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white_wolf

(6,238 posts)
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 02:34 PM Jul 2012

Top 10 Worst States to Retire In. All but 1 are Southern conservative states.

I found this link on comcast's site, its a list by bankrate, here they are if you all don't want to click the link:

1. Louisiana
2. Georgia
3. New Mexico
4. Texas
5. Arkansas
6. Tennessee
7. South Carolina
8. Mississippi
9. Alabama
10. Kentucky.

(Note: I don't think these are ranked in any order from best to worst or anything like that.)

Here is the link: http://www.bankrate.com/finance/retirement/worst-states-for-retirement.aspx?ec_id=cmct_002_HP_mainlink-test#slide=1

83 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Top 10 Worst States to Retire In. All but 1 are Southern conservative states. (Original Post) white_wolf Jul 2012 OP
And mostly god-fearing places too. I guess god doesn't care much for retirees. n/t RKP5637 Jul 2012 #1
Here in Tennessee it feels like there is literally a church on every corner. white_wolf Jul 2012 #3
They just built a church here, KS, so big I bet it's a rival to the RKP5637 Jul 2012 #5
Same here in North Georgia, just northwest of Atlanta. n/t RebelOne Jul 2012 #23
In SC there is too. nt raccoon Jul 2012 #42
I am retired in Milwaukee. mysuzuki2 Jul 2012 #50
well, you know, "opiate of the masses" phantom power Jul 2012 #27
I love your sig line!!! So true!!! "But these are times of madness, dressed RKP5637 Jul 2012 #30
IMO more churches = less desirable nt msongs Jul 2012 #2
More sinners need more churches, I guess. nt DocMac Jul 2012 #13
With all that prayer going on, one would think these would be really good times! n/t RKP5637 Jul 2012 #31
Personally, I prefer more strip clubs and package stores near schools. SlimJimmy Jul 2012 #49
Guess it depends on what your looking at. Most of those states are sinkingfeeling Jul 2012 #4
The stats the list I cited used to measure were: white_wolf Jul 2012 #6
I recently tried to find a cheaper place to live state/city. It was an RKP5637 Jul 2012 #10
Yeah, I'm betting you didn't have too much luck. white_wolf Jul 2012 #12
Vermont is a beautiful place to live, I've been there a number of times over RKP5637 Jul 2012 #14
What was the best spot you saw? tia uponit7771 Jul 2012 #39
Montpelier was the area I was mostly in ... I recall well just getting there RKP5637 Jul 2012 #44
I'm In Vermont (Not Retired, Yet) Tace Jul 2012 #35
Misleading. dixiegrrrrl Jul 2012 #67
Don't let that fool you -- I lived in AL on a rural route near a VERY small town -- we got burgled Nay Jul 2012 #78
A good loud dog and a shotgun. I hear ya.Works a treat most of the time. dixiegrrrrl Jul 2012 #79
Here are the "10 Best" from AARP KansDem Jul 2012 #7
Because they're pretty? Neoma Jul 2012 #11
And none of them are liberal, some cities are, but it seems so often the RKP5637 Jul 2012 #15
Somebody didn't think things through very well Warpy Jul 2012 #19
Yes, FL has A/C... but heating costs are almost zero. HooptieWagon Jul 2012 #33
+1 uponit7771 Jul 2012 #40
TN here Tsiyu Jul 2012 #34
+1 Go Vols Jul 2012 #72
A vastly cheaper housing market 4th law of robotics Jul 2012 #55
Retirees are cantankerous? 4th law of robotics Jul 2012 #54
