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jpak

(41,742 posts)
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 03:27 PM Mar 2016

IS trains 400 fighters to attack Europe in wave of bloodshed

Source: Associated Press

PARIS (AP) — The Islamic State group has trained at least 400 fighters to target Europe in deadly waves of attacks, deploying interlocking terror cells like the ones that struck Brussels and Paris with orders to choose the time, place and method for maximum carnage, The Associated Press has learned.

The network of agile and semiautonomous cells shows the reach of the extremist group in Europe even as it loses ground in Syria and Iraq. The officials, including European and Iraqi intelligence officials and a French lawmaker who follows the jihadi networks, described camps in Syria, Iraq and possibly the former Soviet bloc where attackers are trained to attack the West. Before being killed in a police raid, the ringleader of the Nov. 13 Paris attacks claimed to have entered Europe in a multinational group of 90 fighters, who scattered "more or less everywhere."

But the biggest break yet in the Paris attacks investigation — the arrest on Friday of fugitive Salah Abdeslam— did not thwart the multipronged attack just four days later on the Belgian capital's airport and metro that left 31 people dead and an estimated 270 wounded. Three suicide bombers also died.

Just as in Paris, Belgian authorities were searching for at least one fugitive in Tuesday's attacks — this time for a man seen on security footage in the airport with the two suicide attackers. The fear is that the man, whose identity Belgian officials say is not known, will find Abdeslam's path instructive.

<more>

Read more: http://bigstory.ap.org/article/1c1661cef71c4a1a93f3a1863d27a284/trains-400-fighters-attack-europe-wave-bloodshed

34 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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IS trains 400 fighters to attack Europe in wave of bloodshed (Original Post) jpak Mar 2016 OP
Do we have any proof? scscholar Mar 2016 #1
is there any doubt this is where it is heading? Skittles Mar 2016 #2
Unfortunately, Clinton and Petraeus created new hornet nests and armed them. leveymg Mar 2016 #26
not really sure why Obama is relieved of accountability here Skittles Mar 2016 #27
Benefit of the doubt and circumstantial evidence that Petraeus was terminated with leveymg Mar 2016 #28
what? the author of the article is spewing hate? maxsolomon Mar 2016 #3
what are the terrorists spewing? innocent blood and limbs. MariaThinks Mar 2016 #5
ISIS said they would. Then Paris happened, then Brussels. What more proof do you need? Yo_Mama Mar 2016 #32
As their caliphate fails in Iraq/Syria, this will be their new recruitment method riderinthestorm Mar 2016 #4
it is a sick twisted ideology that will only have two outcomes MariaThinks Mar 2016 #6
The moderate Muslim community has done little to combat this LiberalLovinLug Mar 2016 #10
i don't see that the moderates do anything. Every attack is followed by their self concern about how MariaThinks Mar 2016 #12
YUP. mylye2222 Mar 2016 #17
Watch out. romanic Mar 2016 #14
I just have been threated that way yesturday mylye2222 Mar 2016 #18
we have to speak the truth MariaThinks Mar 2016 #24
Liberals are ahead in a lot of ways LiberalLovinLug Mar 2016 #30
Agree with you. mylye2222 Mar 2016 #16
Can't we just send Tom Clancy after them? Roland99 Mar 2016 #7
Good ol' Jack Ryan PersonNumber503602 Mar 2016 #34
And yet trying George W. for war crimes is "off the table". Initech Mar 2016 #8
Would it help? And, you give GWB too much credit. JustABozoOnThisBus Mar 2016 #9
Might help but it simply wouldn't happen ... Nihil Mar 2016 #25
it is possible to say that there are two evils here - not just one. MariaThinks Mar 2016 #13
I may be wrong but IMO what ISIS is doing is trying to jwirr Mar 2016 #11
Ding ding ding... TowneshipRebellion Mar 2016 #19
Exactly. jwirr Mar 2016 #21
+1 mylye2222 Mar 2016 #23
This is just an observation, and I condemn the attack in Belgium, but . . . sus453 Mar 2016 #15
This is the natural consequence of war-as-a-business... TowneshipRebellion Mar 2016 #20
Yes. But did Laotians and Vietnamese People mylye2222 Mar 2016 #22
The group's publicly stated aim, however, is to crush any other religious interpretation muriel_volestrangler Mar 2016 #29
But what did the Yazidis ever do to them? They were no threat. ISIS is just a megalomaniac murder Yo_Mama Mar 2016 #33
Nonsense philosslayer Mar 2016 #31

Skittles

(152,967 posts)
2. is there any doubt this is where it is heading?
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 03:31 PM
Mar 2016

Bush poked a stick into the hornet's nest and this is where it is all heading

leveymg

(36,418 posts)
26. Unfortunately, Clinton and Petraeus created new hornet nests and armed them.
Thu Mar 24, 2016, 09:45 AM
Mar 2016

ISIS may have originated in Iraq, but it was a mere footnote until the US joined its regional "allies" in setting up, funding, and transporting the flow of heavy arms and Jihadi fighters out of Libya into Syria.

