America's military reckoning: It's time to stop the ritualistic fawning over veterans

[marmar]

America's military reckoning: It's time to stop the ritualistic fawning over veterans
Most who've served deserve our praise. But military veterans don't get a free pass to spread sedition or hatred

By GREGORY A. DADDIS
DECEMBER 28, 2020 11:00AM


(Salon) It's time for Americans to end their ritualistic fawning over veterans. When former members of the U.S. armed forces visit the White House to promote military coups, they prove that veterans do not automatically, uncritically warrant our praise.

In an era of perpetual war, this may appear blasphemous. America's all-volunteer force has borne the burden of a militarized foreign policy in the wake of 9/11 that has sent more than two million servicemen and women overseas to keep our nation safe. These veterans have sacrificed immensely, some in heroic fashion. Incredibly brave men and women still populate our military ranks.

Yet in society's haste to thank them for their service, veterans have become, in far too many ways, an inviolable sect beyond reproach. Any criticism risks bringing forth a slew of anti-patriotic opprobrium. Such blanket adulation must end. And this most chaotic of years demonstrates why.

In one of the more contentious political seasons in American history, few malefactors have exceeded the duplicity of retired Lt. Gen. Michael Flynn, who has called on President Trump to suspend the Constitution and declare martial law so military leaders can oversee a redo of the 2020 election. Never mind that Flynn, who pled guilty to misleading the FBI, once swore an oath to uphold that very Constitution. ............(more)

https://www.salon.com/2020/12/28/americas-military-reckoning-its-time-to-stop-the-ritualistic-fawning-over-veterans/

[NRaleighLiberal]

1. no single group of anything or anybody should be a carte blanche for blanket respect

real life is far more complex and there are great and awful in each group.

we are a highly flawed species.

[llmart]

50. I came here to post something similar.

But instead I'll just agree with you wholeheartedly.

[lastlib]

2. Spot on!

The soldier-worship, and the glorification of war, have gome way too far!
It doesn't mean we have to hate them, or despise them, or spit on them--rather, we should be directing our veneration to equally worthy recipients--teachers, doctors, diplomats, who do as much to build our country up, yet get far less praise and glorification.

[Walleye]

8. For 50 years we've been trying to make up for Vietnam

[Irish_Dem]

9. This and it is a way to justify the outrageous military budget. nt

[Dakota Flint]

26. So have I

And it repulses me to no end for idiots to "thank me for me service." I did not have a choice as I was about to be drafted.

[Walleye]

30. Today's young people haven't a clue what that was all about. They can't imagine being drafted

[dware]

58. Yep, me too.

I was on the verge of being drafted so instead, I volunteered for the Marines so I could get the MOS I wanted.

[Lasher]

60. I was almost drafted into the Marines.

I was in a group of Army draftees about to be sworn in. Some people came in to ask for about 6 of us to serve our 2 years in the Marines instead. Nobody wanted to do that, so they selected their volunteers. They picked the individuals standing to the immediate left and right of me in my row.

[dware]

67. I remember taking my Oath of Enlistment with a whole bunch of other guys

in an auditorium, the Officer administering the Oath was real nice up to the giving of the Oath, as soon as we were done, he left and a Sgt. yelled at us to "sit the fuck down and listen the fuck up", and it only got worse from there.
I thought, uh oh, what did I just do?

But, ya know what? I made it a career and haven't regretted my decision.

[Hestia]

37. FYI - not one soldier was spat upon when returning from Vietnam - there is a socialologist

who has been researching this in Calif for years, and not one person has come forward to verify a claim of being spat upon. If you are someone or personally know the details of someone, he wants to hear from you for his research. Of course, after Mai Lai, who could blame people for at least thinking about it.

Just more made up shit for continued military support.

[Bradshaw3]

42. It became an urban legend

Tom Hayden, among others, did a lot of research on this and the result was the same as other urban legends: I heard it from a friend of a friend, and when you ask that guy he says the same thing.

[franzwohlgemuth]

3. I've always viewed

it as, I thank them for their service, but an asshole is an asshole, regardless.....

[Baked Potato]

5. Oh Poo! Fawning over any group went out years ago!

One by one, American virtues and values have been laid bare to the fact there are good people and bad people in every corner of the earth.

Trump has finished the job all of our adversaries have started. Trump has politicized every institution that used to function way better with politics put aside.

