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Fri May 13, 2016, 08:14 AM

Fearing Trump, some Democrats up pressure on Sanders to exit

This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by etherealtruth (a host of the Latest Breaking News forum).

Source: Associated Press

WASHINGTON (AP) — Pressure is mounting on Bernie Sanders to end his campaign for president, with Democratic Party leaders raising alarms that his continued presence in the race is undermining efforts to beat presumptive GOP nominee Donald Trump this fall.

Sanders is having none of it, frequently telling the thousands of supporters who attend his rallies that he still has a narrow path to the nomination.

"Please do not moan to me about Hillary Clinton's problems," Sanders said in a recent interview with MSNBC. "It is a steep hill to climb, but we're going to fight for every last vote."


Read more: https://www.yahoo.com/news/fearing-trump-democrats-pressure-sanders-exit-074218940--election.html



Your thoughts?

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Reply Fearing Trump, some Democrats up pressure on Sanders to exit (Original post)
chwaliszewski May 2016 OP
Merryland May 2016 #1
lewebley3 May 2016 #102
RiverNoord May 2016 #111
Post removed May 2016 #116
RiverNoord May 2016 #129
SammyWinstonJack May 2016 #133
Renew Deal May 2016 #2
Post removed May 2016 #9
JonLeibowitz May 2016 #18
Mbrow May 2016 #23
JonLeibowitz May 2016 #25
Mbrow May 2016 #68
jhart3333 May 2016 #70
ancianita May 2016 #143
Ned_Devine May 2016 #123
ybbor May 2016 #81
EvieM May 2016 #91
Orrex May 2016 #92
JonLeibowitz May 2016 #120
RiverNoord May 2016 #125
angrychair May 2016 #43
Renew Deal May 2016 #50
AgingAmerican May 2016 #52
Plucketeer May 2016 #98
morningfog May 2016 #56
angrychair May 2016 #58
RhettScarlett May 2016 #171
donnasgirl May 2016 #69
Renew Deal May 2016 #75
donnasgirl May 2016 #89
Renew Deal May 2016 #94
donnasgirl May 2016 #109
KPN May 2016 #138
A Simple Game May 2016 #166
RhettScarlett May 2016 #173
RiverNoord May 2016 #95
angrychair May 2016 #113
zentrum May 2016 #87
bjo59 May 2016 #66
billhicks76 May 2016 #67
jhart3333 May 2016 #71
Renew Deal May 2016 #76
jhart3333 May 2016 #78
Renew Deal May 2016 #84
jhart3333 May 2016 #97
Renew Deal May 2016 #99
SunSeeker May 2016 #135
leftofcool May 2016 #137
Human101948 May 2016 #160
kadaholo May 2016 #96
jhart3333 May 2016 #104
freedom fighter jh May 2016 #73
RiverNoord May 2016 #80
zalinda May 2016 #88
RiverNoord May 2016 #103
liberal from boston May 2016 #117
NJCher May 2016 #141
RiverNoord May 2016 #172
All in it together May 2016 #165
Android3.14 May 2016 #93
yeoman6987 May 2016 #101
Wibly May 2016 #162
RhettScarlett May 2016 #170
yourpaljoey May 2016 #3
MissDeeds May 2016 #32
SammyWinstonJack May 2016 #105
Fuddnik May 2016 #4
RealAmericanDem May 2016 #5
merrily May 2016 #11
apnu May 2016 #65
Bluenorthwest May 2016 #33
NewImproved Deal May 2016 #55
coco77 May 2016 #72
snort May 2016 #168
Yallow May 2016 #6
Shadowflash May 2016 #29
merrily May 2016 #7
hueymahl May 2016 #39
merrily May 2016 #46
reddread May 2016 #41
jwirr May 2016 #108
pengu May 2016 #147
jtuck004 May 2016 #8
Autumn May 2016 #10
Playinghardball May 2016 #149
NRaleighLiberal May 2016 #12
TheCowsCameHome May 2016 #13
4bucksagallon May 2016 #14
yellerpup May 2016 #15
jwirr May 2016 #110
yellerpup May 2016 #153
jwirr May 2016 #158
hollowdweller May 2016 #16
me b zola May 2016 #17
coffeeAM May 2016 #19
carburyme May 2016 #156
sulphurdunn May 2016 #20
karynnj May 2016 #21
djean111 May 2016 #28
karynnj May 2016 #51
djean111 May 2016 #62
karynnj May 2016 #90
djean111 May 2016 #106
karynnj May 2016 #114
djean111 May 2016 #122
karynnj May 2016 #124
djean111 May 2016 #128
SammyWinstonJack May 2016 #136
NV Whino May 2016 #22
liberal N proud May 2016 #24
BillZBubb May 2016 #26
afertal May 2016 #27
SammyWinstonJack May 2016 #115
Larkspur May 2016 #30
Cryptoad May 2016 #35
Larkspur May 2016 #40
Cryptoad May 2016 #54
Larkspur May 2016 #79
Cryptoad May 2016 #86
ancianita May 2016 #152
Cryptoad May 2016 #155
Redwoods Red May 2016 #150
Cryptoad May 2016 #151
TheCowsCameHome May 2016 #49
LiberalLovinLug May 2016 #142
Cryptoad May 2016 #144
LiberalLovinLug May 2016 #164
That Guy 888 May 2016 #163
Roland99 May 2016 #63
Cryptoad May 2016 #146
Roland99 May 2016 #157
Cryptoad May 2016 #31
Bluenorthwest May 2016 #42
Cryptoad May 2016 #148
Red Oak May 2016 #34
floriduck May 2016 #36
CoffeeCat May 2016 #37
TxGrandpa May 2016 #38
Harriety May 2016 #44
Gene Debs May 2016 #45
Progressive dog May 2016 #47
Gregorian May 2016 #48
dubyadiprecession May 2016 #53
bigbrother05 May 2016 #57
hobbit709 May 2016 #59
GoneOffShore May 2016 #60
billhicks76 May 2016 #61
bjo59 May 2016 #64
Thespian2 May 2016 #74
SmittynMo May 2016 #77
SmittynMo May 2016 #82
highprincipleswork May 2016 #83
zentrum May 2016 #85
PatrickforO May 2016 #100
jwirr May 2016 #107
shireen May 2016 #112
Bonhomme Richard May 2016 #118
BeyondGeography May 2016 #119
rateyes May 2016 #121
AllyCat May 2016 #126
Skwmom May 2016 #127
phazed0 May 2016 #131
Skwmom May 2016 #132
Amimnoch May 2016 #130
Spitfire of ATJ May 2016 #134
KPN May 2016 #139
SheilaT May 2016 #140
onecaliberal May 2016 #145
Old Vet May 2016 #154
notadmblnd May 2016 #159
Wibly May 2016 #161
CharlotteVale May 2016 #167
MisterP May 2016 #169
etherealtruth May 2016 #174

Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:16 AM

1. If democracy means anything

Bernie & the American people need to ignore this attempted blackmail by the Clinton machine. And its media enablers like the AP

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Response to Merryland (Reply #1)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:09 AM

102. We won't have a any democracy if Trump gets elected

 

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #102)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:18 AM

111. :-(

 

Lewebly3, you're back to your sad tricks again.

