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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsWilliam Rivers Pitt: Coward-in-Chief: Trump Wilts in the Face of Fascist Terrorism
Here is the car, stopped along Monticello Avenue in Charlottesville, Virginia. It has clearly been involved in a high-speed incident. Video shows this same car -- allegedly driven by one James Alex Fields Jr. of Ohio -- plowing into a crowd of peaceful anti-fascist protesters at high speed. When it reversed to escape, the damaged fender swung wide, and a shoe clearly bounced out of the grille. The roar of the engine fades, leaving in its wake screams and curses.
According to everything we have heard from the federal government about vehicles being used as weapons worldwide, everything we have heard from the White House and Homeland Security on the issue, everything we have heard in the news media after London and Paris, this was an ISIS-style terrorist attack deliberately perpetrated against a crowd of innocent people to lethal effect.
This was terrorism. By the book. Someone should probably tell the president. He doesn't seem to get it.
The short version: A well-organized pack of white supremacists, Nazis, Klan members and generalized fascists tried to hold a rally in Charlottesville, Virginia, on Saturday, ostensibly to protest the removal of a monument to Confederate Gen. Robert E. Lee. Large numbers showed up, greeted not only by law enforcement and angry locals, but by a sizeable contingent of anti-fascist activists who came prepared to shout them down.
full article
http://www.truth-out.org/opinion/item/41604-coward-in-chief-trump-wilts-in-the-face-of-fascist-terrorism
dsc
(52,129 posts)but the author of that article didn't think it mattered because Hillary had an email account or whatever.
Foamfollower
(1,097 posts)In order to profit off what he helped along!
George II
(67,782 posts)sheshe2
(83,319 posts)Docreed2003
(16,817 posts)Daaayum....true, but that's a sick burn!!
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)Autumn
(44,743 posts)Amimnoch
(4,558 posts)On the nose.
betsuni
(25,119 posts)Tarheel_Dem
(31,207 posts)Starry Messenger
(32,342 posts)Writer brags about voting for Jill Stein on his FB page, and now collects a paycheck for complaining about the outcome. No thanks from me.
donheld
(21,311 posts)William never ever said he was voting for Jill Stein. Please don't lie.
Starry Messenger
(32,342 posts)He always does.
Starry Messenger
(32,342 posts)Last edited Mon Aug 21, 2017, 12:18 AM - Edit history (1)
betsuni
(25,119 posts)NastyRiffraff
(12,448 posts)Wish I could rec a post!
lunasun
(21,646 posts)Response to Foamfollower (Reply #5)
Post removed
TastyTaters
(17 posts)QC
(26,371 posts)Autumn
(44,743 posts)One doesn't have to read far
Orrex
(63,083 posts)Yet still he has his acolytes, despite his explicit threat to another DUer and his "used car salesman" rejection of Obama, as well as his passionate advocacy against the 2016 Democratic candidate.
Yes, Pitt is definitely a DUer we want on our side, if only so that we can read his poorly-written rehashes of opinions that other people posted three days prior.
Golly, how I miss him!
Eliot Rosewater
(31,096 posts)Threatened a DU person?
wow
Orrex
(63,083 posts)the exact phrase was "piece of shit used car salesman."
He was a peach.
Jamaal510
(10,893 posts)exact words he used toward President Obama::
"F--- you, Mr. President, you piece of sh*t used-car salesman. From my heart and soul, f--- you."
This was the original thread where Will Pitt posted that OP (he deleted it after it was left up for over a year):
https://www.democraticunderground.com/10024685964
And he followed up with more anti-Obama threads, including this:
https://www.democraticunderground.com/10026887802
Eliot Rosewater
(31,096 posts)Not safe here for democrats. We better watch our asses and not piss off a certain bunch, I guess.
Response to Jamaal510 (Reply #566)
JonLP24 This message was self-deleted by its author.
MrsCoffee
(5,801 posts)Autumn
(44,743 posts)well after Pitt last posted here may not realize that long time DUers with scruples don't get FFR and sign up real quick with a new name.
R B Garr
(16,919 posts)Autumn
(44,743 posts)R B Garr
(16,919 posts)Autumn
(44,743 posts)when she would post a shit storm a few "socks" who were stalking her would show up in her threads to get banned so she could have verification in her threads.
Whatever, Will Pitt has not created a sock to post his writing and his opinions here. Unlike all the new people in this thread who came in long after Will was flagged that positively hate him and remember all his sins. Skinner doesn't mind people coming back, he stated that in ATA and MIRT once, as long as they don't carry on in the same way that got them flagged in the first place. But most carry their issues right back.
R B Garr
(16,919 posts)previous divisiveness we've seen. And she wasn't racist. How ridiculous, but indicative of the motives of those who were "stalking" her.
Autumn
(44,743 posts)Proof is always nice. As for the rest of your remarks we and others on the receiving end obviously have a very different interpretation of racism.
Response to Autumn (Reply #329)
Post removed
Autumn
(44,743 posts)or his opinions here as I was sure he wouldn't so I was half wrong. I have no problem admitting that.
Hassin Bin Sober
(26,271 posts)Autumn
(44,743 posts)R B Garr
(16,919 posts)That was his screen name: "Uh huh"
See post #338 -- he put his post on his Facebook and someone copied it here. LOL,
Response to Autumn (Reply #329)
hrmjustin This message was self-deleted by its author.
R B Garr
(16,919 posts)Autumn
(44,743 posts)containing the now deleted post quoted in it, I take that MIRT member at his word, I have never known him to lie to me. I assume he is a MIRT member since he has access to MIRT messages.
As to your question about another flagged member yes screen caps have been posted, many last year. Have a wonderful day.
R B Garr
(16,919 posts)"nyuk nyuk" as if there was some big gotcha going on at my expense is why I asked you for screen caps. You are refusing to post the supposed screen caps, so why would you ask me to do something you are unwilling to do.
And, yes, post 338 is a "screen cap" of the post removed on this thread. He posted it on his Facebook page, and it was copied here.
Have a nice day, yourself.
Autumn
(44,743 posts)friends post you can probably get them from a lot of people on his FB page, I won't post them or mail them since she's not here any longer.
R B Garr
(16,919 posts)You were obviously trying to make it a gotcha moment, but now that it's been pointed out that the post is here on this thread -- you don't need to say it was a "hint". It was copied from his Facebook page by at least two posters here, all you have to do is read the posts.
Post 338 has it, another poster just took it from his Facebook page, and it's apparently still on his Facebook page. You have three (3) sources to read the post from him.
Autumn
(44,743 posts)reply to the poster that was deleted by MIRT. Many were willing to do so, I still have seen no proof it was Will signing up to post that reply and he didn't admit that he did on his FB post. Anyone can see that on FB, no screen shots or cut and paste needed.
The screen shots I have, that I said I'm not willing to post is because that person has no bearing on this discussion so you should quit bringing her up. Thanks for the pleasant discussion.
R B Garr
(16,919 posts)the post is from Will.
There are three (3) sources and you are now making it the 4th that say the post is on his Facebook page and it was copied here. This is not complicated.
And you brought "her" up by commenting on someone else's recent join date (post 326).
Autumn
(44,743 posts)R B Garr
(16,919 posts)And that's what I told you and what you acknowledged. Post 338 got it from his Facebook page. Another poster also posted it from his Facebook page. You acknowledge twice now that it came from his Facebook page, and now you confirm my first post to you that someone (post 338) took it from his Facebook page to post here.
lol, so there were no "hints" about it. We all saw it.
Demsrule86
(68,347 posts)Autumn
(44,743 posts)R B Garr
(16,919 posts)And so much for the concern over people not being able to defend themselves.....
Autumn
(44,743 posts)R B Garr
(16,919 posts)Don't know. But I did see it suggested that those that know where to find him can read him at that source. I can understand that mostly because he didn't vote for the Democrat. Now look what we have.
Autumn
(44,743 posts)there is no rule that content by writers who can no longer post here cannot be posted.
R B Garr
(16,919 posts)So that is probably where the problem is. If you malign our candidate and state in your vast arsenal of print media that you will not vote for our candidate, then it's a different story. That's how I understand it, anyway. And that looks to be correct if you look at the responses here.
Autumn
(44,743 posts)R B Garr
(16,919 posts)the ticket, which is what the issue is. That article about the "coward in chief" is in the OP, and not voting for the Democrat is how Trump got into the White House, so this is back to square one now, which you can read from the start of the thread for the responses on how he's not taken seriously because of not voting for Hillary. It's all in this thread already.
Autumn
(44,743 posts)3 million votes, she also won the NH EC votes. It's his vote to do with it as he chooses. I consider it a waste of time to hate people who didn't vote for her, she won the election by a large margin.
R B Garr
(16,919 posts)so that's a bogus excuse. Anyone who didn't vote for the Democrat knew what the consequences were. Al Gore won that 2000 election, too, but the Nader lies made it close. We've already seen this before, so it takes his authority as a critic in that article away if he helped contribute to putting Trump in office by not voting for the Democrat.
It's all in this thread already. The responses are clear and make a lot of sense.
Autumn
(44,743 posts)It's not my circus and it's not my monkeys. Trump sucks and is a danger to humanity. That's what should be focused on.
R B Garr
(16,919 posts)Anyone attacking Hillary helped bring us Trump. The Russian hacking shows how those unnecessary attacks on her were used. And the Russians are still at it, so it looks like people will have little tolerance anymore for irresponsible journalism.
Autumn
(44,743 posts)I'm going to trash this thread, it's kind of icky. Take care.
R B Garr
(16,919 posts)Lots of ugly things. Trump had a lot of help from ugly sources.
You take care, too.
AntiFascist
(12,792 posts)do we have to continue supporting her in future elections? I voted for Hillary for president and I supported her over Bernie Sanders, but I was also a bit ruthless toward her back when she ran against Obama. If we continue along the lines that "everyone must think the same way that I do", then Democrats as a party will continue to face defeat.
R B Garr
(16,919 posts)No. No. Never. The numbers show that Democrats haven't actually faced defeat except when there is divisiveness and lies. I could tell you what to get over "it", too. That was the real issue with divisiveness from 2015.
AntiFascist
(12,792 posts)and that doesn't mean we move on from the investigations into Russian hacking, collusion and Trump's Quid Pro Quo arrangements. Those are separate issues and we should never get over that until justice prevails.
If Hillary decided to run again against a fresh, new progressive face many of us may come down hard on her again. We might point out that her campaign, with all of it's baggage, against Trump, was way too close for comfort and we don't a repeat.
ucrdem
(15,512 posts)If there's a fresh new progressive face that has the wherewithal to overcome the monstrous RW noise machine, great, let's go with him/her. If there isn't, and so far I haven't seen such a person (2024, yes, 2020, not yet), 2020 might finally be her year, meaning Mr and Mrs Ohio-Pennsylvania-Michigan might finally be ready to get behind another Clinton presidency. We could do worse.
ETA: I don't think this will happen, but the point is that it's unwise to toss aside any viable candidate, and the winner of the 2016 presidential election is a viable candidate, and I think she would probably win if she runs in 2020. But I'm pretty sure she won't.
R B Garr
(16,919 posts)period is too much for any candidate. So stop it. The attacks on her were way over the top. That's what this thread is about actually. Someone who contributed to her loss by advocating to other easily influenced people that they are somehow showing principle by not voting is the absurd reason we have Trump.
I'm not getting where you think Hillary may run again. Way too close? There were 75,000 or so people who decided this election, and there was an active campaign called Busters who refused to vote unless they got their preferred candidate. So we lost. If you don't vote out of protest or write in someone's else's name, it's a vote for Trump.
AntiFascist
(12,792 posts)they were hoping he would turn Washington upside down and were tired of politics as usual.
This is why I posted recently that the alt-right and extreme Left have a subject in common: anti-globalization, a cause that the Left should be debating, but the Right seems to be controlling the argument from both sides. The media loves a good fight and Breitbart may be gearing up to give it to them, but ultimately it is the Right that wants control of the issue from their distorted Nationalist perspective.
Someone argued that Bernie Sanders got into a fight with globalists and ended up with threats against him and his family. That is sad if true.
R B Garr
(16,919 posts)took office. That makes the "far left" (your words) not very believable about progressive/liberal policies. The GOP thanks them for their help in letting the GOP keep power.
The rest sounds too abstract. I think people will be welcoming of stability in government now instead of the shock jock posturing of all this agitation. And Brietbart shouldn't be elevated anymore than we're forced to hear about them through their mouthpiece in the WH. Lots of these Nazi sites are losing their internet providers. Let them trip themselves up.
AntiFascist
(12,792 posts)I'm talking about the rising discontent that swept through the rust belt which Trump was able to capitalize on, and Democrats largely ignored. Breitbart may now be trying to capitalize on this as well, but I agree that they shouldn't be given more attention by the media. I'm not trying to elevate anything, I'm just pointing out a phenomena that many Hillary supporters continue to oblivious to.
R B Garr
(16,919 posts)So Bernie lost also. Over a year ago. What you are ignoring is that the divisiveness was fostered to create the results we got, and obviously that was to attack Hillary, who was the Democratic nominee. The subject of this thread also contributed with anti-Hillary writings. That's what is being ignored. It's already obvious that the RW keeps stirring up the non-Hillary supporters and some keep falling for their games. It's really obvious.
AntiFascist
(12,792 posts)unless of course she decides to run for office again, which is why I wonder about that.
The RW can stir up Hillary supporters all they want, but when they latch onto a much broader movement that the Left fails to address, that's what I feel is dangerous for Democrats. I'm not talking about white supremacy movements either, I'm talking about the margin of voters in the Rust Belt who shifted from voting for Obama in one election to Trump in the next. These voters are not necessarily dedicated to one party alone and decided to vote instead for who they felt would bring about the most change. They must be disappointed at this point, but Democrats need someone like Obama who will at least talk about change that appeals to them.
R B Garr
(16,919 posts)out of touch, then of course messaging is a problem. That was beyond irresponsible, and there was no excuse for it.
AntiFascist
(12,792 posts)and most Democrats cannot be painted with such a broad brush.
Demsrule86
(68,347 posts)seaglass
(8,170 posts)Eliot Rosewater
(31,096 posts)Imagine being on the brink of literal extinction and people still engaging in such.
R B Garr
(16,919 posts)It's a real shame.
Eliot Rosewater
(31,096 posts)positions and actions are all they can point to is a speech, smiling in a photo with Kissinger, and the comment about predators or something (and most of the critics are white so that last one is disingenuous) but they are all disingenuous because if you look at her record she is a liberal and one of the best if not the best candidate the party ever had.
R B Garr
(16,919 posts)They knew who to copy to attack Hillary. No facts needed, no context needed. Just emotional and petty claptrap, the examples you gave are perfect. Who goes around telling people off, as they expected her to do to Bush or other GOP'ers. No one does that, and no one in real life does that unless you can afford to completely burn your bridges. It's just absurd what she was put through. I miss her.
betsuni
(25,119 posts)and everything she ever said examined under a magnifying glass, but for others we're not supposed to remember anything they've written even when it's spectacularly vulgar and hateful. "He's a good person," they say. Where have I heard that before?
jaysunb
(11,856 posts)sheshe2
(83,319 posts)Great to see you posting again
Response to MrsCoffee (Reply #282)
Name removed Message auto-removed
mahina
(17,502 posts)Response to Post removed (Reply #260)
Name removed Message auto-removed
MrsCoffee
(5,801 posts)WoonTars
(694 posts)...
