General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsRedneck Revolt Says Deal With Racism First, Then Economics
Addressing our systems of White supremacy cannot be dismissed as identity politics.Our entire capitalist system is built on a bedrock of White supremacy.
Moved by the need for control, for an unchallenged top tier, the power elite in American history has thrived by placating the vulnerable and creating for them a false sense of identificationdenying real class differences where possible.
Nancy Isenberg, White Trash: The 400-Year Untold History of Class in America
Laws have been written to oppress and exploit particular identitiesNative Americans, Black Americans, Asians, homosexuals, transgender, and womenin a successful effort to maintain a system of White supremacy. Yet, members of these communities have worked for the rights and equality of everyone. In turn, White allies have joined in these anti-racism fights.
The Redneck Revolt is one such organization. The self-described anti-capitalist, anti-racist, anti-fascist group challenges working-class White people to stand against White supremacy.
Jeffries: Can you give an example of what you mean by changing hearts and minds. What does that look like?
Brett: A really great example would be back in June. The ACT for America folks did an anti-sharia law march. Redneck Revolt was there. We were on one side of the barricades along with a slew of other leftist organizations. On the other side of the barricades were Proud Boys, Vanguard America, and a hodgepodge of other alt-right groups. But one of the most prominent was the Michigan Liberty Militia, which is famously racist and famously exclusionary.
Toward the end of the demonstration, this one older gentlemanhe was an older White man up at the barricade with all the gear on, and armedhad his rifle. One of my members and I went up to this guy and were like, I understand mixing state and religion is not good. Nobody here wants to mix state and religion, nobody is protesting that. its clearly anti-Muslim. This protest is against Muslims.
Furthermore, its against all people of color because this neighborhood [is] first-generation Somali, first-generation people form sub-Saharan Africa who are fleeing abject poverty and warfare, starvation, disease. So how can you be in this neighborhood and be like, This is what America stands for?
Not only that, if you look to your left and right, those kids with the sun wheel on their shields, and the eagle on their shirts, those guys are self-described, literal Nazis. We fought a war about this. I thought we were all in unanimous agreement that Nazis are bad.
And this guy he kind of started tearing up, and he was like, You know, Ill tell you, my dad died in World War II in Europe fighting Nazis. And he goes, This really has given me [something to think about]. You know I may not agree with everything you say. But associating myself like this has really given me pause, and has really made me think about what Im doing here.
I get that economics in an important factor. I did not share this to start another economics vs identity debate, but to share a story of activists in the field, working on making the world a little better, doing the difficult task of persuading hearts and minds and the reasoning behind their approach and strategy.
ehrnst
(32,640 posts)and it's at the root of keeping people of color out of schools and workplaces.
JHan
(10,173 posts)But as a concept "identity politics"is nothing new. Conventional wisdom among the anti-identity politics brigade is that this is some kind of new cynical move by modern liberals to pander to groups when Truman himself recognized "identity politics" - and he followed FDR.
this memo from Clark Clifford THE POLITICS OF 1948 (1947) about the re-election of Truman is revealing. http://personal.ashland.edu/~jmoser1/clifford.htm
The only pragmatic reason for conciliating the South in normal times is because of its tremendous strength in the Congress. Since the Congress is Republican and the Democratic President has, therefore, no real chance to get his own program approved by it, particularly in an election year, he has no real necessity for getting along with the Southern conservatives. He must, however, get along with the Westerners and with labor if he is to be reelected.
The Administration is, for practical purposes, politically free to concentrate on the winning of the West. If the Democrats carry the solid South and also those Western states carried in 1944, they will have 216 of the required 266 electoral votes. And if the Democratic Party is powerful enough to capture the pest, it will almost certainly pick up enough of the doubtful Middlewestern and Eastern states to get 50 more votes (e.g. Missouri's 14 votes). We could lose New York, Pennsylvania, Illinois, New Jersey, Ohio, Massachusetts -- all the "big" states -- and still win.
Therefore, political and program planning demands concentration upon the West and its problems, including reclamation, floods, and agriculture. It is the Number One Priority for the 1948 campaign, The Republican Congress has already done its share to give the West to the Administration."
He then goes on to assess the different demographic groups Democrats would have to reach out to: catholics, italians, jews, "negroes" etc etc.
