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Sun Nov 29, 2015, 12:53 PM

Bird, snake could delay 28,000-home development near Benson


A move by the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service could delay or change plans for a 28,000-home development near Benson.

But that could depend on how much legal weight is given to an unsigned recommendation from the federal agency.

A draft letter from the service’s Phoenix office says officials recommend that the Army Corps of Engineers consult with it to determine the Villages at Vigneto’s potential impacts on two federally protected species: the Western yellow-billed cuckoo and Northern Mexican garter snake.

Fish and Wildlife mailed the letter to the Corps in mid-July. The Star recently obtained a copy through the federal Freedom of Information Act.

http://tucson.com/news/local/bird-snake-could-delay--home-development-near-benson/article_cf7076b6-847b-5e22-b46f-d2eda6531209.html

12 replies, 2082 views

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Arrow 12 replies Author Time Post
Reply Bird, snake could delay 28,000-home development near Benson (Original post)
Ptah Nov 2015 OP
Boxerfan Nov 2015 #1
Kali Nov 2015 #2
Ptah Nov 2015 #3
Kali Nov 2015 #5
MisterP Nov 2015 #4
2naSalit Nov 2015 #6
Ptah Nov 2015 #7
2naSalit Nov 2015 #8
Ptah Nov 2015 #9
2naSalit Nov 2015 #10
Ptah Nov 2015 #11
2naSalit Nov 2015 #12

Response to Ptah (Original post)

Sun Nov 29, 2015, 01:10 PM

1. Good -

And I'd rather see a patch of nature-than a mass of housing when so much is already un-occupied.


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Response to Ptah (Original post)

Sun Nov 29, 2015, 02:01 PM

2. they are reaching on this

but whatever it takes is pretty much OK with me.

Benson has such a hard on for this, but it is going to be a whole other city and downtown will die completely. they are such idiots. and now the bozo who originally went broke with this project is a fucking neighbor of mine!

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Response to Kali (Reply #2)

Sun Nov 29, 2015, 02:16 PM

3. I don't understand where that development would get water.

And Benson's support for it puzzles me too.

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Response to Ptah (Reply #3)

Sun Nov 29, 2015, 02:26 PM

5. the ground water is probably there but it may affect both the river and Kartchner Caverns

studies so far seem to show they will not affect either, but just the reality of 20-30,000 homes plus the attendant commercial development tells you there will be. I predict they will go broke long before build out.

as for Benson, they have never turned down a project that they imagine will boost revenue (note the key word IMAGINE) in some way, and have never shown any consideration about fugly landscapes, open space, water, rural character, agriculture, the environment in any way shape or form. fortunately, most projects that get proposed are out right scams or fail in some way before too much damage occurs. this one seems to actually have some funding behind it, which makes it a bit more worrisome. they are planting weekly stories in the various media and starting to donate to the local little league and that kind of corporate bribery. of course few in the town have any objections, so the people objecting are easily vilified as "outsiders" same old story.

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Response to Ptah (Original post)

Sun Nov 29, 2015, 02:25 PM

4. no! without overpriced McMansions everyone will be homeless!!!11

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Response to Ptah (Original post)

Sun Nov 29, 2015, 02:28 PM

6. I hope they can win on this

and what about water? Is there even enough in that location to sustain a community that large it what appears to be a desert? And they can get the cattle off the land too as far as I'm concerned.

And some additional questions:

Just how much energy will it take to build and sustain such a development when it is getting increasingly hotter there?

How many are willing to live in a place where resources are becoming more scarce?

Aside from the threatened species, what about all the other impacts associated with a development of this size?


As an ESA specialist of a sort (I give talks on the ESA, sometimes paid) I cringe when people start to argue against the Act because I can see that they truly don't know what the Act says that we, as a nation, have agreed to do in order to protect the natural realm. It isn't a long or very complicated legislation... all of 45 pages including definitions - a little more than 2 pages. And these pages are 5.5" X 4.25".

If you don't understand the Act, get educated because the same Congressional toads who want to end so many of our rights are also diligently trying to rescind this Act so their billionaire buddies/overlords can make more money to and steal more of our "Commons".

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Response to 2naSalit (Reply #6)

Sun Nov 29, 2015, 02:38 PM

7. I think it would be a bedroom community for

I think it would be a bedroom community for
Tucson: 45 miles to the west
Seirra Vista/ Fort Huachuca: 35 to 40 miles.

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Response to Ptah (Reply #7)

Sun Nov 29, 2015, 02:40 PM

8. There will

still be the sense of entitlement over water and other resources... looks like it could be an elitist-like bedroom community. Wonder where they intend to get water for this development.

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Response to 2naSalit (Reply #8)

Sun Nov 29, 2015, 02:58 PM

9. I didn't mean to sound like I support this development.

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Response to Ptah (Reply #9)

Sun Nov 29, 2015, 03:35 PM

10. Sorry

didn't mean to sound as though you did. Might be my temporary medical condition... I do agree with both of you (you and Kali).

I do, in my "talks", emphasize the importance of public participation and how it is essential to our survival at this point... not that it hasn't been all along.

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Response to 2naSalit (Reply #10)

Sun Nov 29, 2015, 04:29 PM

11. No problem. For you and those reading along,

Here's a summary from U.S. Fish & Wildlife Service | Pacific Southwest Region

Public Advisory




Here's a pdf fact sheet:

Western Yellow-billed Cuckoo

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Response to Ptah (Reply #11)

Sun Nov 29, 2015, 04:41 PM

12. Thanks!

I haven't been of the site to go hunt that down. Beautiful bird.

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