Naomi Osaka upsets Serena Williams in U.S. Open
Source: CBS News
Naomi Osaka defeated Serena Williams at the U.S. Open on Saturday, becoming the first Japanese player to win a Grand Slam singles championship. Osaka, who is now two for two against Willams, won the contentious match 6-2-, 6-4.
Thousands of fans jeered repeatedly during the trophy ceremony as Osaka and Williams cried.Williams put an arm around Osaka's shoulder and told the crowd: "I know you guys were here rooting, and I was rooting, too, but let's make this the best moment we can. We're going to get through this and let's be positive. So congratulations, Naomi. No more booing."
Williams added with a laugh, "I really hope to continue to go and play here again. We'll see."
This was the third high-profile conflict with an official for Williams at Flushing Meadows, following her infamous tirade after a foot fault in the 2009 semifinals against Kim Clijsters, and a dispute over a hindrance call in the 2011 final against Sam Stosur.
Read more: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/naomi-osaka-defeats-serena-williams-today-us-open-2018-09-08/
left-of-center2012
(34,195 posts)... it came after Williams screamed at U.S. Open chair umpire Carlos Ramos after she was docked a point penalty for two code violations (illegal coaching from the stands and smashing her racket). Williams was then docked a game penalty for a third code violation, verbal abuse after calling Ramos a thief over the first violation.
Williams received that first code violation when Ramos deemed that her coach, Patrick Mouratoglou, gave Williams illegal coaching from the stands.
Early in the second set, Mouratoglou appeared to make a hand gesture looking at Williams suggesting she move closer to the net during points. Williams denied she received the coaching ...
Mouratoglou said after the match that he was coaching, but he didnt think Williams even saw it.
https://olympics.nbcsports.com/2018/09/08/serena-williams-naomi-osaka-us-open-chair-umpire/?cid=eref:nbcnews:text
at140
(6,110 posts)The coach's hand signals! Regardless, Serena blew it herself by smashing her racket and calling the umpire a thief.
writes3000
(4,734 posts)Its a shame the match ended that way but Im happy for Naomi and Serena. Black girl magic.
iluvtennis
(19,851 posts)Naomi would have been the eventual winner as Serena serve and movement was off...BUT the players should have decided, not some umpire who is about to retire. I've watched 100s and 100s of tennis matches and seen players call umpire so awful name. Serena calling him a thief is no where to that level.
Congrats to Naomi on her !st Grand Slam and congrats to Serena for making it this far after having a bay 1-year ago.
Perseus
(4,341 posts)Because it is Serena you are not going to give her a pass, if her coach sends signals to her (coaching), which is against the rules, then the player gets penalized.
"Serena calling him a thief is no where to that level." WHAT???? If she calls the referee a "thief" then that is reason for a penalty due to unbecoming behaviour. She has no right at all to insult the referee, or anyone for that matter. If one allows that from ones favourite player, then one should not be alarmed when trump calls someone a "low intelligent person", or any other name that seems not as awful as what other people have said in the past.
If she smashes a racquet in anger then she has also committed an Tennis infraction.
Those are the rules of Tennis, be it trump or Serena, the rule of law must be observed at all times.
Lucky Luciano
(11,253 posts)If everyone does it (as Serenas coach said) and only she gets punished (in the finals no less!), then that is fucked up.
Perseus
(4,341 posts)they don't get punished, but those who do get caught get punished. Its not selective enforcement, all players get punished when they get caught.
The "everyone does it" doesn't make it right, isn't that what trump tweeted the other day? I bet everyone on this board didn't like it when he said it, why would anyone then be selective when a favouite player does it? why should she be excused?
Don't get me wrong, I like Serena and I am at awe with what she and Venus have accomplished, but I would never excuse her behaviour as she did yesterday. I would never excuse or allow that behaviour from my children either.
Right is right, wrong is wrong.
Lucky Luciano
(11,253 posts)It is remarkable that a rule that is virtually never ever used (I never even heard of it before, though I am not a massive tennis fan) just happened to be enforced all of a sudden out of nowhere.
Perseus
(4,341 posts)Many players have been penalized because of the coach trying to send signals to their players, everyone who plays tennis competitively knows that.