Your argument is, quite literally, absurd.

It indicates that sacrificing important aspects of a democratic process is valid in order to keep important aspects of the democratic process from being sacrificed.

And, even in the ugliest worst-case scenario, a single President of the United States, especially someone as loathed as Donald Trump, cannot somehow annihilate the entire Constitutional basis for the very existence of the office.

If we send Hillary Clinton against Donald Trump, there is a considerable prospect of a Trump presidency. In which case an awful lot of vigilant people, and I'll include myself in that group, will be extremely active, using all legal means, as well as some forms of civil disobedience that probably aren't fully legal, but nevertheless morally right under the circumstances, to block any and all unconstitutional initiatives by the bastard.

It would not be Doomsday, just an fine example to the world of the extraordinary foolishness of millions of American Democrats and Republicans alike. Which would be no great surprise.

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #102)


Response to Post removed (Reply #116)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:44 AM

129. I won't vote for Clinton, but I'd beg you to reconsider your alternative.

 

Voting for Trump is just inviting a god-awful mess of our federal government for at least the next 4 years. I agree that Clinton represents what you claim, but Trump represents something awful as well.

Not voting for Clinton does not equal a vote for Trump, which is a common assertion around here.

Voting for Trump, however, well, um... duh.

Declaring that you'll vote for Trump truly does mean you're not the sort of person who belongs here.

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #102)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:51 AM

133. Boo!

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:18 AM

2. Sanders is an egomaniac that can't stand that he lost

And doesn't know how to break it to his supporters. He's also advised by two guys that winning presidential campaigns would avoid and those guys are getting rich off of him.

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #2)


Response to Renew Deal (Reply #2)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:37 AM

18. ^^^ what you said!

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Response to JonLeibowitz (Reply #18)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:40 AM

23. I see the alert police are out in full force

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Response to Mbrow (Reply #23)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:44 AM

25. I see now I was slightly ambiguous about who I was referring to....

Oops!

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Response to JonLeibowitz (Reply #25)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:43 AM

68. sorry Jon

I was referring to the hidden post. I use to be called for juries about everyday, I'm at 90%. But i've not been called in over a month, I'm seeing people who have 11 hides in less then 90 days still posting, makes you wonder what has happened to the site.

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Response to Mbrow (Reply #68)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:45 AM

70. I'm not wondering at all.

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Response to Mbrow (Reply #68)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:11 AM

143. I'm at 100% chance and haven't served since Mar. 17. Maybe what's happened is a free speech

standard which has slowed down alerts, since alerters can aso get Hides if their alert is denied.

I'm on every day, so my not being called can't be due to erratic site attendance.

Maybe MIRT has higher activity.

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Response to Mbrow (Reply #23)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:35 AM

123. I got alerted for posting someone's profile stats

 

This person had signed up last week and was doing CTR type stuff. So, all I said in the subject line was "Interesting" and in the body of the post I put out this person's stats. That got me a "hide". Can I appeal my hide?

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Response to JonLeibowitz (Reply #18)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:55 AM

81. That is one of the most ridiculous hides I have ever seen

Wow!

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Response to ybbor (Reply #81)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:04 AM

91. absolutely ~ all in for hill, apparently!! n/t

 

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Response to ybbor (Reply #81)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:04 AM

92. I agree.

It should have been 7-0 instead of 6-1.

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Response to Orrex (Reply #92)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:26 AM

120. Nonsense -- when it is confirmed that Brock is paying for online trolls, one cannot be too careful.

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Response to Orrex (Reply #92)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:38 AM

125. Wow.

 

We're damn good at double-standards on DU.

Here's a very meaningful portion of the 'Our Community Standards:'

"It is the responsibility of all DU members to participate in a manner that promotes a positive atmosphere and encourages good discussions among a diverse community of people holding a broad range of center-to-left viewpoints."

One guy accuses, absurdly, Bernie Sanders of being an insulated egomaniac, which is not a question of policies, political strategy, or substance. It's an absurd and very hostile claim regarding the state of mind of a person he's never met.

Which is way off the rails with respect to what DU is really about.

So another poster questions his motives. And that gets hidden. Then the same poster's who made the absurd 'egomaniac' asserts that, should circumstances render Hillary Clinton unsuitable for the nomination, somehow Joe Biden would likely become the nominee.

Which, of course, is not only absurd, but would be an absolute disaster for the Democratic party on a scale not seen since the Civil War (not because of Biden - I like him. Because of the astounding contempt it would demonstrate for Democratic primary and caucus voters), I also have some strong concerns about his motives.

The OP is about Democratic elite urging Bernie Sanders to withdraw his candidacy for the Democratic nomination, in a manner that suggests that they believe this would be good for the Democratic Party. The poster, on the other hand, appears to be taking positions with utter disregard for the consequences to the Democratic Party.

I think you've got things backwards.

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #2)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:03 AM

43. In 2008

HRC stayed in until the last caucus and last primary was over. Get over yourself.

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Response to angrychair (Reply #43)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:22 AM

50. She should have dropped out too

And it was far closer. Bernies only hope is for super-delegates to flip or for something bad to happen to Hillary. If something bad happens, Bernie is not the next one up.

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #50)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:27 AM

52. If something bad happens and Bernie is not the next one up

 

We lose

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #52)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:06 AM

98. Might I add that if "something bad" doesn't happen

 

we still LOSE.

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #50)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:34 AM

56. Bernie is the next one up if something bad happens.

 

He has the next most delegates.

And, as of now, flipping supers is not his route to possible win. Really the only route, extreme unlikely long shot, is securing the majority of pledged delegates. Neither candidate can or will do that until June 7, essentially the last day of voting.

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #50)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:36 AM

58. What??

If something bad happens, Bernie is not the next one up.


What are you basing that logic on? He is the only other declared Democratic presidential candidate. He is the only other declared Democratic presidential candidate that has won caucuses and primaries across the country. He has over 10 million votes and millions of donations to he presidential campaign.
By what strange logic is he not the next logical choice? What bizarre situation do you envision that a Biden or another would sweep in and accept the nomination over Sanders? Despite your personal hate of Sanders, that scenario would never happen like that.

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Response to angrychair (Reply #58)

Fri May 13, 2016, 12:34 PM

171. The Party will never let Sanders hold the power.

Not whether he SHOULD or not, just what the party will do (or not do). If you think otherwise, I'm sorry but you're naive.
Biden will be called in should something happen to Hillary.

