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Sat Aug 31, 2019, 07:55 AM

I am pissed. It seems the State of Florida, in 2017,

issued me a driver's license that will not be valid identification for flying commercial after October 1, 2020. It doesn't have a star in the upper right corner, nor does it say "Not for Federal Identification." I find myself wondering why this should be my problem. Check your license. This will probably only be a problem for people born before 1964 because of different implementation dates that ultimately never went into effect. From what I have read, the license I was issued violates Federal law. I was allowed to renew my license online in 2017 despite not ever having to produce the documents required by the stupid circa 2005 Real ID law.

I have always said nothing in Florida ever gets done right the first time, so I am not surprised, just angry.

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Arrow 53 replies Author Time Post
Reply I am pissed. It seems the State of Florida, in 2017, (Original post)
rzemanfl Aug 31 OP
MaryMagdaline Aug 31 #1
rzemanfl Aug 31 #3
MaryMagdaline Aug 31 #2
rzemanfl Aug 31 #5
rurallib Aug 31 #4
rzemanfl Aug 31 #6
HockeyMom Aug 31 #38
snowybirdie Aug 31 #7
rzemanfl Aug 31 #8
lark Aug 31 #9
rzemanfl Aug 31 #11
CDerekGo Aug 31 #10
rzemanfl Aug 31 #12
rzemanfl Aug 31 #14
PoindexterOglethorpe Aug 31 #13
Nay Aug 31 #15
rzemanfl Aug 31 #22
mitch96 Aug 31 #37
rzemanfl Aug 31 #39
mitch96 Aug 31 #43
Kilgore Aug 31 #16
femmocrat Aug 31 #19
rzemanfl Aug 31 #21
Callmecrazy Aug 31 #34
rzemanfl Aug 31 #45
rzemanfl Aug 31 #20
femmocrat Aug 31 #23
rzemanfl Aug 31 #24
femmocrat Aug 31 #25
Dr Vegas Aug 31 #17
HockeyMom Aug 31 #18
dawg day Aug 31 #32
Callmecrazy Aug 31 #35
ariadne0614 Sep 3 #50
FM123 Aug 31 #26
IggleDuer Aug 31 #27
ariadne0614 Aug 31 #29
rzemanfl Aug 31 #30
ariadne0614 Aug 31 #33
rzemanfl Aug 31 #40
rzemanfl Aug 31 #46
ariadne0614 Sep 3 #51
vsrazdem Aug 31 #28
dawg day Aug 31 #31
NotASurfer Aug 31 #36
rzemanfl Aug 31 #41
NotASurfer Aug 31 #42
rzemanfl Aug 31 #44
dawg day Sep 2 #48
femmocrat Sep 1 #47
dawg day Sep 2 #49
iscooterliberally Sep 3 #52
cyclonefence Sep 3 #53

Response to rzemanfl (Original post)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 08:02 AM

1. Thank you for post.

I was born before 1964; my Florida license has a star in the upper corner. I remember having to bring original birth certificate and other documents after 911 to re-register. I hope this means my Id is ok. Also have a passport issued in 2015.

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Reply #1)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 08:12 AM

3. You are good. We took our documents in back in 2009

but our tax collector would not accept them because of our age. It would have been extra work. Then they left a big crack for us to fall through when we were allowed to renew online in 2017. The Real ID law has been a cluster bleep for the past 14 years.

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Response to rzemanfl (Original post)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 08:06 AM

2. By the way if you schedule an appointment at DMV through AAA

This is a very efficient process. Theyíll even take you early if you arrive early. I signed up for AAA but was not required to do so to use their appointment system. (AAA is great and glad I signed up).

Good luck with bureaucracy. Hope you are able to fix things.

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Response to MaryMagdaline (Reply #2)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 08:14 AM

5. Thanks. I intend to just show up and complain loudly and often. n/t

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Response to rzemanfl (Original post)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 08:13 AM

4. it's not just Florida

We are in the same boat here in Iowa.

I am a bit pissed, but more than that I am very wary of the "papers, please" feel to the "real ID."

