Snowden denies he got help from Russia in leaking U.S. secrets: report

[dipsydoodle]

Source: Reuters

(Reuters) - Former U.S. spy agency contractor Edward Snowden said he acted alone in leaking U.S. government secrets and that suggestions by some U.S. lawmakers he might have had help from Russia were "absurd," the New Yorker magazine reported on Tuesday.

In an interview the magazine said was conducted by encrypted means from Moscow, Snowden was quoted as saying, "This 'Russian spy' push is absurd."

Snowden said he "clearly and unambiguously acted alone, with no help from anyone, much less a government," the New Yorker said.

"It won't stick. ... Because it's clearly false, and the American people are smarter than politicians think they are," the publication quoted Snowden as saying.

Read more: http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/01/22/uk-usa-security-snowden-idUKBREA0L04520140122

[newfie11]

1. All because Russia gave him asylum

I guess they feel if enough mud is thrown some will stick. Them maybe Russia will feel compelled to hand him over.

What a pathetic childish game.

[Demeter]

3. It's slander, pure and simple

And I hope that Snowden gets to take his oppressors to court and win.

[newfie11]

4. +1 Nt

[George II]

5. He STOLE millions of documents and people are worrying about him being "slandered"?

[msanthrope]

12. You should read some Assange threads...the concern for a rapist's reputation would make you sick. n

[whatchamacallit]

29. Tried and convicted right msanthope?

Ye shall know them by their repugnant bullshit

[msanthrope]

34. No..bail jumping fugitive rapist, as guilty as sin. But his time is gonna come. nt

[whatchamacallit]

35. Libel much?

Piece-o-work...

[msanthrope]

36. Yeah...Julian can sue me for it, too. Except, wait....he can't. nt

[whatchamacallit]

39. Spoken like a true misanthrope

Congrats!

[msanthrope]

44. Msanthrope, como si chiam'. nt

[George II]

46. No, he wasn't tried and convicted - he's too much of a coward to allow a trial.

[whatchamacallit]

48. George II Lol!

What have we here?...

[Titonwan]

53. Fawning devotion to authority

seems to be endemic to a place founded on independent thinking...
How odd is that!

[whatchamacallit]

58. Welcome to DU!

[Titonwan]

60. Thanks.

I've been here since 2008 but talk only when I feel the subject is worthwhile.

[whatchamacallit]

63. Ah, well good to see you out and about.

[Titonwan]

66. Well, don't get me wrong...

... I like DU, but it's sort of like an echo chamber sometimes and you get a lot of high mileage posters who get shrill at the least little bit of criticism of 'their' president. You know, the corporatist shill we have now.
I used to like going to HuffPo to argue with WingNuts® but first they sold out to AOL and then got real tight-assed on comments, but the last straw was forcing people to sign up for FaceFuck (even though they said we would be grandfathered in).
I had many fans but I quit over such requirements.

[treestar]

71. Better than fawning devotion to Edward Snowden

Just why should anyone believe what he says?

And it appears his only virtue is snubbing authority. Of a nation that is a republic, with free speech and whistleblower laws. Where he is now, he'd better respect authority, or he could end up in the gulag.

[Titonwan]

54. I didn't get the poster's name, but this is funny!

"I was in a coal mine once and there was this narcissistic canary.
Little bird was all like "look at me, I can't breathe! You're all going to die if you don't get to fresh air!"

It was all about him. We told him to shut up.

Right before we passed out..."

(h/t to whoever that genius was!)

[Demenace]

16. Thank you, people for pushing back on this worship of something that is dangerous...

Lots of people who are otherwise smart, are failing to see the dangers in worshipping an individual who is in possession of information that could have an adverse effective on their very well being. This individual did not just take information that is limited to the local concerns of Americans which if that was what he did would be, maybe, okay to a certain degree because those details would have helped focus attention on what the government was doing within its borders. No, this individual has information that is global which for a long time, no one would be able to address the fall outs.

But most here think, he did this for their local interests. In my day, anyone who acted like this individual has done and is on a foreign soil is regarded as a foreign agent. So why is this individual any different?

