Plea deal possible in Haditha killings court-martial

[ellisonz]

January 19, 2012 | 7:44 am

The court-martial of Staff Sgt. Frank Wuterich in the killing of 24 Iraqis in 2005 is set to resume Thursday afternoon at Camp Pendleton amid indications prosecutors and defense lawyers may negotiate a plea bargain.

The military judge, Lt. Col. David Jones, abruptly recessed the trial Wednesday afternoon, telling the lawyers to discuss "other options." He added he would be available for consultation.

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Two prosecution witnesses -- a former platoon commander and former sergeant-major -- gave testimony that appeared favorable to Wuterich. The former platoon commander testified that Wuterich and his Marines followed their orders and training when told to "clear'' houses that the Marines suspected as the hiding spot for a gunman firing on them.

Eight Marines -- four officers and four enlisted -- were charged in the killings. Six have had their cases dismissed and one was acquitted.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2012/01/marine-court-martial-to-resume-amid-indications-of-talk-of-plea-bargain.html

I believe Wuterich is the final case to come to trial over Haditha.

More coverage:

Court-martial begins in Marine killing of 24 Iraqis
By Tony Perry, Los Angeles Times
January 9, 2012, 9:40 p.m.
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-marine-iraq-20120110,0,3673376.story

Ex-Marine testifies at squad leader's court-martial in Iraqi deaths
By Tony Perry, Los Angeles Times
January 11, 2012
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-court-marine-20120111,0,5787826.story

Marine testifies squad leader asked him to lie about Iraqi killings
By Tony Perry, Los Angeles Times
January 12, 2012
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-marine-trial-20120112,0,4682900.story

Platoon commander says he gave order to 'clear' Iraqi house
By Tony Perry, Los Angeles Times
January 14, 2012
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-0114-marine-court-20120114,0,2522492.story

U.S. troops need better training on laws of war, experts say
By Carol J. Williams, Los Angeles Times
January 14, 2012, 10:46 p.m.
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-court-marine-20120111,0,5787826.story

Rules of engagement a key issue in Marine's court-martial
By Tony Perry, Los Angeles Times
January 19, 2012
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-marines-haditha-20120119,0,1803996.story

[Lord Magus]

1. So, that would complete the whitewash.

Typical.

[ellisonz]

2. Correct. n/t

[atreides1]

5. Not a surprise

The Army has done a better job of getting convictions then the Marines have...maybe the Marines should let the Army lawyers take over!

This whole Haditha thing reminds me that Monty Python skit, "...nudge, nudge, wink, wink, you know what I mean..."

[happyslug]

8. Part of the reason is the differences in Tactical Doctrine between the Army and the Marines

The Marines tend to be a bit more "aggressive" then the Army when it comes to tactical operations. That increase aggressive can be used to justify the actions of the Marines. i.e. it is harder for Marine Prosecutors to show a disregard of higher orders, then it is for Army Prosecutors, given that the Marines doctrine is that much more aggressive.

[gratuitous]

3. Can't help but wonder

What "justice" might look like if our star-spangled military folks were tried in a court conducted by our victims. We snuff bin Laden without due process and dump the body at sea, and that's called "justice." Then we try our own for the unprovoked massacre of civilians and they all get off. Oh wait; someone might lose a chance at promotion, so that's punishment enough.

Darn those terrorists who hate us for our freedom!

[ellisonz]

6. Perhaps even less just...

...I mean it's not like we don't have a serious militarism problem in this country.

[cstanleytech]

10. Hmm perhaps using Bin Laden wasnt the best choice you could have made when it

comes to examples of due process, after all there were 2,752 people who were denied their due process on 9/11 by bin laden.

[gratuitous]

13. And your proof of that is . . . ?

See, that's the problem with that whole "due process" thing. You can know something in your heart, but producing actual evidence, even against the Worst Person Ever, is what it takes to secure a conviction. While the United States promised us a white paper that would lay out the case against Al Qaeda and Osama bin Laden, for some reason it was never written. We have been assured over and over again that bin Laden was a bad, bad man, and there were videotapes of him apparently endorsing the 9/11 attacks (I don't speak Arabic, so I'm taking someone else's word for that), there was never an outright statement on bin Laden's part that he had direct involvement.

