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David__77

(23,372 posts)
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 04:38 PM Aug 2017

Trump is Not Crazy- He's a Fascist

I see lots of posts here with people saying Trump is senile or crazy or unhinged, etc. I disagree.

He's a fascist, a white supremacist: a conscious one. He knows what he's signaling to his surest base of support, which is itself a fascist movement.

The sooner to fully recognize it, the better. We need as much unity and action against him as possible. That includes Democrats, independents, and Republicans, too.

46 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Trump is Not Crazy- He's a Fascist (Original Post) David__77 Aug 2017 OP
I agree, he is all those things. madaboutharry Aug 2017 #1
Not really Nazi infra Aug 2017 #35
Various personality disorders, especially the cluster B category Rump almost certainly Hortensis Aug 2017 #44
He's talented MFM008 Aug 2017 #2
at this point it should be well known Red Don is a Nazi wannabe .. fuck him uponit7771 Aug 2017 #3
'Crazy' lets people think there's no explanation leftstreet Aug 2017 #4
Yeah. This isn't dementia. Ilsa Aug 2017 #5
What did VJ say about fear infra Aug 2017 #36
Several pundits, including host Tapper, say their circle of friends includes Ilsa Aug 2017 #37
He's a fascists Nazi sympathizer and unhinged. herding cats Aug 2017 #6
IMHO: Facism and insanity are not mutually exclusive. sagesnow Aug 2017 #7
Precisely. It's an insane ideology, because it REQUIRES delusions of grandeur and blind hatred. VOX Aug 2017 #42
could be both 0rganism Aug 2017 #8
What do you mean by fascist? infra Aug 2017 #38
that and more 0rganism Aug 2017 #41
You are right. His father was a member of the KKK. He is the KKKOTUS Maraya1969 Aug 2017 #9
E) All of the Above world wide wally Aug 2017 #10
Yes Solly Mack Aug 2017 #11
I agree NewJeffCT Aug 2017 #22
Was thinking the same thing. His gut, initial reaction is to defend the Nazi's Quixote1818 Aug 2017 #12
He's a crazy Fascist wryter2000 Aug 2017 #13
Dog whistles aren't enough. He wants a real movement, in power. David__77 Aug 2017 #15
I said this on Twitter. 6000eliot Aug 2017 #14
I agree. He's evil. JoeOtterbein Aug 2017 #16
That's true, and at the same time .. ananda Aug 2017 #17
I think his white supremacist beliefs stem naturally from his innate narcissism. Mister Ed Aug 2017 #18
All out in the open now, locked and loaded bucolic_frolic Aug 2017 #19
absolutely AlexSFCA Aug 2017 #20
They're not mutually exclusive, though - he's both n/t MrPurple Aug 2017 #21
Nope. Dreamer Tatum Aug 2017 #23
100% agreed Perseus Aug 2017 #24
Forgot to say this Perseus Aug 2017 #25
he's a crazy fascist spanone Aug 2017 #26
I am willing to go along with the narrative that Trump is crazy paulkienitz Aug 2017 #27
Any comment from Bibby about this Nazi sympathizer ? Thrill Aug 2017 #28
Exactly..... dawnie51 Aug 2017 #29
I always thought it was dementia, but after today's press conference... Freethinker65 Aug 2017 #30
You know he wanted to say the N word, right? jayschool2013 Aug 2017 #31
He is also crazy and unhinged PatSeg Aug 2017 #32
He is an A-hole who should have never run for president LeftInTX Aug 2017 #33
He's Nazi Number One C_U_L8R Aug 2017 #34
I think he is stupid though JonLP24 Aug 2017 #39
Unless someone intervenes, he's president until at least 2021. David__77 Aug 2017 #40
He's exactly who I thought he was Generic Brad Aug 2017 #43
They are not mutually exclusive. I bet he has Alzheimer's, too, which lowers his tblue37 Aug 2017 #45
He's competent to stand trial. David__77 Aug 2017 #46

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
44. Various personality disorders, especially the cluster B category Rump almost certainly
Wed Aug 16, 2017, 01:00 PM
Aug 2017

falls into, can manifest extremist traits. Personality disorders are every bit as real as psychotic disorders and are reportedly very difficult, usually impossible, to treat with any sustained success. There IS something unquestionably wrong with the these people, and it's not something they can change out like their clothes, so would it be a surprise if the worst of them met the criteria for a full-blown mental disorder?

