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Tue Jul 14, 2020, 02:16 PM

Masks offer much more protection against coronavirus than many think

This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by JudyM (a host of the Latest Breaking News forum).

Source: Los Angeles Times

SAN FRANCISCO — There’s a common refrain that masks don’t protect you; they protect other people from your own germs, which is especially important to keep unknowingly infected people from spreading the coronavirus.
But now, there’s mounting evidence that masks also protect you.

If you’re unlucky enough to encounter an infectious person, wearing any kind of face covering will reduce the amount of virus that your body will take in.

As it turns out, that’s pretty important. Breathing in a small amount of virus may lead to no disease or far more mild infection. But inhaling a huge volume of virus particles can result in serious disease or death.

Read more: https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2020-07-14/evidence-mounts-that-masks-help-lower-your-exposure-to-the-coronavirus

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Arrow 34 replies Author Time Post
Reply Masks offer much more protection against coronavirus than many think (Original post)
Mme. Defarge Jul 2020 OP
bucolic_frolic Jul 2020 #1
live love laugh Jul 2020 #4
KS Toronado Jul 2020 #29
jayfish Jul 2020 #2
LiberalArkie Jul 2020 #3
Bernardo de La Paz Jul 2020 #17
stopdiggin Jul 2020 #8
jayfish Jul 2020 #13
stopdiggin Jul 2020 #14
Bernardo de La Paz Jul 2020 #20
Bernardo de La Paz Jul 2020 #18
jayfish Jul 2020 #25
Bernardo de La Paz Jul 2020 #21
stopdiggin Jul 2020 #27
Bernardo de La Paz Jul 2020 #28
stopdiggin Jul 2020 #31
wnylib Jul 2020 #22
Bernardo de La Paz Jul 2020 #9
Kaleva Jul 2020 #24
stopdiggin Jul 2020 #5
bucolic_frolic Jul 2020 #11
IronLionZion Jul 2020 #6
stopdiggin Jul 2020 #10
Faux pas Jul 2020 #7
LizBeth Jul 2020 #12
Happyhippychick Jul 2020 #15
Laelth Jul 2020 #16
cayugafalls Jul 2020 #19
LisaL Jul 2020 #23
rickyhall Jul 2020 #26
jayfish Jul 2020 #30
lagomorph777 Jul 2020 #33
lagomorph777 Jul 2020 #32
JudyM Jul 2020 #34

Response to Mme. Defarge (Original post)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 02:21 PM

1. That says to me that immunity is either slow, or weak initially

I still see about 2% of people without masks. I scoot in the opposite direction. I close my eyes and don't breathe when walking past someone.

I hear less and less about virus on resting surfaces like plastic. Walmart had all the peroxide or rubbing alcohol you'd want today.

I thought I caught COVID three times. Once in early mid-March some woman coughed on me. This was just as masks were recommended. In fact I think it was the first day I saw someone (one!) with a mask, March 11, the last time I was out without a mask. I had 4 days of nasal discharge and coughing. No fever that I know of. Two more encounters in the next 8 weeks, not as much coughing.

So yeah, I would say wear a mask to everyone. It does allow retail to function. Americans can solve this if we get leadership unlike what Trump provides.

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Response to bucolic_frolic (Reply #1)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 02:30 PM

4. I often hold my breath too--especially when passing

idiots talking in the store aisles for instance. I wish there was a no talking rule in public enclosed spaces.

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Response to live love laugh (Reply #4)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 03:50 PM

29. I wish there was a no talking rule in public enclosed spaces.

That's an excellent idea! No more talking than absolutely necessary.

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Response to Mme. Defarge (Original post)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 02:24 PM

2. This Is One Place I Do Fault The Experts.

They were all over the place early on saying a mask (non-N95) won't help the wearer. People who don't understand that data changes over time have taken this as gospel.

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Response to jayfish (Reply #2)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 02:29 PM

3. The science folks like 100% perfect solution.

At some point at the CDC someone said "What if everyone had something simple covering mouth and nose"?

and then a light bulb went off.

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Response to LiberalArkie (Reply #3)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 03:05 PM

17. No. You have it backwards. It's scientists who put in the qualifiers, like "most" or "often"


It is the simpleminded trumpanzees who most want and push the 100% all-or-nothing thinking.
They would rather have a simple wrong explanation that fits dear leader's narrative than a true more complicated explanation.

When scientists speak and write they qualify what they say.

So where an activist might say "Global warming is caused by burning oil!", a scientist might say "Most of the increase in global warming gasses are released as a result of human activity, including raising cattle and combustion of fossil fuels, to name only two."

Then the activist would say "Yeah, that too."

The trumpanzee would say "It's all a hoax. All the scientists are in on the conspiracy because they want easy grants from Soros and Gates!"

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Response to jayfish (Reply #2)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 02:43 PM

8. some of that was "messaging"

rather than straight information -- and that's another place where the the community didn't do themselves (or us) any favors.

The assertion that anything less than N95 offered no protection at all .. was never defensible, even with the earliest information. But at that time they were trying to "message" that everybody needed to stay home -- and stop cleaning out the stores of everything from panty hose to Reynolds wrap.

