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Suburban Warrior

(405 posts)
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 12:45 AM Jan 2014

Southwest Jet Bound for Branson Lands at Wrong Airport

Source: KSPR

BRANSON, Mo.

A Southwest Airlines flight, bound for Branson Airport lands at M. Graham Clark Airport, just eight miles away.

A Southwest Airlines official says there were 124 passengers on the plane.

No one was injured, but passengers tell KSPR News the runway is too short to allow for a safe takeoff. There is a steep drop off at both ends of the runway that is near College of the Ozarks and the 737 came dangerously close to tumbling off.

Passengers report the pilot had to break hard to prevent going over the edge and they could smell burning rubber inside the plane as a result.

Read more: http://www.kspr.com/news/local/southwest-jet-bound-for-branson-lands-at-wrong-airport/-/21051620/23895590/-/n08v03/-/index.html

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Southwest Jet Bound for Branson Lands at Wrong Airport (Original Post) Suburban Warrior Jan 2014 OP
Yikes! Isn't this the second time airline has landed at wrong airport KoKo Jan 2014 #1
A cargo 747 landed Suburban Warrior Jan 2014 #3
Okay, this is pilot error but not negligence or poor piloting. dballance Jan 2014 #2
A pretty serious error ... Gordon Alf Shumway Jan 2014 #7
8 miles is nothing to a jet Sgent Jan 2014 #16
I get it ... Gordon Alf Shumway Jan 2014 #38
It's damn poor piloting. The Velveteen Ocelot Jan 2014 #12
Yea, that's what I thought ... Gordon Alf Shumway Jan 2014 #39
you think that's comparable to a wrong turn? CreekDog Jan 2014 #55
Land on the wrong runway? It's easy. dballance Jan 2014 #60
Shows how small Branson airport is! WhiteTara Jan 2014 #4
Those lucky folks who were spared spending time in Branson should take it as a sign. Hoyt Jan 2014 #5
LOL! +1 Le Taz Hot Jan 2014 #61
They were lucky: jsr Jan 2014 #6
Very Lucky Suburban Warrior Jan 2014 #13
Nice areal shot davidpdx Jan 2014 #20
Soooo.... House of Roberts Jan 2014 #8
No passengers, minimum fuel, maybe take out the galley carts The Velveteen Ocelot Jan 2014 #10
Don't forget full flaps! n/t Meandyou Jan 2014 #23
Not a 737. You never take off with full flaps The Velveteen Ocelot Jan 2014 #45
Haven't checked specs on the 737-700 but- pangaia Jan 2014 #43
They'll off load passengers and fuel and fly it out. Suburban Warrior Jan 2014 #11
With little fuel and no passengers/cargo, a 737 can take off in 1400 feet. NutmegYankee Jan 2014 #29
He landed with one eye jakeXT Jan 2014 #47
No sweat. They can handle the takeoff easily using... pinboy3niner Jan 2014 #52
D'oh! The Velveteen Ocelot Jan 2014 #9
The airport he landed at is far closer to Branson than Branson Airport is jmowreader Jan 2014 #14
The upside is the passengers have a shorter commute to their hotel Major Nikon Jan 2014 #22
Look at Google Maps and you'll see you're exactly right jmowreader Jan 2014 #33
I've flown into PLK Major Nikon Jan 2014 #35
Can't you just see the flight crew and attendants red faces saying .. bu-bye, bu-bye, bu-bye ..ha ha YOHABLO Jan 2014 #15
No seattledo Jan 2014 #17
I posted the first four Suburban Warrior Jan 2014 #18
nice response (high 5) tomm2thumbs Jan 2014 #34
I giggled and I appre iate your sense of humor.... TheDebbieDee Jan 2014 #59
Local commuter landed at the wrong airport here years ago. Pre-tower days. pinto Jan 2014 #19
Quite a few of them are on the same frequency Major Nikon Jan 2014 #30
We need more facts... Capt.Rocky300 Jan 2014 #21
I suspect the tower was closed Major Nikon Jan 2014 #31
There is no published back course approach so I suspect....... Capt.Rocky300 Jan 2014 #48
Last I heard they were talking to the FAA and the NTSB Major Nikon Jan 2014 #50
I believe most, if not all, 121 airline company flight operation manuals...... Capt.Rocky300 Jan 2014 #53
I've flown with a lot of professional pilots Major Nikon Jan 2014 #54
As has been learned from past incidents, it's almost never.. Capt.Rocky300 Jan 2014 #57
This seems to have happened a lot lately. n/t Meandyou Jan 2014 #24
The pilot had to brake hard... awoke_in_2003 Jan 2014 #25
Let me guess....They departed from Colorado, right? Th1onein Jan 2014 #26
LOL! LeftofObama Jan 2014 #27
:) Th1onein Jan 2014 #62
They got lucky. Sky Masterson Jan 2014 #28
STOP IT SKY MASTERSON Skittles Jan 2014 #32
What? Sky Masterson Jan 2014 #56
They landed even closer to Branson Major Nikon Jan 2014 #36
"Paddle faster - I hear banos!" The Velveteen Ocelot Jan 2014 #46
Why not paint the airport code on the runway? greymattermom Jan 2014 #37
That's how you end up in Bronson instead of Branson. tanyev Jan 2014 #40
"...This ain't ovah!!" Blue_Tires Jan 2014 #49
Sounds like everything turned out alright. truthisfreedom Jan 2014 #41
3,700 feet of runway- James48 Jan 2014 #42
Sounds like they are going to have to truck it out of there. Historic NY Jan 2014 #44
oops! KansDem Jan 2014 #51
giggity giggity, giggity goo Kaleva Jan 2014 #58
not exactly the right airport, but in the ballpark. olddad56 Jan 2014 #63

