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Tue Apr 16, 2019, 01:36 PM

Poland and U.S. Closing In on Deal to Build 'Fort Trump,' Sources Say

Source: Bloomberg News


By Jennifer Jacobs , Justin Sink , Nick Wadhams , and Marek Strzelecki
April 16, 2019, 11:14 AM CDT

Poland is nearing a deal with the U.S. to establish an American military base in the former Communist bloc country, according to people familiar with the matter -- an outpost the Poles see as a deterrent to Russian aggression and that the Kremlin would likely consider a provocation.

If a deal is reached, President Donald Trump is considering traveling to Poland in the fall, in part to commemorate the agreement. But it’s unclear whether he fully supports the idea, even after he said during a September meeting with Polish President Andrzsej Duda that the U.S. was looking “very seriously” at establishing a base. Duda, who joked that it could be named “Fort Trump,” remains committed to contribute $2 billion for its construction.

Polish Prime Minister Mateusz Morawiecki planned to visit Washington this week to discuss the proposal with Trump’s national security adviser, John Bolton, but his trip was postponed, according to two people familiar with the matter. He’s traveling to Chicago and New York instead.

Trump has often criticized NATO allies for not spending enough toward their own defense, and he’s considered demanding that countries hosting U.S. forces pay the full cost of the bases, plus as much as a 50 percent premium for the privilege, according to people familiar with the matter. But the American president has an affinity for Poland, a NATO member whose government has repeatedly clashed with European Union leaders in Brussels over rule-of-law issues. Duda has employed Trump-style anti-migrant and nationalist rhetoric.

Read more: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-04-16/poles-and-u-s-said-to-close-in-on-deal-to-build-fort-trump

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Reply Poland and U.S. Closing In on Deal to Build 'Fort Trump,' Sources Say (Original post)
Judi Lynn Apr 2019 OP
Perseus Apr 2019 #1
salin Apr 2019 #4
blue-wave Apr 2019 #2
Mc Mike Apr 2019 #3
jcmaine72 Apr 2019 #5
sheepfarm Apr 2019 #14
CaptainTruth Apr 2019 #6
Yeehah Apr 2019 #12
smirkymonkey Apr 2019 #7
EarthFirst Apr 2019 #8
yaesu Apr 2019 #9
mpcamb Apr 2019 #10
Maxheader Apr 2019 #11
The Liberal Lion Apr 2019 #13

Response to Judi Lynn (Original post)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 01:58 PM

1. It won't happen, he will get a spanking by his master

 

and although he may like the spanking by his beloved master, he will be ordered to do the right thing for Putin and Russia.

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Response to Perseus (Reply #1)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 02:06 PM

4. unless that it is what that master wants

and access to intel on a myriad of levels.

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Response to Judi Lynn (Original post)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 02:02 PM

2. Just figures

Totalitarians stick together.

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Response to Judi Lynn (Original post)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 02:05 PM

3. We can house F Troop there.

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Response to Judi Lynn (Original post)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 04:05 PM

5. Two peas in a racist pod.

Poland is a xenophobic, homophobic rogue state within the EU. Trump would love nothing more than to transform the U.S. into the same only on a grander scale.

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Response to jcmaine72 (Reply #5)

Wed Apr 17, 2019, 02:29 AM

14. Not just Poland...

... Hungary is being led under a "democratic" authoritian government as well under their PM Viktor Orban. Very similar rethoritic, very similar populist policies where the broad appeal is in rural and less wealthy parts of their countries, socially right wing while fisicially centerist or left wing. The public broadcasters in both countries have been purged of anyone working there who hold even slight dissidence or nonconformity to the government line. Slovakia has had similar struggles on a smaller scale until recently as well - mostly anti immigration rethoritic particularly around the time of the Syrian refugee crises but otherwise not the same level of populism or public media purging.

I do have a little bit of sympathy for the Poles here - as a ethnic nation over the last number of centuries it has rarely had much time to have had a country that they could rightfully call their own without being under the boot of one or more empires in central and eastern Europe at the same time, and the Russians are particularly mistrusted by them. You only have to look at the history between the two over the last century to see why. Therefore they are quite fearful of Putin's shows of military strength which lies too close for comfort for a lot of Poles. Not to mention the Russian exclave of Kaliningrad, home of the Russian Navy's Baltic Sea fleet and which has a land border with Poland. The Law & Justice Party (Pis) that makes up the current Polish government has its strongest support in the east of the country as well.

