White nationalists are flocking to genetic ancestry tests but dont like what they find

[applegrove]

STAT at Raw Story

http://www.rawstory.com/2017/08/white-nationalists-are-flocking-to-genetic-ancestry-tests-but-dont-like-what-they-find/

"SNIP............


August 16, 2017
Eric Boodman
Posted with permission from STAT

It was a strange moment of triumph against racism: The gun-slinging white supremacist Craig Cobb, dressed up for daytime TV in a dark suit and red tie, hearing that his DNA testing revealed his ancestry to be only "86 percent European, and ... 14 percent Sub-Saharan African." The studio audience whooped and laughed and cheered. And Cobb - who was, in 2013, charged with terrorizing people while trying to create an all-white enclave in North Dakota - reacted like a sore loser in the schoolyard.

"Wait a minute, wait a minute, hold on, just wait a minute," he said, trying to put on an all-knowing smile. "This is called statistical noise."

Then, according to the Southern Poverty Law Center, he took to the white nationalist website Stormfront to dispute those results. That's not uncommon: With the rise of spit-in-a-cup genetic testing, there's a trend of white nationalists using these services to prove their racial identity, and then using online forums to discuss the results.

But like Cobb, many are disappointed to find out that their ancestry is not as "white" as they'd hoped. In a new study, sociologists Aaron Panofsky and Joan Donovan examined years' worth of posts on Stormfront to see how members dealt with the news.

..............SNIP"

[temporary311]

1. The real irony

is the only racially pure humans are mostly sub-saharan Africans. Most of the rest of us have a bit of neanderthal dna.

[applegrove]

2. Sub-saharan people are much more genetically diverse than people who emigrated from africa 100,000

years ago. And I think there were non homo sapien sapiens mixed in with all different populations of homo sapiens sapiens. We are all muts. Thank god. That is why we thrive everywhere.

[trixie2]

31. Yes and don't forget the Denisovan

I never met a map I didn't love!

[Duppers]

71. Cool map!

Thank you.

[Maven]

3. These people claim to be the 'master race', yet prove their inferiority at every turn

What a bunch of rejects.

[PSPS]

6. Tyson's animated image must have induces a seizure or hypnotized them. Just an accident!

[Maraya1969]

10. How do you know a post was alerted unless you are on a jury?

[yardwork]

11. I was on the jury.

[applegrove]

21. I read it wrong and alerted. I guess, with all the Nazi stuff on the news

I am primed to see Nazis.

[yardwork]

40. Oh, that's a relief. I understand. No harm done.

[GulfCoast66]

22. WTF!??

Well, it shows the jury system worked.

[applegrove]

25. I read it wrong and alerted. I guess, with all the Nazi stuff on the news

I saw a Nazi where there wasn't one.

[GulfCoast66]

29. Very big of you to admit it. Have a nice night. nt

[Maven]

24. Wait, really?

Um, okay.

[applegrove]

27. I read it wrong and alerted. I guess, with all the Nazi stuff on the news

I was primed and saw a Nazi lurking where there was not one.

[Maven]

30. That's some trigger finger you got there!

All good.

[applegrove]

33. I feel bad. I am jumpy today.

[Maven]

34. Don't feel bad. We are all on edge, understandably so.

It was a simple mistake.

[applegrove]

36. Thanks.

[yardwork]

41. I will self-delete my post above. Thanks for letting us know.

[applegrove]

46. No need. Maybe others can learn from it.

[Drahthaardogs]

48. As a descendent of Rome, I say

Your race must have ruled the world for at least 100 years before you can even think of calling yourself the master race.

As my Italian father told his German brother in law, "My people had flushing toilets while yours were still fighting over the deer hide."

[hatrack]

60. Reminds me of a great quote from Disraeli

He was questioned on the floor of Commons about his ancestry, something to the effect of "Is it not so that the right honorable gentleman is, indeed, of the Jewish persuasion?"

Disraeli responded "The right honorable gentleman is entirely correct - while his ancestors were painting themselves blue and roaming the fens of East Anglia, mine were building the Temple of Jerusalem."

[dalton99a]

4. Great article.

[Warpy]

7. "Surprised by DNA test" is now a thing over at You Tube

and I confess, I did watch a couple of the group tests. Funny, most of the Europeans were part something else, with a majority showing Ashkenazi Jewish as a component.