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #50)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:44 AM

69. How do you figure Bernie is not the next one up?

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Response to donnasgirl (Reply #69)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:49 AM

75. Super Delegates will decide

With the help of pledged delegates. I suspect they will favor Biden.

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #75)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:02 AM

89. If that was to happen

That would be the end of the Party, it would show everyone in the Country that their votes do not count,

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Response to donnasgirl (Reply #89)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:04 AM

94. Their votes counted

They chose someone else. Why should the party nominate someone just because they chose to run this cycle? It would totally open things up.

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #94)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:17 AM

109. Then i suggest do it

But it will be at a heavy cost the Democratic party, as for the Party Nominating anyone that is up to the voters the last I looked.

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #94)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:00 AM

138. Hahaha.

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #94)

Fri May 13, 2016, 12:03 PM

166. So if Bernie drops out can his supporters nominate someone else in his place?

How it works is she can throw her support behind someone but her delegates are free to go where they wish. Her delegates represent her and no one else, when she is gone they are either gone or pick someone else. I suspect many would go to Bernie, but once Hillary is gone no one can tell them who they have to support.

If Hillary is gone then so is her bribe money for the super delegates so many may decide to support Bernie also.

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Response to donnasgirl (Reply #89)

Fri May 13, 2016, 12:37 PM

173. They will come up with some reason why

But you and me know that reason is bullcrap. Hillary is ALL IN FAVOR of this. It's all about The Party and they don't consider Sanders a card-carrying member.

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #75)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:04 AM

95. If something made Clinton an unnaceptable choice for the

 

party, Sanders would unquestionably be the nominee.

Do you really want the Democratic party to burn every conceivable bridge its voters for the next couple of decades? That's what would happen in such a scenario. Which would be impossible unless Sanders was dead, as his delegates would never, never let such a thing happen, and there would be enough 'superdelegates' seeing sense to wrap it up sensibly.

That sort of statement makes me wonder what is really motivating you, because, although the OP is about some Party elites wanting Sanders to quite 'for the good of the party,' your statements don't seem to be oriented toward the good of the party at all.

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #75)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:21 AM

113. First

NO, SuperDelegates will not decide. That is not how it works. I suggest you read the rules.

Secondly, most importantly, that you think so little of Biden as a person and a Democrat, that he would go along with that is disappointing and insane proposal?

Your hate for Sanders is disturbing.

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Response to angrychair (Reply #43)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:00 AM

87. ^^THIS^^

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #2)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:42 AM

66. You keep telling yourself that - whatever it takes to calm your nerves.

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #2)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:43 AM

67. You Think We're Stupid Enough To Swallow That Crap?

 

Keep trying though. We need a good laugh after witnessing Hillary court Jebs money men.

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #2)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:47 AM

71. Making another donation to Bernie in your honor. Congratulations.

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Response to jhart3333 (Reply #71)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:50 AM

76. David Plouffe called it a fraud

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #76)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:54 AM

78. And another. Keep it up.

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Response to jhart3333 (Reply #78)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:58 AM

84. It won't make it any less of a fraud

It's like the lotto. I'll keep it going all day until you go broke. And we know Bernie doesn't have a problem with excessive and illegal donations.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511943364#post16

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #84)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:06 AM

97. David Plouffe is a fraud.

One more time. The Bernie Sanders campaign thanks you for your efforts.

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Response to jhart3333 (Reply #97)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:07 AM

99. How big do you think the FEC fine will be?

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #99)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:57 AM

135. Not as big as when the FEC weighs in on that campaign-funded Roman holiday.

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #76)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:00 AM

137. And he is correct. Campaign money for a trip to Rome???????????????

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Response to leftofcool (Reply #137)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:45 AM

160. Outrageous! He could have put that money to good use...

 

Like installing an email server in his basement or donating it to his own personal charity slush fund.

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Response to jhart3333 (Reply #71)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:05 AM

96. WAY TO GO JHART3333!!!

K&R

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Response to kadaholo (Reply #96)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:09 AM

104. Thank you. Just trying to do my part.

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #2)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:48 AM

73. Sanders hasn't lost. nt

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #2)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:55 AM

80. You haven't got the vaguest idea what you're talking about.

 

This statement is fundamentally absurd:

"c)an't stand that he lost"

Bernie Sanders biggest challenge has been coming to grips with the astounding level of support his candidacy has achieved. When he declared his candidacy, he hadn't but the slightest glimmer of possibility hat he could actually win. The entire point was to drive some national dialogue, if he could, and when he started pulling in crowds of thousands and donations from tens, then hundreds of thousands, he had to make some major decisions that he didn't expect to be confronting.

Now, have you ever met Bernie Sanders?

I have, 3 times. Once, about 2 years ago, totally by accident, I bumped into him in NY when he was heading for a Bill Moyers interview. He recalled me from a 5 minute conversation about 8 years before that, and I was rather flattering toward him. He had some time to spare, apparently, and we ended up chatting for about 20 minutes.

He dismissed my flattery gracefully, and I'll never forget just how down to earth he was. He didn't talk about himself at all, asked questions about me, my family, my interests.

I've met a few sitting Congressmen (literally - I've never met a Congresswoman), and 3 sitting Senators apart from Sanders. Each of them were very polite, but handled themselves just a bit stiffly, clearly on guard to ensure they didn't say something they didn't want to get around. (I've met a couple of them after they retired, and the tenor was completely different.)

But you spend 5 minutes with Bernie Sanders and it's obvious you're talking to the real person without any pretense. I've met people who I would have to say are almost certainly less ego-driven than Sanders, people who seem almost oblivious to their own psychological gratification on any level, and they've tended to be poor and uninterested in most activities. But a politician? Never.

The reason why he is continuing in the race is very simple. He made a commitment to hundreds of thousands of people who have donated a lot of money (and we're not in hedge funds or global capital management - it's real money that comes from real work) to stick. That's it. He made it clear that he wasn't just going to bail if the going got tough, and he's holding up his end.

You suggest that Bernie Sanders is somehow insulated by Jeff Weaver and Tad Devine. Seriously? Sanders is about as hands-on as you get from a politician. This is a guy who's both won and lost more elections than Hillary Clinton, and in the present context, he's nobody's fool.

I write things about my concerns and impressions of politicians like Hillary Clinton. But I don't claim to understand the inner workings of someone's mind. Sometimes I will straight out ask for opinions about what people think a politician's state of mind might be like, based on statements or behavior. But it's still all speculation.

I will say this, though. Coming from the experiences of 46 years of hard knocks, I am absolutely certain that the 'ego' of Bernie Sanders is a trifle compared to the nearly boundless personal ambition of Hillary Clinton. You'll find some way to dismiss what I say, even though, somewhere in the back of your mind, you'll recognize that this is true, but very inconvenient with respect to the overall point of view you've adopted.