Be it military, or police, or fire, or doctors, or nurses, or any frickin where, now that those institutions aren’t apolitical it’s going to be hard as hell to get together on anything.

There are incredibly brave Americans in all walks of life, of all political persuasions. The “Ritualistic fawning of military” functions to give comfort and motivation to the folks who worked tirelessly around the world to protect us from the likes of Putin.

To single out a few sycophants who happen to be in uniform or used to be in uniform and declare we shouldn’t “fawn” over them is a DUH moment, for me.

Trump has tainted everything, however he hasn’t tainted American’s hearts and minds. We know who to fawn over and who not to. Yawn on this article.

[Irish_Dem]

6. My father who was a decorated combat veteran of three wars would be horrified at the fawning.

Last edited Mon Dec 28, 2020, 02:28 PM - Edit history (1)

He flew very dangerous combat missions in WWII, Korea, and Viet Nam.
It is a miracle he survived any of it.

A first generation Irish American, his parents immigrated from County Mayo, Ireland to Boston in 1910.
He was fiercely proud of America, and loved this country to an extent that seemed almost ridiculous to his children.
He risked his life so many times for the country he loved dearly.

All this reverence, fawning, adoration would have been embarrassing and unwanted to him.
And almost an insult to a man who was just doing his job. A job he was proud and honored to perform.

When I grew up in the military, we all felt our fathers were just doing their jobs.
We did not see ourselves as special, unique or important.
The military paid my father a good salary, with benefits, housing, food allowance, medical.
It was a lot more than some civilians. We considered our selves lucky.

I know that some in the military now do not have a good standard of living, and I feel terrible about that.
This needs to change.

Just my 2 cents, and I know isn't a popular view.

Edited to add: I should mention my mother is a military vet as well, military nurse during the Korean War.
And my brother is also a Vet as well.

[MyOwnPeace]

14. Not so sure about that........

"I know isn't a popular view."

It just might be a "popular view," but unlike you, some may be afraid to state it for fear of being called "commie" or some other nasty name - the price you pay for speaking out.

Many facets of the issue here. Like you are saying - the "reverence, fawning, adoration" - bothers some because they know that "some" who served were there because they had no choice - they weren't driven by a "noble cause" - they needed a job or were there because they just didn't know what else to do.

Another bothersome part is how this "fawning" seems to have become so "political" - and the RepubliCons have laid heavy claim to the right to be the true "Patriotic Americans." Such bullshit! Again, just because you don't stand up and cheer veterans when they march by in their ill-fitting uniforms (on their way to the VFW to get soused and tell old war lies) - does that mean you don't love your country? Veterans, just like any other American, come with many different thoughts and beliefs, and should be commended, respected, thanked, and allowed to continue to lead a normal life in a great country that honors and allows great diversity and opinions, as well as different opportunities to serve.

And the flag. If you don't wear an American Flag lapel pin - does that mean you HATE AMERICA? Look at how the flag has also been claimed by "true Americans" - flags surrounding campaign signs that say "DRAIN THE SWAMP" - which is finally being done if you consider the "swamp" as being prisons and BunkerBoy is draining them by pardoning half of his campaign and office staff.

Does anybody ever want to throw something at the TV when they run a commercial for the groups asking for donations to "Help the Vets?" Isn't it pathetic that our own government will not provide sufficient support for those that did serve and now need help. Forget the parades and fly-overs of every football game and sporting event. Take that money and help those that DO NEED THE HELP!!!!
Don't fly Mike Pence from Indianapolis to California because he left a game early (hell, it hadn't even started!) because a football player chose to kneel to show his concern for civil rights. Let Pence work a full shift at a VA Hospital lifting soldiers who lost limbs and can't kneel or stand. THAT is showing your concern for VETERANS!

Much of this carries over to the issues of the police also. Just as so many "TRUMP" campaign signs were surrounded by American flags, many "Support our Police" signs and black & blue flags (is that even legal?) that represent supporting police were also in great strength around those same campaign signs. So if we don't show the "blue" flag or don't have a "Support our Police" sign in our yard, will we have to wait longer for a response call or does it mean that we "support our criminals?"

These are indeed strange times - one wonders how our own ancestors as well as the "Founding Fathers" would look at all of it.
We have to hope that our new administration will be able to arouse the support of a majority of Americans and get us on the road to truly "Make America Gr......." - no, sorry, can't even do that. It was a campaign lie and something else that wrong-minded people threw at anybody that dared questioned motives and beliefs.