I haven't done it yet, my own family ran to sailors, scholars, and itinerant musicians and the women were foreigners who took a chance on a passing stranger rather than end up like their mothers. I know I'm a mutt.

I've always thought the "racial purity" types were kidding themselves--a lot.

[jalan48]

8. My understanding is that humans originated in Africa.

That would mean that all these Neo-Nazis share their African background with all other human beings on the planet.

[Maraya1969]

9. 23AndMe testing company has me at 99% European. I was a little disappointed.

I guess I wanted to have some African Heritage in me. But now that I think about it many of the American Nazis have black heritage because they were here during the slave years and a lot of white men raped black women back then.

I thinking of Thurgood Marshall too and how many times white men must have had clandestine relationships with black women. Plus most black people in this country are lighter skinned than their African ancestors. There has been a lot of mixing of the races here in the melting pot.

My family only came here, from Eastern Europe about 3-4 generations ago. My dad was from Canada and there were no slaves up there, (that I know of).

I think the longer your family has lived in the US the more chance you have of having African descent

[applegrove]

12. There were slaves in Canada. But it was british and went into antislavery at the start of the

Last edited Thu Aug 17, 2017, 12:22 AM - Edit history (1)

19th Century when Britain did. There were not hundreds of thousands of them. We did much the US did including genociding indigenous people. We did other stuff like had the Catholic Church control the french speaking people. We were all assholes.

[Maeve]

44. Family has been here since 1750

so I was hoping for some interesting findings...but genetically, I could pass for a native of the British and Irish Isles, just a touch of Scandenavia, a bit western Europe and a tad from the Iberian penninsula. Dang! I feel so white-bread!

[al bupp]

76. What an awesome sentiment. I think we could be related. /nt

[Pacifist Patriot]

77. Don't know your gender, but...

more than happy to call you brother or sister!

[shanti]

57. I think it has something to do

with whether or not many of your ancestors lived south of the mason-dixon line. I also tested at 23nme and came out at 99.1% mostly northwestern European, with .07% NA, and .01% "Unassigned". (They didn't explain or include the missing .01%). Only one line of mine was southern, from Northern Kentucky via Virginia. The rest were all European immigrants arriving between 1850-1880, or were from pre-colonial New England. My brother and sister also took the test and their results were roughly the same, although my brother listed at 100% European and did not show the NA.

My ex took the DNA test, and his maternal line was almost all southern white, something he already knew. But the test came back about 5% African. He also didn't know the true identity of his birth father before he took the test, believing it was the man his mother told him it was. Well, it wasn't. At all. His father was found to be Mexican American, which the original assumed birth father was not. It's very possible that some of the AA DNA was from his birth father though.

The 23nMe forums make for some interesting discussions!

[linuxman]

13. According to many on this site, that means he's actually incapable of racism.

[kcr]

16. Well, don't hold back.

Do you agree with these supposed many DUers who supposedly make this wild claim?

[Kingofalldems]

23. Nice attack on DU.

[GulfCoast66]

26. Man!

You must really be carrying a rock in your pocket on this issue.

[BostonianMagi]

14. Anyone who would assume a 'lily-white' ancestry

is a complete fool. My father once told me during a genealogy project for school to 'not look too closely at our family tree' for fear that I might find something that would offend who I thought was. He assumed because of the fact that we live in the South that I might have a hard time (and I have some cousins who WOULD have a hard time with it) with what it revealed. I found it funny because I was just curious and didn't care how much of various 'races' I would be a mix of.

It astounds me that people care.

Magi

[applegrove]

15. I enjoyed finding out we were part Neanderthal. I wish there was more variety

actually. I had quite a bit of eastern European ancestry which was no surprise. But I'd like more detail.

[kcr]

19. That is so cool

That is the one thing that made change my mind to where I might consider doing one of those tests. Learning I could find out if I have Neanderthal ancestry.

[applegrove]

20. It is neat. I think if you have red hair in your family that implies Neanderthal

DNA. So that's a clue.

[safeinOhio]

39. Mine said I have

Have 63 pecent more Neanderthal traits than all others tested. What ever that means.