That's an established fact, and the former Secretary of State and CIA Director should be held accountable for pushing that policy against Obama's better judgement with foreseeable catastrophic results.

leveymg

(36,418 posts)
28. Benefit of the doubt and circumstantial evidence that Petraeus was terminated with
Thu Mar 24, 2016, 03:47 PM
Mar 2016

prejudice while Obama graciously accepted Hillary's resignation following the death of Amb. Stevens. I consider this to be mitigating, not exonerating of the President for allowing the policy to progress beyond the talking stage into a very real, deadly and disastrous covert operation, the finding for which he signed off on.

Also mitigating are reports that Obama generally restrained the Libya/Syria regime change operations, and in the end curtailed some of the arms transfers. My reading of the same has led me to conclude that while Obama as CIC ultimately has ownership of these failed policies, there seems to be accumulating evidence that Hillary was using her private email to run a sort of off-the-books intelligence service as a go-around to the authorized Departmental system. We are seeing more of the details lately, and they go to confirm the suspicions.

The details of Petraeus' activities are still relatively well-hidden behind the wall of classification, but we have seen a glimpse of some of it, and it indicates that the CIA was doing more than just collecting and destroying Libyan MANPADs after the armories were looted - the NYT and other sources have revealed the Agency was actively involved with Qatari special forces and Turkish middlemen in distributing sophisticated Libyan weapons, and they ended up in the hands of al-Nusura and similar Jihadi groups that morphed into ISIS.

Yo_Mama

(8,303 posts)
32. ISIS said they would. Then Paris happened, then Brussels. What more proof do you need?
Thu Mar 24, 2016, 04:18 PM
Mar 2016

The Germans, after getting more than a hundred complaints about ISIS adherents in refugee shelters, arrested some of them. One was an ISIS adherent who came in to Germany as a refugee late last year with his wife and child.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/06/world/europe/germany-refugees-isis.html?_r=0

http://metro.co.uk/2016/02/06/suspected-isis-jihadis-enter-europe-posing-as-refugees-as-berlin-terror-attack-is-foiled-5666636/

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-europe-migrants-germany-security-idUSKCN0VE00E

They've known that there was a good chance that a nuclear reactor would be targeted for a while now.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/isis-dirty-bomb-nuclear-scientists-paris-attacks-a6884146.html

 

riderinthestorm

(23,272 posts)
4. As their caliphate fails in Iraq/Syria, this will be their new recruitment method
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 03:49 PM
Mar 2016

The madness of their ideology inspires sick followers to believe they are heroes by becoming suicide bombers/terrorists.

What better way than to strike in the heart of the "infidel" world.

I have no problem believing this which also makes me incredibly sad for the refugees. The door to Europe is closing very, very quickly if it's not already permanently shut.

I have no idea where they'll go now.

MariaThinks

(2,495 posts)
6. it is a sick twisted ideology that will only have two outcomes
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 03:50 PM
Mar 2016

1. the ideology and followers are destroyed
2. they destroy everyone else.

LiberalLovinLug

(14,154 posts)
10. The moderate Muslim community has done little to combat this
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 04:40 PM
Mar 2016

We keep hearing about how the majority of Muslims are against this kind of extremism. And we do hear some leaders speak out once in awhile but it is meek and far between. Why? Its like the NRA having so much influence in Washington that any Republican OR Red State Democrat as well, cannot ever speak ill of this extremist group either. Its a fear of the vocal minority. Either that or it is a secret support, if not the methods, then the simple fact of the success of ISIS in pushing back against the decedent, hedonistic, liberal Western open society ideology is actually admired behind closed doors.

And on a bigger scale, it is the same reason that Saudi Arabia, Egypt, and other Muslim powers do not either send their full armies in to once and for all defeat ISIS. Both countries have an estimated 500,000 troops each While ISIS is estimated at 30,000.