Serena's behaviour yesterday was pitiful, she called the umpire a "thief", and also demanded an apology? First, the umpire never called her a cheater, the penalty was because of the coach, and I understand that the coach admitted to have done it with the excuse that "everyone else does it", which is not true, not every coach does it. Then the breaking of the racquet is in the rules book, these are actions that cannot be accepted, no matter who the player is.
I have seen Serena do this before, she gets into tantrums or gets a sudden injury to take the other player off their momentum. She did that to Lindsey Davenport at the Australian Open many years ago. Lindsay was winning easy, she had won the 1st set and was cruising on the 2nd, suddenly, Serena had an injury and took a long time to "get it fixed", by then Lindsay had lost her momentum and Serena won the match in 3 sets.
Her behaviour was not worthy of a champion yesterday (watch the video, someone published it at DU), and any excuses made of that are wrong. Excusing someone for their wrong actions opens the door for more. I repeat myself, right is right, wrong is wrong.
Her coaches actions hurt her, and I bet it was not the 1st time he tried to coach her either, umpires usually ignore the first 2 or 3 attempts before penalizing.
janterry
(4,429 posts)Just a warning. Then she caused it to escalate.
She should have also been charged with time wasting on Osaka's serve. Time Wasting is against the rules because it can shift the momentum of the game and match. And claiming that men do not receive penalties is simply not true.
Willam's coach rightfully pointed out that cheating/coaching is rife in tennis (but it's not true, as he claimed, that "everyone does it" ).
I hope that something good comes of this and that more tennis players are caught and given penalties for cheating.
But they aren't, and what the hell does tRump have to do with Serena Williams? And the rules are not applied the same across the ATP and WTA. Rafa & Nole have said more to this jack ass than she ever has to him. He accused her sister Venus of cheating. But it doesn't shock me. Males are scared of other males, and so when she stood up for herself, the snowflake male Ramos didn't like it and couldn't stand it. I am proud of her standing up for herself. Nole and Rafa have said worse to the SAME sexist jerk, but he didn't dare rare up on THEM. Go to youtube and check out their rants to him if they show you them in the country you live in. Google up articles about them and him. Him going to the extreme to alter the match, a match I know he wouldn't referee against a male is absurd. But then again, he's a non-black MALE. Typical. Sexism and a foundation of racism is alive and well in the all-white sport of tennis, a sport that a black female has dominated for 20 years in the WTA.
at140
(6,110 posts)has a nice Japanese bred personality. She is a really good player for age 20. She has great service and powerful backhand. She has great future ahead oh her. Imagine earning $3.8 Million prize today at age 30!
Serena needs to learn never to call umpire any names, even if umpire made a blunder. It never pays. Calling umpire "thief" is never going to pay dividends. You will ALWAYS lose the argument.
July
(4,750 posts)She has a Japanese mother who "bred" her, along with her Haitian-American father, but she came to the U.S. at age three and grew up here. She is a citizen of both the U.S. and Japan, and has played for Japan, but she iis not completely fluent in Japanese (reports on her during the Open say that she will take questions in Japanese but answer in English).
My point is not that she is not just Japanese but is both Japanese and American. So her "nice Japanese personality" is perhaps not owing to just one part of her heritage.
at140
(6,110 posts)and Naomi said today she owes her success to sacrifices by her mother. Asian mothers are known to raise more disciplined children, in general. There are exceptions to everything, of course.
kwassa
(23,340 posts)And she is 20, not 30.
Haitian-Japanese American!
iluvtennis
(19,851 posts)LenaBaby61
(6,974 posts)Not really.
I've seen men tennis players saying a LOT more than calling someone a thief. I remember John McEnroe telling a chair to go fuck himself. McEnroe was always calling some umpire a name or arguing/cursing at them. I Remember Connors calling one umpire an abortion. He was arguing with that guy the whole match. I even Remember Illie Nastase calling one chair umpire a stupid asshole. He said it in Romanian then in English, and back in the day on ABC sports there wasn't a delay button back, so as a kid I heard him cursing the chair umpire. I remember Chris Schenkel apologizing to the audience about Nastase's cursing/abuse towards the chair umpire which us in the audience had to endure.
