New York Judge To Decide If Senator Ted Cruz Is American

[big_dog]

Source: NBC News/Metro New York PUBLISHED : Today 1:07 pm

A New York judge will hear arguments on Tuesday in a lawsuit that challenges Republican Sen. Ted Cruz’s ability to run for president given that he was born in Canada.

State Supreme Court Justice David Weinstein will hear the claim of two men who contend that Cruz is not a citizen of the U.S. and is therefore ineligible to run for president, NBC has reported. Cruz was born in Alberta, Canada.


Barry Korman and William Gallo will argue that despite Cruz’s mother being an American, the senator is not a citizen because such status cannot be passed from parent to child, Newsday reported.

The defense of Cruz’s place in the election is being argued by the New York Board of Elections, which put Cruz on the ballot, NBC added. Cruz, a lawyer, was elected to be a senator from Texas in 2012, Newsday added.

Read more: http://www.metro.us/new-york/new-york-judge-to-decide-if-ted-cruz-is-american/zsJpbC---fzHw5s10TNuo2/

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

1. I know we're all embarrassed by him, but you can't just go and declare him not an American.

There's no 'totalwhackjobistan' for him to hold citizenship in.

[Angry Dragon]

6. I have listened to some Constitutional experts debate this

and it says Natural born citizen and some contend this means both parents are American and it matters not where that child is born

[dixiegrrrrl]

9. Neither of Rubio's parents was a U.S. citizen at the time of Rubio’s birth

so does he meet "natural born" status for Prez?

[Angry Dragon]

10. according to some he is not

[muriel_volestrangler]

12. No, his mother was

Some people pretend that since she qualified for voting in Canada a few years after Donald was born, she wasn't a US citizen when he was. But that's not how time works - it has a direction. Plus, there's no evidence she gave up US citizenship ever.

[iandhr]

13. Was born on American soil.

Natural born.

[ozone_man]

17. I would think so. n/t

[markj757]

23. Rubio is definitely a natural born citizen....but Cruz may have to be settled in court....

Rubio was born in the US so he is automatically a natural born citizen. But Cruz problem is different, because he was born in Canada, and one parent was American. The legal argument is not whether he is an American citizen, that is basically settled. The argument is whether he is a natural born citizen. There are very reasonable arguments to be made, although he was a naturalized citizen at birth, that still does not make him a natural born citizen like Rubio. And this isn't about crazy birther conspiracies, there are serious Constitutional questions in which the Supreme Court will eventually play a role. His situation is very different than John McCain who was born in Panama. No one doubts John McCain was a natural born citizen because he was born on a military installation (considered US soil) into a military family.

[dixiegrrrrl]

44. Didja know the Senate passed a resolution that McCain was a natural born citizen?

I found it interesting that they did that.

It's here:

Whereas previous presidential candidates were born outside of the United States of America and were understood to be eligible to be President; and

Whereas John Sidney McCain, III, was born to American citizens on an American military base in the Panama Canal Zone in 1936: Now, therefore, be it

That John Sidney McCain, III, is a "natural born Citizen" under Article II, Section 1, of the Constitution of the United States.

https://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/110/sres511/text

[MADem]

32. Rubio was born on American soil - Cruz wasn't.

Also "some people say" (and we know how that works) that his parents took Canadian citizenship - they are listed on a Canadian electoral roll.

Apparently, if a judge interpreted the Constitution the way Cruz does, routinely, he would have to find him ineligible.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/opinion/2016/01/11/through-ted-cruz-constitutional-looking-glass/zvKE6qpF31q2RsvPO9nGoK/story.html

By Laurence H. Tribe JANUARY 11, 2016
There’s more than meets the eye in the ongoing dustup over whether Ted Cruz is eligible to serve as president, which under the Constitution comes down to whether he’s a “natural born citizen” despite his 1970 Canadian birth. Senator Cruz contends his eligibility is “settled” by naturalization laws Congress enacted long ago. But those laws didn’t address, much less resolve, the matter of presidential eligibility, and no Supreme Court decision in the past two centuries has ever done so. In truth, the constitutional definition of a “natural born citizen” is completely unsettled, as the most careful scholarship on the question has concluded. Needless to say, Cruz would never take Donald Trump’s advice to ask a court whether the Cruz definition is correct, because that would in effect confess doubt where Cruz claims there is certainty.