MrsCoffee
(5,801 posts)Squinch
(50,773 posts)Generic Other
(28,979 posts)Damn, I miss your voice.
Egnever
(21,506 posts)With his POSUCS BS.
He lost me long ago.
Brother Buzz
(36,212 posts)George II
(67,782 posts)Eliot Rosewater
(31,096 posts)than most could imagine doing IN THEIR LIFETIMES what the Clinton foundation does in ONE day.
sheshe2
(83,319 posts)Generic Other
(28,979 posts)Don't forget that. Today, they are mostly united in a feeding frenzy against him, but flash back a few months and most seemed willing to give Fascism a chance. Only a few voices in the media were raising the alarm.
Everyone voted for HRC. She won. Please stop picking old wounds.
dsc
(52,129 posts)He decided it didn't matter if Trump became President because reasons. He is one reason why Trump is defiling the White House as I type.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)Yet I don't see you as my undying enemy. Yes, we disagreed during primaries and yes this one was the hardest to heal from, but we need to have an amnesty on attacking former DUers like this if people can't resist forming a lynch mob every time they hear his name. It makes me feel like crying to see it happen. Will Pitt has a voice that has made lots of noise over the years. Shouting him down forever with one harsh quote he made in the heat of the moment won't drown out the good work he has done and continues to do by raising his voice.
defacto7
(13,485 posts)they would do better by ignoring him rather than pumping his Internet presence posting threads on how much they hate him. Rehashing it positive or negative is in his favor.
I suppose the real reason people keep attacking him here is to let off steam but it's not really hurting him, his credibility or his lack of credibility.
Freedom of speech and the Internet... a complex combination.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)as I give as good as I get here, but I always believe we are the ones who rise above the swamp we look down upon. Just to the right of our field of vision.
defacto7
(13,485 posts)Squinch
(50,773 posts)who posted elsewhere that they would NEVER vote for Hillary.
Not to mention The Pitts himself.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)So my votes didn't count? Because it wasn't done with the right attitude? Others who said NEVER also voted for her after the primaries. In spite of some of her supporters who seemed intent on driving people away.
Squinch
(50,773 posts)Generic Other
(28,979 posts)I personally think a vote for Stein was a waste and maybe worse that she was a Putin candidate. But I know most who voted for her were progressives and believed a lot of what I believe. Same as I think you are a progressive and/or a liberal and a Democrat. We must agree on some things. Otherwise we would be posting on Discussionist.
I don't believe in attacking others who are potential friends and allies though, attacking them forever with the same accusations and with a fervor I reserve for Trump. Will Pitt does not deserve to be attacked like he was Trump's right hand man. He is not Bannon and nothing people say here will convince all DUers that he is.
Squinch
(50,773 posts)created one drama queen nonsense controversy after another as long as I was aware of him. He doesn't get any respect from me. He is not a potential friend. He encouraged people not to vote for the Democratic candidate when Trump was the Republican candidate.
And it's not the same accusations. It's not accusations at all. It is simply observations of his multiple acts of assholery.
Yes, I would hope we agree on some things. This is not going to be one of them.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)A poster he did not know insulted his mother. When I posted that my mother died and linked to a video she made, I got hate responses from some people too. They read about her on DU and went to Youtube to say I FAKED her death because I was a DRAMA QUEEN. I deleted many comments on Youtube. Some were angry responses I made to deplorables who found me through DU.
Squinch
(50,773 posts)Generic Other
(28,979 posts)It is a form of fighting words. Since you are the one who brought up this red herring as a way to deflect from my original comment, I thought I should address it.
Response to Generic Other (Reply #386)
Name removed Message auto-removed
Squinch
(50,773 posts)Eliot Rosewater
(31,096 posts)longship
(40,416 posts)Foamfollower
(1,097 posts)Fuck him.
Fuck all like him
HE is DIRECTLY RESPONSIBLE for Trump and the rise of Nazism in America.
I will give him NOTHING now that he is trying to profit from what HE created.
FUCK HIM!!!
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)Foamfollower
(1,097 posts)Tarheel_Dem
(31,207 posts)Eliot Rosewater
(31,096 posts)and Patrick and Booker and will be working FEVERISHLY to make sure the GOP retains power.
They dont like repubs, but they HATE liberals.
aikoaiko
(34,127 posts)JustAnotherGen
(31,681 posts)What's the image from?
Do you mean "Do you admire . . ." I don't watch walking dead or zombie shows so I miss the references.
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)... especially when someone is trying to ridicule or poke-fun... lest the meme itself becomes an object of ridicule and hilarity!
, etc etc etc
JustAnotherGen
(31,681 posts)There's a word left out. *smdh* I thought it was a zombie show "thing".
Thanks NJ!
aikoaiko
(34,127 posts)And yes there was a word missing. I fixed it up.
R B Garr
(16,919 posts)He was not victimized.
aikoaiko
(34,127 posts)R B Garr
(16,919 posts)H2O Man
(73,308 posts)countryjake
(8,554 posts)That's about where things are going.
FarPoint
(12,206 posts)Last edited Fri Aug 18, 2017, 10:59 AM - Edit history (1)
He was a Sanders supporter...but...he is a True DEMOCRAT...Never would he vote for tRump nor would he not vote....
I know Will Pitt.... he's earned his just respects...I defend him against this lies....We need to embrace our Party as a Whole...
Adrahil
(13,340 posts)Sure. THAT was embracing our party as a whole. WRP can go fuck himself.
Response to Adrahil (Reply #333)
donheld This message was self-deleted by its author.
Demsrule86
(68,347 posts)William Pitt
The used car salesman strikes again
"Moreover, Russia has pointed to Americas decision to go into Iraq as an example of Western hypocrisy. Now, it is true that the Iraq War was a subject of vigorous debate not just around the world, but in the United States as well. I participated in that debate and I opposed our military intervention there. But even in Iraq, America sought to work within the international system. We did not claim or annex Iraqs territory. We did not grab its resources for our own gain. Instead, we ended our war and left Iraq to its people and a fully sovereign Iraqi state that could make decisions about its own future."
- Obama, in Brussells, yesterday
An amazing amount of bullshit in one paragraph. We ran roughshod over the international community to get that war going. If an invasion and ten-year occupation isn't annexation, then nothing is. We totally, totally grabbed their resources, because the oil was supposed to "pay for the war," as I recall...and there were gas lines in Iraq for years after the invasion, because we were sitting on their oil like it was our own private piggy bank. And as for the state we left Iraq in, thousands upon thousands of people have been killed in the sectarian strife we left behind. They aren't making decisions about their future. They're running for their damned lives.
The used car salesman is trying to sell the lemon that was the Iraq war in order to avoid sounding like a hypocrite about Russia.
Utterly nauseating.
https://www.democraticunderground.com/10024734511
Brother Buzz
(36,212 posts)It was pointed out to me upthread that it was POS used car salesman, or piece of shit used car thread. Words matter, or something.
Demsrule86
(68,347 posts)This message was self-deleted by its author - Democratic Underground
https://www.democraticunderground.com/10024685964
Mar 18, 2014 - "fuck you mr president you piece of shit used car salesman" is an .... Ranting on the DU about how awful Obama is won't change anything.
You visited this page on 8/18/17.
This message was self-deleted by its author
This message was self-deleted by its author (WilliamPitt) on Fri Apr 4, 2014, 02:41 PM. When the original post in a discussion thread is self-deleted, the entire discussion thread is automatically locked so new replies cannot be posted.
Here is a post that was in response....
He obviously said it...it is posted on other right wing sites...and attributed to him.
https://www.google.com/search?q=President+Obama+is+a+piece+of+shit+used+car+salesman+democratic+underground&rlz=1C1CHZL_enUS730US730&oq=President+Obama+is+a+piece+of+shit+used+car+salesman+democratic+underground&aqs=chrome..69i57.30839j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8
https://www.democraticunderground.com/10024685964
MrsCoffee
(5,801 posts)FarPoint
(12,206 posts)He focused on ACA...and yes, we came up real short of our goal....far from single payer...but we did get ACA where we COULD OF built a stronger system....He should of added the GOP obstruction...that's really where his anger was fueled....I'm fine with it...
The post was misleading.. claiming fuck Obama.. it was definitely not that way .. it as an issue frustration.
mcar
(42,206 posts)He called President Obama a "piece of shit used car salesman." He said f you to him.
He should have been banned for that.
You asked for proof, then move the goalposts.
Eliot Rosewater
(31,096 posts)room full of folks who normally dont vote, to REALLY not vote when they hear attacks like that of HIllary?
Yeah, I blame lots of people for why a Nazi is in the WH, but if those progressives had not acted like that, we would not be here right now talking about trump.
FarPoint
(12,206 posts)If he did..it was probably a brief single issue frustration....He was on Team Obama.
Adrahil
(13,340 posts)He was tombstoned precisely because of outbursts like that.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)flooded with hostile professional agents, both foreign and domestic, whose purpose was and is to sow dissension and disillusionment and turn as many on the left as possible against both the party as a whole and against our presidential candidate by providing false information and stirring up trouble on forums like this one.
The actions of this particular demagogic troublemaker fit that profile all too well, so well that it doesn't even matter whether he was paid or not, operating on his own or not, sabotaging our party on behalf of the right deliberately or accidentally. The actions stand on their own.
FarPoint
(12,206 posts)15 years..... he's definitely one of the good guys.
FarPoint
(12,206 posts)If you got to actually know him...or even care to know his Democratic contributions, commitment and dynamic knowledge of our political arena.. If you did that...you might be feeling a little shameful.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)DUers have both long and short memories.
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)brush
(53,467 posts)Kingofalldems
(38,359 posts)Beringia
(4,313 posts)Phentex
(16,330 posts)if people want to read him, they know where to find him.
He isn't here, so has no "audience" here, but there are still DUers who DO both read his work AND talk to him elsewhere. Will was one of the group of DUers I first got to know right here back in '03; sometimes I agreed with him, sometimes not, sometimes really not, but I listened, engaged, and found substance to discuss. Not so much anymore here; it's become more and more an authoritarian echo chamber as it's evolved.
MuseRider
(34,057 posts)and wondering how you are. Good to see you.
It is always good to read Will, you don't have to agree with everything you read. If you want to learn you read many things and sometimes discard them, not because of the author but because there is no value to that particular piece of writing. Throwing out Will Pitt by liberals would be stupid no matter what he has said or how he voted (nobody knows what he actually did so get over yourselves it is none of your business anyway). His ideas are worth reading and considering. The reactions here are what I expect from high school students who need to belong to a certain group and cannot stand being threatened by how others dress.
I am grateful to be his friend elsewhere and read him in other places. I am always glad to see him posted here as well.
annabanana
(52,791 posts)Generic Other
(28,979 posts)They were slave owners and should never be praised EVER EVER EVER for any good they accomplished because of they owned human beings and did not have consistent enough worldviews. Yet most of us give them a pass for the good they set in motion. We may not approve of their actions as slaveholders, but we have not thrown out the Dec of Independence or the Bill of Rights because we hate Jefferson. We have not removed all references to George Washington because he owned slaves.
Jefferson acknowledged slavery was wrong, and yet he did nothing to alleviate the problem. Should we hate the man and post angry words whenever we speak his name?
LWolf
(46,179 posts)I try to stop in here once a week or so, for LOLcats in the lounge, if nothing else. I hope you are doing well.
This is my last weekend before I'm back to school full-time, except for Monday. We are in the path of totality for Monday's eclipse, and have been overrun with an influx of people here to see the event; more visitors than actual residents, so our quiet roads and gas stations and stores and parking AND emergency services are severely taxed; our school district is shutting down and locking up the entire district Monday.
Things here are about the same, otherwise, except for my old mare. She's fine right now, but has come out of winter in terrible shape the last two springs in a row, and I don't know if I want to put her through another. A hard choice, since her coat's shiny, her ribs are finally not showing, and her energy is good; it only took almost the entire spring and summer to get her back to that condition, though. I keep putting off making that final choice.
MuseRider
(34,057 posts)She is still ribby and I too have been fighting it with her all summer and it has been so so hot. The day we hit 126 heat index I was surprised any of the critters made it, including me!
Mine I cannot boost with different food choices or she gets the runs. Back and forth. One more winter I think, she has not seemed terribly upset about it all and she gets a double stall with fans and a mister during the day and of course she loves showing it off to the others out in the heat. I think she still has time.
We are about 100 miles from the total eclipse. We will be headed North to try and meet up with some cousins and annoy some farmers up there by parking along their road. Knowing how I would feel about others coming on the farm or putting a bunch of crap on the grass we will be courteous, stay on the side of the road and not do that. I am bringing a card to put in the box thanking them if they let us stay. I imagine even here it will be busy but it will not be full.
I hope it does not get worse for you this weekend. Enjoy the eclipse, I am looking forward to it. The adventure will be the fun part I suppose since it is supposed to get cloudy and rain here. It will still get very dark and that in itself will be interesting.
Have a great school year.
LWolf
(46,179 posts)I'll know it's time to retire when I'm not excited to see students.
Here it's more about the winter cold than the summer heat; I'm wondering if I can get her to wear a blanket if we can't do one more winter. Last winter was the worst around here since 1992, and school went way beyond the last day of school doing make-up days. I still have spots in the barn roof to repair, and broken pipes, before it freezes up again. So many roofs collapsed that anyone who would work on roofs has had a months-long waiting list.
She's never worn a blanket, and tends to be very touchy about touching. She'll let me brush her, she'll let us pick up her feet, but she doesn't like anyone but me to touch her. When it cools down a bit, I'll start working with the blanket and see if I can get her comfortable before everything freezes up.
MuseRider
(34,057 posts)Mine loves having a blanket but she did not want it at first. It took some time. If she trusts you, and she obviously does, then you will get it done. I would start early, some of them take a long time. I have one that needs to be broke to fly spray every year.
PatSeg
(46,773 posts)to greet and welcome me back in 2004. I may not always agree with him or anyone for that matter, but this thread is over the top. A lot of people I know have moved away from Democratic Underground and it is largely because of these sorts of frenzied attacks.
I have enough republicans and white supremacists to be angry at, I won't waste my anger on Democrats.
GusBob
(7,286 posts)This all about Hillary
You value shit
He is not welcome here
Foamfollower
(1,097 posts)If you didn't vote Hillary, you supported Trump.
There is no other choice. Choosing AGAINST Hillary was to support Trump and that's exactly what this fucking Nazi fuck did.
Yes, William Rivers Pitt is FUCKING NAZI because he chose to help Trump win.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)Guilt by association.
I voted for Clinton, but I never much liked the flashmob mentality expressed here. Sorry. Guess I should expect to be driven off soon too.
edited: to reflect I do not think I am a Nazi under any circumstances.