Secondly, the US Open has been her worst slam to play at. Shot spot came into play when she was so badly cheated there one year in 2004 when she was playing Jennifer Capriati. That match was called so badly from the chair to the lines people that the USTA issued her an apology. The debacle in 2009 where a lines umpire kept calling Serena for foot faults and we know what happened there, she defaulted to Kim Clijsters. This same chair also called Venus for a few FF's as I recall during the same tournament, and although the there weren't lines cameras set up specifically for foot faults, at least 1 camera angle showed that it wasn't a foot fault. When I saw Carlos Ramos in the chair, I said to myself UH OH, because I remember how he said that Venus was "cheating" by receiving continual coaching help from her coach David Witt when she was playing a match vs Aliez Cornet in 2016. Venus was seething and said something to him sitting in her chair during the change over. Something about how dare you question me and call me a cheater. I don't need to cheat. But she played through it. Ramos doesn't do a good job at administering his calls for coaching from the box consistently, because I remember a match vividly where Rafa's Uncle Tony was doing his thing up in the coaches box. The people calling the match on Eurosport were laughing because the Uncle's coaching was so blatant. On the back of Serena again, as with shot spot, there will probably be a ZERO tolerance policy against it coaching from the players box. IF a coach is seen to have been coaching, a warning. The next time he/she is caught coaching, he/she is thrown out of the match.
All credit to Osaka, she played very well and held her composure. Serena my favorite, not so well. Nerves as well as Osaka took it's toll today. What I hate more than Serena losing, because that's life, is that the chair umpire Carlos Ramos once again interjected himself into a Williams-sister match. Serena was still in the match, but that game was taken away from her. IF Serena was a male, I doubt he would have umpired the way he did, nor take a game away from a guy for a 3rd violation (Calling him a thief). Calling someone a thief as opposed to an abortion or telling them to go fuck themselves isn't so bad, I guess Ah that sexism & snowflake male thing are alive and well in tennis just as it is in LIFE.
Serena, continue getting healthy, keep on striving as you hopefully continue going after Court's record, and I LOVE YOU. You've made so much happen in your brief return after maternity leave. You still have it in you for a few more years if you can stay healthy I think.
But PLEASE think about NOT going to the US Open again. You don't have great luck there.
at140
(6,110 posts)and I go back to Margaret Court era LOL..
Again, my advice to any tennis player is to not compound the situation by smashing your racket and calling the umpire any names. The umpire has the right to assess penalties.
Just because others got away from mis-behavior, is not a good reason for others to do the same.
LenaBaby61
(6,974 posts)FUNNY that he's only assessed those penalties against her and not against men who've done and said far worse to him.
at140
(6,110 posts)But lately I have not watched every tennis match on TV,
so I have to take your word.
LisaM
(27,803 posts)Last edited Sun Sep 9, 2018, 08:06 AM - Edit history (1)
They went back and looked at it. Then she physically threatened the umpire, then she lied about it!
My issue with her is that when she's losing, she never takes responsibility by blaming it on her play. She's always got to blame some other factor. I thought she'd moved past it, but today convinced me otherwise.
And I hate that even though she was pretty well beaten, we are only talking about her. I'm shocked people are condoning her behavior and calling up decades-opd examples from the men's tour.
LenaBaby61
(6,974 posts)Neither do men in the ATP. DO you follow tennis? I have for decades. I've seen Ramos gone after by MALES a lot worse. Have seen him allow blatant cheating from the coaches box. So now he comes up with this BS against a woman? Why not a male?
Lastly, Serena was royally SCREWED in her 2004 US open vs Jennifer Capriati. I'm sorry, but why is SHE always the test case for rules change? That match bought on shot spot, because she was screwed so royally. That clown Ramaos interjected himself into her match. People condone MALES behavior. Not saying they should, but if you don't think sexism was at play last night ....
Pretty sure he doesn't do Rafa, Nole (Who both have gone after that clown during and post match), or Fed like that.
LisaM
(27,803 posts)Last edited Sun Sep 9, 2018, 08:53 AM - Edit history (1)
They are showing a graphic right now of two (widely spread out) court violations called against Djokovic and Murray by the same umpire, so I don't think it's necessarily sexism. She was getting beaten, and she lost it. I'm sure there is plenty of sexism in tennis, but her persistent refusal to actually play the game so.she could keep.yelling about the perceived apology she was owed while a patient Osaka stood.there was awful. Awful. Now, I watched it real time as.well as on replay, and continue to be floored. Her coach admitted he was coaching and in my opinion, they lied that she hadn't seen it because she was saying he was just giving her a "thumbs up" for good play. If she didn't see it, how did she know what it was?