AARP had the war criminal Bush on their cover so AARP is full of lying whores just1voice Jul 2012 #66
Tennessee is top state to retire in Go Vols Jul 2012 #8
According to the list I cited, Tennessee has the following: white_wolf Jul 2012 #9
No offense meant to anyone, but these states I wouldn't even want to RKP5637 Jul 2012 #16
I live in TN, I want to drive out of it and never come back, but that's it. white_wolf Jul 2012 #17
NYC is a cool place. I grew up not too far from NYC and also used to RKP5637 Jul 2012 #22
Is there a state that is socially liberal and pro business? FarCenter Jul 2012 #18
Only in my mind. I've longed for something like that, but I sure never RKP5637 Jul 2012 #28
got all of those except low taxes KurtNYC Jul 2012 #48
New Hampshire fits that bill. LAGC Jul 2012 #52
I have relatives in Boston, and NH seems definitely a possibility FarCenter Jul 2012 #62
Switzerland nichomachus Jul 2012 #57
Oregon?? NMDemDist2 Jul 2012 #60
Would Oregon be more pro-business than Washington FarCenter Jul 2012 #61
.... NMDemDist2 Jul 2012 #64
But there's no sales tax in Oregon. wickerwoman Jul 2012 #75
74.8 % of all statistics deaniac21 Jul 2012 #20
The link I posted gives the sources for the stats cited. n/t white_wolf Jul 2012 #21
Please reference reply #20 deaniac21 Jul 2012 #24
Oh yeah, where did you get that stat? 4th law of robotics Jul 2012 #56
I made it up on the spot. Are you slow to catch on? deaniac21 Jul 2012 #69
I was joking . . . 4th law of robotics Jul 2012 #70
I think I was drunk........... deaniac21 Jul 2012 #81
I live in Georgia and I love it. RebelOne Jul 2012 #25
annotated rant.... frankroberts Jul 2012 #26
That made me laugh. Great rant n/t. white_wolf Jul 2012 #29
Very juvenile. cordelia Jul 2012 #63
what? frankroberts Jul 2012 #71
I don't give a fuck about the language. cordelia Jul 2012 #74
oh frankroberts Jul 2012 #80
This is absurd. Low life expectancy doesn't mean if you move there you'll die. nolabear Jul 2012 #32
I like Kentucky, but I already live in Pennsyltucky so it wouldn't be much of a change. HopeHoops Jul 2012 #36
now I wonder how NM got itself in that rogues' gallery? mitchtv Jul 2012 #37
Another way choose SDjack Jul 2012 #38
South Dakota taxes food and there are local sales taxes. libinnyandia Jul 2012 #53
I was reading recently that Oklahoma was one of the best madokie Jul 2012 #41
No place on that list I'd want to retire to. GoneOffShore Jul 2012 #43
Another reason the south is popular for retirees... HooptieWagon Jul 2012 #45
In the South, I spend half of the year indoors during the summer! amandabeech Jul 2012 #73
Here in south central Montana with the climate change the sorefeet Jul 2012 #46
stop attacking the South, don't confuse me with facts and statistics! quinnox Jul 2012 #47
So, tell me all about the quality of life of Philidelphia in February? SlimJimmy Jul 2012 #58
Reasons WHY we moved to the Ouachita Mountains of Arkansas for early retirement: bvar22 Jul 2012 #51
Beautiful place. Enjoy! virgogal Jul 2012 #59
Ouchita Mountains EffieH Mar 2013 #82
Hi. bvar22 Mar 2013 #83
South Carolina? Somebody needs to... GoCubsGo Jul 2012 #65
I love Los Angeles We are Devo Jul 2012 #68
I been to them all riverbendviewgal Jul 2012 #76
So much about what makes a state or locality desirable is in the eye of the beholder. SheilaT Jul 2012 #77