Foamfollower
(1,097 posts)You chose to vote AGAINST the Nazis, unlike Pitt who was okay with Nazis taking over.
TastyTaters
(17 posts)Which is strange coming from someone who couldn't possibly have interacted with him here since you registered less than 6 months ago. As for me I've been friend with him on FB for many years. Maybe that's where you had some heated exchanges with Will?
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)And I refuse to throw this ugly word around lightly. You should be ashamed to do so as well.
Because there ARE real Nazis. Real racists. And they are laughing at us and plotting to harm us.
zentrum
(9,865 posts).....that he supported Trump. Do you have a link?
I know he criticized HRC, as did many in the primary, but is there a statement of active support for Trump by Pitt?
I've googled etc. and it's not turning up.
Arazi
(6,829 posts)Foamfollower
(1,097 posts)ergo, he supported Trump and is a Nazi.
zentrum
(9,865 posts)...does not a nazi make. Lots of Democratic voters stayed home. They are not nazis.
Let's not diminish the horror of nazism.
Beartracks
(12,761 posts)Look at the horrors Nazis inflicted on the world 80 years ago. The absolute evil of their actions. And now we're supposed to equate a bad voting decision with that level of atrocity?
No, thanks.
=================
fleabiscuit
(4,542 posts)LovesPNW
(65 posts)Will has been at the vanguard of anti-fascist opinion since before DU even existed.
Sorry, but you don't have the gravitas to criticize or condemn Will out of hand with a slander and a lie.
Will was a leading voice in DU against the IWR and Dubya's Iraq adventure.
You were nowhere to be seen.
So, put that in your pipe and smoke it!
brush
(53,467 posts)Stop violating the terms of service. Value what he has to say on your own.
Beartracks
(12,761 posts)=========
brush
(53,467 posts)Dennis Donovan
(18,770 posts)He may be flagged for review, but Truth-out is an acceptable site to link to.
brush
(53,467 posts)another poster.
Dennis Donovan
(18,770 posts)Can you post a link to where he threatened to kill another DUer?
brush
(53,467 posts)You'll find your answers there.
Dennis Donovan
(18,770 posts)Have a nice day!
mcar
(42,206 posts)He is responsible for this mess. He actively campaigned against the Democratic nominee.
Beringia
(4,313 posts)because he is a close watcher of what goes on in politics and I believe he has a good mind.
mcar
(42,206 posts)LibraLiz1973
(8,197 posts)WRP is no ally. He is not for the DEMOCRATS. And this is DEMOCRATIC underground, so...
MrsCoffee
(5,801 posts)donheld
(21,311 posts)Can you or anyone else prove he called Obama a used car salesman?
MrsCoffee
(5,801 posts)MrsCoffee
(5,801 posts)Ninsianna
(1,349 posts)WoonTars
(694 posts)Or you could just retract your lie.
Ninsianna
(1,349 posts)general, then YES he voted for Trump. Writing in invalid votes elected Trump.
Last time I checked Trump was a nazi.
Or you could just stop with refighting the primary and lying about what this person did, and the mad man his moronic campaign to convince idiots to throw away their votes elected a damned Nazi.
You could stop with the personal attacks and the lying about what this man and Jill Stein and every Nazi enabler did.
Last time I checked, I never said the thing you falsely accused me of.
Stop the lying.
WoonTars
(694 posts)Enough with the lies. You are stating something that is utterly false on its face.
I have attacked NO-ONE.
Ninsianna
(1,349 posts)ANY idiot who wrote in invalid candidates and encouraged other idiots to do the same, it's beyond a doubt that these were a campaign of votes for Trump. He voted in Trump, because as anyone with a functioning brain cell knew, Bernie Sanders was not a valid candidate, having lost the nomination. HE asked everyone who followed him and believed in him to vote for Hillary. The most profoundly stupid ignored Bernie and wrote him in anyway.
Enough with the projection, the dishonest, the ad hominems and the statements that are false in every way, the lying needs to stop, as do the attacks.
This Pitt person and his minions dumb enough to listen to him gave us Trump, there is no defense for this idiocy. No amount of personal attacks against me for stating that undeniable fact will change his complicity and those of his defenders against what they did.
WoonTars
(694 posts)He wrote in 'Bernie Sanders'. Last time i checked 'Donald Trump' isn't spelled B-E-R-N-I-E S-A-N-D-E-R-S....
Hillary Clinton won the popular vote and the EC votes in his home state so he therefore had NOTHING to do with Dump getting elected.
Oh, and btw, I'm STILL not attacking you...
donheld
(21,311 posts)?
Ninsianna
(1,349 posts)Demsrule86
(68,347 posts)obamanut2012
(25,905 posts)He is pompous as hell, and I am ashamed I ever thought he had anything of merit to say. He also called Obama a POS on here, and threatened to murder another DUer for no reason.
I also don;t think he is a great writer
sheshe2
(83,319 posts)He never researched Obamacare for his wife's vital meds when he moved to NH. He blamed Obama for denying her Meds then voted for a man that is taking away her meds.
obamanut2012
(25,905 posts)And he attacked me.
Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #27)
Name removed Message auto-removed
mahina
(17,502 posts)I never saw any evidence of that.
Are you sure that is correct? I'm sure it is not. I definitely recall him saying if the race was close in NH that he would vote for Hillary.
I proudly voted for Hillary by the way and advocated for her after she won the primary.
Whatever you think of his writing is your business. The rest of your post will need to wait for another day when I'm not so far behind to respond. Peace to you and to all beings.
phylny
(8,352 posts)of the thread. I think I'll do it now.
LibraLiz1973
(8,197 posts)he is just one more human partially responsible for this fucking mess.
Ellipsis
(9,123 posts)Hard to argue with the imagery.
ecstatic
(32,566 posts)but I'm glad to see others feel the same way.
stonecutter357
(12,682 posts)JHB
(37,128 posts)sheshe2
(83,319 posts)There is no place for his articles on a Democratic Site. He made his choice, he stated clearly that he would NOT VOTE FOR CLINTON.
Gravitycollapse
(8,155 posts)sheshe2
(83,319 posts)He voted Trump or Third Party.
Gravitycollapse
(8,155 posts)sheshe2
(83,319 posts)POSUCS?
George II
(67,782 posts)sheshe2
(83,319 posts)Blamed him for taking away her vital meds...that he was to stupid research before moving to NH. Then voted for the man that is taking away her meds.
He called Obama a...PIECE OF SHIT USED CAR SALESMAN.
Eliot Rosewater
(31,096 posts)be the "end of the fucking world."
I got into it recently with one of them who was mad as hell at me for mentioning how much good the Clinton foundation does on a daily basis.
sheshe2
(83,319 posts)Because the Clinton Foundation has always benefited the people.
Eliot Rosewater
(31,096 posts)a positive manner.
sheshe2
(83,319 posts)She is a strong Democrat and this is still Democratic Underground.
grantcart
(53,061 posts)Gravitycollapse
(8,155 posts)Hissyspit
(45,788 posts)Jeez, that's so fucking stupid.
annabanana
(52,791 posts)Whole lotta hate in this thread.
Kingofalldems
(38,359 posts)NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)sheshe2
(83,319 posts)emulatorloo
(43,979 posts)George II
(67,782 posts)Foamfollower
(1,097 posts)So long as he used a female pen name, any way.
sheshe2
(83,319 posts)I was just going to post that!
TSIAS
(14,689 posts)I believe that's where she got her start.
pintobean
(18,101 posts)he's in FFR purgatory.
sheshe2
(83,319 posts)Bleacher Creature
(11,235 posts)And the two of them share some traits in common, including a mutual hatred of President Obama.
Please don't post his crap here.
Pathwalker
(6,596 posts)here. Disgusting P.O.S. indeed.
obamanut2012
(25,905 posts)And, the Admins cravenly unbanned him after they gave him a very short time out.
Foamfollower
(1,097 posts)obamanut2012
(25,905 posts)even if he was.
Pathwalker
(6,596 posts)act like it was "no big deal". The violence in his threat was so beyond the pale he should never have been allowed to return.
Kingofalldems
(38,359 posts)It was downright hero worship.
Pathwalker
(6,596 posts)I never understood the hero worship.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)When DU started, it was a group as small as the group of people crowding on this thread. We had each other's backs. No matter what. We focused on the good we could do, not on which DUers we could bring down even when they made us mad. We spent most of our energy trying to bring down the mighty and powerful. And when we brought down the mighty and powerful, it was because they deserved it. We kept our eyes on the prize.
Pathwalker
(6,596 posts)"Had each other's backs" - and sometimes each other's throats. Purity tests up the wazoo, who was a "real" Democrat/Liberal/Progressive, etc. I remember Kephra, Andy Stephenson (and what was done to him), Nostamj, and many others now gracing DU's in Memorium page, and I remember Will threatening to break down a woman's door and beat her face so bad it would take a DNA test to identify her. But, maybe that's acceptable IF you're the right kind of long time DUer. My mileage definitely varies.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)I know because I was one of the DUers who attended. Will Pitt draws blood when he is angry and insulting his mother makes him angry. Fighting words. Would you not be on the attack against a DUer if they besmirched your mother?
Mostly it is rightwing blood he has been after, and he has been effective. He started by writing on DU and ended up on Truthout. He has earned some respect as a progressive voice even if you think we should shun him for the lapses.
On edit: Kephra adored Pitt and got a job with him.
Pathwalker
(6,596 posts)I won't be a part of group think, and I will disagree when and where I choose. I am an old woman with little time left on this earth, and I will not bow down to anyone, anywhere. Threatening violence against someone is my line in the sand, my deal breaker. I'm sorry you don't like that, but that is how I feel. I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)but I also will agree to disagree. Will Pitt does not need me to defend his record.
Peace as I assume I have known you in another incarnation.
obamanut2012
(25,905 posts)Pitt assisted Trump in getting elected. He threatened to kill someone -- anyone insulting his mom, or him being drunk, or him having a temper excuses his actions. He wasn't a toddler.
I read his threads on FB during the primaries. He is a sick, twisted guy who told people not to vote for Hillary, and stated he never would, and that Trump would be a better President than Hillary
Fuck that guy - WHO IS A BANNED POSTER ON DU
obamanut2012
(25,905 posts)And reached out to his victim and asked if they needed help.
Pathwalker
(6,596 posts)n/t
obamanut2012
(25,905 posts)i know she could be horrible, but she was mentally ill and basically homeless.
Pathwalker
(6,596 posts)Generic Other
(28,979 posts)So why do we keep throwing it in his face like a vindictive ex-spouse? Or a cow chewing our cabbage twice? We need to focus on how to fight Trump.
mcar
(42,206 posts)Generic Other
(28,979 posts)Last edited Fri Aug 18, 2017, 03:02 PM - Edit history (2)
on edit: I was wrong. He wrote in Bernie as a poster down thread has stated. His right.
And HR Clinton still won. Both popular and possibly the electoral vote. And worse, Trump is still in the White House. So what can we do about that?
mcar
(42,206 posts)for one.
Has Pitt ever expressed regret for his support of a Nazi? For his endless trashing of HRC?
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)Pitt is no more a Nazi than you or I. It is an ugly term to throw around so casually. Especially as real Nazis attack our country. And when untrue or hyperbole seems like fighting words to me.
I am going back to fighting real enemies, not tilting at strawmen, painting everything as either/or, jumping on bandwagons, attacking the man and every other logical fallacy I have seen used here to mask the fact we are supposed to shun an ex-Duer in order to silence his voice.
mcar
(42,206 posts)Generic Other
(28,979 posts)Last edited Fri Aug 18, 2017, 03:03 PM - Edit history (1)
on edit: I misread. You said he supported a Nazi. My apologies. Again, I do not know any DUers who did that.
But he was called a Nazi upthread: https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=9474699
obamanut2012
(25,905 posts)It was sickening to see.
annabanana
(52,791 posts)I never saw that.. I find it hard to believe
Ninsianna
(1,349 posts)for his actions, aiding and abetting a dangerous, mentally unstable racist who brought actual Nazis into the White House.
We can stop listening to what he says and hold him accountable. We don't need to post his writing here, a place he was banned from because of what people are explaining are some shockingly racist and posts.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)We all know most of us did not. Or couldn't leave that line blank. I feared for the consequences. But she won. The vote was likely stolen in critical states by Russia, and nothing any of us could do to change that. Blaming Pitt won't change that.
Ninsianna
(1,349 posts)If they had not done so, we'd not be facing what we're facing today. So many people were encouraging purity votes for Stein (not people who actually gave a crap about the Green Party or its stances) but as a protest vote. Many left the slot blank, and many wrote in something dumb and left the ballot blank.
The vote was stolen, and Pitt, Stein and the various bots that switched from Bernie to Jill en masse online helped the Russians and the GOP to steal it.
There was plenty we could have done to change that, but anyone stating that purity was not so pure in this instance were ridiculed, silenced, attacked, abused and pretty much harassed. That behavior is still going on all over the internet.
Putting blame where it belongs will keep us from falling for that deliberate divisive idiocy again.
It's important that he be held accountable, along with everyone else who responded to "vote for the only qualified candidate on the ballot" with anything other than a vote. 70,000 votes. That what this guy and people like him swayed, and that was all it took.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)Do you also refuse to speak to any friends or relatives in your real life who voted for Trump? I know some who did. I am trying not to hate them for their unwise choice like I did during Bush years when I refused to speak to them. This time, I hope to educate them and win them over maybe.
Not sure I can with the hardcore deplorables, but some of the others seem capable of change. Should we reach out or just hit them with ugly sticks like people did to the Neo-Nazis and the Klan? Hitting those on the fence, however, will not win them over. And it sounds like we need them. Isn't that what coalition building is all about? Different groups trying to find common ground?
I get what you are saying about purity. I am guilty of having sometimes expected that. I am trying to change. But DUers keep trying to enforce the same thing. Anyway, thanks for taking the time to share your views with me. I appreciate it.
sheshe2
(83,319 posts)Please show me all the pictures of the anti Nazi people beating Nazis half to death.
Deandre Harris.
Link to tweet
These are the ones you want to reach out to? These with their ugly sticks. How could you blame our side? The ones against racism and bigotry.
We do not need these people and never will. All they know is hate and believe in their right to White Supremacy.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)I meant the dummies who just cast a stupid vote for Trump. Or even Stein or that Libertarian jackass. Can we get any of them to change their minds. They were dupes. Dopes. The others who marched like Nazis got exactly what they deserved. No argument from me!
Ninsianna
(1,349 posts)white, not Christian and the very people Trump and his Nazis hate. But they're mostly in red states and their few votes didn't make a difference, nor did they infect anyone else.
I don't hate them, I just know how mind fucked they are from living in Texas and all that fox news that has crept into their heads. I haven't won them over, but they've figured out not to tangle with me debating policies. I've actually shut them up and convinced them on a couple of issues. I just can't pierce the raging Hillary hate that decades of Fox and nightly Hannity and O'Reilly have wrought.
I've lost respect for the hardcore deplorables on my FB page, one of whom was a history teacher in a private school full of the people Trump hates. I can only imagine what this man was thinking with all those brown kids and muslims he had to teach, though his classes were not honors so I don't know how many of them were in his classes.