People are entitled to their own opinions about what the definition ought to be. But the kind of judge Cruz says he admires and would appoint to the Supreme Court is an “originalist,” one who claims to be bound by the narrowly historical meaning of the Constitution’s terms at the time of their adoption. To his kind of judge, Cruz ironically wouldn’t be eligible, because the legal principles that prevailed in the 1780s and ’90s required that someone actually be born on US soil to be a “natural born” citizen. Even having two US parents wouldn’t suffice. And having just an American mother, as Cruz did, would have been insufficient at a time that made patrilineal descent decisive.

[Retrograde]

34. And neither was one of Obama's

but both Obama and Rubio were born in the US, thereby meeting the 14th Amendment definition of citizens.

[WhiteTara]

8. He is American, just not Natural Botn

which means you were born in the US.

[TipTok]

60. Nope...

A child born to an American parent is an American citizen from birth and 'natural born'...

This is birther bullshit that was rightly mocked before and should be mocked now.

[markj757]

65. It's not bullshit.....

and its not settled law. The Supreme will have a role to play one way or another. Either they will eventually hear the case and decide, or decline to hear it and let a lower court ruling stand....but its definitely not birther bullshit. It is a serious Constitutional question even though it may lean in his favor.

[elleng]

28. Right, it's a bad headline, but what else is new?

THE issue is whether or not he was 'natural born' for purposes of serving as President, and he was not.

Ted Cruz is not eligible to be president.

by Mary Brigid McManamon January 12
Mary Brigid McManamon is a constitutional law professor at Widener University’s Delaware Law School.

'Sen. Ted Cruz (R-Tex.) is not a natural-born citizen and therefore is not eligible to be president or vice president of the United States.

The Constitution provides that “No person except a natural born Citizen .?.?. shall be eligible to the Office of President.” The concept of “natural born” comes from common law, and it is that law the Supreme Court has said we must turn to for the concept’s definition. On this subject, common law is clear and unambiguous. The 18th-century English jurist William Blackstone, the preeminent authority on it, declared natural-born citizens are “such as are born within the dominions of the crown of England,” while aliens are “such as are born out of it.” The key to this division is the assumption of allegiance to one’s country of birth. The Americans who drafted the Constitution adopted this principle for the United States. James Madison, known as the “father of the Constitution,” stated, “It is an established maxim that birth is a criterion of allegiance. .?.?. place is the most certain criterion; it is what applies in the United States.”

Cruz is, of course, a U.S. citizen. As he was born in Canada, he is not natural-born. His mother, however, is an American, and Congress has provided by statute for the naturalization of children born abroad to citizens. Because of the senator’s parentage, he did not have to follow the lengthy naturalization process that aliens without American parents must undergo. Instead, Cruz was naturalized at birth. This provision has not always been available. For example, there were several decades in the 19th century when children of Americans born abroad were not given automatic naturalization.' >>>

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/ted-cruz-is-not-eligible-to-be-president/2016/01/12/1484a7d0-b7af-11e5-99f3-184bc379b12d_story.html

[former9thward]

62. LOL

Widener University Delaware Law School is really a law school I would like on my diploma.... Says no one. It is a toilet T4 ranked law school. So they trotted out one of their "professors" to get a little publicity.

[Cavallo]

39. I agree. And this will affect a lot more people than Ted Cruz.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

54. He's clearly American. Just not natural born and therefore Cruz is ineligible for the Presidency.

Actually, United States of America citizen, since "America" technically is North and South America.

People born on US soil are "natural born" citizens. People born off US soil need to be naturalized to become citizens. They are either naturalized at birth by US citizen parentage or they are naturalized later in life through the legal immigration process. Cruz was naturalized at birth because of his US citizen mother and this was necessary because he was not born on US soil.

[former9thward]

61. No, not how it works.

If what you said was true then children born overseas of American military, diplomats, business people and tourists could not be President. They can and Congress has passed a law saying they do 8 U.S.C. § 1403.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

63. You make my point

Congress had to pass that law, precisely because that's how it works. If they had not passed it, then children of diplomats and tourists would not be "natural born".