white_wolf

(6,238 posts)
3. Here in Tennessee it feels like there is literally a church on every corner.
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 02:40 PM
Jul 2012

Hell, in some parts I'm not exaggerating, there really is a new church every few miles.

RKP5637

(67,030 posts)
5. They just built a church here, KS, so big I bet it's a rival to the
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 02:44 PM
Jul 2012

crystal cathedral, and complete with an attached indoctrination center (I guess they call it a school).

Yep, there's big money, really big money, in Religion, Inc. Around here they want 10% of your income each year. I bet some even more, you know, buy early, reserve a spot in heaven, guaranteed late arrival.





mysuzuki2

(3,521 posts)
50. I am retired in Milwaukee.
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 06:01 PM
Jul 2012

We have more than our share of churches but they are outnumbered by bars and pubs. In Milwaukee there is a bar on every corner and the churches only every other One of the many reasons I like living here!

RKP5637

(67,030 posts)
30. I love your sig line!!! So true!!! "But these are times of madness, dressed
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 03:57 PM
Jul 2012

in good suits.
--Paul Krugman"

white_wolf

(6,238 posts)
6. The stats the list I cited used to measure were:
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 02:44 PM
Jul 2012

Crime rate, percentage of retirees living in poverty, life expectancy. If you are worried about low taxes, then all three of those probably won't bother you that much since if you obviously won't be in poverty if you are rich, you can probably afford good healthcare for life expectancy, and you can live in a nice part of town to avoid crime.

RKP5637

(67,030 posts)
10. I recently tried to find a cheaper place to live state/city. It was an
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 02:53 PM
Jul 2012

eye opener for me, traveling around the US it really sank in how many places have really turned into sh**holes for places to live unless you really want to spend a fair amount of money to "live in a nice part of town to avoid crime."

And then in some places when you try to get out of the city the real estate taxes go way up because there is not that much industry to help support the infrastructure of the small town.



white_wolf

(6,238 posts)
12. Yeah, I'm betting you didn't have too much luck.
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 02:55 PM
Jul 2012

Though, I've always thought Vermont seemed like a nice place to retire. I know very little about it, it just seems nice and peaceful.

RKP5637

(67,030 posts)
14. Vermont is a beautiful place to live, I've been there a number of times over
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 02:57 PM
Jul 2012

the years, but it can be pretty expensive. Yep, I had no luck at all.

RKP5637

(67,030 posts)
44. Montpelier was the area I was mostly in ... I recall well just getting there
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 05:12 PM
Jul 2012

was a beautiful drive. I was coming up from Boston, MA where I lived at that time.


Tace

(6,800 posts)
35. I'm In Vermont (Not Retired, Yet)
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 04:22 PM
Jul 2012

It's a great place in a lot of ways. However, taxes are high, and, some of the winters can be daunting.

I'll recommend Vermont for retirement, with the caveat that the retiree should get a place that doesn't require massive snow removal. You've really got to love winter to be happy here.

There are dozens (hundreds) of lovely villages that can offer a nice, quiet lifestyle. Church/school dinners, high school sports events, etc.

That said, I'm not sure I will retire here. : )

dixiegrrrrl

(60,010 posts)
67. Misleading.
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 09:54 PM
Jul 2012

There are only 4 large cities in Ala. and most of the crime reports come from the urban areas.
But 80% of the state is rural with lots and lots of small towns, where most
"crime" is meth busts and DUI's and passing bad checks, all drug/alcohol issues. And I can tell you that there is not much worry about crime in the small towns.

The cost of housing here is 50% lower than the cost of similar housing on the coasts.
Lots of people have homes that have been passed down to them ( home ownership is still high here)
AND
for retirees, there is NO propety tax after age 65.

The Federal poverty guidelines for a family of 2 ( most retirees are a couple) is $15,130.
One person would have to be getting only a monthly income of 700.00 to qualify for the poverty level guideline.
And those low figures would be reflecting a racial disparity.
Most retirees get Medicare, thus have affordable health coverage.

Overall, I disagree with the parameters of the report. We find it very affordable and extremely rewarding to be living out our retirement in our Ala. home.





Nay

(12,051 posts)
78. Don't let that fool you -- I lived in AL on a rural route near a VERY small town -- we got burgled
Wed Jul 18, 2012, 05:06 PM
Jul 2012

several times. Plants in pots taken from our back porch, plants CUT or DUG UP from the front garden, rakes/shovels/metal detector/lawn mower stolen from a shed, and to top it all off, one day we returned home in the early evening to find our dog in a total frenzy in the front yard. Barking, running around, etc. We didn't see anything or anyone, so we retired for the evening after we calmed him down. In the light of the morning, we could see a front window screen bent and almost pried off; our dog and, probably, our arrival, had interrupted a burglary in progress.

Oh, and I forgot to mention the time when I was alone one evening at dusk; the house lights were off, Mr Nay and Sonny Nay had taken the car so the carport was empty, and I was enjoying gazing out the front window. A car with its lights off pulled into the driveway and sat there. I took the rifle (loaded) and stepped out into the carport with it -- those guys took off backwards so fast they slammed into the ditch. They did manage to drive out of it at top speed and get away. Another robbery foiled.