And, why couldn't someone be showing early effects, for instance, of dementia AND the dysfunctions of a lifelong personality disorder, perhaps flaring into full-blown psychosis at some points in life, or bouts of major depression? All in one person. Oh, and the personality disorders themselves can also progress in severity and change in characteristics.

It'd be reasonable to believe Rump could be exhibiting all of these. By the way, Kurt Eichenwald of Newsweek believes from his very extensive research but can't prove that Rump was in a mental hospital some time in the 1990s.

MFM008

(19,806 posts)
2. He's talented
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 04:42 PM
Aug 2017

He's CRAZY, RACIST AND Fascist.
I should have
NEVER tried to eat lunch and
listen to that bag of shit.
Lunch lost.

Ilsa

(61,694 posts)
5. Yeah. This isn't dementia.
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 04:44 PM
Aug 2017

This is hate.

CNN just had Van Jones on talking about how afraid POC are, and that once again, DT has revealed who he is and what he believes.

Other pundits: republicans voted for party over substance and decency. Trump showed us who he is during the primaries. He has not changed, no matter how much Republicans wished he had.

Ilsa

(61,694 posts)
37. Several pundits, including host Tapper, say their circle of friends includes
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 07:46 PM
Aug 2017

POC, specifically, his wife's dear friend who is Black. Tapper said they are nervous, afraid of what could happen to them because these nazis feel emboldened by DT and his DOJ.

Van Jones said something similar, especially in African American families that have already been victims of racial violence. He condemned what dt said, and was asking how dt could speak this way, knowing his daughter, SIL, and their three kids were Jewish. VJ sounded emotional, nervous, almost like someone about to cry.

(I remember content, but I'm not always good at remembering exact sources when there are several people talking.)

Here, here:




The verdict is in on Trump's presidency.

sagesnow

(2,824 posts)
7. IMHO: Facism and insanity are not mutually exclusive.
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 04:46 PM
Aug 2017

Facism and insanity probably go hand in hand. Doesn't one have to be some kind of crazy to think you and your kin are better than all other people? I think you do.

VOX

(22,976 posts)
42. Precisely. It's an insane ideology, because it REQUIRES delusions of grandeur and blind hatred.
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 09:28 PM
Aug 2017

To be a good fascist, you have to believe that you and your kind are top dogs, just because you're whiter than white. It helps to be deluded into believing that there's something supernatural involved in your "superiority."

But "others" are standing in the way of your "greatness": Jews, blacks, intellectuals, liberals, independent thinkers, etc. So, to maintain top-dog status, all those on the ever-lengthening "enemies of the state" roster must be vanquished and destroyed.

0rganism

(23,944 posts)
8. could be both
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 04:46 PM
Aug 2017

in his increasingly rare moments of lucidity he's a ill-tempered fascist, racist asshole
in his increasingly frequent periods of delirium he's an ill-tempered fascist, racist lunatic

good luck figuring out which is which before his next even-more-surreal outburst

0rganism

(23,944 posts)
41. that and more
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 09:16 PM
Aug 2017

Mussolini's definition of fascism is certainly relevant, for obvious reasons, but it is incomplete.
no question in my mind that SCROTUS would like to have direct command of industrial power through the government and command of government through industrial cronies - imho, that was the endgame of his "American Manufacturing Council".

however, i would extend my conception of SCROTUS's interest in fascism to include the popular 14 indicators of fascism:

1. Powerful and Continuing Nationalism - Fascist regimes tend to make constant use of patriotic mottos, slogans, symbols, songs, and other paraphernalia. Flags are seen everywhere, as are flag symbols on clothing and in public displays. <- Yep

2. Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights - Because of fear of enemies and the need for security, the people in fascist regimes are persuaded that human rights can be ignored in certain cases because of "need." The people tend to look the other way or even approve of torture, summary executions, assassinations, long incarcerations of prisoners, etc. <- Yep

3. Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause - The people are rallied into a unifying patriotic frenzy over the need to eliminate a perceived common threat or foe: racial , ethnic or religious minorities; liberals; communists; socialists, terrorists, etc. <- Yep

4. Supremacy of the Military - Even when there are widespread domestic problems, the military is given a disproportionate amount of government funding, and the domestic agenda is neglected. Soldiers and military service are glamorized. <- Yep

5. Rampant Sexism - The governments of fascist nations tend to be almost exclusively male-dominated. Under fascist regimes, traditional gender roles are made more rigid. Divorce, abortion and homosexuality are suppressed and the state is represented as the ultimate guardian of the family institution. <- Yep

6. Controlled Mass Media - Sometimes to media is directly controlled by the government, but in other cases, the media is indirectly controlled by government regulation, or sympathetic media spokespeople and executives. Censorship, especially in war time, is very common. <- we'll see, not quite there yet, but it's clear SCROTUS has developed an antagonistic relationship with the press...

