:22 PM

68. LOL! You made me click.

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 03:44 PM

11. There haven't been many (any?) leaks coming from Mueller's team, have there?

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Response to NurseJackie (Reply #11)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:23 PM

33. That was what was driving me nuts in anticipation

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Response to NurseJackie (Reply #11)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 06:25 PM

91. Not to my knowledge

Mueller simply doesn't leak, and he has the stature to make sure his team doesn't either.

This is getting good! I'm stocking up:

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 03:46 PM

13. This is a good step in the right direction

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 03:47 PM

14. I'm cackling like a witch right now.

Last edited Thu Aug 3, 2017, 07:57 PM - Edit history (1)

It's probably Defcon 1 (Thanks) at the WH now.

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Response to SaschaHM (Reply #14)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:19 PM

25. More like DEFCON 1.

Five is least severe. I can only imagine how Twitler is reacting to this piece of news.

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Response to SaschaHM (Reply #14)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:22 PM

67. It's DEFCON 1, Cocked pistol: Nuclear war is imminent

or shit just hit the fan.

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 03:51 PM

15. Must be why Hannity did a hit piece on Mueller yesterday.

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 03:59 PM

16. Someone's getting indicted

and someone may be an un-indicted co-conspirator.

Seems its getting too late to fire Mueller.

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Response to C_U_L8R (Reply #16)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:23 PM

70. Have a fun vacation, and just keep repeating "Crooked Hillary" ROFLMAO

Should be a fun rally in WV



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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:02 PM

17. Nuclear war with NK in the next few days..,

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Response to maryellen99 (Reply #17)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:23 PM

31. Military generals would invoke the 25th Amendment

And not follow that order - an order which would end in destroying S.K. and parts of Japan. Remember there are ~84,000 Americans stationed in SK and Japan.

Also China wouldn't just sit there. Too dangerous a scenario. The military knows this man is nuts. If they chose ignore his transgender order, I think they'd ignore a call for nuclear war.



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Response to Duppers (Reply #31)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:33 PM

36. Let's hope so..nt

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Response to Duppers (Reply #31)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:45 PM

45. Mattis might. Kelly would help push the button. Nt

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Response to Duppers (Reply #31)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:21 PM

65. The system isn't actually engineered to allow that.

If the Secretary of Defense does not concur, the president can fire him and replace him until one does say 'concur'.

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Response to AtheistCrusader (Reply #65)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:26 PM

74. It would seem that Congress would call

A special emergency session in that case.

Often repeated here: this man is too incompetent, insane, and dangerous to hold the highest office in the country.

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Response to Duppers (Reply #74)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 10:55 PM

115. Congress (likely) couldn't stop Trump

They could impeach him, but I doubt they could convene 218 yay votes in the House, 51 yay votes in the Senate, and the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court before the nukes left their silos.

The more likely scenario would be:
1) Trump orders the nuclear strike
2) James Mattis says no.
3) Trump fires Mattis and Patrick Shanahan takes over as he is Deputy Secretary of Defense.
4) Mattis calls Mike Pence
5) Mike Pence tries to convince eight of the 15 cabinet members to invoke the 25th amendment and declare Trump unfit for office
6) Pence and the eight cabinet members send a message to the Speaker of the House (Paul Ryan) and Senate President Pro Tempore (Orrin Hatch) that Pence is Acting-President of the United States.

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Response to Massacure (Reply #115)

Fri Aug 4, 2017, 12:03 AM

120. Slight correction:

They would need 67 votes in the Senate to convict Rump. But if anything, that bolsters your point.

Edit: let's hope that in your scenario, steps 4, 5, and 6 happen very quickly...like within minutes, if not seconds.

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Response to Massacure (Reply #115)

Fri Aug 4, 2017, 12:16 AM

122. Thank you!

Another person also enlightened me.

Let's hope this would happen.


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Response to Duppers (Reply #31)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 10:49 PM

114. Generals cannot invoke the 25th

The 25th can only by invoked by the Vice President in addition to eight of the 15 cabinet members.