The problem of course is that getting into bed with Trump, and wanting to be BFF with him, could have repercussions. There is little appetite among most other European countries in NATO for a significant increase in American military presence in the continent especially as it has been winding down the last 25 years. The Baltic countries (Estonia, Latvia & Lithuania) all share the same worries as Poland does of Russia flexing its muscles but neither of them have suggested having an openly American army presence based in their own countries, rather they would have a general combined NATO force to help protect them. Hungary's Orban, despite the similar style of governing he shares with PiS, doesn't have the same concerns on Russia, at least in public.

One big issue for PiS however is that while they are sceptical of the EU, by no means at this time at least do they want to leave it. If they tried to do a "Pexit" they would have even less leverage to negotiate an exit deal with the EU than the UK has, the Polish economy has also been able to grow fairly steadily ever since it joined the EU through two main means. One being that Poland is one of the biggest recipients of EU development aid money for infrastructure, and another is the advantage taken by a lot of young, educated Polish men and women to seek work in richer parts of the EU through freedom of movement. This has allowed Poland to keep its unemployment levels to look much better than they were in the 90's with its young adults free to go abroad for opportunities, with an advantage that the Poles are often regarded as hard workers who'll do job the locals/natives won't - the flip side to that however is a brain drain lost to the country even if many of them will return home after a few years saving up abroad, and while that happens many of those left behind tend to vote PiS. PiS are terrified of the wealthier EU countries like Germany and the UK (for now) putting stronger restrictions on their citizens in terms of what they can claim from social security payments like unemployment allowances and child benefit any more than what is mandated by the EU. Poland needs to have friends next door to it that at least somewhat care to help keep the likes of Russian under Putin at bay. An isolated Poland would be vulnerable.

P. S. I've met quite a lot of Polish people who have come over to N. Ireland to work now for some years, and they've been a good bunch to mix with. You get the odd bad apple but it's no worse than what's been in your own neighbourhood for as long as you remember, and of course there is a large minority element in Poland that holds some very xenophobic, bigoted, racist views that are deep rooted in strong Catholic traditionalist views that isn't as progressive leaning than elsewhere in Europe. But it would be unfair to describe Poland and its people that way the same way as if I described the US and Americans as obese, inbred uncultured redneck loudmouths whose Sundays are spent first having sex with their sister, then going to church, then getting back home to screw their cousin. Of course that might describe a few of them, but definitely, DEFINITELY not to tar all the people of a country with such a broad brush!

Oh, and P.P.S if Trump is trying to wrangle money out of any European country that current has an American military base there where their governments are struggling to meet funding needed for schools, healthcare, roads and public transport etc. the public sentiment in most places will be to tell Cheeto Jesus with the small paws "Goodbye then, and don't let the door hit your arse on the way out!"

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Response to Judi Lynn (Original post)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 05:08 PM

6. Fort Trump? So it will be a gold-painted cardboard fort that crumbles under the least pressure?


The key word here is "facade."

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Response to CaptainTruth (Reply #6)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 08:35 PM

12. With no soldiers

because they all have bone spurs.

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Response to Judi Lynn (Original post)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 05:14 PM

7. What is the logic in this?

Two Billion Dollars that we need here at home and a move that is going to seriously piss off Putin and other Kremlin officials. Is there something I am missing other than Trump may get a base on European soil that is named after him?

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Response to Judi Lynn (Original post)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 05:21 PM

8. Didn't he just hold the government hostage over several billion on a border wall?

Take your monument money and reallocate it.

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Response to Judi Lynn (Original post)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 06:26 PM

9. Poland has always had a love affair with rightwing nutjobs like trump & reagan. nt

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Response to Judi Lynn (Original post)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 07:24 PM

10. It's going to get shuttered as soon as he's indicted.

It'll just be one more blemish on our rep then.

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Response to Judi Lynn (Original post)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 07:39 PM

11. 2 billion for construction?


And because stumpy believes foreign countries with usofa protections...
2000000000$ is just the beginning on what the traitor will look for..

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Response to Judi Lynn (Original post)

Tue Apr 16, 2019, 08:45 PM

13. Just think of it

You convince a country's to relinquish it's sovereignty by placing your military bases in it. You essentially make it part of your empire, a client state and then you demand they pay for that "privilege".

It doesn't get more mafia than that....

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