And if you get beyond your own inner necessity to seek out ways of demonizing someone you consider to be an obstacle to something that you have decided matters to you, you might just discover that it's a very, very good thing that Bernie Sanders hasn't pulled out of the race.

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Response to RiverNoord (Reply #80)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:01 AM

88. Bernie's ego has been the latest talking point. eom

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Response to zalinda (Reply #88)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:09 AM

103. And it's absurd nonsense, which is why I call it out.

 

It's got nothing to do with reality.

Which, of course, makes it a perfect subject for the time-honored practice of attacking a political candidate by totally misrepresenting that candidate's best personal attributes.

But to see it on DU, at such a level, is disheartening...

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Response to zalinda (Reply #88)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:24 AM

117. Go Bernie


Signs of Panic?? California voter registration experiencing Historic Growth.
"Demographically, they largely fit the profile of Bernie Sanders supporters," Vasquez said. "How many will vote down ticket, and what are the campaigns doing to appeal to these new voters? We’ll find out on election night.”

http://www.kpbs.org/news/2016/may/09/report-new-voters-may-influence-san-diego-races/

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Response to RiverNoord (Reply #80)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:04 AM

141. educational, informative post

It was interesting to hear of your impressions of political representatives and the comparison to Bernie. I also found this comment of interest: "I've met people who I would have to say are almost certainly less ego-driven than Sanders, people who seem almost oblivious to their own psychological gratification on any level, and they've tended to be poor and uninterested in most activities. But a politician? Never."

The "uninterested in most activities" is what I wonder about. Level of involvement? Some people are just not very involved or engaged in the world. I find those who are fascinating; those who aren't of little interest to me.

I've also always been interested in "ego."What is it that gives some people a big ego, while others do not have that?


Cher

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Response to NJCher (Reply #141)

Fri May 13, 2016, 12:35 PM

172. I've got a friend who literally has no ambition of any kind. (warning - became kind of a novel)

 

He's in his forties, like me, is rather intelligent (so maybe not like me, who's to say... ), a bit of a sci-fi/fantasy nerd (a bit like me), and is perpetually on the edge of being dead broke.

He seems to be a typical straight guy in terms of the usual basic reaction to attractive women, but seem so have no interest at all in any sort of relationship.

He's a thin guy, not much for grooming, and smokes, so he carries that funk around with him most of the time.

He accepts people 'spotting him' for a meal when out with the guys and is grateful, but any hint of 'that means you pay me back' gets a little awkward, so those of us who do spot him know that we're picking up the tab and leave it at that.

I'm in a board gaming group of a bunch of 40-ish guys who get together every few weeks for plenty of BS around a table that will feature a few of the latest games to be found among the 'board game hobbyist culture' (try www.boardgamegeek.com for a glimpse of what I'm talking about.) And if the particular friend I refer to ever wins a game, we all try to pretend it's not a major event... He learns rules, can plan ahead, but just doesn't seem interested in winning.

He's not emotionally stunted, so far as anyone can discern. His closest friend, (they go back all the way to grade school) a guy who has made plenty of money in IT through his life, is very politically liberal (except that he's a gun nut and is totally up-front about the irony), has a healthy, well balanced family that he's utterly devoted to, in all the right ways, and recently chucked the IT life to become a H.S. physics teacher (which took a lot of ambition), is convinced that he just plain lacks the basic machinery for initiative.

He's a pleasant person with a healthy sense of humor. And, although we talk a little bit about the jobs he tends to hold down for about 6 months before he 'loses' them and goes through a few months of rapidly depleting reserves before he has absolutely no choice but to track down another job, I know there's no point suggesting strategies for a more stable income-type life. It could be the best advice ever given on the subject and it'd be lost on him.

And as for 'ego,' he does seem to display signs of faux-indignation when someone ribs him, but I've never seen him take actual umbrage to anything said about him. Of course, he doesn't get treated in a way that would elicit that by his friends, but, of course, guys sometimes take things just a bit past the edge, and he's practically immune. It would be like... I don't know, repeatedly kicking a puppy (I don't kick puppies!, just looking for a comparison) that yips happily as you start breaking bones and cause internal injuries. And so you realize that, not only is there no reason in the world to kick the puppy, the psychological harm you would cause to yourself doing such a thing would cause you to stop way faster than any response from the puppy.

And for all that, I'd gladly include him in any sort of 'guy's night' activity. If he gets into real money trouble, I'm among the guys who would (have a couple of times) contribute to the bailout.

And so one thing I've learned about people over the years is that not everyone possesses the essential attributes necessary to 'better themselves' (financially speaking), make or execute long-term goals, or, really, just plain accomplish stuff. Some people are just along for the ride, wherever it takes them.

When I see some asshole bitching about how 'welfare queens' are milking the system, I know one thing - 'miking the system' in the way that they're talking about takes a lot of work for minimal return. And when the target is a homeless panhandler, who apparently only needs people to stop 'enabling' her/him so that there'll be no choice but to get a job, I think (for the very few who aren't crippled by serious psychological or psychiatric problems) that, for the people who really just aren't driven to even modest ambition, the cost among those of us who do have such drives to enable them to have at least a rudimentary level of basic needs met is so minimal that there's no point in talking about disincentives to work, etc.

The other thing I've learned is that ambition and ego often go together, but not always. I know I'd sacrifice my life for any member of my family if it was necessary to save them from serious harm or death. And I've comforted myself a little bit by thinking through that sort of thing hypothetically, the comfort coming from the recognition that hesitation based on concern for my own safety wouldn't be a factor at all. Of course, the probability of doing something like that is minimal in the extreme, but if it happened, my ego wouldn't be involved. It would be an act driven solely by my valuation of someone else's well-being at a higher level than my own. If I, and certainly many parents, grandparents, uncles and aunts, etc., would act almost instinctively based on that comparison of value, how many other things that we do, which don't require such a sacrifice, are also driven by valuation of the well-being of others sometimes at a higher level of ourselves. It happens in war, it must also happen in peacetime and in all sorts of ways.

If you read all of this... I'm really sorry Time to get back to work - shouldn't abuse the fact that I'm the IT director of my employer's company...

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Response to RiverNoord (Reply #80)

Fri May 13, 2016, 12:01 PM

165. Thank you, well said and so true!

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #2)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:04 AM

93. Someone is projecting

 

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #2)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:08 AM

101. Hillary didn't leave the race until June in 2008

 

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #2)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:53 AM

162. Based on what?

Are you a Psychiatrist who has interviewed Sanders?
How can he have "lost" when the vote hasn't happened yet?
Who are the two guys you speak of?
How do you know how much they are being paid, if they exist at all?

Your comment is atypical of what we have come to expect from the Clinton campaign, all artful smear.