Ah, shit, one more thing. I just happened to be home from school one day and noticed a beat up truck and a bunch of guys across the road who were measuring my trees. Called the cops, but the one local cop was off and the staties were going to take an hour to respond. When I saw the chainsaws come out, I took the rifle and the dog down there and chased them off, too.

Rural Alabama is FULL of petty and not-so-petty crooks and thieves of all types.

dixiegrrrrl

(60,010 posts)
79. A good loud dog and a shotgun. I hear ya.Works a treat most of the time.
Wed Jul 18, 2012, 07:06 PM
Jul 2012

What we often read in our local paper is " so and so was arrested for stealing Farmer John's backhoe when someone noticed it being driven down the county road at 5 am and called the police".

copper pipes and anything that can be sold for metal is the usual stuff that gets taken, here.
But people usually get caught because there are dozens of eyes watching out for anything that looks unusual in the area.

The "crime rate" that is reported in statistics usually covers the felonies..murder, shootings, rapes, etc.
Most of that is cement city stuff. Not saying ALL of it, mind, but tis highly unusual to have that in my town.

KansDem

(28,498 posts)
7. Here are the "10 Best" from AARP
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 02:47 PM
Jul 2012

...according to Money-Rates.com--
10. Kansas
9. Tennessee
8. South Dakota
7. Mississippi
6. Virginia
5. Louisiana
4. Iowa
3. Oklahoma
2. Kentucky
1. Texas

http://www.aarp.org/work/retirement-planning/info-09-2010/10-best-rated-states-for-retirement.2.html

I don't know: Texas, Louisiana, Tennessee, Kentucky, and Mississippi are on both lists...

RKP5637

(67,030 posts)
15. And none of them are liberal, some cities are, but it seems so often the
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 02:59 PM
Jul 2012

states on these lists are not liberal at all.

Warpy

(110,900 posts)
19. Somebody didn't think things through very well
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 03:24 PM
Jul 2012

Retirees are generally living on pretty limited funds. All those states require megabucks in electrical costs every summer for cooling and many require heating in winter, too.

Personally, I looked at areas with cheap heating and cooling, proximity to amenities, housing and food costs and the existence of public transit, and a decent ambient culture. It's why I ended up in low rated NM instead of higher rated Texas.

Offhand, though, I'd say one of the best places right now is Florida. The state is in a depression and housing prices are at rock bottom. Food prices are generally pretty low since it's a major agricultural, fishing, and cattle area (yes, CATTLE). In addition, the state provides a lot of recreational amenities.The only major screw job is in air conditioning.

And once enough thinking people move there, the GOP will be kicked out of government and the economy will start to improve.

Tsiyu

(18,186 posts)
34. TN here
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 04:07 PM
Jul 2012

Edit to add: Nearly all our new neighbors are from Florida...



Our electricity is by a wonderful Co-op. I own my little part. I pay around $50 in summer, but live more simply than most. $150-200 in the winter, but hope to change to an outdoor furnace and passive solar.

Land, taxes, food and entertainment costs are low here, moderate commute to cities but not horrible. Few services but good neighbors.

No traffic, pretty scenery, easygoing, when a funeral passes, everyone pulls over to the side of the road. Everyone.


If you want to live with a lot of shopping, easy access to high quality medical care and heavy zoning, it wouldn't be for you. If you're relatively healthy, like nature and an easygoing lifestyle and don't care about shiny cars and the latest fashions, you'd fit right in.

 

4th law of robotics

(6,801 posts)
54. Retirees are cantankerous?
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 06:21 PM
Jul 2012

Might explain it.

Or maybe they're ranking it by entirely different metrics.

 

just1voice

(1,362 posts)
66. AARP had the war criminal Bush on their cover so AARP is full of lying whores
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 08:06 PM
Jul 2012

I wouldn't believe a thing they ever print.

Go Vols

(5,902 posts)
8. Tennessee is top state to retire in
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 02:47 PM
Jul 2012

according to The Wall Street Journal,with most in top ten being in the south.

