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MADem

(135,425 posts)
1. Well, the BBC is reporting on a STUDY that says this. THEY aren't saying it. Bit of a distinction.
Mon May 5, 2014, 12:56 PM
May 2014

Makes for great click bait, though!

Of course, USA is a republic, not a democracy, really, given all that electoral college business... but that's a discussion for another day.

zeemike

(18,998 posts)
3. The USSR was a republic
Mon May 5, 2014, 01:21 PM
May 2014

And so was the Peoples Republic of China.
It is not who controls the government but how they are selected...and today money does the selection...no different than the Communist party doing the selection.
Our republic was set up to be a Democratically selected republic not an oligarchical selected one.

zeemike

(18,998 posts)
14. So other than a socialist one or a democratic one
Wed May 7, 2014, 12:27 AM
May 2014

what other kind of Republic do you want for us if Democratic one is no good?
What this article says is that we have an Oligarchical Republic...are you cool with that?

MADem

(135,425 posts)
15. I didn't say I wanted any other kind of republic.
Wed May 7, 2014, 12:39 AM
May 2014

My only gripe--and it's not directed at you, it's at the source--is that the entire story was crafted in a clickbaity way. It's as if they're more determined to get the click than provide the information.

The BBC was dragged into the MSNBC coverage, almost meaninglessly, for what? Gravitas? Tattle - taling? "Look, the Brits are badmouthing us!!!" A long circular intro about how we broke away from the UK only for them to tell us a couple of hundred years later how much we suck?

The study (which is a good one, as I've said) was crafted right here in the USA, and MSNBC (the video used at the top) did some great reporting on it after they got past the BBC bull.

I'm just not overjoyed with the presentation, there's nothing wrong with the dish.

Quixote1818

(28,918 posts)
4. I would say that a scientific study would hold much more weight than what a news outlet thinks.
Mon May 5, 2014, 02:30 PM
May 2014

It's also not just one study that came to this conclusion. Would one say that NASA believes in global warming or NASA's studies show global warming is occurring? I don't really see the difference. Also not sure what you mean by "click bait"? I am always more attracted to headlines talking about studies, knowing they have science behind them, not just opinion.

MADem

(135,425 posts)
7. I would agree. Click bait is what websites put out there to get people to click on it.
Mon May 5, 2014, 03:33 PM
May 2014

The more clicks, the more money, because the clicks put eyes on the site's advertisements.

The headline "suggests" that BBC (an independent/public service media arm funded by the UK government) came up with this pronouncement and reported it as news that they developed. It's a different thing altogether if they are reporting on a study making the claim, regardless of the validity of the source.

Using NASA as an analogy doesn't quite work. NASA isn't the BBC and we don't watch the nightly news brought to us by NASA, nor does NASA comment on the governmental management tendencies of foreign nations. One is a government space agency, the other is a British news outlet. If PBS/NPR developed a story telling the UK about themselves, they'd throw a little shade, too--if they simply reported on a study, why, that's a different thing altogether.

As far as the study goes, it's an interesting effort, and they could have reported on it without even mentioning "BBC" at all. MSNBC is a good enough source, I should think.
Their coverage isn't bad at all. They stick with the conclusion, blame both parties, and suggest a few fixes at your link.

Here's some more information on the study itself, also courtesy of MSNBC (in effect the same source, if not the same program, as your link): http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/the-us-no-longer-democracy


The study looked at nearly 1,800 policy issues over a 20-year period between 1982 and 2002. According to their data, when the rich support a policy, it has a 45% chance of becoming law. And when they oppose it, it has only an 18% chance of being enacted.

“In the United States, our findings indicate, the majority does not rule – at least not in the causal sense of actually determining policy outcomes. When a majority of citizens disagrees with economic elites and/or with organized interests, they generally lose. Moreover, because of the strong status quo bias built into the U.S. political system, even when fairly large majorities of Americans favor policy change, they generally do not get it,” the study said.

Other studies have shown that income inequality has grown in recent years. An economist at the University of California-Berkeley estimated that between 2009 and 2012, the richest 1% of Americans held 95% of all income growth.



I'm delighted that this kind of conversation is finally happening--I just don't need it suggested that "BBC" is telling us to eat our peas (don't take that personally; that's not how I intended it). The study itself was conducted right here in USA.
 

AgingAmerican

(12,958 posts)
10. The USA is a Democracy in the form of a Republic
Mon May 5, 2014, 07:33 PM
May 2014

The electoral college is what keeps us dysfunctional and stuck in a two party system.

Jefferson23

(30,099 posts)
5. Didn't happen over night, one bad policy after another, you're left with an advancing
Mon May 5, 2014, 02:54 PM
May 2014

oligarchy.

We just need more of us servants to be aware in order to fight back, we'll get there..soon, I think.


K&R

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