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Response to rurallib (Reply #4)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 08:15 AM

6. At least you can drive with the thing. n/t

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Response to rurallib (Reply #4)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 02:27 PM

38. When we moved from Florida to PA 2 years ago,

I still had to show the same documentation (BC, Marriage License) as I did in Florida to get that Gold Star Real ID. I even had to surrender my Florida Gold Star License. Asked at the DMV if I would get that Real ID License showing all this documentation. They told me No, they did not have it.

Since I live in a fairly rural area here, it is a good 20 miles from my house to the closest DMV. So if I need to fly domestically, or go to a government building, I am going to have to go through the same process all over again? They did not record all my documentation proof the first time 2 years ago?

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Response to rzemanfl (Original post)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 08:15 AM

7. Need to upgrade

licenses in Illinois too. Nationwide law. A passport will be accepted on flights as well.

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Response to snowybirdie (Reply #7)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 08:17 AM

8. Yes, a nationwide law that hasn't been fully implemented after

14 years.

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Response to rzemanfl (Original post)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 08:18 AM

9. agree, if it's from the state of FL, chances are it's totally fucked up.

No one ever seems to know any real facts, just make stupid shit up. I'm fighting with them right now about my Medical Marijuana approval I have glaucoma, a qualifying condition, but they didn't like the paperwork provided. Grrr, it was from my dr. and had my diagnosis, onset, treatment plan, etc. But not good enough for our dear state it seems. Grrrr.

I'll be actually opening the link in a few min. to see what the instructions are for the "proper documentation". I also have chronic pain from my my lower back as well as my neck fusion and now can't take muscle relaxers or narcotics and know my level of nsaid ingestion has got to go down. CBD is the best option for that (need THC varieties for glaucoma) but buying it off the internet is so iffy, I'd rather have reliable products that will ease my pain and a different one at night for sleeping and glaucoma. I'm so sick of this chronic pain.

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Response to lark (Reply #9)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 08:26 AM

11. Sorry about your problems. n/t

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Response to rzemanfl (Original post)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 08:23 AM

10. I renewed in FL

Last year, now required is Birth Certificate, first born, left toenail, right leg, upper quadrant of left eardrum...

You get the idea. Because you renewed online (I did too, for almost 20 years) what you have IS a State Issued Drivers License, but it does not meet new Federal Requirements put in place AFTER your last license was issued. I know, I know, leave it to Florida to wait till the very last to handle a situation, thank you Governor Rick Skeletor Nelson, but donít blame Florida. Look to Fed on this one.
Oh, do yourself a favor, go ahead and schedule yourself an appointment soon for replacement license. Have ALL necessary documentation, otherwise youíve wasted your time.

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Response to CDerekGo (Reply #10)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 08:32 AM

12. I am not sure you are correct about new requirements.

I am tired of researching the Real ID law and will let them explain to me how they fucked up. They deserve a class action lawsuit.

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Response to CDerekGo (Reply #10)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 08:33 AM

14. Oh, and Skeletor's last name is Scott. He stole Nelson's seat. n/t

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Response to rzemanfl (Original post)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 08:33 AM

13. In my state, NM, to get one of those Real ID drivers licenses,

among the documents they want is your Social Security card. They even apparently want it for the non Real ID card. My Social Security card very clearly says "Not to be used for identification purposes". I'm thinking of photocopying it, blacking out my SS number, and showing that to them when I need to renew my DL next year.

In this state there have been far too many stories of people being told they need to bring in documentation they really don't need. Another huge problem here is that a lot of people more or less informally changed their names, or were inconsistent in how they used them, making it a real nightmare, as the name on their birth certificate bears only a passing resemblance to names on school records, or paychecks, or anything else.

I at least have been "Poindexter Oglethorpe" my entire life and that's the name on all of my IDs and paperwork.

I also have a passport, which I can use to travel, so other than to drive legally I don't need a DL.

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Response to rzemanfl (Original post)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 08:38 AM

15. At least in Virginia you get a mail renewal letter that says you can get either type

of license (star or no star) if you renew, but that after Oct 2020 the non-star one would not be valid ID for flying anymore. Only the non-star license was renewable by mail. I had to renew this year anyway, so I dragged my 3 forms of ID in and got my starred license. I actually brought in about 6 forms of ID just in case. Virginia's DMV is pretty efficient, although overburdened and too busy because, like most states, they are getting starved by Republicans.

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Response to Nay (Reply #15)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 09:06 AM

22. From what I've read the non-star license is supposed

to say "Not for Federal Identification." My Florida license does not.