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #2)

Fri May 13, 2016, 12:29 PM

170. Sanders is the High Sparrow

....and Hillary is Cersei Lannister.

Time for her walk of shame. I'm not voting for her if she wins. No one should. All the energy in this race has been Bernie's. He's clearly the choice!

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:19 AM

3. Hill needs to drop out before the shoes start dropping (octopus shoes, mind you)

Hill and Biden and Warren need to back Sanders. Now!

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Response to yourpaljoey (Reply #3)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:56 AM

32. +1000

 

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Response to yourpaljoey (Reply #3)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:10 AM

105. +1000000

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:19 AM

4. Considering Bernie has much better poll numbers against Trump.....

Maybe they should start pressuring Hillary to leave.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:20 AM

5. Bernie needs to dial it back.


Three points:

1. At this same point in '08 Obama's lead over Hillary was SMALLER than the current lead she has over Bernie.

2. In '08 Hillary went on to win almost all the remaining primaries. How did that come out? It is likely that Hillary will win New Mexico and New Jersey. California may be close but as long as Hillary gets a mere 23% of those votes she is the nominee.

3. In '08 Hillary did not drop out at this point BUT she did totally dial it back knowing we needed a dem in office regardless of who it was.

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Response to RealAmericanDem (Reply #5)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:25 AM

11. And dialing it back made America forget what she had said earlier in the campaign? Things that were

racially-tinged; things that implied Obama was a Muslim, things like Senator McCain and I are ready for that 3 am phone call. Senator Obama is not?

Seriously? America got collective amnesia because she dialed back that crap during the last month?

Not to mention Hillary had a deal to cut for herself with Obama at the end of the primary.

Please. Pretending she took some kind of high road in 2008 just won't wash.

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Response to merrily (Reply #11)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:41 AM

65. As campaigns fall short they become increasingly desperate and shrill

Hillary was that in 2008. All those things she said were said out of desperation. Everybody knows it, and nobody holds it against her. There is no collective amnesia, more like giving people a pass when they're frustrated while behind. This is what politicians do, Bernie is no different in this case.

He's starting to amp up the FUD on Hillary just like Hillary did to Obama and failed. It was ugly then and its ugly now. But its not unexpected or unusual.

I don't get people whitewashing history, suggesting Hillary was chill about losing to Obama. When it became apparent that Hillary wasn't going to catch Obama she, her campaign, and her supporters became very nasty and pouted publicly in the worst way.

I'll never forget the PUMAs, and I fear Bernie people are going to PUMA as well. Its disappointing, really, I thought we were better than this.

Yes its hard to lose, I've supported Bernie in this but I'm not a hopeful idealist. I'm a realist and pragmatic, we need the change that Bernie's talking about, but he's not winning and its time to start planning the next steps and what we're going to do with Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump.

That doesn't mean Bernie and his people should pack up and go home. But it is time to get ready for a loss and what comes after.

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Response to RealAmericanDem (Reply #5)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:56 AM

33. She did not 'dial it back' she doubled down. Here is Hillary from May 2008....

 

She lists many reasons she should stay in until the end, going so far as to mention RFK's murder but also including many other less offensive supporting elements. But 'dialing back' precludes citation of assassinated past candidates. That's dialing it way, way up.

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Response to Bluenorthwest (Reply #33)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:30 AM

55. Chilling. A deeply sinister woman...

 

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Response to RealAmericanDem (Reply #5)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:48 AM

72. Hey surrogate

 

Bernie,Bernie,Bernie!!!

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Response to RealAmericanDem (Reply #5)

Fri May 13, 2016, 12:26 PM

168. Mr. Brock!

Whuuzzzuuuppp?

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:21 AM

6. Maybe They Should Pressure Hillary To Exit Instead

 

I mean, if they want to hold onto the White House.....

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Response to Yallow (Reply #6)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:53 AM

29. Yup.

NT

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:21 AM

7. Why is Andrea Mitchell, whose job should be simply to inform us, serving as an agent of the DNC?

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Response to merrily (Reply #7)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:01 AM

39. Why are you surprised by this?

Not trying to be snarky toward you - I totally get your point.

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Response to hueymahl (Reply #39)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:07 AM

46. My post expressed no surprise.

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Response to merrily (Reply #7)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:03 AM

41. "inform"?

 

Im not so sure about that.
nice of Bernie to come to her rescue, though.

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Response to merrily (Reply #7)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:14 AM

108. Her bankster husband?

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Response to merrily (Reply #7)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:21 AM

147. You think her job is to inform us?

Buhahahahahahaha.

(catches breath)

Buhahahahahahaha.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:22 AM

8. President Sanders should ignore it and continue. They are irrelevant. n/t

 



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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:23 AM

10. Democratic party leaders can STFU. I'm sick of their moaning too she's not a china

doll to be wrapped in bubble wrap. If she has to be coddled that much it look to me they backed the wrong horse in this race.

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Response to Autumn (Reply #10)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:25 AM

149. I'm sticking with Bernie!!

 

He's the only one in my opinion that can beat Trump!!!

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)


Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:27 AM

13. Guess what? They got behind the wrong candidiate.

Maybe they couldn't see with all her baggage in the way.

Ain't that a *itch?

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:29 AM

14. Don'tcha do it Bernie..

If or as it's looking more likely now, when Hillary is charged there has to be a viable candidate ready to go.... Sorry but no Uncle Joe is not a viable candidate IMO, I do like his VP pick though, but hey Bernie might chose Warren too..... Keep on trucking Bernie, hang in there odds are good you may yet defeat what'shername.....

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:32 AM

15. He said from the beginning he was in it to the end.

Everyone deserves to have their vote counted and the primary isn't over. He's not going to quit.

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Response to yellerpup (Reply #15)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:17 AM

110. Bernie sees this from the point of view of his supporters. We

donated - he runs.

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Response to jwirr (Reply #110)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:33 AM

153. And this indicates that he would listen to the voters

AFTER he is president as well. He's not running for himself, he's running because we want him to run.

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Response to yellerpup (Reply #153)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:38 AM

158. Absolutely.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:32 AM

16. I don't see that Trump is more formidable than McCain

 


Clinton hung in there against Obama for a long time, which I thought was good.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:37 AM

17. Hillary should step aside

Bernie would revitalize the Party, but they seem too short-sighted to see it.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:38 AM

19. Bernie is gonna end up the nominee, you can just see it with trump rising in the polls and Bernie

 

Winning all the remaining contests.

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Response to coffeeAM (Reply #19)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:36 AM

156. Delusional Much!

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:39 AM

20. The Democratic Party

 

establishment doesn't care if nominating Clinton costs them the election. They aim to do it anyway. Why in the hell should Sanders aid and abet such stupidity?