KoKo

(84,711 posts)
1. Yikes! Isn't this the second time airline has landed at wrong airport
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 12:49 AM
Jan 2014

in the past few months?

Weather is bad...but, is there a glitch in our Air Traffic System?

Suburban Warrior

(405 posts)
3. A cargo 747 landed
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 12:55 AM
Jan 2014

at the wrong airport in November.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/11/21/travel/kansas-cargo-plane-wrong-airport/

I don't think weather was an issue in this latest incident but we will have to wait for the NTSB report for factual information.

 

dballance

(5,756 posts)
2. Okay, this is pilot error but not negligence or poor piloting.
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 12:54 AM
Jan 2014

Yes they made a mistake. How many times have any of us taken the wrong exit or a wrong turn?

The fact this happens so rarely is a tribute to the professionals who are in the cockpits.

7. A pretty serious error ...
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 01:15 AM
Jan 2014

I really don't get how this happens. The GPS on my phone generally gets me within 8 meters of where I need to go, much less 8 miles. (Even Apple Maps) is Air Traffic Control operating with technology inferior to my cell phone?

Maybe it's time to let at least the pilots turn on their cell phones during landing.

Sgent

(5,857 posts)
16. 8 miles is nothing to a jet
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 02:01 AM
Jan 2014

its about 1 minute of flight time.

In addition, most airports still don't have GPS approaches, so you use the GPS until you get to the approach point (could be 50-100 miles away) and the use the old ILS system for the actual approach. In addition, the GPS in a 737 is probably not fully integrated with the instruments as its a relatively new system.

Finally, many pilots, if its a clear day and at an uncontrolled field (Branson probably is one), will cancel the instrument approach and land via visual flight rules once they have the airport in sight.

If its nighttime, they spot a nearby airport and mistake it for the intended one, not realizing that its the wrong one until very late in the landing process or not until they are on the ground.

Its still not excusable, but that's how it happens.

38. I get it ...
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 08:35 AM
Jan 2014

But really, 8 miles is a lot to a jet, particularly a jet at low altitude and in the vicinity of airports. In less remote air space it could easily cause mid-air collisions.

Bottom line, I still don't get how the pilots of a commercial passenger jet don't have or don't use technology that can tell them where they are closer than 8 miles, while my phone can easily tell me where I am within a few meters.

Weird ...

The Velveteen Ocelot

(115,674 posts)
12. It's damn poor piloting.
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 01:23 AM
Jan 2014

Modern airplanes have instruments that should make it impossible to land at the wrong airport if the crew is paying attention to what the airplane is telling them.

CreekDog

(46,192 posts)
55. you think that's comparable to a wrong turn?
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 04:48 PM
Jan 2014

choosing the wrong airport, navigating to the wrong airport, lining up to a runway too short, proceeding with a landing at the wrong airport and a runway too short for the airplane?

you think that's a wrong turn?

oh no. you're way wrong on this, people could have been killed, very conceivably.

wrong turn my butt.

 

dballance

(5,756 posts)
60. Land on the wrong runway? It's easy.
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 07:29 PM
Jan 2014
http://www.cnn.com/2014/01/13/opinion/goyer-airplane-wrong-runway/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

(CNN) -- After a Boeing 747 Dreamlifter landed at a small airport in Wichita a couple of months ago -- the pilot having mistaken the runway for a much longer and wider one in a similar orientation at a nearby military base -- I made the prediction that it wasn't the last time we'd see such a blunder.

But on Sunday, a Southwest 737 crew mistook a runway in Branson, Missouri, for one at the much larger airport nearby, Springfield/Branson National Airport, and landed there instead. To make matters more hair-raising, the 737 touched down on a relatively short runway even for light planes, never mind for airliners. To their credit, the crew members of the Boeing jet got it stopped short of the end of the runway, where an embankment separated it from U.S. Highway 65, without doing any damage to passengers or the plane.