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Response to rzemanfl (Reply #22)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 12:25 PM

37. I recently renewed, got the star... and the fancy hologram

Just looked and it does not say anything about being a federal ID...
What I thought was weird is they renewed my Drivers License by mail. Used my old photo from 8 yrs ago...
m

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Response to mitch96 (Reply #37)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 02:38 PM

39. That statement is only supposed to be on the ones

without a star. If you renewed this year your last renewal was in 2011, so you provided the required ID then or earlier, depending on your d.o.b. My wife and I both renewed in 2009 and 2017. Our licenses were mailed to us in 2017 with the pictures from the previous license.

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Response to rzemanfl (Reply #39)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 04:20 PM

43. Got it, thanks...... nt

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Response to rzemanfl (Original post)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 08:40 AM

16. Dont bother upgrading, just use your passport

Assuming you have one. I dont plan on ever upgrading unless forced to do so.

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Response to Kilgore (Reply #16)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 08:57 AM

19. That is what we did (in PA).

Of course getting a passport is its own tangled web of red tape. I have yet to go through the driversí license ordeal. Thanks, bush.

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Response to femmocrat (Reply #19)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 09:02 AM

21. Dubya continues to haunt us. n/t

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Response to femmocrat (Reply #19)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 11:47 AM

34. Getting a passport is easy...

Fill out the application, provide a copy of your driver license and a hard copy of your birth certificate. Pay the $99. Ten days later you get your birth certificate back. I received my passport in 14 days.
Piece of cake.

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Response to Callmecrazy (Reply #34)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 05:26 PM

45. Getting $99 is hard for some folks. I refuse to get "papers" to

travel in the country I was born in.

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Response to Kilgore (Reply #16)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 08:58 AM

20. Don't have one. I am 72 and have no intention of traveling outside

the U.S.

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Response to rzemanfl (Reply #20)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 09:07 AM

23. The hassle of getting a passport was less than the Real ID.

Itís all a pain in the butt and totally unnecessary!! And-- I hope this is true-- the passport serves as a Real ID for air travel.

Who knows!! Iím too old for this crap, too. Why canít they just leave us alone already.

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Response to femmocrat (Reply #23)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 09:11 AM

24. I refuse to pay money for "papers" in the supposedly free

country I was born in and have no plans to leave.

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Response to rzemanfl (Reply #24)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 09:13 AM

25. That's true, there was a fee.

Maybe $60? Plus we had to pay for official birth certificates with a raised seal.

None of it is painless.

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Response to rzemanfl (Original post)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 08:46 AM

17. New Jersey is STILL trying to get their act together

I have contacted the DMV several times and they continue stalling their "Rollout" of the Real ID.
I had renewed my DL a few months ago and now they tell me if I want the Real ID I can turn in that DL and pay an additional 12 Dollars
WHEN they finally roll it out. Homeland Security sent out a Press Release last week about the Real ID Deadline and that made the Local News in New Jersey. I am sure that I am NOT the only one asking the DMV to get their act together

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Response to rzemanfl (Original post)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 08:51 AM

18. You renewed your license online?

That is why. I went to the DMV to renew my license in Florida where I had to show all my papers in person. Never asked for the Real ID license but they issued it to me. My husband renewed his license online and therefore never got that Gold Star on his without showing those legal documents.

Yes, it will be very inconvenient to a lot of people who cannot go to the DMV in person. You can just get a Passport but that is just as inconvenient and costs a lot more money.

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Response to HockeyMom (Reply #18)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 10:36 AM

32. And with a passport, you'd have to carry it all the time.

It's not something that can fit into your wallet.

I was recently on a long trip abroad and had to carry the passport everywhere. You should see how banged up it is. I got caught in a downpour and it was in my purse and got soaked (along with everything else), so now it's all bent and waterspotted. When I got back the US, the passport control agent said, "You're going to have to get a replacement."
$145.

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Response to dawg day (Reply #32)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 11:50 AM

35. He lied.

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Response to dawg day (Reply #32)

Tue Sep 3, 2019, 01:46 AM

50. There's a wallet version.

I got it when I applied for my regular passport. Itís plastic, like a drivers license.