In any case, that was passed in 2006, long after Cruz was born. But would be moot because it wouldn't apply to him.

Further, Cruz's parents were not military, not diplomats, and not tourists. They were possibly business people, but they had emigrated to Canada to start a business there, and not simply there on a business trip or a business posting. Cruz's father never bothered with American citizenship til 2005, after coming back to the US to live, and Cruz's mother obtained the right to vote in Canadian elections. Neither fact about his parents affects his citizenship, but it does show intent that they were not simply visiting or posted by some corporation.

Cruz was naturalized an American citizen at birth, but not natural born.

[former9thward]

64. 2006 is just the latest codification of the law.

The law was the same when he was born. Intent of the parents is not a factor in citizenship.

Right wing and left wing birthers of the world unite!

[TheCowsCameHome]

2. I'm more concerned about which planet he's from.

[MBS]

31. yes, better question : ) n/t

[Dont call me Shirley]

33. Planet Creepistan.

[randys1]

3. It is an embarrassment he is a dog pound worker, let alone United States Senator

the idea this vicious religious bigot hate machine could be president is unacceptable, no matter whether he was born here or not

[PoliticAverse]

4. Misleading headline as the issue concerns the constitutional phrase "natural born".

No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

41. Yes. Cruz was not natural born, but was naturalized instantly at birth by his mother's citizenship.

It's an odd quirk of US citizenship law.

If you are born on US soil (regardless of parentage), you are "natural born" and a US citizen that way and eligible for the Presidency.

If you are born off US soil to a US citizen parent, you are "naturalized" a citizen at birth by that fact, but not natural born and thus ineligible.

If you are born off US soil to no US citizen parent, but immigrate into the US and fulfill legal obligations such as period of residency, then you become "naturalized by law" and also ineligible.

In McCain's case, he was born on US soil (Panama Canal Zone at the time) and thus natural born and eligible.

Obama was born on US soil in Hawaii and obviously eligible.

George Romney (Mitt's parent) was naturalized at birth in Mexico City and thus ineligible but nobody raised the issue at the time and his failed presidential campaign made the issue moot.

Ted Cruz is naturalized but not natural born. Ted Cruz is ineligible for the Presidency.

Rubio was natural born on US soil. He is eligible.

[Orsino]

47. Where is "natural born" defined? n/t

[Bernardo de La Paz]

50. It is ill-defined, but it is deep in American jurisprudence including foundational writing from Brit

If Cruz respects "original intent" the way he claims to, then the original intent is clear: born on American soil except those born before the Constitution was ratified. Cruz was not born before the Constitution was ratified.

Otherwise Cruz is a hypocrite if he supports some modernistic determination favorable to him on this issue.

It is ill-defined, but it is deep in American jurisprudence including foundational writing inherited from Britain in the 1700s.

Clearly it is not settled law, but I assert that it should be settled by case law starting now or it should be settled by Congressional legislation to define it precisely, though the latter would probably be subject to its own litigation as to whether it requires a Constitutional Amendment to define Constitutional terms.

[Orsino]

53. Then let's not just blindly assert that Cruz doesn't meet this undefined standard.

The reasons why Cruz should never get near government have nothing to do with his birth, IMO.

"Born a citizen" would be close enough in my book, but I don't see much reason for the birth requirement, anyway. I can't see a judge inventing a standard that Cruz wouldn't be grandfathered into, or the Supreme taking on t he issue in time to make a difference.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

56. Though Cruz should be disqualified for Dominionist treason, "your book" does not rule.

I agree, Cruz is a Dominionist abomination and should never get near government. He and his ilk want to turn the USA into a christian theocracy.

But he has.

However, I think that a strong case can be made for him being naturalized at birth and not "natural born".

[lapfog_1]

5. The issue isn't citizenship

but the phrase "natural born"

i don't think Ted can prove that he was a natural born anything, much less American.

I'm sure he is a pod people or replicant or alien of some sort

[meow2u3]

25. I don't even know if Ted Cruz was even born

He might have been hatched, so no one hatched from a dinosaur egg is eligible to be President.

[PatrynXX]

7. well I assume like John McCain congress will have to approve him to run, but as it stands Canada con

siders him canadian and he wasn't born in the USA so....

