U.S. Bugged EU Offices, Computer Networks: German Magazine

[Purveyor]

Last edited Sat Jun 29, 2013, 02:59 PM - Edit history (1)

Source: REUTERS

Sat Jun 29, 2013 12:20pm EDT

BERLIN (Reuters) - The United States bugged European Union offices and gained access to EU internal computer networks, according to secret documents cited in a German magazine on Saturday, the latest in a series of exposures of alleged U.S. spy programs.

Der Spiegel cited from a September 2010 "top secret" document of the U.S. National Security Agency (NSA) which it said fugitive former NSA contractor Edward Snowden had taken with him and which the weekly's journalists had seen in part.

The document outlines how the NSA bugged offices and spied on EU internal computer networks in Washington and at the United Nations, not only listening to conversations and phone calls but also gaining access to documents and emails.

The document explicitly called the EU a "target".

A slew of Snowden's disclosures in foreign media about U.S. surveillance programs have ignited a political furor in the United States and abroad over the balance between privacy rights and national security.

Read more: http://ca.reuters.com/article/topNews/idCABRE95S0AQ20130629

[Comrade Grumpy]

1. With friends like us...

[pnwmom]

2. Thanks, Snowden. What a hero you are for revealing this.

Since no al Queda (or other terrorists) need to be tracked within Europe, the US is obviously up to no good, and we needed you to expose all this. You obviously know so much more and are so much better at deciding this than all the people we actually elected.

[polly7]

3. Because yes ......... 'fighting terrorism' is behind it all, right?

Whatever happened to working in conjunction with other countries sharing information on possible terrorist activity, do you really think whole 'countries' are working to bring down the U.S.?

But I guess when 'terrorism' can be used to illegally overthrow govt's and kill/maim/displace millions, open up long sought after resources, destroy economies ... a little guy like Snowden can be painted as a terrorist-enabler, no problem and people will fall for it.

[frontier00]

4. Catch

We gotta get this Snowden guy, He's gonna expose our entire foreign intel network
this is more than just protecting civil liberties, this is Ron Paul anarchy

[Comrade Grumpy]

11. Yeah, we certainly don't want to find out things like...

...CIA secret armies

....networks of torture bases

...clandestine arms supplies to guys uncomfortably close to Al Qaeda

...subversion of democratic governments

...spying on American citizens

...massive data collection vacuums sucking up everything

"Ron Paul anarchy." You're a hoot.

[pnwmom]

34. Welcome to DU, frontier00! n/t

[Coyotl]

57. Catch the hyperbole before it gets rampant

bye

[Comrade Grumpy]

9. We were spying on European Union officials, not Al Qaeda.

I'll bet the EU officials are quite pleased to have this information, even if they're not so pleased about being spied on by their putative ally.

What other nasty shit is our national security surveillance state up to? Stay tuned. Sunlight is the best disinfectant.

[muriel_volestrangler]

20. Are you saying the US is right to spy on the European Union?

This is not spying on a suspected terrorist in Europe - it's spying on the officials of allies. This is the equivalent of the German security services bugging the White House.

[PSPS]

29. Oh, yes! TERRA! TERRA! Please spy on me lest I shit myself from FEAR of the TERRA!

[idwiyo]

45. Screw your elected officials and your (generic your) (illusion of) security. You are more than

welcome to volunteer to give your own private data to your elected officials.

[Progressive dog]

51. Well stated nt

[struggle4progress]

5. Translation: Snowden and friends work to sabotage Mr Obama's diplomatic efforts

[frontier00]

6. Snowden

Glen Greenwald should be arrested also

[struggle4progress]

8. That's unlikely, unless there's quite considerable malfeasance by Greenwald: being a dickhead

is not a criminal offense (I am personally relieved to note), nor is being a liar, nor any of Greenwald's other obvious character flaws

[Comrade Grumpy]

10. And the New York Times, and the Guardian, and Der Spiegal, and Reuters...

Ah, the smell of fascism in the morning.

[GermanSmoker]

13. For what? Exposing the USA.

I hope that the damage to the USA MIC is done. We here in Europe are more than angry. The politicians will have a hard time to convince the people that everything is fine. The comment sections of the Newssites are furios. Obama was very popular here in germany, but now he has reached Bush level. Even worse. People never expected anything positive from a moron like Bush, but we all had high hopes in Obama. And when it comes to his legacy. Well he will have one, but it will not be a pretty one.

I wrote to the State Department an Email begging them to ban me for life from entering the USA. I want to be treated like an enemy of the state. Sadly these lazy bums haven't answered me. Or maybe they think I am an important lunatic.