The question arises: "How did a professionally trained crew manage to screw up so badly?" The answer is it's very easy to do. Take the accidental landing of a C-17 at a small Florida airport in 2012, for example. The crew's intended airport was MacDill Air Force Base, but it instead touched down the giant jet on the much, much shorter, 100-foot-wide runway a few miles away. Military personnel had to work for hours after the mix-up to lighten the airplane's load so it could take off from the short strip.

The fact is that any pilot with a lot of experience who claims to have never at least lined up to land at a runway other than the intended one is probably fibbing. I've been flying everything from light propeller planes to big jets for more than 30 years, and I've aimed for the wrong runway three times and a really big taxiway on a different occasion.

More at link.

On Edit: don't be such jerk. You're not a professional pilot and you don't know anything about flying. Read the linked article by a real professional pilot.

WhiteTara

(29,704 posts)
4. Shows how small Branson airport is!
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 12:59 AM
Jan 2014

Southwest has only been flying out of there for less than a year I think. Funny, but scary.

 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
5. Those lucky folks who were spared spending time in Branson should take it as a sign.
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 01:01 AM
Jan 2014

Seriously, glad it was not a tragic pilot error.

Le Taz Hot

(22,271 posts)
61. LOL! +1
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 07:39 PM
Jan 2014

I was visiting relatives last summer in the Bible Belt and the possibility of visiting Branson came up. I wasn't really interested but I thought, "Well, there's lots of opportunities for entertainment, surely I could find something that might be interesting." Wrong! It's like Las Vegas for has-beens and hackneyed "hoe downs," etc. And the ticket prices! $50.00 for something I had absolutely NO interest in seeing. Thankfully, we didn't have time to do the Branson thing.

The Velveteen Ocelot

(115,674 posts)
10. No passengers, minimum fuel, maybe take out the galley carts
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 01:22 AM
Jan 2014

and anything else that isn't bolted down. Then do a short-field takeoff (hold the brakes while advancing the throttles) and hope for the best.

The Velveteen Ocelot

(115,674 posts)
45. Not a 737. You never take off with full flaps
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 11:21 AM
Jan 2014

in a commercial jet - you'd get a takeoff warning horn or chime. There is a specific takeoff flap setting (typically about 15 degrees), and if you haven't set flaps properly the airplane will warn you that the setting is unsafe. Full flaps on a 737 would be a landing config only.

pangaia

(24,324 posts)
43. Haven't checked specs on the 737-700 but-
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 11:02 AM
Jan 2014

the 3500' length of the runway where it is, IS in fact long enough to take off. But of there is an engine failure, or any other problem after using up about 2000' or more, no way will it be possible to stop the aircraft.

Every commercial aircraft over a certain weight has minimum runway requirements - accelerate-stop distance - that include enough distance once the aircraft reaches v1 to come to a stop in case of a problem.
Sort of...

NutmegYankee

(16,199 posts)
29. With little fuel and no passengers/cargo, a 737 can take off in 1400 feet.
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 06:14 AM
Jan 2014

The runway is twice that. My all-time favorite is TACA flight 110, which suffered a dual engine failure and had to land on a levy outside of New Orleans. They fixed the engines and flew it off.

jmowreader

(50,554 posts)
14. The airport he landed at is far closer to Branson than Branson Airport is
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 01:31 AM
Jan 2014

This is gonna be ugly no matter what.

jmowreader

(50,554 posts)
33. Look at Google Maps and you'll see you're exactly right
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 07:02 AM
Jan 2014

I've been past Branson Airport...there is not a damn thing out there.

 

YOHABLO

(7,358 posts)
15. Can't you just see the flight crew and attendants red faces saying .. bu-bye, bu-bye, bu-bye ..ha ha
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 01:34 AM
Jan 2014

the scowls on those passengers faces must have been something.

 

seattledo

(295 posts)
17. No
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 02:07 AM
Jan 2014

> pilot had to break hard

No, the other article I read said nothing was broken. That is incorrect. So what are you claiming that he broke?

Suburban Warrior

(405 posts)
18. I posted the first four
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 02:11 AM
Jan 2014

paragraphs as they appear in the news article (spelling errors included) as is required of a LBN post. The non wise-ass posters all understood that. Why didn't you?

pinto

(106,886 posts)
19. Local commuter landed at the wrong airport here years ago. Pre-tower days.
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 02:23 AM
Jan 2014

Apparently it was a radio "click" approach to light the runway. Seems the two airports were close enough that the signal worked for both. Pilots made a safe landing, passengers were bussed to the intended destination, but the plane had to be stripped down to minimum weight to get back up off the short runway.