If President issues an order for a nuclear strike, the National Command Authority would contact the Secretary of Defense to validate the order. Legally, the Secretary of Defense is only supposed to be able to authenticate the validity of the order; he or she cannot veto it. If James Mattis refused to validate a nuclear strike order from Trump, things would get interesting to say the least.

Trump could fire Mattis and order Patrick Shanahan (the Deputy Secretary of Defense) to validate the order. If Shanahan refused, Trump could fire him and order the next person in line to validate the order.

Mattis would probably call Mike Pence, and Pence could then try to convince eight cabinet members to recognize him as acting president. If Pence got the support of eight cabinet members, he would then have to inform the Speaker of the House and the Senate President Pro Tempore of such. I'm not sure how the military chain of command would be notified though.

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Response to Massacure (Reply #114)

Fri Aug 4, 2017, 12:12 AM

121. Thank You!

I should have looked this up. My 2nd thought was that it would take a congressional act.

Thank you for enlightening me.

Pence is also nuts but do you think that he would start a nuclear war with North Korea? If he took the sane route, could he get 8 cabinet members to agree?



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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:03 PM

18. To investigate Benghazi??!!

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Response to progressoid (Reply #18)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 06:02 PM

90. !

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:06 PM

20. A D.C. based grand jury! Nice!

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Response to Glimmer of Hope (Reply #20)

Fri Aug 4, 2017, 03:22 AM

132. Indeed. nt

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:08 PM

21. BOOM SHAAK-A-LACKA

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:13 PM

22. "continue for months"

awwww, come on! we could be in a nuclear war by then! Bring this F-er down quickly please!


Sorry folks, just being impatient.

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Response to berksdem (Reply #22)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:22 PM

30. Are you part of a military family too?

Days like this you laugh tears. Hang in there, the good guys are gonna win this!

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Response to Deb (Reply #30)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:06 PM

56. Military/Defense Dept seems to running policy

since Trump is clueless and crazy, and I don't think Trump would digress from advice, or be allowed to.

Which is good in his case, with Mattis and Kelly in there. Though JFK would have bombed Cuba and started WWIII if it was up to his generals.

It just goes to show how ignorant, self-centered and CHILDLIKE Trump supporters are - exclusively focused on race - by allowing this idiot in there.

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Response to Deb (Reply #30)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:29 PM

77. I am

and despite just coming back from deployment, be ready to deploy was the message when trump started squatting in the White House. Officers are very worried what he might do.

Just look at his tweet the other day when trump said he had a big announcement for the military. Then took almost 10 minutes to tweet the announcement. The bigwigs thought he was going to announce bombing NK. He then announced his ban on transgender members, which the military promptly said they weren't going to change policy.

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Response to mercuryblues (Reply #77)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 09:20 PM

107. Enjoy the sweet things in life, you deserve it

My husband worked in the Titan silos and we had some very anxious times but never anything like this. My son is currently deployed to Japan, everyone here and there is nervous, a very insecure time for us all.

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:18 PM

23. I don't understand why Special Counsel would need to impanel a grand jury.

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Response to Sunlei (Reply #23)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:21 PM

26. grand juries are the ones that can return indicments.

prosecutors can present facts to the grand jury. If they return an indictment, the prosecutor can then proceed directly to trial.

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Response to drray23 (Reply #26)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:23 PM

34. Yes, I think if a GJ indicts the trial happens a lot sooner.

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Response to Sunlei (Reply #23)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:23 PM

32. There are only two reasons for a grand jury in this case

Reason 1- he has enough evidence for an indictment and wants one.

Reason 2- he doesn't have enough evidence or it's a close call and he wants a grand jury to make the call to not move forward based on what they have instead of doing it himself so as to not look like he did it or so he doesn't take the heat for nothing coming from his investigation by saying "I have it all to the grand jury, it was their call not mine."