[struggle4progress]

16. Amid Ire At U.S., Germany Does Its Own Domestic Spying

by Soraya Sarhaddi Nelson
June 22, 2013 5:14 AM

... Then came the revelations this week — — that the German government is spending more than $130 million over the next five years to beef up its own online surveillance.

Currently, antiquated technology limits access by the country's foreign intelligence agency to 5 percent of online communications that go in and out of the country. The improvements could increase that number to 20 percent, the magazine said.

Germany's top court also recently upheld the right of security agencies to maintain an anti-terror database containing sensitive personal information about German citizens ...

http://www.npr.org/blogs/parallels/2013/06/22/194299389/Privacy-In-Germany

[MannyGoldstein]

23. Can you send some European outrage to us Americans?

We Americans have forgotten how to be outraged by truly outrageous acts.

"The White House is spying on every American!!!"

"Uh... Snowden didn't smile at his neighbors."

"But the White House is spying on every American!!!"

"Uh... there's some guy who's crazy who also is worried about that, so you must be crazy."

[nineteen50]

7. and there it is again

it's about protecting Obama and his legacy not about spying and constitution rights.

[struggle4progress]

15. Mr Snowden's original self-presentation as a whistle-blower concerned about Constitutional rights

doesn't seem to hold up well, given subsequent behavior and "revelations"

One can, of course, be opposed to spying on principle -- and I suppose it is possible that Mr Snowden has now developed some conscientious objections to spying, though the fact that Mr Snowden says he deliberately took his most job at BAH in order to pilfer documents does not seem to square well with a deep personal conscientious objection to spy-like activities

In any case, Constitutional rights and international spying are not the same issue, and it doesn't help us think clearly if we confuse them

[nineteen50]

19. Big question is

what happened to all the democrats upset about Bush spying? Why are they supporting Obama increase and continued use of spying?

[struggle4progress]

22. ... The spying extended to the 27-member bloc's Brussels headquarters, Der Spiegel said, referring

to an incident "more than five years ago" when EU security experts discovered telephone and online bugging devices at the Justus Lipsius building. In 2003, the EU announced it had discovered phone taps in the building targeting the offices of several countries, including Germany, Britain and France ...
EU officials targeted in US spying: report
07:01 Sun Jun 30 2013
AAP

Obama wasn't President in 2003. And he wasn't President "more than five years ago" either. But thanks for playing

[muriel_volestrangler]

46. Oh, please, don't try to hide behind "..."

when "..." means "But it was not immediately clear if Der Spiegel was referring to this case."

The pro-surveillance DUers never miss a chance to mislead, do you? Even when it's a petty "..."

[struggle4progress]

47. I read that as reference to two different incidents: one over five and a half years ago, the other

in 2003

The "not immediately clear" refers to one of those two

But whichever it was, Obama wasn't President then: he wasn't President in 2003, and he wasn't President five and a half years ago, either

I suppose we'll have to wait for the Sunday news comes to we see what Der Spiegel actually claims and perhaps until them we could avoid pizzing our pants over summary teasers

[struggle4progress]

49. "... Without citing sources, the magazine reported that more than five years ago security officers

at the EU had noticed and traced several missed calls to NSA offices within the NATO compound in Brussels ..."
NSA Spied On European Union States At Brussels And UN, Der Spiegel Says Edward Snowden Documents Show
By Eric Linton
on June 29 2013 3:34 PM

[struggle4progress]

50. "... Spiegel reports that five years ago, EU security officers had investigated a series of missed

calls to NSA offices located in NATO facilities in Brussels ..."
Report: NSA spied on EU institutions

[PSPS]

33. Sadly, you're right. Obama's worshipers are really no different than Bush's worshipers

To each, it's all about "my guy versus your guy." My primary concern is for american values being upheld.

[nineteen50]

44. Thank You

PSPS I like your primary concern.

[Nihil]

58. So true.

> Obama's worshipers are really no different than Bush's worshipers
> "my guy versus your guy"

The creatures outside looked from pig to man, and from man to pig, and from pig to man again;
but already it was impossible to say which was which.

(FWIW: Note how it's the same bunch who crap out anti-Assange walls of text at the drop of a hat ...
obviously "hating them for their freedom" ...)

[siligut]

37. But they have sacrificed their queen to do it?

So basically you believe that there is a powerful element in the NSA that doesn't want diplomacy? Or a powerful element within Booz Allen?

[struggle4progress]

38. huh?