Major Nikon

(36,827 posts)
30. Quite a few of them are on the same frequency
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 06:27 AM
Jan 2014

Around where I am there are so many airports close together you can often see several of them light up when you click the mic to turn the lights on.

Capt.Rocky300

(1,005 posts)
21. We need more facts...
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 02:56 AM
Jan 2014

The two runways are similarly aligned, a difference of about 20 degrees in orientation. The normal runway to use in calm conditions at Branson is to the Northwest, runway 32 which has an instrument landing system. The winds were from the south however and of sufficient speed to mandate a landing to the Southeast using runway 14. The only guided approach to that runway is a GPS approach utilizing onboard equipment, assuming they have it and it is functional. Otherwise it is strictly a look out the windshield visual approach. The crew may not have taken advantage of all the tools available to them. We'll have to wait and see.

Major Nikon

(36,827 posts)
31. I suspect the tower was closed
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 06:49 AM
Jan 2014

My guess is they were in a hurry for ATC to give them the frequency change to the CTAF so they could start making their inbound calls, so they called the airport in sight before they were certain it was positively identified.

On one hand I can understand how it happened. PLK has a pretty wide runway and both airports are single runways. However, PLK has a different frequency so they should have suspected something was wrong when they couldn't control the runway lights. BBG also has a MALSF on the 32 end which they should have noticed was missing, and even if they were intending on landing on 14, they could have gotten a back course indication from the localizer. If nothing else the DME would have given them useful information.

Capt.Rocky300

(1,005 posts)
48. There is no published back course approach so I suspect.......
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 02:44 PM
Jan 2014

Branson Airport may have the highly directional type of localizer which doesn't give a reliable signal for a back course. So, they most likely didn't even have it tuned in. One thing is for sure, the crew is probably in the Chief Pilot's office right now trying to explain themselves.

Major Nikon

(36,827 posts)
50. Last I heard they were talking to the FAA and the NTSB
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 03:50 PM
Jan 2014

So I'm sure they are having several conversations regarding their future in aviation.

All localizers will generate a back course signal to one degree or another simply due to the nature of the antenna design. With a few exceptions the FAA has standardized to one type of antenna with the biggest difference for most being the number of dipoles in the array. Sometimes they can't be flight checked reliably for back course use due to obstructions, and sometimes there isn't enough of a reason for the FAA to maintain the back course approach which costs money. Given the proliferation of GPS approaches, back course approaches are falling out of favor. It's just as easy for them to commission a GPS approach which provides for vertical guidance and in many cases lower minimums. There's no reason not to dial it up, if for no other reason than to receive the DME, which is omnidirectional. Even though there's no requirement to do so, it could have saved their aviation careers and the airline a lot of money. Personally I like to have all my radios working for me. If nothing else it gives me something to do on the enroute phase.

It will be interesting to see what comes of this. Two of these in two months almost guarantees there will be some type of action taken by both the FAA and the insurance companies.

Capt.Rocky300

(1,005 posts)
53. I believe most, if not all, 121 airline company flight operation manuals......
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 04:29 PM
Jan 2014

require the crew to use all available navaids for an approach, even when doing a visual in order to avoid this very situation. As you said, the DME would have given them a clue. I don't know the level of automation in this airplane but I would have thought the SWA fleet would be equipped with GPS and a Navigation Display in a Full Glass or Partial Glass Cockpit. You would think the pilot monitoring would have seen the discrepancy on the ND.

Major Nikon

(36,827 posts)
54. I've flown with a lot of professional pilots
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 04:37 PM
Jan 2014

Most of them have been very big on using all the radios, even when flying part 91. As you said we need more facts to see what was going on. Perhaps they had some sort of distractions going on that prevented them from due diligence. For all we know at this point they could have had an emergency. I hope this isn't a simple matter of just being careless.

Capt.Rocky300

(1,005 posts)
57. As has been learned from past incidents, it's almost never..
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 04:54 PM
Jan 2014

just one thing, it's a chain of events that leads to mistakes. Break the chain and the outcome is improved. Following prescribed procedures almost always prevents that chain from being linked together in the first place. I will be interested to hear how much rest they had had and how long their duty day was. Being tired can cause bad decisions and complacency.

Sky Masterson

(5,240 posts)
28. They got lucky.
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 06:02 AM
Jan 2014

They could have landed in Branson.
Been there once and got hives. If I want to see toothless yokels, I'll go to a family reunion.

Major Nikon

(36,827 posts)
36. They landed even closer to Branson
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 07:27 AM
Jan 2014

If nothing else, hearing the banjo music on final approach should have clued them in.

greymattermom

(5,754 posts)
37. Why not paint the airport code on the runway?
Mon Jan 13, 2014, 07:38 AM
Jan 2014

It's just 3 letters. I like it when the lanes of a complex intersection are labeled.

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