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:40 AM

21. Note that McCain clinched months before Obama in 2008

HRC, who was much closer than Bernie, but unlikely to win stayed in even after all the contests. Here, Sanders is astonishingly not mathematically eliminated from getting the majority of pledged delegates. True, it is completely improbable to win the percent needed to do it, but Sanders backing out before that happens could cause many of his supporters to drop out all together.

What might be a brilliant thing for Sanders and HRC to do now is for both of them to commit to Obama's effort to get rid of American tax shelters. This is right down Sander's alley and he could transition much of his grassroots to this issue which deals directly with income inequality and corruption.

For HRC, this would be a counter to her perceived weakness on these issues. Her bring 100 percent behind both Obama and the broader international anti corruption effort could help Sanders move his supporters to her in June.

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Response to karynnj (Reply #21)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:52 AM

28. Bernie cannot "move" me to support a Third Way hawk who will say anything at all in order to

 

win. What would happen afterwards would just be the Third Way and Wall Street and MIC wish list. I don't believe a word Hillary says, about any damned thing. No point in even bothering to listen to her.

So this endless maundering and snipping and snapping about Bernie dropping out and then OF COURSE his supporters will blindly pivot to Hillary - that's yer unicorns'n'rainbows.

Oh, and "perceived" weakness? Bwahahahaha! Hillary is proudly in their pocket.

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Response to djean111 (Reply #28)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:26 AM

51. I hope that you rethink this if you are in anything but a very blue or very red state

I am not a Hillary Clinton fan. I became disillusioned in both Clintons decades ago -- and I had always been skeptical of Bill Clinton. However, though it will be Clinton and Trump on the ballot - everything that Obama has worked for and everything Bernie believes in will implicitly be there. Healthcare, education, any help for those who need it will probably not happen under Trump.

I do not trust Trump to keep the US in this new anti-corruption effort or in the Paris Climate Change agreement. It is essential that we be in both. Consider if the world acts together to end tax havens. Every country benefits because people at the top can not hide money that should be taxed. This would help every country, but consider that the improvement might be strongest where it is needed most in third world countries where only a few have almost all the money. This effort could be a game changer.

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Response to karynnj (Reply #51)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:40 AM

62. Neither Trump nor Hillary would do ANYTHING about corruption.

 

Funnily enough, I think Trump is mired in corruption in a very surface and shallow sort of way, since I doubt he has had access to the really really big and powerful money. The Clintons have wooed that money assiduously, and benefited greatly from it. So, again - neither Trump not Hillary will really do anything about the corruption.

Hillary has already said no to Single Payer. The ACA is rapidly becoming just another cash cow for insurance companies.

I am not saying vote for Trump - I am saying that Hillary should not be the Dem candidate if we want any sort of change (for the better) at all.

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Response to djean111 (Reply #62)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:04 AM

90. Hillary Clinton was never my choice, but it is near certain that by June she will be the

de facto nominee. I have no problem with anyone voting against HRC now in the primaries. Everyone should vote their preference. However, I think that in the general election, it is not true that HRC is as bad as Trump.

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Response to karynnj (Reply #90)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:12 AM

106. Then maybe you should wait until Hillary has been declared the nominee to start talking about

 

this stuff. It is off-putting, and not in the least bit helpful to Hillary, I promise you.

I honestly don't know why anybody still thinks mentioning that they are not really for Hillary, or were big Bernie supporters, BUT, or any of that sort of window dressing, really even bothers. I guess it is supposed to foster a false sense of fellowship or whatever, but it has been used so much it is now just amusing.

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Response to djean111 (Reply #106)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:21 AM

114. I voted for Bernie here in Vermont. The reason I wrote this is because of the importance of Obama's

and the world's initiative. Now is the time for both to join behind it based on its merits.

I noted that HRC has not won 50% of the pledged delegates yet. However the odds are against Sanders getting to 50% - and if he doesn't he won't be the nominee.

This issue is SO what he stands for here and internationally, that it should be a no brainer for him to jump onto this effort. If he wins the nomination and the Presidency, it is clearly something he would continue. If he doesn't, this is an effort that many Sanders people led by Bernie could fight for. If, as I would expect, HRC backs the effort as well, it helps Sanders and HRC past one of their biggest perceived differences.

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Response to karynnj (Reply #114)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:33 AM

122. Boiled down, you are asking that Bernie step down now, and that his supporters

 

unite behind Hillary in the (bound to be crushed) hope that Hillary will keep her word on anything at all, much less anything to do with the accumulation of money. I don't care who you voted for in the primary. That is irrelevant.

No, Bernie should not step down. Hillary is a Third Way 1% Trojan horse, posing as a Democrat.

Biggest perceived differences? Did you forget about war and the TPP and cluster bombs and single payer and bloody interfering regime changes and fracking? Good grief!

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Response to djean111 (Reply #122)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:36 AM

124. I don't think Bernie should step down until HRC gets 50% plus of the pledged delegates

If there is a miracle win of Bernie and he gets 50% plus of the pledged delegates - he will be the nominee.

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Response to karynnj (Reply #124)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:42 AM

128. And that will be decided at the convention. By Bernie.

 

Bernie's supporters are not some amorphous and biddable entity - they will do what they want to do.

A great many of the new-to-politics people will just drop back to trying to earn a living, afford some sort of mandated health insurance, and hoping they won't get drafted into some war over money and resources; they will continue to not be able to buy a home because of student debt, they will continue to see jobs sent out of the country and the remaining jobs pay less and less. They will continue wondering what kind of world will be inherited by their children. Neither Trump not Hillary are going to help with any of that.

'bye, now, really!

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Response to djean111 (Reply #128)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:58 AM

136. +1000000

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:40 AM

22. Oh boy. They're out in force this morning.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:40 AM

24. If Bernie Sanders is the Democrat he says he is

he needs to take a serious look at the math and probabilities and make the right decision.

Too much time and money being wasted on the internal battle while Trump and his band of GOP hypocrites are out there already swinging.

It is going to take everything to make sure that Trump and the crazies that believe his rhetoric don't prevail.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:50 AM

26. "some Democrats"--yeah Third Way, corporatist Democrats.

Sanders will wisely ignore their whining and press on.

Want president trump? Vote Hillary.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:52 AM

27. Hillary has potentially been handed the least qualified..

 

...opponent imaginable, but she and her supporters are terrified she might not be able to beat him.


Go Bernie!

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Response to afertal (Reply #27)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:22 AM

115. Least qualified, how so?



Don't drop out Bernie! F those who suggest you do so.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:54 AM

30. If HRC was a strong candidate, Bernie would have lefte the race a long time ago

 

but she is a weak candidate.

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Response to Larkspur (Reply #30)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:59 AM

35. Funny,,,

Hillary has beaten Bern by any metric u want to use and u call her the weak candidate, priceless!