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Response to Lee-Lee (Reply #32)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:44 PM

44. he wouldn't be pulling attorneys from the private sector as recently as yesterday if it is #2.

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Response to Lee-Lee (Reply #32)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:53 PM

48. Wouldn't reason 2 be inconsistent w/hiring

additional attorneys? Asking for a friend.

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Response to Juliusseizure (Reply #48)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:56 PM

51. Probably.

I don't think it's likely that option 2 is on the table, but like I said you never know and should be aware of all possibilities and not read this to mean anything for sure.

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Response to Lee-Lee (Reply #32)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:29 PM

76. Assange has a third reason, no evidence. LOL.

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Response to L. Coyote (Reply #76)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:32 PM

81. He a moron more and more every day...

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Response to Lee-Lee (Reply #81)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:40 PM

83. He is also worried because he is part of a criminal conspiracy. He may be indicted too.

And Ecuador would likely turn him over for that one.

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Response to L. Coyote (Reply #76)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 08:07 PM

96. When the court of public opinion holds absolutely ZERO sway in the ultimate disposition

Why in God's name do Trump and Assange and these fools take straight to Twitter to feign innocence when their guilt will soon be revealed? What is the upside? A few more days of pretend bravado?

STFU.

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Response to Mr. Ected (Reply #96)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 08:40 PM

101. Self delusion requires constant reinforcement and the very best lies, only the best lies, bigly lies

Trump will read this and think it really happened.

Trump Says Mueller Just Called Him and Said He’s the Most Innocent Person Ever
By Andy Borowitz - http://www.newyorker.com/humor/borowitz-report/trump-says-mueller-just-called-him-and-said-hes-the-most-innocent-person-ever

WASHINGTON (The Borowitz Report)—The special counsel, Robert Mueller, just called Donald Trump to tell the President that he was “the most innocent person ever,” Trump told reporters on Thursday.

“It was the middle of the afternoon, and he just picked up the phone to say how innocent I was,” Trump said. “He said I was the most innocent person he’d ever come across, and maybe in history.”

“He said he had been over all of the evidence and that he and his staff would spend hours just looking at each other in amazement at about how unbelievably innocent I was,” he said.

Trump said that he asked Mueller why, in his opinion, the media had reported so many stories about his campaign colluding with Russians. “Bob said to me, ‘Are you talking about the failing New York Times and CNN?’ ” Trump reported. “ ‘They have been very unfair to you. They are bad (or sick) people. Sad!’ That’s what Bob said to me.” ......


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Response to L. Coyote (Reply #76)

Fri Aug 4, 2017, 01:06 AM

128. CNN was saying this on the radio today

No collusion, Mueller is past that, focusing on finances. And that a Mueller has crossed a red line, whatever that is.

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Response to Lee-Lee (Reply #32)

Fri Aug 4, 2017, 01:04 AM

127. Per Louise Mensch, there have been grand juries in EDVA for months

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Response to Sunlei (Reply #23)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:56 PM

50. Nicole Wallace's guests are saying that Mueller just needs more space for

all of the documentation, the growing staff and their work, the growing list of spacial attorneys, along with the new Grand Jury people and their staff and the area is larger and it makes sense as far as distance, bringing more witnesses/ people in to interview, etc.

They are saying that Mueller is nearing the fine tuning portion of the investigation and this will take a while but he knows what and who he needs to bring it all together completely and thoroughly from all angles.

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:18 PM

24. Yes, that is entirely possible

This is heating up, I knew something was going on

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:21 PM

27. 2nd one, already one for Flynn...this is getting EXCITING

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Response to Eliot Rosewater (Reply #27)

Fri Aug 4, 2017, 12:27 AM

123. Flynn had financial ties to Cambridge Analytica. They coordinated with Russian Intelligence

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Response to UCmeNdc (Reply #123)

Fri Aug 4, 2017, 11:11 AM

137. I wish I could take credit for what I am about to say

I have the best juries
my juries are so great
.. so great they're called grand

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:21 PM

28. Trump has a lawyer named Ty Cobb? That's rich! Every avid baseball fan knows

that Ty Cobb might be the all-time biggest asshole in the history of the sport!