7. Obsession with National Security - Fear is used as a motivational tool by the government over the masses. <- Yep

8. Religion and Government are Intertwined - Governments in fascist nations tend to use the most common religion in the nation as a tool to manipulate public opinion. Religious rhetoric and terminology is common from government leaders, even when the major tenets of the religion are diametrically opposed to the government's policies or actions. <- Yep, although SCROTUS is not adept at using this technique himself

9. Corporate Power is Protected - The industrial and business aristocracy of a fascist nation often are the ones who put the government leaders into power, creating a mutually beneficial business/government relationship and power elite. <- Yep

10. Labor Power is Suppressed - Because the organizing power of labor is the only real threat to a fascist government, labor unions are either eliminated entirely, or are severely suppressed. <- Yep, although this process has taken place over the course of decades

11. Disdain for Intellectuals and the Arts - Fascist nations tend to promote and tolerate open hostility to higher education, and academia. It is not uncommon for professors and other academics to be censored or even arrested. Free expression in the arts and letters is openly attacked. <- Yep

12. Obsession with Crime and Punishment - Under fascist regimes, the police are given almost limitless power to enforce laws. The people are often willing to overlook police abuses and even forego civil liberties in the name of patriotism. There is often a national police force with virtually unlimited power in fascist nations. <- Yep, not there yet but getting disturbingly close

13. Rampant Cronyism and Corruption - Fascist regimes almost always are governed by groups of friends and associates who appoint each other to government positions and use governmental power and authority to protect their friends from accountability. It is not uncommon in fascist regimes for national resources and even treasures to be appropriated or even outright stolen by government leaders. <- you think maybe?

14. Fraudulent Elections - Sometimes elections in fascist nations are a complete sham. Other times elections are manipulated by smear campaigns against or even assassination of opposition candidates, use of legislation to control voting numbers or political district boundaries, and manipulation of the media. Fascist nations also typically use their judiciaries to manipulate or control elections. <- Yep

while SCROTUS doesn't quite have it all locked down yet, i strongly suspect he would very much like to do so. that, by my reckoning, makes him a fascist.

Maraya1969

(22,478 posts)
9. You are right. His father was a member of the KKK. He is the KKKOTUS
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 04:46 PM
Aug 2017

I wish we could get "Trump is a Nazi" trending on Twitter.

Quixote1818

(28,929 posts)
12. Was thinking the same thing. His gut, initial reaction is to defend the Nazi's
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 04:53 PM
Aug 2017

just like his gut, initial reactions are to defend Russia. We literally have a Nazi in the White House. This is very serious!

David__77

(23,372 posts)
15. Dog whistles aren't enough. He wants a real movement, in power.
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 06:01 PM
Aug 2017

He's not just winking at sentiment to gain political power. He's seeking to encourage the mobilization of a mass fascist political movement.

ananda

(28,858 posts)
17. That's true, and at the same time ..
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 06:44 PM
Aug 2017

45 is not very coherent or able to make a workable plan
other than to pack the courts with rightwing extremists,
which I guess in the long run, will screw us all over
bigly.

Mister Ed

(5,928 posts)
18. I think his white supremacist beliefs stem naturally from his innate narcissism.
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 06:47 PM
Aug 2017

His most deeply-held belief is that he himself is at the very pinnacle of humanity. It follows, naturally, that those who are most like him - his own children - are nearest to him on that lofty spire.

Those who are least like him - especially those who are not even white - are, to him, the dregs of humanity, perhaps not even human at all.

bucolic_frolic

(43,137 posts)
19. All out in the open now, locked and loaded
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 06:47 PM
Aug 2017

24 karat alt-right neo-Nazi White Supremacist using fascism for a political agenda

If it looks like a duck and walks like a duck ...

Ain't no mistakin' it

AlexSFCA

(6,137 posts)
20. absolutely
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 06:48 PM
Aug 2017

he is neither crazy nor stupid. He is doing exactly what a fascist is supposed to do. Beleive it when his ex-wife said he holds mein kampf book under his bed. He is fulfillig his life long dream. He is the greatest con artist in modern history and that's a talent in itself, he is a performer. On top of that he understands the media second to no one.