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Response to stopdiggin (Reply #8)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 02:51 PM

13. I'm Including Non-Governmetal Experts (NGE?) As Well.

People like Sanjay Gupta.


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Response to jayfish (Reply #13)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 02:57 PM

14. is there approved medical terminology for JUST FLAT ASSED WRONG ?

----- -- -- -----

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Response to stopdiggin (Reply #14)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 03:11 PM

20. Yes. "Hindsight has 20-20 vision." That tweet was before the first known US death. . . . nt

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Response to jayfish (Reply #13)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 03:09 PM

18. That's February 29! There was very little US infection at that time & no known US deaths!


So, yes, on that day it was reasonable.

Go find the biggest faults before you nit-pick the earliest responses.

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Response to Bernardo de La Paz (Reply #18)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 03:33 PM

25. Did You Read What I Wrote In My Original Respose?

"early on".

Also, it's not nit-picking. It was everywhere.

Can face coverings prevent the spread of the virus?

If you cough or sneeze, the mask can catch those respiratory droplets so they don't land on other people or surfaces. "So it's not going to protect you, but it is going to protect your neighbor," says Dr. Daniel Griffin at Columbia University, an expert on infectious diseases. "If your neighbor is wearing a mask and the same thing happens, they're going to protect you. So masks worn properly have the potential to benefit people."


Masks Prevent You From Infecting Others With Coronavirus, But May Not Protect You From Being Infected

Experts, including the CDC, continue to state that the evidence does not show that wearing a mask will protect the wearer, but everyone wearing masks should benefit the population overall. The headline has been changed since publication to reflect this understanding.


Can wearing a face mask protect you from the new coronavirus?

Can wearing a medical face mask protect you against the new coronavirus? It's a question many people are asking, including pet owners who are putting canine face masks on their dogs. If it's a regular surgical face mask, the answer is no, Dr. William Schaffner, an infectious disease specialist at Vanderbilt University in Tennessee, told Live Science.


Surgical face masks

Surgical face masks
Surgical face masks are fairly loose-fitting, disposable masks approved by the Food and Drug Administration for use as medical devices. Doctors, dentists, and nurses often wear them while treating patients.

These masks prevent large droplets of bodily fluids that may contain viruses or other germs from escaping via the nose and mouth. They also protect against splashes and sprays from other people, such as those from sneezes and coughs.

But the average masks you can buy from a local drugstore aren’t enough to filter out viruses.


Surgical Masks

Surgical masks, commonly worn by healthcare workers, are intended to block bacterial germs transmitted through secretions, sprays, splashes and large-particle droplets from entering the mouth or nose. They’re disposable, loose-fitting and cover the nose, mouth and chin and should be thrown away after using them. You can easily recognize them by their design: flat, rectangular shaped with pleats, a metal strip along the nose area and long straight ties. Although they’re easy to wear and effective, they’re not able to filter most viral particles.

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Response to jayfish (Reply #13)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 03:15 PM

21. Further, back then, masks were in short supply & needed to be reserved for healthcare workers. nt

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Response to Bernardo de La Paz (Reply #21)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 03:42 PM

27. Fine. But then that is a fundamentally different argument

than saying that masks were unnecessary -- or the assertion that anything less than a N95 offered no protection at all.
(both of which were widely promoted)

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Response to stopdiggin (Reply #27)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 03:43 PM

28. It's related. Pushing masks too early would have made the situation worse & killed healthcare worker

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Response to Bernardo de La Paz (Reply #28)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 03:58 PM

31. Right. I refer you back to the start of this thread

"messaging" -- versus science
(there may have been very valid reasons -- but it falls a little short of the straight dope.)

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Response to stopdiggin (Reply #8)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 03:20 PM

22. There was a lot of discounting of mask use

right here at DU. I remember posts saying that masks were useless except to make people feel better psychogically.

Some posters here promoted that idea about hand sanitizer, too.



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Response to jayfish (Reply #2)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 02:49 PM

9. Not true. All the reports said it helps the wearer some (others more). . . . nt

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Response to jayfish (Reply #2)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 03:22 PM

24. Here's a post I made in Feb, where some experts said masks do help

"According to a study published in the International Journal of Infectious Diseases, families with kids who had flu-like symptoms and used the masks properly were 80% less likely to be diagnosed with the same thing.

Another study looked at 400 people who had the flu found that family members who wore a surgical mask and washed their hands reduced their chance of getting the flu by 70%.

“Individual brands of masks and that sort of thing hasn't been studied, but the few studies that have looked at them do have an effect – in some studies, up to 50 to 80% reduction in transmission,” UW virology expert Alex Greninger said. “They seem to stop large droplets, and I think the other key thing to mention with masks is that it really depends on what you're willing to wear.”

Coronavirus is most commonly spread through the air by coughing or sneezing or though close personal contact, such as touching or shaking hands, according to the Washington State Department of Health.