It is time for liberals to start to "appreciate" the power of decades of indoctrination by Muslim oligarchies on their children and adults in a twisted version of Isam to the point where most Muslim states have a large segment that actually think it is fine to execute someone for changing their faith from Islam to something else, or for rejecting any religion period.

Religion at best is a mild sedative to make people feel empowered because they have an invisible friend that watches out for them, and when they die they will be taken care of in perpetuity. Some people need that kind of assurance to get through the day. But at worst it can become a dangerous potential weapon used by ruling psychopaths to brainwash entire generations.

The West of course helped this development along with their historic colonization and taking advantage of third world Muslim countries. But all that means is we have burnt our bridges in regards to being listened to. So it is now even more important for world Muslim leaders to publicly stand up for peace over whatever political price they may take for doing so.

MariaThinks

(2,495 posts)
12. i don't see that the moderates do anything. Every attack is followed by their self concern about how
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 05:09 PM
Mar 2016

they are treated. there are no ideas about controlling the extremists aside from addressing every insult or attack against the muslim community stretching back hundreds of years - and never any addressing of the attacks against other communities.

while we accept tens of thousands of refugees, what do the other arab states do? I think the saudias offered to fund the more extremist mosques around the world.

Most interviews with moderate muslims also reveal something interesting. They don't often condemn the extremists outright. Simple questions:

1. should a person converting from Islam to another religion be subjected to any type of punishment or shunning including but not limited to death?
2. can a muslim marry a non-muslim without being punished or shunned.
3. should adultorers or homosexuals be put to death, by stoning or some other method?

I think a moderate would immediately answer no to each question, otherwise why am I expected to be liberal in my viewpoint.

romanic

(2,841 posts)
14. Watch out.
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 05:39 PM
Mar 2016

You'll be branded as a xenophobic anti-Islamic meanie for not treating the religion with kid gloves.

No but I agree with you, I think "Moderate" Muslims need to get a handle on the ISIS problem and on the extreme views of Islam itself. They've got to unless they want to be dragged in the mud further by their silence and inaction.

 

mylye2222

(2,992 posts)
18. I just have been threated that way yesturday
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 06:14 PM
Mar 2016

In french-pooitical/news forums...
I wrote that sadly Abdelslams friends and harborers in Molenbeek might be celebrating Brussels attacks while Belgium is weeping.
I slamed terror cover-up people. No the whole area.
So I am a nazi....a racist.... a "f.. white imperialist"... N/T.

LiberalLovinLug

(14,154 posts)
30. Liberals are ahead in a lot of ways
Thu Mar 24, 2016, 04:04 PM
Mar 2016

They are smarter (more professionals, intellectuals, university grads etc..regard themselves as liberal)

They are more aware of issues (more liberals use social media)

They are more diverse, a big tent. (Just look at DU, from socialists to authoritarian conservatives)

They are funnier (Jon Stewart, John Oliver, Bill Maher...need I go on?)

They use facts to back up their points, for the most part. (In comparison to the other side's blatant provable lying)

They are more tolerant of the "other". Studies show conservatives are less empathetic of others pain.


But this last point can be so stubbornly held on to that it becomes a pissing contest. It becomes more knee-jerk obliged opposite reaction than anything based in reality. ie... If a Republican warns about the dangers of Sharia Law becoming the law in the United States, or that the President is secretly Muslim, etc.. we know its all BS, but because it is the Republicans that are known to be so racist and anti-immigrant, some liberals seem to always simply think the opposite must be true. That it is now racist or anti-immigrant to have concerns about the power and spread of anti-western, and by that I mean mostly anti-liberal propaganda perpetrated by the very powerful religious leaders that hold so much sway in Muslim communties. And the acceptance of violence and death penalties for thought crimes. I mean, its conservatives that most align with ISIS's bigotry, sexism, and use of guns and violence. Why do liberals always have to seemingly bend over backwards to not be honest and admit that religion, and theocracies, right now in the Islamic countries are dangerously indoctrinating large segments with instilled hatred for everything a good liberal has fought for over the last century in the West. Because when that is allowed to happen, the extremists always take it one lever further. Just like Hate Radio in the US. It is also a form of mass brainwashing that 1. prevents actual real and truthful information from getting to the people. 2. Repeats lies and innuendo over and over until it becomes a "fact". 3. At best it just makes people in general angry and stressed at imaginary problems with gub'mint, but at worst empowers mentally unstable zombies to act out.