I think most of us, including me, have been mistaken, thinking of trump as bannon's puppet. I now beleive it is trump who is using banon to coalesce the alt right.

Dreamer Tatum

(10,926 posts)
23. Nope.
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 06:57 PM
Aug 2017

He's a narcissist who latches on to the approval of others, no matter who or what they are. His sense of self derives from the approval of others, and when their judgment is called into question, he lashes out.

He's not really a fascist - he doesn't even know what it means. He's not truly a racist - he just hangs around a lot of white people who are, and whose approval he desperately needs.

He's a pathetic, sad, insecure turd who will gladly dance with anyone who looks his way for their own needs. He's too stupid and needy to see through anyone's agenda.

 

Perseus

(4,341 posts)
24. 100% agreed
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 07:04 PM
Aug 2017

That is how Hugo Chanvez started in Venezuela, it is the same tactic for these horrible people until they feel they can do anything they want, like shoot someone in the middle of 5th avenue, and get away with it. In Venezuela they have the "Colectivos", in the USA you have the White Supremacists and KKK, and although their thing was social injustice fueled by the regime who gave them weapons to protect the "Revolution", these people took on the streets to rob, kill every day, and part of the chaos there is that group of people.

This is reaching those levels, and anyone who thinks otherwise has not read old and current history. Trump is just evil, he is not as stupid as many think, ignorant yes, but he has a one-track mind, and that is not to serve, or make America great.

Very frustrating that the people who can, are not doing anything about it, the worst part is that they think they are safe, and they are not. As it happened to Sessions, and McConnell, when Trump feels he wants to get rid of Ryan, and the rest, he will do so...that includes Pence, and they will be made slaves as everyone else. When the brick hits them on the head it will be too late for them, and for everyone in the USA who doesn't want any part of it.

 

Perseus

(4,341 posts)
25. Forgot to say this
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 07:05 PM
Aug 2017

The worst thing everyone can do is to underestimate Trump, he does know where he is going with all this, his diatribes are just mere distraction.

paulkienitz

(1,296 posts)
27. I am willing to go along with the narrative that Trump is crazy
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 07:08 PM
Aug 2017

if that's what helps the GOP be willing to impeach or 25th-amendment him. But it isn't true (except that maybe he's starting to show signs of dementia). He knows he's lying all the time, he knows he's being racist, and he chooses these behaviors freely.

dawnie51

(959 posts)
29. Exactly.....
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 07:12 PM
Aug 2017

so tired of people making alternative suggestions for this insane behavior. He's not senile (yet), he's not crazy, he's not stupid. He's a racist, son of a racist, grandson of a racist, and a devotee of Nazism. Always has been. Who else keeps Mein Kampf on their bedside table?

Freethinker65

(10,010 posts)
30. I always thought it was dementia, but after today's press conference...
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 07:12 PM
Aug 2017

...an out and out narcissistic white supremacist fascist with early age-related cognitive decline?

jayschool2013

(2,312 posts)
31. You know he wanted to say the N word, right?
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 07:15 PM
Aug 2017

Come on, Donald. You've said thousands of times in private. We know it's in you.

Go ahead, pal. I dare you.

PatSeg

(47,412 posts)
32. He is also crazy and unhinged
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 07:15 PM
Aug 2017

I think he was always a hateful racist and misogynist, but as he got older, he also became unhinged and possibly senile.

JonLP24

(29,322 posts)
39. I think he is stupid though
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 08:41 PM
Aug 2017

Hasn't he ever heard of "damage control"? Either that or he is going to live or die with his base.

David__77

(23,372 posts)
40. Unless someone intervenes, he's president until at least 2021.
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 09:00 PM
Aug 2017

He may not at all need majority support, or anything close to it, in order to maintain his office until then.

Generic Brad

(14,274 posts)
43. He's exactly who I thought he was
Tue Aug 15, 2017, 09:29 PM
Aug 2017

And he would have already imposed his will on all of us if he were not so thoroughly incompetent. Thank goodness he is impotent, ineffective, unpopular, lazy, and unrealistic.

tblue37

(65,336 posts)
45. They are not mutually exclusive. I bet he has Alzheimer's, too, which lowers his
Wed Aug 16, 2017, 01:02 PM
Aug 2017

inhibitions, so he reveals himself more readily.

David__77

(23,372 posts)
46. He's competent to stand trial.
Wed Aug 16, 2017, 01:06 PM
Aug 2017

His is not a "loss of control"; rather, he uses a great deal of intention in seeking to accomplish his objectives.

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