[msanthrope]

8. What court? Where? I thank you for the belly laugh though! nt

[Progressive dog]

27. Come home and sue, Snowden

Come home, you should have your day in court. You've been slandered, come home and defend yourself.

[MADem]

2. Well, he needs to talk about how he came to be staying in the Russian consulate in Hong Kong...

....and he needs to tell us where he was staying while in the cough-bullshit-cough "transit zone" because most people do not believe he was really staying there.

[Titonwan]

6. Edward Snowden stayed in a nice hotel in Hong Kong

... gave the heavily encrypted information to Glenn Greenwald and film maker Laura Poitras and then sought to fly to South America via Russia and Europe. En route, his passport was illegally revoked (per U.N. law re: political asylum) and was forcibly stranded in Russia. Anatoly Kucherena and Wikileaks Sarah Harrison can affirm this if one was to research a bit, instead of speculating.
I've been studying this intently since June and I suggest you go to the Guardian and read Glenn's archives to catch up because it sounds like you're woefully behind in your 'facts'.
Here's a nice interview with Glenn (at his home in Rio) where he's not having to fend off spurious attacks by propaganda interviewers.
http://motherboard.vice.com/blog/meet-glenn-greenwald-video-interview
Personally, I like it when he cuts down the media squawkers. Glenn doesn't suffer fools gladly.

[msanthrope]

11. Poor Ed....he should file a complaint at the US Embassy. nt

[George II]

13. Most people in Hong Kong fly EAST to get to South America, not through Moscow!

Further, if he was working in Hawaii, and his final intended destination was South America, why did he go to Hong Kong to give Greenwald his documents? Remember, Greenwald LIVES in South America!!

[Demenace]

20. You bother too much to reason with the worshipper of this individual...

For them, they are so smart that they have all this figured out but when you stand back and review their reasoning, you tend to see the narrow vision with which they view this issue.

Why fly to Hong Kong and talk about what the NSA has not discovered you have stolen if your final destination was South America. Why not get on another plane and make it to your South American destination before you start running your mouth about the crimes you have committed?

And like you asked, why not buy that ticket to your South American destination from Hawaii or just get back to the mainland of America and drive into Mexico like every other person on the run does it?

You will not hear or see any of the smart followers of this individual address this questions!

[Demenace]

18. ...En route, his passport was illegally revoked (per U.N. Law) - you wrote

I ask you - Did the U.N issue him this illegally revoked passport? Has the U.N issued him a U.N passport yet? Did he declare political asylum in Hong Kong? Did he declare political asylum while en route to South America?

You asked the poster to visit a collaborator in this affair as your resource of verifiable truth. A little story from me, a thief stole a bunch of stuff from my house and handed them over to his Fence but you want me to go visit his Fence for the thief's character verification!

You guys engage in a circular reasoning because for some reason, this is something you guys want to get behind. All I ask of you guys is that you do it with some amount smart because you guys may not be in the know of all the moving parts behind this issue, just saying.

[Progressive dog]

31. +10

[MADem]

37. Snowden checked out of that "nice hotel" and was in HK for days before he departed.

The media was not asleep at the switch at that stage--he was no longer registered in that hotel, he had checked out, and he wasn't hanging out at the airport.

It seems, to say the least, odd that a former CIA operative who leaked highly classified documents to a newspaper would use his real name, especially when he's described as being so paranoid that he only logs into his computer under a hood that protects his keystrokes from prying eyes. Also odd is the fact that the Mira clerk says Snowden (or "Snowden&quot stayed for just over a week when Snowden, in his Guardian video, says he's barely left the hotel for three weeks.

Suffer fools? Most people weren't born yesterday. They can follow a timeline. He gave an interview to the SCMP at that "undisclosed location" everyone seems to want to gloss over. He didn't leave HK after he checked out of the Mira.

He got help from the Russians.

And why should we believe his denials now?

[msanthrope]

10. He wasn't staying there, except for FSB photo ops. nt

[MADem]

38. Far more plausible a scenario than his insistence that he was there for three weeks, when

the hotel said he was only there for a week.

Figures the Russians would be cheap--they probably paid the bill!

