HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Main » General Discussion (Forum) » Trying to understand the ...

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 08:28 PM

Trying to understand the NFL boos: Do "fans" want players to be seen & not heard?

My first thought when the Cowboys were booed and criticized for taking a knee while standing for the anthem was that the fans were racist. But then why are racists going to see mostly black NFL teams?

Kirsten Powers (CNN) raised a good point just now: if fans had even a tiny amount of respect for these players, wouldn't they be curious about how the players feel and what their views are? Instead, these so called fans want the players to STFU and entertain them. To be seen but not heard. Really, to even die for their entertainment (CTE).

19 replies, 2384 views

Reply to this thread

Back to top Alert abuse

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 19 replies Author Time Post
Reply Trying to understand the NFL boos: Do "fans" want players to be seen & not heard? (Original post)
ecstatic Sep 2017 OP
LisaM Sep 2017 #1
NobodyHere Sep 2017 #2
rainbow4321 Sep 2017 #5
maryellen99 Sep 2017 #6
NobodyHere Sep 2017 #11
EffieBlack Sep 2017 #7
BruceWane Sep 2017 #9
sharp_stick Sep 2017 #3
mythology Sep 2017 #10
moriah Sep 2017 #12
Tracer Sep 2017 #18
moriah Sep 2017 #19
meadowlark5 Sep 2017 #4
Lee-Lee Sep 2017 #15
meadowlark5 Sep 2017 #16
Lee-Lee Sep 2017 #17
bagelsforbreakfast Sep 2017 #8
SweetieD Sep 2017 #13
JonLP24 Sep 2017 #14

Response to ecstatic (Original post)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 08:30 PM

1. I don't get it either. That is no way to support their teams.

It should sink in with these people that the owners and coaches are supporting the players. Why can't they?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ecstatic (Original post)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 08:31 PM

2. Many people don't want to see politics in their entertainment

 

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NobodyHere (Reply #2)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 08:43 PM

5. They can thank the Feds for that...

Because they payed the NFL owners lots and lots of money to use the players as pawns to try and recruit football fans into signing up for the military.

http://www.snopes.com/nfl-sideline-anthem/

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NobodyHere (Reply #2)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 08:44 PM

6. these same people who want the players fired were defending Paula Deen and Phil Robertson though nt

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to maryellen99 (Reply #6)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 11:37 PM

11. They may be the same people

 

But they still don't want politics mixing with sports entertainment

It's like Independent George mixing with Relationship George.

Worlds collide

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NobodyHere (Reply #2)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 08:49 PM

7. They dont object to politics in their entertainment - They just want to be THEIR politics ...

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to EffieBlack (Reply #7)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 09:45 PM

9. Exactly.

If there were players on the field outwardly promoting "blue lives matter" or some such BS these same people would be cheering at the top of their lungs.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ecstatic (Original post)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 08:32 PM

3. Part of it also is that it was the Cowboys

in Arizona. A Cowboys player would be booed crossing the street.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to sharp_stick (Reply #3)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 09:46 PM

10. The Patriots got booed at home

 

I think in large part it's that it's uncomfortable for white people (I am one myself) to talk about race especially in subtle fashion. It's relatively easy when it's something like do black people have the right to vote during the Civil Movement (easy in terms of people being able to fire hoses turned on blacks for example) compared to modern vote suppression tactics. Likewise it can be hard to understand how a multi-millionare athlete who has so much money can be on the receiving end of racism.

I think part of it is actually a symbol of how far we've come. We've gotten past the days where a large percentage of people were okay with "segregation today, segregation tomorrow, segregation forever". Instead our societal racism is more subtle. That's good in that people now understand that racism is a bad thing, but it's hard to fix because people are invested in not being racist, but think of racism as just the overt things.

It's similar in how guys will admit to rape if you ask the question "Have you ever coerced somebody to intercourse by holding them down?" nearly 1 out of 3 guys will say yes, but the number drops substantially if you ask "Have you ever raped?" We're very good as a species at justifying our actions to avoid the words we know are bad, but not as good at looking at our actions objectively.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to mythology (Reply #10)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 11:59 PM

12. Everyone wants to believe they are good people.

That their parents and grandparents were good people at heart, even if they did things "because of their times". And we certainly don't want our kids to not love Grandpa -- so we don't tell them about Grandpa's mistakes while they're young enough for the lessons to be learned.

And when reality isn't what we want it to be, we reframe it so we don't feel so uncomfortable. Grandpa was simply a hard-working businessman and that's why the great-grandkids have this nice house to inherit -- not that he was successful because he was white and able to join the Masons to get business contacts no black man would have in the South then.... and wouldn't let black people in his house without telling his daughter to keep them out of his office (though never said it when a white friend visited).

I didn't hear those tidbits of reality until after both my grandparents were dead.

And is it any wonder people hearing only half the story presume people whose grandparents didn't have their own home must have had lazy grandparents? Or to feel like they have to defend that falsehood to outsiders, even when they are faced with reality, because Grandpa was idolized in front of them?

The uncomfortable thing is a nagging sense of guilt or shame. And that is a useless emotion when trying to heal wounds. We aren't to blame for the actions of our forefathers, but we have to look them in the eyes and judge the actions for what they were -- wrong -- to see the poison chattel slavery and its aftermath have left in our culture and how to find the cure.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to mythology (Reply #10)

Wed Sep 27, 2017, 12:15 PM

18. From interviews I saw on local TV stations,

the people interviewed outside of Gillette after the game didn't comprehend what the kneeing was all about.

