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Larry O'D On Joy Reid Why Not To Criticise Dems On REcent Shutdown (Original Post) Me. Jan 2018 OP
This was a great segment and a great discussion of the political realities Gothmog Jan 2018 #1
Excellent cp Jan 2018 #2
As the excuses mount GaryCnf Jan 2018 #3
Horrible excuses! Sophia4 Jan 2018 #4
Totally Disagree Me. Jan 2018 #5
Do you disagree with my idea that the vote of each Californian should be voted Sophia4 Jan 2018 #8
Don't Even Me. Jan 2018 #9
Agree. Now need your plan to make that happen. How will you eliminate the EC? Dream Girl Jan 2018 #14
Start a movement. I can't do it because I am in California. Sophia4 Jan 2018 #15
Video is blocked. madamesilverspurs Jan 2018 #6
Damn Me. Jan 2018 #10
i hope we dont start eating our own.... samnsara Jan 2018 #7
Copyright thing, sorry shenmue Jan 2018 #11
My Bad Me. Jan 2018 #12
We cool shenmue Jan 2018 #13
 

GaryCnf

(1,399 posts)
3. As the excuses mount
Sat Jan 27, 2018, 03:23 PM
Jan 2018

and insults replace discussion, remember that our leadership CHOSE to tie DACA to the CR, KNOWING they could NEVER WIN that battle, and KNOWING that surrender would leave millions of immigrants and their citizen connections, one of our most loyal Democratic voting blocs, feeling betrayed. Compounding the foolishness of starting that fight, they CHOSE to give the GOP the opportunity to look like THEY reached across the aisle to cooperate on CHIP instead of making them choose between uninsured dying children piled up in front of their door on election day and THEM SURRENDERING TO US and passing CHIP with us giving them nothing in return.

 

Sophia4

(3,515 posts)
4. Horrible excuses!
Sat Jan 27, 2018, 03:36 PM
Jan 2018

Last edited Sat Jan 27, 2018, 04:28 PM - Edit history (1)

The 39 million vote elephant in the room that is never mentioned, not even by Pelosi, is California.

A good portion of the dreamers are California. I'm a Californian. Our tax money educated these dreamers, some from their toddlerhood to their college degrees, and now the Republicans in the rest of the country as well as some Democrats, want to not only send them home to fend for themselves with less knowledge of the language or culture where they came from than those who grew up there, but ignore and slight California in the process.

IF Democrats had stood up for Californians and the concept that each Californian should have an equal vote and an equal voice in presidential elections with every other American, Trump and his horrible immigration scheme would not be in the White House.

Schumer and the rest of the overcounted in the Eastern and sparsely populated states could really, really care less about equality for California voters or the dreamers. And all this poppycock about Senate rules would not be an issue if the votes of Californians that put Hillary over the top when it comes to the popular vote had been counted in November 2016 as equal to the votes of the lucky few in less populated, smaller states.

But that topic is never mentioned. It's too "complicated." And we've always had the electoral college.

The electoral college was brought in to some extent at least to protect states that had slavery. Now it exists to protect states with small populations -- putting many in California among the uncounted.

Like slaves in the South at the time of the American Revolution, a certain percentage of Californians just don't count -- not because of their color but because of their location.

Get rid of the electoral college, and the problem of the Dreamers and many other problems, like Trump who wasn't really elected by a majority of American voters, in the White House will not exist.

I usually like Joy's shows, but this one is way, way, way off the mark. It doesn't mention the real issue, the real problem -- California and the electoral college.

 

Sophia4

(3,515 posts)
8. Do you disagree with my idea that the vote of each Californian should be voted
Sat Jan 27, 2018, 04:34 PM
Jan 2018

as equal to the vote of each Montanan or New Yorker or Ohioan or Alabaman?

Is it the equality that so upsets people?

Or is it that a large number of Californians live in cities?

Or is it the demographic balance that puts non-whites nearly or in the majority in California?

Is it the desire to have more for oneself?
Disgust at the idea of equality?
A belief that rural areas should rule the country?
Or simply racism?

Because I don't really believe that Americans are so attached to the idea of the electoral college that they hold on to it out of some love of history.

We are a country that ultimately believes in justice.

It is unjust to keep the electoral college. It is unjust to return Dreamers to their homes.

And by the way, but it's another topic, the make-up of the Senate with only two senators for a huge state like California, is probably also very, very unjust.

 

Sophia4

(3,515 posts)
15. Start a movement. I can't do it because I am in California.
Sat Jan 27, 2018, 05:34 PM
Jan 2018

But I will raise the issue as often as I can here online and with my representatives and senators.

Democrats across the nation have to see the importance of this issue.

One citizen, one vote should be the rule in presidential elections. The electoral college is an anachronism from the days of slavery, horses and not even phones. We don't need it. It is not democratic. It cheats some people in some states of a vote, and it overcounts the votes of certain others.

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