Tennessee

It’s not what you think. Yes, warm weather states are in general the best places to which to retire in the U.S. And Florida—as always—is on the list. But the Sunshine state is no longer the absolute best place for retirees, according to research just completed by TopRetirements.com. That title now belongs (Pull up a rocking chair and a glass of Jack and cola if you want) to Tennessee. (At left, Graceland in Memphis.) That’s right; retirees might consider waltzing first to the Volunteer state for their golden years, according to John Brady, the president of TopRetirements.com. Why so? Well, Tennessee ranked highest among all 50 states based on Brady’s analysis of such factors as taxes on all types of income (Tennessee taxes only interest and dividends), property taxes, climate, cost of living and senior health-care costs. What’s more, the state really wants retirees to sit for a spell and then some. For instance, the state recently launched a campaign to attract retirees called Retire Tennessee. That campaign features a website chock full of reasons to move to Tennessee: one being that the state has the lowest cost of living in the U.S. Now it should come as no surprise that southern states, Tennessee being the most northern of them, dominated TopRetirements.com’s 2012 list of best states to which to retire. But what might come as a surprise are the states that followed Tennessee.


http://articles.marketwatch.com/2012-06-07/finance/32080870_1_property-taxes-southern-states-income-tax

white_wolf

(6,238 posts)
9. According to the list I cited, Tennessee has the following:
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 02:52 PM
Jul 2012

a crime rate of 4,2712.2 per 10,000, 9.7% of retirees living below poverty, life expectancy of 76.2. Granted, a lot of it comes down to what you are looking for. If you are poor you may not want to retire here, because we have an extremely regressive tax system that taxes food of all things.

RKP5637

(67,030 posts)
16. No offense meant to anyone, but these states I wouldn't even want to
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 03:03 PM
Jul 2012

drive through much less retire there.

white_wolf

(6,238 posts)
17. I live in TN, I want to drive out of it and never come back, but that's it.
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 03:10 PM
Jul 2012

When I graduate I'm so moving to NYC or maybe L.A., but the one time I visited New York City I loved it.

RKP5637

(67,030 posts)
22. NYC is a cool place. I grew up not too far from NYC and also used to
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 03:47 PM
Jul 2012

work there from time to time for the companies I worked for. I never lived directly in NYC, but sure spent a lot of time there. I used to know Manhattan like the palm of my hand.

The city goes 7x24 and one can do almost anything in the world. Some people say it's not a friendly city, but I also sometimes don't find some parts of America too friendly, large or small. I never had any problem in NYC.

For me, I would pick NYC over LA, but that's probably just me because I grew up near NYC.

 

FarCenter

(19,429 posts)
18. Is there a state that is socially liberal and pro business?
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 03:10 PM
Jul 2012

Pro-science, non-religious, pro-womens and gay rights.

Pro business, low unemployment, healthy economy, low taxes.

RKP5637

(67,030 posts)
28. Only in my mind. I've longed for something like that, but I sure never
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 03:54 PM
Jul 2012

have found one. To me it often seems they are diametrically opposed. I can never find a pro-social rights place mixed with pro business, low unemployment, healthy economy, low taxes.

LAGC

(5,330 posts)
52. New Hampshire fits that bill.
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 06:13 PM
Jul 2012

Very low religiosity, low taxes, very socially liberal, pro-business, etc.

 

FarCenter

(19,429 posts)
61. Would Oregon be more pro-business than Washington
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 07:22 PM
Jul 2012

IIRC, there is no income tax in Washington. Are the religious nuts confined mostly to the eastern end of the state?

wickerwoman

(5,662 posts)
75. But there's no sales tax in Oregon.
Wed Jul 18, 2012, 03:58 PM
Jul 2012

Lots of people live on the border, work in Washington and shop in Oregon.

Oregon has a decent climate (if you don't mind some rain) and is comparatively cheap in terms of housing. Basically there's no jobs since the timber industry folded in the 1980s but if you're living off investments/Social Security then it doesn't matter and you'd be supporting a hurting local economy in a very blue state.

RebelOne

(30,947 posts)
25. I live in Georgia and I love it.
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 03:50 PM
Jul 2012

I moved up here to North Georgia in 1989 after living in South Florida most of my life, and I have never regretted it.

frankroberts

(35 posts)
71. what?
Wed Jul 18, 2012, 02:21 PM
Jul 2012

Do you have a problem with the language or the message? It is a bit 'overthetop' but isn't that what a rant is?

