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Related: About this forum"The EU Is 1 Big Scam & The Ukraine Is It's Next Victim"...Retro of 3/25 Hartmann & Richard Wolfe
(Sort of interesting watching this in Retropspective, isn't it)
The EU Is 1 Big Scam & The Ukraine Is It's Next Victim...
Published on Mar 25, 2014
Dr. Richard Wolff, Democracy At Work, joins Thom Hartmann. Joining the European Union has been a disaster for countries like Greece - Spain - and Ireland. Austerity cuts have decimated their already struggling economies. So why is Ukraine even THINKING of moving closer to joining the EU?
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dipsydoodle
(42,239 posts)From November 25, 2013 07:16 PM Der Spiegel :
This tug-of-war began four years ago, when the EU proposed an "eastern partnership" with Ukraine as well as Armenia, Azerbaijan, Georgia, Moldova and Belarus. The EU offered cooperation, free trade and financial contributions in exchange for democratic reforms. Officials in Brussels spoke enthusiastically about the emergence of an historic Eastern European policy not unlike former German Chancellor Willy Brandt's rapprochement with the Warsaw Pact countries in the 1970s. The planned partnership agreements were intended to facilitate visa-free travel, reduce tariffs and introduce European norms. The only thing that was not offered was EU membership.
The EU's other goal, even though it was not as openly expressed, was to limit Russia's influence and define how far Europe extends into the east. For Russia, the struggle to win over Ukraine is not only about maintaining its geopolitical influence, but about having control over a region that was the nucleus of the Russian empire a millennium ago. The word Ukraine translates as "border country," and many feel the capital Kiev is the mother of all Russian cities.
This helped create Cold War-style grappling between Moscow and Brussels. The Russian president, hardened by his fights in the Kremlin, is more adept than EU bureaucrats at manipulating people with venality and affections. None of the top European politicians made a serious effort to win over Ukraine, with neither German Chancellor Angela Merkel nor European Commission President José Manuel Barroso flying to Kiev to convince its wavering president.
http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/how-the-eu-lost-to-russia-in-negotiations-over-ukraine-trade-deal-a-935476.html
Its certainly a scam with regard exports / import. The current value of EU exports to the Ukraine are $10billion pa higher than imports. In some respects EU loans will do no more than help fund that gap i.e its providing finance to sell its own goods.
KoKo
(84,711 posts)JDPriestly
(57,936 posts)probably prefer the high-quality West European goods over the Russian ones.
Also, one advantage for citizens of a country in joining the EU is that workers can go from a struggling country to an EU country and work for higher wages.
dipsydoodle
(42,239 posts)Last edited Tue May 13, 2014, 07:53 AM - Edit history (1)
and it would be a very long time before they were considered acceptable to do so. Out of this they've got Schengen visas only, not permissions to work, which allow a 90 stay in the Schengen area effectively as tourists - same as US citizens coming over for example and the same as restrictions on the US visa waiver program, for those eligible, travelling to the USA.
There was never any real intention within the EU of workers going from a struggling country to another EU country to simply work in routine low paid jobs for higher wages if all they were going to do was ship money home instead of spending it where earned.
With regard preferences for higher quality West European goods devaluation of their currency is hardly likely to help average citizens with that.
edit to add :
Rada adopts all laws needed to implement first phase of action plan on visa liberalization with EU
Ukraine has completed the implementation of the first phase of its action plan on visa liberalization with the EU.
http://www.kyivpost.com/content/politics/rada-adopts-all-laws-needed-to-implement-first-phase-of-action-plan-on-visa-liberalization-with-eu-347591.html
newthinking
(3,982 posts)They are not near tooled to offer Europe goods they will buy.
This is going to be a very rough transition.
Demeter
(85,373 posts)The nicest thing about the Eurozone is that everybody can be victimized over and over again...except Germany. Look upon it as a guaranteed lunch for Merkel and her German bankster friends...
JDPriestly
(57,936 posts)Excellent working conditions and in big companies worker participation in some decisionmaking. Excellent manufacturing. Excellent quality of goods. That's why Germany does so well. Sorry, but Germany emphasizes quality and its exports are in demand.
Demeter
(85,373 posts)Mika
(17,751 posts)iamthebandfanman
(8,127 posts)that thom hartmann owns his show, right?