These people who seem capable of change, how do you think they'd respond to you versus me? Would you be risking your life on sight with these people? I would. I cannot hide who and what I am. I have friends who have been infiltrating these Trump gatherings to just just what flavor and intensity of crazy they're cooking up. If you feel like reaching out, then do so, just stop expecting it from the rest of us. We're not privileged enough to survive that. It sounds like we need to win over all the idiots who believed the propaganda they were fed. They were lied to and the damage was done, we need to deal with them. Let the on-the-fence nazis and white supremacists and other deplorables seek absolution on their own. Coalition building is not about coddling Nazis or fascists, it's about seeking common ground with people who have the same goals we do. Those people do not share goals with me. They want me dead, they want me dehumanized and they think I'm an animal or a heathen. They're fine with robbing me of my culture and history and religion, but I am not a human being to them.
The purity forces were the ones who keep saying that we need to forget the basic tenets of our party to chase after angry white men.
Human rights is a purity test I can deal with, but when those humans are women, a great many here become all wobbly.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)It was like a reflex action for the right. Always my main fear concerning her candidacy. And not her fault. It was not "hers to lose" as so many said. She did not lose. Russian interference won the day. Rightwingers in Congress and the media stole the election from her. Some of them are starting to regret it.
But I am not talking about the hateful marchers. I am talking about the few deplorables who might be starting to regret their stupidity. Aligned as they are now with Nazis and looking worse than deplorable, maybe feeling guilty. I wonder if any are kicking themselves for being stupid enough to vote Trump. I hope some feel ashamed. Should we never forgive them for being duped? Should we just hate them forever? Can't we try to change minds? Win hearts?
Let's work to restore voting rights in red states. Work to get people to the polls. That's the sort of organizing DU does best, not just attack each other. Many people here have strong religious faith. They more than anyone should preach reconciliation with others on the left as well as those on the right that can be reached.
I don't know the answer, but the alternative is very ugly as we have seen. Nazis and blood in the streets. People who want to kill all of us on the left -- POC and Jews first, but the rest of us as well. We can only vow to fight those haters. But we can also not hate our own or others if they are on our side.
If the US punished Germany and Japan after WW2, we would have been within our rights, but we showed mercy, and these two nations are our allies today. Just sayin'...
Ninsianna
(1,349 posts)they what lies were being told about Hillary by the right and the left (often the same things). They did this. They should feel guilty. They need to examine what's broken in themselves and figure out how to fix it.
I hope they're kicking themselves and I hope it hurts when they do. If they want forgiveness they need to earn it and ask for it. I don't hate them, I just then know they hate me, and us and the rest of the world. I don't need to change their minds, I don't think they have hearts, they need to prove that to me, and they need to do the damned work.
We're already working on those things, they were supporting the restrictions of those voting rights. We're not attacking them, that's literally all on them, regardless of what Trump says. There is no "many sides" of equivalent guilt here. They chose to support a party of racism that promotes Nazis. They chose to attack us, they chose to support Trump and the GOP.
You can't "reconcile" with people who are trying to kill you and think you're not human, there is no compromise with people who want you dead. Having a strong religious faith doesn't equal trying to compromise with people who find supporting evil tolerable.
We're not the ones hating our own, we're the ones being attacked viciously by those who pretend to be on our side. There is a lot of latent racism even in these boards, as I found out on another thread, where supposed liberals are saying just what those tiki torch bearing lumps of pale, bald angry men were snarling, and they have no idea why they're so offensive. If they want to be on our side, they need to walk the walk and talk the talk, that goes for anyone.
We did punish Germany and Japan after ww2, we didn't show much mercy to Japan, considering we blew up 2 major cities with atomic bombs that incinerated civilian populations.
Germany didn't show their nazis any mercy and they're in control over there, just sayin' coddling Nazis is a dumb thing to do. if they want forgiveness, then earn it, they will not be given anything. Not by me or anyone who sees what they are and what they've done. Goes for the Repubs and the destructive forces who were pretending to be on the left and doing the work of the right. Right wingers have much work to do, anyone who spouted that nonsense is one of them. Even Republicans voted against Trump and Hillary, I have no forgiveness who saw Trump and did not vote for the only person who could have saved us from him. None.
IF they're feeling guilty, fine, they deserve to , now they can fix the mess they made.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)Post-war, the Japanese feared MacArthur would slaughter them and their emperor. He didn't. Americans occupied and rebuilt. We forgave. Same in Germany.
The nuking of Japanese cities pretty much ended hostilities. American soldiers came in and rebuilt. I know because my father was among that group. He went to Japan prepared to HATE every single person. He ended up embracing the people and culture. What is learned can be unlearned.
If we had punished them after the war, neither country would have made the kind of recovery they subsequently did.
Ninsianna
(1,349 posts)"forgivenes"?
Fine, I'll forgive these Trump voters by not nuking or slaughtering them. So they can do what the Japanese and the Germans did, and address the elements in their society that they engaged in, and I'll keep from nuking them as I watch what they do closely, just like the U.S. did with their "forgiveness". We demanded that they put into action proof that they were not dangerous and they were not allowing those elements to survive in their country.
Yeah the people who actually require forgiveness rarely admit they need it, like we did when we annihilated 2 cities filled with civillians who were non combatants, and the Nazis who annihilated millions of people don't think they need forgiveness.
How did anyone rebuild the countless lives incinerated? The DNA of a population that was affected by radiation? Did we ask forgiveness?
That's nice that the went there to "hate" everyone who had every right to hate him, I think you do not see the views of the people who were the victims of unforgiveable acts.
American citizens knowingly supporting the nazi and fascist takeover of this country are not nations. You object to holding them accountable in the same we we did Japan and Germany. They didn't just get "forgiven" and everything was forgotten, they did things to earn that.
You seem to object to even treating them as we did the Germans and Japanese. Your analogy fails due to a simplistic and superficial view of post war countries.
Post Trump Nazis of the Right and the GOP have a great deal to do to provide reparations for their heinous actions.
Look up the Paris Treaty to understand why your analogy fails and why these Nazis and their enablers should do what their German brothers did in Germany by hunting down and ejecting the very worst of their Nazis and making them personal non grata, they didn't just hug it out with them and say all is forgiven and forgotten because we need to build bridges with ignorance, hate and violence, they required that those people who were guilty drive that out of their society.
Why won't you require that of the Nazi enabling hatemongers in your own circle? It's what the Allies did after all, and that's your argument, why change the rules?
mcar
(42,206 posts)BTW, no one has the "luxury" of not voting or not voting for the best candidate on the ballot.
sheshe2
(83,319 posts)Wow. He had the luxury of allowing his wife's vital meds to be put on the line. The very meds he railed at Obama for taking, when he did not.
He had the luxury.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)I did not for one second feel that certain about my blue state. Sorry, I used that word. He felt comfortable not voting. I did not. Obviously, you either. You voted for the candidate you felt was best. I voted for a candidate I felt was the only option while fearing that the other side would do anything to bring her down (as they did).
She was not wrong about a vast rightwing conspiracy against her. And she was not wrong that not every Democrat supported her wholeheartedly. Partially for that reason. I decided after the primaries that she was the only and best choice. I am sorry we were not able to convince more in swing states, but I am not sure it would have mattered due to Russian interference. I blame them. Not Comey. Or Pitt. Or any other progressive.
sheshe2
(83,319 posts)Crystal Ball?
I ALWAYS VOTE DEMOCRAT!
PERIOD.
FULLSTOP.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)by deriding their choices. When I say he must have known it is because in many states the outcome is a foregone conclusion.
But yes, it is a dangerous risk you and I did not take.
sheshe2
(83,319 posts)Women have fought far to long for their voice to be heard and our right to vote. We fought for our rights. We were imprisoned and force fed when we went on hunger strikes FOR OUR RIGHT TO VOTE! We do not toss our votes away. Perhaps it is easy for a white man to sit it out. They were allowed to vote long before us. They finally decided we were worthy and intelligent enough to vote.
I will deride anyone's decision to sit it out and not vote. No clue how that drives away potential votes.
George II
(67,782 posts)Four tenths of one percent. He rolled the dice and he got lucky.
H. Clinton 47.6% 348,521
D. Trump 47.2% 345,789
G. Johnson 4.2% 30,827
J. Stein 0.9% 6,416
R. De La Fuente 0.1% 676
seaglass
(8,170 posts)voted Bush over Gore (this was a Nader issue), Bush over Dukakis, Reagan over Carter, Reagan over Mondale.
Eliot Rosewater
(31,096 posts)on at least 5 other people, each of them repeats something and all of a sudden one person has caused 20 to not vote because they throw their hands in the air and think both candidates are bad.
The nation wide, all day long everyday, non stop ATTACKS of Hillary Clinton is why she ONLY won by 3 million votes.
WoonTars
(694 posts)That's a filthy goddamned lie...you can use whatever hyperbole you want, but your statement is an outright fucking lie...
I am SICK to death of the bullshit circular firing-squad, purity tests here. Not everyone is going to agree with everyone else's viewpoint. And spare me the "He didn't vote for her so that's just like voting for Trump" bullshit,do you have no clue how the Electoral College works? He lives in a state that was going to go for the Democratic candidate NO MATTER WHAT, so he could have voted for fucking SPIDERMAN and she would still have won his state.
It's clearly become de rigeur to jump in the group think, and pile on those people that make you face the uncomfortable truth, but if you don't knock it the fuck off and start working together, this party is going to be stuck in the political wilderness for a very long time...
And i don't think this country can withstand that in the long term...
MrsCoffee
(5,801 posts)A swing state not a damn blue state.
That's a pretty clever crystal ball he owns there. "NO MATTER WHAT" you say? You shouldn't be screaming at anyone in this thread after that pile of baloney.
MineralMan
(146,189 posts)WoonTars
(694 posts)They lied. Period.
R B Garr
(16,919 posts)from those who were too "pure" to vote for the Democrat. It's not the other way around. Since you're attacking someone, it's best you keep your own house in order.
And it was already refuted that New Hampshire was a sure thing for Democrats. Someone else pointed out that the Nader lies affected that state before, so gambling away your vote meant on some level that Trump was okay. That's just a known consequence that doesn't even have to be articulated.
WoonTars
(694 posts)...it meant no such thing by the way...that's hindsight 20/20 bullshit...
The bigger issue is she couldn't hold the states she was supposed to win by a country mile like Wi, Pa and Mi...
But sure let's rag on someone that can't defend themselves from the outright lies being spewed in this thread...
He's not always my cup of tea either, but there's no way in hell he ever advocated, hinted, suggested, or endorsed voting for Donald Fucking Trump. That is an outright goddamned lie. Period.
The fact that this sort of Orwellian, two minutes of hate, bile is allowed on this site is a disgrace. We are supposed to be better than that.
R B Garr
(16,919 posts)what else has been subverted. Hillary was deemed not pure enough. It's not the other way around.
The lies about Hillary and Democrats aren't the first time this has happened. We also had the Nader lies. It's not as if lying about Democrats has worked out in our favor. It doesn't work out. Whatever excuses you have about other states, the fact remains that Clinton was maligned and viciously attacked, and that took a toll. People aren't going to stand for this anymore.
Look what we got out of in 2000 -- Gore was not the same as Bush.
It's common knowledge that if you don't vote for the Democrat, then the Republican gets the White House. Quit calling people liars for just acknowledging common sense and the natural consequence of rejecting "impure" candidates for vanity reasons.
That is the "hate and bile" that needs to be called out. There was a time I used to think I had to read this kind of nastiness to try and see the other side, but I've been disabused of that. Enough is enough with attacking Democrats. That's what you are noticing now.
WoonTars
(694 posts)Since the election countless people have been harassed and driven away by the "purists" that required 100% fealty, even after her stunning defeat.
We need to come together or we are doomed. There is a man in the Whitehouse right now that actively defends Neo-nazis and yet he STILL has a 34% approval rating!!!
We need to find a way past the infighting, and rehashing of old fights, or we don't stand a chance to take back the House next year which is vital to stop the Dump/Pence regime...
Calling someone a nazi, or lying about the things someone said, achieves nothing constructive, and it needs to stop.
The future of the Republic may very well be on the line here...
R B Garr
(16,919 posts)Democrats. You joined in March '17, but you don't get to rewrite history. You can look at the TOS and see it says "support Democrats". So I'm positive that's where it comes from. If you were maligning our candidate, the Democrat Hillary Clinton, then you were attacking her as "impure" that you wouldn't vote for her, and mostly for vanity reasons.
If you didn't support the Democrat, then it's implied that you knew what the consequences were to your actions -- a Republican in the White House. That is reality, and it's not a lie.
obamanut2012
(25,905 posts)Your defending his sociopathy against that poster is an extremely odd hill to die on.
And, your ignoring his support for Trump is noted.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)I have not done my part for DU over the years? I have not supported, towed party lines, posted, been active, worked for Democrats enough to earn the respect of not being dismissed by being told I am choosing an "odd hill to die on" ? That my unorthodoxy "is noted"? I am dismissed for asking you to prove Pitt or anyone else ON THIS SITE ever supported Trump?
I have spent the past 6 months doing nothing but attacking him. Here and everywhere else. If you think I need to be driven off from here, fine. I will still be attacking Trump elsewhere.
Why am I shocked by your words?
oasis
(49,150 posts)He provided me with informational links and he always put in a good word for DU whenever he got a guest spot on the radio. That was my memory of him back in the day.
I unretired during most of Obama's two terms so I rarely posted on DU. Don't know much what went on over here. I'm far from being sympathetic to anyone hostile to HRC, which I have come to understand, he falls into that category.
You seem to be taking quite a pounding here on his behalf, so for that, and for old time's sake, I salute you.
obamanut2012
(25,905 posts)Declared Trump a much better prospect for Presdient than HRC. Said this publicly for MONTHS, over and over and over.
Called Obama a piece of shit used car salesman.
Threatened, on here, to murder a homeless and mentally ill woman, to beat her so badly the cops would need DNA to identify her.
So, I don;t get why being an "old timer" should get you passes for any of this, or why people shouldn't tell the TRUTH abOUT Pitt.
There are plenty of old timers who have done none of these things, and I salute THEM.
oasis
(49,150 posts)on anything you list as a negative. I was saluting Generic Other for his recognition of Pitt's past positive contributions.
emulatorloo
(43,979 posts)obamanut2012
(25,905 posts)Generic Other
(28,979 posts)Why do you ask?
donheld
(21,311 posts)You made that shit up. I read nearly everything the man writes. Never once did he say Trump would be a better president. Ever.
LexVegas
(6,005 posts)hrmjustin
(71,265 posts)...has no credibility here.
Response to Beringia (Original post)
iemitsu This message was self-deleted by its author.
sheshe2
(83,319 posts)Why should any Democrat, PoC, Woman, (out) LGBTQ, or member of the left give a good (or bad) shit what a "conscience voter" has to say about 45 ... he elected him."