[hatrack]

61. Well, my beard was red when i had one . . .

So that would make me . . . Ron Perlman?

[linuxman]

32. I was told the same thing.

I took a DNA test a couple months ago. 100% European. I wondered what he meant.

[trixie2]

35. My mom always said that no one will be free until all the races are mixed

[phylny]

17. Yup. Hundreds of years ago, my ancestors were Italian or Greek,

and thousands of years ago they were from Northern Africa, Middle East - Syria, Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Oman, Yemen, United Arab Emirates (UAE), Lebanon, Israel. It's literally in my DNA

To look at me, I'm a blue-eyed, brown-haired (well, gray now), white woman. Doesn't it make sense that we are all from other places?

[applegrove]

18. I actually did a DNA test that showed my northern European ancestors

went from Africa, to the middle east, to India, then through Russia to Europe.

[eShirl]

28. dumbasses

genetic diversity is a good thing

[Grammy23]

42. Not if you believe that some DNA

is better, higher quality than others. These dumb bunnies don't have a clue but have convinced themselves that having a "pure", untainted DNA somehow makes them superior to someone with a lot of diversity in their DNA. Imagine their shock when they find out they are Hines 57 Variety! No wonder they claim those DNA services are inaccurate. Delicate little buttercups, aren't they?

[itsrobert]

37. Lots of wars in the world

Part of war was the "spoils" were the men were killed and the women were raped. Hard to believe anyone is "pure"

[McCamy Taylor]

38. I'm 3% African off the Slave Coast and No Native American.

Meaning that my (white) southern family's claim that my exotic looking great grandmother was "Cherokee" was probably a lie to cover up her real ancestry.

They did not take the news well.

[crosinski]

51. My husband is 5% African From the Ivory Coast with family from the south.

He also has a 'Cherokee' great grandmother story that wasn't true either.

Guess that Cherokee story got told a lot.

[bora13]

43. the fun begins

when they find jewish ancestry.
I actually found that I have 1% Jewish in me.
Glad there are no Nazi's around to check up on that.
Oh wait, there are.

[pansypoo53219]

56. my mom got 5% in hers. her brother has 2%, so on the female side.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

45. NEW racial standard among white nationalists (e.g. Fields' group) is 80% Caucasian (European)

James Fields, the murderer who rammed the crowd with his car, was not actually a member of Vanguard, but was accepted among them at the racist rally as a fellow traveler (recycling the old phrase).

Irizarry, whom the ADL also identifies as the group’s leader, said Vanguard has a centralized application procedure. Its website — removed from its host Monday and republished on another host as of Tuesday morning — lists requirements, saying members must be “at least 80% White/European heritage,” and that the group prohibits “homosexuals, transsexual, adulterers, or any other form of sexual degeneracy,” as well as criminals and those with addictions.

-- WaPo article

It's interesting because Irizarry is a Basque name from the Iberian peninsula (Spain/Portugal/Castilian). The WaPo is using his family name even though he legally changed it to Hopper to appear to be more white.

[flibbitygiblets]

47. No adultery, gays or addictions allowed, but they're cool with murder?

Fine group of people you guys got there, as 45 said without a trace of sarcasm.

[Mariana]

58. Hey, everybody's gotta have priorities.

It's funny as hell that 45, being a sexual degenerate, would be rejected by this group according to their rules.

[Wounded Bear]

68. Well, killing gays and POC is hardly murder, you know...

I hope everybody knows that is

[anneboleyn]

75. Yes, they support the infamous Varg Vikernes who killed his bandmate in the early 90s and since

he got out of jail spends his time making white nationalism videos on YouTube and apparently living off the gov in France. Varg is the Norwegian dude who claimed to invent Norwegian black metal or whatever it's called and allegedly burned down some of Norway's beautiful medieval wooden churches before killing his bandmate. They love him. What a hero.

[Thor_MN]

49. This 100% European says they can go F themselves.

81% Scandihoovian with another 9% Finn, the rest Western Europe and British Isles.

All my immigrant ancestors came to the Us from Norway or Sweden. The Finland was by way of Sweden, no clue where the Western Europe/British Isles comes into play, but it was probably trade rather than conquest, my people were dirt poor farmers, not Vikings.

I know all but one set of 3rd great grandparents by name and 3/4ths of my 4th great grandparents.