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Response to Cryptoad (Reply #35)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:01 AM

40. Yet Bernie is still in the primary race and he has still won contests

 

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Response to Larkspur (Reply #40)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:28 AM

54. Yet he continues to drag down the Progressive movement by feeding his Ego!

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Response to Cryptoad (Reply #54)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:54 AM

79. The Clintons have the biggest egos

 

HRC's approval numbers have been in negative territory for years, yet she can't stop feeding her hunger for power.

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Response to Larkspur (Reply #79)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:59 AM

86. Mean While,,,,,,,,

HRC's number looking Good,


and Bern is booed at rally in North Dakota!

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Response to Cryptoad (Reply #86)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:33 AM

152. I want her numbers to be a reflection of a clean primary. It's not shaping up that way, and

HRC supporters know that.

North Dakota's people are mostly employed by Big Fossil frackers, NORAD and Big Ag, so yeah, they boo.

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Response to ancianita (Reply #152)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:35 AM

155. Bern Lost to HIllary looks mighty clean,,,,,,,,,,

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Response to Cryptoad (Reply #54)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:28 AM

150. This whole Bernie ego meme is lame and offensive.

 

You guys should be ashamed of yourselves. Really, it's like lower than snail trails.

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Response to Redwoods Red (Reply #150)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:31 AM

151. almost as low as,,,

dragging out the election Bern Lost to Hillary for no good reason, eh?

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Response to Cryptoad (Reply #35)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:15 AM

49. Read the OP.

I smell concern, if not a touch of panic.

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Response to Cryptoad (Reply #35)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:10 AM

142. Yeah, she beats him in every one!

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Response to LiberalLovinLug (Reply #142)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:13 AM

144. u do realize

that Quinnipac is rated by pollster analyst at best a B+ with a Republican Bias.... u keep me in stitches!

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Response to Cryptoad (Reply #144)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:57 AM

164. So its all the messenger's fault

Here are a few more

?739



?1438108367



?fit=1087%2C460&resize=350%2C200



................................


You know a truly confident Hillary backer would have just admitted that this is a big hurdle for their chosen candidate, and outlined reasons why they believed their candidate could overcome it. Very telling that all you have is to play the "kill the messenger" card.

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Response to Cryptoad (Reply #35)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:54 AM

163. With how much help from the Party, before any other candidate announced?

 

Over 400 Supers pledged to back her before anyone else even announced they would run.

Clinton went to the leadership over most Democratic leaning organizations (unions, etc) to get pledges of support before anyone else announced they would run. Oddly she didn't consider it important to get the consent (or input) of the members of those groups.

The DNC head seems to have a problem remembering she's not still part of her 2008 campaign.

The media has also largely backed her.

The fact that Sanders is still in this is amazing. The fact that given all that support Clinton still hasn't won enough pledged delegates to win is astonishing. If she's this weak in a Primary where she has almost total control, perhaps she should drop out.

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Response to Larkspur (Reply #30)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:41 AM

63. The polls show that. ALL polls in general election matchups have Bernie winning by larger margins

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Response to Roland99 (Reply #63)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:16 AM

146. that is mainly bc most people dont know

who the hell is Bern Sanders. But its moot anyway since Bern was unable to beat Hillary.

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Response to Cryptoad (Reply #146)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:37 AM

157. yeah...that's the reason



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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:54 AM

31. Looks like She doing a good job without yall's help

Since Bern and Band are not Democrats, they could give a shit less what is good for the Party.

RCP knows who is the presumptive nominee is.

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Response to Cryptoad (Reply #31)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:03 AM

42. I'm a Democrat and I support Democratic candidate Bernie Sanders. Your words are offensive

 

and insulting and based on nothing but your own sour world view. You do not own and operate this Party and I'm extremely adept at dealing with conservative straight people who think that they do own the Party. They are a fixture in our politics and thus not a surprise to anyone.

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Response to Bluenorthwest (Reply #42)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:22 AM

148. I am a Publicly elected member of the Democratic Party Exe Committee

so I do have some little part in operating the Party. Im sorry that reality of Hillary's win is a sour world view for u.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:56 AM

34. Bernie, tell the Hillbots to go pound sand.

If they can't beat Trump, they should have supported a better candidate.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 08:59 AM

36. The McCaskill crowd all need to be replaced by real Democrats.

 

(But I would like to see what the hair on the back of her neck looks like when it stand up like she said in the article.).

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:00 AM

37. Bernie has earned the right to stay in this race. Clinton has not earned the win.

No one has hit the magic number of 2383 in pledged delegates yet. If Clinton was a stronger candidate and she had arrived at that 2383 in pledged delegates, Bernie would be out.

Neither candidate is there.

You don't get to tell someone to exit the race. Hillary and her little establishment buddies need to pipe down. We're in it until the end.

Quit whining.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:01 AM

38. Is it because they fear Trump or is he a problem to Hillary? N/T

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:04 AM

44. Never!

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:06 AM

45. If they really fear Trump, anyone with any sense would pressure Clinton to drop out.

 

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:09 AM

47. It's hard to fight for votes that

have already been cast, as most have been.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:12 AM

48. Establishment fear.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:27 AM

53. BS can leave the race whenever he wants..

He doesn't need to seek approval from his supporters.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:35 AM

57. If it's over and he has no chance, what's stopping their turn toward the GE?

Running on two fronts is their choice based on where the risk is. Is the Clinton campaign concerned with messaging addressed to different audiences? Won't they be running in those states in the GE too?

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:36 AM

59. If they really want to beat Trump, Hillary is the one that needs to exit.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:37 AM

60. They should be putting the pressure on HRC-WJC, Inc. to quit.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:40 AM

61. Hillary Should Exit

 

She keeps losing. And exit polls in states she won show extreme election fraud. Yes she still was winning most of those but by much slimmer margins. Exit polls never lie. 4% margin of error. Idiots in the media believed Karl Rove that exit polls suddenly faulty when the polls stopped lining up in 2002 coinciding with the rise of electronic voting machines. We all know how sickening the Bush/Clinton alliance is amd now Hillary is reaching out to Jebs funders. No way Bernie should listen to these corrupted Clintonites.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:41 AM

64. Same old, same old.

Democratic Party "leaders" have wanted Bernie to get out since before he ever got in.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:49 AM

74. If Bernie loses,

America is toast...the GREEDY BASTARDS who control the US will have their willing surrogate to continue the decimation of democracy...BUT Her Royal Highness would have to beat tRump, and more and more, it appears that tRump will beat her...

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Response to Thespian2 (Reply #74)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:52 AM

77. We owe it to ourselves to

totally fuck this one up (like many others in the past)and it sure looks like that's the path we're heading down.

How sad

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:56 AM

82. Fearing Trump?

Umm, I don't think so. Unless they think he really can win against the queen. And if that's the case, then Bernie is the man. Polls prove this to be true. So, I guess, I don't get this post.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:56 AM

83. We're in it to win it. That's our right, and I hope we take it all the way. This Democratic Party

 

is in serious trouble and Hillary is a flawed candidate with an FBI investigation hanging over her head.