LenaBaby61
(6,974 posts)A male player would never be done like this, and I don't CARE if she was being beaten. I've gotten past that. It's life. She aging, a new generation is here. 'Grats to young Osaka. I get and accept Serena's loss, and I'm a 20 plus decades fan of hers. But I'm sorry, you saying that sexism is not part of what happened yesterday is like saying that Hillary Clinton didn't face sexism during the 2016 GE. tRump gets away with MURDER and treason, he's a MALE. But with Hillary, it was that trumped up charge of her emails, and sexism on top of that. This chair umpire did the SAME thing to Venus Williams. Accused her of receiving coaching help in 2016 at the FO, and for that she got a violation. Again, she was cheated during 2004's US Open and she kept her cool through that, and was more or less patted on the head for being a "good girl" and the "bigger person" in many accounts/instances as I recall reading of what happened to her at the 2004 US Open vs Jennifer Capriati. IF that match vs Capriati were in reverse, Serena would have been eaten alive and called every cheater on this planet for saying "I didn't see any balls go in or long" during that match like Capriati did. Just like Maria Sharapova got a suspended sentence for PED use over decades. If that was Serena, she'd still be serving a ban or completely out of tennis. Did Serena get a bit too angry? Yes, and I wished she had controlled herself a bit better. But it's not like she hasn't been cheated before at the US Open. I don't blame her for being human. She was all too human in 2004 and told basically to be a big person, accept it. Move on. Shut up about it.
We can agree to disagree, as we have before. But, double-standards, underlying racism and sexism have been an unfortunate woven in part of Serena/Venus' tennis career, just like racism, sexism are part of every African-American's LIFE. I'm African-American and Native American, so both racial groups I come from have been ROYALLY screwed too or suffered mightily in some racist form or fashion.
LisaM
(27,803 posts)I don't think it was a factor here because the same umpire has made court violation calls against major male players as well.
The coaching warning was nothing more than a warning. She didn't lose a point for it. It started when she smashed her racquet after losing a point. There was no reason for it. It was completely disconnected from the coaching warning. The later tirade was an excuse for her poor play, and the umpire was pretty patient but she went on three separate tirades, called him a name, and refused to play.
Yes, back in 2004 she was robbed, but that was 14 years ago and she's had plenty of success since so it's not as if it's hurt her career.
I have seen plenty of male athletes get thrown out of games, especially in baseball, for berating the officials.
LenaBaby61
(6,974 posts)I don't think it was a factor here because the same umpire has made court violation calls against major male players as well.
Coaching violations are subjective. On ESPN this morning, they did a side by side during the alleged coaching violation and she wasn't even looking at her coach when it happened. God, I can't count the times Rafa's uncle has been in his box coaching with hat/hand signals going to town, and this same chair never called any violation of anykind on HIM or warned him at anytime that I can remember, and I follow the ATP pretty closely. Again, I wished that she hadn't lost her temper, but after so many years of what she's gone through on a tennis court, especially with chair umpires, I'd suspect that she's fed up. Human., especially when she sees MEN in the ATP say a lot worse to chair umpires and who've got coaches cheating in the box for their players all match long.
I agree about the incident in 2004 being 14 years ago, but WHY oh WHY does something like this always happen to her at the US Open? WHY oh WHY did it happen to her at the 2003 FO too? WHY was Venus given a violation by the same chair umpire who accused her of cheating with her coach? ALL I hope for as a sports fan is that rules are rules for men and women in tennis and in any sport where there are men and women. I bet there will be a new rule where coaching is outlawed, enforced and called on ALL players coaches who are doing it. GOOD if this does happen. The first time the coach is warned, then a 2nd time he/she is tossed.
LisaM
(27,803 posts)And there were apparently 23 court violations against men at the U S Open this year, vs. 9 for women. I just don't see sexism here.
But she's somehow got everyone in her pocket, excusing her behavior. And all this, "how am I going to go home and explain this to my daughter"? Her daughter is what, one year old? Go home, throw off the match, and cuddle your baby, that's the best thing she can do for her.