[Luminous Animal]

19. As Snowden's lawyer states, not one news agency has been able to confirm

that Snowden stayed in the Russian consulate.

http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/newsdesk/2014/01/snowden-calls-russian-spy-story-absurd.html

Some observers, looking at the possibility that Snowden was in league with the Russian government before taking asylum there, have pointed to a report in a Russian newspaper, Kommersant, that before leaving Hong Kong last June Snowden stayed at the Russian consulate. Snowden’s legal adviser, Ben Wizner, a lawyer with the American Civil Liberties Union, denied that report, however, saying, “Every news organization in the world has been trying to confirm that story. They haven’t been able to, because it’s false.”

[Demenace]

22. So that should mean it is false right?

Until the photos show up! Like the Newspapers around the world have been able to confirm all the 'Black sites' the CIA has taken people to over these years. How stupid can people be when it comes the games involved with the Intelligence community?

[Luminous Animal]

28. Actually, there has been plenty of evidence that black sites exist

and quite a bit of investigative journalism around it:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_site#Media_and_investigative_history

And if they didn't exist, why would Panetta feel compelled to announce that he was shutting them down?

In April, 2009, CIA director Leon Panetta announced that the "CIA no longer operates detention facilities or black sites", in a letter to staff and that "[r]emaining sites would be decommissioned". He also announced that the CIA was no longer allowing outside "contractors" to carry out interrogations and that the CIA no longer employed controversial "harsh interrogation techniques".[118][119][120] Panetta informed his fellow employees that the CIA would only use interrogation techniques authorized in the US Army int

[Titonwan]

26. Thanks, Luminous Animal n/t

[MADem]

33. Any time a lawyer "speaks" for someone with working vocal cords, I call bullshit. nt

[Titonwan]

7. You gotta hand it to Mr. Snowden

"It won't stick. ... Because it's clearly false, and the American people are smarter than politicians think they are."
He certainly is optimistic about American's critical thinking skills! (Me, not so much).
Ed is todays Daniel Ellsberg. Couldn't have come at a better time.

[George II]

14. "Ed is todays Daniel Ellsberg"??

Did Daniel Ellsberg stay in the US?

Did Daniel Ellsberg face his accusers?

Did Daniel Ellsberg go on trial?

[Titonwan]

25. I'll let Daniel do the talkin'

“There’s no American official or former official that I admire more at this point," Ellsberg said of Snowden to a reporter. "There’s never been a more important disclosure to the American people than the leak — and I include the Pentagon Papers in that."
http://www.justice-integrity.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=490:daniel-ellsberg-snowden-s-nsa-leak-was-heroic-historic&catid=21:myblog&Itemid=114

[MADem]

40. But you don't demand the same of Fast Eddie--you'll let his lawyer lie for him! nt

[Titonwan]

50. I'm with Dan

and I'm pretty sure he's more knowledgeable about these things.
Dan likes him. I like him. So do a lot of other whistleblowers (Some even gave him the Sam Adams prize).*
History's gonna smile on Mr. Snowden's bravery and patriotism.

*Former NSA contractor Edward Snowden is awarded the Sam Adams prize for integrity in intelligence in Moscow on Friday. The award is issued by a group of former intelligence and US law enforcement officials who have become critics of government surveillance programmes. The event represents the first time Snowden has been seen and heard in front of cameras since being granted temporary asylum in Russia
http://www.theguardian.com/world/video/2013/oct/12/edward-snowden-awarded-sam-adams-prize-integrity-intelligence-video

[MADem]

57. "Dan" is an old man (who didn't run to, say, Vietnam) and he knows about researching

a war that happened nearly a half century ago. He knows about xeroxing.

He doesn't know a thing about how the present-day NSA operates.

He also knows that he prevailed because he didn't run away.

[Titonwan]

61. Dan knows AT LEAST as much as you.

And I can safely say he does know more- since a lot of intelligence officials (past & present) talk with him. You know, the other whistleblowers.
You know about them thieves who stole from the FBI in the early seventies? They're heros now!
Just like Edward Snowden will be known. Hero. Patriot. American.
Mark. My. Words.