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Response to rzemanfl (Original post)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 09:19 AM

26. Thank you SO MUCH for sharing this info with us!

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Response to rzemanfl (Original post)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 09:21 AM

27. New plans for Real ID under the Trump administration is to include your IQ ...

... when they decide to round up the intellectuals ....

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Response to IggleDuer (Reply #27)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 09:51 AM

29. Speaking of justifiable paranoia, . . .

. .is it crazy to suspect the whole Real ID thing is connected to voter suppression? Many people donít have the time, the means, or the money to overcome all the obstacles.

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Response to ariadne0614 (Reply #29)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 10:04 AM

30. Yep. n/t

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Response to rzemanfl (Reply #30)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 10:50 AM

33. So I'm crazy? n/t

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Response to ariadne0614 (Reply #33)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 02:40 PM

40. Justifiably paranoid. n/t

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Response to ariadne0614 (Reply #33)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 05:31 PM

46. Also see Callmecrazy's post upthread. Crazy is spoken for.

Nuts, bonkers, whacko, and others are available, but you're right and perfectly sane.

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Response to rzemanfl (Reply #46)

Tue Sep 3, 2019, 02:48 AM

51. I feel better now. n/t

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Response to rzemanfl (Original post)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 09:22 AM

28. Same issue in AZ. Just got my renewed this year and now have to get a new one by next year

in order to travel. Need 3 forms of ID: Birth certificate, 2 bills with my home address from bank or utility, and SS card. I guess after having an AZ drivers' license since 1985, they still are not sure who I am.

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Response to rzemanfl (Original post)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 10:29 AM

31. I went and checked, and the 5 levels of documentation are absurd

I have lived in the same city for 40 years, the same HOUSE for 35 years.
I have gotten driver's licenses here for 40 years.
I have had a US passport for 45 years (renewed several times).
I was just approved for that Trusted Traveller (US) card.
I have paid federal and state taxes every year since I was 18.



But... it is going to require work to get all the many forms of documentation needed to get this stupid real ID. Here are the problem ones-
Utility bills mailed to your with your name and address. (Utility bills are in husband's name, because back when we bought the house, that's what they did -- married women couldn't even get credit cards in their own name.) Ditto insurance bills.

Mortgage bill (paid off mortgage 12 years ago)

Credit card bills (all my bills except a couple utility bills in husband's name arrive electronically, which isn't acceptable)

Bank statements (also electronic)
(These above are to prove residence in the house I've lived in for 35 years and paid property tax on-- AND at least two different types are needed)

W-2 forms (also electronic)
(These all have to be issued, btw, within 60 days of applying for the real ID)

Social Security card (Umm, which I probably lost 40 years ago and was in my maiden name anyway)
Voter registration card (ditto-- and anyway, why wouldn't the state be able to check that, since I'm registered in the state, and we have driver-voter law, so the BMV does have access?)

I went through all the options, and it looks like I am going to have to do this- Get my bank to send me a statement through the mail, meaning I have to go to the bank branch and prove my ID and ask for it.
Switch my credit card "paperless" delivery to "paper" for a month (and then back).

I'm not sure about the W-2 (which absent my SS card, seems to be the one way I can prove SSN relatively easily, though you know, it's ON MY DRIVER'S LICENSE!!!!). My company does not ever send the paper copy anymore. Maybe I can wait until the SSA sends out that annual statement of benefits? But that probably doesn't have my SSN on it. Oh, well. Too bad I won't turn 66 and get social security checks in time.

This anti-immigration fever is getting insane. Everyone-- everyone -- in the country is now going to have to go through these extra steps and the states all have to go to extra expense... and why? So that we can further demonize some farmworkers and roofers and babysitters and college students and business owners who are here doing honest work and bothering no one?

And INS continues to harass them while letting employers (LIKE TRUMP) who hire them skate.

I know I'm being petty, but I travel a lot, and it's idiotic that I and everyone else should have to go to all this trouble to be able to continue to do something we are legally allowed to do.










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Response to dawg day (Reply #31)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 12:15 PM

36. My wife describes one part of it as proving your husband has solid chain of custody

Name on old license matches SSA card, but not birth certificate, so you need marriage license.

Previous name on marriage license matches SSA card because you got that updated but doesn't match birth certificate because prior marriage, so you need THAT marriage certificate.