Liberals should be raising their voices in supporting the small but abused liberal minority in Muslim countries. And we should be holding the majority of moderate Muslims to the same standard that we espouse for others, That staying silent is not acceptable anymore. And also we should not be shy about demanding they understand that the country they are immigrating to will be welcoming, and helpful, but in exchange they must acknowledge that they now live in a country with gay rights, women's rights, and where civil law trumps religious edicts.

 

mylye2222

(2,992 posts)
16. Agree with you.
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 06:07 PM
Mar 2016

I argued the same on French political forums.
Now I am dealing with threats and called a Nazi....
People, including from the far left will keep their eyes closed... until they' ll lost a friend or family member..

Initech

(99,915 posts)
8. And yet trying George W. for war crimes is "off the table".
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 04:26 PM
Mar 2016

Isis wouldn't exist without the War in Iraq, a product of the George W. Bush administration.

JustABozoOnThisBus

(23,283 posts)
9. Would it help? And, you give GWB too much credit.
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 04:38 PM
Mar 2016

The war started under GHWB, continued at a nice, steady pace under WJC, and was given increased heat by GWB (under the direction of President Cheney).

 

Nihil

(13,508 posts)
25. Might help but it simply wouldn't happen ...
Thu Mar 24, 2016, 09:19 AM
Mar 2016

... for the same reasons that the contributions of WJC and BHO are kept "off the table"
even more than the chance of justice for GWB: It's just one very exclusive club.

When you are doing the bidding of the oligarchy, you know that - as long as you follow
the orders - your back is covered.

jwirr

(39,215 posts)
11. I may be wrong but IMO what ISIS is doing is trying to
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 04:45 PM
Mar 2016

cause an uprising against the refugees so that they have no choice but to either return home or denounce Europe and fight back. Whenever there is another attack there is more hatred/fear and this helps ISIS with their goal.

MOST of the refugees are helpless tools caught between the forces.

 
19. Ding ding ding...
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 06:21 PM
Mar 2016

And the perpetual war machine is arming these insurgencies and terrorist groups because this sort of perpetual action/reaction is good for business. The terrorists and the warmongers in the west are winning while the hoi polloi are losing.

 

mylye2222

(2,992 posts)
23. +1
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 06:28 PM
Mar 2016

And so refugees would became hatefull towards the West... and therefore fall into Daesh' s arms.
Just another way to recuite, so that their "caliphate" might recover from its present struggles.

sus453

(164 posts)
15. This is just an observation, and I condemn the attack in Belgium, but . . .
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 06:04 PM
Mar 2016

The attack is a despicable act with no justification, and training 400 fighters to prey on civilians in Europe is lower than low. But from their point of view (which I do not share), the West is doing the same thing to civilians in the areas they control - drones, bombings, etc., so from their perspective it makes sense to take some of the war back to the west.

I am not defending them, but sometimes the pot calls the kettle black. Look at what the US and its surrogates have done in Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria, Libya, Vietnam, Cambodia, and Laos. Something to think about.

 
20. This is the natural consequence of war-as-a-business...
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 06:23 PM
Mar 2016

The elites want it this way. They like perpetual war because it is good for business and war against -ism is the best because -ism is abstract. The enemy is everywhere.

 

mylye2222

(2,992 posts)
22. Yes. But did Laotians and Vietnamese People
Wed Mar 23, 2016, 06:26 PM
Mar 2016

Did those Southern Asia people wowed to destroy United State as a kind of "renvenge"?
No.

muriel_volestrangler

(101,155 posts)
29. The group's publicly stated aim, however, is to crush any other religious interpretation
Thu Mar 24, 2016, 03:58 PM
Mar 2016

with extreme violence, if necessary - and have carried out massacres, mass rapes, and enslavement of powerless minorities in Syria and Iraq. We can't see them just as people in a war against "the West" (and in both France and Belgium, the people and the governments opposed the 2003 Iraq invasion).

Yo_Mama

(8,303 posts)
33. But what did the Yazidis ever do to them? They were no threat. ISIS is just a megalomaniac murder
Thu Mar 24, 2016, 04:22 PM
Mar 2016

cult. It has no limits.

It believes that the way to go to heaven is to kill yourself while committing murder.

They are insanely dangerous, and trying to apply logic like yours to them is just off.

 

philosslayer

(3,076 posts)
31. Nonsense
Thu Mar 24, 2016, 04:17 PM
Mar 2016

More fear mongering. This from the same intelligence community who thought Iraq had WMDs.

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