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Response to Still In Wisconsin (Reply #28)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:32 PM

35. He is related to the same

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Response to Still In Wisconsin (Reply #28)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:37 PM

38. They are related.

No lie.

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Response to Still In Wisconsin (Reply #28)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:57 PM

52. Ty Cobb wanted to play

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Response to 47of74 (Reply #52)

Fri Aug 4, 2017, 03:23 AM

133. LOL

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:22 PM

29. OWWWWWWW!

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:35 PM

37. Waiting for Trump to unleash the bling bedazzled squirrels as countermeasures. nt

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:38 PM

39. GOOD!!

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:42 PM

41. MSNBC is officially calling it a "Grand Jury Investigation". Even though it is the same investigate

the name change implies the severity. This may throw the fake prez into an even bigger basket case. Wonder what he'll say at his pep rally (who pays for those by the way?).

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:43 PM

42. I think Trump resigns in August, may never even go back to DC

Then Pence pardons him.
He will forget, as usual, about NY's Atty General who is also on the hunt, and Pence can't pardon state crimes.
With his corrupt business history, Trump should NEVER HAVE run for any office, even dogcatcher.

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Response to adigal (Reply #42)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:50 PM

46. this has always been the thing i never quite understood - with all that baggage, why would you run?

ok, never mind. Ego, check. Self-delusional, check. Greedy, check. Stupid, check.

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Response to Native (Reply #46)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:50 PM

47. Since the earliest Grrek tragedies, hubris takes people down nt

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Response to Native (Reply #46)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:13 PM

59. Money from Russia is reason enough for Trump

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Response to Native (Reply #46)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:16 PM

61. Ego Is Certainly

part of it, in my opinion. Let's not forget, though, that Russia has been grooming this clown for years, and I think this is all part of a 'creative' way for Dump to 'pay back' the hundreds of millions of dollars the deadbeat will never otherwise pay back to Russian creditors.

Putin, aside from whatever other kompromat he has, literally owns his ass. He ran because he was told to run.

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Response to Native (Reply #46)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:21 PM

66. If I could get inside his mind

I'd get out immediately.

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Response to Juliusseizure (Reply #66)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:51 PM

87. Nice!

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Response to Native (Reply #46)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:23 PM

69. Malignant narcissist sociopaths

are never responsible for their behavior. The way he lies about the littlest things, and does it so badly, shows the ego and delusion.

Oh, I want them all to go down!

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Response to adigal (Reply #42)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:24 PM

71. Pence just got in on Trumps' coat tails.

He should be subject to the same election irregularities applied to Trump (of course, Ryan is just as unappealing, Hatch not so good, either). It infuriates me that Trump is only in due to the Electoral College, which was allegedly in place to stop the very kind of candidate Trump was well-known to be. After the Democrats lost despite winning the popular vote in 2000, nothing but a little grumbling occurred. Supposedly the Bush people were ready for an all-out fight if the popular/electoral votes had gone the other way. Trump's followers would be up for bloodshed if the rightful winner were installed in the office now. What a mess! I put a lot of it on the Democrats, who did nothing about the Electoral College after 2000.

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Response to adigal (Reply #42)


Response to adigal (Reply #42)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:28 PM

75. Pence might think twice.

G. Ford's pardon of Nixon was the end of his career.

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Response to adigal (Reply #42)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:32 PM

80. Never

His ego wouldn't allow it check him out tonight in WV with massive crowds of adoring fans, he eats that shit up. Any crime he could get impeached but I doubt the Repub house would even consider it, of course it becomes the dominate campaign issue for 2018 our side saying hold him accountable elect us, but that comes with risk and if in fact we win the House we can certainly impeach him but again he won't resign and the Senate would require 2/3 to remove and sorry but that simply won't happen. I believe his minions are already beginning a push to get a special counsel to investigate the leaks, the Clinton campaign, and the previous administration unmasking, they do this to muddy the waters and point fingers, political tactic may backfire on them.