And don't forget divorce papers to prove you actually did get divorced so the subsequent marriage is valid.

Which is a nightmare if you've been married a couple times and moved a couple times and now you have to scramble to assemble the required documents.

Me, they glanced at the folder I brought to see if my name was on stuff, checked to make sure the old DL was valid, and waved me through.

Moral of the story I imagine, if you're thinking of getting married, it works way better if everyone keeps the name on their birth certificate. Less documentation to keep track of.

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Response to NotASurfer (Reply #36)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 02:45 PM

41. Real ID says they're supposed to copy the stuff not just look at it. n/t

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Response to rzemanfl (Reply #41)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 03:26 PM

42. Could be state-specific implementation

Texas flat refused to issue a license until I established chain of custody so to speak. California, she took all the papers upfront based on the Texas experience and the DMV did check to make sure everything lined up.

Just seems like an extra layer of difficulty that disproportionately affects women and has a potential side effect of disenfranchising a percentage.

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Response to NotASurfer (Reply #42)

Sat Aug 31, 2019, 05:22 PM

44. See Ariadne0614's post upthread. Yes, it does disproportionately affect

women and creates a burden on the poor and uneducated and suppresses votes. The certified copy of my birth certificate is from March, 1959, its original use was to show I still qualified as a child for travel as I approached 12 years of age 60 years ago. It would be a real pain to get one now.

The federal law says the state is to retain copies. I think they can probably rely on another state's compliant license.

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Response to NotASurfer (Reply #36)

Mon Sep 2, 2019, 11:35 PM

48. I hadn't even thought of this, but my driver's license-

first licensed in this state 40 years ago! has my married name... but my middle name, like Jane Marie Doe.

My passport has my maiden name instead of a middle name, like Jane Myers Doe.

I bet that will make a problem. Sigh.

So true-- keep the name your parents put on the birth certificate!

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Response to dawg day (Reply #31)

Sun Sep 1, 2019, 09:26 AM

47. Thanks for posting this.

My husband did the research and ran into the same snags that you mentioned.

BTW, what is a ďTrusted TravelerĒ card? I havenít heard of that one!

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Response to femmocrat (Reply #47)

Mon Sep 2, 2019, 11:40 PM

49. Trusted Traveller- lets you through passport control (I think it's "Global Access") faster-

Also you get TSA-pre automatically.

It's an ordeal to get the first time. You have to fill out forms online, and once you're approved, you have to get an interview with passport control agent (and there will probably only be one agent who can do this) at a major airport. (I did it in Philly.)

I hope it gets me through Passport faster, also maybe get in the fast lane when I drive back from Canada.

Something interesting-- if you have one of those travel credit cards, like Capital One, they'll pay the initial fee (which is like $100). you just charge it on that card and they reimburse.

I haven't travelled since I got the card, so I don't know whether it's worth it.


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Response to rzemanfl (Original post)

Tue Sep 3, 2019, 05:25 AM

52. Thanks for this.

I went and checked my license and I do have the gold star. I had moved up to MA for a couple of years. I had to show them a whole bunch of documents to get a license up there. When I got back to FL in 2014 I renewed in person with my BC and utility bills. I also went and got a new passport last year. That was very easy to do at the courthouse. I got there early and was in and out in about 15 minutes. I guess if I had not moved outside of FL I would probably not have known about this until reading your post. Apparently traveling to Europe is about to get a little more difficult for Americans too.


https://theweek.com/speedreads/828252/traveling-europe-little-more-difficult-americans

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Response to rzemanfl (Original post)

Tue Sep 3, 2019, 07:20 AM

53. Real ID in PA discriminates against married women

I was gathering documents to take to the licensing center. Some of the accepted forms of proof of address are utility bills, auto registration, and tax documents. Well, guess what? Many of us (I suspect older) married women do not have utility bills, auto registration, or tax bills in our own names. Fortunately (?) I live in an area that collects a per capita tax, and the bill is in my name. I took in a couple of documents that listed me secondarily (like one car registration), but it was the per capita bill that was used.

I remarked to the clerk (an older woman) that it seemed unfair and more difficult for married women, that we had to reach a higher bar (because you also have to prove name change with a marriage certificate or something) than did men, and she agreed. She said she had to turn away many more women than men because of lack of proof of residency.

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