RT is most certainly a bias government funded network, and just because thom wanted a bigger audience doesn't make them not so.
Mika
(17,751 posts)Yes, I do know that TH owns his own show.
uhnope
(6,419 posts)[center][/center]
DeSwiss
(27,137 posts)[center]@ Zerohedge [/center]
Demeter
(85,373 posts)DeSwiss
(27,137 posts)...there's the green-being from Planet France, Nicolas ''I'm-All-Ears'' Sarkosy. Then, with her cool shades on even in the dark of space, is that German femme-fatale (just ask Greece how fatal she is) and all-round triangular hand-holder Jean ''I'm-Not-Hitler's-Daughter'' Merkle. The other smiling asshat with glasses on is the EU Commission President José Manuel ''Portaguey'' Barroso. And of course in the chair and in absolute, utter and total control OF EVERYTHING is IMF Chief Christine ''Let-Me-Loan-U-Some-Muney-Huney'' Lagarde. And next to her is her trusty sidekick and all-round smoosher is Barack ''I-Have-An-Alien-Birth-Certificate'' Obama. And in the foreground, and last but certainly not least by any stretch of the imagination since he's done more damage to an empire since Atilla-the-Hun did it, Ben ''I'm-Justa-Klingon-At-Heart'' Bernanke.
I don't even know what they look like when they look like themselves....nor do I want to, frankly.
It makes a lot more sense with your captions....
blkmusclmachine
(16,149 posts)uhnope
(6,419 posts)But he won't disclose how much $$$ he gets from the Kremlin and he's a collaborator
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/03/10/1283668/-Thom-Hartmann-Sticking-with-RT-despite-Resignations-over-Putin-s-Actions-in-Ukraine
newthinking
(3,982 posts)image. This from TruthDig:
How Cold War-Hungry Neocons Stage Managed RT Anchor Liz Wahls Resignation
The Freedom selfie from James Kirchicks Twitter feed.
Behind the coverage of Wahls dramatic protest, a cadre of neoconservatives was celebrating a public relations coup. Desperate to revive the Cold War, head off further cuts to the defense budget and restore the legitimacy they lost in the ruins of Iraq, the tightknit group of neoconservative writers and stewards had opened up a new PR front through Wahls resignation. And they succeeded with no shortage of help from an ossified media establishment struggling to maintain credibility in an increasingly anarchic online news environment. With isolated skeptics branded as useful idiots for Putin, the scene has been kept clean of neoconservative fingerprints, obscuring their interest in Wahls resignation and the broader push to deepen tensions with Russia.
Through interviews with six current RT employeesall Americans with no particular affection for Russian President Vladimir Putin or his policiesand an investigation into the political forces managing the spectacle, a story has emerged that stands in stark contrast to the one advanced by Wahl, her supporters and the mainstream American press.
It is the story, according to former colleagues, of an apolitical, deeply disgruntled employee seeking an exit strategy from a job where, sources say, she was disciplined for unprofessional behavior and had been demoted. Wahl did not return several voice and text messages sent to her cellphone.
At the center of the intrigue is a young neoconservative writer and activist who helped craft Wahls strategy and exploit her resignation to propel the agenda of a powerful pro-war lobby in Washington.
http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/how_cold_war-hungry_neocons_stage_managed_liz_wahls_resignation_20140319
uhnope
(6,419 posts)newthinking
(3,982 posts)uhnope
(6,419 posts)like big tobacco companies did against whistleblowers back in the day. It blames "war hungry neocons"-- well what the heck is Putin if not a war-hungry neocon? Have you noticed that the west hasn't made war on Ukraine, but Putin sure has?
newthinking
(3,982 posts)uhnope
(6,419 posts)you are so into Orwellian doublethink, as Putin supporters must be, that you didn't notice/forgot about it.
http://www.truthdig.com/report/print/how_cold_war-hungry_neocons_stage_managed_liz_wahls_resignation_20140319
newthinking
(3,982 posts)You pick out one paragraph that is asking sources not about the sourced material about Wahl's act, but asking them about about editorial pressure.
Like most *any* other employer, people are very careful about speaking out "on the record".
How about what the article was really about, or are your comments just to find some way to "one up".
Somehow I doubt I am going to see intellectual honesty.