[MADem]

65. No, you can't "safely say" any such thing. You're just making assumptions to try and prove an

unprovable point.

You don't even know if "Dan" is computer literate. You don't know who talks to him on a day-to-day basis. The guy is in his EIGHTIES, he's not out tripping the light fantastic.

I'll remember that you said you think Snowden will be some kind of hero, if that's important to you... but I don't think your wishes for the guy will be realized.

He'll be a Hero and Patriot in Pootie-ville, and Vlad will probably give him some fancy Russian medal one day.

As long as we're into Mark. My. Words. territory, I'll bet you a donut that Snowden will come up with another "dramatic" announcement the second his name leaves the headlines for more than a week. He's an attention-seeker. He should take a lesson, though--every time he pokes his head up, his Q Score goes down.

There is little disagreement on the matter across party lines. Majorities of Democrats (59 percent), Republicans (56 percent) and a plurality of independents (48 percent) said Snowden should be charged....Americans have become less sympathetic to Snowden as additional programs have been revealed. In June, a Post-ABC poll found the public split 43 to 48 percent over whether he should be charged. Opinions changed one month later, with 53 percent saying he should be charged, a finding that held steady in November at 52 percent.

[Titonwan]

67. Oh noes, the polls!

"You're just making assumptions to try and prove an unprovable point."
Like you have with your Russian Spy fantasy. Unless you want me to believe Mike Rogers(R) and Dianne Feinstein(Corporatist) really have my best interests at heart.
There's a reason many in D.C. fear Keith Alexander. He's J Edgar on steroids.
You know what's the best part? These embarrassing leaks aren't gonna stop any time soon! (The seething! Oh the seething!)

"I was in a coal mine once and there was this narcissistic little canary

Little bird was all like "look at me, I can't breathe! You're all going to die if you don't get to fresh air!"

It was all about him. We told him to shut up.

Right before we passed out..."

[MADem]

69. Pooh pooh all you'd like. I'm not the one collecting this data, which gets worse for your team, not

better, with every passing day. It's not "seething," either--it's simple, basic disgust at a guy who lied his way into the intelligence sphere, and then betrayed the nation's trust. If you seriously think that the Chinese and the Russians don't do the exact same thing (never mind the French, the Israelis, the Brazilians and the Germans--as many of them have acknowledged, quite pragmatically) you can buy a bridge from Chris Christie.

This isn't about Aesop's (or anyone else's) Fables. This is about the perception of Fast Eddie by his fellow citizens, based on his history of prevarication and his present conduct. And that, I suspect, is what's causing YOU to do some of that "seething" you're projecting on others! His numbers are going south, and every time he opens his mouth, he loses a few acolytes.

Send Eddie a Care Package, if he means so much to you. Go on, show him your support! Some Thinsulate long drawers and some of those North Face mittens wouldn't go amiss! It's below zero in Moscow these days....

[George II]

47. I would have considered what he said a lot more credible 20 years or so ago.

[Titonwan]

51. Ha Ha!

Sorry- twenty years ago you'd be hollerin' for Daniels head!

[George II]

55. Wrong. I lived through the Nixon/Watergate/Pentagon Papers days (I was in my early twenties).....

....and I applauded Ellsberg for what he did - first for exposing what he and the NY Times did and second for his courage to face his accusers and face prosecution.

We don't see people do things like that these days.

[Titonwan]

62. And yet Daniel would disagree with you. Like totally!

You see, Daniel has the utmost admiration for what Mr. Snowden did!
You gonna deny that?

[George II]

64. Like I said.....

I would have considered what he said a lot more credible 20 years or so ago.

[msanthrope]

9. He's an idiot. And desperate from the sound of the interview. nt

[George II]

15. Yeah, desperate to keep his name in the news.

[davidthegnome]

17. I expect they're trying to paint him...

as a spy, because it will make the American people more angry if they believe it. If he is a spy, he is not then, by definition, a patriot who's goal was to inform his Country of the gross abuse and over-reaching of the NSA. If he is a spy, then many will accept that he should be imprisoned, tortured, even killed. If enough of us can be convinced that the Russians put him up to this, it will thrill some of our older (and not so old) Republicans, who are still living in the cold war.