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Response to adigal (Reply #42)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:41 PM

84. I agree...he will resign soon.

Mueller wouldn't have impaneled this grand jury if he didn't have some serious shit. Trump will walk before he lets his financial affairs be made public. Personally, I think it's because he just isn't as wealthy as he claims to be, or possibly at all, and that would destroy his whole "mystique/brand". He just thought he could bully everyone to get his own way, just like he did in business. I'm just to the point that I don't care if he, his evil spawn, or anyone else involved in this national nightmare ever do any time. I mean, I'd love to see them in orange jumpsuits, but that ain't gonna happen. I just want these assholes OUT of power. I want power wrenched out of their hands, and the whole cabal sent packing. Let him live with the knowledge he was the most hated President in history. Just get them out. Maybe Putin will take them in.

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Response to WinstonSmith4740 (Reply #84)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:49 PM

86. And they will be like W and Cheney...never able to walk on a street again

Or go to a show, or an event, or anywhere, cause we will give them the Bronx cheer.

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:44 PM

43. Boy, would I love to be on that jury.

Not that I'd be biased or anything.

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Response to trof (Reply #43)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:58 PM

53. Yeah me too

Not that I would be biased either.

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Response to 47of74 (Reply #53)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:20 PM

64. Where would you find an impartial jury?

Seriously, that would be a risk, so assuming genuine intent here is to get an indictment, Mueller must think he has a strong enough case to persuade a member of the "silent" majority.

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Response to Juliusseizure (Reply #64)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:53 PM

88. That's the thing

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Response to trof (Reply #43)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:07 PM

57. Me three.

Completely unbiased.

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:55 PM

49. I get a small degree of satisfaction in imaging the con man squirming in

frustration and the fear beginning to take control. He is going to react in angry and unstable ways.

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Response to Enoki33 (Reply #49)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:31 PM

78. I'm thinking of him calling his

jail cell a dump

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 04:58 PM

54. Love it ..

Mueller is the Right's worst nightmare.

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:11 PM

58. Grand Juries are not investigative. They are there to decide whether to indict.

Seems like Mueller sees what he thinks is criminal conduct.

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Response to Blue_true (Reply #58)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:38 PM

82. Not a lawyer, not even a paralegal

Last edited Fri Aug 4, 2017, 11:54 AM - Edit history (1)

But somebody on MTP told Chuck, investigations, use whatever grand jury is already impaneled to subpoena documents. What one reason you would impanel your own would be ongoing multiple involved witnesses, subpoenas, indictments

Hopefully a legal whiz could help us out on this

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Response to MiddleClass (Reply #82)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:43 PM

85. There are several DU members who are Attornies. Maybe they can weigh in.

I could be wrong on my earlier view, but that is all that I have seen such juries do.

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Response to MiddleClass (Reply #82)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 11:03 PM

116. I'm no longer practicing but...

I think the new D.C. grand jury is for crimes committed there, in the District (including, of course, the White House). I think the F.B.I. *is* using the already-existing grand jury in the Eastern District of Virginia for security-related crimes.

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Response to More_Cowbell (Reply #116)

Fri Aug 4, 2017, 11:57 AM

138. Thank you for narrowing them down, it helps perception a lot

We can only hope our assumptions turn into reality. But right now it is wishful thinking

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Response to Blue_true (Reply #58)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 08:07 PM

97. They can issue subpoenas. That's investigative. n/t

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Response to Blue_true (Reply #58)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 08:58 PM

104. Serious question: how do they assign a judge to this Grand Jury hearing?

This is not my area of expertise and I don't know Washington DC courts either.

Do they select somebody who has experience in high level politics/behavior (I hope)?
This could all backfire if the wrong/too conservative judge gets assigned to this hearing.
We don't want Judge Ito either.