Or maybe you are from the 'South' and don't like the message?

Cheers.

nolabear

(41,915 posts)
32. This is absurd. Low life expectancy doesn't mean if you move there you'll die.
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 04:03 PM
Jul 2012

No more than poverty level means if you move there your money will disappear. High crime rate? Yes, if you move into an area with a high crime rate. Many, many places are remarkably low in crime.

But the cost of living and the slower pace and (until recently) good weather and the low housing prices make it pretty desirable for lots of folks.

SDjack

(1,448 posts)
38. Another way choose
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 04:59 PM
Jul 2012

Considering state income tax, local sales tax, and insurance for car, truck, RV, and boat, the top 3 states for residence are:
1. South Dakota
2. Texas
3. Florida

South Dakota is the clear winner because its sales tax is 4%, which is about one-half that of Texas and Florida. Insurance rates are lower in South Dakota, probably because of the lack of exposure to hurricanes.

madokie

(51,076 posts)
41. I was reading recently that Oklahoma was one of the best
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 05:06 PM
Jul 2012

Tulsa being tops in the state.
I knew I liked my state for some reason

GoneOffShore

(17,308 posts)
43. No place on that list I'd want to retire to.
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 05:11 PM
Jul 2012

And only a few places I'd want to visit.

Too hot, too many churches.. Though there is good barbecue and whisky.

 

HooptieWagon

(17,064 posts)
45. Another reason the south is popular for retirees...
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 05:12 PM
Jul 2012

Its not called the Sunbelt for nothing. Youve only got a couple decades left to enjoy life. Do you want to spend half of it indoors during winter? Or, golfing, boating, beachcombing, gardening, bike riding, and any of the other numerous year-round outdoor activities?

 

amandabeech

(9,893 posts)
73. In the South, I spend half of the year indoors during the summer!
Wed Jul 18, 2012, 03:49 PM
Jul 2012

I lived in East Texas, which is part of the Old South. I could not stand the summers. I have nearly as much trouble here in DC.

I want to spend most of the year near my home town, which is 10 miles from beautiful Lake Michigan beaches and right in the middle of a fruit and vegetable growing area. There is an incredible variety of fruits, berries and vegetables--from asparagus in May to late apples in early October. In December, you can get a fresh-cut Christmas tree from the farmer that cut it that morning.

There is a festival or free concert or art fair almost every weekend in some area within an hour's drive. People know how to make the most of nice 75-85 degree weather.

All you need to do is have a cheap place for 2-3 months (or maybe take a long vacation) in a warmer climate. In early retirement years, a lot of people just stay put with plenty of local firewood and a well-stocked pantry.

sorefeet

(1,241 posts)
46. Here in south central Montana with the climate change the
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 05:40 PM
Jul 2012

winters are milder than TN, longer maybe but it wasn't very mean last year. I searched for a place I could afford for 15 years and found an old homestead that I rent for $300 bucks a month, my electric bill was $57.52 last month and I heated for the season for $400. Downfall on the heat, it is coal stoker. Very warm, but dusty. This place is beutiful, but I can't find a liberal, democrat , intellegent girlfriend anywhere. Thinking about Oregon. Probably never find the cheap living I got here though.

 

quinnox

(20,600 posts)
47. stop attacking the South, don't confuse me with facts and statistics!
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 05:44 PM
Jul 2012


Damn it, I know the South always is in the top ten worse states of most any quality of life statistics, and has horrible politics and produces disgusting politicians by and large, but I don't care, it must be bigotry against the South and its not fair!



(sarcasm)

bvar22

(39,909 posts)
51. Reasons WHY we moved to the Ouachita Mountains of Arkansas for early retirement:
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 06:04 PM
Jul 2012

Last edited Tue Jul 17, 2012, 06:38 PM - Edit history (1)

*Inexpensive, pristine, fertile land
Hilltop locations with views readily available and inexpensive to buy ($2000/acre)

*Abundant clean water,
On Property springs not difficult to find
The water most people buy in plastic bottles bubbles up out of the ground in our back yard.
We drink straight from the spring.
It is cold & clear, and tastes wonderful.