No, I don't buy it. What I do expect is that there will be a great deal of false information, lies and propaganda... to recreate Edward Snowden for the American media viewers. Yeah, a lot of people will probably fall for it.

It's a damn shame when a true patriot is seen as a traitor or a spy. Yes, he leaked classified information, but when we're being spied on, when our allies are being spied on - so many people who have done nothing wrong, who have a right to privacy... well, then I, for one, want to know about it.

Which would you rather have working for you? A man with a conscience... or a simple yes-man who does what he is told, regardless of questions of ethics or morality?

I'm with you, Mr. Snowden - and I'm not going to buy the bull shit.

[Luminous Animal]

21. The Nixon admin tried to paint Ellsberg as a Russian spy.

Same ole same ole:

Ellsberg is commonly looked at as the quintessential whistleblower today, but shortly after he leaked the top secret Vietnam War study, the Nixon administration made a concerted effort to paint him as a Soviet spy in the press, using anonymous quotes and non-existent ‘secret’ evidence. (Sound familiar?)

This is from the New York Times on August 11, 1973:

An attorney for Dr. Daniel Ellsberg has chided the Senate Watergate committee for failing to challenge what he called “totally false and slanderous” testimony by the former White House aide, John D. Ehrlichman, suggesting that Dr. Ellsberg delivered copies of the Pentagon papers to the Soviet embassy.

“During his testimony before your committee, Mr. Ehrlichman repeatedly asserted that the Pentagon papers had been given in 1971 to the Soviet Embassy and implied that this might have been done by my client, Dr. Daniel Ellsberg, or with his knowledge,” the attorney, Leonard B. Boudin, who wrote the committee. “These allegations are made of whole cloth; they are totally false and slanderous of Dr. Ellsberg.”

https://pressfreedomfoundation.org/blog/2014/01/russian-spy-tactics-used-rep-rogers-snowden-were-pioneered-nixon-admin-against-daniel

[George II]

24. Yeah, but Ellsberg stuck around to fight the charges - Snowden? Nope!

[frylock]

43. and?

[Demenace]

23. No paint needed...

He became a spy, the minute he stole information that had global significance and got asylum in a foreign country. And the last time I check, this individual did both of them. A Whistleblower blows the whistle on a specific issue and stays in country to challenge those involved.

[davidthegnome]

32. Interesting notion.

Generally, a spy acts as someone else's operative. Generally, there is some kind of quid pro quo. Your assertion is somewhat flawed for a few reasons... among them being the fact that (as far as any of us are aware) Snowden was not being paid by a foreign power, nor employed by a foreign power, to collect the information he did in order to create havoc or weaken our international standing.

Is a man who very reasonably fears being tortured and executed by a corrupt power by definition a spy? I mean, let's say he HAD stayed. For the sake of argument, let's say Mr. Snowden leaked his information, then went ahead and turned himself in. We are talking about catching the NSA, an immensely powerful government agency... doing something illegal, wrong, and basically insulting to our own Citizens and to foreign leaders around the world - particularly our allies.

Snowden would not have had the time to build up a media following - the very notoriety which, to some extent, protects him. It is entirely likely that he would have been tortured into revealing his contacts, who almost certainly would have also been captured and tortured. I expect that they could have quickly shut down the leaking of this information - and I fully expect that, had it been possible, they would have, all without concern for niceties like rule of law or fair trials. Check out the "Patriot Act" some time - it's not just misnamed, it's a damn betrayal of everything we're supposed to stand for.

Frankly, I do not trust the NSA - for good reason. They're spying on all kinds of people without warrants, without probable cause. They're spying on our allies. Do you think they would have ever told us the truth about this? I don't. If the truth of the abuses of government are ever to be known, then it will be revealed, primarily, by people like Snowden, who have conscience, who put their loyalty to the American people ahead of their loyalty to a government that is unapologetically breaking the law.

Any human being with sense does not put his head into the mouth of a grizzly bear. Any human being with sense does not taunt a lion when he is naked and unarmed.