I did find that the guy that sits next me at work is related by a marriage in 1758, by helping him with his tree.

[sandensea]

50. Reminds me of J. Edgar Hoover.

Who, famously, was part Black on his mother's side - but spent his entire life attacking that part of himself by persecuting Black activists.

Hardly the only thing he hated about himself.

[guillaumeb]

52. So their "pure white genes" are in fact mixed with other genes?

what is a pure Aryan superman to do when he finds out his blood is not pure Aryan?

Recommended.

[IrishEyes]

54. My mom did that test.

I found out that my ancestors came from Ireland. Shocking. My father hasn't done the test but his family all came from Ireland in the late 1800s and early 1900s.

Europe -- 99%
Ireland 62%
Great Britain 18%
West Europe 14%

European traces -- 5%
Scandinavia 3%
East Europe 1%
Italy/Greece <1

Other traces -- 1%
Caucasus <1%

[Bradshaw3]

55. These tests are interesting but in the end we all have the same mother

I read where if you go back like 40 generations you have a million grandparents. Many people think of lineage mostly in patrilineal terms but we derive our genes from many sources and, while past family history is interesting to me and many others, we all are born of the same mother: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitochondrial_Eve

[GeoWilliam750]

65. 20 generations actually

Roughly 600 years. At 900 years, it becomes a billion, and at 1,200 years a trillion.

There sure were a lot of people back then.

[Warren DeMontague]

59. Dumbasses. The more genetic diversity, the healthier the population, generally speaking

Inbreeding is a shortcut to all manner of problems, vulnerabilities, weaknesses and disease.

Look at dogs, or European royalty.

[applegrove]

62. Exactly.

[hatrack]

63. Ever hear of Fumarase Deficiency? AKA "Mormon Downs"

To your point re. inbreeding:

A polygamous, Mormon community in Utah is facing what has been labelled a “genetic disaster”. Children born into the remote Utah community of the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (FLDS) are a million times more likely than the average person to develop a rare, debilitating genetic disorder, the BBC reports.

Doctors claim they have discovered 20 cases of the disorder – which can cause seizures, facial deformities, and severe brain damage – in the Utah FLDS community. Previously, they knew of just 13 cases in the world.

EDIT

According to local historian Benjamin Bistline, 75 to 80 per cent of people in Short Creek are related to two of the community’s founders, Joseph Jessop and John Barlow. Now, researchers know that either Mr Jessop or his first wife, Martha Yeates, carried a gene for fumarase deficiency – an inherited metabolic disorder that attacks the nervous system, often with debilitating effects.

The disease is extremely rare because it is recessive, meaning both parents need to carry faulty copies of the gene for their child to inherit it. Scientists put the odds of inheriting fumarase deficiency at one in 400 million. But in a community like FLDS – where most people are polygamous, and the majority are related – the chance of inheriting two faulty genes is much higher. Researchers estimate that thousands of people living in Short Creek currently carry the gene.

EDIT

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/mormon-polygamists-utah-genetic-disorder-fumarase-deficiency-fundamentalist-church-of-jesus-christ-a7875671.html

[Warren DeMontague]

72. I wasn't familiar with that exact situation, no. Interesting.

Yeah, case in point, precisely.

[Warren DeMontague]

64. I did mine. Most of it lined up with what I knew, but there were some surprises.

Like the 1% "mystery DNA"

i'm choosing to believe it's extraterrestrial.

[hatrack]

67. So, you're not saying it's aliens . . .

. . . but it's aliens?

[Warren DeMontague]

69. HAVE YOU SEEN MY HAIR?

Do the math, man

[intheflow]

66. What's really funny is that DNA testing is about the human genome.

And these idiots don't believe in genetics, since they think people with different skin colors are sub-human.

[Historic NY]

70. Its Mitochondrial Eve....

the common ancestor of all humans she comes out of Africa

[crosinski]

73. Eve's daughter 'V'

I inherited mtdna V from my mother. National Geographic and Ancestry narrowed it down to Skolt Sammi, or Russian reindeer herder. I've been trying to get Reindeer Moss established in our yard ever since, but no luck, so reindeer have not shown up yet. Dang-it!

[applegrove]

74. How cool is that!