They had bought the Asshole's blithering about "lack of respect for the flag".

The denseness of many Americans is extremely discouraging.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to mythology (Reply #10)

Wed Sep 27, 2017, 12:21 PM

19. One other thing on what I said...

As white Americans, we need to realize what that "guilt" and "shame" that we push back against comes from --- for generations our ancestors and our culture taught us to turn off our empathy to people of color.

Our forefathers couldn't afford to empathize with the person they were treating as less than human. If they did, they wouldn't be able to go to sleep at night. And they made that leap of lack of empathy easier for each generation of child brought up who might question "isn't this wrong?" It was too uncomfortable for adults to fathom, but the kids were seeing it every day. It had to be justified, normalized, institutionalized... "for the children".

And now we have a society that automatically perceives that big dark men are dangerous when only given a glimpse in apperception testing. Where a white child found in a cooler got tons of immediate publicity and was identified quickly, but there are *still* babies and young children without names for DECADES who are of color. Where we so *easily* blame the victims of systemic racism instead of even having the capacity to put ourselves in their shoes.

The shame and the guilt is unnecessary and harmful. What we NEED to learn is empathy, or to at least recognize that our ability to have empathy for those who don't look like us has been systematically destroyed "for our benefit", realize how messed up that is, and teach our children differently. While they're still young enough to feel.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ecstatic (Original post)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 08:38 PM

4. I saw someone else write, that the players are supposed to be there to entertain the fans

The players are not supposed to do anything to ruin their enjoyment for those watching.

I LOVE that the deplorables second religion is being ruined for them. Waa! They live for football. For some, that might be the only little bit of enjoyment they have in their shitty little lives. Now it's ruined.

Maybe people who are on waiting lists for season tickets can score some now. If these deplorables stand by their principals. Which I doubt. They say they'll quit watching. That will maybe last one week. What else do they have? NASCAR over?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to meadowlark5 (Reply #4)

Wed Sep 27, 2017, 05:41 AM

15. I think a lot of it is just that simple- players are entertainers

 

And they don't want to be lectured to about politics or be remind of politics in the middle of something they paid a pretty good amount of money to see to be entertained.

Last time I went to a Football game was many years ago and then for two of us when you rolled in tickets, parking, food and drinks it was insanely expensive for a few hours entertainment.

And if it's politics that makes them uncomfortable to confront that discomfort just adds to the anger.

I saw someone above mention Phil Robinson or Paula Deen. I don't thing that's in the same category exactly, because people were not paying tons of money to come see them do one thing live and then getting something totally different thrown in. Sure, what they did was 10000x different and actually bad instead of for a righteous cause, but they didn't do it in front of an audience that paid big money to see them do their real job- entertain- live.

I have an ex who is a Democrat and die hard Panthers fan and African American- what he said on Facebook yesterday was "can we please just leave on thing that makes me happy and takes me away from all the mess in the world free of politics? Why does it have to go deep into even my Football that I can't go to a game without being reminded of what is already in front of me 24/7 almost everywhere else?"

I suspect a lot of fans of every political stripe agree with him to some degree....

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Lee-Lee (Reply #15)

Wed Sep 27, 2017, 11:59 AM

16. Most of these people are not paying for tickets to go to the games

Most of what I was seeing is, "I won't watch", "I shut it off" etc. The only investment is their teevee, beer and nachos.

I think the purpose was totally to make them feel something! It's easy for trumpsters to turn a blind eye to police violence on the black community by sticking to Fox News and the conservative social media that continually finds ways to justify every shooting.

That's why they're mad. Because they are being reminded of something they have chosen to ignore. Some people need to be reminded. Sorry if it bothers those that already support those that are effected.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to meadowlark5 (Reply #16)

Wed Sep 27, 2017, 12:06 PM

17. I was talking about the boos in the stadium

 

Since that is what the original poster referenced.

I agree the purpose was to make them feel something and they likely didn't like what they felt or were faced to confront, and I'm sure that was part of it.

But my point still stands that when people do something expecting to be entertained and are subjected to something that doesn't entertain them and makes them feel the opposite of what there were going to or watching the event to feel you will get a backlash.

That backlash doesn't necessarily mean that the actions they took didn't work for the intended purpose, in fact it may be a sign that they did.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ecstatic (Original post)

Tue Sep 26, 2017, 09:39 PM

8. It's really pretty simple to them - the players make a million while

 

they've lost ground over the past 40 years. (It's kind of like when Reagan went after the Air Traffic Controllers).

When they look toward the liberal side they see a new order where people of color and women seem to be coming first while they (they think) come last and get nothing.

That's why we should turn more to things like the $15 min wage and things which clearly benefit ALL. Bannon wants Identity politics to craft his Fascism.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ecstatic (Original post)

Wed Sep 27, 2017, 01:25 AM

13. Yes. Most of the fans don't view the players as real people.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ecstatic (Original post)

Wed Sep 27, 2017, 05:23 AM

14. Fucking Arizona

I back the Cardinals but was dissappointed with the boos.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Reply to this thread