If we lived in a Country that respected the rule of law - that could be trusted to have granted Snowden a fair trial and just treatment, I would be more inclined to agree with you. However, the abuses of the last few decades prove that this is not so. I am ashamed of how we have acted - both at home and abroad. Both our own citizens - and our allies, deserve far better than this.

[Titonwan]

45. Right on!

This is definitely not the 70's we live in. Politicians actually respected (or feared) the news agencies, back then but they're merely stenographers to power now.
Great post.

[George II]

49. "Generally, a spy acts as someone else's operative"

BINGO!!!!

[davidthegnome]

52. Okay

Then who's operative is he? If you would claim that it is the Russian government, then I would be glad to see any evidence that supports that claim. All we have here is the knowledge that he leaked this information, then fled to Russia seeking asylum. The fact that he fled to Russia could be pure coincidence. As I recall, the Russians were reluctant to grant him asylum in the first place.

There is no way for Snowden to prove that he is NOT a spy. So if his accusers and detractors intend to be convincing, or fair, or to tell the truth - then I believe it would be incumbent upon them to provide evidence proving their accusations. Until they can do this, Snowden is innocent until PROVEN guilty. I don't give a damn if he's living here, in Russia, in China, or on the fricking moon.

[Titonwan]

68. Thanks for pushing back

"So if his accusers and detractors intend to be convincing, or fair, or to tell the truth - then I believe it would be incumbent upon them to provide evidence proving their accusations. Until they can do this, Snowden is innocent until PROVEN guilty."
That's what we call 'due process' of the law. Quaint, I know.
I don't blame Snowden one bit for whistle blowing from afar- have you seen the treatment of the latest whistleblowers? Harsh. Having a choice of Guantanamo, indefinite detention or 'disappearing' isn't a choice.
I love how this drip drip drip of embarrassment can't be stopped. It's like the government's getting water boarded for a change!
You sound old school DU!

[riderinthestorm]

73. He didn't "flee" to Russia. His passport was revoked as he was trying to get to S. America

He got stranded there by the US

[Demenace]

74. Like trying to get to South America from Hawaii requires a flight first to Hong Kong and then...

wait for it, through Mother Russia! Sometimes, those of you who claim to be very smart, sure do not use your smarts!

[riderinthestorm]

75. His plan was to get there through Cuba which has direct flights from Moscow

[treestar]

72. He does not reasonably fear torture

Really people, get off of it. You are picking up his paranoia.

[KurtNYC]

30. Reuters pushing a conspiracy theory. Snowden says he "acted alone" Unreal. n/t

[bemildred]

41. "with no help from anyone, much less a government"

See, now that is smart.

[Titonwan]

42. Chris Hedges take on Friday's Speechifying

Remarks by the President on Review of Signals Intelligence
(if he had told the truth)
http://www.truth-out.org/opinion/item/21335-chris-hedges-what-obama-really-meant-was

[Titonwan]

56. Another take

Sure is coincidental when all the Sunday Funny Papers (CBS, NBC, ABC) are filled with security 'experts' mouthing the same propaganda on all of them. Yes, right...

His (Obama's) unbridled defense of the surveillance state opened the door to the new McCarthyism of Mike Rogers and Dianne Feinstein, the leaders of the House and Senate intelligence committees, who on Sunday talk shows were branding Edward Snowden as a possible Russian spy.

Instead of crediting Snowden for forcing what the president concedes is a much-needed debate, Obama bizarrely cited the example of Paul Revere and the other early American rebels in the Sons of Liberty to denounce their modern equivalent. But the "secret surveillance committee" Obama referenced that Revere and his fellow underground conspirators established was intended to subvert rather than celebrate the crimes of the British controlled government in power."
http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/no_place_to_hide_were_all_suspects_in_barack_obamas_america_20140121

You had yer patriots and your tories. Guess which ones are here (I betcha can!).

[frwrfpos]

59. snowden is a true patriot

Of course he will be slandered for his courageous actions of expoaing the rot and corruption in pur government. Scurrying bugs hate when the light gets shined brightly

[treestar]

70. He should have saved this one for another week or two

Julian times these things better.