Please delete this OP. It is not helping. Pitt elected trump with his refusal to vote for Hill. He stated that clearly and loudly on our Democratic board that he would vote trump or third party.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)Because I thought he did not cast a vote in a BLUE state. If I am wrong, I stand corrected.
sheshe2
(83,319 posts)Blue state. No clue where the thread is...I was on it at the time...he got two hides on that thread...maybe three.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)he left the slot blank because HRC would win his state. I did not do this in my state. I voted for her after losing the primaries. I did not badmouth her, and I tried to support wholeheartedly even as I read thread after thread about us Bernie folk being scum. I did not rise to the bait. I focused instead on today and tomorrow and the real issues we needed to address. I voted for HRC and she won the popular vote. Nothing Pitt did impacted the outcome.
We have real Nazis among us. Unless they are trolls, none of them are on DU. I hope we can agree on that much. It would be a start anyway.
sheshe2
(83,319 posts)Not on DU...he was gone from here on August 9th. Three months before the election.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)DUers cannot silence his voice everywhere. And I am not sure why some would spend more energy trying to silence Pitt than they do attacking Trump.
sheshe2
(83,319 posts)One thread. None of us really care about him until someone posts his crap here.
Have you missed all the anti trump threads on DU? I think we are choosing our time wisely. We do not need the distraction of a banned poster that spent much of his time bashing Democrats on a Democratic board. We got it. He hated Obama and Hillary.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)When can we read and quote from Truthout without being told Will Pitt is bad. It has happened since Day One on DU. Like clockwork. I meant to say one thing on this thread and move on.
I am not trying to make enemies, but clearly, I have now pinned a bullseye on my chest and may as well find a new home to post my views and fight against the right wing agenda because I defend and support people who have been DUs strongest voices but are now hated. This is not the first time (nor possibly the last) that I have defended DUers who were being attacked by others.
I apologize for speaking out of turn. People can just put me on ignore. And vice versa. But what good does that really do any of us?
I have respected and listened to your voice many times, sheshe2. I am just surprised at the anger we direct against each other here. How do we direct the anger where it belongs? None of us hated Obama. Some of us said stupid things in the heat of the moment. I know I did and regretted it.
When do we quit building walls and dividing our ranks?
still_one
(91,937 posts)Below is the thread where he posted those vile comments.
He eventually self deleted that OP, but it stayed up there for more than a year
Here are the words Pitt used toward President Obama::
"F--- you, Mr. President, you piece of sh*t used-car salesman.
From my heart and soul, f--- you."
https://www.democraticunderground.com/10024685964
https://www.democraticunderground.com/10026887802
He also didn't vote for the Democratic nominee in the most important election of our lives, and the EXCUSE that "he was in a blue state", doesn't hold water. That is the same garbage some people were saying in 2000 when they voted for Nader.
Mr. Pitt is the one who built that wall and worked diligently to divide the ranks.
He made his bed, and is now is persona non grata here on DU
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)We all knew it was flawed but hoped we could change it if we kept the president's "feet to the fire." Today, I bet even President Obama wished he had fought harder for single payer. It would have been even harder to overturn now and done more good ultimately.
If I had a spouse with a terminal illness, I would be angry too. I am meeting middle class folks with high insurance rates who blame Obama for not doing more. I have maybe begun to see how complicated it is. I still believe in single payer. I do not blame Obama for failing to get it. But I still think we need to keep fighting for it. And we need to quit with the constant recriminations. That's all.
JHan
(10,173 posts)Everyone knew the ACA needed to be fixed, and Obama faced obstruction fixing it...he idealistically believed that he could improve the status quo by appropriating a plan that he hoped would get republicans on board. And for millions of Americans the ACA was an improvement.
The GOP has so twisted the narrative in the way Obama is blamed for outcomes that were a direct result of their obstinacy and determination to see him fail.
And they were able to do this because in a census year, democrats stayed home, and the GOP took the house- democrats ought to have known the risks of allowing that to happen. Worse yet, the tea party rebellion ensured there were fewer republican centrists who would have been prepared to reach across the aisle.
As for Pitt, I had no idea who he was prior to this year ( I joined DU after the primaries)
From my observation in this thread, he seemed to have been yet another person on the left who did not understand that presidential elections are a zero sum game. By using his influence (such as it was) to denigrate the dem candidate, He was typical of many who don't understand game theory: the simplest theory there is to understand - Vote in ways that give you the best outcome based on the choices before you. He is now complaining about a President who is 100 times less progressive and liberal than the choice he shat on : Hillary. No matter how you slice it, this is dumb.
And that is on him........voters are adults...they shouldn't be coddled.
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)... there are many groupies, fan-boys, fan-girls, and other assorted sycophants who'll continue to make excuses for his ugly words and threats, and for his myopic self-indulgent behavior. And you know, I just don't get all the adoration for him. Even if I had never heard about the "personal issues" and other conflicts that have happened here... setting that aside just for a moment... he's really a HORRIBLE writer. It's clear to me that he gets paid by-the-word, and after he comes up with his basic outline of what he wants to say, he goes back and "dresses it up" to such an extreme that it becomes a laughable distraction. That type of writing style is often described as "Purple Prose"
Liz Bureman explains purple prose while intentionally using purple prose in the explanation itself:"On occasion, one finds oneself immersed in the literary throes of a piece of prose where there is very little in the way of advancement of the plot or development of the characters, but the pages are still filled with words. Since the esteemed author has allowed their writing to take a turn for the dry and dull, they gallantly attempt to overcompensate for the lack of stimulation by indulging in elaborate turns of phrase."
JHan
(10,173 posts)The purple prose analogy is brilliant
still_one
(91,937 posts)facts. Even when he was informed of that, he keep that OP alive for over a year, and made subsequent anti-Obama and Hillary posts. Sorry, but Pitt is a jerk, and that is NOT a recrimination, that is a fact.
The stakes were never higher than they were in 2016, and any self-identified progressives who refused to vote for the Democratic nominee I will NEVER forget or forgive.
Sarandon was recently interviewed by one of the late night talk hosts, and she was spewing about how trump would bring about "their so-called revolution".
What their "revolution" accomplished was that every Democrat running for Senate in those critical swing states, lost to the establishment, incumbent, republican, because some believed the LIES that there was no difference between the republicans and the Democrats.
Noam Chomsky said it best, progressives who refused to vote for Hillary Clinton made a bad mistake
I think they [made] a bad mistake, said Chomsky, who reiterated that its important to keep a greater evil from obtaining power, even if youre not thrilled with the alternative. I didnt like Clinton at all, but her positions are much better than Trumps on every issue I can think of.
Chomsky also attacked the arguments made by philosopher Slavoj Zizek, who argued that Trumps election would at least shake up the system and provide a real rallying point for the left.
[Zizek makes a] terrible point, Chomsky told Hasan. It was the same point that people like him said about Hitler in the early 30s
hell shake up the system in bad ways.
http://www.rawstory.com/2016/11/noam-chomsky-progressives-who-refused-to-vote-for-hillary-clinton-made-a-bad-mistake/
Pitt's fan club is over at JPR, where the majority of those other self-identified progressives also refused to vote for Hillary.
As for Single Payer, it couldn't pass. THEY DIDN'T HAVE THE VOTES. The blue dogs made it clear
they would NOT vote for it, and they needed every vote to get something passed. There was no leeway.
They had a limited time to pass it, or have nothing.
As for those who want to blame President Obama for the high insurance rates, what is their context? Which states are they in? Did their states expand Medicaid? Were they entitled to a subsidy? How much of those increased rates is due to their state's implementation of the exchanges, and unwillingness to make it work? I could go on, but without details there is no point.
Egnever
(21,506 posts)Great post btw.
sheshe2
(83,319 posts)WE NEVER EVER HAD THE VOTES FOR SINGLE PAYER!
Never had the votes. Even with ya'll keeping his feet to the fire we never had the votes!!!
Sorry. Will has to take some responsibility here. He never researched what was covered in NH for his wife's meds. Then blames Obama. In that thread time and time again DUers gave him good solid advice and he ignored it all. So. Fact. Proves one thing and one thing only. He never wanted a solution. He wanted to bash Obama.
That is a fact.
Response to sheshe2 (Reply #182)
Name removed Message auto-removed
MrsCoffee
(5,801 posts)Demsrule86
(68,347 posts)people view health insurance...now a majority view it as a right. As for his wife's illness...that was a failure on his part to check out what plans covered...and it was corrected as I recall. We will not get single payer in the form of a big bill pushed though congress...but by lowering the age of medicare if we get it at all...we may end up with a Switzerland type plan...and for those who say Obama didn't try hard enough...I say...I worked my ass off to get a unicorn, and I still don't have one. Sometimes things are just not possible. Obamacare saved my daughter's life and Mr. Pitt used it to care for his wife as well...so maybe we should be thankful we got something...many great Dems sacrificed their seats for that legislation. And it makes me sick to see how many don't appreciate it.
sheshe2
(83,319 posts)still_one
(91,937 posts)spewed here against Hillary or President Obama, and than implies we should "stop the recriminations" against Pitt, is insulting
I know.
Sad isn't it. Like we don't have a self proclaimed Nazi in the WH...now this...bashing two people I love.
BannonsLiver
(16,161 posts)But he seems like a narcisist to the 10th power, and it's amazing to me that a post that slurs President Obama like that would be allowed to stand, let alone get 196 recs from Obama hating alleged progressives. Pretty fucking pitiful.
Glad I missed Pitt even if it is an interesting soap opera. He doesn't seem like any kind of progressive I know, or would want to know.
G_j
(40,366 posts)The amount of hatred expressed here towards others on the left is actually frightening. Not just this one person. I've seen it over and over. Fuck this person, Fuck that person. Calling people alt-left etc. What a waste of time.
still_one
(91,937 posts)emulatorloo
(43,979 posts)"I am not sure why some one would spend energy trying to silence Pitt than they do attacking Trump"
DU runs on hyperbole and strawmen, but that takes the cake.
"DUers cannot silence his voice everywhere". Said nobody ever.
The guy got banned at DU and for good reason. So yeah some folks get annoyed having his stuff posted @ DU.
And no you are not a victim nor are you being persecuted, as I saw you suggest up thread.
Nor did anyone here call Pitt a Nazi, another one of your strawman fabrications I just saw you make in another post.
sheshe2
(83,319 posts)Generic Other
(28,979 posts)But I am still waiting for anyone to post a DUer saying they supported Trump. Accusing people of this without proof is what I find hard to take.
emulatorloo
(43,979 posts)of calling Pitt a Nazi.
Pitt shat non-stop on the Dem nominee during campaign 2016, try not to be so literal minded.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)Many of us said things we regretted during the primaries. During the primaries, I said I would NEVER vote for HRC over Bernie. I voted for her. So did Bernie. We are not enemies.
I understand you are still raging mad forever at Pitt. I just thought I could appeal to your better nature to move on to the real enemy.
emulatorloo
(43,979 posts)My goal was to remind you that Will was banned @ DU. He was banned for a good reason by Admins. That's why people are not happy to see his work here.
I also wanted to push back on some of the hyperbolic strawmen arguments you were posting.
Personally think Pitt went off the rails, that's a shame.
Of course you and I are not enemies!
Bernie primary supporter here too. I always support the person closest ideologically to me. My choice rarely gets the nom.So getting out and enthusiastically knocking doors for the nom in the general is what I do. We know who the real enemy is.
I didn't say anything I regretted in the primary nor have I in any primary that I remember.
I know who our real enemies are. Not fellow DU'ers nor Democrats. Thanks for offer to enlighten me but we're good!
Have a good night.
obamanut2012
(25,905 posts)He may ahve chosen at the end not to vote -- WHCIH WAS STILL A VOTE FOR TRUMP -- but for almost a year, he did nothing but attack Obama and Hillary, and support TRump over HRC. I am on his FB friends list -- I read this garbage for months.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)Well, I will have to take your word for it then because I also read FB and no one was talking smack about anyone but Trump as far as I recall.
Last DU Journal post:
HEADS UP Clinton supporters
I was for Bernie. But if you're looking for something to convince people to vote for her, this is the article of the year...P.S. Non-Hill people: Read this, too. It is also the ultimate defenestration of Trump and the GOP.
https://www.democraticunderground.com/12512353821
still_one
(91,937 posts)The Supreme Court wasn't a reason?
Women's rights were not a reason?
Civil Rights were not a reason?
Healthcare was not a reason?
Workers rights were not a reason?
Social Security and Medicare were not a reason?
The environment wasn't a reason?
The differences just on those issues, between republicans and Democrats were as clear as day, and anyone who spews the garbage that the Democratic nominee didn't give us a reason to vote for her in the general election is full of it.
sheshe2
(83,319 posts)Last post.
Post Removed
https://www.democraticunderground.com/10028086007
George II
(67,782 posts)mopinko
(69,803 posts)and tho technically not a vote, since he wasnt a declared write in, just how much bigger would the popular vote margin have been w/o all these idiots and the conscience?
auntAgonist
(17,252 posts)mopinko
(69,803 posts)Weekend Warrior
(1,301 posts)After reading all of these replies it seems he didn't simply embrace that "luxury", he attacked her with his national platform as well. That part is missing from the "luxury" justification. Seems more like it was entitled luxury and an affront to each group you mentioned.
murielm99
(30,655 posts)with drivel by a banned poster.
BainsBane
(53,001 posts)who, as far as I know, has yet to take responsibility for putting the fascist in the White House.
mcar
(42,206 posts)DU was my haven, post 911, as it was for so many of us.
Pitt was a big part of that, active and fully dedicated to Democratic principles.
Then Barack Obama got elected. Pitt morphed into one of the Democratic president's chief detractors. He seemed to go out of his way to find fault.
Then came the POSUCS episode. A man who didn't bother to research medical insurance coverage for his chronically Ill wife before they moved from a large city to a rural area pitched a royal fit when he realized her meds were not covered under the new insurance. Did he blame himself? No. He called the best president of my lifetime (I'm 58), a piece of shit.
I, and other DUers, stepped in to offer advice. Within an hour of his posting his temper tantrum, his problem was solved. Still, he kept the thread going for days if not weeks, while DUs Obama haters gleefully piled on. Only then did he delete the thread and apologize in a new one.
I recall that in the new thread, his acolytes twisted themselves into pretzels to justify his egregious behavior.
Then came the 2016 primary. Enough said.
riversedge
(69,707 posts)sheshe2
(83,319 posts)He finally did.
Then came the apology thread that was not an apology.
mcar
(42,206 posts)Posting a flame bait, usually anti-Obama, thread, then deleting it. Then following up with a not quite apology thread.
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)Arazi
(6,829 posts)Beringia
(4,313 posts)It seems people really love to vent. This was a thoughtful post by William Pitt on the topic of the day. So many posts on DU are just 2 lines and just spark of an idea. We need all hands on deck to display Trump as the dangerous fool he is.
Arazi
(6,829 posts)obamanut2012
(25,905 posts)SHRED
(28,136 posts)He is that bad.
An intellectually dishonest term, the meaning of which is deliberately vague and nebulous.
BainsBane
(53,001 posts)so tirelessly to install in power.