While masks do seem promising, it's also important to utilize other preventive measures. Make sure you wash your hands often during flu season, especially if you're around others who may be sick. Also, be sure to get your annual flu shot to protect yourself and others from spreading the virus."

https://www.king5.com/article/news/health/coronavirus/surgical-mask-effectiveness/281-9c762e52-c2ec-4dec-b5f3-77ee833fca1e

"At the start of flu season in the last two years, participants were randomly assigned to six weeks of wearing a standard medical procedure mask alone, mask use and hand sanitizer use, or a control group with no intervention. Researchers followed students for incidence of influenza like illness symptoms, defined as cough with at least one other characteristic symptom such as fever, chills or body aches, Monto said.

From the third week on, both the mask only and mask/hand sanitizer interventions showed a significant or nearly significant reduction in the rate of influenza-like illness symptoms in comparison to the control group. The observed reduction in rate of flu-like symptoms remained even after adjusting for gender, race/ethnicity, hand washing practices, sleep quality, and flu vaccination."

https://news.umich.edu/masks-hand-washing-prevent-spread-of-flu-like-symptoms-by-up-to-50-percent/

https://upload.democraticunderground.com/100213020466#post10

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Response to Mme. Defarge (Original post)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 02:31 PM

5. this is pretty much what we suspected all along

the argument otherwise (and we certainly saw them) just never made any real world practical sense.
Taking in less infectious material -- versus, taking in more?
----- -----

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Response to stopdiggin (Reply #5)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 02:50 PM

11. Does science offer any guidance on the rate of growth of viruses following infection?

I'd bet we still don't know a lot. If a small amount is fended off by immunity, but a large amount is not, it tells a lot.

I seem to remember in the early 5 years of the HIV crisis that some reports indicated that people who thought they contracted a small amount of the virus (how or why they thought that - who knows) thought they had developed immunity, their body fought off the illness.
There was a story that tried to link smokers and risky sex encounters with higher incidence of contracting HIV. Did they ever follow up on that? Did doctors or scientists ever figure out if initial viral load was a factor in whether the immune system was overwhelmed, or if it rose to the occasion?

The public needs information, damn it. Filtered Fauci is muzzled, he can't say anything other than 'wear a mask'. He knows far far far more than he is allowed to tell the American people, and we've paid his salary for 30+ years! We deserve better than the slop Trump is throwing at us!

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Response to Mme. Defarge (Original post)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 02:33 PM

6. Viruses can go through masks but oxygen and carbon dioxide can't

it's one of the favorite logical fallacies of the COVIDiot maskholes.

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Response to IronLionZion (Reply #6)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 02:49 PM

10. some can (and do) as the article affirms

but some inevitably do not. And getting less virus, rather than more -- has always been the smarter move.

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Response to Mme. Defarge (Original post)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 02:39 PM

7. Kickin'

To share, thanks for posting

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Response to Mme. Defarge (Original post)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 02:50 PM

12. I think so. Just common sense. May not stop all, but it has to reduce load.

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Response to Mme. Defarge (Original post)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 03:01 PM

15. Do me a favor friends and buy masks that have a slip pocket for a filter

That's even more of a barrier and better protection!

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Response to Mme. Defarge (Original post)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 03:01 PM

16. LOAD is a real issue.

Intuitively, masks reduce viral load for those who wear them.

-Laelth

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Response to Mme. Defarge (Original post)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 03:10 PM

19. Here is an article from Mayo Clinic.

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/coronavirus/in-depth/coronavirus-mask/art-20485449

Cloth masks are OK and help. You can use multiple layers and some even have filter pockets.

The ones we have have filter pockets, fit well and when breathing in, they collapse, breathing out they puff up with some leakage from sides but they seem to work well and if you have seen the simulations on how they help prevent the spread of the viral load then you know what I am saying. If you can't blow out a candle with your mask on, then your viral shedding is probably quite low.

With multi layer masks (4 or 5) and a filter you are severely reducing the viral load you inhale, which is always a good thing. Combine that with handwashing and social distancing and you have a trifecta of prevention.

Quick video of mask vs unmasked shedding.


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Response to cayugafalls (Reply #19)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 03:20 PM

23. The more layers you add, the more protection you get.

Unfortunately you do have to be able to breathe, and the more layers you add, the harder it is to breathe.

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Response to Mme. Defarge (Original post)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 03:41 PM

26. I've heard N95 masks are not the best. What are?

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Response to rickyhall (Reply #26)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 03:57 PM

30. A Respirator



I believe the issues with N95 masks come down to correct fitment. They can be a bear to get sealed correctly.

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Response to jayfish (Reply #30)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 04:08 PM

33. N95 masks have a bypass valve that bypasses protection of those near you.

That's the bigger problem.

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Response to Mme. Defarge (Original post)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 04:07 PM

32. Thank you for posting. I have always believed basically what this says.

I mask up and wear a face shield and gloves when I go into any store.

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Response to Mme. Defarge (Original post)

Tue Jul 14, 2020, 04:15 PM

34. Locking

After a review by forum hosts - analysis-type article should be posted in GD, feel free to repost it there, good article.
LBN’s SOP:
Post the latest news from reputable mainstream news websites and blogs. Important news of national interest only. No analysis or opinion pieces. No duplicates. News stories must have been published within the last 12 hours. Use the published title of the story as the title of the discussion thread.

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