Get out now? Ridiculous idea, seems to me.

Keep on campaigning Hillary, if you like, and take care of your own troubled candidacy. Stay true to something, and your karma just may work itself out. I don't count on it, but it just may.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 09:59 AM

85. Her flagging against

….Trump has nothing to do with Bernie and everything to do with what a weak candidate she is. Polls on disapproval ratings show that both she and Trump have the highest scores (i.e. are the most disliked) of any candidates in the history of national polling.

I'm a staunch Democrat and also a Bernie supporter, and even if he had never run, I'd be helping any primary challenge to her. I'm mad as hell at the Democrats for caving into Clinton cronies and not giving us strong candidates—Biden and Warren and O'Malley.

Bernie needs to stay in until the convention because of his importance in restoring progressive values to the Democratic party. Bernie's emergence is a symptom of the long simmering civil war in the Democratic party and not its cause.

Sending him more money today.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:08 AM

100. Sanders is staying in the race because he cares about Americans.

He's the only candidate in my voting lifetime who really cares about me, my family and the quality of our lives.

So, let the pressure mount. Sanders is staying in, and as long as he does, the American people and our needs are actually represented and being talked about.

If Sanders is so bad then why did the establishment pick such a weak candidate in Clinton???

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:12 AM

107. I do not see the connection. All that would be accomplished

by Bernie dropping out would be a lot of angry Bernie supporters. We already have enough reasons not to vote for either Trump or Clinton.

If you still want to call this a democracy - let everyone vote.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:19 AM

112. Even if Bernie steps down now,

that will simply signal that Hillary is a vulnerable candidate. Bernie staying in the race is going to strengthen her, not weaken her, if she's the nominee. because it will show that she was strong enough to prevail. And she will have Bernie's support.

I think those polls about Trump vs. Hillary are nonsense. It's too early to make calls like that. People are pissed off and are reacting emotionally by saying they're supporting Trump. As it gets closer to the general election, voters will become more serious about their choice. By then, Hillary (if she is the nominee) would have demolished Trump in the debates.

Only the stupid will vote for that toxic buffoon.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:24 AM

118. Funny..I fear Trump winning.

Hillary has way to much baggage, deserved or not, VS Trump who can seem to do anything and it doesn't seem to matter.
Toss in a random terrorist attack here and she is done.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:25 AM

119. Another month won't matter; the strength of his endorsement will

One thing Sanders does especially well is rip Republicans. I'm not worried about him. His more unrealistic supporters are another issue.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:30 AM

121. Fear Trump?? If you are afraid of Trump you

ought to be backing the candidate that can more easily defeat him. That ain't Hillary.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:39 AM

126. We still get to decide the best candidate.

Democrats do not need to decide now to stop the racist. We can keep going. If this was to be fair, let's ask Clinton to bow out since polling, legal issues, and momentum are not on her side.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:41 AM

127. If they fear Trump, they need to nominate Bernie.

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Response to Skwmom (Reply #127)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:50 AM

131. +1000 - As the polls show he is the better candidate by a mile vs. Trump nt

 

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Response to phazed0 (Reply #131)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:51 AM

132. Common sense and not living in the corrupt bubble of DC tells me he is the better candidate.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:45 AM

130. I see the logic, but I disagree with it.

Even as a supporter of Hillary, I do not agree with stifling the democratic process.

I do believe that Hillary will ultimately win the nomination. The math is very much against Senator Sanders on this.

I do believe that the continued primary season, when the Republicans have now effectively clinched their nomination does hurt our chances come November. (I also believe come november, either of our candidates will squash the Donald regardless)

I don't agree with trying to push any candidate out of the race before they are ready to determine the end of their campaign for themselves. If the roles were reversed, I'd be pissed off to no end with people calling for the candidate I support and believe in to drop out. I will not be a hypocrite and call for it just because my candidate is in the lead and it benefits her.

Senator Sanders should end his campaign when he and his campaign feels it's the time to do so.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 10:54 AM

134. "Democratic Party Leaders" need to be replaced. Too many have sold out.

 

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:03 AM

139. Fearmongering again by the rightwing DINOs.

If they weren't DINOs, they'd do what the polls suggest and support Bernie instead of being afraid.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:03 AM

140. Yes exactly as Hillary left the race in 2008 as soon as it was obvious she

 

wouldn't get the nomination. Oh, wait, she didn't. She stayed in until after the very last primary.

She has NOT sealed the deal. She does NOT yet have enough delegates to get the nomination. Not to mention a bunch of states (mine included) still have not voted.

I think I might take up alerting on all OPs that call for him to drop out, as they are divisive and over the top, given he still might get the nomination.

The real problem is that Hillary is such a weak candidate that her supporters are genuinely scared she won't get the nomination, and the only way she can is if she has not challenger at all. Screw that. I'm voting for Bernie next month in my primary, and I'll vote for him in the fall if I have to write in his name. I will not vote for a lesser evil, because that's still voting for evil.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:16 AM

145. If they really feared Trump, they would be encouraging clinton to drop out.

She can't beat trump, and she is the biggest disaster of a candidate we have seen in a while.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:35 AM

154. All I can say is we better get our shit together.............

Clinton and Sanders supporters better get to the subject matter and policies rather then egos and e-mails. As a life long dem it really pains me to see fellow dems beginning to act like the republicans were. Personally I see the good in both, Its just that I cant take Bernie's platform serious. Sure, free college would be fucking awesome, Legal weed also, Raising the minimum to 15.00 great. BUT, getting these ideas passed in congress in the real world is a complete different matter and he knows this. If I thought Sanders had a chance to get even half his ideas passed into law he would have my complete backing. If we don't get to real conversations and who can really get the massive machine which will be needed to beat trump going I fear this election will be a Trump blowout, He plays by no rules and Its gonna be a nasty in the gutter fight this year.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:39 AM

159. The establishment Dems wants Bernie out.

They're now afraid that HRC is going to face charges and they want to put in Biden because he's another establishment Dem.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 11:48 AM

161. Idiotic argument

The Democrats have nothing to lose by having a contested convention. It will give them lots of free publicity and plenty of momentum.
The only people putting forth such an argument are Clinton supporters who are more worried about their candidate failing than they are about what is right for America.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 12:05 PM

167. If Hill can't beat Trump, that's on her. I think she's the one who should drop out!

All this "pressure" does is show what a lousy candidate she is.

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 12:27 PM

169. they want the stronger candidate against Trump to drop out so they can

try and make the feebler candidate strong enough?

actually that sounds exactly their policy for a decade and a half, at least

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Response to chwaliszewski (Original post)

Fri May 13, 2016, 12:41 PM

174. I am sorry, LOCKING

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