"We love each other": a sentiment Pitt never showed toward Democrats, toward President Obama or Hillary Clinton. Nor did he show it toward the homeless DUer he threatened to beat to a pulp. He certainly didn't show it toward the poor and vulnerable whom he chose to ignore while arguing against Clinton's being elected.
It's called hypocrisy and lies. He stood against all of those values he pretends to hold now.
Trump is a fascist, and Pitt and every other person who refused to stand up to fascism by voting for Clinton last November are the Vichy Collaboration. The Nazis would not now be emboldened if not for them, and Heather Heyer would not be dead.
Not only did he refuse to stand up to fascism through his vote, he fomented its rise by using his position at Truthout to ensure Clinton lost to the fascist.
Actions matter, and we are living through the hell that self-entitled assholes like Pitt imposed on this country. While he sits safe in his Trust Fund world, those who lack his self-entitlement and privilege live in terror because of what he and other narcissists like him did to this country. Every immigrant family torn apart and even injury and death from a hate crime is on um and the rest of the Vichy Collaboration.
And if that's really what you consider thoughtful, you need a better class of reading material.
Phentex
(16,330 posts)in fact, he doubled down when called out on it. I hadn't disliked him or thought much about him until then. I couldn't figure out why he'd support them for the things they posted. Those posters were banned (although it took a long time!)
After Pitt had a daughter, he seemed to change, perhaps seeing the world as it is going to be for his little girl. I think he even wrote about it. I am not sure why he hadn't given his wife as much consideration but I am glad he started to think about it.
After that he showed his true colors again for all of the reasons you listed. That's why I posted above he has no audience here. His followers know where to find him.
WoonTars
(694 posts)So other than Heather Heyer's death, and the "fascist state he worked so tirelessly to install", what else is he responsible for?
Seriously, do you even hear yourself? Have you no decency? Have you no sense of proportion? He wrote down Bernie Sander's name on his ballot as he is legally allowed to do, and it had NO IMPACT on his state's overall
result.
This sort of unhinged vitriole is precisely what Skinner has said, "makes DU suck".
I hope you are proud of yourself.
BainsBane
(53,001 posts)Of course he does. He and every other person who voted for Trump or anyone else of course is within their rights to vote exactly as they please. This isn't a clinic on voter rights. It's about CHOICES. Do people stand up against evil--against fascism--or do they abet it.
Pitt and the rest of the Vichy collaboration did not simply stop at voting against Clinton. Pitt used his position at Truthout to argue against the election of Clinton in the general election. They spread every bit of Kremlin and GOP propaganda to ensure her defeat to Trump. They made it their fucking mission in life, and they succeeded. They got exactly what they wanted. This is their victory, the America they created, and they own every last life lost as a result.
Support for Democrats does not make DU suck. It is a requirement for membership of this site. This is not a site where Stein/Trump/Nazi party voters are welcomed equally along with Democrats. The name DEMOCRATIC, as in the party, is in the fucking title of the site.
What sucks is fascism. What sucks is cowards who not only refused to stand up to fascism but now cry victim because people like me don't put their fragile egos over the lives of those lost and jeopardized by the regime they worked to put into power.
The choice in 2016 could not have been clearer. It was obvious Trump was racist, ultra-reactionary, and fascist. Any vote against Clinton was a vote for him. That's how it works in America. Bernie was a candidate in the primary, not the GE. He told his supporters to vote for Clinton, but they refused and used him as an excuse, as cowards do. They had their own reasons for their hatred of the Democratic Party AND most importantly the Democratic voters they chose to punish through their votes, writing, arguments, and campaigning against Clinton. Hillary Clinton as an individual was the least of the issues on that ballot. Her candidacy was the only thing standing in the way of America's descent into fascism. Rather that standing up to that fascist assault, they chose to abet it.
The excuse that those votes didn't matter is the refuge of cowards. If their votes didn't matter, why did they work so hard to convince others not to vote for Clinton? If Clinton won his state, it was against his best efforts, since everything he said and did was directed toward ensuring she lost. In Michigan she lost by two voters per precinct. Are you going to claim that all of the constant posts at sites like JPR, on Twitter, on Truthout and all of social media had absolutely no bearing on those votes? That's bullshit. People don't get to devote their every breath for years on end to defeating the Democratic nominee and then claim their votes didn't matter because their entire state wasn't taken in by their LIES and Kremlin propaganda.
If you ever looked at history and thought, why didn't people stop Hitler, you need look no further. This is exactly why. Because too many refused to stand up against fascism. They put their petty animosities and egos first. The lives of those imperiled by fascists were less consequential to them compared to their bruised egos and/or anger at those same populations for refusing to defer to the white male bourgeois entitlement, the kind of entitlement that takes more offense at outrage to fascism and those who refused to stand up to it than in the violence we are witnessing around America at the hands of White Supremacists.
Your version of decency is indecent. It is refusing to stand up to evil, and then placing the egos of those who refused to stand up to that evil above its victims.
The truly repulsive thing about these defenses of so-called "progressive" Trump/Stein/ratfuck voters is that it shows a complete refusal to learn from past mistakes. It shows that they continue to put their egos over the lives of their fellow citizens, which is exactly how we got in this situation in the first place. And by refusing to acknowledge any error or responsibility and demanding that we all put their feelings first, it shows they have every intention of continuing to demand that the less privileged, affluent members of the public put them and their narcissism over their own lives. Obscene doesn't begin to describe the moral bankruptcy that such a posture reveals.
WoonTars
(694 posts)THAT is obscene.
BainsBane
(53,001 posts)those who will lose their health insurance and even die if the GOP succeeds in repealing Obamacare. The victims of hate crimes. I will add many many more. And if that is what you consider obscene, so be it. the list will only grow by the day. And if you take that personally, I can only presume you have a good reason for doing so.
For the record, I think those who voted against Clinton out of spite are infinitely worse than Trump voters who thought he would improve their lives. The former knew he was bad but willingly chose him over Clinton. They KNEW they were doing harm. They KNEW they were causing suffering. That is what I consider obscene.
Response to WoonTars (Reply #390)
Name removed Message auto-removed
Demsrule86
(68,347 posts)after publicly declaring they would not...have blood on their hands...including the blood of( but not limited to )those killed and injured in Charlottesville. If you didn't support Hillary and vote for her with words and deeds in the General...then you supported Trump.
WoonTars
(694 posts)...
Demsrule86
(68,347 posts)Screw him.
mcar
(42,206 posts)still_one
(91,937 posts)NO THANK YOU!!!
Tarheel_Dem
(31,207 posts)He secretly loves Donald Trump cuz he gets to make $$$$$ off the misery he helped create. Fuck WP.
LexVegas
(6,005 posts)ismnotwasm
(41,916 posts)Wash. state Desk Jet
(3,426 posts)I looked at that article on the link Truth out org. and I noticed at the bottom he has this thing about himself. I recall that day he came on with pos of a used car salesmen,at the time it seemed to me he was venting at a time of tragedy in his life.He actually received considerable support from DU'ers given the circumstances . And as it turned out ,as was mentioned, eloquently I must say ,within a few hours his issues were nothing at all like he imagined. So he went off the rails ! OK, so he fooled us for a while. And he's gone now.
But since he is of topic (!) I did notice this ,-
William Rivers Pitt
William Rivers Pitt is a senior editor and lead columnist at Truthout. He is also a New York Times and internationally bestselling author of three books: War on Iraq: What Team Bush Doesn't Want You to Know, The Greatest Sedition Is Silence and House of Ill Repute: Reflections on War, Lies, and America's Ravaged Reputation. His fourth book, The Mass Destruction of Iraq: Why It Is Happening, and Who Is Responsible, co-written with Dahr Jamail, is available now on Amazon. He lives and works in New Hampshire.
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By Spencer Sunshine, Truthout | Report (!)
I should think by all that he would would have an office in NY Trump tower, no, just fooling there !
internationally best selling author it says. But is it truth ?
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)On a smaller scale, DUers honed their political voices by engaging each other here. Pitt, Skinner, Andy, all the others long gone cried, fought, supported each other as citizens became activists. Some got published locally. Pitt got national attention. I remember when he and one other long gone DUer leafleted Harvard Square, one of the first instances of activism on DU after Skinner's act of creating the site as a lifeboat for shellshocked Democrats and progressives. We spoke with a singular angry voice back then. We were the 2% of Americans who did not accept Bush after 9/11 or believe the lies that led to the Iraq war. We were naysayers shouting into a maelstrom of rightwing blather. And in many ways, that has not changed.
BTW, What Pitt says about himself in his byline is how it happened. He has been under fire on DU ever since. Even before the current and ongoing minute of hate organized against him.
emulatorloo
(43,979 posts)Will was honored here for the great work he did, so please no revisionist history that he was "under fire" on DU.
His work on Iraq was stellar and much appreciated.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)It was his nickname for years. Be honest. From the start, there were people annoyed with him for their own personal reasons. They piled on when he pissed them off. When people posted his articles, someone always posted to trash his writing style and bring him down a peg.
Raven
(13,872 posts)truth to power. The purist here may not have liked what he has said and that is fine...we all have a right to our thoughts and opinions. He firmly believed that HC was the worst possible candidate to put up against DT and he was correct. He also said "bullshit" about some of what Obama did. When we get to the point of such mind purity that we don't tolerate ideas that are other than our own, we are becoming like the crowds carrying torches in Virginia. I understand that you all cannot know all that I know about William Pitt because you do not know him like I do, but, in a fight, I would be on his side and in a tempest, I'd pick his lifeboat.
For those of you who don't know who I am, I'm his mother and probably his worst critic.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)Please save me a place in the lifeboat.
emulatorloo
(43,979 posts)everybody did. He wasn't "under fire" by DU'ers. He was respected for the hard work he put in.
At some point during his evolution as a op-ed writer he lost me, but yeah people disagree. Will always remember those early days. He was of the main people who made DU such an incredible forum.
MrsCoffee
(5,801 posts)Nazis?
Holy shit.
I understand a mother's love for her child, but that was a horrible thing to say.
countryjake
(8,554 posts)Holy shit!
Reading thru this entire thread, one could come away believing that William Rivers Pitt is worse than some Nazi brownshirt or a Fascist bastard and such despicable accusations are what are truly horrible.
R B Garr
(16,919 posts)was intended to influence people not to vote for her, and now look what we have. That's the point. He was not right about Hillary. Con men like Donald knew how to manipulate people with divisive rhetoric because all he had to do was look at what was being done to Hillary and copy it. It's shameful how she was maligned.
And you are misusing "purist". The "purists" are those who savage any Democrat who isn't "pure" enough to measure up to the idealists standards because they live in the real world.
In fact, your comments about torch-carriers in Virginia show you have a lot of things backwards.
nini
(16,670 posts)Tough shit.. the blood of Trump hate is on his hands like so many others who actively attacked Hillary's character because his boy didn't get the nomination. . Destroying Hillary the way he did was unhinged. Having issues with Hillary is one thing.. but he went way too far after the nominee was indeed chosen.
And I will never forget his vile comments about an ex girlfriend and threatening others here. Purist peaceful people don't do that kind of crap either.
countryjake
(8,554 posts)Add me to those who'd jump into your son's lifeboat, Raven.
I've watched Will's political thought evolve here over many years, since the day he first signed up to DU, and, let me tell you, he is one of the many young 'uns who have continually given me hope for this country of ours. You done good!
Our kids who are determined to speak out when necessary, who are able to discern that coming tempest and know when it's time to sound the clarion call...those are the ones I listen to and choose to hear. Our future depends on it.
Raven
(13,872 posts)riderinthestorm
(23,272 posts)Peace to you and Will
davsand
(13,420 posts)I'm not on DU much these days and I miss seeing the folks I've known here.
Will has had his critics over the years, no doubt. Not gonna lie, there have been times when I really wanted to rise to his defense and times when I wanted to send him to his room for a timeout. (How DARE he be a mere human!) Thing is, in all the years I've known him I have never had cause to doubt his politics or his word. He's passionate, he's outspoken, he doesn't suffer fools, but he is what he is, and makes no bones about it.
One of the reasons that I've reduced my time here is the shift in the community to an attitude I just don't recognize. Like you, I've seen all the prior squabbles unfold here, and I've seen them pass. Seems to me that in the last few years stuff isn't passing, and all the old hurts are coming back up too. There's a sourness here these days that never used to cling like it does now. Maybe I'm too sentimental, but I haven't walked away like so many others have.
I actually have come to the point of hiding entire threads here--which I never used to do--rather than leave the site in disgust. It's that bad sometimes. I almost hid this thread, in fact. In retrospect, I probably should have, but it goes against my nature to plug my ears when I'm in disagreement.
I have NEVER seen Will advocate for voting for the orange assailant. Never ever. I did see Will discuss the electoral realities of voting third party or write in. I also saw him discuss the electoral realities and if it was "safe" to protest vote where you live. Not sure why that merits the level of attack I'm seeing here, but it is making me sad.
Laura
MuseRider
(34,057 posts)He says what he says and he believes what he says and he works tirelessly to bring information to people hoping to educate them. Nobody has to agree with him but to attempt to hide everything he writes is simply stupid and short sighted and shows a lack of understanding how we learn and grow.
The only problem I have had with Will was a very long plane ride engaged in conversation with Ted Stevens because I had Will's first book, The Greatest Sedition Is Silence, in my lap intending to read it. Senator Stevens could not help himself he saw it and proceeded to talk endlessly about his thoughts. It was one LONG flight.
Other than that Will is bright and writes well and I agree with him much of the time. I am glad to know him. Nice to see you Raven.
...I do think Hillary became an excellent candidate, sullied by a wave of misogyny and opportunism regarding the email canard.
I wish more folks would have recognized the imperative to get behind our nominee.
That said, I think Will is a fine person and I appreciate his dedication to progressive causes and interests, and the passionate and often eloquent way he expresses his advocacy or dissent.
Wash. state Desk Jet
(3,426 posts)3 best selling books international acclaim,now than, can you expand on that ? Is he over billing himself ,you know for appearances ?
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)was hired to be Kusinich's press spokesperson during primaries in 2004 (way before Kusinich went rightwing). He was a DU success story. And also always had enemies. I guess dynamic characters draw friends and foes. Goes with the territory.
I have been defending people on DU who get attacked for a long time. I have a history of doing that. Maybe I defended the wrong people sometimes (BevH for one). Mostly, I was right though. Many who drove people off were often themselves later exposed as disruptors.
If I am driven off for my comments in this thread, so be it. I just feel strongly about supporting people who have carried my water in the past.
Wash. state Desk Jet
(3,426 posts)I really don't think you will be driven off . Looking at how he bills himself on truthorg one might draw the conclusion he must be doing well, book sales you know. I don't know all that much about young Pitt, what I do know is he doesn't seem to handle criticism well. And that for a writer who opens up dialog with readers is a short coming. OK so, he has issues.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)Oh right, it's not there. That would require intellectual honesty.
Beringia
(4,313 posts)But what did he say about actually voting for Trump?
obamanut2012
(25,905 posts)And, you shouldnt even vote, but if you do, vote for Stein if you could, but if not, then TRump. NEVER vote for Hillary, ever.