I'm trying really hard to conform to the new fashion in jurisprudence, truly I am. But I can't quite seem to trim my ideals to fit.

[cstanleytech]

14. Proof? Would a confession from the man himself do?

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/updates/binladen_10-29-04.html


Edit: Of course I cannot force you to accept this story at pbs as proof if you dont want to.

[gratuitous]

15. So, you speak Arabic?

Because as odd as it might sound, I don't necessarily trust the Bush administration. None of the quotes in the story quite back up the assertion of an admission in the headline. There's also a little sentence in the story you may have overlooked: "Although there was no way to authenticate the tape or say when it was made, it referenced the upcoming presidential election." See, that's what I mean by "evidence" and "due process." Just because someone else says something, it ain't necessarily so.

[cstanleytech]

17. Why? Do you? If so then I would love to hear your translation that actually refutes what

the article from pbs claims.
As for the adorable theory (and I use the word theory to kindly describe it) I really doubt it because if it was and bin laden wasnt behind 9/11 then he had years to refute it unless of course you think Bush had some sort of godlike powers to control reality itself and prevent such a refutation from appearing.

[gratuitous]

19. Sorry, do your own research

You're the one making unsubstantiated assertions, not me. Osama bin Laden was executed and his body dumped at sea without a trial, without a presentation of the evidence against him, and an opportunity to defend himself. I know that makes a lot of people uncomfortable. If you believe in the Constitution, that may be why. On the other hand, if it's just because someone is pointing that out, there may be another reason it makes you so uncomfortable.

[cstanleytech]

20. No, your the one questioning the articles accuracy if you cant back it up

thats your problem not mine.

[Solly Mack]

4. K&R

Thank you for all the added info.

[ellisonz]

7. You're welcome.

I think it's important to take a full look at this case, which seems to be the most damaging of the the Haditha cases.

[ellisonz]

9. Marine in Haditha killings trial has to decide: Fight or take a deal

January 19, 2012 | 7:38 pm
--Tony Perry at Camp Pendleton

This could be the longest night of Staff Sgt. Frank Wuterich’s life since he became a defendant in arguably the largest war-crime case from the war in Iraq: the killing of 24 unarmed civilians by Marines in the Euphrates River town of Haditha in 2005.

The 31-year-old native of Meriden, Conn., has to decide whether to take a deal offered by Marine prosecutors or continue fighting for a full acquittal and an honorable discharge.

If he takes a deal, he could immediately leave the Marine Corps and continue life as a divorced father of three daughters. But that deal could come with a kind of discharge that would keep him from being eligible for veterans benefits.

But if he decides to continue fighting the charges against him -- manslaughter, assault and dereliction of duty -- he could end up with a conviction on one or more of the counts, which would also bring a discharge under less than honorable grounds.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2012/01/this-could-be-the-longest-night-of-staff-sgt-frank-wuterichs-life-since-he-became-a-defendant-in-arguably-the-largest-war.html

[cstanleytech]

11. I support a plea deal.

Provided it involves life without parole for each act of murder.

[RainbowSuperfund]

12. That sounds reasonable to me. Eom

[ellisonz]

18. Marine's court-martial resumes with no plea deal

Prosecutors and defense attorneys for Staff Sgt. Frank Wuterich apparently fail to reach a settlement over his role in the killing of 24 Iraqi civilians in Haditha in 2005.

By Tony Perry, Los Angeles Times
January 21, 2012

Reporting from Camp Pendleton -- Prosecutors and defense attorneys apparently failed to reach a settlement Friday in the court-martial of Marine Staff Sgt. Frank Wuterich over his role in the killing of 24 Iraqi civilians.

The military judge, Lt. Col. David Jones, cautioned the eight Marines on the jury not to speculate about what had caused him to suspend proceedings Wednesday afternoon, although the jury foreman, a lieutenant colonel, told Jones that he was curious.

Jones said only that the delay had been due to "some legal issues that needed to be taken care of." He promised to clear up the mystery when the trial concludes.

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Wuterich, 31, is charged with manslaughter, assault and dereliction of duty. He is the last of eight Marines charged in the Nov. 19, 2005, killings in the Euphrates River town of Haditha. Charges were dropped against six Marines and another was acquitted at court-martial.

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-marine-haditha-20120121,0,3565379.story