[siligut]

40. "Translation: Snowden and friends work to sabotage Mr Obama's diplomatic efforts"

"Translation: Snowden and friends work to sabotage Mr Obama's diplomatic efforts"

Who are Snowden's friends? And why do they want to sabotage Obama's diplomatic efforts?

[JDPriestly]

53. Bugging an ally's phones is not diplomacy.

I hope they don't take back Obama's Nobel Peace Prize.

[struggle4progress]

54. "... Without citing sources, the magazine reported that more than five years ago security officers

at the EU had noticed and traced several missed calls to NSA offices within the NATO compound in Brussels ..."
NSA Spied On European Union States At Brussels And UN, Der Spiegel Says Edward Snowden Documents Show
By Eric Linton
on June 29 2013 3:34 PM

"... Spiegel reports that five years ago, EU security officers had investigated a series of missed calls to NSA offices located in NATO facilities in Brussels ..."
Report: NSA spied on EU institutions

I can only go by what's reported. I don't know what Der Spiegel saw or whether it's authentic

I do know that "more than five years ago" Mr Obama was still in the middle of his first Presidential campaign

And I know that Mr Snowden is a libertarian who didn't vote for Obama but who has been using the now-standard libertarian "I'm so disappointed in Obama" troll-line ever since he popped up

And I've noticed that Mr Snowden managed to make claims about the US spying on China just in time to disrupt the Xi-Obama summit and that he managed to make claims about the UK spying just in time for the G8

So perhaps it is reasonable to guess that the Merkel-Obama meeting gave Mr Snowden the idea that he might be able to foment discord between Germany and the US

[L0oniX]

12. Snowden and friends tend to piss off the US pro snooping assholes ...and that's a good thing.

They're pissed because they got their dirty deeds exposed ...and they should be shamed for it. The more embarrassment the better.

[DeSwiss]

56. +1000

- And these f&^@ers don't embarrass easy.....

[frontier00]

14. Snowden

He doesn't have much time left, kinda feel sorry for the guy

[temmer]

17. Germany will grant him asylum

if the revelations keep coming like that.

[struggle4progress]

24. not likely

[temmer]

26. you killed my joke

[struggle4progress]

48. Sorry. No body language, no facial expressions, no tone of voice on an internet chat board

so I can't always figure out what folks are saying

[MyNameGoesHere]

18. What the fuck have we become? eom

[Poll_Blind]

21. The EU, a major trading partner, will not be happy with this. nt

PB

[dipsydoodle]

28. Snowden leaks have not hurt US foreign policy, says UN ambassador Susan Rice

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1014&pid=522311

I'm lucky - at least I can trust egg fried.

[Catherina]

25. Now being carried in Le Monde for the French, with a few more details

Der Spiegel also gathered the reaction of European leaders on its site, such as the President of the EU Parliament Martin Schulz, who stated that "if this is confirmed, it's an immense scandal: "It would considerably damagee relations between the EU and the US", he added.

As far as Luxembourg's Minister of Foreign Affairs is concerned, "the United States had better conduct surveillance on their Spy Agencies instead of their allies". American espionage is "out of control", he stated, and underlined that if these espionage activities "are justified by the war on terrorism (...) the EU and its diplomats are not terrorists".

Also on Spiegel's site, the European Deputy for Ecological Affairs, Daniel Conh-Bendit, called for an immediate rupture in negotiations for the Trans Atlantic Free Trade Agreement, as long as an accord isn't signed for data protection. The negotiations were begun in 2011 and are still ongoing.

On Wednesday, the European Union asked the United States to provide answers to its questions about Prism, NSA's surveillance program, "as quickly as possible".

====
Der Spiegel a également recueilli sur son site internet des réactions de personnalités européennes, comme le président du Parlement européen, l'Allemand Martin Schulz, qui estime que "si cela se confirme, il s'agit d'un immense scandale". "Cela nuirait considérablement aux relations entre l'UE et les Etats-Unis", ajoute-t-il.

Pour le ministre des affaires étrangères luxembourgeois, Jean Asselbron, "les États-Unis feraient manifestement mieux de surveiller leurs services de renseignement plutôt que leurs alliés". L'espionnage américain est "hors de contrôle", juge-t-il, soulignant que si les activités de renseignement "sont justifiées par la lutte contre le terrorisme (...) l'UE et ses diplomates ne sont pas des terroristes".