*Surrounded by extensive hardwood National Forest and protected Wilderness
Abundant wild game, fish, and unspoiled natural beauty

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=268x5178

*low, LOW, LOW property taxes
(8 acres with house less than $300/year)

*Low Cost of Living in general

*Low Winter energy overhead
We heat with a wood stove,
burn Oak and Hickory which we cut, haul, and split ourselves.
Total Heating cost last Winter about $50

*LONG Growing Season
We produce about 1/2 our food, and could do more if need be.
We have never eaten better or healthier in our lives.
Two crops/year possible for some veggies

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=268x2601

*Long way from Industrial/Agricultural/Urban/SubUrban pollution
Fish caught in local rivers are not hazardous to your health.
Our HoneyBees are happy here with no CCD.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1182412
All the Coal Mine Canaries still thriving here
Plenty of healthy frogs, butterflies, hummingbirds, lightening bugs, worms, ...
AND, you can see the stars at night!

*No Zoning, HOAs, Inspections, or Building Permits
If we want to build something, we build it.

There are some downsides.
Mid-Summer Heat & Humidity are tough.
Poverty & Ignorance are a problem,
but that is improving.
Thanks to Sat TV and the Internet, all the kids are connected.
More "organic" and "sustainable" people are moving into the area every day looking for the things we found here.


But Shhh!
Keep it quiet.
We don't want the Yuppies moving in and ruining it.




---bvar22 & Starkraven
Living Well in the Arkansas woods
on a low "taxable" income,
and stuff we learned inn the '60s








EffieH

(1 post)
82. Ouchita Mountains
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 12:57 PM
Mar 2013

I found your wonderful post through a Google search "retirement Ouachita mountains" and was hoping you could recommend some areas that are like the one you mentioned in your post? I'm originally from OK (all my family still live there), I have lived in CT for 35 years, and we would like to retire in OK or AR in the Ouachita mountain area. CT is a "retirement nightmare", although beautiful the taxes here are horrendous. I've been researching trying to narrow down where to look in the Ouachita mountains, and loved your post, it convinced me this is a good decision! Hubby likes to hike so we want to be close to trails, also. Thanks for your great post and photos!

--Effie

bvar22

(39,909 posts)
83. Hi.
Mon Mar 11, 2013, 07:57 PM
Mar 2013

I'm surprised this turned up on Google.

There were a number of reasons why we chose this area, but affordability and stretching the dollar was one of the biggest.
We would have preferred the Pacific North West, but the buy in was Off-the-Dial, and all the good stuff was already taken.
We could find cheap land there, but none of it had all the necessary ingredients, like
Water, Southern Exposure, distance from Industrial or Urban Pollution.

There are some downsides to Arkansas.
Roads are bad, as are Social Services.
Ignorance & Poverty are depressing,
especially if you've been living in Connecticut.
Most people are genuinely nice, but poorly informed.

The last two Summer Droughts/HeatWave have been pretty bad, but we have a Spring Fed Well that has never quit, for which we are grateful.
We can run this well 24/7, irrigate our gardens, wash our clothes, and take baths,
and it has never even coughed,
and we have adopted a work schedule for dealing with the heat:
Get your work done EARLY, and get OUT of the sun and relax until it cools off in the evening.
(not the only thing we have stolen from our Mexican neighbors.
We also LOVE the spicy food).

WATER is the #1 thing I would advise you to put on the top of your list.
Our spring is "above ground" during the rainy season, but goes underground during droughts.
We have a shallow well (60') and submersible pump that accesses this spring during dry spells.
Without this, our life here would not be tolerable.


While springs are common in the Ouachita Mountains, they are not everywhere.
Not everybody has one, and it is painful to watch your neighbors veggie garden dry up and blow away because they can't water their crops.

We have been informed by the locals that the HeatWave/Drought is cyclical and won't last,
and we pray they are right,
because if THIS is the Global Warming "New Normal",
then things are going to be tough.
There is evidence supporting the cyclical view.
Our rainfall so far this Spring is above normal,
and we are excited about the new growing season.
Our Fruit Trees are budding, and we are expecting our first Asparagus any day now.