The main reason people have such difficulty with this I believe is that Class has never really been acknowledged in America, because America is not ethnically homogeneous. America's founding was built on a racial caste system so you can't thread race and class separately . It always strikes me that in America , race is discussed the way class is discussed in other countries.
What compounds this problem is that the white working class -specifically white males - are seen as neutral (supposedly neither motivated by race nor gender) and without an identity of their own - and this is wrong, wrong in the present day and historically wrong.
JI7
(89,241 posts)Is because they don't want minorities and women to benefit.
Caliman73
(11,726 posts)I agree most with this view because built in, systemic racism has stopped truly wide reaching reform from happening on an economic level in this country. When Unions formed in the late 1800's and early 1900's, many of them barred membership by POC. The economic populism of the 1930's and 40's was discriminatory toward POC. That is not to say that economic reform for the poor and working class is not a good thing, but as stated, this country was built with a racial caste system and policies have RARELY if EVER been color blind. White working class voters were peeled away from the Democratic Party in the 1980's with an appeal to racial bias and hostility toward POC who were either lazy Black people on welfare, or Mexican immigrants stealing your jobs. Union members went with Reagan who was intent on destroying Unions, and the tribal appeal of us v them was a major component.
The us v them should be those who want to control all the wealth v those of us who just want our fair share, but for that to happen, there has to be recognition about how race, gender, etc... has been used to divide us.
JHan
(10,173 posts)as Brett says in the interview , using an old adage "get them before the klann does" , he wants to reach out to sensitize and create awareness. I really respect their approach.
fleabiscuit
(4,542 posts)~George Lakoff
The Conservative Moral Hierarchy:
God above Man
Man above Nature
The Disciplined (Strong) above the Undisciplined (Weak)
The Rich above the Poor
Employers above Employees
Adults above Children
Western culture above other cultures
America above other countries
Men above Women
Whites above Nonwhites
Christians above non-Christians
Straights above Gays
https://georgelakoff.com/2017/07/01/two-questions-about-trump-and-republicans-that-stump-progressives/amp/
JHan
(10,173 posts)fleabiscuit
(4,542 posts)That about covers it.
Thanks, fleabiscuit.
fleabiscuit
(4,542 posts)Thanks JHan.
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)True.
Eliot Rosewater
(31,106 posts)brer cat
(24,524 posts)It will be interesting to see how successful they are at winning hearts and minds.
JHan
(10,173 posts)Response to JHan (Original post)
Skittles This message was self-deleted by its author.
lunamagica
(9,967 posts)Gothmog
(144,939 posts)JHan
(10,173 posts)i highly recommend https://www.redneckrevolt.org/single-post/2016/07/24/LOOKING-AT-THE-WHITE-WORKING-CLASS-HISTORICALLY - comprehensive essay on the WWC.
Alea
(706 posts)Unless you want to completely change America as we know it. For those of you salivating over them, read this page before you make up your mind. It won't work out the way you, or they want it to.
https://www.redneckrevolt.org/principles
JHan
(10,173 posts)I know they are not democrats. Again I repeat, The reason I shared this was because of their strategy in combating racism and how they engage with whites who find alt right rhetoric appealing at this time. How they've prioritized social justice , and see social justic as the pathway towards change. In their view, things won't change until social justice is at the heart of economic arguments, I tend to agree.
EDIT: Also I'm not as anti-capitalist as they are, I've said often on this site that capitalism needs to be tempered with collectivism - where there's regard for quality of human of life and focus on human flourishing ( these are things which should be the bedrock of any civilization) For too long, vulture capitalism was seen as the key to liberty - growth unchecked ( further edit: And while there's collectivism in vulture capitalism, it's aimed at consolidating the power of the predatory capitalist). Where gains are privatized, costs externalized, and where there's the hoarding of profits. I see critiques like this often , even on this site. And everytime we talk about redistributing wealth, it's an attempt to address imbalances due to capitalist enterprise left unchecked.
Alea
(706 posts)JHan
(10,173 posts)Alice11111
(5,730 posts)My brother is one, a fairly wealthy one, and he kisses up to become super wealthy at some point. Tense and angry, yet he does do volunteer work for several good organizations, and he can be funny as hell. He is also an angry Repub who hates the left.