And I have to say that Serena has an inconsistent story. She said she saw the coach give her the thumbs up. I heard her say it!! So she did see something, not saying she acted on it, but others say differently.
The crowd was boorish.
iluvtennis
(19,851 posts)tenisfin
(36 posts)A strong chance Naomi would win today. Serena is still on the comeback trail and she hasn't played a lot of tennis matches recently whereas Naomi had nothing to lose and seems to be inspired by big matches. The trophy ceremony was painful to watch.
writes3000
(4,734 posts)She will get her 24th Grand Slam championship soon. Looking forward to that.
Congrats to Naomi. She played well today. Serena has been an inspiration to her so in essence they both can share in this accomplishment. Hooray!
yuiyoshida
(41,831 posts)彼らにビデオテープがあることを願っています。 それを見たい。 Hope I get to see it on youtube!
at140
(6,110 posts)Iggo
(47,550 posts)erpowers
(9,350 posts)I am only midly surprised by this result. I was thinking Serena Williams would win because of her strength and past dominance. However, Mrs. Williams is an older players, so these younger players have a chance to beat her.
The only thing I would question is whether Mrs. Williams is beginning to chock in the finals. How many times, lately, has she made to the finals only to lose in the finals? Is the idea of passing Margaret Court getting to her mentally?
paleotn
(17,911 posts)Serena is still be best ever. An old Carly Simon song comes to mind.
C Moon
(12,212 posts)I do think that judge went overboardat least with the last call.
Williams was visibly upset, and the judge should have understood that and let the two play tennis.
iluvtennis
(19,851 posts)C Moon
(12,212 posts)But from what the announcers were saying he is well respected and has no prior issues.
I'm sure we'll be hearing more about this.
LenaBaby61
(6,974 posts)Nole, Rafa have gone after this guy more recently. Andy Murray. He accused Venus Williams in 2016 in a match vs Aliez Cornet of cheating/getting coaching help and she received a violation. Venus told him, I'm 37 years old and I don't have to cheat, or words to that effect.
IF the Williams Sisters play next year, I surely don't want Ramos anywhere near their matches.
Lucky Luciano
(11,253 posts)It was disappointing to see it go down like this, but I think the result would have been the same as Osaka played really well.
She has such a cute personality too - although she grew up here, her mannerisms and humility were very Japanese (very proud if her Haitian roots as well!) - she even had a little bow on the stage at that the end - very notable to my Japanese wife.
The interview when she won the semis:
what do you want to say to Serena?
Like a sheepish starstruck teenager she says, I...love you?!
TDale313
(7,820 posts)I really think this will be the first of many Majors for her. Sad about the controversy with the officiating. Not good for anyone involved. I am a big Serena fan, but Osaka has arrived, and its wonderful to see.
iluvtennis
(19,851 posts)colsohlibgal
(5,275 posts)Serena, like Federer, has been a great player but sooner or later the years catch up to us all, and in Serenas case other issues are there, she just had a child and later serious health issues.
Osaka would seem to have a great future in front of her.
iluvtennis
(19,851 posts)Chair umpire Carlos Ramos managed to rob not one but two players in the womens U.S. Open final. Nobody has ever seen anything like it: An umpire so wrecked a big occasion that both players, Naomi Osaka and Serena Williams alike, wound up distraught with tears streaming down their faces during the trophy presentation and an incensed crowd screamed boos at the court. Ramos took what began as a minor infraction and turned it into one of the nastiest and most emotional controversies in the history of tennis, all because he couldnt take a woman speaking sharply to him.
Williams abused her racket, but Ramos did something far uglier: He abused his authority. Champions get heated its their nature to burn. All good umpires in every sport understand that the heart of their job is to help temper the moment, to turn the dial down, not up, and to be quiet stewards of the event rather than to let their own temper play a role in determining the outcome. Instead, Ramos made himself the chief player in the womens final. He marred Osakas first Grand Slam title and one of Williamss last bids for all-time greatness. Over what? A tone of voice. Male players have sworn and cursed at the top of their lungs, hurled and blasted their equipment into shards, and never been penalized as Williams was in the second set of the U.S. Open final.