We can be better than that.

[KBlagburn]

25. This disabled combat vet thanks you.

[MyOwnPeace]

29. Well, gotta' say.....

you brought a bit of moisture to the corner of my eye. I was concerned about being so "vocal" with my own thoughts, but I'm elated that something in there meritted your thanks.

And the irony of it all is, I MUST thank you for your service! That is NOT being trite or glib, I sincerely mean it - and I hope that our GOVERNMENT is making all things possible for you after what you have done for us.

[Irish_Dem]

31. I need to thank you! nt

[Irish_Dem]

38. Our Founding Fathers would not be happy campers right now. nt

[MyOwnPeace]

45. I see them in bitter arguments......

as to who weakened or ignored the Constitution to allow such a "thing" as IQ45 to get anywhere near the Oval Office!

[Irish_Dem]

46. I guarantee there would be duels aplenty. nt

[MyOwnPeace]

49. I'm hearing songs from "Hamilton" right now........

[Irish_Dem]

51. Ha so was I ....... nt

[IsItJustMe]

55. Well thought out. What you said.

When you said strange days, it reminded me of that song by John Lennon

[MyOwnPeace]

56. Funny how certain phrases

can trigger links. Good one!!!

[IsItJustMe]

57. Actually, this song has helped me deal with the last four years.

When I see a large group of people congregating in super spreader situations, instead of getting all pissed off about it or wondering why people would be so reckless (just leads to a sense of helplessness and/or hopelessness), I say to myself, "Strange days indeed."

It's a coping mechanism for me, and hey, it works.

[LiberalFighter]

32. That is a key too. They get paid for their service.

Some make it seem it is piddling wages. You would be right that your father received a good salary. And based on research I have done in the past year they still do when you put the whole package together.

If it wasn't they wouldn't be sticking around for it to be their career or signing up.

[Irish_Dem]

36. My father had: A good, steady salary, housing, food allowance, free medical, free college degree.

Last edited Mon Dec 28, 2020, 03:13 PM - Edit history (1)

Once we lived in off base housing here in the states.
Our neighbors ate hamburger and we had steak once a week.


Edited to add: But some of the assignments were pretty grim.
Living in third world countries off base. Times were not always easy.
And the fathers were in dire combat situations.

[Walleye]

7. I do hate it when we're told that the military protects our freedom.

For one thing the military is not into freedom. And we protect our own freedoms by living them every day and insisting on our rights, always have. The military protects us from hostility from other countries, period. Not that that’s not important

[maxsolomon]

13. It's a fantastic device to shut down any larger debate.

The idea that our overseas interventions somehow protect our constitutional rights or prevent an impending invasion is absurd. It's propaganda that shouts down dissent; Jingoism.

Back in the Iraq War days I got hold of a "Power of Pride" bumper sticker and converted it to read "Pride of Power". Not sure if anyone ever understood it, but I like obscurity.

[Walleye]

16. Yes, we agree. I wasn't sure anybody would

[progree]

19. I learned all about FREEDOM and the military when I was drafted

I keep seeing comments on bar resistor websites (ones that are open despite the governor's shutdown orders) making it an issue of FREEDOM and CONSTITUTION. The Constitution guarantees our FREEDOM. We should be FREE to operate our bars and restaurants as we please, and nobody is forcing you scaredy cats to go to bars/restaurants. Blah blah

Well my comment is that Freedom is not some absolute. I learned that when I was drafted into the military. We have obligations and responsibilities as well, sometimes calling for the ultimate sacrifice.

(detail: technically I wasn't drafted. I pre-emptively joined the Navy only so I wouldn't be drafted and end up in an Army infantry division in the jungles of Vietnam. As it turned out, that was a good move -- my lottery draft number turned out to be low enough that I would have been drafted for sure)

[Walleye]

21. So true. My late boyfriend also volunteered his draft and became a paratrooper for two years

[Irish_Dem]

43. The military is taught they are protecting our freedom, but instead they fight for corporate $$$$.

[Irish_Dem]

10. They made the military a sacred cow to justify the outrageous amount of money spent on it.

And prevent any one from complaining about it.

Military contractors and double dippers are making a fortune.