Toujours sur le site du Spiegel, le député européen écologiste Daniel Conh-Bendit appelle à une rupture immédiate des négociations sur le traité de libre-échange transatlantique, tant qu'un accord n'a pas été signé avec les États-Unis sur la protection des données. Des négociations en ce sens, lancées en 2011, n'ont toujours pas abouti.

Mercredi, l'Union européenne avait demandé aux États-Unis de lui fournir "aussi rapidement que possible" des réponses à ses questions sur le programme de surveillance américain Prism.

http://www.lemonde.fr/ameriques/article/2013/06/29/prism-la-nsa-espionnait-l-union-europeenne_3439112_3222.html

[proverbialwisdom]

30. Thank you for the translation. nt

[Catherina]

32. You're welcome n/t

[temmer]

35. Cohn-Bendit tried to rip you off? Tell me more

Interesting.

Cohn-Bendit is a franco-german green/leftist politician with a high reputation and recognition for decades.

What did he do - did he sell you fake jewelry or what?

[adric mutelovic]

27. The key question is: Did Glenn Greenwald repay his entire student loan?

The Magazine failed to address that.

[struggle4progress]

39. Note lack of specifics so far

[Catherina]

41. From 'Le Parisien' so guaranteed to be the topic du jour

It wasn't just microphones installed in the building but also the infiltration of the computer networks that allowed it (the NSA) to read all the emails and internal documents. According to these same documents, in which the Europeans are explicitly designated as "attack targets", the EU Representatives to the UN were spied upon in the same way.

France was also spied upon very closely

The NSA had even expanded its operations to Brussels. "More than five years ago" wrote Der Spiegel, security experts from the EU had discovered a listening device in the telephone and internet network of in the Justus Lipsius building, the principal headquarters of the Council of the European Union, which relayed back to NATO headquarters in the suburbs of Brussels. In 2003, the EU confirmed the discovery of a wiretapping system in the offices of several countries, including France and Germany. But it is unclear if the 2003 discovery is what the article in the German newspaper refers to. Der Spiegel also collected on its website the reactions of European personalities, as President of the European Parliament, German Martin Schulz, who believes that "if this is confirmed, this is a huge scandal." "This would significantly harm relations between the EU and the U.S.," he added.

====
Il s'agissait non seulement de micros installés dans le bâtiment, mais aussi d'une infiltration du réseau informatique qui lui permettait de lire les courriers électroniques et les documents internes. La représentation de l'UE à l'ONU était surveillée de la même manière, toujours selon ces documents, dans lesquels les Européens sont explicitement désignés comme des «cibles à attaquer».

La France également surveillée de près

La NSA avait même étendu ses opérations jusqu'à Bruxelles. Il y a «plus de cinq ans», écrit Der Spiegel, les experts en sécurité de l'UE avaient découvert un système d'écoutes sur le réseau téléphonique et internet du bâtiment Justus-Lipsius, principal siège du Conseil de l'Union européenne, et qui remontait jusqu'au quartier général de l'Otan dans la banlieue de Bruxelles.
En 2003, l'UE avait confirmé la découverte d'un système d'écoutes téléphoniques des bureaux de plusieurs pays, dont la France et l'Allemagne. Mais il est difficile de savoir s'il s'agit de cette affaire dont parle l'article du journal allemand. Der Spiegel a également recueilli sur son site internet des réactions de personnalités européennes, comme le président du Parlement européen, l'Allemand Martin Schulz, qui estime que «si cela se confirme, il s'agit d'un immense scandale». «Cela nuirait considérablement aux relations entre l'UE et les Etats-Unis», ajoute-t-il.

http://www.leparisien.fr/international/affaire-snowden-les-etats-unis-auraient-aussi-espionne-les-europeens-29-06-2013-2939689.php

Someone should consider getting Susan Rice a subscription to European newspapers.

[Purveyor]

42. +1 EOM

[Catherina]

43. Video report: Bugging Brussels: New Snowden leak claims NSA spies on EU diplomats

Published on Jun 29, 2013

Even more scathing reports of US surveillance are emerging from Germany - courtesy of Edward Snowden. Der Spiegel magazine is reporting that they've seen a top secret US document - outlining how the country's intelligence bugged EU offices and spied on the bloc's internal computer networks. RT's Peter Oliver is in Berlin with more on this latest leak. RT is also joined by Lode Vanoost - former deputy speaker of the Belgian parliament. Read more: http://on.rt.com/0ha7ne

[AdHocSolver]

52. Ubiquitous spying by the NSA and similar groups is the equivalent of a bunch of Peeping Toms.

"They are merely looking. You have no reason to be upset."

[DeSwiss]

55. K&R