Just sayin'

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Response to FakeNoose (Reply #104)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 09:11 PM

105. I don't know.

Ask an Attorney. There are a few on DU. The only Grand Juries that I know of indict people, but I live in the South.

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Response to Blue_true (Reply #105)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 09:14 PM

106. OK maybe somebody else here knows

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:14 PM

60. "possible financial crimes, some unconnected to the 2016 elections" Second Grand Jury too!!

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:19 PM

63. So....how would DU react if Mueller, in the end, finds no evidence other than circumstantial?

And thus no charges are recommended?

And every GOP member backs up the other one, like cops?


I am worried that IF that were to happen, Trump and the GOP would use that, as BushCo. did with Dan Rather's blunder, as a way to whitewash everything else they have been doing. They can then crow loudly how this PROVES that there was, not collusion and malfeasance with Republicans, but collusion and conspiracy with Democrats and the "fake news media". (To bring down a great man) His approval will climb back up for those hopeful moderate Republicans and independents.

The GOP will feel like they have a whole new mandate to get even bolder in regards to other issues like net neutrality, and Social Security.

I suspect even the MSM networks will back off, maybe even apologize. And everything ELSE will be forgiven. His crude behavior, his lying, his tarnished reputation as a great businessman etc. Dropping out of the Paris accord. All his bone-head appointments with inexperienced true believers whose only credential Trump uses is their previous disdain for the department they now oversee.

Obviously this is the worst case scenerio. But we have to be prepared for it. And to not just give up the resistance, but remember that he still won unfairly using dark laundered money, Crosscheck, gerrymandering, and fake news about Hillary. But it will be so difficult to get the train back on the tracks and get any traction again.

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Response to LiberalLovinLug (Reply #63)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:54 PM

89. not even remotely possible

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Response to LiberalLovinLug (Reply #63)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 08:22 PM

98. "Fitzmas"

Was pretty much a big nothing ...

I want to think this is happening, there is too much there.

But, until it does ...

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Response to Cosmocat (Reply #98)

Fri Aug 4, 2017, 12:35 AM

124. I'm not sayin

I'm just sayin

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Response to LiberalLovinLug (Reply #63)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 08:35 PM

100. Not possible. So much obvious obstruction, collusion, lying, and we don't even have the tax returns

and we also don't know what Flynn has spilled. Someone's going down, probably at least Jr., Manafort and Flynn, if not Jared too. And at least one of them will flip for reduced sentence.

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Response to LiberalLovinLug (Reply #63)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 09:34 PM

109. Who's got two tiny hands and is acting guilty as everloving fuck?

"This Guy!"

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Response to LiberalLovinLug (Reply #63)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 09:50 PM

110. I dunno. The team he is assembling didn't put their careers on hold

over rumors or maybes.

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Response to LiberalLovinLug (Reply #63)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 11:21 PM

118. He admitted to obstruction already

When he fired Comey for the Russia investigation. Obstruction of justice was the first article of impeachment against Nixon, I think.

New York's AG will get him on financial crimes, if nothing else. It won't be as good as finding him guilty of collysion or treason, but he'll still forfeit everything and I can live with that.

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Response to More_Cowbell (Reply #118)

Fri Aug 4, 2017, 12:41 AM

125. Is "financial crimes" enough?

Hasn't he been found guilty in other financial crimes? His university fraud case comes to mind.

Just doesn't have the same bite as collusion with a foreign government to usurp democracy.

If its soley financial, he will shrug his shoulders and say he made a mistake, but will pay any restitution. But what also would happen is that his deplorables would be all "see see you f'in libtards, YOU WERE WRONG! Just some business faux pas, and like he said, trying to find ways to not have to pay the blood sucking go'mint of your earnings is the American way!

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Response to LiberalLovinLug (Reply #63)

Fri Aug 4, 2017, 03:59 AM

135. He's openly violated the emoluments clause

I'm not sure how he could be found totally innocent of all charges.

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:24 PM

72. Unless I do not understand the legal issue here (a distinct possibility) doesn't the Grand Jury

go on even when and if Mueller is fired?