[mopinko]

11. i've said it for a long time- medals are just cogs in the war machine.

kill off the hero worship, and you'll have a reeeeeeal hard time starting wars.

[twodogsbarking]

12. It is embedded in our society.

If you speak against any part of it you are not a patriot. Either jump on the band wagon or go to another country. Yada yada.

[Zorro]

15. IMHO all the fawning is probably from those who've never served

Maybe they feel guilty for that.

I do like parking in the veteran's reserved spaces at Lowes, though.

[MyOwnPeace]

34. WHOLE bunch of that for sure!!!!

Just look at Donnie Bone Spurs - wanted the biggest, greatest military parade in DC ever, JUST FOR HIM!!!!!!

PS: he's never felt guilty about any f**kin' thing!

[Skittles]

61. I have yet to see a parking spot reserved for veterans!

I.....don't think I would use it though

[Zorro]

63. Lowes also gives a 10% discount to vets

Just submit a copy of your DD214 and you're set.

I like that perk, too.

[Skittles]

64. I actually have VETERAN on my driver's license

that makes it easier

[dware]

70. I have the Veteran's designation on my CDL,

when shopping at Home Depot, all I have to do is show my DL and I get the 10% discount.

[dware]

69. Home Depot has spots reserved for Veterans and also Purple Heart recipients.

When I'm at home and I have to go to HD, I'll use either or.

[tiredtoo]

17. Know a veteran who uses his status at times

when in arguments he comes up with "I served to protect you and our country, what have you done?" This guy spent three years at the bars and beaches in N.Carolina, gimme a break.

[Mr.Bill]

18. Ditto for police and firemen.

They by and large do a dangerous job and we appreciate it when it is done well. But they volunteered for it and in most areas, they are obscenely compensated for it.

I stopped going to professional baseball games because I was tired of being expected to worship the military and the police for 30 minutes or so before the game.

Putting on a uniform does not automatically make you a hero.

[Ferrets are Cool]

20. I stopped LONG ago

with NO apologies.

[Politicalgolfer]

22. This isn't anything new or American

The warrior class has always been worshipped, adored and the backbone of power in all it's forms whether democratic or the most heinous of murdering dictatorship.

[Moostache]

23. Acknowledgement does not have to devolve into fawning, yet there are profits in that fawning...

Look no further than the NFL and its sale of pre-game rituals to the Dept. of Defense (some $10.4M per year?) to stage those field-wide flags and overblown worship of the military... The DOD knows that tying the flag and veterans to football was a winning move for funding from Congress, so for a scant $10M bucks, they secure TRILLIONS in annual funding. That is ROI that would make most investors faint.

[jmowreader]

24. They love veterans when it's convenient for them

On every year that doesn’t have a global pandemic, Coeur d’Alene, Idaho, holds a huge parade on July 4th. I used to live on the corner where it ended, so I always had a good view of the proceedings from my second-floor window.

One year the local Republican Party turned this huge machine that only government agencies buy (it was a scissor lift built on a Cat dump truck chassis) into a float and covered it with “support our veterans” crap. I saw this thing coming from three-quarters of a mile away (a full mile and it would have been in the lake) so I decided to be an asshole and print up a sign that said “raise taxes now.” And I stood there with my sign right where they could see it. Up comes this rather indignant woman. So I told her: taxes pay for the military. Taxes pay for veterans benefits. Hell, taxes paid for that machine you used as a float, and for the road you drove it on. And if we don’t raise taxes on everyone, you and I included, we get to borrow the money and pay interest on it. And no, spending cuts alone won’t work because a country of 350 million people needs things. I doubt I turned her into a Democrat, but at least she understood.

[LiberalFighter]

27. I totally agree. I've been saying this in one form or another for a while.

No one group should be treated above reproach. Besides if they were above reproach then why do they have a military court, KP duty, dishonorable discharges, court martials?

Here is another thought regarding those who serve. Who deserves higher praise? The draftee or the enlisted? Not a simple question. I say it all depends on the person serving as to how they served.

[gopiscrap]

28. same goes with cops

[Martin Eden]

33. "to keep our nation safe"

I challenge that premise, especially regarding Iraq. I don't doubt most or all who volunteer believe they are deployed to keep our nation safe, but the war of choice in Iraq cannot be justified as self defense. It had a lot more to do with neocon schemes for Pax Americana and control of oil resources.