JHan
(10,173 posts)to keep the peace?
Alice11111
(5,730 posts)hugs me, kisses me goodbye, & tells me he loves me, as we leave family events. It is a love-hate relationship. I'm close to my niece, his daughter. We try to stick to communication about our kids. He is naturally high strung, and I'm usually not.
He had a meltdown on a family trip in Mexico. He said, for the first time in his life, he felt racially discriminated against, when our party, the only gringos, didn't get waited on, at a sort of country club, he insisted on. I said, it's the wall.
He had a fit, and he said, these people don't care about the wall...their economy is doing great. I said, it's insulting. They have a lot of pride. He got pissed and stormed out w his family, taking the vehicle we had ridden in, which wasn't a big deal, just an AH. The insensitivity to racism comes up a lot. They don't think they are racists, but they are! He has a briefcase with a gun. He rents miniature horses for his daughter's BDay, which goes on in various forms for three days. Private schools all of the way. True red blood Repub. My daughter and her family are very liberal. Our family is almost exactly half and half, so blow ups happen. After Charlottesville, his sister-in-law blew up, as she is married to a Palestinian (in film directing, does well & everyone adores him, but he says while opening Christmas gifts, he is celebrating Ramadan. Everyone shows respect). Her kids are of course very Middle Eastern, beautiful, in appearance. She rightfully lost it with her mother, but the trigger was Charlottesville,
not a comment, how can you support this monster, who would mow down my children.
It's not black or white, complex. It's like the divided civil war families. There is love, but tension, and it can, and does, explode easily. His daughter, age 10, sharp, tries to trigger it. She will ask questions to the table. She's exploring reality and her values.
Sorry. A little question, and you got more than you wanted to hear.
JHan
(10,173 posts)I have friends who have just severed ties with some family members. Modern conservatism is toxic.
Alice11111
(5,730 posts)If it continues, it will eventually lead to civil war, 15 years?, or the breakup of the US, which is better, IMO.
JHan
(10,173 posts)I hope it doesn't, but there are agitators who want that though. I am afraid though, i never thought liberal democracy itself would be under threat in 2017 but here we are.
Alice11111
(5,730 posts)haven't worked so well. Finally, they have fought back hard, but with integrity.
Maybe, there will be a turn around. We are more polarized than ever before. I believe they hate us in an uncivil way and are willing to hurt us to weaken us and strengthen them. If this continues to grow,
JHan
(10,173 posts)hyper individualism is part of the American DNA, so how they're reaching out to alt righters/nazies by imploring them to not just focus on their own concerns but others as well, and as corny as it sounds, showing how we're "all in this together" is interesting. If they could persuade these folks that they have far more in common with americans who may not look like them, but share their concerns for the future and their families, that's a step forward ( instead of being duped by rich conmen)
JustAnotherGen
(31,781 posts)It takes all kinds to set America on the right course.
betsuni
(25,380 posts)When that book first came out I wanted to read it but then forgot. On my list now.
JHan
(10,173 posts)I felt that she could have fleshed out her thesis a little more and analyzed the provincialism of Appalachia whites vis a vis southern whites ( Hillbilly Elegy, by Jd Vance, is the only book I've read which addresses the Appalachian white demographic , based on the author's own experience )
Me.
(35,454 posts)I don't think of it as one or the other but you can't have one without the other, at least not if you want a successful society.
+1
The Polack MSgt
(13,182 posts)I respect their willingness to stand tall against the worst of us (us being rural whites) as well...
I also agree that until the great reservoir of racist bullshit is drained, we can't move forward as a nation.
But I am a Democrat, by definition a capitalist, of an age where any Marxist jargon grates at me
NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)JHan
(10,173 posts)If they were the only ones to benefit from it , they've been told for so long that government services are "handouts" because other people get them too.
Garrett78
(10,721 posts)This is in sync with what I was getting across in the following thread a little while back: "A fundamental misunderstanding of the relationship between economic and social justice."
As for how Redneck Revolt responds to bogus accusations of so-called "reverse racism," I offer up Robin DiAngelo's definition of racism. Racism, she said, is "an act or a dynamic that is backed by the weight of history, legal authority and institutional control." In other words, there is no such thing as "reverse racism." It's nothing more than a tool used to obfuscate.