I AM ON HIS FRIEND'S LIST AND SAW MONTHS AND MONTHS OF HIS SHITTY POSTS LIKE THIS
This banned poster, who threatened to murder a mentally ill woman.
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)sheshe2
(83,319 posts)NH was far from a sure thing.
WoonTars
(694 posts)Specifically he wrote in Bernie Sanders in a State that Hillary won.
My entire family were Bernie supporters, but they all voted for Hillary, and we're in a very safe Dem state.
Demsrule86
(68,347 posts)WoonTars
(694 posts)His state went for Hillary, so please explain to me how his vote got Dump elected.
I'll wait...
Demsrule86
(68,347 posts)Also, those who did not for Hillary affected the popular vote ...the bigger the better as it would be more humiliating for Trump. He failed to vote for the Democratic nominee and encouraged others in states that narrowly went for Trump to vote against Hillary...thus he has blood on his hands and can screw off.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)Seeing as how there are two possible choices, it's not very complicated. It's impossible for a person to have any sort of progressive principles and not support Hillary in the last election. Unless they are insane, which in Pitt's case is certainly possible.
ucrdem
(15,512 posts)Apparently he was FFR'ed last August for an OP about Hillary, which was hidden:
https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=8086007
I can't comment on the OP, but August 9 was after the convention in July, and DU was in election mode, and there was no Hillary harp that hadn't been strummed a thousand times. So whatever he had to say had already been said to death.
Wash. state Desk Jet
(3,426 posts)You know, he mentioned the Nancy Sinatra song boots made for walking. What it looked like is the heat got turned up and he cut out and ran. I recall that rather lengthy post just prior to his cutting out.
ucrdem
(15,512 posts)He could hardly have had any illusions about what would probably happen.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)So if you want to blame someone for defending its being here, I am the one to direct the anger at today.
ucrdem
(15,512 posts)I'm not angry but the anger toward Pitt is not unmerited.
Wash. state Desk Jet
(3,426 posts)There is no assignment of blame .
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)DU has been my home for many years, but I don't agree with what happens on these threads.
Wash. state Desk Jet
(3,426 posts)And so have some of Pitt's critics. Pitt's history here run's deep and is loaded with controversy some of which is laced with praise ,even raving reviews. But some of Pitt's critics are quite knowledgeable about William Rivers Pitt and there is I dare say, some dark truths. And we must after all except the good with the bad . If you are going to post Pitt's work ,it stands to reason it is subject to criticism,or he is. The door was left open.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)but many DUers open the threads to read his articles just like I do. And many have rec'd it. I could ignore all the voices raised against him, but I choose not to do that today. I could put some on ignore, but I do choose not to do so today. DUers are of course free to ignore me if they choose to do that to me too.
Wash. state Desk Jet
(3,426 posts)The point is Pitt's work is subject to criticism as is William Rivers Pitt himself .When his work or opinion pieces are posted ,he also gains visibility. And with that comes good comments and serious criticism as well. Pitt knows how it works.There is no room for thin skins in the writers game and Pitt knows that too.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)I will go back and see if I can find any.
Wash. state Desk Jet
(3,426 posts)Here it is again,
Pitt's work is subject to criticisim as is William Rivers Pitt himself. That means on this site Pitt himself is subject to criticism as a writer and as a former member of this particular on line community.
Now, you tell me, am I right or am I wrong about that ?
DU is here to stay and the way it was is no more. ONE word-CHANGE.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)So you say "ONE word-CHANGE."
I am not sure I understand. If you mean DUers no longer believe in activism against the GOP, then that is a change I can't support. If you think DU is about picking on each other forever, insisting no one express a dissenting opinion, then that is also something I cannot support.
CHANGE is not always a good thing. I see many many people posting on this thread who were chased off this site. They are here being counted. Some things do NOT change. Look at the number of recs this thread has. Many long-absent DUers. Their views have not CHANGED. CHANGE for the worse is not change I support.
Anyway, I am not trying to pick a fight with you.
Peace out.
Wash. state Desk Jet
(3,426 posts)Participating in DU is activisim for as much or as little as it is. DU will continue to evolve because it simply must. It can seem as though change is either slow to come or it comes to fast . One would almost think at times change orders itself. One thing for certain ,ordering change is no easy task. All we can do is roll with the changes or what?
What I mean ,if nothing else exists than only change does exist.
My instincts tell me Pitt is somewhat of an opportunist. Visibility. I see the recs. And I haven't seen Pitt's presence for quite some time now.
I do see some users are not going to let old Bill Pitt kept way back there in archives.
Especially at such an opportune time, Trump in a downward tail spin and all.
But that's just opinion. I don't hate Pitt or his work, I don't even know him,nor do I read his stuff.
Starry Messenger
(32,342 posts)NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)sheshe2
(83,319 posts)JI7
(89,172 posts)JI7
(89,172 posts)Hissyspit
(45,788 posts)Yeah, it's Will Pitt's fault Trump became President. DNC, Hillary? Not so much.
Jeez...
obamanut2012
(25,905 posts)So yeah, he is part of the reason why Trump won.
Your concern against Starry is noted.
WoonTars
(694 posts)....but keep telling yourself that...
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)into a ongoing flashmob largely because of me speaking up. I tried not to respond yesterday, hoping the voices would calm down, but it is obvious that if we do not denounce those who are marked out for DU scarlet letters, we risk having to wear them ourselves.
Well, I will wear one. I backed Bernie in the primaries. I liked him after the primaries. I still like him. I voted for Hillary in the general. I stopped defending any other view after the primaries. But even my vote has been questioned on this thread, and the purity of my convictions has been questioned, and my creds as a DUer of longstanding has been questioned based on not thinking it is right to turn on other progressive voices as has happened here.
I will never understand. And I will not be silent. I have always stood up for DUers, usually admitted when I was wrong, and tried not to simply pick on other DUers with constant recriminations about something they said years ago in the heat of passion.
I have been a voice of reason and have had kneejerk responses. Appealing to people to give the Pitt character assassination a rest clearly backfired. Appealing to our better natures was a mistake.
I believe this thread exemplifies what Skinner said "makes DU suck."
Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #241)
Post removed
Starry Messenger
(32,342 posts)If one were too self-important to vote in solidarity with the oppressed in this election, one can go fuck oneself, imho.
grossproffit
(5,591 posts)Weekend Warrior
(1,301 posts)Generic Other
(28,979 posts)24/7 as you have reminded us in the past. Peace.
Weekend Warrior
(1,301 posts)It's about much more than that. That is far to simple of a statement for me or to be correctly placed upon me. That is often the case when someone tries to define others.
You and I do clearly share a defined enemy. That is Trump. As a progressive I imagine we share a lot of things in common.
JI7
(89,172 posts)posting.
but minorites are banned if they defend democrats and call out trolls like pitt.
still_one
(91,937 posts)leftstreet
(36,076 posts)If it was an actual poster
obamanut2012
(25,905 posts)She is mentally ill and homeless, and quite a few DUers know her.
And Pitt threatened to murder her, and he meant it.
Starry Messenger
(32,342 posts)Several of us were in email contact with her before she fell out of communication.
lunasun
(21,646 posts)yardwork
(61,408 posts)I'm not into hero worship of anybody. I find it particularly unpleasant when hero worship supports a person who literally threatened to murder somebody, in very graphic terms.
If anybody ever deserved to be banned from this site, that post should have done it.
I've been here since 2004, served as an old mod, new host, MIRT. Was banned myself for years and never threatened to murder anybody. Take my opinion for what it's worth.
melman
(7,681 posts)always thought he was a bit too impressed with himself, and really kind of a dick tbh, but ffs he's just a guy on the internet. The way people rant and rave about this guy is ridiculous.
Orrex
(63,083 posts)three days after they've been widely posted by other people.
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)MrsCoffee
(5,801 posts)Then maybe someone will take you seriously again.
heaven05
(18,124 posts)Last edited Sat Aug 19, 2017, 11:33 AM - Edit history (3)
on edit: I did not know or forgot that pitt voted for trump, so pitt can go to hell with his assessment of what happened in Virginia.Someone also reminded me that he was the author of Obama/used car salesman statement. He enabled this to happen, along with the idiot potus, shadow leaders bannon, miller and gorka. I stand by every word I wrote about idiot potus and hateful troika....running our country.
I knew we were in trouble when I heard bannon would be the bee pouring poisonous honey in the ear of our idiot potus. An ear by the way that wanted to hear the words of our shadow president. What a fucked up situation this culture, it's people and our nation is in....now how the hell do we remedy this and run the bugs, vermin, snakes back into their homelands. We must figure out a way to marginalize these clowns, en masse.....start by jailing as many as possible as treasonous bastards for as long as possible.
With the storm trooper(s) mobilizing across our country to raise and spread mayhem and murder at the behest of the shadow government leadership of bannon, miller and gorka pouring their poisonous words into the ear of the idiot potus I feel they want their storm troopers to raise enough hell so that martial law can be declared and they be able to take all freedoms from those not white, male, KKKristian or a supporter of mentioned.
Dangerous times.....slowly sneaking and snaking, like pitt coming here again, it's way into the fabric of american culture/true democrats to be finally normalized with an openly fascist government declaring imminent danger with all power to destroy all opposed.
Hissyspit
(45,788 posts)Good god, what a shithole of sycophancy and stupidity this place has become. Pitt, for all his faults was helping to warn why Trump could become president, and then, lol and behold, it happened.
And I voted for Hillary, so don't even start...
sheshe2
(83,319 posts)He also stated clearly in his OP on August 9th that he would not vote for her. His OP and two comments were removed and he was gone.
Hissyspit
(45,788 posts)mcar
(42,206 posts)Hissyspit
(45,788 posts)But that doesn't fit the narrative, does it?
Everyone just proving my point.
mcar
(42,206 posts)and refused to vote for the Democratic nominee. And encouraged others to do the same.
There, I fixed it for you. And I am done with the Pitt apologia nonsense.
Hissyspit
(45,788 posts)There. I fixed it for you.
obamanut2012
(25,905 posts)In teh voting booth. So, we have his own repeated words to go by.
As well as his own words threatening to murder a DUer, and his own words calling Obama a POS used car salesman.
Warrior of the Left he is not.
We have many on here we actually are warriors of the left, and I salute and laud THEM.
George II
(67,782 posts)...or primaries.
He called Obama a "piece of shit used car salesman", maybe that's why he's offering to buy a car to anyone who vouches for him.
sheshe2
(83,319 posts)He prefaced that by saying..."Fuck you Mr President...."
George II
(67,782 posts)...posted here?
sheshe2
(83,319 posts)I looked it up the other night...He ended it with Fuck you very much Mr. President. Well...lol at least he called him Mr. President.
ucrdem
(15,512 posts)and how he wasn't going to vote for her. Nothing about Trump. A lot about Sanders. Basically he was sore because his candidate lost the nomination and he drank the hemlock, no doubt under the illusion that DU would become unbearable once Hillary was elected. Didn't turn out that way but that seems to be the logic.
Another victim of CDS basically.
https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=post&forum=1002&pid=9480008
G_j
(40,366 posts)Last edited Fri Aug 18, 2017, 02:51 AM - Edit history (1)
glad to see an old DU veteran. This place is unrecognizable.
obamanut2012
(25,905 posts)Over Hillary. He said it many times, and urged people NOT TO VOTE if they wanted to vote for Hillary, because TRump would be a better President than her.
The Pitt apologists on her are amazing.
Hissyspit
(45,788 posts)Why are you arguing against something I didn't say?
Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #243)
Post removed
yardwork
(61,408 posts)This poster is FFR here because of exactly this kind of thing. Calling another poster a liar used to get hidden around here. You're posting a personal attack by proxy. Cut it out.
Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #243)
Name removed Message auto-removed
sheshe2
(83,319 posts)Wash. state Desk Jet
(3,426 posts)Last edited Thu Aug 17, 2017, 11:13 PM - Edit history (1)
45 recs. 5800 views and onward goes the discussion. The Pitt article is posted same as latest breaking news ,a few paragraphs with a direct link provided. It's been about a year now since Pitt's grand exit complete with the use of Nancy Sinatra's signature song Boots Are Made For Walking. There was no mention of the line where it says ,one of these days these boots are gonna walk all over you.But Pitt likes to write so he left that for the reader to fill in or not.
A lot has happened since last August ,a terrible lot has happened. And I imagine a lot of people are finding the way here at DU.New people. Some frustrated,scared ,even terrified. And some just good and angry. New people.
I reread Pitt's article at the link today and do you know I took a rather lengthy look at that little donation pop up this time, the last time I just x's it out ! My curiosity got to me so I clicked on the pop up and than reviewed that donation link ! You know I thought well, ain't that the truth !
Visibility ,earned or owed ? That's my thought to it at the moment.
If he earned it here some years back he tossed it down the toilet ,after all to him it was just a POS.
H2O Man
(73,308 posts)Will Pitt is outstanding. I have great respect for him.
Glad to hear from one of the finest and wisest voices ever to grace these boards. Hope all is well with you and yours. Much love!
H2O Man
(73,308 posts)I'm doing well. Hope all is good with you.
Others are getting about 25 cords of wood ready for the late summer to mid-winter sweats, and all I have to do is watch. Can't beat that!
https://www.democraticunderground.com/10029480579
G_j
(40,366 posts)brightest blessings for your ceremonies. We need your prayers.
riderinthestorm
(23,272 posts)The perpetual smearing (and obsession) of Will Pitt on DU is ridiculous.
He's gone on to a bigger audience on Facebook of several thousand friends. I'm in that circle of friends and proud of it.
I refuse to participate in alienating allies. Will Pitt is exactly the type of voter Dems can and should be reaching (and why Chuck Schumer has appointed Bernie as outreach director). We need these folks.
H2O Man
(73,308 posts)Thank you!
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)Like a lot of people who insisted only "she was flawed", he helped make it the election a squeaker. He used his influence to hurt Dems in November no matter how you look at it. It was far from a "safe vote".
riderinthestorm
(23,272 posts)His vote mattered naught to Hillary's win or loss.
And his influence isn't nearly as vast as everyone here purports lol...
Response to riderinthestorm (Reply #444)
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bettyellen
(47,209 posts)Not even close. Hope you're right that he holds little influence. Even the 3K FB followers are more than what would have swing it in his state, so I'm glad they're not all from NH too!
Response to riderinthestorm (Reply #353)
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countryjake
(8,554 posts)and I'm not talking about many rethugs or the caterwauling this current prez is so wont to do these days in his wild attacks on the media.
No, the progressive news site "Truth-Out" was lumped right along with many incredibly vile right-wing, reactionary, and hatefully bigoted outlets, all supposedly suspected of covert russian influence, and that fake news accusation was made by people who are supposedly progressives, themselves.
When that happened soon after the Election, it left a lot of us in wonder, shaking our heads in disbelief and also, anger, that Truth-Out was effectively condemned and compared to deplorable anti-Semitic, racist wingnut mouth-pieces, such as Rense, What Really Happened, Global Research, PrisonPlanet, and Infowars, by liberals.