[Tommymac]

35. Tell this to the NFL, MLB, and NBA.

Of coarse the Military PR budget gives those league millions to fund their 'Patriotic' shows

Rather see all that money go directly to the families of the vetrans rather then fund what amount to a frigging public service commercial.

[MyOwnPeace]

48. AGREE!!!!!

We wouldn't need trucks picking up old clothes if the government would take care of those that served!

[Irish_Dem]

39. Other professions are high risk, high danger but do not get accolades. nt

[extvbroadcaster]

40. Yes, not all veterans are heroes

Military service should not be made out to be more than it is. Not everyone that wears a military uniform is a "hero." There are plenty of soldiers that drive trucks, sling hash. That is hardly falling on a grenade in combat to save your fellow soldiers.

[McKim]

41. It's Part of the Glorification of War

This is just one moving part of the Glorification of War. All the army stuff pageantry at sports events and everywhere is all part of a huge PR campaign to get Americans to accept and love our military and justify its huge expenditures and military bases around the world to keep the world safer for corporations. My brother in law died for a lie in Vietnam and I have researched the new putsch since Vietnam to make war once again accepted by your average American.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

44. Not to forget the mercenary murderers pardoned by tRump. And that earlier pardon of some SEALs?

Any vets among those Blackguard mercenaries?

[Bradshaw3]

47. About 1 percent of the military actually served in combat

The great majority work in jobs that are support personnel like clerical, etc. Yet people act like they all fought in war zones. Mostly what is now is a huge jobs and corporate slush fund program, one that doesn't produce anything that benefits - other than the amorphous and highly debatable "protecting our freedom" line.

What has happened with this American military of today is that it generates trillions for companies that produce products like bombs that will be destroyed, or don't work, and that pay former high-ranking military brass to "lobby" when government officials give them whatever they want, making the CEOs and big investors even more wealthy - all in a country that "can't afford " Medicare for all.

And this worship of the military is more of a recent trend. After WWII the vets just wanted to come home and get a job and start a family.

[mac2766]

52. I laugh and say...

No need to thank me. I served six years during the longest peace-time era in our nations history. I don't deserve thanks or praise, but thank you, and how much is my military discount?

[IsItJustMe]

53. I always feel like it is a form of hero worship.

Yes, It's great to have people that will put their life on the line. But I have always felt that nurses, doctors, teachers, fire fighters, and the like deserve the same respect, and they don't get it. Why pick out one group of people to glorify and not the rest. It is what it is.

[Wounded Bear]

54. As a Vet, I actually get a little tired of all the people walking up and thanking me...

Sorry, but if you really like Vets and want to support them properly, vote for people who will do so where it matters, funding the VA...especially in the psych and drug rehab fields.

I'm doing OK now. Truth be told I didn't do much while active, no combat tours. I just did my job, and I got a lot out of it, including a career that set me up pretty decently.

But yeah, all the fawning is kind of -worthy, especially in high places. Hell, I'd support a 10% cut in the Pentagon budget. Much better places to overspend on in today's world.

[Skittles]

62. why do they walk up to you

how do they know you are a veteran?

[Wounded Bear]

68. Well, I suppose the hat kind of gives me away...

Yeah, I wear my various USMC and Vet hats (not the red one, not just yet ) most of the time. When I get greetings from fellow vets it's more bearable, though.

[marie999]

59. Some times people who haven't served seen my husband's disabled veteran's license

plate and ask him what service he was in and what did he do. I lot of times he will say "It was a long time ago." or something similar. They don't realize that they should just say "ok" and walk away.

[drmeow]

65. The "volunteer" military

is part of the problem. The gov keeps the military volunteer because a draft or required service would force Americans to confront and acknowledge the incredible level of violence the US military perpetrates overseas. Because it is volunteer, it attracts people desperate to get out of their life circumstances (escape poverty) and fanatics. The first group ensures that the poor and minorities continue to be the ones to die for rich people. The second group has grown due to lessening of restrictions on what was never called fascism but pretty much is as the military needed more bodies to support rich people's (oil companies) wars. "Supporting" the troops is part and parcel of both a propaganda campaign to get more volunteer cannon fodder and a right wing reaction to a legitimate distaste for American military overreach.

[AmyStrange]

66. I won't fawn over ALL veterans (including myself), but...

-

I do respect the guys getting shot at.
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