[itsrobert]

16. If the Judge rules the constition says he is not "natural born"

than it would take a constitutional amendment for him to run.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

42. Cruz renounced his Canadian citizenship and Canadians denounce him

Canada elected Justin Trudeau as Prime Minister by his leadership of the Liberal Party last year.

Trudeau (and Canada) are about as diametrically opposed to Cruz as is possible.

[onehandle]

11. 30 Rock says no.

Jack and his wife, Avery had their baby girl in Canada, against their wishes.

They lamented the fact that she can never be President.

Tiny Fey would not lie to me.

[Chasstev365]

14. The Birth Parent Argument Makes Me Crazy!

Besides the fact that Barack Obama was born in Hawaii, their argument for Cruz's situation wouldn't have mattered in 2008 because the same racist assholes were just out to delegitimize President Obama. The hipocracy boggles the mind.

[AxionExcel]

15. Cubanadian Repubbbies are their own special breed

[dixiegrrrrl]

45. For some reason, he looks almost...natural...in that outfit.

[Kip Humphrey]

18. a specious argument intended so Cruz can claim, "a judge ruled in my favor. So, its settled. I'm

an American citizen...blah,blah,blah...". Of course we have bloodline citizenship.

[houston16revival]

19. Natural born

with a midwife, not a gynecologist

not born unnatural

"No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident"

To me, 'natural born' means born on American soil.

So Cruz is disqualified on two counts

Born in a foreign country

and obviously, born unnatural cause he is weird!

[LastLiberal in PalmSprings]

37. Cruz is not a natural born person

He's a dick.

[HubertHeaver]

20. He is American. No argument at all.

North American, that is. Except he gave that up.

[LiberalEsto]

21. First things first: is he human?

[potone]

22. Yes, that is the question that I want answered.

Everything about him suggests that he is not.

[meow2u3]

24. The judge ought to decide if Ted Cruz is human

My hunch is that he's not.

[Bjornsdotter]

27. You beat me to it!

[Raster]

26. I think first they better decide if he's human.

[Ducksworthy]

29. Did I miss the hearing to determine if he is human?

I would have thought that would come first.

[Earth_First]

30. A simple solution:

Put two beers side by side.

A Labatt's and a Molson.

See which one he grabs for...

[pandr32]

43. Both are Canadian beers

So what is your point?

[Earth_First]

58. It was a joke...

Lighten up!

[kentauros]

59. I got it!

Although maybe put down a Tim Horton's donut and one from Shipleys (very popular Texas donut-maker, because if he's a "real" Texan, he'll choose Shipleys over any other brand.)

[EllieBC]

35. We aren't taking him back.

No! You can't make us!

[Manifestor_of_Light]

36. This is a case of first impression.

Which is legalese for "This question has never come before a court before, so this is the first court decision to be made concerning this question." I'm glad somebody's going to straighten this out. It needs to be decided.

[Skittles]

38. his nationality is the least of my concerns with him

[mdbl]

40. that's true but if the New York board of elections would have done their job to begin with

We wouldn't have been subjected to as much of the crap spewed from his mouth.

[RussBLib]

46. natural born is simple to me

You have to be born in the United States. Later it was amended to include born on US bases abroad. I'm fine with that, but Cruz meets neither definition.

[Bradical79]

48. I thought having an American citizen parent

made one "natural born". I thought the question of Cruz's status went back to weather his mother was a citizen at the time steming from her voting in a Canadian election.

[Liberty Sage]

49. Cruz is eligible

Being born to an America citizen makes Cruz natural born. It doesn't have to be on US soil. Some of you sound more like Donald Trump.

[seaotter]

51. Please make your constitutional arguments Here:

Some actual constitutional lawyers do not agree with you.

[Liberty Sage]

55. Harvard Law Review

Here is the link and its not even in a right wing rag. This is a waste of time and our money.
http://harvardlawreview.org/2015/03/on-the-meaning-of-natural-born-citizen/

[Bernardo de La Paz]

52. Nope

Being born to an American citizen off-soil is naturalized at birth but not "natural born". Otherwise it would not have required the special legislation to include American bases as American soil for the purposes of natural born.

[AngryAmish]

57. Canadian. Anchor. Baby.