I thank you for sharing that article here! I've never stopped reading at Truth-Out, despite whatever wickedness some may choose to blame certain of its authors for. Voicing truth to power is needed, now more than ever!
Beringia
(4,313 posts)That is hard to fathom. It seems people like to pile on when someone becomes controversial. I believe with William Pitt's extensive involvement in investigating and reporting on the Iraq war, he has his own particular view on politicians who support war or are hawkish. I go to his website and read his articles. I also think it is good to keep him on DU, because new people can be exposed to his writings.
greytdemocrat
(3,299 posts)Being exposed to Pitt has its downsides.
George II
(67,782 posts)countryjake
(8,554 posts)and decided to bring a new and improved McCarthyism back in vogue. Across this nation, liberals of all stripes commenced bantering and bickering after the Washington Post published the link to that questionable site, going after the Left, instead of attempting a much-needed recoup of all progressive forces in the wake of the defeat of Sec. Clinton.
http://www.alternet.org/media/washington-post-promotes-shadowy-website-accuses-200-publications-russian-propaganda-plants
A shady website that claims Russia is Manipulating US Opinion Through Online Propaganda has compiled a blacklist of websites its anonymous authors accuse of pushing fake news and Russian propaganda. The blacklist includes over 200 outlets, from the right-wing Drudge Report and Russian government-funded Russia Today, to Wikileaks and an array of marginal conspiracy and far-right sites. The blacklist also includes some of the flagship publications of the progressive left, including Truthdig, Counterpunch, Truthout, Naked Capitalism, and the Black Agenda Report, a leftist African-American opinion hub that is critical of the liberal black political establishment.
Called PropOrNot, the blacklisting organization was described by the Washington Posts Craig Timberg as a nonpartisan collection of researchers with foreign policy, military and technology backgrounds. The Washington Post agreed to preserve the anonymity of the groups director on the grounds that exposure could result in their being targeted by Russias legions of skilled hackers. The Post failed to explain what methods PropOrNot relied on to conclude that stories planted or promoted by the Russian disinformation campaign were viewed more than 213 million times." (Timberg also cited a report co-authored by Aaron Weisburg, founder of the one-man anti-Palestinian Internet Haganah operation, who has been accused of interfering in federal investigations, stealing the personal information of anarchists, online harassment, and fabricating information to smear his targets.)
Despite the Washington Posts charitable description of PropOrNot as a group of independent-minded researchers dedicated to protecting the integrity of American democracy, the shadowy group bears many of the qualities of the red enemies it claims to be battling. In addition to its blacklist of Russian dupes, it lists a collection of outlets funded by the U.S. State Department, NATO and assorted tech and weapons companies as allies. PropOrNots methodology is so shabby it is able to peg widely read outlets like Naked Capitalism, a leading left-wing financial news blog, as Russian propaganda operations...
~ snip ~
As scrutiny of PropOrNot increases, its credibility is rapidly unraveling. But that has not stopped Beltway media wiseguys and Democratic political operatives from hyping its claims. Fake news and Russian propaganda have become the great post-election moral panic, a creeping Sharia-style conspiracy theory for shell-shocked liberals. Hoping to punish the dark foreign forces they blame for rigging the election, many of these insiders have latched onto a McCarthyite campaign that calls for government investigations of a wide array of alternative media outlets. In this case, the medicine might be worse than the disease.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)I vowed to stay out of this thread after my initial responses, and I did so yesterday. But wrong is wrong. People want to trash DUers who carried our water for years, they can expect me to defend them.
countryjake
(8,554 posts)Your efforts are noble, Generic Other, and you're to be commended, in my book!
Response to George II (Reply #296)
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CanSocDem
(3,286 posts)Thank you for posting it.
Sadly, the lingering effects of the primary, and the stark realization that many democratic thinkers were expressing, that the messaging was off.
K&R
.
Response to Beringia (Original post)
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Orrex
(63,083 posts)WoonTars
(694 posts)...
Phentex
(16,330 posts)but you have to be good enough to not get banned. Yes, that's a double negative.
MineralMan
(146,189 posts)There is no requirement on DU that one be a professional writer. Some here are, but most are not. A lot of people make their livings as writers, but write right-wing garbage or make little sense most of the time.
Criticizing a writer does not require one to also be a professional writer. Not in any way.
WoonTars
(694 posts)Thanks for your opinion though!
Orrex
(63,083 posts)He makes his living making credulous people think that he's an erudite wordsmith.
If the current administration has taught us anything, it's the people of minimal ability can create the illusion of competence simply by securing the belief of the gullible.
But by all means, please continue reading the prattle of a poser who explicitly threatened the life of a DUer.
Hissyspit
(45,788 posts)Really, if I absolutely despised Will Pitt, I'd still think those was solipsistic slander.
Orrex
(63,083 posts)Pitt has a history of bullying and slander, and I ruffle your feathers when I point out this fact? It is to laugh.
With his repeated GBCW threads, his threats to DUers, his attacks on Obama, and his efforts to help Trump take the Whitehouse, I can see no reason why any thinking person can read his crap fondly, much less defend him.
Response to Hissyspit (Reply #335)
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With prose.....called the President of the United States a "Piece Of Shit Used Car Salesman" oh wait he prefaced that with..."Fuck You Mr President"
Thanks Orrex
betsuni
(25,119 posts)telling people things like they're "wrong and dumb in public." Good to know.
lapislzi
(5,762 posts)Mr. Pitt didn't vote for the yam. He never said he was going to vote for the yam. Never said it; didn't happen.
Starting a palaver about a tombstoned poster is an indication that some of you have too much free time on your hands. Now, you folks go outside and take a walk or something.
FarPoint
(12,206 posts)Not the days of wanting to work together.
Response to Beringia (Original post)
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H2O Man
(73,308 posts)DU should avoid being like a US prison, where a lie twice repeated becomes accepted fact.
G_j
(40,366 posts)In the past, the critical mass of DU members would demand sources, thus blatant lies were rarely allowed to flourish. It appears that critical mass is no longer.
H2O Man
(73,308 posts)versus individual, rational thinking.
FarPoint
(12,206 posts)I second that motion for a Demand to support the argument that had been presented..
FarPoint
(12,206 posts)Ya know..I so do miss DU of yesterday....
betsuni
(25,119 posts)FarPoint
(12,206 posts)Old time DU'er members do remember....Like, " The North Remembers".
betsuni
(25,119 posts)FarPoint
(12,206 posts)I look forward to his information, accurate artles and FN discussion... He was always an articulate DU'er.
PatSeg
(46,773 posts)The tone of this thread is very disappointing.
BainsBane
(53,001 posts)We all have our priorities.
R B Garr
(16,919 posts)about Hillary. Nothing good came of it. Now look what we have.
Response to Beringia (Original post)
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Demsrule86
(68,347 posts)This is Democratic underground, and he mercilessly attacked Pres. Obama before the 14 election...google it.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)Turns out he was both right as the decent man he was and wrong because they dedicated their lives to destroying him. No DUer did that except a few low post disruptors. MIRT mostly take those fools down.
I wonder what President Obama or Hillary Clinton would think of how their loyal followers are speaking out on their behalf. Both would probably be appalled at the misdirected venom.
From now on, when there are anti-Trump posts here, I hope I see the same fervor expressed against Trump from the posters on this thread!
Demsrule86
(68,347 posts)Eliot Rosewater
(31,096 posts)progressive and then vote 3rd party or not at all in a TWO party system.
VERY dumb, unless you want the GOP to win, that is.
Demsrule86
(68,347 posts)Tim Ryan was a right to lifer...a Democrat....my congressman. I voted for him and I am very pro-choice. Recently, he recanted this position...but any Democrat is better than any Republican.
Stoic
(1,200 posts)Like he's said, being in the district he votes in that went for Hillary by more than 60% he wrote in Sanders for his vote. He was careful that his vote didn't help Trump. I detested Hillary as the Democratic candidate but I voted for her in my Florida district.
The same district that now has the former REPUBLICAN governor as the Democratic representative.
Yay! Look at all the winning we have.
Demsrule86
(68,347 posts)Democrats here and vote for the Democratic candidate. I won't even read the article and support his site...but I googled some of his posts...and now have no desire to read anything else.
sheshe2
(83,319 posts)NO ONE can afford to throw their vote away.
still_one
(91,937 posts)foul name in the book.
That he is proud of not voting for Hillary, speaks volumes what he is. It doesn't matter that his town, district, or state went for Hillary.
This was the most important election of most people's lifetime, and by refusing to vote for the Democratic nominee, Pitt is saying that there was no difference between Hillary and trump, and that simply is untrue. That false equivalency is pure bullshit.
Autumn
(44,743 posts)R B Garr
(16,919 posts)I was "hinting" at it being his post. LOL,
Autumn
(44,743 posts)would post his reply. It looks like someone may have done it for him. Will would never have used that subject line in the post.
I asked for proof when you responded to my post where I stated that when Will was flagged he didn't create another sock to post here. you responded that yes he had and it had been removed in this thread. That covers it all and I have no interest in discussing a he said/ she said.
Response to Autumn (Reply #415)
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R B Garr
(16,919 posts)by MIRT as you said yourself. Posters who quoted him from Facebook were not banned, but he was. You admit that yourself when you brought up the MIRT removal.
obamanut2012
(25,905 posts)I feel special he singled me out. Actually, it is rather bizarre he singled me lout. But, he always liked to single out women from the crowd and attack them. At least he didn't say he would kill me.
to you, Pitt.
leftstreet
(36,076 posts)We love our country, we love our God, we love our flag, we're proud of our country, we're proud of who we are.
How very true. How very sad
DURec
Blue_In_AK
(46,436 posts)is exactly illustrative of why I don't frequent this place anymore. Some of you are vile.
countryjake
(8,554 posts)our community activist corp, most any and all attempts to build unity, appear to have been left by the wayside. Instead of building, it's breaking down.
You are greatly missed here, Blue!
leftstreet
(36,076 posts)sure miss your posts
good to see you here
Blue_In_AK
(46,436 posts)I wish I could stay, but my blood pressure has gone up since November and I don't need any more aggravation. Every time I peek in here ... well, you get the picture.
I do miss my old friends here, though.
SHRED
(28,136 posts)SHRED
(28,136 posts)Just an option.
G_j
(40,366 posts)NRaleighLiberal
(59,940 posts)Blue_In_AK
(46,436 posts)oberliner
(58,724 posts)Screw this guy.
Raven
(13,872 posts)Not so much because of the things being said about Will, but because so little is being said about the article he wrote which was the intended subject of the thread. I presume that the person who posted it thought it was worth reading. Covering this president over the last several months has been excruciating for Will. I've watched the process and it is like having to wade into a sewer everyday. Often, when he is done, he'll read the essay to me and I'll think "maybe this one will make a difference."
Years ago, after he wrote his first book on Iraq, which, by the way, he wrote on the porch of our cabin in the woods, I would joke and tell him that I was getting the "safe room" ready for him. Little did I know then that the threats against him and our family would become real. He doesn't talk about it much but I know they are real, his wife knows they are real. Fortunately, his daughter is too young to know, but she will.
In case anyone here thinks we live in some idyllic rural utopia, please know that Chris Cantwell lives and spews his garbage in the next town over from us. I, in my professional life, have had a number of run-ins with his ilk. They are demented and dangerous and have quite a following. So, after many of you get through venting your anger at Will Pitt, please read his essay and understand that doing what he does everyday, day after day, comes at a high cost, to him and the people he loves.
Respectfully,
Jane Pitt
ucrdem
(15,512 posts)For whatever reason Mr. Pitt refused to countenance a Clinton presidency let alone support or heaven forbid defend her candidacy. And he would have kept up the attacks after she took office, if she had. Yes, such righteousness "comes at a high cost," one we'll be paying for four years at least. No doubt he calls it conscience and is completely satisfied with it, but one can also call it intellectual lethargy. He had a perch and could have used it more responsibly, but he didn't or couldn't exert himself to think that far ahead, and instead took the well-worn path, and here we are. That's what the anger here is about.
Raven
(13,872 posts)ucrdem
(15,512 posts)please feel free to explain how.
crim son
(27,462 posts)might be guilty of the same crime.
Demsrule86
(68,347 posts)He helped elect Trump by tearing her down. Thus what are we to make of his writing after the fact?
I have no idea why this post triple posted but I deleted the extra posts...weird.
Eliot Rosewater
(31,096 posts)to liberals or Democrats
PERIOD
Demsrule86
(68,347 posts)Such folks are not our ally...and helped deliver Trump to us.
Demsrule86
(68,347 posts)he would vote for Trump.
Response to Raven (Reply #494)
Demsrule86 This message was self-deleted by its author.
Response to Raven (Reply #494)
Demsrule86 This message was self-deleted by its author.
Beringia
(4,313 posts)I have just let it go because I feel it will die out soon enough.
George II
(67,782 posts)"F--- you, Mr. President, you piece of sh*t used-car salesman. From my heart and soul, f--- you."
To be honest, I can see in a fit of frustration or anger someone saying that, but to never ever apologize and to then to double down later with similar venomous words, sorry. No pity here.
I suppose that's why he's essentially been banned (i.e., flagged for review) from DU since early August last year.
JustAnotherGen
(31,681 posts)JustAnotherGen
(31,681 posts)He has to live with the acronym he used against President Obama.
He has to live with his words he spewed against President Obama.
Words have consequences. It's a free country and one can say or write what they want.
However, your words are also subject to others 1st Amendment rights, consideration, reaction, and opinion.
Eliot Rosewater
(31,096 posts)Response to Beringia (Original post)
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bigtree
(85,915 posts)...even when it was clear no other had managed to obtain anywhere near the support Hillary had achieved.
Where is this magic Democratic primary candidate who would have bested Hillary? That's a sad fantasy.
Raven
(13,872 posts)if this thread is any indication, they won't hear it now and we will probably have 4 more years of the madman or someone just as bad.
JHan
(10,173 posts)You choose the most viable option: the option whose positions more closely aligns with yours than their opponent. Sanders was not on the ballot because he lost the primaries. Though the post you replied to is hidden I can take a guess what it was all about.
"No one on this board" - as if the world revolves around DU. Pity the millions who voted for the dem nominee , they're fucking invisible in the whole "my dude shoulda won" arguments and they numbered in the millions - 4 to be precise.
Stein and Johnson were election spoilers so failing to vote Hillary and using influence to get people to not vote for her was dumb and reckless. That's on Pitt.
Don't blame people in this thread who did the responsible thing on Nov. 8th for Trump being in the white house .
7wo7rees
(5,128 posts)Bless you and his family, always.
I called him and told him he had to come to Crawford.
He did. I have a picture of him on his 1st day there.
delisen
(6,039 posts)If only he had listened to Hillary Clinton, instead of Jill Stein?
The unwillingness to accept, acknowledge, and correct for ones own biases while presuming to be worthy of instructing and advising others has brought us generations of commentators whose utterances fall from the their lips into the toilets of history.
Too much noise, too little thought, so little self-awareness and reflection. Cafe philosophers who drone on, and on, and on.
No shame.