I just feel like the fact that I have to go through this is just an example for the next person that has emotions and that want to express themselves and wants to be a strong woman, she said afterward.
It was pure pettiness from Ramos that started the ugly cascade in the first place, when he issued a warning over coaching, as if a signal from Patrick Mouratoglou in the grandstand has ever been the difference in a Serena Williams match. It was a technicality that could be called on any player in any match on any occasion and ludicrous in view of the power-on-power match that was taking place on the court between Williams and the 20-year-old Osaka. It was one more added stressor for Williams, still trying to come back from her maternity leave and fighting to regain her fitness and resume her pursuit of Margaret Courts record of 24 Grand Slam singles titles. I dont cheat, she told Ramos hotly.
....continued at link
-----
This article sums up my feelings exactly.
LenaBaby61
(6,974 posts)I'm so sick of this sexist double-standard in tennis. It was on display last night thanks to Ramos. I love Serena. Have been a fan forever. I know she's getting older, and accept that a new generation is on the way. Times moves ON. But for God's sake, why interject yourself into a match like Ramos did? The same crap happened to her against Justine Henin in the Finals of the FO in 2003. That umpire completely destroyed that match as well. Justine also was of no help during the match, because her sportsmanship didn't allow her to admit to the chair umpire that she had HER hand up, which would have meant 2 serves for Serena. I heard the same crap that Serena has to be the bigger person during that match just like with J. Capriati too. Shut up and take it But to Justine's credit, unlike Jennifer Capriati who said she didn't see or remember any balls wide or inside the court during the whole match, or words to that effect , Justine admitted years later that she should have told the ump her hand WAS up, but she said something to the effect that she wanted the FO championship so badly, and that that match was not her best moment.
I mean, I've seen people cheating their asses off with coaching during matches. Seen folks curse at umpires, insult them. Yet, someone whose been cheated and maligned for decades and accused of concerning Williams Family match-fixing (Indian Wells), steroid use (Maria was caught using Meldonium for NO reason) and referred to as the N-word in her own country is the one called for cheating and refereed differently because she's a woman? WHY not call the matches the same way for EVERYONE, and make the RULES apply to everyone.
iluvtennis
(19,851 posts)LenaBaby61
(6,974 posts)The 2004 US Open screw JOB vs Jennifer Capriati?
NOPE, because Serena was screwed so royally that it ushered in shot spot for good, AND they (USTA) had to issue an apology to her for that match being so poorly officiated by a so-called Gold Star judge Marianna Alvez and her lines crew
Tursiops
(89 posts)Bullying plain and simple. Straight out of the Trump playbook. Someone calls you out on your bad behavior, come back at them harder. They accuse you of being coached you come back calling them a liar and a thief and threatening their job. Its there on tape, but do not take accountability; rather deflect and insist you're a victim, insist that its not fair. A conspiracy. Or it' sexism, MSM, or fake news. Rely on your popularity to shout others down. Get the crowds roaring, joining you in mean behavior.
Male players have been expelled from entire matches (rightfully so) for less. It's not a gender issue.
LenaBaby61
(6,974 posts)You obviously know NOTHING about tennis. Don't follow it to DARE say that she's like tRump, because she has never gotten away with the shit he has and is continuing to get away with, being a white male.
Michael Jordan, Ali wouldn't dare be called trumplike because they're males who had the nerve to tell you "YES this is who I am, stop me."
Do you know anything about Connors, McEnroe, Illie Nastase and their antics from the past? You don't know the cheating and accusations this young woman has had to endure. Being called the N word in her own country. Accusations of her father fixing Her and her sister's matches, when SHE has been the victim of matches she was cheated OUT of. And, if you're not a woman or a black female, but a white male, then you need to just NOT talk about things you know nothing about.
iluvtennis
(19,851 posts)LenaBaby61
(6,974 posts)Link to tweet
vs tRump.
tRump and Serena are NOTHING alike.
We had a black president and the abuse HE took. He followed ALL of the rules, and where did it get Merrick Garland?
tRumputin breaks all of them and he's sitting in as our first ruskie PRESIDENT. Let that sink in.
Gosh golly darn-it, he (Philando Castile ) followed the rules:
?w=2000
They didn't, but there are HERE alive though:
Wonder what the difference IS 🤔