The Ozarks, further north, are a bit more scenic, but also more developed.
Land prices for good property there are higher, but there are more amenities too.
They are also in a different Growing Zone.
We can plant two weeks earlier in the Ouachitas, and have out first Fall Freeze about 2 weeks later.
That is important for us because we depend on our Veggie Garden for much of our food, and are still finding ways to stretch our growing season, the Two week before and two weeks after = a full month longer growing season.
The land in the Ouachitas is not quite as rocky as further north...
more top soil, easier to grow stuff.

We are on the west edge of Arkansas, about 10 miles from the Oklahoma border, north-west of Mena, close to Lake Wilhelmina, and it sound like you are familiar with this area.

The area is still fairly depressed, "undiscovered", and property is inexpensive.
Polk County is also a "Dry County", though that is going to change in the near future. When it does, this place will BOOM with resorts and vacation spots.
Highway 71 runs through this area, and land is available for about 5 miles either side of Hwy71. Everything else is national Forrest, expert for that corridor.
So land here is surrounded by extensive National Forest, plenty of wild game, good, clean air... pristine environment.

I would suggest that you come stay for a few days in a motel or rental cabin in Mena, and explore the area for available property. You can find a bunch listed with the realtors,
but, in my opinion, the best stuff is "For Sale by Owner", and you have to explore some to find it, ask around, check the local papers, (Mena Star & The Pulse),
or "The Trader", or even EBay for auctions and private sales.
(We actually found our place on EBay).

Things to look for:

[font size=3]1)A Spring...or spring fed well,
creek or river frontage is nice too, but the well is more important!!!
[/font]

2)Southern exposure.
You definitely want the sun.
Avoid anything on the north side of a mountain or ridge.
(The Ouachitas and Ozarks run East/West, the only mountains in the US that do so.)
Northern exposures are colder, damper, and less sun for growing stuff,
though some have magnificent views, they aren't worth it.

3) Some flat spots with top soil.
Even if you are not interested in growing food,
you might at a later date.
Health reasons aside, we would grow food for the taste only.
We grow the best Asparagus and Strawberries I have ever tasted.
My Wife is an excellent Italian cook, so we grow all that Italian and Mexican Salsa stuff too.
(San Marzanos, Garlic, Basil, Onions, Chives, Sage, Tyme, Rosemary Peppers,....)

4) The ONLY "industry" in the area are Tyson Chicken farms.
There are a few stashed back in the countryside.
You don't want to be anywhere close to one of these Chicken Concentration Camps. They STINK during hot weather. If you find a place you are interested in, check the Satellite Photos (Google Maps) to make sure you are at least a mile away.
and that you will not be to the East or South East of one of these. (Prevailing winds North-Westerly)
The people who own these places say "It smells like money",
but everybody else says, "GACK. How can you stand to live there"?



You can find some other photos and text here:
Early Honey Bounty in Central ARkansas
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1182412

Happy Birthday to Blossom the Rescue Fawn
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1182456

Veggie Garden Porn Season 3
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=280x57204

August Update
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=268x2747

Good Luck with your research.
We also found some interesting and affordable places around the Smokey Mountains
before we decided on this place.

GoCubsGo

(32,061 posts)
65. South Carolina? Somebody needs to...
Tue Jul 17, 2012, 08:03 PM
Jul 2012

...tell all those retirees who have been moving here in droves over the past 15 years that it's a lousy place to retire.

 

SheilaT

(23,156 posts)
77. So much about what makes a state or locality desirable is in the eye of the beholder.
Wed Jul 18, 2012, 04:09 PM
Jul 2012

I moved to New Mexico four years ago after a divorce, and it's but great for me so far. But, and this is huge for me, I would not live here if I still had kids in school. The public schools are not very good, which is a shame, other than in Los Alamos where the high IQs of the parents helps a great deal.

For me, personally, hot summers are to be avoided. The cost of a/c is often higher than the cost of heating in the winter. When we lived in Phoenix in the mid 1980's we'd see elderly retired people hanging out at a mall all day because they couldn't afford the a/c for their home. It was quite sad to see.

I also expect that the figures on life expectancy more reflect those who've lived in that state their entire lives, and would imply something about the availability and affordability of health care, smoking rates, and so on.

I do not intend to stay here forever. I have a son in Portland, OR, and may relocate there in a few years. Milwaukee is also appealing, but that would put me even farther away from either of my sons.

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