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:32 PM

79. Show time! n/t

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 06:43 PM

92. Don Jr and Jared will probably be the first two witnesses they subpoena?

And they will have to think twice before they lie to a grand jury.

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 07:33 PM

93. As long as pence goes down, too. he can't be the knight in shining armor

that would really suck.

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 07:53 PM

94. Time for my favorite Trump Gif!

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 07:55 PM

95. Bring it on!

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 08:34 PM

99. If Mueller's strategy is to use indictments and plea bargains

If Mueller's strategy is to use indictments and plea bargains to work his way up, wouldn't this be a step he'd take?

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Response to GopherGal (Reply #99)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 08:42 PM

102. Yes

This is a tried and true play to get confessions.

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Response to Vinnie From Indy (Reply #102)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 09:53 PM

111. And for this crew, it will end up a purgery trap.

Lord knows not a one of 'em can tell the time of day without lying. Their arrogance will walk into this thinking they are the smartest guys in the room and try to BS their way through it.

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Response to Ruby the Liberal (Reply #111)

Fri Aug 4, 2017, 02:46 AM

130. Could you imagine if tRump went under oath Ken Star style

In a situation where the counsel has evidence Trump doesn't think they have (like the stained dress, but something that is actually a crime). Film the hearing like they did Clinton with a camera with a tight close up on his face with the people asking the questions just appearing on the recording as disembodied voices.

If Trump was on camera for 20 minutes, there would be 40 lies.

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 08:47 PM

103. I hope Trump doesn't slither away.



Even if they. And get Trump, putting one of his family members in fed prison would destroy him.

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Response to aikoaiko (Reply #103)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 09:31 PM

108. Only if it was Ivanka. I honestly don't think he cares about any of the rest.

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Response to briv1016 (Reply #108)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 10:16 PM

112. Big news! Mueller issues subpoenas over Jr.'s Russia meeting!

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 11:09 PM

117. Target Rich Environment

That's what we have here. Hoowee!

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Thu Aug 3, 2017, 11:55 PM

119. There is another reason to impanel a Grand Jury.

By going through the Grand Jury process you increase the right of discovery, which is very important in looking at financial transactions like money laundering and banking in generak. They are following the money. Of course you need a case to present to the grand jury, but I'm not holding my breath. this could take a long time as it's a very complex web of corruption involving top people who have the means to fight back.

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Fri Aug 4, 2017, 02:39 AM

129. Kind of appropriate that the lawyer representing the racism President is Ty Cobb

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Fri Aug 4, 2017, 02:55 AM

131. If Trump gets a choice of him or his kids go to jail...what does he choose?

himself of course, i have no doubt.

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Response to sunonmars (Reply #131)

Fri Aug 4, 2017, 03:28 AM

134. Yep. He already threw Don Jr. under the bus. nt

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Fri Aug 4, 2017, 09:10 AM

136. The noose of treason is tightening around this administration.

Treason.

I can't tell you how many times Dems, liberals, progressives or whatever you want to call us have been accused by the other side of hating this country, but this is beyond that.

What the Republican party has done, beginning on the night of Obama's inauguration, when they decided to not help govern this nation, but instead obstruct everything Obama and the Dems tried to get done. To my mind that was sedition at the least.

But when they colluded with a hostile foreign power to win an election, that is treason pure and simple. All our security guys that I've heard quoted or interviewed are saying how serious this is because it was not only hacking God knows how many voting machines and election rolls, but it was also a sophisticated psychological operation designed to sway voters in swing states and key communities in those states by planting propaganda.

This is FUCKING TREASON. It is ugly. It is disgusting. It is foul. And it MUST NOT STAND.

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Response to sunonmars (Original post)

Sun Aug 6, 2017, 12:13 PM

139. Prosecutors are working diligently

they know this can't be allowed to drag on even as long as Nixon and Watergate

We have not a swamp but a festering pustule that must be pricked at its peak

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